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Hey everybody, Robert Evans here and I wanted to let you know this is a compilation episode. So every episode of the week that just happened is here in one convenient and with somewhat less ads package for you to listen to in a long stretch if you want. If you've been listening to the episodes every day this week, there's going to be nothing new here for you, but you can make your own decisions.
Welcome to it could happen here. I'm Garrison Davis. Admidst attempts by President Trump to seize control of Greenland. Last month during the World Economic Forum, administration officials started posting images of a penguin. On January twenty third, the White House shared in artificial image of Trump walking hand and flipper alongside a penguin holding an American flag across a snowy tundra towards mountains bearing the flag of Greenland. The
caption read, Embrace the Penguin. The flags look like poorly photoshopped stock images, while the rest of the image appears to be generated by AI. Immediately, this post sparked ridicule across various online platforms based on the fact that there aren't any penguins in Greenland. Erm Penguins don't live in the Northern Hemisphere save for zoos and the Glapcos Islands of Ecuador. So haha, the foolish trump has been bested
once again in the arena of facts and logic. Except this White House penguin post was actually in reference to a TikTok meme that was currently going super viral. In mid January, remixed footage from Werner Herzog's Arctic documentary Encounters at the End of the World, featuring a lone penguin breaking off from the flock and marching towards some icy mountains, started spreading around TikTok sinked to an organ cover of Lemour Tejoure, a song which is adopted by far right
anti immigration groups in Europe the past few years. This combination of music and footage soon spread to other short form video platforms like Instagram reels, with the featherless subject being dubbed the Lonely Penguin. On January twentieth, a more explicitly political version went kind of viral with over twenty thousand likes. With the addition of a Frederick Nietzsche quote, I know of no better life purpose than to perish in attempting the great and impossible quote with the caption
save Europe hashtag remigration. That same day, an edit with thirty six thousand likes by the TikTok account Epic History thirty two, captioned do the Hard Thing played the documentary footage with herz Aug Generation overlaid with images of historical figures and pop culture characters like Alexander the Great, Caesar, Joan of Arc, King Richard the First King, Baldwin Fourth Genghis Khan, Aragorn, John Snow, Luke, Skywalker, and Spider Man.
An op ed in Fox News by the daughter of Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy referred to these as quote unquote Western heroes. To quote this op ed, in the film, Herzog shows a lone penguin peeling away from the safety of its colony and heading inland towards certain death according to Herzog, But the online right saw something else. Users, mostly male, saw the penguin as a powerful rebuke of secular modernity. They interpreted the penguin not as lost, but
as a freethinker. To them, he was rejecting the colony. In today's terms, that means rejecting secular postmodern orthodoxy and marching toward a greater purpose unquote. So though Herzog in this documentary refers to this penguin as Drain as a meme, users identified with the penguin as a symbol of masculine rebellion against what they view as mainstream culture and the solitary trek up the mountains as a metaphor for the
struggle of the individual greatness. Clips of men on outdoor adventures and climbing mountains Zarathustra style with the caption be the Penguin spread wildly online, the most popular reaching four point two million likes, and other penguin themed videos getting hundreds of thousands of likes. The Herzog penguin meme piggybacked and partially merged with an older, right wing penguin based meme video from two years ago of a drag queen
asking a kid about boys wearing makeup. The kid responds that boys can't wear makeup, so the drag queen asks the kid who told him that, and this confused child looks around and sees a cartoon penguin on the wall, points to it and says that penguin over there one hundred and eighteen thousand likes.
What do you think about menwear? Who wear makeup?
To boys?
Who said.
The penguin in there?
The penguin.
This video and this figure of the penguin has since been used as a symbol for masculine resistance to the LGBTQ agenda, and this new penguin meme pertains to tap into a uniquely masculine urge, as explained by this TikToker who racked up forty two thousand likes.
I hate to be the one to say it, but the penguin didn't make it. But does that mean he died in vain? No, his life was not a tragedy. It was an inspiration. He left a legacy most of us could.
Only hope for. It would be easy to quote Nietzsche.
Here, but that wouldn't do it justice. The penguin's spoke to something inside all of us men, a desire for more, to push our limits and see what we're truly made of. Sometimes our purpose is the impact that we leave behind.
On January twenty third, the Department of War Rapid response account posted be a Warrior Embrace the penguin with an AI generated image of five men wearing the uniform of each military branch walking towards the mountains alongside a penguin. Secretary Kennedy posted a Make America Healthy Again edit of the penguin meme with the organ music over an AI video of RFK Junior and a penguin walking to the mountains. Onscreen text reads the mainstream made us sick. Choose the
healthier path. The Health and Human Services government account quote tweeted this video with the caption locking in after watching that penguin edit unquote, soy occupied government. An anti immigration advocacy account created a viral aiimage of a large, evidently prosperous colony of penguins gathered under the banner of multiculturalism. It reads that as a giant banner, juxtaposed to a lone penguin facing the mountains and a sign reading remigration
now across the pond. The London mayoral candidate for the far right Reform Party in the UK, Lila Cunningham, copied Trump's version of the penguin meme with an artificial image of her holding hands with a penguin walking towards some snowy mountains surrounding the Tower Bridge in London. The caption reads, choose a new path for London before it's too late. The last penguin post will consider is a video edit
from the Department of Homeland Security. It starts, like many of the viral TikTok and reels videos with footage and narration from Herzog's documentary, which I will find play here.
But one of them caught our eye, the one in the center. He would neither go towards the feeding grounds at the edge of the ice nor return to the colony. Shortly afterwards, we saw him heading straight towards the mountains, some seventy kilometers away.
Doctor Ainley explained.
That even if he caught him and brought him back to the colony, he would immediately head right back for the mountains. But why.
After the narration cuts out, the music continues as a fan cam style montage plays Trump, military helicopters, swat style home raids, and Icen border patrol arresting people. The video is captioned Americans have always known why. In response to Herzog's query, this post from the DHS asserts that part of the essence of America is breaking away from the
herd and forging your own path. Those who don't understand Trump's desire to control Greenland at the risk of further damaging our geopolitical standing just suffer from herd mentality and will never be strong enough to take the kind of risks that are core to the existence of this country. On January twenty fourth, the White House posted the penguin does not concern himself with the opinions of those who
cannot comprehend. For Trump, Venezuela Greenland imperial expansion is an existential mission to achieve some mythic frontier greatness, and only true Americans can understand why. The Fox News penguin op ed by Christian nationalist Sean Duffy's daughter, Wow, that's a nightmare sentence reads quote for Trump, the penguin is an apt symbol for the President's decade long fight against the radical left. Everything Trump does is opposed by the global
power brokers. Even the president's pushed to obtain Greenland has been fanatically opposed by hysterical European elites. America was built by penguins, and by that I mean rebels, pilgrims, frontier men and women, conquistadors and cowboys. We are a nation founded by risk takers who left the colony for the mountains. We are descended from men who suffered and died to
carve civilization out of wilderness. It is our inheritance unquote. Now, what this DHS penguin video doesn't include, but has already been alluded to by some of the other videos I've played, is the actual context of this lone bird's journey and its sad fate. We will return to discuss penguin insanity after this ad break.
We're back, though.
The twenty twenty six version of the penguin meme was dubbed the Lonely Penguin. Earlier meme videos of this documentary footage from years past carried the titles deranged penguin or nihilist penguin. Before the footage of this lone Penguin plays. In the documentary, Herzog asks a penguin expert if they can experience insanity?
Is there such thing as insanity among penguins? I try to avoid the definition of insanity a derangement. I don't mean that a penguin might believe he was. She's lending a Napoleon Bonaparte.
But could they just go crazy because they've had enough of their.
Column Well, I've never seen a penguin bashing his head against the rock. They do get disoriented, they end up in places they shouldn't be, long way from the ocean.
The political invocations of this footage largely ignore ourner Herzog's own speculation on why the penguin is marching towards the mountains in the far off distance and its inevitable state.
One of these disoriented, deranged penguins showed up at the New Harbor diving camp, already some eighty kilometers away from where it should be. And here he's heading off into the interior of the vast continent with five thousand kilometers ahead of him. He's heading towards certain death.
The penguin is not the uber match. The penguin will not achieve individual greatness at the summit of the mountain because it's never going to get there. As friend of the pod Dan Olsen so eloquently put it, the penguin is going to die. Though the penguin does not bash its head on a rock. This separation from society is still an act of suicide. The deranged penguin has literally turned its back on food, water, shelter, and the colony to die, wandering towards mountains that it will never reach.
The Trump administration's embrace of this suicidal penguin as a that's literally me figure is a shockingly open display of fascism's relation to the death drive. It's just so naked to make your mascot a symbol of suicidal defiance against perceived cultural norms. They're doing a first as tragedy, twice as farce for fascist death emblems. The Nazis get the skull, we get a fucking penguin. But the penguin is not
the first modern American suicidal folk hero. The Kildozer rampage of public destruction, which ended in the suicide of the perpetrator, has been a mascot for the libertarian right for over two decades, and in twenty eighteen, a twenty eight year old airport ground service agent named Richard Russell hijacked in empty plane at SeaTac to fly over Mount Rainier before killing himself by purposely crashing the plane, very similar to
Herzog's deranged penguin. Russell left behind a wife of six years, but became a sort of nihilistic folk hero to overly online young men, especially among the online far right on places like four Chan and Telegram, where he was dubbed
sky King. Last August, a Congressional Republican from Georgia, Mike Collins, who serves on the Republican Transportation Committee, posted a glowing, multi paragraph memorial for Richard Russell on the anniversary of his suicide, signing off the message with rest in peace, sky King. But the direct identification of the Trump administration
with a suicidal penguin is a step farther. The fascist appetite for death is well understood, but the death drive represents a usually subconscious desire to not only harm or kill others, but ultimately yourself, an attempt to ease the tensions driving social life by returning to a prior in organic state. This desire can be channeled through the politics of fascism, which allow for violent, paranoid manifestations of repressed
internal contradictions which attempt to be resolved through death. But fascism itself is a contradiction between a primitive war machine and a stable state apparatus, and the way that tension is released is also self destruction. In the second volume of Capitalism at Schizophrenia A Thousand Plateaus by philosopher Jills Deluze and psychoanalyst Felix Quattaie, they discuss the ways in
which fascism and totalitarianism differ. They write that totalitarianism is a state affair made up of material components that over manage society.
Quote.
Even in the case of a military dictatorship, it is a state army, not a war machine, that takes power and elevates the state to the totalitarian stage. Totalitarianism is quint essentially conservative. Fascism, on the other hand, involves a war machine. When fascism builds itself a totalitarian state, it is not in the sense of a state army taking power, but of a war machine taking over this state unquote.
This analysis from Deluze and Quataree is build holding off of an essay by the French writer Paul Verilio called the Suicidal State, where Verilio argues that in fascism, this state is far less totalitarian than it is suicidal. An evolution of this state that quote no longer pretends to be guided internally by reason and progress, but rather non progress and terror, founded on the repulsion and fear of
all development in this civil domain unquote. This repulsion and fear were manifested in the accelerated destruction of state institutions during the first few months of Trump's second term and Doge's scorched earth approach to slashing government agencies. Verilio writes that during the disappearance of public service quote, infrastructures of service are reduced as the wire taps of the vermacht
are restored colonial geometry of decolonialization. So as the federal government rescinds public services, the everyday presence of the federal government is reduced to masked armed agents in the streets, disappearing our neighbors and shooting civilians, while the president fights in court for the ability to deploy the military against
American citizens within our own territory. During the tension of total war or total peace, Filio says, the system expands and reproduces itself, a material process without an end, but no longer without limits. To quote the Brazilian philosopher of Vladimir's Fatley the Suicide State quote, is not just a manager of death. It is rather the ongoing agent of
its own catastrophe, the maker of its own explosion. To be more precise, this new state mixes the death management of entire sectors of its own population with an ongoing and risky flirtation with its own self destruction unquote. Verlio's idea of the suicidal state emerges as this new mode of governing to solve the crisis of post war liberalism in Germany after World War One, as well as risked by the United States after each of our many wars.
Quote.
One of the keys to the present situation is on one side, the overly informed status of experts of the system, and on the other the underinformed status of all those who are supposedly thinking outside of it. Verlio says that the experts no longer know how to use their hordes of information except to gain money and status by continually adding to their body of work. Meanwhile, the outsiders produce the polit and cultural undercurrent of modern folklore and ordinary life.
But this limp dichotomy cannot last for very long on its own, so I Verrelia proposes the new emergence of a third category of people who make use of information for an end. The ultimate end the directors of the suicidal state, while the outsiders, ideologues and artists simply try to simulate Catharsis quote. By contrast, the third category, the suicidal state it self produces a feeling for the real better it aims to retain the exclusivity of its production.
This feeling is a contempt for and hatred of the every day unquote, to paraphrase Verilio, the fascist project exploits man's alienation from his environment through pollution, economic insecurity, emotional insecurity, socialization, and seeks to replace any legitimate grievance he has with society with a more repulsive and expressive force, the fear of society, which is superimposed on a new military schema of total war and internal invasion, all towards a nihilistic
end of dropping the bomb on ourselves. The oscillation of external and internal destruction epitomized by the death Drive is mirrored by the imperial boomerang, where the violence of colonial expansion is forced to return to its homeland. Once home, the drive remains, resulting in a war on society directly or through other means. But this is a war on
its own people. Whereas Trump would say the enemy within, to quote a paragraph from a thousand Plateaus, so called total war scene is less a state undertaking than an undertaking of a war machine that appropriates the state and channels it into a flow of absolute war whose only possible outcome is the suicide of this state itself. There
is in fascism a realized nihilism. Unlike the ttalitarian state, which does its utmost to seal all possible lines of escape, Fascism is constructed on an intense line of escape, which it transforms into a line of pure destruction and abolition. It is curious that from the very beginning, the Nazis announced to Germany what they were bringing at once wedding bells and death, including their own deaths and the death
of the Germans. They thought they would perish, but that their undertaking would be resumed all across Europe, all over the world, throughout the solar system. And the people cheered, not because they did not understand, but because they wanted that death through the death of others. Like a will to wager everything, you have every hand to stake your
own death against the death of others. Unquote in a thousand plateaus, Deluze and Guatai quote an excerpt from Klausman's nineteen thirty six novel Mefisto, which contains fascist speeches and ordinary conversations from Nazi Germany. The quote they include is eerily similar to the visuals of Trump as the suicidal penguin quote, heroism was something that was being ruled out of our lives. In reality, we are not marching forward. We are reeling, staggering. Our beloved fear is dragging us
toward the shades of darkness and everlasting nothingness. How can we poets who have a special affinity for darkness and lower depths not admire him? Unquote Deluze in Guataye then write, suicide is presented not as a punishment, but as the crowning glory of the death of others. The insufficiency of economic and political definitions of fascism does not simply imply a need to tack on vague so called ideological determinations.
We prefer to inquiry into the precise formation of Nazi statements, which are just as much in evidence in politics and economics as in the most absurd of conversations. They always contain the stupid and repugnant cry long Live death. Even at the economic level, where the arms expansion replaces growth in consumption, and where investment veers from the means of
production toward the means of pure destruction unquote. Verilio calls this a psychosis which governs its entire politics of production, and he writes that the replacement of the American industries of the automobile and the cinema with the military industrial complex quote does not involve a rational, functional, or useful choice, but rather entirely psychological, or rather psychopathological. It stems from contempt for an abandonment of productive rapport with the milieu.
Every investment is made to escape from it. For contemporary reference, go check out the stock price of Pallantier. And on the larger economic and international level, Trump's tariffs, his trade wars, and the self destruction of the United States geopolitical standing
are all expressions of this suicidal state in action. Filio claims the state of total war, where the economy of war has become the economy of peace, is facilitated by a transformation in the American sense of freedom, where quote unquote, the free as a subject as in the Land of the Free, Quote is no longer properly spoken of as a citizen. He has an anonymous organism, without culture, without society, and without memory. This figure has no historical precedent. Assistance
has become survival, non assistance, a condemnation to death. All liberation henceforth has for him invariably the appearance of death of the end, suicide or murder unquote. This sort of freedom from social services, freedom from this state, freedom from assistance, as a movement of the death drive, also provides insight into people's willingness to and even desire to vote against their own material interests, especially when their political struggle has
turned against society itself. Only in transformation of ordinary social life in to the horrific in the minds of the populace can the fascist Quote find their surest means of governing. The legitimization of his politics and military strategies, and right up to the end, far from weakening the repulsive nature of his powers, the ruins, the hoarders, the crimes, the chaos of total war will generally only increase in scope. In Hitler's nineteen forty five telegram, seventy one, he writes,
if the war is lost, may the nation perish. Here Hitler decides to join forces with his enemies in order to complete the destruction of his own people by obliterating the last remaining sources of its life support system, civil reserves of every kind, putable water fuel provisions. This is the normal outcome of the politics of dialectical retreat from the man who had written the idea of protection, haunts
and fulfills life unquote. Fascism hijacks the mechanism of evolutionary and revolutionary escape and reverts it into a mechanism of destruction. Instead of resolving crises, it produces constant crisis for it to feed off of forming as delusion guatris, say, a war machine instead of resonating in a state apparatus, a war machine that no longer had anything but war as its object and would rather annihilate its own servants than
stop the destruction. To quote a thousand plateaus, this is war not for conquest or revolution, but war as its own end. The hollowing out of public institutions and social services, the divestment from the milieu of life, leads people to turn towards the suicidal state as the only force of mood movement resting on, as Filio says, quote, the advanced exploitation of our instincts for death. A new tatalitarian state, defined by the constant ascent of statistics toward planetary death.
