Bonus Ep: Debate Review w/ Katy and Cody

of history. But we're doing nothing like that today. Today, as prep for the election podcast that Cody Johnston, Katie Stole and I will be launching in the worst year ever, we are doing an episode covering the Democratic debates, which could not be further from the premise of my show because none of the people involved in the debates, regardless of my issues with them, individually, qualify as true bastards. But it's an hour or so of free contents, like

what are you gonna do? You whine at me? Already gave you two episodes about bastards this week, Like this is just deal with it. He can't hear you, Yeah, I can't hear you. Like complain more, but please please do listen to the podcast. I love all of you. Yeah, where we just thought we would get the ball rolling on our eventual show. Yeah, we're trying to figure out exactly what it's going to be so that we we aren't just throwing another nonsense political podcast into a crowded

field of misery that makes everyone hate themselves. So like the candidates, like the candidates, and debates themselves. So this is a little bit of a refining process. It's kind of like, if you're shooting missiles at the Moon, you're gonna hit Mars a couple of times. It's just hard. It's hard to hit the moon with a missiles. Kind of get a few bedos up there, so you know, this missile might hit Jupiter, we might hit Europe U,

we might hit the Sun, we might hit Manhattan. Either way, the next missile we fire will be closer to the moon. I don't know why I'm comparing this tow missiles, Jupiter or Manhattan. Yep, okay, classic one to those are the options. Ye hey, everybody, one way or the other. You heard either Katie and Cody's intro or my intro. And now with the actual podcast is starting, and I arrogantly grabbed

leading everyone in stole it from you both disgusting. It is I'm a monster, absolutely not um this is this is gonna be fun for everybody's listening who might be confused that listens to both we're sitting here or recording two different intros for the episode. Um, it'll cut together. You know we're here, we're in it, We're with you now, all right, we'll talk about the debates. Guys, who I want to know? First off? Who surprised you? Who were

you discounting? And then you came into it and you're like, wow, man, if anybody that person was interesting. I mean, I'm gonna be honest, Looper, I know Castro's name was not at all in my mind. I wasn't even really aware that he was running, and he performed very well, really did for debate too. I would say the person who surprised me who was not? I mean I knew she was running, but she was not on my radar. I think Gillibrando

a lot better than I expected. She absolutely, um she didn't earn my vote, but she did better than I expected. I was completely blown away that Marian Williamson was even on the stage. I don't know how that over my She got a few you really like, oh that's actually true. Yeah, like you don't you shouldn't really be here, but what you're saying is true. You're not wrong. Yeah, it's like what are you doing here? And I would almost like

it if in the future. For debates, we had the candidates and then like one person who was popular in America and who just came on to like drive home an issue like Okay, yeah, everybody, but like the ice caps are melting in the world's dying, like maybe addressed bring it back because the moderators definitely are going to do that, not Chuck Todd for sure. Um so yeah, having someone be the actual voices. Like but like, here's

what we're really talking about. One thing we've learned as a species is that, regardless of our ability to put human beings on other planets to create electric cars, we have not invented a human being who is capable of moderating a political thing has never happened. We need roots. Yeah, robots maybe or or Herzog could do that. Jo you would do that silently, like he could come to that. Yeah,

just like his presidents would would do that. One thing it would help probably is fewer candidates and more hours, but we can we can talk about that. Would you have preferred five candidates a night for four nights? I would have been fine with that more than what is currently there. I would have preferred even then, like ten candidates for four hours or like even longer. Um, Like I have no problem with a longer debate, Like that's

why we're here. Uh, we have literally twenty four hour news channels and people are like engaged in that kind of thing, and we want to know that, oh, whoever is going to be can like stand on a stage for six hours and talk about the issues. And we live in a world where people routinely will spend a dozen hours in a weekend been watching television just to chill out. Like I feel like we can devote ten hours to debates about the future of our species. You

think it seems reasonable. It seems like it's difficult because watching these yeah, you don't really get a clear sense of people. These are the most important so they say, the most important people in the world right now, right and and like we're not getting that many opportunities to get to know them outside of Twitter, outside of the headlines that we see, the random clips that are passed around, and you don't really have the time to hear anything,

like it's a quick SoundBite thirty seconds. Yeah, I think in general kind of like I don't think it's exaggerating necessarily. I think it's kind of shameful what they have done, like, uh, the idea, like that's fair. Yeah, I didn't want to oversell it, but I do. It's a shameful thing that the media is allowed to happen. It's just it shows that they didn't learn anything from but if they did, they learned the wrong thing. It wasn't even just ten

candidates over two hours. It was ten candids over two hours with five moderators and like a bunch of commercial breaks. The whole thing is it's like, well, there weren't that many commercial breaks, but yeah, there shouldn't have been any, Like there's moderator switches. It's not that long if it was a six hour to be like yeah, yes, one hour and we don't like three people for one hour, two people for the next hour. Is really is that just because everybody wanted to be involved or all that

because they're from different networks? I guess yeah, it must have been some, isn't it. No, Yeah, I don't know either way. It was unnecessary and like no one like no one that position isn't like oh they got like the best question, Like I will say that I thought, especially on night once Evanna Guthrie did a good job of she could have done the whole thing, I know exactly, and I like, I'm one of the people that like Rachel Matto not obsessively. She's fine. She's fine. I mean,

I think that she's entertaining. She made some bad mistakes. Are the Muller report this, I completely agree, and I don't watch her show nearly as much as I used to, but I think that she is good at breaking down stuff and she's really good on her feet. Anyway, this isn't about Rachel Maddow and I like her fine, but could have just stuck with Savannah Guth, especially following up really aggressively and keeping people on points, saying like, you

don't answer the questions. You expect a single human being to function for four hours in a week. That's good points impossible. No one cut it up, cut it up, get more people up there, Oh I do. I did want to mention this because this is what you asked at the very beginning. I think Corey Booker also surprised me, and I didn't. I wanted to give him credit where it's due because I've I think he's corny as hell all the time. I know, I avoided saying that but yes,

