Also media.
Hey everyone, Robert Evans here, and I wanted to let you know we're doing another fundraiser for the fifth year in a row for the Portland Diaper Bank, which provides diapers to parents who wouldn't be able to afford them otherwise. If you go to bTB fundraiser for PDX Diaper Bank, go fund me. That's just type bTB fundraiser for PDX Diaper Bank, go fund me into Google and you can donate there in order to help out some people who
really need it with some diapers. Oh my god, welcome back to Behind the Bastards.
Oh my god.
Speaking of great bits, you know, it's not a great bit, Molly tax protesters. I was gonna say pedophilia, because, oh, I'm gonna be honest with you. You can't because we had just had some hard episodes. This has been a tough year, and we had some hard episodes specifically dealt with pedophilia and the German left and I was like, I'm gonna do Kent Hooven, you know, something like wacky tax protester, sovereign citizen. It's not Kent's. He's not a pedophile.
Maybe he might be. Actually it's kind of weird. Yeah, it's it's an open question, Molly, people are asking. But you know what's not an open question the fact that the cold Open has done. Ah, we're back. We're warmed up from the Cold Open. And when we left off with Kent, he had started preaching a new gospel that Christians are immune to taxes if they just claim to be ministers. And anyone can be a minister. Now, this is not a law work. Partially, this is how the
law works. Right, Churches get away with a lot of tax bullshit. They shouldn't, right, But there are things you have to do. You can't just say I'm mature. There's paperwork, and like they know, they aren't immune to taxes. For example, church payrolls still have to pay income tax. Right.
You can't just walk outside and say I'm a church.
I'm a church. It's not that simple.
Yeah.
Now. In a letter Kent wrote outlining his beliefs for fans of his fifteen and a half hour lecture series on taxes, he marks the source of his break with the federal government as income taxes, which are communists.
Quote.
People occasionally ask me what I mean when I say and seminar part five of my Creation Seminar series that income tax and social security are voluntary. I only intended to point out the connection between evolution and communism. Everything Karl Marks, the father of communism, proposed in his Ten Planks of the Communist Manifesto eighteen forty eight was deliberately anti God and anti Bible. Since the graduated income tax
was plank number two, the subject inevitably came up. The income tax system is one of the main ways to destroy a country and bring it under communism.
I don't really know how we got here.
I'll tell you, Molly. So the idea that there's ten planks by which communists destroy a society so they can take over is a common conservative bugbear to the present day. You can find people talking about the ten planks of communism all over the place. What they are actually referring to is Chapter two of the Communist Manifesto, which Kent did get right. It was written in eighteen forty eight right.
The chapters titled Proletarians and Communists, and Marx does not lay out ten planks by which communists can take over a society, but he does describe the ways in which the revolution of the working class will, in his eyes, progress to raise the proletariat to the ruling class and
win what he describes as the battle of democracy. Mark states that he believes that in most advanced countries, a victorious proletariat will engage in a number of activities like abolition of property in land and a heavy progressive income tax, which is number two on a list of activities he thought would be generally applicable, so number one. This is different from what Kent's saying. He's not saying this is
how we destroy a society. He's saying that in advanced societies, when the proletariat wins the battle of democracy, they're going to do a number of things, and one of those things is a progressive income tax right to try and reduce income inequality, disparity in wealth roll.
Marx wants to take your dinoh Land.
Yes, that's a bit different from what Hovid and these other guys claim is happening. It's also for people like to talk about Marx like he was some evil mastermind. He was like a like a journalist and a theory
nerd who spent a lot of time. Well, I think these kind of things might happen, Like he wouldn't write the same things he wrote then today because he would be looking at a different world, right, Like he was kind of in their stuff he was wrong about in terms of predicting the ways in which he thought, you know, society would progress. It didn't like, obviously it didn't happen that way, right. Marx would not have been like, oh,
everything I thought was wrong. He'd be like, well, yeah, you know, you can't predict the future, you know, I was just laying out what I saw best based on my understanding of the world at the time. Anyway, I also don't think he's wrong that if we were to ever have the proletariat take charge in the battle of democracy, we should have a heavy progressive income tax. We should just have that. In general. It's a good idea.
Girl. Carl would have said that Kent should pay his taxes.
Caurl would have said Ken should be paying taxes on the millions of dollars he's making in dinosaur merchandise.
Is still selling the dino merch I'm interested, Oh.
Yeah, oh yeah, you can find some good anyway. Hon though, insists that FDR, who is of course a communist, forced income tax unconstitutionally upon US, and so as a result, Hovind resists the temptation to obey tax law and writes, I am not afraid of the I R S. I know the truth that have been set free. Oh you should be giving that's the number one thing you shouldn't say. And for the record, I'm very scared of the I R S. I pay my taxes.
They send you a letter, like if you log into your account online, they send you a letter in the mail to be like did you log in online? Was this you? Look? That's fair enough? But I get the email ahead of time about like what mail I'm getting? And so I get this email, but like are sending am I?
Am?
I going to god?
What did I do wrong? Are you coming after me? Did I accidentally like misplace a decimal point and lie about a deduction?
I was so careful?
Yeah no, And this is like again, this is the difference between somebody who claims to resist this, like hate the state, but does so based on like nonsense, and somebody who hates the state but also understands the reality of the state, which is like, yeah, I'm going to try not to go to prison for tax shit. I'm going to pay my taxes. And do my best to abide by the law, because that's not a fight I want.
I'll take some fights. I'll pick some fights with the government, but not every fight because that's stupid, because you.
Can't keep fighting if you're in jail for taxing.
No, no, you have to be You have to pick your battles. It's a big thing government, like I'll focus on like I don't know, trying to make the police less heavily armed.
God, God told me I don't have to do this paperwork.
So yeah, not doing it. So and Kent does again the thing you're not supposed to do, which he's he has all these quotes where he's like, if the IRS really, you know, think, if the IRS actually has the ability to arrest me, they and come and do it, and they're about to.
They will do It's they're like, oh really, oh really, Like.