Crime and madness will no longer be the defects. The madman and the assassin are the legitimate children engendered and recognized by the suicidal state unquote. And what phenomenon has risen in the United States the past few years, the conspiracy, theorist and the assassin. The embrace of total war and the campaign of civil fear necessitates a break from sanity and the bizarre strangeness of means that inevitably result in a self destructive end. Verilio claims there is an insanity
at the heart of the fascist project. The imaginary potential of the fascist state arises quote from a finished war world where insanity has become the goal of order, the very product of organization unquote. There's a quote from Goebels to one of his aides, Prince Frederick Christian. The world in which Hitler moves is a world of absolute fate, a world in which even success makes no sense. It's not a mistake that the White House has cast itself as a lost penguin marching to its own death. They
know the absurdity of their replies. They know the world looks upon them as insane. They know that they'll never reach the make America Great Again mountain. The self destruction ice, the tariffs, the broken treaties are not for any greater purpose. The means are the end. This is total war, the psychological purpose of which is terror, which for the fascist is synonymous with peace. But let's not forget how Hitler and Goebbels finally resolved their contradictions.
So Trump is kind of moving like a bull in a china shop, or rather a bulliner missile shop. You know, I think that's a more apt analogy. The system of government wasn't exactly benign beforehand, you know. Yeah, I think it really needs to click for people that Trump is not truly exceptional m hm. Rather, he's a product of the normal that people seem to be uni for. Yeah, you know, and the other issues we're dealing with too.
Yeah.
I think like this is the the crux of what next. Right, It's like, we have this, like I don't want to I don't want to disparage people. We have this tendency in American politics, this liberal tendency, progressive liberal tendency. Even to think that like, basically things have been magnificent until the first week of November in twenty sixteen, right that America was progressing on this like linear pathway towards total equality and justice for all, and that what's happening now
is an aberration. It's the idea that there's a few individuals conspiring rather than there is a system which inherently creates interests which were opposed.
To our own.
I guess, yeah, exactly. It's like all of these these these problems, the genocides, were waging long before Trump came into power. You know, the economic strains people are feeling today that people have been feeling for decades for their entire lives. You know, the climate crisis that is only worse and this time is going on. You know, all of this is a problem of that normal, of that pre Trump normal. And I still hear people asking, you know, when are things going to go back to normal? When
can we settle down? When will we go back onto the track of normalcy? And well, if you're listening to this podcast, I think you already know what time it is. This is it could happen here. I'm Andrew Sage and I'm joined.
By James again here to talk about the new normal.
All right and welcome, thank you. The new normal, the ever shifting normal, the phantom of normal and why it is that it's really not coming back, and why normalcy as a concept is actually pretty weird. So part of I think what feeds into this notion of normal is this myth of progress that people are obsessed with. You know, recently I read this book Progress by Samuel Miller McDonald and I would like to do a review of it
at some point for the podcast. Butt of it is it a get into just how pervasive this concept of progress is in kind of tripping people up and keeping us serving systems that don't serve us. You know, you mentioned progressives earlier, and you know even that notion I
think of being a progressive. He kind of calls that into question in the course of the book, going from ancient times to talking about a religious sense of a promised land to the sort of modern sense of a secular or technological progressive improvement or a social progressive improvement. He identifies it as a story, and a story that's
so powerful that it acts like a sedative. You know, we don't engage with the degree in reality the world around us because be wrapped up in this all powerful feet were balance of progress or progress is linear, that we are ever striving forward, you know, and we point to examples of things like social progress. But as he quotes in the book, it's like what Malcolm X said. You know, if I stick a knife into you and I only pull it out three inches, that's our progress.
Put it out six inches, that's our progress. Nine inches, that's a progress progress will be, you know, removing the knife completely and mending the wound. But I would take it a step further and say that is it really progress to go back to a state that already was? Is it progress to abolish slavery when there was a time when slavery did not exist? You know, going back to a previous default state is not necessarily contributing to the nat same thing with patriarchy, you know, patriarchy did
not always exist. Eroding and abolishing the patriarchy reaching a point where the limitations placed on women are no longer there can we call that progress or is it just rectifying a previously imposed state? And so these are some of the questions he grapples with. And there's also, of course the techno utopian promise of you know, we can in self driving cars any minute, you know, fusion energy
AI and then work forever. You know, all these things are blind to the social or ecological reality of collapse. But where else would you say, might see this myth showing up in politics? I think I covered a good few, but I might be missing something.
Yeah, Like, I mean it's almost in everything, right, Like it's a fundamental myth of liberal capitalism, I guess. Like it also underlies a certain logic of colonialism, right, the idea that like progress towards that then a neoliberal state is this can be like the logic of explicit or
less explicit colonialism, I guess. But like you see it there too, right, Like you see it in the sort of do you see a lot in nineteenth century, So it's very explicit the idea to uplift, civilize and christianize our little brown brothers.
Yeah, the civil mission, yeah yeah, yeah.
They're the white man's burden, and these things that became very very on vogue in the late nineteen thirty twentieth century. I suppose you see it a lot there too, right.
Yeah, this whole notion I think that idents really starts with the concept of civilization. When you have that civilized other divide that binary of the civilized and the barbaria, and or the civilized and the savage, and how that gets turned into this mission that civilization expands, that you bring those savage peoples into the fold and you slowly, you know, bring them up, make them upright men, and closer to being human than the state that they were
in previously. And the whole narrative around that is what has as it has evolved with time, led to the situation a bit in now.
Yeah.
And there's this idea as well that even when there are these ruptures in normal that everything will go back
to its right place. As of people say, you know, history is a series of unprecedented things, you know, And one of the unprecedented things in history that I wish people would realize is not ever going to come back is that sort of post war economic boom, you know, that nineteen fifty era growth and excess that has become the default day that many people are striving to return into when in reality, something like that is a historical
normally driven by artificially cheap and abundant energy. Yeah, you know, the normal that people are talking about. Sometimes it's just this fifty to seventy year fossil fuel binge, a binge that we are reaching the end of. And I think a fantasy to believe that we can replicate for all the time.
Right yeah, but it's the time that so much of the like the world that we exist in was created, right, And like people almost see themselves as like a different species from human beings in the in the nineteenth century, right, Yeah, they can't conceive of society that way.
Exactly exactly, And it's something that I've been well on because like, what a time to be alive to see, you know, personal cars being so ubiquitous. But the ubiquity of personal cars is an aberration. It's a historical laboration. It's not one that is likely to be sustainable in the long term. You know, even if there are electric cars taking a place of gas powered vehicles and we run out of gas oil, even the materials in story to produce electric cars are not always going to be around.
They're not always going to exist. We can't supplement each and every individual person with a car for all of time, you know. Yeah, so many of the rare earth minerals that are again quite rare, we've we've spent them on things that that may serve a novelty or an interest in the short term, but it's something that we can
maintain forever. You know. I hear people talking about this EI bubble, you know, and it is in the sense of the financial markets, the financial aspect of AI and how it's affecting our perception of the economy and whether
that bubble is going to boost economically. But I'm more interested in the EI bubble in the sense that how long can this EI everywhere thing persist when the material is necessary to maintain it because it is material, despite the sort of cloud marketing they get associated with it. How long until we run out of those materials, until those material needs cannot be sustained.
Yeah, we keep shifting, like the goalposts, but like the terrain, right like you know, we okay, well we've run out of fossil fuel, so that's fine. We will do electric okay, we you know, with the electric actu She relies on on rares. So that's fine, We're fine. Different thing to make batteries out of fra other than acknowledging that like we've created a system, or we'll just.
Go to space.
Yeah yeah, yeah, and and trash another planet for another few hundred years. You know, when you're driving your track and you have a lot of stuff in it and it's hitting the end of the rev counter, you know, like you're trying to pass someone, it's bouncing. It's in the red zone. Like we've been running in the red zone, certainly for most of this century, you know, since the Industrial Revolution, or certainly since the end of the Second
World War. And like sustainability is a phrase that's been co opted, but like it's just not possible to keep doing it.
Yeah, I mean, it's really an anomaly, U blipin our timeline, I would say, And I think ruptures in that normalcy, like the ruptural experience and now provides an opportunity for us to you know, take an eggs at ramp to kind of control the transition, to control our descent. But instead, you know, it seems like we were just rapidly moving towards the more forceful transition the transition made so by the laws of physics, and that transition I don't think
will be nearly as pleasant as it could be. You know. That's why a lot of people call it collapse, and that transition is being delayed currently, both the collapse of the material resources and also the collapse of the financial economic system. That stuff has been delayed by rent seeking, by new frontiers or exploitation, and by ramping up theft in parts of the world that we're not as pillaged as other parts of the world, or ramping up surveillance
and violence to make it harder to resist. But eventually is going to hit, you know, and I hate that it makes me sound like a second comment of Jesus conspiracist or something like that, just like well, yeah, it's coming, it's coming, you know, like like like I'm a profit screaming into the into the streets. But you know, it may not be some kind of prophesiede end times, but we are approaching that point, you know, where that sort
of narrative of economic growth going back to normal. You know, there's this big group project of making the literature because that rise and tide will lift all boats. You know, there's this story that everybody wins, that nobody will have to lose anything because the pie will just keep getting bigger. It has to come to an end.
It's amazing how long it's lasted, right, Like, certain group of society has been able to make the rest of society believe that the pie will just keep getting bigger when the pie has got smaller for most people, you know, certainly for the last few decades, but arguably you know, like lives have become worse for us since the Industrial Revolution in some ways.
Right exactly. And you know, people will point to improvements in health and sanitation. Sure, you can have improvements in health and sanitation without all this other baggage though, Yeah, you know, we can have improvements in literacy without literally poisoning our fresh water and bleaching our oceans and killing off biodiversity by the millions of species.
Yeah, it's not a like a package deal, right, Like we can have vaccination against diseases without having super fun sites. We didn't need one to make the others. It's not a like this way or the Dark Ages.
Exactly exactly. For example, all London had to do I mean, I'm oversimplifying, but all London had to do was stop dumping their sewage in the Thames.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Yeah. It's a remarkable It's not that hard. But like just look at the disposal of hazardous waste and the way that rather than being like, huh, maybe we should stop making waste, it will be hazardous for centuries. For the better part of one hundred years, we've just been finding somewhere else to put it.
Yeah, just keep just keep dumping it.
Yeah.
Even as a child, I was like, what are we supposed to do with all these moms in the garbage? Like, like, are we just going to keep on piling it's up until we reach the moon?
I mean, yeah, it's like it in San Diego they dump these dump it in the bay. There's a whole part of our bay which used to be a landfill site. And like I like to to free dive sometimes I would be practicing or diving in the bay or whatever, and like you dive down and be like, the fuck is a barbecue grill doing on the bottom of the ocean? And people just continue to chuck shit into the bay, right, Like, even though we have another landfill, what we put it now?
No, But you see games it's like that barbecue grill was seven dollars on TMO Yeah, right, you can't pass up that deal, you know.
Yeah yeah, and then when it when it turns out to be absolut crap, it will be on our planet for longer than any of us. But we've created a system where there's no disincentive to buy a t moou barbecue grill, use it once, and then throw it into the bay. And like we can't see that that's a problem.
Yeah, yeah, because of how this system is set up, you don't have to think about it. We had a second, why is the barbecue grill seven dollars? You know, who is suffering so that this barbecue real? For example?
Yeah? Right, because they were so detached from that, right, Like, despite being so connected, we're also so far away from the people who the misery is a consequence of our consumption or of the system which which makes our consumption the way it is exactly.
And you know, instead of thinking about how we can make society resilient, how we can reasonably and ethically, with consideration for seven generations, use the resources that we have, and without endless throughput all the years, continue to chase growth, they continue to progress perpetually like a cancer. Yeah, you know, and everybody's seeing the consequences. At this point, the work situation is getting worse because these platforms, these these employers
are finding ways to game the label laws. You know, we're seeing shrinking margins and sit in sectors. Because when you rely on growth, when that growth comes to an end, there's nowhere else to grow. You have to squeeze what there is. What's the phrase squeeze blood out of a stone. Yeah, you know, you have to force over work. You have to and shitify existence services so that you can extract more subscriptions, more pay months, more upgrades, whatever the case.
Maybe the liverability of entire cities of it has been wiped out because you know, you have ABNB and a private companies holing out something as basic as hose in for all, and so the pressure is to keep the whole machine run and just how ways any long term considerations.
I keep saying this normal was never sustainable. I will say, though, when we criticize the system and we call it out and we talk about how these leaders are pushing things in a certain direction, they are, But at the same time, it's easy to fall into this notion that they are manipulating the whole thing, you know, that they manage the system in its entirety. It's tempting to see the system as coherent, you know, to act like it's all piloted by one vidual or group as some wise or malevolent
parental figure. And you know, these institutions, they all rely to vary lining degrees under the appearance of competence, right. But I think what recent times has revealed is that things are a lot messier than that. That political leaders know that they don't know, but won't admit that they don't know, or they don't know that they don't know, and in either case, they are pretending or believing that they have this grip on things that they can anticipate
and smooth out the shocks to the system. You know, there are those who think that if they share the honest truth, that they could trigger a panic into populace. So they think they're doing something you know, brave and benevolent by not giving people all the information they need and whose yet they failed by sharing all the information that needed to make accurate decisions, that they might lose investments, They might lose investors. You know that the economy will
take a hitter as results. That's why you have situations where like when the Texas grid field in twenty twenty one, that the officials were insistent that it was stable and so they wasn't, you know, Or for the years the UK is has water, it's what infrastructure is used, it continues to claim that thing's under control, and sewage were still getting into people's reverse. Yeah you know.
Yeah, Like I think a lot about Flint, Michigan, where the water that people have to drink to survive is killing them. And this has been happening. We've known about it for a decade, and there have been a series of politicians for both parties who have just been like, yeah, no, don't worry, We've got this cupboard, and like that. We
fundamentally have not got this cupboard right. But the machine is moving so far so no one person can can stop and turn it around because the machine will just bulldoze them.
Yep. It's not as steady as and stable as it puts forward. You know, in fact that that whole image of the system as coherent stays stable. I think it also seems to keep us from defying it. Yeah, you know, because we get this sense that yeah, this is this, like this this behema of this all powerful love crafty
and entity that us may have. Individuals come truly challenge when there are things that we can do directly to throw you know, spokes in the wheel, if that's the expression, No, it's something in this spooks.
Yeahs Spanner when sticking the spokes maybe right?
Yeah? Sure? Would you say there was like a pit secular moment when you realize that nobody actually knew what they were doing? Though, Yeah, I'm trying.
To think if it was like a momental recognition for me or like a sort of gradual one. You know. I think a few of the times, like you see it a lot when you travel more, right, because the perception that, like we are helping here, we've got this under control. Like I think with immigration it's a great example actually, right, Like so I've obviously spent a lot of time with the immigrants, and I think you see this.
I remember twenty eighteen we had the migrant caravan, right, Like there have been many migrant caravans, this one was just coincided with a mid term in a way that allowed it to become like a political football, and the American government is like, we are stopping them at the border so we can check if everyone's okay. And government in Mexico is like, well, we are taking care of them.
And you get there and you're like fuck, like these people haven't had water today, and like at that point, you know, I was already sort of predisposed to thinking that perhaps the state didn't have all the answers, and like to be clear that Mexican states a lot more than the US state in this instance, and provided these people with a place to be, which it would have been much worse if they hadn't had that, But like it was just this realization. I was with a few friends.
All of us happened at the time to be full time bicycle people, so we didn't have jobs that needed us to be like in a place at nine am.
So that realization that like, if these people are going to get water today, it's going to be because we go to Costco and buy all the water bottles and then we we ride back whilst slowly destroying the suspension of this pickup truck we've got so much weight in it, and give them out, like because no one else is going to right and like there's this whole world of NGOs and governments and states and like didn't matter right this people stidn't have water.
Yeah, there's a lot of rule for direct action still.
Yeah.
And the part was that be're not as competent as they may a first glance appear. In other words, if they say they have everything under control, don't believe them.
Yeah.
I think also that instability within this system is part of it, you know, it's part of how it works. It's part of what's necessary for it to keep going. The competitive tune of the capitalist markets, the shifts of industries that you know upgroove people's lives just part of how the system operates. You know, the booms and bus in real estate, they all always for the powers that be to expand their wealth in some way, to expand their regions and territories, and people, for the most part,
just go along with it. You know, daily life is complex as it is. Without having to grapple with the full scale of all the global issues, you know, the following the leader, just going along with what they say, it does give you some psychological breathing room. You know, it's hard to grapple the existential threats that we face.
I don't have time too in many cases, especially when you have an administrative strategy that involves flooding the zone with so much mess, with so much drama, with so many different controversies and lies and incidents, that it feels like the best thing to do is just throw your hands up and your foot And then I'm speaking both from the perspective of what I'm observing in the Chunitian
government and what I'm observing in the American government. But I see this attitude of our guns, callousness, and corruption. So I'm not even trying to maintain a veneer of legitimacy or intelligence or anything like that. Studies go through the motions to provide the things that it claims it's necessary to provide, you know, but they're feeling that even that, and they're so cocky about it. They're so careless about it too. So they're smiling in your face and lying
to you. Yeah, people do see what's happening, and they're responding in a couple of different ways. You know. They panic, of course, or they fall into conspiracies, or they deny that there is an actual problem. They continue to insist that everything is normal, that everything is fine. If they double down, they hustle harder, they consume more, they carry
on as if nothing's wrong. And there are those who see that something is wrong, but they see everybody else carrying on as if everything is fine, and so they go along as well, you know. Or there are people, of course who disengage, who are burnt out to a numb who are just drifting or going through the emotions.