I agree with you completely. He's super corny and I

don't think he comes off it's very authentic. Um, But I thought he did a really good job surprisingly so all right, And I guess the limited time I wanted more time to see what he had to say, I mean everybody, because but like we were talking about, like the idea that he even brought up, like African Americans trans women in America are the idea that like he that he in his very limited amount of time, an issue that will not gain him a single vote because

there's very few trans first off, not like not just said that African American trans women are being murdered at a night Mary straight. But first I've introduced that, like transgender people in general are victims of violent crimes at huge rates. Women specified that and this is particularly a problem within the black transgender community. The fact that he took that time is a and I don't like the guy, but it is a very significant credit to his first

and give him a lot of credit. I was kind of I was surprised and kind of blown away and that he brought it up, and also like it's because it's no one's ever going to bring that up. I don't know if it's just me being cynical when I see him do that, because I have this idea of him and I know that he's a politician, and I have fears and authentic I immediately go to, are you just saying that? But I don't. I don't want to

operate like that. And I do agree. I really appreciated it, and I think it's important to us to say this and like start saying on the debate stage that people start getting used to this being an issue that we discuss. I hate the Democratic Party almost like much as I hate the Republican Party for very different reasons. But it is a credit to the Democratic Party that the issue of violence against trans people came up more than once in this debate, and in spite like it is not

it's not a vote getter. It's an issue they could ignore and not lose a vote. And the fact that it has been made and not insignificant part of at least one of the debates is a real credit to the party. And I'll say that that matters a lot to me. Yeah, I wanted to say that because, yeah, well we're talking about this. William Castro was the first one to bring on trans women and talking about healthcare and how it's necessary for us to include them when

we're talking about women's reproductive rights, and I clapped. I was sitting. It's so rare to see anything that even vaguely resembles at a distance. If squint and take mushrooms, courage and politics today, and that's I would. I would. I would call standing up for trans people from a mainstream politician courage. And it shouldn't be and it's horrible that it is, but it is, and we're thrilled to see those steps being taken. I think it's important. Even

though this was kind of a cluster fuck. We can say that on here because it's a podcast. Um let's call it cluster pp, cluster pep. This was this was a bit of a cluster PP. I do feel good about a lot of this stuff that we've talked about. I do feel like even the candidates that I'm not thrilled about people throwing out stuff. Especially on Night one.

I liked seeing Lean Castro standing up there saying I'd like to see everybody else on the stage, the other candidates, and you know, and that happened a couple of times. In different in different capacities, and we saw it happening. And that is the beautiful thing about this part of the process, seeing where we land on certain issues. I would like more in longer debates, they all radicalize each other.

And Joe Biden is wearing like a chairman mouse shirt and shouting about taking the factories back, and that's well, that's like, I'm not not but I would enjoy that from a a fewer perspective. And then we saw a little bit of that and it was really cool. And I think that we've talked about leading up to this that like like the winner of the Democratic debates is like, well, what is the platform end up being? What are the

issues and plans of people gravitate tours? And if you have ten people for two hours and five moderators, it's really hard to get to that point. And it's actually kind of amazing that there were a few moments like that, yeah, you have four hours, you have you are able to say you get two minutes to talk about this, and if someone is like raising their hand, you can actually say okay, actually have a conversation instead of like really forcing it and trying to get the sound bites in

and so on. For the purpose of intellectual masturbation, I would like to talk about how we'd like to see this happen, and for my own self, what I would enjoy saying of the same twenty candidates. If I was picking the rules, I would want five of them to get two hours each four nights in one week, and then six weeks later you look at who they are and you pick the top ten, and then you have a four hour debate with the top ten. And four

hours is a long time. People might say that's unreasonable. Like, one of the things you vote for and you should be voting for in a president is their stamina, their ability to function and focus for four hours of a hard core debate. That's important because we currently have a president. You can't do that. Yeah, And like I think a lot of people that were in the debate tonight and last night couldn't do that. Yeah. I mean, how many lines can beato say in Spanish and English? Just one

based on the most time to talk about that? Did everybody gasp? Everybody gasped, And that was the most likable Corey Booker has ever been when he gave him that. That was perfect. Yeah, that looks that look had even more because we knew he was going to do it. I think they all did it more reasonably that he did it an issue where it was like, no, you're just repeating your point in Spanish for no reason, and

that's weird. Yeah, brought it out really early on, and really it was like the thing I'm going to do, and it did have nothing and he and he made sure to be the first person to speak Spanish on the floor with Latino Canada, which is the part that was painful. Come on, man, it's not going to disagree with the great wonderful, but obviously this whole debate isn't

in Spanish. You're doing something wondering and out of the gate the white man that stands on tables that everybody rolls their eyes at, how little self awareness does he? If it had been if the question the first question, if it had still been the first question, but it had been like about immigration reform or about something directly tied to that, as opposed to just like I'm going to answer a question and I'm gonna do it again in Spanish, and like what do you beto? Right? He

didn't really answer the question. Yeah, I mean I don't know. He did not answer the question in either language at a time. He's also just super fun. I'm not a fan of Beto Rouric. He didn't win me over here. Yeah, I don't care for him, but yeah, Julian Castro really did um and I had zero expectations for him. Yeah, I was not aware he was really running. Be entirely honest, at the risk of credifying myself the people, I absolutely

still cannot. I didn't even know the Oprah book Lady was going to be there, right, that was a surprise. Every once in a while, they would towards the end of the debate they'd go to somebody and like, wait, have they gone to this guy yet? I'm always surprised that John hicken Looper exists, that he looks nothing like I imagine. It's really funny too, because it's like there were like four hicken Loopers tonight, and there were four hicken Loopers last night. Like it's just it's not but

it's not even like white Man. It's just like a very specific type type of guy. It's it's a guy that you wind up in line behind at the co op buying a lot of organic so like all of them are that guy. And I have tweeted about this and talked about this before, and some people are like, that's racist when I say specifically this type of white man.