What are you gonna do? Stab me guy, or they'll never hit us from over here.
But I think a lot of people who are doing tax drawn don't realize is they don't come after you year one or year two. They wait. They wait until they have a.
Very target coming after you for shoplifting, you know exactly.
They wait till you hit that the felon your life.
Yeah, exactly. So for a surprisingly long time, Kent and his wife were able to sail by on this bullshit without getting clapped in irons. But eventually the man came for them, and in two thousand and six, Kent was charged with fifty eight tax related crimes, including two counts of willful failure to with old federal income tax from employee wages and forty five counts of structuring transactions to
evade reporting requirements. He's doing shit like every time he withdraws money, he'll withdraw ninety five hundred dollars to keep it under the ten thousand dollars limit that he thinks the government can't pay attention to the small I don't know, man, if you if you have a thousand, ninety five hundred dollars with draws, what that says for the irs is, well, this guy's trying not to get on our radar, which means he's breaking some law.
Like the teller that would normally have you fill out the cash Transaction record form, which is the form you fill out if you're making a withdrawal or a deposit of ten thousand dollars or more just because you're putting it in a ninety five hundred, like she's saying something to the manager that's getting written down.
And if you know you can do that, I've had to do like when I went to Syria. I think I took seven or eight grand out because like it costs a lot of money to pay fixers and there's not cash machines over there.
But if you do it ten times, but I did it one hundred times, it's not structuring to do it once.
Yeah, Yeah, it's that. That's what That's what they're talking about here. Now with any of these guys, it's always a little bit of a mystery. How much of this bullshit is them like believing the shit and how much are they just trying to get away with not paying taxes and they have to hold the lie because what
else are they going to do? Colum A low Collum, I think so generally, whatever the case, Kent does the dumbest thing possible when he gets arraigned eventually for this in two thousand and six and he tells a US magistrate, I still don't understand what I'm being charged for and who is charging me? Now? One thing I'll say about our federal government is that, like, I don't think any that's ever a valid complaint because even if the charges are bullshit, it's always very clear who is charging you
and what the charges are. You get that on a piece of paper. Right. He had an attorney at this point who would explain that to him. This is not one of the shortcomings in my opinion of the justice system, and Kent was adequately informed of what he had done wrong. There had been years of communication with the IRS prior to this.
Right.
It's just usually a surprise when you get charged with fifty eight tax cars.
Right right. Shocked. Yeah, Kent's brain, I think, just kind of shuts down when they read out these charges because in his personal head canon of the constitution, none of this should be possible. Right.
Yeah.
The court case winds on for about a year or a lot of that year two thousand and six, and Kent tries to delay it. He files frivolous lawsuits against the IRS for criminal trespass, which eventually earns him a charge for impeding an IRS investigation. Later that year, his dinosaur park gets shut down for refusing to get a building permit.
I do not contract with the zoning administrator.
Yeah, yeah, I don't need to. I found in his article on rational Wiki, which is the best repository of all of the Kent Hovend lore. They write, quote Hovend claims that his decision to build without permits from the county is based on the Bible, questioning, does the Escambia County, Florida civil government have jurisdiction over a church of the sovereign God of the universe. Yes, they do. The Labia County clon when it comes to making a Bible park.
Yes, who's inspecting this roller coaster? Key?
Yeah. During a hearing, Hovind was marked by the local county commissioner with the response that scripture also says render rend of Caesar. What Caesar demand, and right now Caesar demands a building permit. And that's not a bad response.
That's so good.
I mean that is I will say, people talk a lot. What would Jesus Christ say. I think if he came back and a guy was like, look, we just need him to get a permit before he lets children onto rides, Jesus would be like, well, yeah, okay, that seems reasonable, especially since again he's going to kill a seven year old Later on in this episode, don't worry, it's on his next park. So that same year, he gets charged by the tax court for failing to pay income tax.
As you can imagine, he doesn't respond well to this, and once things go to court, it all goes disastrously for Kent. He is convicted of all of the tax fraud and held in jail while he awaits sentencing. One local paper reports that he ran up eight hours of calls per week during the time he was in jail, which I think is meant to make him sound like a crazy person, but that actually sounds reasonable to me.
It's like an hour a Day's an hour a day.
I think they're kind of be an unfair to can't here, that's a print. Seems like a pretty normal amount of time to want to be on the phone when you're like the kid's a wife and a lawyer, right right right, Like I'm not. I don't think that's actually an unreasonable amount. On the other hand, during sentencing, he threatened the judge and prosecutor, claiming their case against him was illegal and he was going to make their lives miserable in revenge, which again not a great call.
They love that. Yeah, they love being judges.
Loved that judges. That's every judge's favorite thing is being personally threatened by a defendant.
Surprised he didn't catch a new charge for that.
Yeah, uh and too well, he had a lot going on. In two thousand and seven, he gets sentenced to ten years in prison and is sent to a federal prison camp or it's just called Federal prison camp in Pensacola. That's a scary name. But this is actually a minimum security facility at least.
Close to home.
Yeah, it's close to his friends and family, like within kind of our car seral system. He does not get the harshest kind of thing he could get.
No, he's in tax jail.
He's in tax jail. He does serve his time. He does about nine years, and he definitely did the crime. But this was not to be the end of the Kentoven's story, just the beginning, or at least like up to the middle part. While he was locked up, the government put leans on a bunch of property he purchased with his untaxed creationist gains. His wife served two years
and then divorced him. Kent fought the government from prison, retaining a lawyer named Glenn Stole, And of course Glynn is as much a lawyer as I am.
He was actually.
Affiliated with a Christian cult called the Embassy of Heaven. Yeah, oh yeah, no, Molly, of course, there's there's so many fun little little cults in the Kins Store.
I'm sorry, I'm inside the Consulate. The iris can never get me.
Yeah, that is. That is basically what they're doing, right is they're like, as the Embassy of Heaven, we can hand out stuff like driver's licenses and passports and the real government there of course, based in Oregon. They're the leader of the Embassy of Heaven. The founder is a former computer systems analyst who calls himself Paul Revere.
