Check it on Man No Down Man Tuesday Morning, November The Meeting the Book podcast special Early Week Bega pod Skill Alexander, thanks for listening in live from the day, our beautiful home with the d in front of how many people would you say? We're in front of the day, Mikey, what do you think the crowd is? Um? What are you? What are you gonna go with a little shy of thirty, little shy, little shy of thirty air on a strange
Tuesday morning for Thanksgiving. That's Mike Palm, Derek Stephen's conciliary vice president of Ops Circus Sports. Mikey is here, Mike Palm and Todd Wishnev from his cork attic, his mom's cork attic somewhere in Pittsburgh, p A. What's the background there, Todd? What's the blue and white? That's a Greek restaurant. I think we've got snowflakes because it's becoming wintertime. You see that? What's It's a Sarah Silverman reference. And our guest at a kind enough to join us first time ever on
the megapod. This is Jason Conn's idea producing number seven, who who said to me he goes, why don't you have felik on? And I'm like, oh, how come my brain never shifted from Chris's you know, his his sports that we always talked, talked to Chris about seven different sports on a numbers game, but never rarely I should say about the NFL. It's Chris Flik of the Bear from ESPNS College Game Day, Daily Wager in the Stanford
Steve in the Bear podcast. How you doing, Chris? So, so we we can blame this on Jason when this goes very very portly, and then we can just depend on him. No. I love, I love that you're here because this is like a meeting amongst friends. So we're excited to uh exactly to talk football. All right, So let's, uh, Todd, how do we do this? Let's start first of all with CIRCA a lot of eliminations and Circus Survivor. We're down at two oh nine. Four entries didn't get in
before the deadline. Three from one person who emailed you at three oh eight and said give me two charges in one Vikings and Supersize and police and you said, sorry, buddy, Jeff Jeff Benson called him, UM's a little older than me. This person, a male person little older than me, works at one of the casinos in town. Yeah. I don't know what happened. I don't know if he worked graveyard. I don't know why he was asleep at five on Saturday eight. But yeah, Jeff called him back and just
explain it. Not only shouldn't we do it, we can't. The system locks out at three, there's no way to in. It's over Las Vegas. Chris, who's in Circle Millions, not in Survivor, who was on the numbers game this morning. He is doing very well in Circumillions. He's like top twenty ish said he got in one week at three pm. Exactly. It can sneak up on you. Two o nine left in the Survivor. I have no idea who to pick on Thursday. None. See if you guys can convince me
of a team here? Um, okay, and then Todd, what's the your court stenographer? What are the updated picks? Well court stenographies for you? Here we go into week twelve. All of us had a poor week last week, going one and two. Gil moves to sixteen fifteen and two. Mikey is tied with Gil exactly at sixteen fifteen and two, and I also wanted to to go to fifteen seventeen and one. Amazingly, we Mikey one is teaser, Me and you Gil lost our teasers, so we all are seven
and four on teasers. So it's a tight race coming down the stretch. I had Cincinnati in Green Bay. I lost because of the Borough injury. By the way, that Cincinnati game was such an interesting in game bet, and I was on Cincinnati. As soon as Burrow got injured, I quickly switched and took the other side. They moved a line like seven points immediately, but I said, I don't even care whatever. They moved the line because the guy who came in I don't even remember his name
was horrendous. After like two plays, I was like, forget this. I just dumped on the other side. Brian Finley and genius North Carolina State. North Carolina State, wasn't he Chris Bryan Finley is all right, here you go, Yeah, all right, let me tell you he wasn't in North Carolina State anymore.
I believe Cincinnati had like a thousand yards before he came in, and seventeen when after he came in, So it was number I think too right, I think he has never seventeen might be number five the number think he was seventeen. I think was seventeen in college. I'm picking up, all right, Chris, I well, I will tell you this. He wasn't playing the A c C And the Washington football team after that. All right, Chris has a hard out Todd. So let's let's keep on format here.