But only a portion have turned to challenge the concept of normal itself, whether it is that they're experimenting with simpler living, developing some program for survival, some strategy either for themselves, for their household, of their community, engaging mutual support. And of course this is only a portion of the population because many of us, like fishing water, you know, we can't really recognize the socioeconomic structure that we are within.
It's hard to recognize what you are immersed in as a thing itself, and so really in seeing and reading about alternatives that you can get a glimpse of this normalcy and question to realize that this system isn't natural or inevitable. There's an aberration destined to decline no matter how much we want to believe otherwise that the script of work, in consuming career, in accumulating property in all
is unnormal. That is actually kind of weird, you know, like, it's strange that an entire society is dependent upon globe spanning supply chains, volatile markets, and oriented entirely around the
quarterly evenens of elites. You know, it's strange that whiteness, maleness, cis, heteronous evilness are treated as the default, the starter kit, even though only a fraction of humanity fits in any one of those molds, let alone the combination of all of the You know, it's strange that normal is so narrowly conformist with those who don't conform a marginalized It's strange that normal means an illusion of independence, the disguises
the webs. You will always rely on that. You can claim to be independent and say, yeah, well I just bought that seven dollar grill of TMU, and not think about the the well of relationships that brought that seven dollar grill to your doorstep and eventually to the landfill. You get to feel self sufficient while the system hides the label the ecosystems logistics, and the people hold them up.
I'm just thinking now about like people whose whole thing is being like homesteaders, but their homesteading is in itself a performance for the global supply or like the global market for distracting or entertainment or whatever you want to call it, right Like, and they do not exist outside of those supply chains, but like they are doing this performance of of like independence because they are so codependent, right Like, like they exist to generate like a revenue
or affiliate links or however influences make money, sponsorships.
Oh yeah, it's like one of the influencers. Yeah.
Yeah.
Like there's a guy who I remember like a year ago am because I'm like, I know, broken inside. I had gotten to an argument with someone on x dot com. Oh yeah, this guy was like posing as a homesteader, and like, you know, I grew up on a farm, right, Like I've I spent lots of my life around like domestic animals and around domestic like I know how to fix things, I know what tools look like when you use them, and like this guy was very clearly just
posing and posing a series of photos. It just really like I don't know why that particularly threw me for a loop, right, But like the idea that this guy is performing performing independence for a system he himself is reinforced. It was just such a strange thing to understand.
Yeah, a system means dependent on.
Yeah, exactly, a system he's entirely dependent on, like more so than most of us even, right, Like, he makes nothing other than photographs so that people look at on their phones. Like, he makes no tangible product, Like at least if you're a you know, you could be a cabinet maker, right, and yeah, you install kitchens for each people, but you know how to make things with your hands.
This guy just gets, you know, a saw that looks like I hadn't been used since he had Wardian era and stands around for photos next to a log in the same breath. I guess that I condemn that. I feel like the way that we deal with the end of this, it's the same way that we help each other get through the middle of this and the and
the collapse of it. Right, Like, I've seen people do mutual aid with such scarce resources and manage to make such amazing things, both in terms of like physical objects and in terms of like these beautiful things we do for each other. We're so little and like the ingenuity that's still there. It's not like people have forgotten how to exist without temu, right, but we just haven't created a way a situation where we have to and in
mutual aid spaces. I sometimes feel like we already have the solution to this, which is to depend on and care for each other. It's just that we need that to be the way we do everything, not just some.
Stuff exactly exactly. You know, the whole homestead and fantasy is very comforting illusion and fiction in my view, because if we're talking about going back to the land, people who live on the land, who live off of the land, they did so in community. Yeah, you know, very very very very rarely did someone live entirely by themselves without
contact and anyone else. Because you can't be an axe maker and a carpenter and a cook and you know, a farmer and a hood and all these different things, all of these different roles, a medicine maker, all these different things at the same time. That is why we as a species have survived and succeeded, because we are able to share our skills with others and you know, collectively accomplish more than the summer of our parts.
Yeah, it's a fantasy. I was recently in a place called Chako Kanyon. I don't know if you've if you're familiar with Chako Kanyon at all, No, but there's this idea I think that like pre the arrival of capitalism, that's how Indigenous people lived. And it's just not like like, yeah, this was a large, thriving communitium. I'm interested in Chako Kanyon because I'm interested in what you're talking about, like a society which consume at an unsustainable level and then collapsed and what came.
Out of it.
But what came out of it is what kept the working class people in that society of life throughout it, which is helping each other, right, Like yeah, sure people have these little plots where they grew grain, but also like by doing their ceremonies, by coming together in community, they had something which could sustain them even when the
economic reality completely changed for them. And it's like it's that part that people forget, right that they think they can Yeah, they think they can grow their own food. Yeah you can, But when you need a new plow, what are you going to do? You're going to buy a forge on TMU, you know, like it's so detached from the way anyone has ever lived.
Yeah, it is, and it kind of lasts, and me perstatly, I would rather not wait until supply chains break down completely and stones wipe the sleep and out's cut all communication none. I would rather wait for those things to create and sustain those networks of dependence, networks of interdependent so it's local networks of aid and cultural practice and
you know, meeting of mutual needs. There's a saying that the sort of hustle bros would say that your network is your net worth, and to that I must concur you know, the community support and the share resources. They're going to matter a lot more than your personal purchase and power. Being part of something is emotionally easier than carrying everything alone. The matter now and the matter even more in the future, as crisis makes the invisible all
too visible. The normal that we remember is an illusion, but once you've seen it, you can't unsee. I think the departure from normal is an opportunity or chance to make something battle, to be adaptable to the shocks that come with courage and with clarity, and I hope that this conversation is able to put towards when I'm sure that I'm not alone in feeling. That's all for me today, all about what to old people. Peace.
Hi friends, and welcome to the show. It's me James today, and I'm very lucky to be joined by Sam Hamilton, who is the senior litigation staff attorney at Asian Americans Advancing Justice Atlanta.
Hi Sam, Hi James, Thanks for having me.
Yeah, thanks for joining us. And we are gathered here today to talk about the new proposals that DHS has to detain people in literal warehouses. Right, if people aren't familiar, maybe you could die out by explaining what those proposals are and how they specifically relate to the areas where you're organizing in Atlanta.
Sure So, Around December of twenty twenty five, a journalist leaked a list of about twenty different cities across the country where ICE was intending to open new detention facilities in warehouses specifically. And this list contained the names of the cities and the expected or projected occupancy of each of these facilities. And so I live here in Atlanta, Georgia, and there were two cities on that list with warehouses contemplated.
One is located.
In the city of Flowery Branch, where the warehouse there is is intended to detain up to one thousand, five hundred people. And the other is in the city of Social Circle, Georgia, where ICE intends to use a warehouse that is over one million square feet to detain about eight five hundred people.
That's vast, Like I think that this would dwarf the capacity of any Like I'm trying to think if there are maybe prisons sort of bigger than that. I don't know, but like in immigration terms, I don't think there is anything.
Yeah, I mean, you know, So for the last four years or so, I've worked I've worked on various different shutdown ICE campaigns here in Georgia, and for the last four years I've been working with the campaign to shut down the Folkston Ice Processing Center, which is an ice facility in South Georgia pretty close to Florida, but it's about a five hour drive from Atlanta, and that ended
up expanding lasts summer. But the number of beds at that facility was projected to be around three thousand, and at the time that was going to be the largest ice attention facility in the country. So to jump from three thousand to eighty five hundred is yeah, it's massive, obviously.
Yeah. I mean people wanted to like it's not fascism enough. It comes from the Fascio Rain area of Italy, right, otherwise it's like sparkling authoritarianism or whatever. But like unless you're looking for like a gate with our Beckmark Fry on it or whatever, like these are concentration camps. Like
that is what this is. It was really interesting in twenty twenty three we had out the outdoor attention under the Biden administration, and like we didn't really have much coverage in the US media when we were participating in mutual aid there, but we'd had a lot from non US media, like folks from Japan and Singapore and Italy, and they'd just come and be like, oh, yeah, it's a concentration camp. And then they'd write the story and
be like these concentration camps. And I think I would never have got that past an editor in LA or New York. To them, it seems so self evident. Now we're just doing it on an even bigger scale. I guess it's it's terrible. It's the ship. So I know you've been organizing in social circle specifically, right or part of an organizing group, I should say that it's been
opposing this detention center. So I think it'll be really instructive to people because either are all of these are going to be all over the country, and this won't be the only expansion of immigration detention we see in the next few years. I imagine, given the massive budget and the priorities to the administration, can you explain a little bit about like how that campaign got started and then like the nuts and bolts of how this is being opposed.
Yeah, So before I get into that, I think providing some context on who the social circle community is it will be, you know, would be instructive. So it's a pretty small it's a very small city. It's got a population of about five thousand people, overwhelmingly Republican, overwhelmingly white, and pretty wealthy, Okay, And it's about an.
Hour drive outside of Atlanta.
And in December of twenty twenty five, a news article was published in the Washington Post announcing, you know, the list of the twenty cities where these warehouses would be would be popping up. And it was that article that told the residents of Social Circle and the elected officials of Social Circle for the first time that this ICE
mega prison was coming to their community. There was no notice to the city by ICE or anyone in the federal government at all, certainly no opportunity to respond, no opportunity for public input.
So they felt really blindsided.
Yeah, and I'm not this community, and you know, I've met many of these people only for the first time, you know, within the last couple of months. But I think it would not be so far fetched to say that some of these people feel, you know, especially the ones who identify as Republicans or as you know, conservatives, I think they feel really betrayed by you know, by their government, by their party. Yeah, and so you know, a lot of these people, I mean I've just described
the demographic. I think many of them have never been involved in organizing of any kind before. Some of them have, I think, but I think due to you know, their life circumstances, just might not have found themselves in a
place where they've needed to organize for anything. So a bunch of these residents got together and have been holding you know, in person kind of town hall community meetings, and they held one in January where they were about you know, I think forty to fifty people in the room, and they wanted to get together and you know, just have a public discourse about what could be done. And I was invited to this meeting because of my history of involvement with shutdown campaigns here in Georgia.
I got started with shutdown campaigns in.
Twenty twenty, okay, when a nurse, a whistleblower who worked at an immigration detention center here in Georgia called the Irwin County Detention Center, alerted the public that there was a doctor who was contracting with ICE who had been, you know, providing medical services to women detained in this facility. Well, he had actually been performing non consensual and medically unnecessary medical and gynecological procedures.
On women in ICE attention.
Remember this here, Yeah, And when these women spoke out about it to their family members, to journalists, to their law layers, to members of Congress, our staffers for members of Congress, they were retaliated against by being swiftly deported and I'm talking put on planes within hours.
Of speaking to a congressional staffer.
And at the time, I was working at the University of Georgia, School of Laws First Amendment Clinic where we were providing you know, free legal services to people across the state, including you know, helping people with getting access to public records and suing the police and you know and federal agents. Yeah, when they were retaliated against. And
so we represented those women. And it was through my work at Irwin and you know, connecting with the organizers there, that I got involved with shut down campaigns, or rather the shutdown Irwin campaign here in Georgia, and then from there later got involved with the shutdown folks in campaigns.
So I had been asked to speak to this group of people who I think were new to the immigrants rights struggle, to talk about, you know, what it's like to try to prevent a detention center from popping up in their community.
And because they like, it's not a community that might traditionally be demographically the same as the people who we
associate with like microan advocacy, migroan activism. I guess when a group like that comes into a moment like this, I mean there are some areas of like activism, I guess civil society stuff, where like white suburban folks have some experience, right planning is one of them, right, Like the recent bike planes only go north south in San Diego is because they think that those of us who can't afford live by the sea don't deserve to cycle safely.
Like there are many other examples of this. But what there were there like thoughts when they when they first met. I'm really interested to know that. Like they're obviously upset and they feel abandoned and betrayed, but like, how did they want to organize to prevent this?
Well, a lot of them were upset about the decrease in their property value. That was what was really breaking down. Yeah, that was that was the redicalizing movement.
Same with the bike lanes.
Actually, oh yeah, I bet yeah. And you know, but in.
Addition to the property value stuff, it's also you know, the strain that this would impose on their small community.
I mean, you know a number of the people who.
Live there might be of you know, well to do means, but you know, their city police department employs a total of fourteen officers and they have two on duty at any given time. They have a fire department of you know, comparably you know, small size, and they have you know, water and sewer infrastructure that was built to accommodate about as many people as live there now, you know, between
four thousand and five thousand people. And it's that impact that is also you know, really maddening and activating and agitating to people. Those arguments are not new to us who have organized in South Georgia and also very red areas,
a lot more rural and a lot less wealthy. Yeah, you know, we'll try to We've canvas door to door in the city of Folkston to try to ask people how do they feel about this mega prison opening up in their community, and a lot of people, you know, we're against it, despite the fact government officials might try to bill it as you know, an economic boon, you know,
unemployment opportunity. A lot of people said like, hey, I mean, I don't necessarily want a prison in my backyard, but if it's bringing jobs, then you know, that's what this community needs. That's something that I think makes Social Circle distinct from the previous shutdown campaigns I've worked on in Irwin County and in Folkston is that this isn't really an area that is starved for employment or starved for you know, economic support, Like these people are doing okay.
And you know, another thing that makes it distinct.
Is before all of this warehouse business, the vast majority of facilities in this country are formed through intergovernmental service agreements, you know, or iggsa's for short, is the acronym. But there are agreements between the federal government and the county, the local government where the local government says, yes, you can use our land or our facilities, and in exchange you pay us I mean in the case of folks, and it's a comparably measly amount. It's only two hundred
thousand dollars per years. Not much, yeah, even though the federal government is giving i mean fifty million dollars a year to insert your favorite private prison corporation here, you know, whether it's corcivic or geogroup.
Yeah, I mean your favorite.
There are only two, really, yeah, not much of a joice.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so typically, like we see this sort of like co opting and manipulation of the local community and the local government by the federal government, you know, coercing them economically to you know, to take on these detention centers or else. But here I mean social like I said, Social Circle is doing fine. They're not starved for economic investment,
and I didn't you know, consult them at all. It really just like, you know, in the dead of night, just bought this warehouse from a private company and pushed this deal through. So those are some aspects that I think might throw you know, some of us who might have been involved in these similar fights before, like for a loop a little bit, because yeah, there's this assumption I think by some of the local officials that the supremacy clause governs here and the federal government can do
whatever it wants. So there's no point in us trying to use our local zoning ordinances or what have you to try to put a stop to this, because there's nothing that we can do, right is at least what you know, some people might be.
Saying, yeah, let's take a break for advertisements. I can't think of anything mean to say, I know, buy some shit this have come from, or don't buy anything you don't need. Okay, we are back. So you were talking about this assumption that the supremacy close would mean that the federal government could build a mega prison in a warehouse in your town without asking you if it could
do that. First, can you explain, like how people are able to use, like you said, like various local tools to oppose is like you said, it's a huge burden. Like when I first read this story, I remember thinking about, like, just like the water and sewage demands of housing eight thousand people would be crippling for the infrastructure in a lot of places. So how are people opposing this?
Well, it's been.
Really inspiring for me to see these local leaders who again many of whom have you know, never been involved in activism we're organizing before.
They've been very.
Consistent in holding demonstrations on a weekly basis at the site of this facility and have garnered the attention of different media who have come and interviewed them. So that's been one way that they've been trying to you know, get their message out there. I was just talking about, you know, the residents who are concerned from you know, sort of fiscal perspective and are concerned about you know,
their own property values and things like that. But there are a fair number of people who are concerned about you know, the core human rights abuses and you know sures. Some of the line might be well this isn't the right place, you know, our city is not the right place for a detention center, suggesting, you know, implying that there are some places that are suitable for a detention center.
But there are a fair.
Number of people in this community who who are opposed to detention centers in general. I mean, they see that they see the violence that ICE is inflicting in broad daylight on public streets, and I think they're they're horrified, and they don't want to be complicit in in something
like that, you know, coming to their community. And I do think that along the way, I'm seeing more of a shift in the consciousness or at least an openness to understanding the different influences that bring us to the same table.
Yeah, it is. It has been very cool.
Yeah, and we can agree that you know, we're not going to have one hundred percent unity of ideas, but we can have a unity of action, and you know, we can save these debates on you know, I mean, whether someone is illegal or not, but you know, we can continue to have them along the way, as we are also identifying the very concrete ways that we can work together.
And I'm thinking of one, for example.
I work pretty closely with some staffers for different members of Congress I mean in terms of like uplifting you know, human rights and civil rights abuses that we see in detention centers, because as part of my job, I go inside detention centers, immigration detention centers in Georgia pretty frequently, also federal prisons, and we'll meet with people and learn about the conditions that they're facing and will you know, fight for them to get released and also share what
I learned from them with you know, different members of Congress, and most of our connections are with people who are aligned with the Democratic Party, you know, I mean to be to be frank, you know, I've never initiated correspondents with a Republican but I think I kind of just assumed that they wouldn't want to that I wouldn't get anywhere with them, or that they wouldn't you know, that they.
Wouldn't talk to me.