And I'm only doing that because I'm describing literally who it is if it was a white man, like a Bernie who is something a different kind And I'm not a Bernie person, but per se, but like, you know,

something unique, something different. But these guys are very hard to differentiate between in these thirty second increments, in these little snippets that we get, and they're not bringing something new, and every every time a new person knew one of them through their hat in the ring, it just frustrated me a little bit because we've got all these unique

candidates that are really exciting. Well that's the other thing, because I think that they're not They're not necessarily like it's not like they're all the same, but like, when you have such a limit of time, it is hard to differentiate them. And there were a few moments, uh the last night and maybe a couple tonight, we're like, oh, yeah, that guy's right, Yeah, that's a good point that that guy made. Wow, who the funk is he? Yeah? Where

did he go? Well, never see him him again. Now he's gone, right, But if you had like more time and time to breathe come back to that guy. And now I now actually know who he is and what he stands for, and how he how he's different from all the other people on the stage. Not just that was a good sentence I heard from somebody. If number one news networks were not entirely a for profit endeavor existed for the call me a crazy fucking communist here

betterment of society rather than sheer oald or value. Uh. And if also the Democratic Party was more competent, having twenty candidates at this point, that it could be real strength, could be a great chance for adversity, is for real debate, for inability for people to have a real choice and to hear a lot of issues and have issues that wouldn't otherwise get pressed in in a campaign be pushed in just based on necessity. Um, I could see that

being a real strength. It's not the way they focused it instead, it just it just hurts the entire cause of sanity. And that's frustrating to me. Right, And they're just like all the like, all right, we're gonna do a real quick down the line and then they do the one one word answers or five word answers ever, and it's like, you're just it's just this onslaught of yeah information, you can and nearly answers the question. The question I will say and say they were like one

one part. I think it was just hicken Looper who was just like climate change. There were a few people who was like, okay, John, like you got me there. It's so interesting because that stands out, whereas people that say, well, go run off and start listening, shoving as many words as they can into that ten seconds. But the people that are concise and answered I did stand out in those moments. Um. Yeah, I hated everyone's answer to the

question who is the biggest threat to America? Because in a sane debate, my opinion is there's one answer, and it's oh, the biggest threat to America is Americans. It will always be, it has always been, and there's no one else that comes close. Run for president. Yeah, sure, I will. I agree. It's frustrating the just these media twerps Chuck Todd, bothers, hello me and he has forever and he didn't change my mind. He's not good. He

didn't win me over. I'm not gonna job. Quick question, Cody, how many times do you think you could buy and sell you? Oh? As many as I could. I could start, I could start counting now, and by the time this episode is done, that number would be less than the actual. The best thing about capitalism is is the meritocracy. I believe. I believe that. I believe in that, and I believe that you think that too, big fan of the meritocracy,

which is really a thing that happens. Chuck Todd deserves everything. Um, he has good, his job, fantastic, a real real smart cookie. Uh. The first time the last night at the going down the line, like what do you think about that? And then they do their their quick answers. He's like, ah, this is my favorite part. This is the good part, you know, the part where you really get into it.

What Chuck fuck? I will say the best part of these two debates, and I can't imagine even another competitor is Kamala Harris, who I don't like because she's a cop. Really fucking grilling Biden about that awesome. That was fucking great. Yeah, that moment of night too for sure for me, was that and emotional about it. You could tell she was damn near at tears when she finished, or fighting for composure, tell like it really affected her and she really meant it.

At the same time, like she was going to do that no matter what, like she was planning on, like we're gonna talk about this on stage, and that's what we've been talking about for a long time. Like I can't wait for Joe Biden to be next to people who actually talked to him about this stuff. I was, I mean, Bernie didn't really go after Joe Biden, and we were expecting that, but I'm thrilled. Yeah, it was so good. And again this is one of those things like there he did not look her in the eye.

He did, man, he gave her, He gave her a glance, and then he looked away. He could he could not do it. He got mad. Yeah, you know, as a journalist, your goal is to try to be to look at things from an objective point of view. As a podcast, your your goal is not that. And I find myself time between the two and I feel like I feel like I need to emphasize I very much dislike Kamala Harris I just and I do not like the idea

of voting for a prosecutor. I think her job, the job that she did for years is fundamentally and evil to the world. She fucking nailed that. That was perfect, And I completely agree with you. I those are all of my reservations against Kamala. And when I talk to people about it, you know, some people don't like that. I don't like Kamala, And um, I'm capable even fucking credit where it's do. Yeah, she's so good at that, and she's so good in all the Senate hearings. She's

so and that's the prosecutor in her. She's concise, she's smart, and she's aggressive and and that showed tonight. And one of the things that I really liked about the moment because she is she is concise, she's very polished, he's very good at speaking. I liked the raw emotion, especially at the very end. And I really everyone find that find that, like the YouTube video of this, and like

really look at after she delivers her last word. What you see on her face is like something you get so rarely in national politics, is like real emotion that moved her body like and that's important to see. Yeah, and I really liked to see her and she had to sort of take a moment and likes it as it should have. Well, because that's also like that's like a scary thing to do on a stage. Character and courage,

and I impressed by her. Some people would skew that as being emotional, and some kinds of people are dumb. I want I want to know that my I want to know that my president has human emotions. The most I've ever been sympathetic to Donald Trump is hearing that his daughter described him what chemical weapons did to kids,

and that he had a gut reaction to it. I want that, like he didn't do anything effective about it, Like you want to know that, like the presidents of human being hear something and be like, well fuck it, we got to take action this, this can't be allowed to happen. Yeah. Absolutely, yes, I create all completely. I think it's funny. At some pointed out I think this is perfect that so like Kamal took a moment to call Joe Biden racist, Well, she said, I'm not calling