But it's sorry, alight and dominuld. I'll start. I'll stay as long as I can. You know when you get when you when you get all these days, you've got doctor's appointments like nick cracking and kind of prompted treatments to at this point in the year, like after being on the road for for thirteen straight weeks and the body completely breaks down. So they've got a nice little nick cracking session going up. So but I told him I'd better be a little late. So well, well, well
we'll structure as long as we can. All right, Then, I apologize Todd riff as much as you want. All right, let's start with the best. Bet. I don't want to. I don't want Todd met at He's already mad at you and Mike, so I don't want I don't want him getting med at mate. He's permamat though. Chris, Chris, here's the deal. You are an upstanding gentleman, a good
person and and everything. I can only say good things about you and you you associate with good people like Kirk curb Street, and I associate with the dregs of humanity. I'm not going to mention any names, but they're in the other two boxes than the other two boxes. Stuck in a box. Alright, best bets, Chris. As always, the guest has honors, your honor. I I really want to take Detroit on Thanksgiving. I just I have a heart. I know you were listening to you and Chris every
week like Houston. You really want to late points with them on the road. I'm not. I'm not there, but it's God are They're gonna play, Swift gonna play? They lost so many guys last week, So it's hard for me to write now to to really want to lock in on the lock luck lock on an EMU is as amazing as it might be. I might put my faith in Anthony Lynn and and the Chargers getting nea. What what are we calling it here? Five and a half six, five and a half. Yeah, I mean they
they perform every week that the Bills have. I think some issues there in that secondary, and we as long as weather's okay, we've seen justin Herbert light a light light, a lot of defense is up and he's clearly going to be the rookie of the year. So I would send my best, but I'm gonna go with the with the Anthony Lynn laed Wow Los Angeles Chargers catching five
and a half at Buffalo on Sunday. As Aaron Shots from Football Outsiders mentioned two weeks ago in a numbers game, the most consistent team in the NFL from week to week is the l A Chargers, despite the fact they find a way to By the way, Chris, you're New York Jets, Braxton Barrios. We do this segment on Primetime Action where we give fruit baskets to people who help us win bets. My fruit basket went to Braxton Barrios of the Jets for refusing the lateral all that last,
but it's tremendous. Alright, Mikey number one, Todd, what line do you have on the game in Dallas? I like how he doesn't he asked the line first? What line do you have on the sides in the game in Dallas on Thanks Dallas Cowboys. I have three even three even yes, sir, and I late and two and a half. I believe you cannot do that. That only certain people have rights to do that. I get. I'm gonna late to three here. I you know people have have asked
me about Thanksgiving survivor. I agree. If you have multiple entries, you should do the double option in advance. Take the Lions, take since in advance right, because I would still save I would save Dallas. I I don't see used in the Texans or the Lions later in the year. UM. But look, we talked about this game with Cincinnati in Washington, UM, a little bit earlier here with the bad beat with your with your teaser last week. Gilt Washington is terrible.
They're terrible on the road. They're owing four this year on the road. They were gonna lose that game. This is the last two games where they've given up two fifty yards in the first half of the game, and Burrow was moving the ball up and down. I mean, we had a miss field, Goo missed extra point. Cincinnati should have had a comfortable lead in that game. So
I'm a little bit concerned about the Washington defense. I've talked to Michael Lombardi of visan uh fame of the g M Shuffle, fame of the New York Giants fame, and he really believes Alex Smith is going to struggle in Dallas on Thanksgiving. This is a tough week. I don't see a lot of plays at all Thursday or Sunday or Monday. My best bet is gonna be Dallas. Remember they haven't forgotten that nasty laid hit on Andy
Dalton in Washington as well, that knocked him out. Uh. It's a revenge spot for them, and all of a sudden they're right back in the thick of it. I think the only team that can't win the NFC East is the Eagles. I think that they are the worst team in division. Any of the other three could win it, not the Eagles, who lead by a half game. Dallas minus three. Best bet team that you've been fading all year the Dallas all year. This is the first time
I've picked them all year. Philadelphia I said this earlier this week. Philadelphia is a team were on paper, they look like they're the play and then within one drive you're like, I cannot believe I picked this team. They are horrific. By the way, the borrow thing. Do you think we're not making enough of the malpractice of the Bengals in this I'm not saying they cause the injury, but the Bengals, how do you how do you throw that offensive line on the field. That's how is that