Yes, yeah, I'm there.
It's so mad. It's all the good shit right there, baby. Now. Because Glenn doesn't really know how the law works, none of his motions do anything, nor does an attempt in twenty thirteen by Kent to use what's called a biven's action to file a civil rights suit against the staff at his minimum security prison. Kent believed that this would launch a chain of dominoes that would see his conviction
overturned and himself freed. But a federal judge rejected his claims and threatened to hold him in contempt of court for continuing to file false bullshit. In twenty fourteen, the year before he was set to be freed, Hovind was indicted by a grand jury on two counts of mail fraud and conspiracy to commit mail fraud. In the Pensilcoli is doing.
A mail fraud from prison?
Oh yeah, yeah, I think because of mail fraud. Yeah, it's a terrible.
Idea, but it's very funny.
This doesn't again, is nothing many crimes and he you know, nine years is not a slap on the wrist. That's a serious sentence. But given the he should have done more time, given the number of crimes, Like anyone who is not a right wing Christian is doing twenty years for all this shit.
Because that's a lot of money laundering.
Yeah, it's a lot of crime. In an article for the Pensacola News Journal, Kevin Robinson wrote, quote, according to an October twenty first federal indictment filed against Hovend and Paul John Hanson, a Nebraska man known for his vigorous opposition of government tax and property laws, the duo has been charged with mail fraud and criminal contempt for interfering with the sale of Pensacola properties. Hovend was forced to forfeit as a result of the two thousand and six case.
The indictment says that in twenty eleven, Hanson filed leans on nine of Hoven's forfeited properties on North Palafox Street, Cummings Road, and Onlyander Drive. In twenty twelve, the government was granted an injunction ordering that neither Hoven nor any agent acting on his behalf file or a tipt to file any leans notices, financing titles and claims of whatever
nature to cloud the title of the properties. The following year, both Hovend and Hansen reportedly mailed additional documents disputing the ownership of the property. So basically, he has to forfeit a bunch of properties because of the tax fraud, and so he starts putting leans on the properties to stop the government from being able to do anything with them, which is like fraud. No, it does not work.
And the court less who that injunction was just the court saying like fucking knock it off.
Yeah, just stop this shit.
Just knock it off. And he couldn't knock it off.
He could knock it off, and they still don't really punish him further for this. Ultimately, Kent squeaks through this without additional sentencing, and he is a free man by twenty fifteen. I think he spends like a year basically doing a parole sort of situation, so he's like fully off the hook in twenty sixteen. His first act after he gets out of prison is to create a YouTube channel. Obviously, of course, get back to video, baby, pivot right back
to video. It has like two hundred thousand followers at its peak. It's since been removed, and he is on Rumble now.
I'm sure you can't see that one.
Rumbles the right place for him. He is not as popular on Rumble.
Is he on bandt video?
I don't think he's on Bandot video, but I didn't really look. Kent's arguments by this point had evolved into what he humbly calls the Hoven theory, which argues that dinosaurs and humans live together. At one point during this Edenic period, even carnivorous dinosaurs were vegetarians, a trait they lost once and Eve fell from grace. Hovid has taken some flak from flat earths who agree with aspects of his theory but are angry that he is not a
flat earther. For his part, his theory includes the idea that God kept up a sort of vapor barrier to protect the Earth until Adam and Eve were forced out of paradise. When this happened, ice meteors hit the Earth and shattered fragments from one meteor caused impact craters on the Moon. Right now, that seems like a weird thing
to need to explain. Kent needs this sweaty explanation because one of the ways that we actually know the universe as old as fuck is that we can look at something like the Moon and see all of these different impacts over time, right, and you can kind of tell
from that. It's part of how you can tell one of the things you can use to sort of tell how long it's been sitting up there, right, because you can see how often it gets impact and be like, well, it's it's clearly been up there getting hit by shit for a long ass time. Right. So Kent needs a way to explain how all of those impact craters happened at the same time, like one hundred years ago, right, it's a little more than that.
I just feel like he's going to a lot of trouble.
Yeah, you have to, because it's non sense, right, It's very easy to see that, like, well, yeah, the moon's been up there a long time. There's just shit flying through space.
Of course, it's yeah, dinosaurs didn't have sharp teeth until eve ate the apple. Then they got to get sharp teeth.
Yeah, but that's probably probably those meteors again, they carved off little chunks of the teeth, sharpened them up. Absolutely, Yeah, that's what meteors do. Now. I haven't wasted a lot of time in these episodes arguing logic with Kent's nonsense, because I see little point. But this is a perfect example. You don't really need to go point by point there.
You can find hundreds. You could spend a whole week reading nothing but people breaking down every argument this man has ever made, and a lot of them are actual scientists. But that's not really necessary, right, we know this is nonsense. I think this hit some of this nonsense. The shit about the vapor barrier is good evidence of why he's not super popular even with creationists. Kent has actually spent most of the last twenty years arguing with more mainstream
creationist thinkers like Carl Wiland. And this seems to be due to the fact that a lot of the arguments Kent makes are easy to debunk. Right, these guys are all creationists, but there are creationists like Wiland. For a long time would be like Hovid is fraudulent because he's a bad creationist. He's doing a bad job of making these arguments and it makes us look stupid.
Why didn't he read some books in prison?
I think he probably wrote some books in prison. I don't think he really reads one. Australian ministry split with their US cousins over a debate on Hovind, and ken Ham supported Hovind in that debate. By the way, he's the guy with a good fake Bible dinosaur park. Kent's new videos focused on the same stuff as his old mail order videos and lectures, arguing about evolution and evangelizing
to the kind of people who find that compelling. He also continued throwing out challenges for debates to famous scientists and scientific writers like Dawkins and Stephen J. Gould. No one credible takes him up on this, but he's made a public offer of a quarter of a million dollars to anyone who could give empirical evidence for evolution. As I noted last episode, his definition of evolution makes any
kind of good faith response to this impossible. He also notes that a handle of judges who he has never named or specified, would be the ones to decide if a proof met his requirements. It has become clear over the years that the only judge in this case is Kent.