But what's been effective in working with this coalition of residents is some of these people, I mean, yeah, like they I you know, they've been card caring Republicans for a long time and feel that they you know, can wield influence over you know, certain Republican elected officials and and one of them, you know, I mean, well, I don't know how many of them, but a number of these local residents have gotten Republican, you know, Mike Collins to come out against this ice facility.
Yeah, that's especially right now in the Republican party and like that that could be very difficult for them to do. And I sort of once it's not hugely sympathetic to Republican politicians, and I would still like to see them get better, Like that's we want people to get better, that's the whole thing. And like I think for these people whose politics may not be the same as ours, sharing the space, sharing the movement, sharing the struggle, like,
I hope it makes people better. I hope being exposed to people who are not of the same background as you be it like class rise, race wise, politics wise, whatever, like makes people realize that things are not quite how they're presented to them on the television or in the media they consume totally. So I'm sure that's yeah, Like
I hope that it's positive. What can like a local government do, or even like elected officials do, given that the elect officials on a federal level do, Given that, I mean, I suggest appears to be operating like without a great deal of oversight right now.
Yeah, I mean with each of these warehouses, there are different circumstances around each of them. I've been really inspired, honestly by the folks in Maryland who are dealing with a warehouse, maybe multiple warehouses, I'm not sure. Yeah, where you know, at both the local and the state level, they have really pushed for legislation that would effectively, yeah,
I mean, prevent these warehouses from existing at all. It is a different set of facts than what we're working with here in Georgia, because there's more involvement by private actors, and so the government, you know, the local government can can regulate them more. But Maryland is certainly not the only place where where those fights are happening. And so I would really encourage folks to, yeah, to learn from Maryland. And I get you know, I'm talking about you know, legislation.
I mean, I will be the first to tell you as a lawyer that I don't think legal tools will liberate us.
You know, the law will not make.
Us free, sure, Yeah, And I do think it's it's the people power, it's the coming together, it's the mass collective action that is, you know, that's what's going to do it. And also there are multiple you know, there are multiple tools and multiplement instruments that we can they can wield. And so right now, I mean with respect to the Social Circle warehouse, ICE is saying that they intend to detain people in their starting in April, jeez,
in less than two months. Yeah, and so right now, the strategy truly is to use just like every tool at our disposal, identifying Yeah, like what legislation can be filed, what litigation you know, what lawsuits can be filed, what you know, demonstrations, what kind of you know, canvassing, door knocking, you know, you name it? Like, how can how can people come together? How can we try to identify which companies would be supplying the labor to turn this warehouse
into something, you know, where people will be detained? I mean not that not that I think ICE gives a damn about making any type of facility habitable for humans.
But there's gonna be there's gonna be some work that needs to.
Be done in order to you know, turn this you know, would be Amazon warehouse into a place for people. And is there work that you know, local organizers, because they're organizers.
We're all organ you know, we're all organizers.
Is there work that local organizers can do to try to unite with laborers, with workers who you know might be working on this facility, to try to like prevent them or like city workers, Like can they prevent city workers from like actually hooking up this warehouse to the city utilities?
Right? Yeah, yeah, presumably Yeah, that will be a building contractor, right, Like they will want to build thousands of cells in this giant Yeah. The call of that stuff, and especially with it happening so quickly, like you know, anything that delays that will cause it to at least slow it down. I guess.
Yeah.
I think another angle that we haven't talked about yet is the environmental angle, Like with social circle. You know, this is I mean a town of five thousand, it's gonna trip. It's gonna nearly triple the number of people in this place, and I mean and also triple the amount of of waste and sewage that's going to be coming out of this place.
I mean, So that's one thing.
Another thing for people to look at is, you know, what would the environmental impact of these warehouses be on local waterways?
For example?
And that's what you know temporarily put a stop on the detention facility in the Everglades in Florida, was a legal challenge in federal court under NIPA, the National Environmental Protection Act, because the federal government had failed to conduct the proper environmental impact assessments. Yeah, and the only thing that they actually really had to do was you know, something very procedural and you know, tick a box.
And ultimately the facility ended up moving forward.
But it was a tool to buy time to figure out what other types of organizing can we do.
Yeah, and it's still like even if it's only time, right, Like harm isn't being done in that time, and it's still a good thing. Yeah, that makes like a form of harm reduction. It reminds me a lot of the struggles here against the newer, larger border wall that we've seen since twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen when Trump got elected. Like I'm thinking about how there have been ecological challenges to it, there have been social challenges to it. Right.
The city of San Diego is currently trying to sue the fed to trest bus for part of its war construction, which, like I'm not a big fan of our city government, but like, I'm glad they did that, and all these different tools have at least at least in the last
Trump administration. I remember in the late summer at twenty twenty being out with some Kumai folks who were in ceremony because the war construction was destroying Kumia ancestors right who are buried there and then the spaces where they are buried, And they ran out the clock on the
Trump administration. Right by using their rights as indigenous people to be in ceremony, the refusal of the workers to literally drive a trucks through the middle of their ceremonial practices, they were able to like run the clock out on the Trump administration. Unfortunately now we have another one. But like all those different things had to work together to mean that, like in that little part of the border, somebody's great great grandparents remains weren't dynamited out of the earth,
and that's still a good thing. Like however we got there, that's a good thing. Absolutely, it makes me happy to hear that. Like even folks who might have otherwise been politically aligned with the project were appalled by this because the idea of literally warehousing humans, like it's so fucking bleak, Like there's these big warehouses where we fulfill them with shit that we don't need, and now definitely in with people that apparently we don't want. Like it's it's one
of the more horrific things that I know. It just it's so bleak to me.
Yeah, yeah, I agree, Like the veil has just been totally lifted, Like we know that they don't view immigrants as human, Yeah, but now they're like not even pretending anymore, just truly treating people like chattel.
Yeah again yeah again right in the same places, yea, in this instance, Like, I guess I'm glad that even people who are not politically on the same team maybe like are opposed to this because it's, uh yeah, it is repugnant.
Yeah.
I guess what if people are hearing about this for the first time, right, and will include that link to the article so people can look up where these locations are, if any of them? What advice would you have for people if you're listening to this, you click on that link, you find this one half an hour from your house or whatever, Like, what advice do you have for those people?
I think if you're already an organizer, regardless of whether you've been in the immigrants rights fight or not.
Now is the time.
When it really is like all hands on deck, So don't be afraid to get involved. But also, you know, like we were talking about before we started, is I think guarantee that there is some immigrants rights movement in your.
Locale or somewhere close by.
And I think it's just so important to you know, approach this work not with the assumption that you are starting, you know, launching this new campaign, spearheading this you know, new, previously untapped, you know, area of work, because I guarantee you that you know, there are people who have have
worked on this before. And so I think connect with you know, connect both with people who have been doing this work for a long time and also try to connect with people who you might not otherwise have thought to connect with. And I think it's important to call out the nimbiism, the not in my backyardism of how, you know, some people are coming at this issue because they're you know, they're worried about their property value.
But it's also something that we can capitalize on.
Right It's energy and oftentimes it's people with capital and connections that you know that you might not otherwise have had access to either. So I think you know, the connecting, you know, and the community organizing needs to go in multiple directions. But I do think it's important to move. Yeah, it's important to move.
Fast, Yeah seriously, Like that is a very constrained timeline, like everybody has to be, but that means it's also important to move respectfully, right, because like, if we just blow each other ship up, because yet people assume that migrant communities have somehow not been advocating for themselves in each other for centuries, then we're not going to have time to organize because we're going to be dealing with
that shit. And I've seen that so much just personally, right, like having been involved for some time in migrant advocacy and seeing folks like pop in and tell us how to do everything. It's tiresome, and I understand that you'll want to help. But yeah, if this is something that like you're organizing around, super easy to find those organizations to be like how can I help?
Yeah?
And it's also such a good like this fight in particular is such a good vehicle for fighting for abolition overall. As someone who's been saying abolish ICE for years. It is amazing to see how much traction that phrase has gotten, especially over the last six months. And we can't just be fighting against you know, preventing.
New ICE facilities.
We need to be fighting for shutting down all ICE facilities and for abolishing ICE as an institution. We've been around before ICE, and we will be around after ICE. As you know, as an agency, ICE has only been around since since two thousand and three. Sure there was a predecessor, there was the in s, but I mean it didn't operate in nearly the type of way that ICE does now as this you know, law enforcement agency.
And even before Trump, like ICE was still a really you know, horrible like horrible yeah, yeah, agency, And so yeah, I think it's important to continue to you know, point these things out while also you know, welcoming people into the fight.
And yeah, and pushing them, pushing them further.
Yeah, I think that's really it's really important. Like I think we have to rebut the assumption that this is an aberration and we can fix it and go back to normal, because normal was bad and you just couldn't see it because it wasn't on your screen, right, like children died in outdoor attention and Abiden. I saw people's suffer immenseally in outdoor attention under Biden, Like, we don't want to go back to that either, And I think it's really important that when we build these coalitions we
build them with that in mind. That like, we're organizing very quickly, but also we're in this for the long haul, until everybody's free. Is there anything that you'd like to leave people with resources or a bit of advice, any like closing words you'd like to share with him?
Abologize?
That's all I got, perfect, all right, So ladies and gentlemen, we're gonna dive in politics.
Prop This is special for me.
We're calling this the Art of Petty and the playoff words you may or may not know is that Petty is actually my last name, and like, like literally government, it's my last name. And as a child they used to bother me. As a grown up, I'm like, not us sounds about right. So what made its start? First of all was the bio, says the writer of the Pettysburg address.
Yeah, that's one of the funniest things.
It makes me mad because it's my last name and I'm like, why did I not think of that?
Like, it's so brilliant. Amanda Nelson, Welcome to the show.
Thank you, thank you so much, and thank you for appreciating my ridiculous Abraham Lincoln joke.
It's brilliant.
I and super producer Ian separately came across your content like at the same time. I know when I first hit the follow within a day or two, I was like, have you heard of there? Have you heard of this president?
And he just simulated. I was like, dude, I just started fall and it's and I think there's a there's a kindred spirit in the sense of like history being actually not that difficult to grasp if you just speak like a regular ass human you know what I'm saying, and politics the same, Like you know, the premise of the Hall Show is that like if you understand inner city living, you understand politics. Like if you grew up in and around our streets, it's really not that different.
You know, even whether you was like a nerd, you know, running as fast as you can to the library, you still knew I better not go down Seventh Street, because like you still know how this works. You know what I'm saying, or whether you were completely outside, like you know, stilling people's bikes like you get it, you know. So what we appreciated about what you do is the accessibility of it.
So thank you, thank you, well, thank you. That's that was the goal from the beginning, especially the you know, on Mondays, I do a series called the Whiteboard, which is literally just a whiteboard with a bunch of sticky notes on it, Yeah, where I track congressional legislation as it moved its way through Congress or doesn't, as is more often the case. Yeah, And that was one of the first things I started doing when I started making content, and people were so appreciative of it in a way
I found surprising. I thought people would find it nerdy and boring and silly. Yeah, but it's such an unnecessarily complicated process and explaining it in ways that people can grasp that. There's been a lot of appreciation for it, which I love.
Yeah, which leads me to the next question, which would be like, Okay, so you're formal training your upbringing, like I need to know the origin story of the nerdery, but before that, this is the week of the super Bowl, So I'm just wondering as a Latina who's not a Latina who I just found out an hour ago is not a Latino. Have you recovered from Benito's performance?
I am not a Latino.
That is true. And I just when I was talking about it, when I was talking about it online about Bad Bunnies halftime show, I got so many people asking me, wait, you're not Latina, so apparently I am presenting, which is nice. Yes, I have recovered because after the halftime show, I went to bed, so I was in mine. It was such a boring game, Like I'm not going to say to her. Last game was trash, four hours of freaking field goals. But then of course I went to bed and it gets spiced up a little bit.
Then it became a game, right, but it didn't matter. Yeah, so you're on the East coast.
Then I am. I'm in Virginia.
Yep, yeah, no, that's that's absolutely hilarious. We are on the West coast, to which the game starts at three pm. But definitely my wife was like ready to go after that. My wife is a first gin Latina and she was just like, wait, there's more game.
She's being silly, but yeah, do we have to stay?
We're at my sister in law's house, and she was just like, uh, we're good unless you want to stay, you know, since I'm a Cali native, I'm like, I really don't care about either of these teams and the same yeah, and my I mean down to my Mitochandria, Like, I cannot ever cheer for a new England team.
Yeah, I can't.
Just the Celtics the boss thing as an la boy, I can't anybody remotely close to that.
I just can't cheer for.
I think I have like twenty ten's PTSD for having to constantly listen to the Patriots be off show in everything, and so I have an ingrained bias. Also their owners like a weird maga dude, and you're weirdo.
Yeah he's weird.
So and Tom Brady is also weird, Like he's a weird guy.
You weird man? Did you see his roast?
Yes?
Yes? I like, yeah, you weird bro like he is.
And I can't decide if like Giselle leaving made him weirder or if he was weird and she left because of that. I can't figure it out.
I don't care that much, but I honestly that's a good thought.
Man like because I've I've considered that a few times because I'm like the level of competitive you have to be to be someone like a Tom Brady, like Michael Jordan, like Tony Hawk, Like you have to be insufferable if with your will and drive to be as good as you are. And now, my wife has a PhD in ed policy. She's one of the most self driven people I know. Even with her just doctoral nerdiness, there's a level of like, will you chill like about you know,
certain stuff. But we're both like we're both nerds, you know what I'm saying. So we're both nerds a lot of ways. But like I can imagine, I can't imagine being married to someone where you're just like, can we talk about anything anything but this?
Yes?
Anything else?
Yes?
The answer is no, no.
Yeah, So okay, so tell me about Okay, formal training and upbringing, Like why are you like this?
Why am I?
Yes?
Well, I have a history degree and undergraduate history that I got. How do I explain why I'm like this? That's such an interesting question.
So I was.
Raised in South by very conservative white people, Okay, and I did not understand why I was kind of singled out a lot growing up. Like, as we said at the beginning, I'm not Latina. My grandmother's from the Philippines, and so that was like enough, like enough one dropness to make all the white people around you, yeah, like
very weird. And I didn't get it. And as I grew up and I realized more about understood more about the South and about Virginia specifically, which is the capital of the Confederacy and all that, I got kind of obsessed with history, Like why are these people like this? So I've always been into history. I got a history degree, and then I became you know, I kind of actively once I got out of my parents' house, to be honest,
and I'm not conservative anymore. But once I got out of my parents' house and discovered like a world of active I went to college, which is the case for so many kids who grew up in you know, the rural South. I went to college, discovered activism and organizing and people with different opinions. Yeah, and I don't know, a whole world opened up for me and I got involved. I've been politically involved ever since. I've done all kinds
of things. I've volunteered for campaigns, I've been a clinic, escort, an abortion clinic here in town, all kinds of it. But I've worked with the ACLU, so I am like, I suppose because my family is strange.
I respect it.
Well maybe not strange, maybe just normal for where they're.
From, normal for where they are from. No, I respect that.
In your defense, the Philippines, y'all are the black and Latinos of.
Asia, Mexicans specific.
Yeah, you're the Mexicans and the black people. That's what's that's what sucks about being what's great about being Filipino? Y'all get to be black and Latino and Asian. It's not fair. My step mom's from the Philippines, So like, I have this affinity because raised by a Filipino woman. Well, I was raised by a black woman and a Filipino woman.
Long story.
The point is that that makes a lot of sense, dude, Like that thing that radicalized you was I'm using radicalized as a stand in word, but just exposure, right, Like that's super interesting to know that, like not even the awareness of because like you said, like you you existed in this white space and you like, I don't understand
why y'all exactly? Yeah, yeah, what did I do. It's like it's cause you're kind of not You're like, well, but yeah, I am right, Like it was it was kind of kind of one of those scenarios or like or did you kind of like I'm maybe putting a little more on like you, like you said you weren't aware of you you're presenting, but did you did you feel sort of culturally that like I.
Feel like I belong here?
Is that was?
Is that true? Yeah?
I mean I didn't understand. I understood that I looked a little bit different than everybody around me. Fine, yeah, a little bit not a time, like I'm not you know, I'm a core a Filipino. Like it's not. I understood that I looked a little bit different. I did not understand why that mattered word for a really long time.
And then like the older I got, the more it would be, Like I go out into school and the sort of racism that I would get would be when people mistook me for being Latina or when people mistook me for being black. That's when I would get like act like really bad. Because where I'm from in Virginia Beach is the largest Filipino population on the East Coast, so be if Filipinos being around people were kind of
used to. But it was when people thought that I was not just other, but a whole other other, you know, than what they were used to.
And I didn't.
I didn't understand, like I was born into this household. Like we've all watched the same fucking NASCAR races, we eat the same talten. I have to listen to your stupid ass Rush Limbaugh, So like, why am I different? It doesn't make sense to me.
That's so interesting.
I love that my undergrad was going to be history, but it kind of switched to like intercultural studies. I was just more interested, a little more like sociology. I majored in illustration and because I wanted to do art and cultural studies and then did social science for like grad school. Mine was a little different in the sense that listeners know. But like my father was a My father was a black panther, you know what I'm saying.
And you know, you know, we grew up in the space and it wasn't sort of like like you said, like this like light bulb was not my experience. My experience was like this is necessary for our survival. And I think I was more thrown back because which is again what I want to get to about, Like kind of the way that you present this stuff is like I feel like this information is available for all of us, Like it didn't take a lot of digging.
For you to like I feel like it was not.