you racis. And if you guys need reminding, this was about the issue about bussing students and how how how Biden was against bussing and children into different districts. If I'm not mistaken, she was supposed to have had a thirty second time or on that. Nobody even thoughts about that. I love that. I was. I was like, well, she blew past for a while, it's are they going to stop? That was well done to say like, well, this is

the moment that we need to let breathe. I feel like Walter Cronkite's ghost would write you down for trying to stop that questioning that would that would have been the most embarrassing moment if if someone tried to stop her from let her speak, Like God, Chuck, shut the funk up. But he didn't do was yeah to hut In Todd's credit, Chuck Todd was like, yeah, this needs to happen. Chuck Todd's credit, he didn't do anything. Yeah,

so the best thing he's done is not anything. Um but I think all this is really funny that in response to that, so obviously Joe Biden got really really mad, but like so she called him racist and then in response he called her a cop. Yeah. It's like, oh, so, like you're just like living Twitter out right now. Like you're doing it all. I would have loved it if Joe Biden. The only thing you could have gotten it to get my my support after that is if he'd called her a cop, put on a black mask, and

then spray painted the Antifa, that would have been amazing. Yeah, just just fucking Joe Biden goes like full banks e. Yeah, I think he really did a bad job tonight. Oh yeah, he wasn't He wasn't great. I mean after that, like there was no going background because it made him so mad, I think, and even before that, before that, and again in terms of like theoretically things that he could have done during my support if he'd just been like, you're right.

I came up in a different era. I learned things that were wrong, and I was wrong then and you are right now. Let me explain why I still think I can do a good job as president. And that's human.

That's why the night well, the night before when Tulsea talked about this, and we've got the various opinions, but like saying, like I think a lot of people watching can relate to growing up in a conservative household and growing and change your mind, and I was like, that is exactly what you say as someone who hate like I hate Tulsa Gabard. I also grew up hating gay people because of how I was raised, and I identified with that statement, and that was a very good way

for her to answer. That's how you address it, because because it's true, yeah, or people and hiding for hiding from it is a real mistake handled that question about the shootings in his town. And at the start at in to it, yes, I completely agree, um, but that was human and honest and him saying like, I don't know this is this is a nightmare and it's very difficult. We could I couldn't get it, I said, I couldn't

get That gutted me a little bit. I was like, not gutted me, but hit me in a way of like I just so deeply appreciated saying And this is where so I'm getting a little bit like off here, but this is where I get to like the fundamental issue of of of the still king, the lurking ghost of authoritarianism that is at the core of every system in the world that's still left over the days when we were ruled by kings. The fact that an acceptable

answer that question wouldn't have been Buddaget going. We couldn't get it done. This is a nightmare. Nobody knows how to fix this entirely, and the only answer will come from sustained, long term nationwide dialogue to figure out how to fix this problem, because it's not a problem that can be solved by a person at the top. It's a problem that starts from the bottom and percolates up, like the solution starts from the bottom and percolates. That's

we'll see. That's another reason why Mary Ann Williamson was like, she's she's right. Was the one when she said that. I was like, why are you derailing? This is weird? And then she got to it was like, oh, she's right.

That is it's exactly what you just said. When she was talking about how like it's not just I mean, it seemed like it was sort of getting into like a holistic medicine where she she went to some weird digressions, but like the idea of and she also called like universal health care and like whether I have medical for all that's like superficial solutions, which I don't necessarily agree with, but like the idea of just like degree with that right, But like, why do people get sick? Why do we

have these problems? What are the roots of these problems? And we have to we have to be able to talk and and really explore what causes the problems that we're making policies to solve the symptoms of that. She doesn't she doesn't think she's gonna win, and I don't think, you know, I think us the ensley of this of the second like knows he's not going to be the presidential candidate. He just wants to make sure climate change

gets talked about. They're all they're all doing the gravel thing or and it might take a while for that to seep in, but it is true. What are the other things that are factoring into this bigger problem? Can I throw in a free at plug? Sure? Try sandwiches They're great, They're just great. Yeah, any sandwich really good concept bread and then things in between the great idea. Try a sandwich. I want to talk about Elizabeth Warren. I love talking about Elizabeth Warren. Are you a couple

of Warren bros? Yes, babe, No, I am You're nothing. Comprehensively planned out and logical solutions to basic problems, Bro wild wild stuff a problem. She's got a plan for that. It's not the number of plots that she has plans for, it's that she specifically the things that she's focused on most seemed to be like breaking up big tech all the fucking Nazis, which literally has a billboard that says

break up big Tech. Like it's so simple. Yeah good, it's also real quick, just something that's been bothering me. Um because like the whole breaking up big tech and and that is I think an issue that everyone can kind of come together. It's the right and the left thing. It's extremely frustrating to watch that the rights concerned about big tech is solely about conservatives being censored because would like everyone else to be banned from existing, right, Like

I know why. It's like not the right, it's but the people who are part of that grift are literal Nazis in many cases, right, And like there's a there's a clear like goal um and mission from a lot of them. But like just like you see Ted Cruz and he's he's like in in uh in the hearing and he's like concerns sounds. It's like no, no no, no, that's not the reason. Like there. It's just very bizarre, and it's not the reason because like David NewART, who is like, one of the things I do for a

living is anti fascist research. David NewART is the very best of us who got banned from Twitter for the fact that his book cover had a stylized image of a guy in a clan hood on it because this book is about racist groups in America, and he got banned from Twitter for weeks. Like David knew, it's not

a conservative. The problem isn't that Twitter bands conservatives. The problem is that Twitter's decisions as to who to ban are completely consistent, have nothing to do with their actual written rules, and are often done by random robots and then justified post facto by individual human beings trying to avoid like making a bad news cycle. And that's dumb. Agree completely. We're talking about Elizbeth Warren. I'm sorry for