I think the only judge is God.
Robert, Yeah, that's that's Mark, you know, God, Molly, and the sponsors of our podcast, who might as well be God to us, you know, sitting here, you know, looking down on their creation, up at their creation, their creation being this podcast. So thank you, sponsors. We worship you. We're back. So despite the fact that Kent's arguments are nonsense and all pretty bad faith, he does well enough
to earn some serious fans. In twenty fifteen, one of them donates one hundred and forty acres of land to him. And by the way, folks, if anyone wants to donate one hundred and forty acres to the Behind the Bastards podcast, I don't know what we'll do, but we'll probably we'll get rated by somebody. I promise you that you know, send it on over and I'll get to work. I'll get to work, make cooking up something that'll be an
entertainer news story. You're gonna get a good, like three part Daily Beast article out of what happens.
Make your own allergy medicine.
That's right. Maybe secede from the government to make our own pseudo fed an independent, pseudo fed based republic. Yes, this is the answer.
Model first engineer, pseudo fed from meth that you bought from a biker to get back into.
Great idea Molly from So this land that gets donated to him is about an hour and a half north of his old home in Florida. It's in Conica County, Alabama. I'm gonna again fuck up again and say Arkansas several times later in the episode Conica County, Alabama, sorry again, gas station drugs and I'm probably pronouncing that wrong, but I don't like Arkansas very much. Hoven created a new five oh one C three to hold the property and named it Creation Science Evangelism Ministries, an art colon Kent
and al dot Com Alabama dot Com. Not long after he took possession of the property that says this quote. On a driving tour of the property, he explained that it used to be a gravel pit where sand, gravel and clay were mined. Because of that, huge sand dunes occupy much of the middle of the property. It's a popular place for four wheeling. Part of the property is
wooded and crisscrossed with dirt trails. The main pond has a redneck water slide made from corrugated plastic tubing and a zip line from a sand dune on the shore to a light post stuck on a tiny island in the middle of the pond. At any one time, Hoven says, there are about twenty five people living and working at Dinosaur Adventure Land. We've probably had twelve hundred people volunteer to come help us build things since they first started
work on the park in twenty sixteen. He said, people just call, they say they love us.
Now, that's the hallmark of a great nonprofit is basically slavery.
That's why God created the five oh one c. Three is so that you can have slaves.
That's not legal. You do still have to pay people.
Yeah, yeah, Kent what he doing. Hes verges on a cult, right. I think it's actually a little more irresponsible because he lacks the kind of centralized control that cult leaders can sometimes use to mitigate the worst aspects of having a cult. He's like a cult leader who's too lazy to take full responsibility.
He's the clockmaker cult leader.
Ol Ron Hubbard would never Yeah, so Kent basically welcomed in anyone who dropped in for a lecture in a view of his Slapdash Dinosaur Museum. If they had like a trailer, he was like, you can live here, right, And he used them as free labor to expand his park, which is usually just called DL. And this led him to invite in a man named Chris Jones. And this is where the pedophile comes into the story. Molly Jones
had an ugly record. No oh, this is the fascinating story about whether or not he knew Mollie Jones had an ugly record by the time he started hanging out around DL during the Trump years. In two thousand and one, he'd been working at a church watching a couple of young boys when he got in trouble hitting a seven year old who naked repeatedly on the butt He was convicted of battery for this. In two thousand and four, he started hanging out with a trio of children ages nine, eleven,
and twelve. One night, he decided to play strip poker with them. No, yeah, yeah, yeah. Here's a quote from a court decision on the matter. Defendant produced a deck of cards and explained the game to the boys. He dealt the cards, told the boys who won to lodged steached hand, and directed the losers to take off some clothes. The boys did as instructed. Alexon remembered he and Anthony M stripped down to their underwear. Anthony M remembered only
himself getting naked. Eg remembered the other two boys stripped him naked and took off their own shirts. There's a lot more there. It's a lot worse. I'm not going to read it all. You get the picture, right, Jones, honestly, just.
Not fair, Like, of course you're going to beat the children.
In yeah, yeah, you have more like there's a lot of reasons why it's bad. Jones was convicted of three charges of lude acts on children, and after this point he starts hanging out at Dall. Now you might think maybe old Kent know about his past, right, this guy shows up. Kent's not doing background checks on these people, these volunteer cult members, right, of course not. But he's not got him. He's not doing that.
The Lord will handle it.
Yeah, that's Kent's attitude. And we know he actually becomes aware of this because of a guy named Billy Summers. Billy lives in South Carolina, kind of near where Jones lives, and he visits dal in twenty seventeen. Kent, unprompted tells him, Oh, we've got a guy who comes in volunteers here and
he lives near where you live. And he gives the guy's name, and Billy gets in contact with that guy and basically Kent unprompted tells him, Also, he's a convicted child sex offender, right, so he Kent tells Billy that, but then it's like he didn't know. Yeah, but he's like, don't worry, the charges are bullshit. They're politically motivated, right, And then he goes on to argue Jones didn't even do anything bad. He was just playing strip poker with several children. Since when is that illegal?
Oh, so he's not saying it didn't happen he's just saying it did happen, but it's.
Fine, Summers, Summers recalls, Hoven says to him, Jones stopped at their underwear, so he did nothing wrong.
That's good.
That's that's really bad.
I deeply hate all these people. They all fucking suck.
Yeah, and this guy, this guy's like operating the jump asar or.
Yeah, yeah, I don't know what exactly he's doing, but he's quote unquote he volunteering. He's volunteering. He has informed Hoven, and Hovend, unprompted, is like, yeah, he's technically a child sex offender, but it's bullshit. He just just some strip poker with the boys, you know, the literal boys, like.
An actual boys, boys, boys, very very good boys.