Really I loved even even you talking about your your experience in like working in politics and organizing and volunteering where it's like a lot of times we feel like the access to entry is much harder than it actually is.
You could just go there, just.
Go over there and just be like, yo, can I help, and it's really like it really be that easy, you know.
And people will be so happy to have you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but yeah, I just feel like especially you're You're I'm jumping around, but like you You're Trump's l's for the week are like, I mean, it's right there, like you know what I'm saying, Like he'd just be saying I.
Don't take a lot of work, you know what I'm saying.
Like, but obviously us as like you know, having formal training and research and fact checking and tumble checks, like you know, like having the formal training that definitely helps me.
You know what I'm saying.
But besides that, sometimes I'll be like, well, this is just I mean, this is what he said he was going to do, and then it didn't happen. So I'm like, that's an l ain't it? Like, I just don't it. Don't be that hard. Okay, Now the next question is about your sense of humor, so like why are you so funny?
Like what why are you like that? Because I mean, I love it.
I'm mean to people you're not supposed to be mean to, Like, you know, there's such an Americans let me rephrase this. White Americans have such an ingrained, like inherent respect for positions of authority, like like the president, Like how can you talk shit about the president?
You know?
I don't care.
Because he trash, because he's garment.
I don't give a shit the color of a rusted out worstrop. What do I care? So I have no problems being being mean, and I'm mean in ways that give people like permission to be a little like thrilled by it or a little delighted by it. And that provides, I think, an entry away for people to learn a little bit of I love it. I don't know, America, We're not We're not great again, I should clarify white America, specifically, especially my people.
I was like, oh no, man, I ever really yeah, yeah, you're right.
Yeah, Like the people that I speak to are a lot of like suburban moms, right, I'm a forty one year old mom, and they are not used to middle fingers.
Up at all.
Especially Yeah recently, you know, like Biden got an office and everybody kind of fell asleep. Yeah, a democratic why people fell asleep. So being mean and just pulling out some claws. It's both like funny and fun for me, but it's also strategic because I do want there to be I want to present a permission structure for people to start learning to have a bit more backbone.
I love that. I love that. I love that, Like you said, the term you use is permission, and that's what I enjoyed. I think that.
Yeah, like knowing that, like you're from the South and that like adds even more of a color to what's happening here makes me like it even more. Yeah, I don't have no second thoughts about dragging a public figure, a politician like I. I have no second thoughts about it because again, like you asked for this, you know, what I'm saying, You signed up for this, you said you was gonna be this, Like all right, I'm about to get real black, But like there's parts of me that's
just like, Okay, are you a bitch ass nigga? You know what I'm saying, Like, and I'm like, there are ways for me to be able to know if you are? You presented yourself like you a real one, And I'm like, okay, well there's qualifying entry points for me to do that, you know what I'm saying, Like we learn I'll respect in our culture, you respect your elders for their position as elders, But do I respect that person as a person.
No, you gotta earn that.
But authority figures are different. You're in a corrupt system, this system already don't like me, and you're applying for a job, and the job you applying for is governance. So I'm like, I don't give fuck about you. Like yo,
I'm saying, like no, but there is something unique. I think about your particular intersections as ethnically ambiguous, from the South, highly educated, you know, and unfortunately in a patriarchal, misogynistic world of female right which I already know greats at so much, which I think I appreciate probably the most when you have time to like drag a comments or oh, like obviously men are not okay, Like we know.
That ship is sailed, we're not okay. You know what I'm saying.
Part of me feels like now this is like as much as I've evolved in my feminism, and you know, I'm the father of two daughters, and you know, I've learned to like really not understand how I was the problem to become to understand that I'm the problem, you know, even in just my ways of communicating, my advocacy stuff like that, my blind spots and all that. And I'm with,
you know what I'm saying, I have nephews. I don't have like I said, I don't have sons, but I have I have nephews who I've like realized that I carried a lot of ways for which I thought I was supposed to talk to my daughter versus talking to a son, you know I'm saying. And I'm like, and I said, well, I'm but talk to my daughter the way I would talk to my son, you know, and just stupid, you know what I'm saying.
And then but even just being like man.
Like sometimes my nephew could use like a gentle voice, like you know, a man just like him that could just be real gentle you know what I'm saying, like bro, like man, I'm sorry you sick man. It sucks when you get your feelings hurt, Like I get it, you know what I'm saying, Like being able to be gentle with him too. That said, I feel like I come from an era where words have consequences. You know, you
say something to somebody might slap the shit out of you. Yes, you know what I'm saying, so like you watch your mouth. You know what I'm saying. Be cause like now, granted, I've, like I said, I've grown to where that like I don't know what the fuck you think you're talking to, Like I don't say that no more, you know what I'm saying, Where it's just like, okay, I have learned
that that's not the person I need to be. However, I feel like a lot of these young men, especially in your comments sections, like they didn't have no big homies like I did. That would be like, m boy, if you don't shut you know what I'm saying, Like you know and just being like son, like, yes, so you can't just be talking. And I come from a city where she might slap the shit at you. Will you know what I'm saying. She wills, not just like you know what I'm saying.
I'm saying.
So I'm like, bro, you can't just be talking. So anyway, that's a long preamble to say. I appreciate when you take the time to drag a comment, So please tell me, Please tell me the origins of that.
Yeah. So I have two sons. Okay, they are twins, they'll be fifteen in a few weeks. And I care a lot. Actually, I get a lot of shit for this from people on the left, from liberals as well, especially from women that I care a lot about men, and yeah, them not being okay, you know.
I care, Yeah they're not ok Yeah, because I have two.
Boys, and I don't want that to be them. I see the traps, yeah, that are waiting for them out there, that are being placed on purpose for sure by bad actors. So I want policy and conversations and acceptance and help for the men and the boys.
Yeah.
And also when it's almost always, you know, like some Republican mouth breather who follows a bunch of AI pornbots gets into my comments to talk to me some kind of way. I decided that I was going to make an example of them, because these are people who have never experienced a consequence.
Yes, ever, that's what I like.
If you're a fifty year old white man, you have never experienced a consequence for running your mouth. That's what I'm saying, and I'm going to be that consequence for you.
You're welcome, yes, thank you.
And it just disgusts me because again they're almost always following like a bunch of teenage AI bots, you know, all of these just yeah, it's completely inappropriate behavior. They do not understand the concept of matching energy. They're completely shocked when they comment to my comments and give me shit and then I match their energy. They're always just a gast that like, how dare I? Well you Darren? First?
What I'm just like, yeah, like for somebody who swear they so like you, so tough and hard, I'm like, man, little cupcake.
Ass like one of the earliest.
I mean, I'm telling you the earliest lesson I got as a child, and I still say it to my kids. You don't dish out what you can't take, like you don't, don't put it out there if you can't handle it. You know, So if you go get jokes and that person roast you back. I come from. That's our culture. It's like even even around family, it's just like bro, I was having a conversation with one of the parents, like, because I have the type of job I have, I do a lot of the pickups, the after school pickups.
Yeah you know, so I was talking to one of them.
Yes, yes, so I was talking to one of the moms just about like nicknames, growing up whatever, right, And my mother biting sarcasm is super funny, brilliant, but like fire baptized, speaking in tongues, praying the house down, she is a biting sarcasm.
And I was like, she used to call me the before picture she just just cold his ice and I was just like dang.
But again it's like she could she could always give it back, you know what I'm saying, So like we you just so you just knew, like if you was gonna get your feelings hurt, I don't know if you can handle that, you know, And even like specifically with the young ladies, it's just like, bro, like, I'm like, you follow with porn bots. Like part of me like again in the most misogynistic possible it's like, nigga, you ain't got no flavor cuz like right, you're weirdo, like that's why you're doing this.
Yeah, and they claim like this is a group of people, you know whatever, I'm conservative Jena x men, Yeah, who claim a level of cultural dominance that that's what they're expressing when they come into the my comments section to yell at me. This like cultural dominance they think they have and it's completely manufactured. Yeah, you dominate no one.
No one look at you like, and that's kind of the point that and I yeah, part of me is like, well, maybe I'm being too mean, but also I feel like I'm doing them a favor, like you really are you have no actual self esteem? You have no self esteem is built by doing estimable things. And when you spend all of your time online just yelling at women, of course, yeah, there's nothing esteemable there.
It's so silly man, Like, I mean, we're totally off the rails here. But I love this because it's very important to me because I'm just like when my oldest was in like junior high. Like I was trying to tell my wife, Like I was like, the thing is, we have been experiencing rejection since fifth grade, and it's because I'm planning this all week to go actually approach Natasha, like you're thinking about it all week when I'm gonna wear the right outfit, I'm gonna do this. You go
over there, you say something to her. She giggles to all her friends and runs away and says you it's just like, okay, that's the first time you got your heartbroken as a little boy, right, So fast forward to middle school. Oh my god, will you dance with me? You know, okay, you did it again. By time, these dudes are in the club and it's like, hey, hey, red jeans, red jeans, red jeans.
You want to dance? No or whatever? Fuck you?
You know what I'm saying. It's just like, you know, you go through this. But all that to say, hopefully, if you have a healthy sense, you start learning, like hey man, you catch more.
Bees with honey bro like or you know what I'm saying, Like, maybe there's a better.
Way to communicate with people, and you just got to understand that, Like I just think you don't know how to talk to people, like you don't know, like she got the right to be like no, thank you, and you gotta be like okay, word, you know what I'm saying. You shot your shot, like I'm trying to be like as bland as passable. Look, you shoot your shot, you don't you don't make every shot.
Yeah, you know what I'm saying. Like, you don't make every shot, You're gonna hit one of them. You know what I'm saying.
Somebody gonna want to dance with you, and you're just like, okay, great, you know it was a good time. You know, hey, can we No, Okay, you know what I'm saying. It's just it is what it is. Your point, I think either I don't. It's so weird to be explained because I just I don't relate to it. I don't relate to somebody who doesn't understand that, like Broll, you're a total stranger, Like I don't care about your opinion number one, And why do you feel like you have the right.
To like what is you doing?
Like it's just it's embarrassing roh, Like yeah, like so anyway, I enjoy it, but I think you brought up something that I would love to hear you talk more about, like all this to say, like this is the note I wrote. It's like, I feel like this type of dragging is not only needed, but I think it's holy right, and I think it's a divine, sacred work to like truly roast a person. And I think when it comes to you in politics, it's because you know what you're talking about.
It makes it even more important.
But I guess my question is, like, do you think that there is something greater than just this is funny going on there?
Oh?
Yeah, for sure. I know it seems like it's for the lulls or whatever, or the views of the clicker of your engagement or whatever. But there's very little that I do in my content that's not strategic. And again it goes back to permission. Like you said, these men don't know me. Yeah, I don't care what they think about about me. I'm doing great. You know, you know
you're free to hate me. I don't care. But I want to again provide a permission structure, especially for other women who exist online and who in this moment especially want to start raising their voices, to learn how to clap back, like, you have got to learn if you're going to be out there, especially right now in the world as a woman, you have got to learn how to tell somebody to fuck off in a way that
that matter, that they will hear. Yeah, you know, because a lot of times men won't hear no. You know that the president doesn't know what the word not means. But if you can say it artfully and mean it with your whole chest, oftentimes it will work. So it's almost like providing an example, especially for women who are a little younger than me because I'm in my four now, how to detach themselves from the value assigned to them by random men who gives a fuck for show.
And like the seasoning on top of that is just corny ass man, Like just yes, you are a cornball. Like that's where it's like, it's not the problem, but it's the part that just like gets under my fingernails, is like you're so fucking corny.
Like you know what I'm saying. Yeah, So I'm like, why are you doing this? Like you're the same guy, bro, Like.
It's the same guy every time.
Why are y'all?
Who where is this aesthetic?
And then I'm just like speaking your language, like I don't know a single female that likes this, Like who anyway, let's go back to the to the profession, even though I do love that that's a part of the thing, like you mentioned before, formerly trained in history, you know your whiteboard stuff, like you're obviously very well researched, and I have my cynical answer to this, but like it's just so bizarre to me how specifically if we're gonna use these binaries of like right wing and left wing,
like especially like content creation, to where I'm just like, Okay, we know that that's a grift, we know that's a hustle, we know you're doing that, but like but even with that, I'm just like they just be factually wrong to where I'm just like I'm not even like I'm not even worried about your position. I can't even get to your positions yet. I'm just saying, like you ain't doing no homework.
I can't square that circle to me. But like what you do and I know what I do too, is because I guess, because I guess we care about reality.
Is like I mean, do a lot of homework. You know what I'm saying so.
Like I would love to know a little bit about your process as far as like your homework, your research, maybe what.
Some tools you use before you even put it on.
Like I mean, I've there's been times I've had to be like, hey, guys, hey, I fucked up. I thought it was you know what I'm saying, Like I'll come back and fact check myself, but I'll just be like, I don't understand fact check it all. Like I feel like I don't even That's why I won't do like jubileese or any to I'll be like.
Oh I've refused. No, absolutely not. I'm like, yeah that ye, No, that's not my actual nightmare a stress stream of being in a jubilee. Yeah, I think that the way that like you were saying, the way that it's approached makes a difference. So like, I'm not here for a media career. I'm not here to make a bajillion dollars and become an influencer and go work on Chuck Schumer's reelection campaign. I don't give a shit about any of that.
No, thank you.
I am here. I don't falk what Chuck.
Suber Yeah, no, thank you.
I am here with a mission, and my mission is to help people who are probably just getting plugged in, or even people have been plugged in for a while and are getting tired, understand how power operates in America politically, historically and now. And that takes a lot of digging and a lot of research and a lot of fact checking, as you were saying, So I need people to trust me, because if they don't trust me, they're not going to take my advice. They're not going to get involved in
the places I tell them to get involved. There's not going to be any strategy to the ways that people are formulating their resistance with their opposition to rising authoritarianism. So it matters a great deal that I am right in the things that I'm saying, yeah, and that it's accurate at least. I mean, I'm not saying my takes are always right. And of course, like you said, I make mistakes sometimes and I will go back and correct myself.
But I mean, you know, I've been an American history person for twenty years now, so I do have a pretty big base of knowledge. Yeah, but I am going to go back before I say a word and like double check my dates, double check like was this person in the House of the Senate, you know, what was the bill number? Like, I am going to do all of that, and that takes a lot of digging. Like I don't I don't think it's on purpose necessarily, but
going through congressional records is everything is very scattered. Nothing is in one place. You're checking fourteen different you know, resources, Congress, dot Gov and all these other things. And I have to collalate all of that and put it together and it takes hours, you know, hours. Yeah, but it's my full time job now, so yeah, that's fine. But when I was working full time, when I had like a corporate job, I was in big tech up until June of last year.
Wow, So it was it was.
Just a lot of hours. It was eighteen nineteen hour days. I slept almost sees zero. I mean it's better now, but yeah, I mean, I am very dedicated to making sure that the thing that I'm putting out there is trustworthy, is not emotionally reactive like I'm I think that is something that separates me from other creators, especially on the left, is I'm not trying to get a rise out of you. I'm not trying to make you that's so dopanic. I'm not doing that, Like that should terrify every American. I'm
not doing that. Shit. You're an adult. If you want to be terrified, be terrified. I don't care. Like your feelings are your own problem. Yeah, I'm telling you what's happening, how it's rooted in American history, and what you can do about it, and like what people have done about it in the past. When similar things have happened, something similar is probably happened, and so like, yeah, that's my strategy.
Yeah again, very much so like a kinsman like spirit in that. Yeah, Like I'm not I'm ultimately an educator, you know what I'm saying, And I'm like, I'm really just trying to onboard you to be like hey, bro, like these people aren't smarter than you.
You know.
Yes, lastly, like I would ask because you kind of just brought it up like some sort of like historical parallels as far as like lessons from the past, like do you have any that like come to mind, like off the head?
Oh yes, how much time do you have?
No?
I know people always always always want to talk about Nazi Germany right now, and like I get it, Okay, I'm not saying that there are no commonalities. Of course there are. It's so important to me that we focus on the commonalities that we have in American history because we are so different from Germany. Yeah, Germany was like very ethnically homogeneous. It's a tactic, a small country compared to ours. Yes, they don't have the same issues that we had. They had they you know, Nazi Germany came
out of a very particular time place and people. We are a different time place and people. So there's that like studying not to German if you want, I'm not saying don't, but if you're going to study Nazi Germany, but you're not going to look at the Black Panthers, and you're not going to look at the Civil rights movement, and you're not going to look at reconstruction, and you're not going to look at Jim Crow.
Yes.
Yes, you're not going to come up with any viable solutions. Yes, because resistance in Germany came from the Soviet Union coming into right and you know, but resistance in America comes from black and indigenous and Latino people, yes, and like we did it y yes, and labor movements and all and so you have got to become more familiar with your own people, with your own people. And that's a little difficult in America, right because we're like, you know,
we're not really a melting pot. We're more of like a weird mixed chopped salad. Yes, but we tend to be in our little on purpose are separated, segregated neighborhoods and our segregated schools, and we don't associate with and we do like Black History Month, and then we forget to read about any other point of Black history outside of that. Yeah, and we'll do like Indigenous People's Day on Columbus Day and never read another piece of Hitt.
And all that is is a disservice because those are the effect of resistance methods that we can take and carry forward as we move through this administration.
And we will, we.
Will come out on the other side.
But like love it.
