Part One: The 12 Tribes: The Worst Cult You've Never Heard Of - podcast episode cover

Part One: The 12 Tribes: The Worst Cult You've Never Heard Of

Sep 05, 20231 hr 5 min
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Episode description

Robert is joined by Alex Steed to discuss The 12 Tribes cult.

(2 Part Series)

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Transcript

Speaker 1

All right, can we are we ready?

Speaker 2

Yes? Boss?

Speaker 1

That was to me because you that was to you?

Speaker 2

Huh, you could never be in charge? Yes, employee.

Speaker 1

Wow? Wow, what's the president of this podcast? My Robert Sophie. That's right, that's right, you admitted it.

Speaker 2

Who is who is the dictator overlord of this podcast? Myself?

Speaker 1

I'm gonna be I'm gonna have Daniel cut that little bit out where you where you introduced me as boss, and then I'm gonna play that like.

Speaker 2

A I am introduced you as boss. I introduced myself as boss.

Speaker 1

No, I'm going to get a little two little buttons, one of them, one of them has you introducing me as boss, and one of them has Garrison calling Reuter's routers. And that's funny. That's gonna be all I need.

Speaker 2

That's very funny. One of one of the weird things about being associated with iHeartRadio is that I have an org chart that literally shows you as my as my employee.

Speaker 1

So wow, this is I have to ask Sophie of a minute and a half ago, who's in charge? Because I seem to recall what she said.

Speaker 2

Wow.

Speaker 1

Anyway, this is Behind the Bastards, a podcast of Vicious power struggles, where we occasionally talk about some of the worst people in all of history. Our guest this week, Alex stead of You are good the podcast and the general concept.

Speaker 3

Yeah, both, and thanks for having me.

Speaker 2

Yeah, Alex. Alex pointed out that the one time we met in person was at Jamie Loft. This is thirtieth birthday at medieval times, where we were both extremely intoxicated, and I've never felt more endeared to a guest in my.

Speaker 1

Life now, Alex. Yes, how do you feel about colts?

Speaker 3

Oh, colts? I find them fascinating. They're part of our They're part of our national history.

Speaker 1

How do you, on a similar topic, feel about the largest wildfire in Colorado State history?

Speaker 3

I have no feelings or knowledge, no feelings towards your knowledge about pro wildfires.

Speaker 1

Got it. I'm just taking notes too, you. Okay. So we're going to be talking today about a cult that I'm gonna guess most people. I had not really heard of these guys until I started digging into them. But it's it's a fascinating, real, real fascinating cult leader, real terrible journey. We're just gonna hear a lot of awful things this week, just deeply unpleasant. So are you are you ready? Are you strapped in to just have a very bad time?

Speaker 3

You know, I've listened to the show before. I know we're in for and I'm eager for the journey.

Speaker 1

Yeah, well, this one's it's been a while since we've had a good cult episode. You know. That's our bread and butter. So yeah, get ready for some bread and butter. Get ready for like the carb equivalent of sorrow. I don't know what that would be.

Speaker 2

I'm sorry, el.

Speaker 1

Existential depression maybe.

Speaker 2

So.

Speaker 1

On December thirtieth, twenty twenty one, embers from an approved trash fire caught dry vegetation on fire in the suburbs between Denver and Boulder, and inferno followed, tearing through desiccated grassland in the Rocky Mountain foothills. One hundred mile an hour winds meant that for quite some time there was no feasible manner of fighting what became known as the Marshall Fire. It killed two people and did around two

billion dollars in damage. It is to date, the most devastating wildfire in Colorado history, although give Colorado some time, I'm sure they'll break that record very soon. The way things are going for everybody ari fires. So after eighteen months of investigation, state authorities concluded that the blaze had started, likely due to smoldering embers from the aforementioned trash fire, and it was like wood trash that was being burned. The fire had started on the communal living property owned

by a little known colt called the Twelve Tribes. This sparked renewed interest in the group and the investigations that followed what inspired these episodes. I should note here that Colorado authorities opted not to charge the cult or its members with the blaze. This may seem unjust, but the logic's actually pretty solid, Like this was a trash burn, the authority showed up, the fire department gave them the go ahead. It just was the driest it's ever been.

So I'm going to say the horrible fire this cult caused probably chalked down more to climate change than the cult, But we have to start there because it's kind of the biggest recent touchstone with this cult. It is weird.

Speaker 3

If you're a cult, you don't want to remind people that you exist.

Speaker 1

No, No, you really want to not start the largest wildfire in state history because it might start a Denver Post investigation. Indeed, it's pretty good, quite good. As a basically fair man, I think it's important to acknowledge, even as we dig into how the authorities have ignored decades of allegations of child abuse committed by this cult, that

the fire that they got famous for probably not their fault. Today, the twelve Tribes number about three thousand members somewhere around there, although we have no insight into their actual numbers because they are a very shady cult. We do know they own about thirty six million dollars in real estate in the United States, and they operate communes in twenty two states,

so there's a lot of these communities. And they also operate a lot of businesses, which we'll be talking about later, mostly like little cafes and restaurants and enormous construction companies. So one thing that interested me right away with this cult is that while it's got a charismatic founder who goes mad with power, it may have functioned in most of its history is in a less like centralized manner, right where the cult leader was kind of potentially usurped

at some point by his equally sketchy wife. It's kind of hard to say exactly because the life of the cult founder Eugene Spriggs is a little bit obscure. But we're going to do our best here to pull back the veil about this guy and what happens to him. So, Elbert Eugene Spriggs Junior gets born on May eighteenth, nineteen thirty seven to a devout Methodist family in East Ridge, Tennessee.

His childhood is mostly a mystery to us. I can tell you his dad was named Elbert Senior, which is ridiculous, and his mother wasn't Mabel, So he's like very thirties kid, right, Mabel and Albert, Like that's like you can only be grandparents, Like while you're I think you get like skipped over straight to their grandparents stage. If you've got old people names like that.

Speaker 3

Yeah, and they're out of they're out of Tennessee. This is like a scene from Pearl Yeah.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Try and also just like try to imagine an eighteen year old Albert, Like it's impossible, you can't do it. It can't like cannot be done.

Speaker 3

To Benjamin Button suation, Yeah.

Speaker 1

I do. I want to. I'm never gonna have a kid, but I want to, like try and start a movement of like gen Z kids to bring back some of these ridiculous old timey names like I want a bunch of gin Alpha Mabels, like a lot of little baby Mabel and Ethel's. Like wandering around.

Speaker 2

I did meet a very nice dog named Mabel once.

Speaker 1

She was we Yeah, but dog. She was a called dog's anything.

Speaker 2

She was a Corgie. She was just doing she was sniffing, and her name was Mabel and it worked so good. Can we have a dog exception?

Speaker 1

There's always a dog exception.

Speaker 3

I know I knew a Mabel named after Maybel Carter as a dog. So yeah, I guess that's a that's a two of them.

Speaker 1

That's a popular dog, that's very popul Yeah, seems like Mabel's the hot new dog name. Everybody's everybody's going with. Why not name your kid Mabel? You know what, bring it back. That's how we get back some of those good thirties values, like smoking lots of cigarettes.