Oh no, Summers, is I presume a guy with some presumable pretty intense religious beliefs. Otherwise why would he be here. But he was not so cooked that he was willing to listen to Kent's pedophile apologism and move on. So he goes at his credit, he goes home. He calls Kent to talk about Jones, and so he can record the call and get a recording of being like, yeah, I know, this guy's a pedophile. Right. He eventually puts
this up online. It becomes a whole thing in the community, and The Daily Beast, who reviewed a copy of the call, describes what happened next. Jones got a job at Bohemian This and this is him talking to Hovin. Jones got a job at Bohemian Grove. That's where they make all their plans for the New World Order, Hoven says on the recording. He got a job there and videotaped a bunch of stuff, and they wanted him in prison. That's why they That's why they arrested him for that bullshit
strip poker charge. It was he was the New World Order trying to stop him from getting out the truth.
Is not even a good lie.
That is a that's a genre of guy. There's this dude who like started out as an anti Iraq war guy, which is at least a reasonable point and is now just a like Bishar al Assade never did anything wrong, YadA YadA, nonsense dude who Scott Ritter, who is a pedophile, like has been convicted of repeatedly trying to fuck kids, and like everybody basically like it's bullshit, it's but they're
trying to stop me from getting out the truth. Like even within that your bullshit ecosystem, there's plenty of people making those arguments who do not have pedophilia convictions, Like, yeah, he was supposed to.
Speak at that pro rush that like anti war rally. That was just a pro Russia rally last year. At the eleventh hour, they're like, finely won.
Probably shouldn't have a literal pedophile.
The pedophile will be there.
Yeah, Like, man, it's a it's a and that is you know, I'll give them that, right, Like that's a that's a low bar. But like kicking the pedophile out eventually is at least better than Hovend does. I'll give them that. Summers is not convinced by Hoven's explanation about Bohemian Grove, and so he makes that YouTube video compelling concerns. Yeah,
you know, you give it. It's nice to know that they're Even within these weird communities of like Dinosaur adventure Land volunteers, there's people who are like, this seems wrong. I should probably spread the word about this.
I believe that a child could write a Trice Era toobs, but should not be playing strip poker.
Wil Man at least there's a line for you, some of you people, right. Hovind calls Summers after he puts this video up and demands the video be removed. Jones eventually gets into contact directly with Summers, and Jones tells Summers that like, yeah, it was the New World Order that got me arrested. My conviction was bullshit. It's always happening, he admits. He calls it a technical crime, and this is how he describes this is the bullshit technicality they
got me on. It was throwing an eleven year old boy in the pool in his underwear. That's my big sex crime. Even if I am guilty, Hopefully the blood of Christ works. At least you're not questioning that the blood of Christ works. Man, we're all forgiven and cleaned up. Not a great argument.
Just because God will still let you into heaven doesn't mean I have to let you into the children's theme park.
Right again. I think that's the argument Summer is making. Summers is making right.
Like, you can be washed clean in the blood of the Lamb, but you're still on the.
Second you're coming out of my house. Yeah, elementary school on your list, right. The fewer Summers created around all. This even reached in the community of Bible weirdos who had chosen to live at DL. A lot of these people had brought their kids with them or had partial visitation rights with their children. Has more common, right, Yeah, that's about right. And to their credit again, a lot of them don't feel good about this pedophile having free access to the property.
In good for their custody cases, it's.
Bad for a lot of things. In twenty nineteen, said pedophile visits again, and Hoven complained to his secretary that people were freaking out about it. A number of folks did leave, and this segment from that Daily Beast article makes it very clear why people were unsatisfied with Hoven's answers about Jones. Asked about Jones, Hoven told the Daily Beasts that Jones had done nothing wrong, either in his criminal case or at DL. He's come here to visit twice.
I think never spends the night, Hoven said. But Jones did spend the night near DL during the November twenty nineteen visit. Oh, that's right, Hoven recalled, when reminded of the incident. They did spend one night here. They where Jones and a young boy who's na Yeah, yeah, eleven years old.
He did? He just go lol.
Oops yeah lol oops, Like oh yeah, okay, they did. There was that one time they.
Stayed here one time, and it was.
What kind of makes this an issue is that there's this lady shunk who is his like secretary basically, and she greets this pedophile and this boy on arrival and Jones is white and the eleven year old boy is black, and so.
She's like, not his son.
Well, they don't look like they're related, you know, not that it's impossible for them to have been related, but like, they don't look related. This seems very sketchy.
And also he probably wouldn't have custody of his own kids.
Yeah, there's a lot that seems wrong with this. Hoven's assistant tries to Okay, well you're staying here, let me get you two separate bedrooms, right. Hoven intervenes personally to put them in a cabin on a neighboring property that DL has access to. The only bed in the cabin is a queen size mattress. His former assistant didn't claims. Hoven specifically wanted Jones in the eleven year old to
share the bed. When confronted on this, Hoven insisted the child was emotionally unstable and just needed to sleep with Jones because he was scared. He told the Daily Beast, Chris is not a pedophile. If that's what you or anyone else's driving at.
That's what I'm driving at. Yes I have I'm driving directly into it. It seems like.
There's a lot of evidence that he's a pedophile.
Like maybe the boy's emotionally disturbed because he's being trafficked by this pedophile.
And by the way, Dabbies gets in charge with his mom, who you know, you get the feeling she makes some mistakes and we'll talk about her in a second, but she's like, he's not emotionally disturbed, Like now he might be like yeah.
But also the secretary, you didn't think that was fucking weird.
She makes a statement like I probably should have called the police, and like, yeah, lady, perhaps you should go.
Girl what I'm not.
A big fan of calling the police, but if I see a pedophile with a boy that doesn't belong to him, you have.
To do something. Like the thing to do is not just be like, well, I hope it's fine.
Enjoy the cabin.
Yeah. What you don't do is be like, here's some fresh towels, have.
A good time, enjoy your private cabin.
God damn, you're enabling pedophilia. You're discussing.
Yeah, eventually this causes enough of an uproar that there's a meeting. But with the whole community of weirdos living on da l and most of them express disbelief and shock. That can't understand why they're unhappy with him.