Even something like the guilded Age, right, like that I think is one of the most important historical analogs the late nineteenth century because in the guilded Age, we had an oligarchy, there was no income tax like the Rockefellers. There was so much corruption at every level of government, Jim Crow was on the rise, was being born out of that era. Labor unions were coming online and all of that, Like, there are so many parallels, but we
made so many mistakes. Then we made so many We let the clan come back, Our labor unions were segregated, purposefully segregated. We got lots of things like the FDA and government regulations and things like that that were born out of all this corruption. But then we went way too far into scoldy moralizing and got prohibition, which was a terrible idea. So we need to avoid that. We need to avoid leaving behind people like we did during the Gilded Age, because that's what Americans tend to do.
We have we like momentum, we like forward, we like progress, and we leave behind all these people who've been oppressed and marginalized and we just ignore them. So we need to we need to look at our own history and learn not just from the effective resistance of the past, but the mistakes we made in the past. And we can't really do that looking at Nazi Germany because that ended with.
Those yeah exactly, I don't like.
He killed himself and then we you know, set up NATO and left yeah, yeah, and that's not what we need to do here.
My biggest gripe was like yeah, like especially with like the leftover Nazis, was like we didn't go hard enough on you. You know what I'm saying, Like we should have like really stamped that out, but you really cook him in, Like I mean you already nailed it. I see, Yeah, Gilded Age slave catchers, Like to me, this is like this some dread Scot shit to me, yes, you know what I'm saying, And yeah, all that like because that was like we're saying, okay, who's a citizen.
Yeah, you know what I'm saying.
That was the dread Scott question, right or just like you know, States rights versus Federal rights, Marlboi versus Madison, like all this stuff like you said, like we've already fleshed out that in my mind is playing. But the Gilded Age thing is like nah, dude, like you cooking, because man, you got me all excited in my history.
I'm excited now. I wish you could see my toes tapping.
But like yeah, cause I'm like, okay, you think of like the Pinkertons, you think about like the ways for which a collective movement being broke in the sense that like you had these you know, steel workers in Pittsburgh that would strike and then they would just go get freed slaves to be like well, y'all could go do this, And it's like, man, what the hell you want me to do?
You know what I'm saying, Like.
Like exactly, yes, I mean any choice.
I don't have no choice. You know what I'm saying.
It's like to the regime, like touche, it was a really good move, you know what I'm saying as somebody trying to hold on to a regime, But like what like to your point, like it's it's always like and this is the hard part for me, even talking about Black history, which is something I want to come back to with Like the cost of this is different for like African American communities. This this costs us more. You know what I'm saying, it's going to in the long
run cost us all. Don't get me wrong, but what you're asking, especially at that moment, going back to the guilded dage, what you're asking me to step into. We're not ponying up the same amount of money here, you know what I'm saying, so I just wonder, like you said, like what are those lessons me living in Los Angeles, like you know, with the ice rage being a part of like deeply student in the Latino community, Like what's the strategic cause, you know, black people get out there,
police open fire. You know what I'm saying, Like they gonna kill us, you know what I mean? So like is this strategic by us? Like kind of like, well, we'll be in the back row, Like what's happening here? You know what I'm saying? Like, so what are those lessons? What are ways for which we can like, like you said, like look at how America has responded to its you know hydra, that's that's rearing itself.
Is an interesting thing.
But I think the last thing before I ask you about predictions is this thing about about black history, this being Black History Month. So the hard part for me is like especially with like like I taught high school for six years, you know, when when discussing blackness or like you said, Indigenous Day or whatever, like it's this carve out, right, that is, you know, a corrective force, right, but the carve out a lot of times tends to just be like trivia, like vocabulary like, oh.
Did you know that this person?
Did you do?
You know what I'm saying.
And it's like, of course, cause you're trying to like I get it, you're trying to wet the appetite, you know what I'm saying. But it's a carve out to me, that's not in the context. It's not context inbedded, it's not a part of history. It's this carveout that's taught as trivia, you know what I'm saying, and.
Like an afterthought, yeah, or an adult it's like an afterthought.
But then like you said, but then never talked about again as if like what it's like, well, we were there whole time, We're in every chapter, we're we're in all the semesters you're about to talk through like we.
Was at all of them, you know what I'm saying.
And it's just like, so we're just gonna not point at the black people for the rest of the year when you talk about this while there needs to be and of course I'm a product of it, like the specificity of a moment to say, I just want to stop right here and say that this person was this you know what I'm saying, But like, what are ways for which we can reimbed the female voices, the indigenous voices, the black voices, back into just the curriculum period, which
is bastardized by what Maggot's trying to say. You know what I'm saying, like the bastardized version of that that is clearly obviously racist, you know what I'm saying. It was like which so like a lot of times we start talking about this, they'd be like, you know what, that's our point, and I'm like, hold up, cuz that's not your point, Joe'm saying, that's not the point you make it, right. The point I'm making is saying we
were there the whole time. Yeah, and I wouldn't love to have the dignity of being there the whole time, you know what I'm saying.
So so I say that to echo.
Your point about like we're just gonna stop talking about natives after indigited like they was there.
You'll say it like.
Yeah, and it matters today, Like I just got into it on threads or Instagram or whatever some platform with some leftist which is I'm not it's not a criticism of leftism, but he was saying like he was criticizing Kamala Harris's campaign. Fine, I don't care Kamala Harris, but he was a white guy and he was saying she kept making pitches about what she could do for the black community, but she never said what she could do
for white people. And I was like, my good bitch, you made that up, Like she went on all black podcasts once and you gek that to mean that she didn't care about white people. Yeah, and like, second of all, what part of like first time home buyer tax credits
to you? I only care about black people. Like the idea that policies or history books or whatever that have black people in them, or that would benefit black people only benefit black people is one of the reasons why we're in this stupid situation that we're in nout because, Yeah, it's bizarre the recognition of how black and Indigenous and Latino people have been in this country since the beginning. The Spanish have been here longer, the English Spanish has
been spoken in this country longer than English. Yeah, to put open in that that raises everyone's boats, Like policies that benefit our marginalized communities benefit everyone else, Like the rising tide truly does raise all of the ships. And we can't get to an understanding of that without understanding the history because like take for example, what we're dealing with right now, mostly direct attacks on the fourteenth Amendment, which is a Reconstruction era amendment.
Guys, yes, and we'll attack that, yeh.
And attacks on the Voting Rights Ade of nineteen sixty five, which was which was passed to make to ensure that all black citizens could vote for us. So the things that are fucking up white people right now are because you don't understand what we got them in the first place.
Yes, that's my rant.
You couldn't now you know that that was my exact point. You're making my exact point. Or I'm just like no, this is like we were here, We're part of the country. So last thing is like, besides the prediction of not counting, Trump going to try to cancel the midterms, which is like I was like, I don't know why we talking about midtimers, he gonna try to cancel. But besides that, like who should we have our eye on?
What do you think, oh, for the midterms over twenty eight midterms? Okay, I think we're going to win the midterms.
Okay, I think.
That the decentralization, the federalization of elections, the way that every state runs their own elections, I don't see a logistical way for him to prevent that from happening. Period, he could tell yeah state not to have elections. I suppose the only ones that would obey him would be red states, in which case we would have a congressional election of only Democrats that go to the hill.
Yeah.
Fine, Yeah, that's good to me.
That's how we got the Reconstruction era amendment, was the conservatives in the South state home and didn't go to Congress. So fine, But I don't think that's going to happen because there are too many Republicans in red states who want to run for governors and who want to be senators, and they're already having fund raisers. So I do think we're going to have the midterms, and I think we're
going to win. And I'm basing that on the special elections that we've been having, sure since January of last year. And it's not just you know, I mean, special elections are different. We were like plus thirteen on average overperformance and special elections. That's not going to replicate itself in the midterms because special elections tend to be like very partisan. People are very dedicated to coming out. But in the last couple of special elections that we've had in Texas,
New Jersey, Louisiana, Republicans have flipped. Yeah, and that is where I'm like, oh, it's in the back, Like maybe the majority won't be huge. I don't know that it's going to be a landslide because they're going to fuck with it whatever. Voter suppression is real, But I do think that at least the House we're gonna we're gonna win, and the Senate I'm looking at. I think Alaska is super interesting. Ohio, North Carolina for sure. Everybody loves word
Cooper in North Carolina. Yeah, Texas, whether you like Jasmine, crocod or Tallerico, either one of them are interesting. You know, Yeah, Texas could be interesting.
So yeah, I think it's love it.
If I were a Republican, I would be very nervous.
You better be, because like you can't pretzel yourself any worse. Like I think people forget that, like ambition didn't die when Trump became president. People still are ambitious and at some point you won't realize like shit ain't working, Homie.
Which rings the last way? If we got time. Yeah, let me ask you about twenty twenty eight.
What do you think.
It's too it's too No, God, No, he's not gonna.
Make it that long.
I was like, he's gonna I keep telling all my friends. I was like, I think you have to accept that he's gonna die in office anyway.
But yeah, yeah, he's not gonna make it. It's gonna be. It's gonna be Vance. Although I think he'll have some competition maybe from Marjorie Tiller Green. I think she's going to try to run.
I think Marjorie's running well. About Tuck.
Tucker, I think he might go for like a cabinet position. You think so he's just like a stupid little bow tie. I don't think anybody would go for him. I don't know.
Okay, stand at me. I really don't, like you can't.
But yeah, he's so unlikable. Yeah, but so is jd.
Vance.
To be honest anyway, on our side, you know, it's so early, Yeah, and I think that there are people who are starting to poke their heads up now, Like I think Osof in Georgia is starting to be a little and he's the best fundraiser in seven So the two best fundraisers are actually a ticket. I would really be interested in, which is OSOF and AOC. They're the two best fund raiders in the party, and that's a ticket. I would not be upset.
About, you know, AO, AOC ticket would be crazy.
I'm not necessarily on the Newsome train. I'm not gonna lie, I'm not really on the Newsom train.
Sister Taylor secret about California feels about I know, I know, which is not so much of a secret.
Yeah, not so hot.
We we'd definitely be looking at our like our like red our Orange counties are our red stations, and they'd be like Gavin newsowhere like yeah no.
Yeah, I don't know.
Sure, hard degree.
Yeah no for real, same heart degree. Yeah.
Anyway, I appreciate that he was one of the first high profile Democrats to stand up to Trump in this administration. I appreciate that That's not good enough reason for me to make a president.
Not the president. Yeah, I'm like, you're not. Yeah, you're not a flaming bag of shit.
I got it. Yeah, you know what I'm saying, Like, you're a DC.
Hell, you're not a fascist.
Yeah you're not a fascist, Like okay, but you're willing to get on a podcast because for some reason you want like I don't understand.
Where your where's your code?
You know?
And also I'm like, I don't know, man, you know, a grown man like that still slicking his hair back is it's just odd to me.
That's going to do it for some like sixty year old ladies in the suffer. He's going to have like a Kennedy thing, you know, like, oh he's so handsome, but that's but so.
Is awesome Hoodsop's handsome.
Yeah maybe I don't know, bro, Yeah, you just I feel like you like I feel like, here's the thing.
Here's the thing about about we need to end this.
But the thing about Gavin to me is I'm like, there's this just like sheen to where it's just like, oh, you need to be liked, and like, you know, it's this whole like la transplant thing, like you know where everybody's like, oh it's so Hollywood and we're like natives are like those are all transplants. We're not like that, you know what I'm saying. So, but to me, he just has that to where I'm just like, oh, you need to be the prom king. You need to like, Oh,
you need this too much? You feel me like, and to me, I'm like, oh I don't. I can't. I can't ride like this. You need to you, you need you need to be popular too much. I don't.
Yeah, I prefer president.
I can't trust you.
Yeah.
They need to resent being there a little bit. I feel like it needs to feel like you.
Gotta like you gotta kind of be like, I'll be all right if it don't work out.
Yeah, you know, there needs to be a sense of service entitlement.
Man, my camera turns off every half hour. I don't know why.
I stuff to figure that out anyway, but that's a good sign for us to wrap this up. Please, can you drop all the at mentions for your stuff so that these people can enjoy what I enjoy.
It's Amanda's mild takes everywhere except not Blue Sky. I can deal with that, but.
Everywhere else, Yeah, Amanda's mile takes with the Pettysburg addressed. It's brilliant. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you, we appreciate it. Y'all go please, you know she'd be alway air dropping gyms.
It's just a good time.
This is it could happen here in Executive Disorder, our weekly newscast covering what's happening in the White House, the crumbling world, and what it means for you.
I'm Garrison Davis today.
I'm joined by Sophie Lichtermann, James Stout, and Robert Evans. This episode, we're covering the week of February fourth to February eleventh. It was the Super Bowl. Wasn't that fun? I heard it was streaming on Peacock this year, so I built it up my Peacock account, went to the sports section and was surprised at how few Americans there
were and how many other flags there were. And I do not remember this much skating typically at previous the previous Super Bowl shows or the ski jumping, But I mean I was it was still fun to watch people compete.
Uh huh.
Yeah, this is because I was watching the Winter Olympics.
Get it it's I did, I did, I did get it.
Good work gear, no fun stuff.
What's your favorite Winter Olympics? And Lane Garrison as a.
Canadian, Honestly, the ski jumping is pretty exciting.
They really fly, Yeah, they do.
That video of that guy that went viral that did like a under six minute mile on skis uphill.
Yeah, going uphill.
It's crazy to me.
Clear he's not going for a mile, like, he just goes uphill, like the whole course is like a mile. Ash. Well yeah, still cross country skis having insane v O two maxes cross country ski when I get the chance. It's fun. But they don't go that fast.
But no, we do.
We do need to discuss this. The actual super Bowl halftime show actually, well no, not the actual one, the other one. Yeah, the All American halftime show.
Maybe I'll just say the kid who Bad Bunny gave his Grammy too was not the same child who you saw being abducted by Ice in a little blue bunny hat.
It was supposed to symbolize a young beneath him.
Yes, yeah, yeah, not anything else.
It really was not.
There was a lot of underlying messages in that show that were very important.
But it would be weird.
It would be weird if he put in a kid that looked like the five year old that was abducted in prison by Ice to give him a grammy.
That would have been really would not have been a cool move. Yeah, that would that would have been bad.
Just to say it was a great halftime show. I enjoyed it thoroughly.
And now here's a clip of the All American halftime show, the real halftime show, our favorite Kid Rock. Ready, whoa, somebody makes some motherfucking.
Noise in here. There's nobody there.
This is not This is not from the show. This is from Silicon Valley. This was This was a joke that they did on the TV show Silicon Valley, which looks almost exactly like hilarious the Turning Point halftime show.
I'm about to say, I didn't hear that aside from the Jewels the I thought that was a new angle.
They did have more people in the crowd, but they were hired actors, But they did have more people in the crowd.
Shockingly lines up.
Our colleague Molly Hunger described his outfit as needed to run out the home deep bo to pick up us part for something.
He's in like shorts and has a wristbracer.
It's great, We'll get to Kid Rock in a sec. But let's start at the beginning. While watching the Turning Point stream, there was no indication where the show is being broadcast from or whether it was live but four performers saying back to back to back, indicating the show was cut together from previously taped performances. Yes, the venue was this dark, narrow, rectangular room with high ceilings and
studio lights. In the middle was a long stage with a small audience on either side, maybe torch people tops. But the show was introduced by none other than Jack Pisobek, which I will show now.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Turning Point USA All American Halftime Show.
And this one's for you, Charlie.
Great stuff. So they stuff.
Four hundred and forty six down votes on rumble h that's rough.
Yeah, yeah, and I watched this. I will admit I watched it after the actual halftime show because it was on YouTube and there was no reason to actually catch it during the Super Bowl. And by the way, the viewership number suggests that most people who did catch it watched it after the Super Bowl.
Yes, because it's weird.
To pause or turn off the sound in the middle of the Super Bowl and pull up like a laptop or something to go watch the fucking Turning Point USA show.
Yeah, it's really cumbersome, really really anti social behavior at the super Bowl party. To turn off the stream, plug in your laptop, go to rumble dot com.
If you are doing that, your kids have not talked to you longer than they've been alive, Like they abandoned you before they were born.
Well, parsident Trump watched the actual Super Bowl halftime show.
Sure he did, there's photos of him watch it.
He knows that this is loser shit. It's it's just about the loserst loser ship that I have ever seen. And right after Jack Besovic introduced it, it cuts to this. You've got this black stage and there's like an amp on the stage and a guy walks up to it with a guitar.
Not a guy Brandley Gilbert. Okay, that's Bentley. Okay, that's that's Brentley. I was going to introduce his name afterwards. But Garrison, you miss something important because Brandley Gilbert's band is where this guy is from. But the all electric guitar performance of the Star Spangled Banner is led by the great guitarist Spencer wohsdor.
Wow, who.
Where are they finding these guys in Brandley Gilbert's band, Garrison, This all sounds like and I think.
You should leave sketch.
I'm making up these names.
The whole performance was that. I think you should leave sketch. But no, it's beautiful electric guitar riff of the Star Spangled Banner.
No, I got a clip to play because there's a moment here. They had pyrotechnics during the show, like the real show had, but they're not good. They were better for the kid rock performance. For the electric guitars, they're just kind of sad and they make a sad, little popping sound. Well, again, a single man is playing guitar.
Stay Jimmy Hendricks played the Star Spangled Banner on guitar, but he was good at playing guitars. But he was one of the best guitar players. Yeah, yeah, different. It does seem like a high yardstick. They've chosen to measure themselves.
We'll talk about that in a second, but I gotta show you guys. You just need to see the pop of these pyro technics just for a second, and you, the listener needs to hear it.