Elizabeth Warren. Okay, So in terms of her debate performance, I feel personally that she stood out, you know, different phrases, heads and shoulders, miles ahead of all the other candidates. She is the person that answers the fun in question. That is true, she answers the question question she doesn't pivot. You see, some are like it's so basic, but everybody else will take it and pivot to something that feel

comfortable talking about. It makes me, even Bernie he did it tonight, makes me people avoid talking about a race racial issue to start talking about, you know, your comfort zone and it's he's got the message that he sticks to and why they want you to do that, but it's it's not authentic and you're not actually you're not answering whenever. You know, there were so many times when like one of the modern is just like, Okay, I'm going to give you twelve more seconds. Do you wanna

answer the direct question? Like they like, I love the wording because that really do you want to answer? The direct question? Was said a lot like the phrase direct brother and Elizabeth to Elizabeth Warren. And you mentioned, you know that moment with Kamala you see her her humanness in that moment. But I I felt that with Elizabeth Warren on most of her answers that I wasn't just looking at a politician. And we talked about this earlier,

how maybe she didn't always have the canned line answer. No, she did, So if I were to like evalue Elizabeth warren'shul performance. Her her first answer and her last answer, we're both very polished, very well scripted, what a progressive

politician would say in a movie. And between then she talked like a normal person having a conversation with you, which is why I would say from a presentation standpoint, she did not come across the best because she came across as a person who is thinking through answers and having a conversation with you, trying to answer them, which I don't know if it is a weakness or strength, because Donald Trump comes across as a drunken farmer um when and like anyone the presidency, that turned out to

be great, and we're all if fucking exhausted of people who sound like politicians, and she sounds she sounded like a politician, like a good politician at the first and last answer. In between she sounded like a person trying to find some oceans. Yeah, that'sated with but I understand, like that's it's just important to note that that is very true, um, and different people are going to take that in different ways. For me, I found it refreshing. Also, she taught special ed and UH as a person who

taught special and was bad at it. I didn't know that about you. I did and was bad at it. My job was mostly to get punched in the face. But having literally gone to war zones and been shot at, I can't imagine a harder job than teaching special education. Anybody who dedicates a chunk of their life to doing that, except for me, because I was at it is a hero. Your mother does, right. Yeah, and to have a president who I understand that. Yeah, I want to talk a

little bit about her. I don't have the answer to this, but maybe you guys do. I've seen a lot of pushback or some amount to with Warren online um specifically about her stance on Palestine as well as Medicare for all. Do you guys know anything about that? I've heard about the Medicare for all of heard what the fun is she saying about? Actually don't know. I don't think that she has a hard stance against Israel, And I think

the point I don't. I don't know. Try imagining anyone having a hard stance against Ariel and running for president in the United States. But that's the thing. I think that seems like everyone is the same, Like no one. No one is is making that an issue for them.

No one's trying to make themselves stand out. Actually, I think a lot of people and people even have been deeming me being like, I'm concerned about your support of warrant because of her really, because of her stands and Palestine and and what what have they specified on what they're concerned about. She doesn't seem to have a lot of empathy towards Palestinians, then yeah, I would consider that

an issue. And yeah, that's what I will say, And what I can say without being more certain better specific views, is that, like I'm sure she has more empathed with Palestine than Donald try. Yeah, that's where yeah, and all do. Yeah, And I guess that she was for Medicare for all and then seemed to take a step but now she's all in, seems, and she waffled on it. I think she mainly waffled on because it's just not one of the core issues that she's focused on. And I mean

she literally said I'm with Bernie on this one. Yeah, so fine. I think we have to take word for them. And it's one of those things where like part of what you're voting for is not what the candidate espouses and what they believed all the career, but whether or not they are a sane person who could be pushed. You will not push a Republican to make It's like

with climate change. Joe Biden, who I don't like if he is elected president, doesn't have a good policy and climate change right now, doesn't have a great history with climate change. But I do firmly believe could be pushed by a Democratic elector who cared about climate change to embrace effective policies to address it purely because he wants to win re election and because he's a political animal. Donald Trump will never do that. I believe that he

could be pushed during this process. I believe that we could get him saying X, Y or Z, and I think he'd go along with a Democratic Senate and House. You might take any step on. That's why I don't think that's what we need. I mean, I think I'm preaching to the choir here, but I'm not talking about

what we need. But just like if we're talking about should you vote for Biden if it's Biden or Trump, Yes, but I do feel like that has to be like it's the kind of thing where it's like there's a lot of criticisms to lot against everybody on the stage, and there's a lot of reasons to not like Biden. But if he was president right now, we would have a lot of the same problems we have, but children wouldn't have died in concentration camps. Yeah, and that's that's

not nothing to me. That's not nothing. I'm also trans wouldn't be banned from serving the military. I'm mostly I'm just I'm mostly worried about post Biden and who they like, who the Republican candidate is after I hate the idea of the election. I think that the response to Joe Biden would be someone smarter than Donald Trump, who am still embodies the same kind of things, and that's totally

super reasonable. I just think for how terrible these years have been with Donald Trump, the sort of positive that you can take away is that we everybody's riled up in a way and paying attention in a way that we maybe never been before. And if any of these big broad changes that we we dream about happening are going to happen, they're going to happen now because everybody's engaged.

And I just feel in my bones that getting Biden in there would be a huge step back from all It would bum me out in a way that I actually fear now long for him. I don't think he's gonna make it. It seems like he's been bleeding support at a rate that makes me think it may not be sustainable. That said, again, as somebody like you know, you've got the part of me who's like trying to approach this as what I believe in a part this prender approach as a journalist, he has really fucking solid

support among the black and Latino community. It's so interesting. Um. It's the same thing with Hillary Clinton. Is what I argued with Bernie people a lot during the election, is just like, no, she objectively won a larger chunk of the non white Democratic vote than he did, by a substantial margin. And that's not because of the d n C. It's because she devoted a lot of time to campaigning in those areas, any of those communities, And you have to acknowledge that. I'm curious how true that will be

for Biden. I am curious how that especial. We're very early yet, um, and he's yeah, I think it's just been a lot of It's been a lot of name recognition and a lot of the like he was Obama's VP the Institution and just like the idea of Joe Biden.