Right, your friend is a pedophile. You let him take a child into a cabin.
Yeah, yeah, And and Hoved responds to their complaints advanta, that's Chris. That's Chris's decision and the kid's decision. How people react to that is their decision. He's got a right to wrestle with a kid if he wants, and you've got a right to say, I'm not getting around Chris. He does not have a right to wrestle with someone else's kid.
That's not a right. You know, that's not a constitution or the Bible.
I don't know where you're getting that right from. Wow, he used to imagine like fucking Thomas Jefferson. And of course, the right to wrestle other people's children.
Well, Thomas Jefferson might have felt that way.
Actually, he himself had a thing for teenagers. So yes, as we'll be talking about in about a week. Oh good, yeah, yeah, good stuff. If you're wondering where Jones got access to this kid, it seems to be a case of his
mom is very busy. She didn't know Jones's backstory. She worked at a boost Mobile and Jones was her manager, and he had like occasionally taken her kids when she needed like a babysitter basically, And this kind of evolves to him volunteering to take one kid to Dinosaur Adventure Land, and she claims that her son later confessed that Chris molested him. She does file, she files like a complaint, but eventually has to drop it. I don't think she has a lot of resources. I think it's just kind of a.
I mean, she works at a boost Mobile.
She works at the Boose Mobile, right, She's I don't know much about this lady. I'm sure she regrets it. It sounds like a situation where she really did not have the wherewithal of the resources to pursue this the way it ought to have been pursued.
It's very sad.
Yeah, it's it's a bummer. But you know what's not a bummer.
Molly, Oh, these products and services.
These products and services.
They want molest your kids.
They sure weren't that that that we make that guarantee except for the Washington State Highway Patrol. That's not ambing.
I was going to say, we don't approve all the ads.
We do not approve all the ads. Look, we don't know who's gonna be on there.
We don't approve most of the ads.
So one of the might molester kids.
It's not a We're never going to say one hundred percent.
Either way, but it's not a definitive thing.
Let's let's just get right, let's get away from this. We're back. Ah. And it's good that we at least did the ad break there because now we're going to talk about that time a kid died on Dinosaur Adventure Land. In March of twenty twenty, a family with five young children came to visit DA l the prop as we needed.
That time you give a date, I'm like, I'm like.
Wait because this is way too recent, this is way to I was.
Like, literally because the last four years the mask not mapping. It's a blur. But uh when you when you first started showing his videos, I was like, all right, this is this is an older video.
It was the it's like this is.
Now yeah, this is now yeah, I mean this spoiler. This guy's like family go. The last thing they do before COVID is go lose one of their kids ins or adventure Land. What a what a fucked up year. So the property features a good sized pond, which Hovid is quick to note they often use for baptisms. Something went wrong while they were playing in one of the little boys, a seven year old started drowning. Several adults rushed in and they pulled this kid out, but in
the chaos, another seven year old boy goes under. The child is rushed to the hospital where they are pronounced dead. Now, in every entailed our article that you will find on dl Kent makes it clear he does not hold any insurance on the property and anyone who comes there is taking their lives into their.
Own hands, right choice.
I will say, this is the kind of tragedy that could have happened anywhere. Right. I went to a lot of swimming holes as a kid that are just out in the middle of nowhere, like shit goes down sometimes this would This isn't a.
Swimming hole, this is a theme park because it's.
Not really a theme park, like there should be a lifeguard or there definitely isn't. I don't think that's not valid, but like it's the kind of thing where like, yeah, the bastardry. I think the real evil here from Kent comes after this is negligence. Probably you can make that case. Sure, it's certainly a tragedy. Here's where it gets really fucked
up on Kent's behalf right. So his secretary claims that he goes to the hospital with the family who is in the process of losing their seven year old boy.
Oh, your lawyer would tell you not to do that.
Here, they sure would. But rather than provide focus on providing comfort to the parents, he sees the experience. Is it an opportunity to advertise for his dinosaur park quote, and this is from his secretary.
The child just dina, yes, because they already know about it.
Alter coming back.
I don't think they're No, that's not a customer.
I'll just read the quest is walking around the hospital passing out ministry cards saying come to Dinosaur Adventureland. We'll give you tours. We're free, everything's free, come see us. And I'm like, doctor Hovend, you're supposed to be sitting with the father having sympathy for it.
What are you talking about?
Hey, guysnosaur park.
I'm here because a kid just died there. But like, it's pretty cool. It's not. It's free.
It's free. It's free if you want to.
You want to lose a child, this is the cheapest way.
I know.
That's a joy.
It's wild. Wow, that's not even good marketing.
No, you want to distract attention from your dinosaur park after you kill a seven year old.
And also, just like the people at the hospital are not the target demographic for a theme park. There's no hospital.
No, but Kent knows there's It's never a wrong time to spread the Gospel of Jesus Christ. So true in the Hospital of Jesus Christ includes dinosaurs. They're a load bearing part of the.
Gospel, higher breathing dinosaurs.
So, when questioned about this by The Daily Beast, Covid replied, yes, I probably did that. My business card has the Plan of Salvation. They're actually gospel tracks, so I do that everywhere I go. I'm trying to get people saved. I'm an evangelist.
He goes on.
It sounds like me.
Yeah, yeah, that sounds like me. He goes on to say, the father of the dead boy holds no grudge and loves our ministry. In fact, he even paid to build a gazebo on the land to honor his death side.
Wow, why did you make him pay for it?
Wow?
So why didn't you build a gazebo?
Kids, there's like so many I don't know the red flags this guy, this just oh say, it's so.
Yeah, baffling. And this is after he went to prison.
Yeah, this is after prison. The new Dinosaur Adventure Land is much more elaborate than the first one. Kent eventually acquired an eighty foot tall dinosaur statue, the largest in the state of Arkansas. So that's okay. Yeah I didn't know. Yeah, I guess that makes sense, Like I wouldn't expect Arkansas I have a taller dinosaur statue. Yeah, yeah, you don't really need no, honest, man needs those call dinosaur than
eighty feet. Attendant succeeded one thousand people per year, though it is extremely difficult to get a clear idea of how many people.