Speaker 3

And putting kids to work.

Speaker 1

Yeah, because like Elbert's a cigarette name, Like Elbert's fucking like smoking the way people just can't smoke today. Yeah, that's what you know about him. So very religious family like again, Hella Methodist. They went to church three times a week on a pretty regular basis. Just a nightmare life. One bio I found notes that Eugene Spriggs was a football stand out at Central High School, so we can

assume a handful of childhood head injuries. He graduated and moved to Chattanooga to attend the University of Tennessee, where he got a degree in psychology. Now. A paper I found on the Virginia Commonwealth University website describes his young life as unsettled in a number of ways, as he held a succession of jobs pretty wide variety, everything from like labor jobs and stuff to he was a high school guidance counselor. For a spell, he was the tour

director of a travel agency. He did a stint in the army, and he seemed to have unusual difficulties staying in relationships. This is a at this point fifties guy who gets divorced three times. Oh yeah, you don't run into that a lot. That means you're really running through like you got to be absolutely And it seems like he is leaving them right like he has one kid and wife takes it. I don't know it's a little

unclear to me what happened in each relationship. But that's not a common story in this period of time.

Speaker 3

No, not, Although it feels like a common story with male cult leaders. It does at this at this time that there's like a couple wives before you find one who's like, let's I like your zany ideas, let's.

Speaker 1

Move on it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and he does you actually have predicted where this goes because wife number four is going to be down to clown.

Speaker 3

This already sounds a lot like I forget the name of the cult. But then Tony Alamo, Yeah, who makes the like beaded jackets. This is almost exactly his story.

Speaker 1

Art well, it's also I mean it's not l Ron Hubbard, like he did everything extra panache, but he gets is divorced basically two or three times before he finds the lady who's going to go to prison for him for infiltrating the FBI.

Speaker 3

It's a high standard really to be like, will you go to jail if it comes to it.

Speaker 1

Yeah. So anyway, listeners, what you should take from this is that if you're looking to start your own cult, get divorced a lot. I mean, I mean, because honestly, unless you're able to, unless you've got real experience abandoning fan, then you're not going to have the kind of emotional distance that it takes to be a good cult leader. It's just basic sense.

Speaker 2

You know.

Speaker 1

You can you can learn more about this in my in my forty two hundred dollars weekend course Divorce Your Way to Leadership Skills.

Speaker 3

Yeah. I think Robert has a free PDF about this.

Speaker 2

Of course.

Speaker 1

Yeah, of course, Sophie, you're you're my dealer basically. So by age yeah, by age thirty two, Spriggs is super divorce, the most divorced man in the nineteen sixties and working as a carnie in Chattanouga, which is so funny, like he is living the most depressing divorced skill.

Speaker 3

Like if you were doing that today.

Speaker 1

It would be word oh yeah, yeah. So he's he's a divorced Carney doing divorced Carni shit in fucking Chattanouga, which is a rough place to be a divorced Carti. And then he hears the voice of God ask him a question, is this what I created you for? Hell? Normally that's like you should go to the doctor. Experience, right, Spriggs does not do that. In fairness, doctors didn't really exist back then, so he would later claim that his time as a carney had given him an intimate look

into the most sinful and debauched aspects of life. This is the only thing he says that I think is probably true, because I've known some carnies and they all report that love them. So he decides this is not what God has in mind for him, and so he follows a large percentage of his generation and fucks off to California. Now, the late sixties early seventies are famous in this country for having been the age of the Hippie movement and its disillusionment and collapse into what eventually

became the soulless corporatism of the Reagan era. Now, I think the fact that the hippie movement gets so much play in media in part because like the kind of people who made movies and shit were likely to be as kids, the kind of people who were into that social movement. There's this like belief among people that it was the generation that spawned that movement was much more radical than they were. The Boomers were always a very conservative generation.

Speaker 3

Yeah, the whole like hippies were the way people are. Thing drives me nuts.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it was not. I mean, hippies weren't the way hippies are, like you talk to people like. For one thing, it was still a very homophobic, very like most people who were who would have called themselves hippies held to some what we would call very traditional values about sexuality and gender still. And it was also just like most people like that, like the fringe, who were super progressive anti war, hippies were not anything close to a majority.

And one of the things that kind of makes this point is that at the same time that the hippie movement, you know, is kind of winding down, another major cultural trend is happening that tends to get left out of popular histories of the era. Have you heard of the Jesus Movement?

Speaker 3

No?

Speaker 1

Yeah, So these are kind of a mirror of the hippies in that, like most of the Gjesis movement, people who get swept up in this, they're like they've got long hair, they're kind of unkemped. Most many of them have dropped out of society. It is a lot of the same kind of you know, living in buses, traveling around doing like handcrafts. A lot of them people are like pooling resources to you know, start farms and stuff together,

back to the land. And the thing that kind of separates them from the hippies is that the Jesus Movement sees Christ as a counter culture hero, so they are kind of Jesus. Yeah, yeah, hippie. There is like a bit of that going on, but it's still it is, as we'll talk about, still quite conservative. Now.

Speaker 3

When I went to church as a kid, like this is how they sold me on Jesus. Yeah, it was like there were it was clearly people who got into Jesus in one way or another from because I grew up in Maine. There were a couple of different kinds of back to the Landers. There were like the hippie hippies, and there were religious hippies, and those were the ones who sold Jesus as like a social justice figure.

Speaker 1

Yeah, and this is because you get the Jesus Movement, some of the what splinters out of it is going to be kind of more progressive. Jesus, you know, was fighting against these injustices that are still present with us today.

But a lot of it's going to lead to the religious right, like it feeds directly because you have kind of Jesus movement is sort of late sixties through parts of the seventies and kind of that's also right around when you know, in the late seventies you get Jerry Folwell start to emerge, you get the religious right welded into this political coalition for the first time. Yeah, so the people who get swept up in this generally called either Jesus people or Jesus freaks. That is where the

term Jesus freak comes from. And yeah, it's a charismatic movement. It's cross denominational, So there are Catholics who like sects

of Catholics who are part of this Jesus movement. There's Protestants in it, and it's like a lot of different organizations, lots of different churches that you can just kind of like broadly call part of the Jesus movement, not because they're part of the same thing with each other, right, Like, if you have this sort of hardcore Protestant, you know church, that's Jesus movement, they're not the same thing as Catholics who might also be swept up in it, but the

similarity they have is that like they're all adopting this really like charismatic kind of countercultural attitude towards their religious worship.

Followers would often speak in tongues. That's a big part of like when that gets more popular in the United States, and there's generally a big focus on what's called the gifts of the Spirit, which is like restoring this kind of sense of a direct connection personal connection to God usually an a static connection, right, So this is part of why you get these like big tint revival worship ceremonies.

A really good documentary to watch if you want to understand the texture of this movement in time is Marjo M A. R. Joe. It's about this kid, Marjo Gortner, who was like the youngest priest in the country. It was kind of a carnival sideshow grift run by his parents, but he went back as an adult to film behind the scenes and it shows a lot of this period you can get Are you.

Speaker 3

Aware of where this was happening, Like did it all over spring out of one geopiece?

Speaker 2

No?