And then as time went on, more and more stuff came out about him that should have been talked about, maybe when he talked about trying to be vice president, all that kind of stuff, And now that you have actual people on stage introducing those things, I just don't think he'll I don't think Yeah, that's my hope, that's my hope, because like, he did not do well tonight. I know he was not the standout. No, he looked he looked real bad tonight. Let's talk about gun control.

We gotta talk about gun control. Both debates did. I didn't like what anybody had to say Um, which is usually the case when I hear Democrats talk about gun control. UM swallows the guy I like the least one of the issues I have with him, and I I want to make it clear to the listeners that as a guy who owns a shipload of guns, I've never voted

on guns. I will never vote on guns. I do not make any of my voting decisions based on people's gun policies I make because like, if I were voting on that, then I would be throwing all of my gay and trans and non white friends under the bus. I would throw the climate under the bus. And I'm not going to do that. That said, uh, when Swallow made the statement that like, I don't care about your handguns and your shotguns of gun crimes and murders are

committed with handguns and shotguns. You look at all of the top guns that actually people in this country all handguns, he didn't care about them, he said, I'm not I have no issue to go. I have no issues with that. I want to go sized problem because I'm not gonna say mass shooting center problem, but like really small chunk of gun crime, actually really small chunk, which doesn't mean we don't address it. But like the assault weapon focus is always because it's an easy way out. That's scary.

They look, they look, they look scary, and and that's an easy talking point, Like, Okay, we can all agree that, yeah, no more handguns. No one wants to say. What the real issue is that that is really fucking attractable difficult. Is that there are a couple of simultaneous truths number one. One of the single most important laws of this country built into its nervous system, it's fucking spinal cord, is

the right to bear arms. The vast majority of gun deaths in this country are suicides, and no restriction of firearms, save a total ban on gun ownership, we'll stop people from being able to kill themselves with guns. That's the single that's the issue that nobody talks about because there's no real way to address it. Mass shootings people do discuss, and I think they tend to get wrong, but like

that's one of those things. And this is one of the issues again where I have with people like Swabow who talk about like gun buy backs, where it's like you realize there's a Constitution and there's the Supreme Court, and there's like that, like that there's a body of law, and like what you are saying might not be legal, and in fact has been categorical bands on weapons after d C versus Heller, like r I'm constitutional, And again there are states with individual sault weapons bands, so you

could argue, but those assault weapons bands, like California has assault weapons ban, and I was still able to own an our fifteen and a K forty seven because their Assault Weapons Band did not ban semi automatic weapons. They banned certain features on weapons which didn't actually make it. Because again, the most recent mass shooting we had in California where we had like twelve dead, was thousands of

shootings we've done with a clock handgun. I think I really wish we had people talking about guns in the Democratic Party and how to effectively legislate them and restrict them that understood them. Um. And I also wish people understood the fact that Bodhadeer served in the military does not mean he knows a damn thing about guns. Some of the dumbest people about guns served in the military aspect soldier. Yeah. Yeah, uh that's my rantin Monopolize that

that that's what was here for. Um. Yeah, this suicide thing is a real problem and concern, and uh, it's one of those things that is linked to so many other problems again and it kind of gets to what Mary Anne Williams was talking about, how do you, like,

what are the things that are causing this? Um And you don't hear a lot of people even talking about, like when you talk about universal health care and medicare for all those things like mental health is important and like people don't Uh, A lot of people don't have anyone to talk to, and uh, if you give them

that outlet helps with a lot of problem. I don't know, like I have the idea of like, well, no, we if you give everyone the mental and physical care that they need, that a lot of these problems not immediately, but like over time time. You'll see. It's just like Switzerland, every adult pretty much has an assault rifle in their home. I did not know that, Yeah, because they're everyone who serves in the military, which is like most of the

adult population. Maybe I'm getting an exact but a lot of people should I get and they take their weapons home with them and it's a G thirty six C, which is a pretty potent gun. Um. Also, you know, I had an editor at a website I wrote with who was Swiss, and when she got pregnant, Uh, she and her husband both got like six or seven months of maternity paternity leave, which is part of like the package that they get. Like, and I think, you know, there's a lot of other stuff at play as too.

If you're trying to wonder like why they Swiss don't have mass shootings and we do. Um, because one thing that the right brings up a lot when they talk about gun controls, like look at Switzerland, they all have machine guns, and like they don't commit nearly as many crimes as US. It's got to be a separate issue. They're not entirely wrong. Um, it's wrong to blame every mass shooting on mental health because that unfairly stigmatized tonically

old people. But it's also wrong they pretend that like the fact that most like therapy is something that has proven benefits for virtually everyone who engages in it, and the vast majority of Americans could not possibly afford to engage in a therapist, reject the concept of it, but also couldn't afford it even if they didn't. That's a problem. Yeah, it's a problem in a place where also, while you can't afford a therapist for the cost of four hours

of therapy, US could buy an air fifteen. Yeah. That's that's an issue to me as a guy who you can get them as cheap as forner Bucks, very cheap. Yeah. Yeah,

that's like a month of therapy. Yea maybe, But none of our but none of our conversations about guns include this, No they don't, and that's what then when they do, it's sort of in a reductive way that like doesn't really yeah, well it's similar to mean, this is a transition, but all of our conversations about immigration rarely include talking about going into Latin America. Going into the being the debate, it was addressed like we kind of fucked up Latin