It's giving village fyworks shit.
It.
Yeah, Oh that's beautiful.
It's great. I don't know what you're talking about. I loved it.
Per what you were saying earlier. There's a New York Times article for Fox's sake that the original title it was published under was the All American Halftime featured an electric anthem, unlike Kendricks. Now they changed that title in the reporter's notebook article to what does a whaling electric take on the Star Spangled Banner mean?
I'm glad that they are getting to the core of the issues the publication that ignored all my pitches about me and math for several years.
Yeah, no, it's good. This is much more important. Let's listen to a quote from this article that I think we can all agree it matters much more than a war in musical terms. Wasdorp's version of the Star Spangled Banner was conservative too. Despite the bent notes and feedback, it largely stuck to the melody and conveyed it reference to stubborn form of patriotism.
I don't know, I kind of loved it. What do you mean, you know it's terrible.
It's terrible.
Hard watch hard ball.
That was the best part of it. I hate to say it, but unfortunately the pyrotechnics were basically competent for the Kid Rock Show, which might have been the only competent part of the kid rock Show.
Yeah, I want to hate the kid rock Show.
I haven't.
I think there's some other hits from this from this show, though, including including Brandley Gilbert's second song, which starts as a slow acoustic ballad and then abruptly changes into whatever this is.
Jay, maybe we.
Can learn how to kids and watch include now as false and he.
Says, saying, what you have Rover spread like that?
Who saw the yallow nose?
He's trying to rock.
He's trying to rock.
He is, he is trying, he is, he is trying faults he said. She said, I'm not going to read into what those lyrics are trying to express.
Slow.
But that was the second song I do. I want to skip to the third act, which is Lee Brice. He started his second song by saying, quote, Charlie gave people microphone so that they could say what was on their mind. This is what's on mine. And this next song starts like a parody of a conservative country song. Here's here's the beginning.
I just want to catch my fish, drive my true, drink.
My beer, not wake up all this stuff.
I just want to catch my fish.
I'm just a little teary eyed. Honestly, just listen to that. The next part is cons the next line.
Okay, I'm coming at this rule.
This is the next line of the song. The same kind of gun I hunt with just killed another man. The only thing mine ever shot?
Was it?
Dear from a deer stand? That's the next Sloty.
Are you including that man?
Miracle?
Why would you do that in a song? And the way he sings it is so bizarre, it's.
It's it's about Charlie Cook.
I would like to hear it.
Oh, I'm just realizing.
What the same kind of gone a hunt will just cute the only thing I shot? What is he doing?
Why?
The gun violence problem is bad enough that he has to like make a comment about it existing and being depressing. He has to do that, but then immediately because the next bit after this, the most of the song is basically about I don't want to listen to the news, correct.
Like I don't want to I don't want to watch.
Things that remind me very The very next verse, yeah, I just want to to cut my grass, feed my dog, wear my boots, not turn the TV on and sit and watch the news.
That's an option for you, Like you can do that.
I was gonna say, that's very doable, friend.
That's entirely doable for you folks.
You could do that.
And I'm sure he is. But this is what he's scared of hearing on the news.
Told Fatal the little boys a little girl.
Yeah, there it is.
This yours.
Of the creek, and discancel your ass world.
But then he said it.
He put it in a sum Oh my god, I almost choke.
Wow.
Yeah again, man, you're you're being paid to sing about this.
It's amazing.
In fact, it's your job because it's it's you know that a few musical abilities. It's your it's your presumably well paid job.
The whole repeated refrain of the song is it's not so easy being cut in this country nowadays that you guys.
Are in charge.
Entire song.
Question, question, who is at this event? How many people?
Where is it?
About two hundred paid attendees in Atlanta, Georgia at a sound stage.
Paid attendees, paid attendees cucial Yeah.
Okay, a lot of like fresh stetsons and like unbroken in boots in the audience.
Maybe so many cowboy hats in the audience. You don't understand.
It's like a bar in Jackson, Wyoming.
I get the vibe, so many of them, and you're like, you're in Atlanta. Not many people wear cowboy hats in Atlanta.
I'm sorry. That's it's not like Texas or Oklahoma.
Yeah, no, I love. I love to see someone in a freshly purchased setting.
The next song, after this, after this country one, well, they're all country songs, but like the next song is what I think is a love song that that goes quote sometimes I drink too much. Sometimes I test your trust. Sometimes I don't know why you stay with me. I'm hard to love, which, yeah, that's related to the last song you were singing. Maybe a little bit about about bullying your children. Wow, sick oh man. But finally, finally the main act, right, Well, what we've all been waiting for,
kid kid rock. I'm gonna play a little over a minute for us. We're not gonna include all of this in the episode. We're just gonna we're just gonna include the I Am a kid section. But I do need to show show this all to James.
Yeah, because this is fun. I think a lot about Like there's that Steve Goodman parody country song that you couldn't write today because it's better musically and less ridiculous than the actual country songs that we're hearing.
All right, James, are you ready?
Always I've never seen it before.
Now that's enough. That's more than enough.
There's a lot to talk about.
Yeah, we got to unpack some of this.
He was better at the rn C.
He's flipping that. He's flipping that mic NonStop. He loves that move.
But his name is But that's how we got the wrist injury.
I will say the first guys to play had a mic with a pair of brass knuckles built into it, which I did like, I think we do need a version of that. That's a full knuckle duster from World War One, so it's got the trench knife on the other side.
Perfect. Yeah we can. Yeah, at least take a risk. Don't be a coward every time you.
Fit them on.
Take a risk, be a man.
As the kid rock lights turn on, he explosively jumps onto the stage. White fur coat, acid washed jeans, black for Dora. Yeah, I used to be a piece of shit.
It's jeans Garrison. These are jewelts that cut they are cut off a bunch of me jeorts and.
Second correction, it was a white furute code vest.
Yeah, it's a vest. And I should note also that his fedora did not have the safari flaps. I repeat, it did not have the safari flaps.
But it's leather, like a shiny black leather, not a breatheable hat.
It's it's beautiful. It's beautiful to see. It is, really, it really is, And I think you should leave sketch come to life.
It's ok.
He just she just jumps around. It's flipping that mic.
How long does he perform? How many songs do we get?
He gets like two or three songs?
Yeah.
None.
None of the audio for this song matches what we're seeing on the sinking is totally off, leading a lot of people to suspect that that it was it was lip SYNCD on stage poorly. We'll get to that in a sec. But the next song began with a two minute prelude featuring the cello and violin.
Which is it one of those like it's just the frame of a cello. Oh, James, you'll see I'm going to see it can offense to god, that's a real cello. Wow. Oh yeah, that's an interesting outfits. Dressed kind of like dressed like that. Yeah, one of the three Musketeers is playing cello. For those of you listening, get home, wait.
Please welcome our brother Robert.
Richie Robert Richard Ritchie is kid Rock his real government name. They reintroduced him under his legal name for the second song.
Kid Rocks Are Not Born. There may those people who introduced him. What was there?
That was it for them?
Unclear?
Okay, they only existed on screen to introduce kid Rock as kid Rock the first time, and then as rich Russell, Richie Russell whatever is Robert Richie, Robert Richie, whatever his real name is. That's the only time they appeared was to introduce kid Rock both times. Now, after the show, it was revealed this whole thing was pre taped on a sound stage Atlanta, and a few days later Kid Rock released a video addressing the rumors that his performance was lip SYNCD, which he denies.
You know, we taped it and then they sent me a first cut, and my comment was, the sink is off they were trying to line up. First off, if we would have done it, if we would have recorded it and then and then played like we were singing it, lip synced it.
It would have been Pie. It would have been Pie.
The line up it was very difficult for them because somebody clearly wasn't super familiar with the song. Also, when I asked him, I go, you know, Freddy raps that song with me my DJ, And they're like he does what? And I'm like, oh no, I'm like, yeah, do we have any cutaways of Freddy?
And and they know they didn't know.
He wasn't.
No, he didn't even line up any TV time. No, sorry, So they don't have that.
Now it's extremely difficult for them to line up the sink could have been done if we.
Had more time.
Let's pour one out for Freddy DJ no screen time.
So mister Rock said that Turning Play was having trouble lining up the audio with the visuals, in part because the song is actually performed vocally by two people going back and forth. Wow and Turning Point did not have a camera on the other vocalist. So that's why it looks weird when there's obviously vocals being heard, but mister Rock isn't singing.
And again, the.
Reason why no one at Turning Point is familiar with Kid Rocks music. Is that even they don't like Kid Rocks.
Music, and mister Rock demonstrated how this is supposed to go in this video with with his DJ which we do need to see thirty seconds up.
Thank you, Oh oh thanks scare care I love you so much. No, I'm sorry, Sophie. We need to have a conversation about this. This is in violation of several rules the company has that I just want to call out the fact that there is a pike behind them. Do you mean the fish that has been to Dermid Yeah, not what you normally expect. I would have expected the other kind of pike behind Garrett.
No, that seems like mister Rock's abode. Actually, this feels very on brand for him.
Is that a drone?
No, that's that's a It's a deer antler turned into a candlestick.
Yeah, it looks like a turned into a candlestick.
Classy Okay maybe, although.
From a distance it does kind of look like a bad three D printing of Deep Space nine.
Yeah, it's Hookers, all Tricken, Mountain, holly Wood, It's one hoods of the world, miss understood.
It's all good, it's all in fun.
Oh damn, I'm not having a physical reaction. I've cringed with every muscle in my body.
Here's how he explained how it's supposed to go.
So he's stilling, you know those words for me? Why I can boom bang my head keep going and carrying on. Now when I'm doing that, you see me. I'm on over the stage. Who I'm flipping the mic?
I'm down here, I'm over here, back boom. I know these guys at a difficult time getting that scene together.
So I have nothing but good things to say, not only about Turning Point, but the production team that they work with on this and other events.
My favorite part about live music is when you post a over four minute flip video explaining.
How fifty second video about how it.
Was supposed to go and explaining to people things that don't actually exist.
No, his whole delivery sounds like good Tim Robinson bit. It's it's it's so beautiful, incredible. The Bad Bunny Hat Times show averaged one hundred and thirty five point four million viewers during the show's time slot, and Half Music claims it's now the most watched show in Super Bowl history.
Me andwhile tpusa's show attracted upwards of six point one million concurrent live viewers on Turning Point USA's YouTube channel, Dude to licensing restrictions, Turning Point was unable to stream the show on x Everything app as they originally planned.
Which got announced like an hour before.
Right before.
But that's probably why they didn't hit one hundred and thirty five million, because one hundred and twenty nine of them were waiting.
Otherwise they would have got it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
The All American Halftime Show now boasts twenty three million views on their YouTube and Rumble pages combined. The Bad Bunny Show is seventy million. A lot of these views are also people like me and other other researchers. Yeah for sure, and it gives me curious Americans who are who are interested in what they had to throw together. But a footage from inside Trump's Super Bowl party shows that even he did not turn into the All American halftime shown me Mimo comfio. Now it's time for you
to tune into these ads. Shall we do the real news now?
Sure? So.
On a Monday, February ninth, twenty twenty six, about three days before we recorded this, there was a student led walkout protesting federal immigration arrests and protesting in large part last year's massive ice actions in Chicago, and students from a number of different high schools walked out. This included students from East Aurora High School, where there was a notable clash. Is the word or skirmish is the word?
Like?
Skirmish is what Shaw Local News described it as between protesters and police. There's video, and at least from the limited clip of video we have, I wouldn't call it a skirmish. I would call it police getting pissed and assaulting some kids. But we don't see the rest of the interaction. This is apparently something that went on for a couple of hours, so I don't know what led up to this. I can tell you the video shows what looks like some high school kids walking in kind
of a line outside of their high school. There's some police by. The police are clearly talking to or maybe yelling at, one of the kids, and then as the video comes in, an officer just charges in and tackles hard like a running tackle, a teenage boy, like a child smaller than him, which leads to several other police officers grabbing kids. At least one student punches a police officer in the head while the officer is on top
of his friend beating his friend. The police only responded by saying, like, look, you know, we had to act. A student punched a police officer. From the Shaw Local article, the police department said the officer who was punched was transported to a local hospital for medical attention for his injuries. They don't show he and his colleagues like literally tackling kids first, yeh, before they get hit. If somebody tackles my friend next to me, I might start punching. That's just life.
Yeah, And.
This is kind of an ongoing story at the moment. I don't know like what's going to wind up being the result of this, but it inspired, at least initially a lot of anger and there have been further protests as a result of the police violence. Students in the area are now demanding the resignation of the police chief in East Aurora. The police have not really like acknowledged those demands yet. I don't know if this is going
to turn into like a larger protest movement. There's some signs that maybe it will, that there may be further walkouts, specifically as a result of the police violence. But this is a situation we will be watching obviously seeing police violently beating kids for you know, speaking for doing the thing they should be doing at high school, which is experimenting with believing things and taking stands. Yeah, so we'll be watching this to see kind of what results next.
But that's that's sort of where we are at the moment.
Yeah, that video, it's pretty brutal. Let's talk a little bit more about some immigration stuff. Let's start with uh, let's start with police in shall we? I have reviewed the police report for the ice officer who in late January negligently discharged he's issued handgun in a hotel room. Bradley's shaver was attempting to fix a backstrap from his glock.
I'll quote the report here quote with his back facing Room three twenty, and the firearm pointed in the area of Bradley's torso he attempted to remove the backstrap that was currently on the firearm while it was still loaded. At some point, the firearm discharged. Luckily, the occupant of that room had just checked into the hotel and was walking to their room when the shot was fired, so there was no one injured. I will quote again from
the report. Initially, the agent thought the gunshot came from somewhere else, and he yelled shots fired, and then told his wife he had to go and hang up. Shaper then felt heat on the left side of his body, looked down and saw the damage to his shirt and realized the shot had come from his own weapon. He said the round went through his sweatshirt and the shirt underneath, but did not penetrate his under armed compression layer or
injure him. It seems like this person was attending to repair or remove apart from his gun that was still loaded, and he didn't think to unload the gun.
All of this is stuff you shouldn't do, right. Yeah, you have to check before you do stuff to a gun to make sure it's unloaded. And even when you've checked to make sure it's unloaded, you should still act like it's loaded and do stuff like not have your finger on the trigger and make sure it's clear of a holster so that there's nothing that like, especially like a leather holster, or maybe stuff could get bowed in
and pull the trigger. You just don't do any of the things he was doing with a gun, especially if you're a cop. But also you do all the things he did with a gun if you're a cop, because this happens regularly.
Yeah, this case a thirty year veteran who had just returned after two years of retirement. I want to talk a little bit now about Liam Conejo Ramos. This is the five year old who was detained in Minneapolis last month. People will remember seeing images of him in like a blue bunny hat. Liam and his father were detained on the twentieth of January in his driveway after returning from school.
They were order released by Judge Fred Berry, who wrote in his order quote, observing human behavior confirms that for some among us, the perfidious lust for unbridled power and the imposition of cruelty in its quest know no bounds and are bereft of human decency, and the rule of law be damned. You could tell the judge was incredibly pissed off at the government. Now put it that way.
DHS then attempted to expedite the removal of Conejo Ramos and his family that the family were granted a continuance by his judge. Liam and his father His father is Adlian and Cornehio Adias or adiyas I've seen like various permutations of his father's name. I think perhaps because some people doing reporting are not familiar with how last names are generally configured in the Spanish speaking world, so I'm
not quite sure how his last name is pronounced. But Liam and his father entered in December of twenty twenty four when they were detained, they were detained at Dilly. Dilly is a detention center for families, right. It is a place that I have reported on before. In my Dardian follow up series, I spoke about Primrose and Kimberly, who were both detained at Dilly, and they went into
some detail about the conditions there. I'm glad to see that Dilly is getting more attention in sort of bigger, more legacy media outlets.
Now.
I also saw that there was a protest at Dilly, seemingly while Liam was there. And we can see this because of drone footage of people walking out of the buildings and assembling in sort of spaces in between the buildings, and they can be heard chanting in some of that footage. Now, when to move on to something I've seen DHS doing recently, which is they're trying to push back against the evidence that they are using schools and children a bait to detain non citizens.
Right.
I just spoke about how Liam was detained. Right. It was the fact that he was at school that allowed those agents to target his father. Right. I believe they got Liam to knock on the door and his dad came out, which obviously was part of the reason that this particular intens was so controversial. DHS, in a post on x said, quote, Ice is not going to schools
to arrest children. A dangerous illegal alien, felon fleeing into a school, or a child sex offender working as an employee may create a situation where an arrest is made. To protect public safety, criminals are no longer able to hide in America's schools to avoid arrest. Potus Trump and Secretary Known trust a brave law enforcement to use common sense. We will not tie the hands of law enforcement officers.
They must be allowed to protect children from public safety threats. Obviously, if someone is a sex offender, they can't work at a school. Right. That's that's the top background checks work. The DHS tweet includes a screenshot of a Houston Chronicle article which details how HISD has lost four thousand students due to the ICE crackdown. Right, this is students who are for the most part, afraid to come to school, and they've seen a twenty two percent decline in migrant
student enrollment. Obviously, I just want to note that ICE has detained parents outside schools and a notal inncedent. Last year, they dessained a fifteen year old disabled boy in Los Angeles. Finally, from me, I want to talk about legislation that is being proposed in the state of Washington. To the State of Washington's House Builds two three two one proposes legislation that focuses on what it calls blocking features that must be integrated into three D printers to prevent their use
in creating firearms. Blocking features are quoting here a software controls process that deploys a firearms blueprint detection algorithm such that those features identify and reject print requests for firearms or at legal firearm path with a high degree of reliability and cannot be overridden or otherwise defeated by a
user with significant technical skill. What this would effectively do is either prevent the sale of three D printers in Washington state or install state level spyware onto three D printers, which would obviously be able to be used for things far beyond firearms. And people have notably been three D printing whistles a great deal in Minneapolis right there. So
there's been lots of coverage of this. I think it would be very naive for people to think that this would start and end with the creation of unregistered firearms.