Speaker 1

So okay, all I think it does start in the West Coast, Like I think that's where you sat, like California, but it spreads everywhere. As we'll talk about these guys are very much a Jesus movement. Story, Eugene Spriggs is going to be a Jesus movement, like that's when he kind of starts becoming a religious leader. And they do embody to an extent a big wing of it. And again, when we talk about the Jesus movement, it's not like

a cult. It's not like a one thing, right, It's like a bunch of different in some cases, very much like opposed different sort of religious organizations, traditions, communities. They're just kind of bound together by certain similarities as a

result of this cultural moment. Yeah, and it's also worth noting that, like a lot of people who get pulled into the Jesus movement, there's a big focus on this idea of like returning to the lifestyles of early Christians, which is part of what convinces them of Like why a lot of them do sort of the back to the land shit, right, Like that's a big thing for them. This helps them kind of blend in with the hippies, right, And often Jesus freaks are people who had been hippies a few years earlier.

Speaker 3

Yea.

Speaker 1

Their lives in a lot of cases collapse, they get criminal chargers or something, or they have you know, they burn out, you know, as a result of drug use or whatever. And then there's this kind of movement that has some aspects of values that are similar to the thing that had brought them in that they can you know that they wound up getting swept up in not an uncommon story.

Speaker 3

Yes, it's super common. I mean I did a podcast series a couple of years ago on Tony Alamo and the in his religious cult, and this is it's almost exactly beat for beat. Like they started in like sixty nine in Hollywood, and they were attracting just burned like hippies who are burned out on being hippies into Jesus.

Speaker 1

Yeah this makes sense. Yeah, yeah, and yeah, a lot of Jesus freaks wound up living in communes practicing versions of religious aestheticism. We see echoes of like modern trad culture in this. A lot of it is this sort of reaction to especially like feminism and stuff. There's this attitude of like the necessity of returning to traditional roles

were changing in the wrong direction. Some of this is tied to the Cold War as well, particularly fears of nuclear war and how that merges with Christian apocalyptic prophecy. One of the key books of the Jesus movement is how Lindsay's The Late Great Planet Earth. And if you if you grew up as an evangelical kid, you probably heard about that book. It is hugely influential to these people. We can't actually know if Spriggs had the vision he

claims he had in nineteen sixty nine. I kind of think he may have falsified that because it's an auspicious year for the counterculture. You know, if you're gonna talk about like, that's the year you do it. Part of why I suspect this is because some versions of the Spriggs story say that, you know, God came to him during his Carnie days in nineteen seventy, you know, a year later, whatever the case. After the late sixties, you know, as the nineteen seventies start, he does become very quickly

like a player. In the newly energized Christian fringe, write up by The Times Free Press notes, while in California, he devoted his life to creating a ministry. According to reporting at the time by the Chattanooga News Free Press. Spriggs said he wanted to reach young people who were not going to church, particularly those turned off of faith

from their parents. That's interesting to me, like he's very much focusing on young people who especially this kind of very staid, stolid Protestantism that's really turn of the century, these very quiet, austere churches that still have kind of some of these Victorian attitudes and worship is very much

like channeled through the pastor. A big part of what he's doing is like, no, we want like personal, astatic connections, and that's what will bring these young people back who kind of got burnt out of these very authoritarian churches of their youths. This is going to be ironic considering where Spriggs ends up.

Speaker 3

It often is, isn't it.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, yeah. In nineteen seventy two, he gets hitched for the fourth time and what will be the final time, to a woman named Marcia and Duval. By all accounts, Marsia shares his spiritual obsession. The two move away from these in full California coast and back to Chattanooga, where they found a Bible study group for young people that they call the Vine Christian community church named after their home, the Vine House, and they bring some California people with them.

The Jesus movement is appealing to disillusioned dropouts, to former war protesters and stuff like that, and Jean realizes early on that these people are the easiest converts to his church because like dropouts people with criminal records, they tend to be desperate, and so he offers them what they need if they'll attend his services, and he starts opening his house to worshippers right, being like, if you're coming to church here, you can live with me, you know,

like your food and whatnot will be taken care of. And so by nineteen seventy four there are between fifty and sixty people living with the Sprigses in their house, which must have smelled fascinating. That's too many people for one house. Perhaps because of this, they start asking their followers to pool their resources, and this is a limited

affair at first. They're kind of just asking for donations, right, you know, if you do have money, if you've got family money or something, or you have savings when you come here, maybe give us some of it so we can pay for these other people who who have nothing.

Speaker 2

And this.

Speaker 1

They do well enough at this they're able to accrue a decent amount of money, and they purchase three additional homes in Chattanooga, and they buy a restaurant which they call the Yellow Deli. This becomes known as a place in town where if you're a runaway or a hitchhiker you can get a free meal. So a lot of

people show up because, like, you know, they're starving. Yeah, and when they're starving, that's a really good way to just kind of pull people into what is becoming a cult, right, you know, that's your little fishing lure.

Speaker 3

Any move like that. That's the tricky thing, is like any movement usually starts with taking disillusion to people and giving them a reason and giving them some resources or making available some resources. But it gets it's usually just like what happens after that step where you determine is this going to be a cult or is this going to be a social movement or is it going to be a little of both?

Speaker 1

Yeah, that is that is exactly the kind of situation here, and it's got to lean cult. Uh spoilers, because this is the show that it is.

Speaker 3

Well, it's like, if you think about just the commonalities of this and again Alamo and then just like Elijah Muhammett was sending people five dollars bills in prison, like it's it's a it's a great way to endear people to you.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it's this. It's this thing that the uh the wind friends and influence people like influencer grindset talk about a lot, but it is a real factor, like the reciprocity effect, right, where like if somebody gives you something, you feel like a psychological need to give them something to return the favor.

Speaker 2

Right.

Speaker 3

It's just the fact that just the fact that Manson loved that book and in Dianetics just like makes all this and that just explains it all for you.

Speaker 1

It is. It is like exactly the books. Like at some point somebody is gonna feed those books to an ai and we're gonna have a real fucking problem on our heads because, like you, they're just going to create l Ron Hubbard the fucking chat bot. Very much.

Speaker 2

Looking forward, that's such a good idea. Can I have ten percent?

Speaker 1

Yeah? Absolutely I do. I am. I I am looking forward to when a bunch of like weirdo online influencer freaks like feed the right combination of books to a chatbot and convince themselves they've created a god.

Speaker 2

But also, why has it scientology made an l Ron Hubbard? AI like that, Oh they will, they will the lrih box, Like why haven't they done that?

Speaker 1

Because I would you know what, I would pay them money for that. I want that on my phone. I want to run all of my life decisions by the l Ron Hubbard.

Speaker 2

Why haven't But I mean, obviously it's because they even miscatches wouldn't have power, But like, why haven't they done that in a strategic way? It doesn't make sense, like you're still putting the clothes out, Like why why haven't you done that?

Speaker 1

Well, I think they're probably don't.

Speaker 2

Take no scientologists, you're despicable, But.