Visit this place. Not very many. Actually, yeah, it does not sound that much.
I feel like I feel I feel Robert. I do feel like we should show Mollie like a couple of pictures of what this looks like.
Show me the dinosaur please people, Sophie, Yeah, I have. It's like none, none people.
Yeah, it's more people than should be visiting Dinosaur Action Land. Yeah.
Well I thought you were to say, like a thousand a day or like a week.
However many people visit, you got to take one off because of the casualty rates.
I've been looking through the Dinosaur Adventure Land. Uh, yelp page. It's it's it's a it's a fun one. But uh yeah, let me let me let me show you some photos so that you because you're like, you're like, it's a theme park, new.
Yeah. Look at that dinosaur. That's a good one, you know, surprisingly honestly surprisingly good. T rex head busting out of a building.
That What's I think these are?
Like? For how tall you have to be to ride them? You know, if your kid goes up to this point.
On the dinosaurs, there's just you know whoa Anyways, that's I.
Think that's a different one was.
Going. That looks way too good for for for dinosaur adventure then. Anyways, Yeah, just wanted Mollie to have some visuals.
Yeah. Really, it's always good to have visuals. So I think this park is less of a park and more of a tax dodge for Kent, who seems to spend most of his time there entrancing new female volunteers, marrying them, and then revealing himself to be an abusive prick in very short order. He has done this at least three times so far, after his first wife. Sometimes I've heard
allegations that he drains financial assets from them. First, his second wife, Mary Taco met Tocco, met him in twenty sixteen after, in her words, raising her five kids on his videos. So Mary may not have great judgment. She reached out to Kent at some point and spent six months communicating with him online. After this time, she traveled to DL and they got married, which lasted less than a year. In a Facebook post, she explained that the split had started when she realized the finances of DL
were not quote above board. Given Kent's past, I assume this means he's back to committing tax fraud, probably stealing donor money to fund his lifestyle. When she brought her concerns to the DL board, which she claims Kent controls,
she was pushed off. Sidney Lincoln, his third wife, claims that she also met him through his videos, which she saw while she was teaching preschoolers for what I certainly hope was some sort of Bible school in twenty sixteen, when she finished his video series, she moved to DL in a tent and wound up married a matter of days afterwards. I think by early twenty twenty, around the time that Little Boy died, she had started to see what she described as huge red flags.
Oh really, really start he saw one? You saw flag?
The pedophile might have been a big one. The tax fraud honestly might have been one. There's a lot of red flags in Ken's life. He's mostly red flags.
Really, everybody needs that one Froe that's like hey girl, yeah, hey girl, Hey.
Girl, don't marry the dinosaur man. Who's best friend this pedophile?
Hey girl?
Yeah. So things degenerated between them over the course of that first COVID year, and by the end of the year he had graduated to physical abuse, body slamming Lincoln badly enough that she had to go to the er and received a protective order against him. Hovind himself was recording audio of this moment. I think he thought that the audio. He claims it's because the audio makes it clear that Lincoln's bipolar, And like, I don't know if she is or not.
Classic if you're not a law classic move right, illgal to beat your bipolar Which is so crazy.
You're not allowed to body slam someone because they have a mental illness. That's not in the law books. Yeah, yeah, it's just a crime. In twenty twenty one, and again I don't know that she I'm not saying she is. That's what his claim is. I'm just saying it doesn't matter.
It doesn't even matter. Yeah.
Yeah. In twenty twenty one, he was convicted of domestic violence. His second wife actually testified in Cindy's defense and claimed in court that she had seen Kent't body slam a thirteen year old boy.
She wrote on Facebook.
Later, several of us w horror as he attacked this young boy, Like he went insane. It was very scary. I shouldn't be laughing, but like that's such a wild.
Thing to do.
Once again, if there's several of you around and there's one dude attacking one young boy, several let me.
Stop him from body slabbing that kid.
Several of you could do a thing.
I think the action could have been taken against Kent at an earlier point than this.
Perhaps we're a lot of a lot of sort of forked paths here, right.
Yeah, right, what did you say, some red flas.
Some residl slighting doors mode couple three.
Yeah. That same year, one of his former residents went public with allegations that Kent fraudulently entered into a trust with him in d L's name, and then broke that trust, taking something like one hundred thousand dollars. This person committed suicide in twenty twenty two, and Hoven has denied that any such trust exists. It remains unclear to me the precise nature of Kent's marital status, based on claims he's made publicly. He is now on his fourth wife in
roughly five years. Tuco, who seems to be the most activist of his ex wives, published an open letter to his fourth wife on Facebook and claimed he is legally married to Cindy and possibly me. Still, that is a felony charge.
And I.
I don't what to be mean to you because he sunds like you've been through a lot. But how are you not sure this.
Is actually this? I have looked into this. This is more common than people realize. Where they think they are divorced. I mean they filed for divorce, but they have lost track of it. And when you get married, it's honor system. Baby, When you fill out that paperwork, you check a box and say, yeah, I promise I'm not still married to anybody else. Nobody's checking, nobody's checking. A lot of people are accidentally committing bigamy.
Well, US government doesn't.
I actually don't think bigamy should be a crime, but yeah, I also think there should be like a guy who checks to be like, all right, but is this like a fucked up religious thing or or is this just like a paperwork You just want to get a couple of different marriages on your under your.
Belt, because you know a guy who does who says that, you know, God says he doesn't have to do paperwork. He probably isn't finalized it. He's probably not doing much. Yeah, because because when you finalize the divorce you have to pay the alimony.
Yeah, and he's not doing that.
No, not doing that.
Absolutely not.
So for his part, Kent's life is a monument to how much terrible shit you can get away with as a Christian Conservative. He only does thirty days in jail for that domestic violence.
Charge and more than most people get.