Yeah, now they'll they'll go, I mean, they'll doff like tread to enforce games workshops, copy rights and stop it for rent models or whatever, exactly right, Like, it opens a whole world of IP enforcement in three D print it more or less ends.
The thing that I find beautiful about three D printing is not that like I can make little plastic things in my office. It's that it shows me that people will choose to create beautiful and innovative things even when there is not a profit incentive for doing so. Yes, And here's the thing, it would be a different discussion if this were a country, We're the only way to get a gun was to three D print it.
But it's not.
Yes, in Washington State, right, you do not have to drive that far from Washington State, to a state where it'ld be perfectly legal to do a private party transfer in the Walmart parking lot.
Yep.
And also it's there's just a lot of guns in Washington, Yeah, like there are in Oregon, like there is everywhere in the country. And to the extent that three D printed firearms are used for crime, they tend to be used like specifically in gang crime, where if the three D printed gun isn't available, the professional criminals will access a separate gun. Americans are not overwhelmingly using three D printed
firearms to shoot up schools. They're using perfectly normally purchased firearms to shoot up schools.
Yeah, that's what we do because this country is full of guns. The state of California is also pursuing a case against three D printed firearms code hosting websites. California passing extremely broad law last year that prohibits the hosting, distribution, and promotion of the quote unlawful manufacturer of firearms. This has significant repercussions for the First Amendment right, Like, the code itself is not a tangible thing, it's not a gun. It is speech. But in this case, it is the
instruction to allow the machine to create gun right. It appears that there are over one hundred other people indicted in this case, and guessing that those are probably the designers who posted their STLs for firearms on the gatalogue.
I think that the evidence also suggests that's unlikely to hold up in court because, like, right now, there's a case over the Kansas laws that are mandating, like you have age, basically restrictions on websites and the like, and there were laws. There was a lawsuit from like a mom who alleged that despite this, her kid was able to access a website that was located out of the state because it didn't have any of these restrictions, and the judge in Kansas ruled, like, well, our law doesn't
restrict people in other states. They don't have to have like this, Like that's just you can't actually enforce this. Yeah, so we'll see how it goes in California. But yeah, California is suing for damages in this case. It's a civil case on a criminal one, sure, but still, I mean, there have been a lot of cases about three D printed guns and how they are covered under the under
the First Amendment. So yeah, I'm going to keep an eye on this because I guess like there are attacks on the First Amendment from just about every angle right now, and I think we should pay attention to that.
That is all I have. Shall we take a little break and then talk about pedophiles? Sure?
I love talking talking about pedophiles.
That's what we do.
I don't.
We're back.
This is another yet another episode of the Pedo Files.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I volunteered to do this section.
These are Epsteine updates as a two day which is Wednesday, Yeah, February eleventh.
There were quite a few things.
We just finished recording a four part around him for Bastards, and there's more new shit.
Yeah.
It just keeps kevin.
It is endless, it really is.
I want to start off which at the top of the week, Glene Maxwell was supposed to speak to the House Oversight Committee, and she was called in for questioning and during a video call. Just so folks know, she is serving a twenty year sentence for sex trafficking and a federal prison camp in Texas, but she invoked her Fifth Amendment right to avoid answering questions that would be self incriminating.
This was expected, but her lawyer's statement was interesting.
So I'm going to read it to the audience now, Members of the Committee, on my advice, Glendne Maxwell respectfully invoke her Fifth Amendment right to silence and decline to answer your questions day. Even though she would very much like to answer your questions, she must remain silent because Miss Maxwell has a habeas petition clearly pending that demonstrates
that her conviction rests on a fundamentally unfair trial. For example, jurors lie during void Yer to secure seats on the jury, and the government promised immunity and then broke that promise. Lily Disco's documents now demonstrate these facts conclusively. If this committee in the American public truly want to hear the unfiltered truth about what happened, there is a straightforward path. Ms Maxwell is prepared to speak fully and honestly if
granted clemency by President Trump. Sure only she can provide the complete account. Some may not like what they hear, but the truth matters. For example, both President Trump and President Clinton are innocent of any wrongdoing. Ms Maxwell alone and explain why, and the public is entitled to that explanation. Thank you.
Look, I'll talk to Donald Trump if I can get immunity for some thanks.
It's like, by the way, I would love to speak.
Got I need immunity.
Yeah, the guy that could grant me clemency. I can vouch for that.
Guy that's the most doesn't commit crimes thing a person could possibly say.
Wild.
Yeah, I'm moving on to another guy that was all over the Epstein files, Casey Wasserman.
Casey wass Robert just said that like he knew. The guy.
Oh yeah, I know. That's what I always call them.
Was founder and CEO of Wasserman, which is a talent agency slash sports marketing agency. And the reason I'm bringing this up is for two reasons. There's two things I want to discuss here. The first one is that since this got announced, he's had major clients, major stars as well as athletes, say that's gross and I'm not going to work with you anymore.
And I've left the agency, which is fucking cool, which is good.
It's what you should do if you find out that you are working for someone in the Epstein files.
Yeah, somebody was specifically communicating consistently with Epstein after his conviction. Right, There's a lot of people who are named in the files.
A lot of random journalists whose articles got shared in the files or something that yes, yes, yeah, big.
Name stars here, we're talking like Chapel Rowelron, you're so annoyed. So like Chapel Rone was probably the first big name to be like ew, I'm out.
Yeah.
And another big part of this is CAC Wasserman is leading the preparations for the twenty twenty eight Summer Olympic Games that are going to be located in Los Angeles and per Fox LA, the LA twenty twenty eight board officially supported chair Casey Wasserman and Wednesday, rejecting calls for his recognation following an independent misconduct review. While multiple LA elected officials demandity step down, the board sited his strong leadership and cooperations as reasons for his retention.
Ew I can't believe the good name of the Olympics finally has a stain on its right now?
Right? Who would have thought?
Can you imagine the Olympics being associated with a bad man?
I love the Olympics? This sucks?
How will I watch trampoline?
Uh?
Huh? What about Louge?
Wait?
No, that's only in the thing right now, that's already happening. Yeah, you can watch Louge.
Yeah, you're right, you're right. The one good sport, the Olympics, is already happening. So we're fine.
We have to be clear on this. Luge has us no links to the Jeffrey Epstein files that we.
Know of the Italian Louge Olympics, completely clean, no problems.
Yeah.
Now I want to move on to probably the biggest story of the week, which is Attorney General Pambondi took heated questions from lawmakers and a compatitive congressional hearing over the Justice Department's handling and the files related to Jeffrey Epstein that exposed sensitive private information about victims despite redaction efforts.
Her the a P.
She she frame mogged everyone at this hearing.
In my opinion, this was the most outrageously unprofessional, shameful, centurable, and sickening congressional.
Hearing in history.
And she is a disgrace and disgusting And yeah, I want to get into a little bit of it. I want to start by playing a clip from Representative Raskin. He's the Democratic congressman from Maryland and he is the Democratic ranking House member of the Committee on the judiciary.
You're running a massive Epstein cover up right out of the Department of Justice. You've been ordered by subpoena and by Congress to turn over six million documents, photographs, and videos in Epstein files.
But you've turned over only three million.
You say you're not turning over the other three million because they're somehow duplicative. But we know that there are actual memos of victim statements in the air. And you also took down the Department of Justice's prosecution memo from twenty nineteen, so it's clearly not all duplicative. But even if it were, why not release it? Just release all
the duplicative stuff. In the half you did produce, you redacted the names of abusers, enablers, accomplices, and co conspirators, apparently to spare them embarrassment and disgrace, which is the exact opposite of.
What the law ordered you to do.
Even worse, you shockingly failed to redact many of the victim's names, which is what you were ordered to do by Congress.
Some of the victims had come forward publicly, but many had not.
Many had kept their torm private, even from family and friends, but you published their names, their identities, their images on thousands of pages for.
The world to see.
So you ignored the law, and even with over one hundred thousand employees at your disposal, you acted with some mixture of staggering incompetence, cold indifference, and jaded cruelty towards more than one.
Thousand victims raped, abused, and trafficked.
This performance screams cover up.
I can't even begin to describe how vile and disgusting it is that they have doxed these survivors of Epstein without their consent. Yeah, it is traumatizing enough that they had to endure this. Now they've had what happened to them put on display, and now they are going to be targeted, and they have not had the ability to speak up if they wanted to on what happened. But the government, despite being told to not out these survivors, did it, but covered the names of the people that
committed these crimes. It is unspeakably disgusting.
Sorry, well I feel great.
It's really upsetting. Yeah, it's really deeply disgusting and upsetting.
Sure.
I thought Ranking Member Raskin spoke very clearly here and I appreciated his statement. Yeah, moving on, Bondi's tactics during this were to deflect, deflect, deflect.
There's a couple instances that I want to play play for everyone.
Now, yeah, you could assign this to a class, and like if you're talking about every way that like the modern Republican Party tries to deflect culpability for anything negative. Like they all got deployed one after the.
Other in this.
So there were Epstein survivors in person, and Bondi wouldn't even look at them. I want to play a clip from when she's asked to address them here to.
The survivors in the room, if you are willing, please stand, and if you are willing, please raise your hands. If you have still not been able to meet with this Department of Justice, please know for the record that every single survivor has raised their hand. Attorney General Bondi, you apologize to the survivors and your opening statement for what they went through at the hands of Jeffrey Epstein.
Will you turn to them now and apologize for what.
Your Department of Justice has put them through with the un absolutely unacceptable release of the Epstein files and their information.
Congresswoman, you set before Merrick Garland set in.
This chair twice, Attorney General von I'm going to finish my answer.
No, I'm going to reclaim my time because I asked you to generalific question that I would like question to answer, which is, will you turn to the survivors? This is not about anybody that came before you. It is about you taking responsibility for your Department of Justice and the arm that it has done to the survivors who are standing right behind you and are waiting for you to turn to them and apologize for what your Department of Justices.
Members.
Members get to ask the questions, the witness get to answer in the way they want to answer.
That that's not accurate, mister chairman, because she doesn't like the answer. So, mister Chairman, I have asked, She Astmaric Garland.
This I am reclaiming.
I will claim my time. Get in the gutter for her.
Theatrics.
The time belongs to the time belongs to the general lady. The general Lady has seventeen seconds.
Thank you.
You're not going to answer this question.
So let me just chair, what a massive question?
Will you restore her time?
The witnesses, the rector the gout her with this woman, She's let me have.
My General lady, the general lady from Washington controls the time. The General Lady has seventeen seconds, you can you can proceed with your final seventeen seconds.
What a mass of cover up this has been and continues to be. Donald Trump may the release of the Epstein files the center of his political campaign because he thought it would benefit him. Then you got into office, Attorney general, claim to have a client list on order, say that there was no list. Your deputy Todd met alone has expired to a minimum security prison.
And now you continue.
She would turn around to the survivors who are standing right behind you, and on a human level, chairman.
Now recognizes the man, the gen You have no time to go back to appreciate the thought.
Despicable, disgusting.
She did not ever turn around and look at these survivors that are in the room. Later, she loses it again when asked why she hasn't indicated any of the Epstein clients in de flex by saying this.
The dow, the dow right now is over. The dow is over fifty thousand dollars. I don't know why you're laughing. You're a great stock trader. As I hear raskin. The Dow is over fifty thousand right now, the S and P at almost seven thousand, and the Nasdaq smashing records. Americans four oh one k's and retirement savings are booming. That's what we should be talking about. We should be talking about making Americans safe. We should be talking about
what does a Dow have to do with anything? That's what they just ask, Are you kidding, mister Jordan?
Am I mister Jordan, No, it's not. You are here for You are here talking. You are here for hearing on the Epstein files.
You are the Attorney General of the United States, and you are a fucking piece of shit, fucking nightmare.
That's in response to a question about indicting Epstein clients. Yeah, she just starts talking with the stock market.
Yeah, and only did you just start talking about it? She clearly came with her stats ready to talk about it. Yeah.
Right, because the message is it's fine that all this happened and the Trump was involved as long as the economy's good, right, people shouldn't be a complaint.
It's it's cartoon. It's cartoon behavior.
Yeah, Like it's not a it's not even some kind of sophisticated route. So just going to look over there.
This would be like in like a British like sketch comedy about the government in like the eighties, Like this is like, yeah, this is wild.
It's truly horrific.
And guess what I still have more to share. Here is an exchange and another attempt for her to deflect. She tries to bring up Merek Garland again. This is with the congresswoman from Vermont.
Didn't ask Merrit Garland anything about Epstein, not once when he was exhaust And also I want the record to reflect that, you know, with this anti Semitic culture right now, she voted against a resolution contempt condemning.
Oh do you want to go there?
Attorney?
Do you want to go there?
Are you gentlemen talking.
To a woman who lost her grandfather in the whole.
It's pretty disgusting.
Yeah, that's crazy.
She's like, ah, yes, how can I work in being pro Israel?
Also again right, she clearly had like if this person speaks, this is what I will say.
It's very clear she had a material list of like cheat sheet of this is how when this person speaks, this is my dirt on this person. When this person speaks, this is my dirt on this person. There are even photos of the dirt she has piled up on each person. She had a sheet of like people's search histories. Just unbelievable deflection, to say the least. I have one more clip I want to I want to display it, and then I'd like to talk about it a little bit more.
Yeah, I want to discuss another man, Donald Trump, who was all over the Epstein files, like former Prince.
Here's the video and for reference, this is the very very popular video of Epstein and Trump.
Worth Epstein wearing that then, I'm sure, and Trump in the pink tie.
They're kind of like elbowing each other and talking about ladies.
Yeah, laughing, laughing at a party.
Yeah, you've seen it.
Former Prince Andrew. Donald Trump attended various parties with Jeffrey Epstein. I want to know whether any underage girls at that party or at any party that Trump attended with Jeffrey Epstein.
This is so ridiculous and that they are trying to deflect from all the great things Donald Trump has done. There is no evidence that Donald Trump has committed a crime. Everyone knows that this has been the most transparent presidency.
He's the one I.
Got your answer you said no evidence.
This time belongs to the gentleman from California.
Okay, I'm gonna put up another document from a witness who called the FBI's National Threat Operation Center because I believe you just lied under oath. There is ample evidence into Epstein.
Don't you ever accuse me of believe you just.
Lied under oath. And this is all on videotape. You said there's no events crime. I'm showing you. Here is a witness statement who called into the FBI's Threat Operation Center. He drove Donald Trump around in limo. He overheard what Donald Trump said to Jeffrey on his cell phone. He was so angry he was gonna stop a limo and hurt Donald Trump. And he met a girl who said she was raped by Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein. She later had her head blown off, and the officers at
the scene said that could not have been suicide. No one, no one at the point of justice interviewed this witness. You need to interview this witness immediately. Epstein should rot in hell. So should the men who patronize this operation. And as we say here today, they are over one thousand sex trafficking victims, and you have not held a single man accountable.
Shame on you. If you had any decency, you would resign right after this.
Here we conclusive, gentlemen, has expired.
She did not answer a single question, honestly, she did not give a yes or no answer. The Republicans spent the time trying to deflect by she had like this sheet of like, well, in your state, this person committed a crime in your district. This person committed a crime and tried to deflect every which way.
Congress people aren't law enforcement, like no, and.
The republic and spent the time praising her and praising Trump and touting their own agenda.
And this is not justice. This is sickening.
I I what precedent this sends to people who are survivors of horrific sex crimes.
I mean the president that they want to send is don't say shit, right.
That's what I'm saying. That's what it sends. And we can't allow this to go on. We have to keep talking about it.
Sorry, I'm just very upset. Pam BONDI. She is one of the most despicable people in the world.
Oh yeah, to get up there with survivors in the room, and to not look at them, to not answer a single question, and to continuously deflect and lie. It's impossibly disgusting and very very very sad, very very sad.
Mm hmm okay, yeah, well, I don't know what else to say about it.
It's impossibly disgusting and very very sad.
Yeah.
Yeah, I hope that these survivors get some kind of justice someday. We are not going to forget about them. We're not going to stop talking about it. Something has to give here. This is This is not justice, This is despicable.
Yeah. Yeah.
I don't know what's going to happen or if anything's going to give in the near future, but people are pissed, and hopefully we'll continue to be, which is I guess all we can hope for is that before much longer, the time comes around where we could make sure that these people, including the folks protecting them now pay. So you know, yeah, we've got any other news or is this no? We it's a real bummer of an ending. Yeah, well yeah, it's appropriate right now.
Yeah, we reported the news, gear, Yeah.
I love the news.
We reported the news.
Yep, James, anything you want to plug at the end here.
Yeah, if you want to email us with news tips, you can email cool Zone Tips at proton dot me. If you want to email us with episode ideas, I will make another email for that, but it makes it significantly harder for all of us going through the news tips email. If you just email us with things that you think we should talk about, so we will try and partition those two things off so that we can deal with both of them separately.
Okay, bye, we reported the news. Hey, We'll be back Monday with more episodes every week from now until the heat death of the Universe.
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