Speaker 1

I feel like you gotta know, like what I would like is a robot in my pocket that when I'm like what should I do in this situation? Says you should kidnap your own daughter and to Cuba because I've been looking for an excuse to go have a nice vacation there. You know, I've always wanted to see Cuba, and I feel like this could make it easier for me. So yeah, I'll kidnap somebody's daughter. Look, kids, you know it's there. They're small. Yeah, there's all all sorts of

kids all around, so it's easy to find one. Anyway.

Speaker 3

It's not your fault if the scientology AI told you to do.

Speaker 1

It exactly, That's exactly what I'm going to say in court. And you know who else loves abduction?

Speaker 2

Where are you going with this?

Speaker 1

It's it's time for ads, So okay.

Speaker 2

But where are you going with this? Uh?

Speaker 1

To Cuba hopefully. Oh. We are just having a great time here talking about the beautiful birth of what's going to become quite a cult. So in one local news article about the Yellow Darties, if you will, the spark, yeah, and really the start of the like the little campfire from which they're going to burn down all of Colorado

is the Yellow Deli. And one local news article about the deli's opening, Spriggs said, when people ask us who our interior designer is, we tell them we have the same one Noah had, which is an interesting like basically saying like God helped us design the interior, which I think means they probably did not have fire escapes. Seems like I thing God would miss. Spriggs was not at this point, openly describing what he was doing as separate

from mainstream Christianity. In fact, he and his followers were careful to maintain regular attendance at a local church, First Presbyterian, because it's you know, like, even if you're doing an ostensibly Christian movement, there's nobody who's going to get pissed at you faster than like old conservative church goers. Right.

So if you're doing this weird thing, if you're living with dozens of people and like convincing all the dropouts and hippies to move in with you and buying up large amounts of real estate, you really want to allay their suspicions. When he is asked by a journalist during this period of time about his plans for the future, Spriggs says, this, can you imagine what a wonderful thing it would be to have Yellow Delis all over America, a restaurant with good food for everyone in the community.

But it would be a place to reach all the runaways who are passing through, or all the young people who are tired and mixed up. These people are not going to church. Sometimes they stop at shelters and guidance. People beat around the Bush. They don't tell it simple like it is, Jesus loves you. You can be happy. Let God run your life, you know.

Speaker 2

With God helping them build that. I really hope they got flood insurance.

Speaker 1

Oh no, God does not believe in flood insurance. That's not having enough faith in him, right.

Speaker 3

Yeah, Heaven is the insurance, I guess.

Speaker 1

Yeah, Heaven is your flood insurance.

Speaker 3

It's wild because this is the same time. I mean, I know, I know how much is happening at this time, but I never really think about all of the individual pinpointed moments. Is this is also the same time that they're opening the Source Family restaurant in La Is sixty nine, and they're like that's their gateway into their cult. So yeah, having like a branded hangout cafe spot was like the way to go, you know.

Speaker 1

So Reading California, where I used to live off and on for years, is run by a cult. Like there's a big church in town that absolutely runs everything. The police, politics like it and are increasingly like an iron grip

on it. And I used to I used to work because like we had no internet for a long time in the trailer in the mountains that we lived in I used to have to go drive every day to this play I thing was called It's absolutely a part of this like fucking church thing all very like a lot of people having like evangelical conversations, like you know, pulling in someone from off the street, some trimmer or whatever and having very earnest talks with them about Jesus.

It was that's where I wrote a lot of what became the first season of It Could happen here. It's like sitting in this cafe with all of these like hardcore Christian right fanatics who were very very carefully trying to expand their little king them quite successfully.

Speaker 3

You're like, in fact, it's happening right before.

Speaker 1

It is in fact happening right here. Yeah, fun town, Uh, don't go there unarmed reading, So we're gonna have like three reading listeners laughing a lot of times.

Speaker 3

Actually, my brother's college roommates from Reading, so I look forward to asking him some follow up questions.

Speaker 1

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, we may be covering them more in the future since I don't have to go back to that fucking town anymore. So the stuff that Spriggs is saying about, like yeah, we want to use these cafes to find these young people who are tired and

mixed up. You know, this is the seventies. This is the fucking easy writer era, right these Like the fact that there's all these young people have kind of dropped out is a major like kind it's not really a culture war touchstone, but it's like a major concern, particularly for like older, more conservative Americans, And so this line plays well with them, you know, particularly well with people who might have been put off by the fact that

he's kind of created a commune in their town. But there are some signs from the beginning that Spriggs was heading in an settling direction. In that same interview, he expressed that another one of his goals was to reach people who had dropped out of Christianity because they didn't like the faith that their parents had expressed. And this line from him is really interesting. You can't fool a dog or a child can see the hypocrisy and the

phoniness in their parents' lives. Their parents take alcohol, tranquilizers, cigarettes, or they disobey speed laws, yet they want their children to stay off drugs and obey all laws. Which is not an inherently bad point, right that, like there's this very like conservative backlash era happening in the particularly in the seventies, but it's being kind of perpetrated by these people who are on what we now call some of the most dangerous benzos in the world. Right.

Speaker 3

He also, that's also like a very like cool youth pastor thing to say. Yeah, and then you're like, you know who else disobeyed laws?

Speaker 1

Yeah, exactly? Jesus. Well, I actually think Jesus would have been a fucking well. Anyway, we can talk about what drugs I think I may have bought from Jesus Christ, but that's that's a separate story for another day. This was such a suit. Yeah, this was such a success that they next opened a coffeehouse and started ministering the

local kids who were disillusioned with mainstream society. Sometimes the cults sent members out into the world to find new members in places where they thought people struggling on the fringe would congregate. This culminated in them for years. They would send a bus to follow the Grateful Dead on concert tours, and hand picked members would offer first aid and food to fans coming up or down on the various substances. Yeah, I do kind of I have this this beautiful image in my head of like the this

cult bust crashing into the nitrous mafia's bus. I don't know who would have won that fight. So Jeene Spriggs promises all of his recruits, you know that if they work hard, he'll take care of them. You know, they won't have any unmet physical needs. All he needs is their yeah, their their labor, and their unyielding religious evoce. And he also promises you'll never be lonely again. Everyone lives communally in the cult, and they work communally too.

They start to call themselves the Light Brigade in this period of time. They're not going to stick with that name very long because it's a dog shit name and it's one of those things. You don't have any autonomy

when you're in the Light Brigade. But you also you're not exposed to capitalism, right, and that like you don't have to worry about winding up on the street, you don't have to worry about starving like that is a huge part of the appeal right especially again, this is a lot of these people are folks who had been swept up in the big social movements of the sixties.

And now they're kind of dealing with how a lot of that failed, how chaotic and scary the world seems in the seventies, the promise that like you can forget all of that and forget interfacing with a confusing and chaotic world. Like that's appealing, right, that is objectively, that is appealing, Like a lot of people. Why it's why, Like folks in our generation idolize this this kind of mythical idea of like living on a farm with your friends.

Speaker 3

God, yeah, and then you live on a fucking farm. Yeah that's the downside.

Speaker 1

Yeah, Like I live on a farm kind of it's a small one, but we don't like there's no attempt to like make a lifting or survive purely by that, because that's like a huge amount of work.

Speaker 3

Exactly. You get blake and no one eats for a year. It's bad. It's a bad time.