America what with the wars we can unbelievable. I mean I was truly yeah, well I was really impressed by that especially it was especially impressive, like it was it did seem like the majority of people on the stage new and said that. Yeah, for all that, I and all of us, I'm sure will continue to shoot on the Democratic Party in frustration for the next year and a half. Kudos on both really focusing on trains people

in how America sucked up Latin America. It really is a credit to the point even Biden was like, by the way, like we gave like millions of hundred millions of dollars and sucked right, yeah, and then they stopped it and like here like it started to reduce the number of people and then here we are maybe like guys, you remember like the Marshall Plan, like the single most effective thing that our government ever did, maybe in its whole history. Maybe that again. No, Germany and Japan don't

seem like you're doing. How many they both reverted to fascism so many times since, constant to do it, so many built the country that famously still fascist statesman. I remember how Japan has continued to invade China for the last eighty years. We all remember, We all remember the things that happened in real life and not making incredible products. I love products and services and services speaking of what cheers And no we're not doing yeah um yeah, No,

that was a great surprise. I was very surprised actually, Like cler last and the first night remind me of like you're a friend in high school, her mom that you never wanted to be stuck young with, but every now and then you get stuck with her and she actually says something, not a bad person that she makes it perfect, Like where you guys going tonight? Yeah? Wait,

no club? Sorry, I was thinking of nonsense. The short brown clar is the one that eats with a comb and is mean to her Yeah, in a pinch, which is fine. She's resourceful. Gila Brand is the mom who, like you think that you wouldn't want to be alone with and like you kind of dread it, but then you do and she's like the cool mom. You smoked weed. Yeah, she's a yeah. I'm not slandering her spreading rumors. All I'm saying if you walk up to Christine Gilabrand, she

will give you weed. Um. Did like everyone take that to heart? Last night didn't have as many I don't. I didn't don't remember them talking about that aspect of the immigration point. But I don't like that brought up the economic comperative of immigration, and that is another thing that I don't see people talking about enough. We're like freaking out about everything that's happened in the border, and nobody's really hammering down the point that we actually are

in a situation where we need immigrants. We have a dearth in the service industry. What are old people going to do without them? I'm all of our companies my mom grew I grew up with My mom has is a caterer, had a catering company, and we relied and she had all sorts of different like Hispanic Hispanic immigrants that worked for her, and she paid them well and she gave them healthcare. And you know, and not that my mom was an amazing person, but they were part

of it was imperative. Nobody else would take that job. Is amazing person. She is an amazing person. Nobody we we needed them, she needed them, and they were better than everybody else. Yeah. Yeah, it's um one of the

things that eternally frustrates me. And then I frustrated me with Bernie Sanders, who was a guy who I know on an emotional personal note, when the rest of my family went for Trump and broke my heart in one of the people who raised me, my aunt, who is a lifelong Republican, voted for Bernie Sanders, and the fact that because she was like I think he's the only honest man in the election, and he will always have

a piece of my heart for that. I am eternally frustrated with his insistence that borders are important, and I know, I know, this is a ridiculous hope. I will never have a party in either side of this country, left or right, who feels the way I do about borders, which is that they are a cancer destroying our entire species, and that until we get past the concept we have no hope of long term survival. That's just me being

a wild eyed radical. But I wish Bernie Sanders had said funck all Borders thrown a smoke bomb and skateboarder out of the that would have been sick. Skateboard punched him right out the door the debate. Yeah, and then yeah, insulted him in Spanish or something. Yeah, I called him a fucking put Yeah. Who do you think is going to make it to the next round? Do? How do we eliminate people? Do we know? I think it Isn't it just like about the amount of PA pularity that's

pulling and stuff? Right? Yeah, it seems like that would be the only same way to do it. All I want to see I want to see I guess Warren, Bernie, But I do want to bring up one other thing. Get frustrated the funk out of me one person Unless I'm missing my guests on the first debate because I missed a little chunk of it because I was in trance all was listening. I think one person in both debates brought up white supremacy and it was fucking Joe Biden. Yeah,

so yeah, that's disappointing. That's disappointing. I mean, good on you, Joe, Like we're not we're not trying to be like one of those fucking nothing but nihilistic podcasts here. So I'm gonna give people credit where it's due. He brought it up, He brought it on. Everyone should have because of all the dead people. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's You're right that there's an alarming lack of that. So he gets credit for that in my book. For that, I don't think

he's any kind of plan. It's a plan. I also don't think he's really careble of talking about it in a way where he really understands it. It really and like I think it's kind of the negative of that when like his first question, I forget even what the question was, but like one of the first words that came out of his mouth with Donald Trump, and it seems like that's just the literal. His whole thing is just like, oh, the Charlottesville and Donald Trump and it's

bad in the soil of over country. But like he doesn't really know where it's coming from or like why or he brought it. He had Charlotte'sville and a couple of my friends were in the ad that he put up first. I saw that. Yeah, Like I will say, also in credit to her, she didn't bring it up in the debates, and she should have. But Elizabeth Warren has suggested plans and made it a focus of her campaign.

I did not know that. Yeah, she's talked about that, like white supremacy needs to be probably need to start prosecuting these people's domestic terrorists, which we're not currently doing. I think she should have said. That's my big bummer about Elizabeth warrenh how do you not do that? It's a fucking debate, Elizabeth talk about it. Well, they don't have very much time, but that's kind of a big one. I do agree that's disappointed she didn't bring it up.