Yes, Yeah, unfortunately this, Yeah, this is not like the least punishment I've heard of for something like this. And the whole thing went down while he was in the process of filing a lawsuit against the federal government for his two thousand and six conviction. An analysis in Forbes notes it was based on the theory that the federal government did not have jurisdiction over Kent Hovend along with seventy six percent more or less of what we consider
the United States. He was seeking damages for a conviction that had been upheld on appeal to the Eleventh Circuit. To get damages for an unlawful conviction, you have to show that it was, you know, unlawful. The appeal was ultimately dismissed to do to the fact that Kent couldn't get his shit together to file it on time. So that's good.
Classic tell me where he's getting this seventy six percent numbers, So like four percent of people who are subject to the jurisdiction might.
Guess would be it has something to do with like the original boundaries of like the thirteen colonies or some shit like that.
Hell yeah, yeah, So if you live in Maryland, get fucked. The federal government is coming state.
Look, I've been saying for years, like most of the states aren't real, Like Wisconsin. Come on, you're gonna tell me Thomas Jefferson Wisconsin. Yeah, I don't believe in any of those. You show New Mexico to Ben Franklin and he's just going to vomit. He's going to vomit. You know he's going to be furious. So, speaking of vomiting, YouTube vomited kent up, which is why he has to be on Rumble.
Now.
I know you're just champing, which is if you're not familiar, Rumble is like kind of right wing YouTube, and I know you're just champing it.
But it doesn't work very well.
Doesn't work as well.
I was gonna say to get this clip up that you want you want me to show the listeners here. It was very annoying.
Look at the very annoying look at the advertisement.
It tells you to press skip ads, but it doesn't work till the third time because it's just giving you pop ups.
It's Yeah, as you can see on the screen, the ad right next to the video is iver next in question mark, We've got you covered.
And it's like a little case full of warm medicine. God, what else is?
Okay?
Oh it's it's Robert.
Oh my god. Okay, wait we should we should watch the let's.
Watch this clip. So this is I just want to give you an example because like most of what he does is plugged for donations. So here's how he sounds.
Today Friday starts our fishing tournament. I don't have my flyer about that. It's like a count out. I'm fishing as it's all free, okay. And then one thousand day anniversary coming up next month. Yeah, Creation boot Camp coming up July third, fourth, fifth, and sixth. You got to come down for that. Love to have you for a bunch of speakers coming in and it'd be a really cool play. You can help us to open for free with Open for Free for eight years, join our seven
seven seven club. So I like what you're doing, please keep going. You can give a dollar a date. Okay, If you can't give anything, that's fine. We're gonna keep going anyway, as long as we can contact Sandra. What was it he I was supposed to tell people, call Sandra. If you're doing PayPal right, there are still some issues if you have automatic PayPal things set up. Callsandra, make Kurt going to the right place.
You can't give him PayPal called Sandra, Call Sandra.
I think might be is I'm sure it's not his next wife then his future wife, just based on his past precedent.
I mean, I like the vibe though, where he's got he's like a low hasher.
Yeah, he's got his Hawaiian's chilling.
He's chilling.
He's pretty marginal on today's far right, thankfully.
Yeah. What's his view count?
Kind of like fifteen hundred of video, Like most of his stuff has trouble breaking fifteen hundred, So.
In terms of far right YouTube rumblers, that's the.
He's with the exception of the pedophile stuff, which I really was not happy to run into. This was a supposed to be a fun episode, like let's talk about this guy who sucks, but it's mostly wacky. Then you get the pedophile and the dead kid, and it's like, well, I guess these guys there's not really any fun ones.
That's unavoidable.
Yeah, but anyway, I hope everybody's found this to be like a nice cool glass of water.
Yeah.
Lightly, lightly, it's like a pedophile Lacroy.
Robert Robert bummed me out at the end there, but uh.
Look at her. Her head looks completely empty.
She didn't hear she heard nothing, she heard nothing. Well she's gotten, really, she's gotten really good at.
I don't know. I don't have a dog or any other kind of adorable pet with me. I do have what is for me the good book Molly. Oh, yeah, my copy of Nazis and the Occult by d Skylar. Great.
So you're having a good time.
I'm having a great time. Yeah. I got it from Howells are there used book section. It's a it's a classic. I think this was published Is this this edition come out nineteen seventy seven by Dusty scar Ah. Yeah, these are the good ones.
And then I dropped into the chat a photo of me at ken Hamm's Creation Museum riding the Tricerah tops with the saddle on really cool, I have to say you.
Yeah, almost Nazis and the occult book.
Well, everybody was like two thousand and nine maybe, and like I went. I went with my my college girlfriend and like we really thought that, like, oh, they'll be like there'll be other people there who are just like joking, right, Like there'll be other people there who just like China. No, no, no, no, no. Everyone there everyone's.
So serious, so serious about it.
Was wearing an ankle length denim skirt and pushing a triple stroller. Everyone there was so serious it was about it was. It was a mistake. It was a mistake.
Don't go wow, Mollie. Uh if people want to go follow you and your work, how can how can they do that?
How can they find me? On the rapidly degrading Twitter dot com at Socialist dog Mom. I'm trying to get back into writing my newsletter, The Devil's Advocates on Ghost and sometimes I'm sometimes I'm making a little podcast on here every now and again.
Oh yeah, well that's gonna be it for us here at Behind the Bastards this week. You know, go make a dinosaur statue, make it. You know what, Folks if you want to make me proud, if you want to you want to make eighty five feet me me a proud cult leader. Yeah, go to Arkansas and build an eighty five foot tall dinosaur. So take this away from camps. There needs to be a taller eighty one feet is fine. We just got to beat him, you know, this is how we can get some justice.
Were tall the dinosaur, the closer to God?
Yeah, we just needed to be They just needed to be eighty one feet Is that eighty one foot tall dinosaur would would give us the way?
You know, Brady one, I do, I will, I will.
Email that journalist at at arkansa or at al dot com or whatever.
Well, this has been, this is this is it. This is the end of the podcast. Goodbye. Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media. For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.