Speaker 1

No, I think.

Speaker 3

I do think that like the real sign of maturity, the eventual real sign of maturity is just like accepting no orientation or situation is gonna be good and they're all gonna suck a lot.

Speaker 1

Yeah. Yeah, there's there's like dog shit that you have to deal with no matter what.

Speaker 3

You do, You're you're gonna eat shit somewhere somewhere on the journey.

Speaker 1

The I think the appeal to something like that, it's the it's the inherent appeal of dropping out right, of like realizing how complex the problems are, and like, well, I just want an option that means I don't have to think about them, because then I can pretend it's not happening. You know, maybe I can escape, maybe I will be safe. And obviously the fact that all of Canada burned down this year as evidence that no, you can't be But we don't need to harp on that.

Everyone is aware of that, right, We're preaching to a large choir here, so.

Speaker 3

And everyone has the vibe of people who know.

Speaker 1

Yeah. I wanted to provide some context from one of the desperate young people lured in by Jean's cult, and I found it. This is a later account from two thousand and six, but I think it holds up. It's from an issue of the local Chattanoogan paper, The Chattanoogan titled I Escaped from the Yellow Deli quote. You would have to understand my situation at the time to understand

how I was influenced by these people. I was twenty one years old and just got out of a three year abusive relationship, renting a room in a house in Saint Elmo, no direction and no family to turn to. They told me what I needed to hear. They loved me, and God loved me, and I could come live with them. When I became convinced, two members moved me out of

my little room at three am. I was driven to their commune in Dalton, Georgia, and like, yeah, I think that gets across, Like, yeah, it was in an abusive relationship. I got out. I've got no family, I've got this apart I can't afford it solves. They offer to solve all your problems as long as you want the Jesus. At first, the Light Brigade and the Weinhaus Church were augments to the local Christian culture, not a wild new

vision of worship. This changes in nineteen seventy five when First Presbyterian makes the decision to cancel a Sunday worship session so that their pastor can go watch the Super Bowl. Right, He's like, you know it, don't come in Sunday, Like we're all going to go to the game anyway. Right, this is kind of a cool thing to do if you're a seventies preacher. But this is like Gene finds this offensive. Right, you don't skip worship for any reason,

especially not this like profane worldly game. So he uses this as an excuse to break his flock away from the church entirely and start hosting Sunday services in a local park instead. This increases his hold over his flock, who now become They had been part of the community before. Right, you're going to church with everybody, you're somewhat tied to it from this point now they're only socializing and working with each other. Right, This is kind of he severed

this like cord that they had to everyone else. This also brings Spriggs his first real opposition, because once the cult kind of steps away from this church, locals start to be like, this does kind of seem like a problem, like this cult. So from seventy five to seventy eight, local churches register protests against the Light Brigade. When Spriggs is spotted performing public baptisms, local papers start running the

first articles accusing them of being a cult. Two local colleges ban their students from eating at the Yellow Deli after enough former students had dropped out to join the Spriggs cult, Like it's becomes such a problem of them like poaching college students. I'm guessing they're kids who were you know, you're in college, you find that you don't like your major as much as you thought, or you get stressed out during exams. You're poor, so you go to the Yellow Deli for a free meal, and they're

like boys, seems like college isn't making you happy. You know it'll make you happy.

Speaker 3

The difference in your where your life turns out could just be like one free sandwich.

Speaker 1

Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3

Just there's so many times in my life where if I got the free sandwich from the wrong place, I would have been screwed.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I mean I know a lot of like former punk kids who are anarchists because the food not bombs people showed up and gave them sandwiches and.

Speaker 3

Bombs is how I same. It's how I turned from a libertarian kid to a anarchist punk kid.

Speaker 1

Yeah. And this is always the case with colts, right where like the things that let colts, I'm not going food not bombs a cult. I'm saying that, like the thing that colts use is something that also has a good site. It's good to give people things, it's good to take care of people who are desperate. If you're doing that because you like people and you want them

to have an easier time, that's good. If you're doing it because you want them to like feel a sense of obligation to you so that you can rope them into your your cult, that's bad, right, Yeah, real estate scheme. Yeah, the key a big part of it. Whenever somebody is like showing up and handing out free food, is like, yeah, who's behind this. Is it just a bunch of people coming together to help out the community, or is they're

a guy. Is there like a dude and this is his thing, you know, then then maybe it's a cult. Then maybe you should get your cult mace out.

Speaker 3

So, oh my god.

Speaker 1

I found one story from a student, actually the student who was the author of that article in the Chattanooga I quote earlier, who talks about like the process of being like recruited and forced to drop out of college by these people. Quote they believe that anything in the outside world was evil, And they drove me to Chattanooga State where I was attending to withdraw me. When I told my counselor what I was doing, he just shook

his head. I told him I found Jesus and these people loved me and were going to take care of me. So they have they build over the years, like a pretty steady process for like disenrolling kids from college when they when they convert them, like it's enough of a thing that like not only dose schools try to ban their students from going to this cafe, but like everyone who works their nose, like, oh shit, we lost another one to the fucking cult.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

So in nineteen seventy eight things come to a head, because that's the Jonestown year, right, Congress, when Leo Ryan and several other people are gunned down in the jungle by a cult. The cult then commits mass suicide. This makes a lot of people very unhappy, really freaks out the country.

Speaker 3

Yeah, it was the golden era to have a cult was, you know, was like sixty seven to seventy eight.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, exactly with.

Speaker 3

The little bit Yeah the Manson blit, but you could still get away with a lot.

Speaker 1

In this effen Yeah. Yeah, this puts an end to that, right, This launches what Spriggs would later call anti cult hysteria in the United States. He says that, like it's a bad thing. Yeah, I don't feel like it's hysteria. This is like clear evidence, you know, Jonestown was clear evidence of a problem. Yeah. So by this point, Jeans Spring Yeah, yeah, yeah, I like one hundred and seventy was like a lot of people are dead now, a little more than a scare.

They shot a congressman. That's so wild. I imagine if that happened today.

Speaker 3

Yeah, they like ran, oh my god, helicopters, there was action. It's yeah, like I cannot believe that that happened. Still, yeah, I can, obviously, but it's yeah, it's it's so specific and in a lot of ways, Jill's like destined to be born of this country, even though it didn't happen here.