But Joe Biden thing seems like it's kind of lip surface and like it's like, oh, I know that people care about this, and it's like a hot button emotional topic that can bring up, as opposed to knowing where it comes from and what to feel about it and call it lip service. If he wasn't the only fucking person images because no one else said anything, So like, yeah, he brought it up. Anything that I'd like to keep

an eye out for the next one. Are there other things that you guys want to see people talking about

in the next debates? You know, the most frustrating moment for me was when they got asked what they would do if they could deal with one problem, and like two people brought up climate change, and like someone brought up like guns, and someone brought up about like like income for families and stuff, and it's like, yeah, man, both both gun control and improving family income are important, but like you know, the planets burning up, like no other answer. But the most important thing is to stop

the environment from collapsing. Nothing else is that important. It's the literally the thing that I need. Yea, I will not vote for you unless you've got anoledgs just better and warrant. I think who said climate change? That was the first debate the second once people said it, I don't even picking Looper and whoever else. I do not like the answer, Like, well, the first thing I do is to rejoin the Paris Climate Agreement. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I mean at least that's acknowledging climate change. We need much more than Gilibrand was the only one with a

really good answer on like that. Yeah, So speaking of what people want to see, one of the things we're doing here, you know, we're trying to provide all of you with an effective and useful podcast series about this election that keeps you informed and hopefully helps not just drive interests but relieve stress and uh, provide some value to people trying to navigate what will be the worst year of all of our lives two thousand and twenty UM.

And we wanna, you know, not just talk about what we thought about this election, but also because the people we assume are listening to this of the folks who like us the most, and the folks will be the core of the audience of our new podcast, The Worst Year Ever, We want to open the ship up to your suggestions about what you want to hear covered, what you want to see addressed you, what you want to

see us go into. Because there is a crowded field of political podcasts, and I find most of them deeply frustrating, and I don't want to make a frustrating and unlistenable podcast, And I don't want to make a reflexively ideological podcast, which I hope we've avoided in this and sort of dealing with the people as they present come later Joe

Biden a couple of times. Yeah, he didn't. Um. So we have an email and we want you to reach out to us if you have things you want us to cover, things you really want to see dealt with suggestions for how we handle this selection because we're all going to be doing a podcast Katie Coney and I the Worst Year Ever, where you know, I think we should give them a little bit of an idea of like what we are currently planning to hit in that. Yeah, yeah, definitely, Yeah,

I mean you want to because I've just been ranting. Yeah, I mean, like a lot of this stuff. I think one of one of the things I think we all agree on is that we're not going to uh, we're gonna do our best to avoid making it the Trump Show at all, um, and it's not going to be about him. It's not gonna be other things he says or the stuff he tweets about it. And I like that about these debates. Also, yes, we talked about for

the most part, they really avoided it. Yeah, I wouldn't making him the focus, which is very good, and so we're gonna avoid that. We want to talk about, Um, what they're actually talking about and the issues there and how they actually affect people, and like talking to talking to people and what affects them. Um, we will be going to various conventions throughout the year about stuff like the shot show. See yes, yeah obviously like the Iowa Caucus.

We'll go to the concus will go to the event and see yeah, um what it was the autism Now I think we're going to go which is like a crazy convention of people who think that it's not like a norm a loutism thing. It's like a convention of people who think you can shoot bleach up your kids, but to cure autisms. We want to Like those people are political, I want to I want to know the election, but you want to you want to know where they're coming from and what they care about and like maybe

how you can bring them back a little bit. So if there are any issues or groups of people or ideas that you have things that you would like to have more insight into that we should look into. We really want to hear your suggestions and things you can do and like, yeah, so the email is worst Year tips at gmail dot com. That's correct, right, and not tips on how to have the worst year ever because we know the answer to that exist just your tips and it's it's it's mixing acid with two C. Don't

do it, don't do it. Don't do it now. Mushrooms and two see also not a great idea, but mushrooms and two cee. I also had a great idea, but to see I an acid bang bad idea. We got to a good idea. See I is a rough one to mix with some substances, but a fun one if you mix it with the right ones. So check out our podcast next Missing mixing to See I with various substances at Sepack the show. Robert's going to be our drug guru on this journey. I guess that's the end

of our our debate. I think so. Yeah, it's been real fun. It's been real fun. Actually it has been. I've enjoyed. This has been great. It's more than the debates. Yes, this is the best part. I want to ask one quick question. Were moving on to the next thing. Do y'all think Joe Biden is a better kisser than Bernie Sanders Because I feel like Joe has the pass. I think he might be I think he might be a

good kisser depends on how wanted the kisses. Now, that's an important point we're talking about, because Bernie does double consent checks, signs a contracts on board. I don't know that Bernie's that interested. I mean, I think he's just got a lot going on. I'm assuming Bernie's down, like maybe we have some sort of pheromone spray so we know that the interest is there. No, I can't imagine

being kissed by Bernie. You can't imagine being kissed by Bernie or either of them, really, But I think that I think that Joe Biden cares about making sure his kisses are good. I don't know. I do think Joe

Biden cares about that. I will say I can imagine being on a beach and in Sonata and like sort of the wind blowing through my hair and like a little bit of sand in between my toad selling it sipping a No, I'm talking about Bernie sipping a little bit of like a nice like mescal, and Bernie Sanders puts his hand on my shoulders and leans into me and whispers into my ear. But I care for all unachievable dream and works and most of the developed world

and that's the thing. Whereas like I feel like, um, Bernie can sweet Talkie, Bernie can, Bernie can get to your soul, Bernie can get to your emotions. Bernie cares about sweet talk. Sure, I don't think. I think it depends on like who you are, you know, you know, idealistic, strong in their convictions, socialist. Is you think I think he can get you going? I just don't think he's like a sexual being. But I think that Joe Biden probably has spent a lot of time. Yeah, um, and

I think that we know that. I also think he probably would get a really good shoulder Rep. I will say one thing that would make almost make Biden being the Democratic candidate worth it, as if the competing hats of were make America great Again and just Biden Fox just we can make those shirts, but our shirts. Honestly, if it we're literally anybody Budda, Judge, Fox, they all, if they all, we all fuck. Except for Beto. I'm

not gonna believe it does not fuck. Hes not he doesn't know what He just doesn't know what to do. He's all he's all thumbs, you know, he's just he's just like ranting single words in Spanish like a white boy trying to like shop in Guatemala. Do a kick flip? Yeah, I hope he's gone by the next one. He's such a dork. Yeah, Okay, that's it for tonight. Um, we love you very much. It's true. We do, we do.