Speaker 1

Well, I mean, the most unbelievable thing about it is that a congress person actually did something right, like heroically, Yeah, pretty heroically. Yeah. So, by this point, Jean Spriggs had developed a new name for his cult, the Twelve Tribes, so named in honor of the fact that he was one of the first guys in the Christian fringe to start incorporating Judaism into his Christian cult right, and this

is a very common thing. Now you might not think about it that way, but if you've ever seen, if you've been to one of these far right gatherings where there's like a lot of religious right people and someone will bring like a show far which is like a horn made out of like an animal horn that you blow into that's like comes from Jewish religious observances, right, that like some Christians have reincorporated back into Evangelicalism, I think because a chofar looks cool and they want But yeah,

he's like kind of the first guy to do this in a big way in the Christian right. And he's more extensive than this. He brings the show far in. He also brings back bar mitzvahs, like kids in his cults celebrate have their bar mitzvahs and bot mitzvahs, And this, you know, is interesting. It's certainly going to play into ways in which other far right like religious cults are

going to move in the future. But it makes them seem more alien to the normies of Chattanooga, who by this point are in kind of a full blown panic that the next jonestown might be in their backyard. Another thing that makes them seem ainly into the normies is that by the late seventies, Spriggs had decided that separation was the critical precondition for his cult to reach the potential that God had set for them. And I'm going

to quote from that write up by vcu here. Twelve Tribes has concluded that adherence to a natural law standard will not be sufficient to create the conditions for the return of the Messiah. Separation is critical for the Twelve Tribes because the absolute values of natural law are being lost in contemporary society. The Twelve Tribes opposed the rise of a multicultural global social order a single world government

in world religion. The former revitalizes values. The latter undermines and compromises the values of natural law and promotes rampant materialism and acquisitiveness, feminism, the devise of the traditional patriarchal family, and the legitimation of gay marriage. The return of the Messiah is contingent on the gathering of a faithful remnant

and the Church being restored in its original form. To pave the way for the millennium, the movement must expand from its present nine to twelve Tribes each of which must grow to at least twelve hundred members, thus creating one hundred and forty four thousand faithful who will be included in God's millennial kingdom. Now, a lot of that's very modern. Gene as a trailblazer in some of this stuff.

It's interesting. I've seen it claim that Gene's particular eschatology, he didn't just need one hundred and forty four thousand faithful to prepare for the way of the Messiah, but he had to build an army of one hundred and forty four thousand male virgins and tall order, yeah, tall, tall order. It is at this point I should also note that, according to the Church, Gene was a scout master at one point. They brag about this a lot. So you hear about a scout master trying to get

one hundred and forty four thousand male virgins together. That's not a happy story, right now, that's going to end bad. That is rough. Yeah. Yeah, Also too many male virgins, like nothing good can happen with all that, all that pentemic.

Speaker 3

Then you need like one hundred and forty four thousand male non virgins order to have.

Speaker 1

To counteract it. Yeah, So to stop it from exploding. Yeah, so Jane decided it was probably wise if his cult branched out and started picking up property and members in another state where they might be more welcome. Right, this is fine cult logic. It's the kind of savvy maneuvering that made scientology great. But Spriggs underestimated the degree to which small towns Americans get scared based on news stories

that they kind of skimmed. He also made the mistake of having the mission to Vermont led by one of his longest serving members, a guy named David Jones. David had joined the Twelve Tribes back in nineteen seventy three as a traumatized Vietnam veteran fresh from the war. He'd

become one of Jane's most trusted lieutenants. Unfortunately, his last name was Jones, and the provincial residence of Island Pond, Vermont, started like as soon as they hear a guy named Jones has moved here with his like weird religious congregation, They're like, he has to be related to Jim Jones.

Speaker 3

You can't google it. Yeah, it's like there's no You're just gonna take it on. Take it on. Toys value that he's not.

Speaker 1

It's like it is funny, Like it would be one thing if he had like some very complicated, rare last name, but being like they're both Joneses. Yeah, there's probably fucking forty Joneses in town. What are you talking about, you fucking small town maniacs. Like they're right to be concerned about this people, but they're still there's still dummies. So from the beginning, the Twelve Tribes attracted eyeballs in Vermont. Now the reason for this is dumb obviously, like that

they think this guy is related to Jim Jones. But they ought to be watching these people because there are absolutely good reasons to be monitoring the Twelve Tribes. They just have nothing to do with Jonestown.

Speaker 3

That's another just classic American story where it's like, you have good reason to be concerned about this, and it just so happens that the reason you are concerned is not the right one.

Speaker 1

Yeah, you picked the wrong one. And the good reason to do this is the fact that by the late seventies, Jeane had built his entire religious philosophy. Philosophy this is like the core of what he actually is teaching in the Twelve Tribes now around beating the shit out of kids.

Like right, This starts off as sort of this, you know, we're going back to the original Christianity, and over the first decade or so it exists, he kind of builds this religious philosophy where he decides the chief problems of the world are all caused by disobedience to God's law, and so the only way to correct that is to raise up a new generation of kids by absolutely beating the piss out of them. And that is going to be That is the Twelve Tribes, right. It is the

let's hit the shit out of kids cult. Terrible way to go to ads, but here they are. We're back now. By this point in the story, Gene has also taken a new name for himself and the tradition of most great cult leaders, Yonick, which Hebrew comes from the Bible. His followers called him an apostle, and there's debate from former members as to whether or not yon Neck was all powerful or just a major source of charismatic authority, but he certainly was not the only source of prophetic

revelations for the group. It does seem fair, though, to say that Yonick set the tone and focus for the church and that his primary concern was children. In the early days, Spriggs had claimed his goal was to bring kids on the fringe, counterculture types who had like dropped out of the Middle America Christianity of their parents back to God. But now in the mid to late seventies, late seventies, early eighties, he starts to claim having a different goal, which is to build a church that it

would be impossible for children to leave. Right like that is his He goes from I want to bring kids back to the church to I want to break their little minds in such a way that they never disobey their parents, that they never leave us. You know, now, part of how he does this is isolation. He starts mandating church kids are not even allowed to be born outside of the compounds. Right, you can't go to a hospital to have your kids. You certainly can't have them

educated in public schools. They're never going to work a job on their own. They'll be apprenticed within church businesses. We have created our own parallel society so that they can't escape and to make any kind of deviation impossible. Spriggs devoted his biblical knowledge to creating a protocol of rigorous abuse described in his brochure. When the spanking stopped, all hell broke loose.

Speaker 3

Oh my god.

Speaker 1

Yeah, that's a good one. Yeah, solid name there. Yeah. I'm going to quote a description of this pamphlet from an excellent article in Pacific Standard magazine. It cites Proverbs thirteen twenty four. He who spares his rod hates his son, but he who loves disciplines him promptly to make the following argument. If you love your child, and you, if you love your child, you will take up the rod and discipline him when he's disobedient. It's not optional, it's

a command. The tribes argue that progressive child bearing practices such as timeouts, are taking away treats or screen time, have resulted in a spike in juvenile violence and crime. The only way to reverse this trend, the tribes contends, is by using the proverbial rod early, often, and hard

enough to leave marx. According to former and current tribes leaders I spoke with, infants raised in the tribes are hit with balloon sticks, thin wooden rods used to keep balloons from floating away for offenses as minor as resisting a diaper change or throwing a bottle. Older children are whipped with bamboo canes. Children are driven by their natural innate nature to do what is wrong. The group's teaching state, it is better to go to heaven with welts than

go to hell without weltz. That's Gene Spriggs right there.

Speaker 3

My god, I can't yeah, like, I can't imagine how they reconcile when kids eventually obviously leave the church, Like, there must be there must be. I'm not mass defection, but there must be defection.

Speaker 1

Yeah. Later on at this stage, again, it's all first generation converts having kids, right, and the kids can't oh hieve you know, sure, sure, sure, and they're trying. This is largely being enforced so that that first generation of kids raised within the cult can't leave, right, That's what Springs wants to set up. Spanking is a technical endeavor within the Twelve tribes. There is arcana around it, right,

depending on the era and the geographic region. They seem to prefer using these balloon sticks or bamboo sticks, but they also for certain things prescribed whipping kids with resin tipped whips. I don't even know where you get those, like, probably have to get a whip and just tip it and resin yourself today. This is all described in detail in their three hundred and forty eight page Child Training Manual, all of which is based on Spriggs's teachings.

Speaker 2

Is it straight up called Child Training Manual? Does it have.

Speaker 1

Okay, that's what it's called. You can find it online. You know, I've been reading a bit of it.

Speaker 2

Yeah, okay, yeah.

Speaker 1

It includes the fact that children as young as six months old should be spanked for deviations from proper behavior, particularly wilfulness. An infant wriggling during a diaper change is specifically listed as in need of a physical punishment. Oh my god, you know the thing that every infant does, which is what he's saying. Right, Children are inherently disobedient and touched by Satan, and you have to beat that out of them. Right. Quote. The pain received from the

balloon stick is more humbling than harmful. There is no defense against it. The only way to stop the sting of the rod is to submit. That is exactly what the child will do, Submit to his parents' will and end his rebellion. Now that's fucked up and bad. It is responsible to acknowledge that like smacking kids around is not all that far from normal in the seventies, right, we are not talking about like that, I mean, it

still happens today. Obviously, a lot of parents some form of physical coercion with their kids, and it's even more common back then.

Speaker 3

Well, and just like institutional corporal punishment, I mean, is not at all out of the norm.

Speaker 1

My elementary school in the nineties spanked me. You know, public elementary school is not in like a Catholic school or anything. This is in fucking Idabell, Oklahoma. Yeah, so smacking kids with rods is unfortunately yet not all that abnormal in this period. But the Twelve Tribes engaged in numerous and much more creative abuse tactics than this. He Spriggs spends a lot of his time thinking up new ways to abuse children and justify it with the Bible.

One ex member who grew up in the church during the eighties were called a practice called scourging, in which a child is stripped, naked and beaten with a rod over every inch of their body. Yeah. Adults would also regularly withhold meals from small children as punishment. Starvation is a really common punishment for them. In some cases, food

would be withheld for days at a time. Children were also locked alone in dark rooms for days at a time in response to crimes like stealing food from a refrigerator.

Speaker 3

And so this isn't getting out right because the kids are probably not in the school system, they're no longer in a church, so that no one knows.

Speaker 1

Some of it as being There are reports. There are reports in Chattanooga and soon after in Vermont, because like they have neighbors, people are like people can see them hitting kids in public, sometimes slapping them and shit. So this is not like totally a black box. One member later told the Denver Post the one time that I was locked in the dungeon, it wasn't a real dungeon,

but it felt like it. I think it was for more than a day because we fasted every Friday, so I was used to starving, and it was longer than that, which is a gives you an idea of the bleakness of this, Like I was pretty used to starving, Like this was worse than normal starving. Now, one of the things that's interesting to me is Spriggs never has a kid. He does not have a child of his own in

the cult. Sorry, he does have one boy, with his first wife, but he leaves when the kid's young, which for the best in this case, that kid really dodged a bullet by not having his dad. Yeah, not always a win to have your dad in your life, especially when it's it's the how to hit children to guy.

Speaker 3

That makes your issues with like dad abandonment even all the more difficult. Were Yeah, I just want him to love me, but I'm glad he didn't love me. It's very complicated.

Speaker 1

I want a dad to love me, maybe not this one. Yeah, yeah, I think that's that's very real. So again, he has no child in the cult. And for what I can tell Spriggs is he seems to have kept some contact with his family and his old friends through like the late seventies, but by the close of the decade even his close relatives had started to grow increasingly like concerned

with the violent tone that his faith had taken. His sister Joyce talked to the press and reported that, like you know, in the when he in the early seventies, when he starts ministering, when he starts like speaking to people doing these church services, I thought, well, maybe he started to figure his life out. This is like, you know, good for him, probably a positive turn. But by the end of the seventies, December of seventy nine, she was like,

I think he's gotten very negative. And she mentions this to him. She like goes to Eugene, She's like, I think the stuff you're talking about is like really aggressive and it's kind of scaring me. And he just says, you know, all I'm doing is following the scripture, right, Like, you can't argue with this. You can't argue with me because this is all the Bible. Now. We will talk more about this in part two, but it's worth noting that while the Twelve Tribes's attitude on child abuse is extreme,

it does not grow up in isolation. The Jesus Movement started out with serious countercultural elements, but it also fed directly into the birth of the religious right, which helped to unseat Jimmy Carter and became a major engine behind Reaganism and the revived cultural conservatism that followed. When I read about Spriggs's teachings here, I think about a book called To Train Up a Child, which is a nineteen ninety four parenting advice book self published by Mike and

Debbie Pearl. If you recall our episodes on the Duggers and the organization behind them. The Institute of Basic Life Principles the IBLP endorses this book. Right to Train Up a Child is common among homeschooling families. It was for years the standard book in the Christian far right about how to raise kids. I have multiple friends who were raised according to its teachings. If you knew any people who were like quiverful kids, this book was a presence

in their house and childhood. And one of the things, like, among other things, the book says that like you need to kind of as Spriggs taught, you have to be constantly using some form of negative physical reinforcement on your kids. And it includes like sadistic shit like spanking your kids like long enough to break their will. Right. It's not just like I'm not saying this is okay. But it's not just saying like, okay, you know you did a bad thing, so I'm going to, like, you know, spank

you five times in the butt or something. It's like you have to spank them until they stop being willful, you know.

Speaker 3

Right, Well, because there's I mean, it's by no means is this an excuse, But like I know that there were people who who would spank their kids because they thought that that's a thing that they you know, like like like my parents.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it's pretty normal practice, yeah, right.

Speaker 3

That they had to do, but they do it in passing and it was like more of an esthetic and like scary thing. And again this is not a justification of those things, but this idea that you then take that to another level, which is like you do it with will and you do it to like break will is the first one is terrifying. But like that's just it's hard to even wrap fully wrap your head around. It's difficult.

Speaker 1

Yeah, and it's we'll talk about it more one of these days if you want to hear what we do. Get into more of this in the Dugger episodes. It is worth noting here though. I bring this up to say that, like Gene Spriggs is a trailblazer in child abuse, but he's not a lonely one. Right ideas close to the ones he promulgated are absolutely the norm among the religious right in the United States today. His cult has

stayed fringe, but his child beating tactics did not. Anyway, when you build a church around slapping, the absolute shit out of small kids. Eventually someone's going to spot your members slapping the shit out of small children. By nineteen seventy nine, several members had fled and taken stories to local Chattanooga papers. Allegations of abuse based on the fact that cult members absolutely were hitting kids had also gone

the old timey equivalent of viral. This problem followed the branch of the church, two hundred members strong, that had moved to Vermont. By all accounts, Spriggs maintained tight control of this breakaway segment, not breakaway, but of this like expansion of his church, writing regular letters to David Jones encouraging him to ensure that children on the new properties

were being beaten often enough. Quote, if one is overly concerned about his son receiving blue marks, you know that he hates his son and hates the word of God. Blue marks are Spriggs's turn for bruises, and he speaks of them as a positive thing. Right, Like, you're not being a good parent if your kids don't have blue marks. If you're not bruising them, you're not doing it hard enough, right, That's what he's saying here. He's just being a little bit more kind of biblical whimsy about it. This is

a frequent euphemism used by church leadership. A reporter for Pacific Standard magazine writes more on this topic based on interviews with former church members. I remember constant Weltz on my hands, thighs and butt. A woman who was raised and the tribes told me. Children are expected to obey on the first command without talking back or complaining. They are not allowed toys or bikes, and cannot engage in fantasy play. They read only the Bible in the group's dogma.

The former members I spoke to claimed most children were beaten multiple times a day for transgressions as an ocuus as forgetting to raise their hands at the dinner table, and dissipation, the group's term for horse play. Responding to these descriptions, a current leader of their California communities, Wade Skinner,

echoed the brochure I read in Blue Blinds. That wouldn't be how we portray our life, he said, But we do believe that if you love your child, you will be diligent to discipline them, and if you hate them, you will withhold the rod. Cool guys love to see it. The first serious trouble for the Twelve Tribes started in from in nineteen eighty three, when an elder named Eddie Wiseman whipped a child named Darlyn with a balloon stick from her shoulders to her ankles for kissing a boy.

Darlin was thirteen years old, and he whips her badly enough that she's like bleeding.

Speaker 3

Do you know where in Vermont they landed?

Speaker 2

Oh?

Speaker 1

Yeah, we read the town name out a little earlier. I don't have it right in front of me here.

Speaker 3

I think it's I think it's Barton, which is like a wild it's like a still still, like a wild West town in Vermont.

Speaker 1

That one not Yeah, I I We've got it up there. We read it out earlier.

Speaker 2

People pond is it is it Island Pond, Vermont.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I think it's Island.

Speaker 3

Yeah, so it's that area. Yeah, it's like a pretty I don't know you're familiarity. I lived.

Speaker 1

I know very little about Vermont.

Speaker 3

Yeah, it is like people think of Vermont like it's kind of like the hippies thing. It's like they think of it like Burlington and hippies, and it's like yeah, no, it's like some of it is like libertarian wasteland.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I had definitely. We'll talk about Vermont and New Hampshire Libertarians more in one of these days. There's some fun stories up there that involve bears.

Speaker 3

Yeah, that's where I'm from. So I love it, I know it, and I love it in yeah.

Speaker 1

So yeah. Her father sees Darlin bleeding from the back after this whipping and he's outraged, so he reports Wiseman to the authorities, who charge Wiseman with simple assault. But then something happens and her father drops the case. He claims, actually, it wasn't that bad. I was pressured by anti cult activists to exaggerate the abuse, so probably a very unpleasant story behind that. Authorities continue to investigate, in part because

the Twelve Tribes had already been attracting concern for a while. Now. Investigating this cult is a really difficult job. The children who were believed to be victims were homeschooled, so they're not ever in front of teachers. They avoid modern medical care, so they're not ever in front of doctors. They very rarely leave cult property, which makes it pretty much impossible

to build a case. Right. You can't get a warrant when you don't know the number of children or their names when you're just like, there's children there and we think they're being a Like, that's that's a tough legal situation to be in if you're if you're the people trying to like do something about this, right like they because you have a lot of rights obviously, especially on

your own property. And yeah, it's it's tough, Like the actual like how to how to break into a situation like this is incredibly difficult when they have so successfully created an alternate world for themselves. It's it's rough.

Speaker 3

I never I never thought of that. That. Like one of the benefits quote heavy quote benefits of absolute sort of separatism is it makes it legally difficult to intervene because there's not the data that you need in order to create a case.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it's fucked up, and it's going to be a real problem in this case. So what they decide to do with the authorities decided to do here is to summon seven cult leaders, including David Jones, to give basic information to the state on how many children live on the properties and what their names are. Jones and his

family refuse to do this. They are jailed, but they're released in short orders three days later, though, an army of state troopers and social workers raids the Twelve Tribes's property with a mandate to do whatever is necessary to figure out how many kids are there and who they are. They find one hundred and twelve miners and they take them all away. It looks, you know, initially, as if maybe the authorities are going to do something to put

an end to this. That is not what happened. While the parents of these kids wait nearby, prosecutors failed to get a court order to examine the children for signs of abuse. The district judge in this case complains that their warrant is too broad, in part because it does not name the children they want to search. All one hundred and twelve miners are ordered released in very short order,

back to the waiting rods of their parents. David Jones gloated that this had all been the result of an unhinged small town mentality, claiming the furor had come to a head like a boil with no puss, which is a weird way to describe being, in his eyes, exonerated for child abuse. Like, yeah, we're just like one of those pusless boils. Yeah, Like what an odd what an odd turn of phrase. June twenty second the day the oil that you want, Yeah, yeah, where the boil you

want to have? There's not a yeah, it's plus less. June twenty second is the day that the raid gets aborted, and this becomes the first religious holiday that the Twelfth tribes celebrate all to themselves. They start calling it the day of Deliverance. They'll do passover style meals right like they call it. They kind of make it into their passover right because it's the day that God miraculously extended his protection to them against the grasping hands of the state.

Jene sprigs after this will only grow more convinced of the wisdom of his separation from society. Another thing that plays into this is what's happening at the same time as the AIDS crisis right is starting to kick off. This convinces him both that like of this kind of fallen nature of the modern world, that the only thing to do is separation, and it also convinces him that God's justice is being delivered against the unrighteous, even as

his hand shields believers. He writes, at this time, when rental authority is rebelled against it opens the door to come against all constituted authority, honoring those who are over you, those who are honorable, especially parents. Releases a special hormone from your brain permeating your body that gives long life. If you don't do this, that hormone dries up and your bones dry up. The disobedient don't live long. The lifespan of a homosexual is about forty years. That's not

because of aids. They die of a bad conscience, and like that's evil it is. I have to say, the idea that like obeying your parents releases a hormone that you die without is a pretty fun bit of pseudo science for a cult leader. That's a good one.

Speaker 3

Several people who's whose moms told them that if they like, if they you know, if they like cut their own hair or war makeup or whatever, it would like give them cancer leader in life. Yeah yeah, so I feel like that that that's a very common bit of parenting psychological warfare that they took to a whole other level.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, quite a new Yeah, a fancy an impressed of level. Yeah. So that's going to be all of it for part one. Here we we how do you feel in here? How we do an alex.

Speaker 3

That's dark man, it's a yeah, it's a I feel I feel heavy with darkness, and I hope that things go awry, but I bet that they won't. It seems like these are people who have staying power.

Speaker 1

Yeah. Yeah, speaking of staying power, you got any pluggables to plug?

Speaker 3

I would just love people to listen to. You Are Good, a feelings podcast about movies where we talk about uh feelings and therapy related things by talking about pop culture because it's too scary to do head on.

Speaker 1

Yeah, very scary. You can find me at cooler Zone Media where you can get this podcast without ads. So do that and uh go to hell. I love you Take it.

Speaker 2

Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media. For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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