you start? It's embarrassing. It's embarrassing. And and they haven't. They're not going anywhere this year, right, and they keep they kept dropping him back to pass over and over and over, even in this game where he got hurt, he had like a full game's worth of stats by the time he got hurt. At some point, your only mission should be to preserve this guy. He has more. What do you want them to do? What are they supposed to do? They don't have offensive line? Yeah, but
what are you gonna do? You know you're gonna have him drop back sixty times seventy times a game? Like, I mean, they're trying to win the game, yil. They played to win the game, yes, but if you have a shoddy offensive line like they do. This is not like justin Herbert and the Chargers, where he's not under where he's under you know, he's not under dress. Burrow
was taking so much punishment all year long. Again, I'm not saying you could predict that that he would blow out his knee, but you certainly didn't minimize the chances of it. The only time they did was in the fourth quarter in Baltimore, where they ran Nixon into the line like seven times because they just didn't want to drop him back anymore, because they knew they couldn't protect him. He's got more past attempts by like twenty than anybody
else in the league. Tough Man Todd first pick from that God wish them, you know, to get the number. I'm gonna go with my first pick. I'm gonna go with a tried and true method of betting, and that is that the Sea a Hattle Seahawks ober the total. And I'll tell you why I'd like to do that today. Seahawks sometimes once in a while ago Under when they play you know, an outstanding defense like the Rams or somebody,
and the Rams were able to hold them down. But the average run of the mill defense, you know with average people from say an average state like Iowa. You know, average kind of teams are not gonna hold down. I'm sorry the hair has been what is that hair? Hair? I can't get the hairs? Sorry about okay? God, you know for a guy who gets fun of my appearance, I'll tell you man and people in glass houses shouldn't
throw stones. But anyways, um my point is the Seattle Seahawks, against average defensive football teams, are gonna be able to move up and down the field. I believe the Philadelphia Eagles are an average of NFL defensive football team. They may even be below average. So I could see Seattle moving the football up and down. I can see Carson Wentz down seventeen points late getting you two touchdowns. He's the king of the late backdoor touchdown. He did it again this week to to knock it over my in
game total. Late in the game. He is fantastic late in the game. Now, he's not Hall of Fame level J Cutler level that was the greatest backdoor touchdown guy of all time. But I will say that Carson Wentz is quite good with backdoor touchdown. So give me the over fifty one. It's not some obscenely high like fifty seven or something. I think we can get over fifty one with Seattle and Philadelphia. Now, I haven't checked the weather, and probably since it's gone down, there's probably bad weather.
But I still think it's gonna go over. So I'll take over fifty one. Todd wishnip Seattle, Philadelphia. My number one pick, best bet is the Tennessee Titans. Give me the three and a half. Is that what it is? Up? Todd and three and a half? Three and a half plus three and a half for Tennessee at Indianapolis. Indianapolis even in victory the last two weeks, the doubling up of Tennessee two weeks ago where Tennessee just kind of
stopped playing in the second half. That was the game where they had eight different third or fourth and ones and Philip Rivers came out of the closet about not sneaking, and they actually had the first pinch sneak. But Jacoby Brissette, Uh, that's gonna come back and harm them in a high level situation at some point. And plus when Jacoby Brissette comes in, now doesn't the defense and know that it's
a sneak for good? The way, that's why I said what they should do now is they should fake the sneak with Brissette and throw a deep No one's gonna be looking for that, because every time Prissette comes in, they're gonna be looking for the sneak. This. Uh, this game last week where they erased a fourteen point deficit against the Packers and did so because the Packers kept turning the ball over. The Colts managed not to put
it away in regulation. From the two seventeen mark to the one mark in regulation in a fifty two second span, they committed five offensive holding penalties and allowed the Packers to maintain time mounts. Packers were eventually were able to tie the game up a regulation. I guess what I'm saying with the Colts is they make this difficult on themselves, and I don't think they're a buttoned up football team. I think the Titans obviously get better as the game
goes on. Derrick Henry quintessential game for the Titans last week against the Ravens. They just kind of wear you down. Uh. Henry didn't have good stats after three quarters. By the end of the game as phenomenal um. Tannehill was great in the clutch. I think fourteen of sixteen when they were down ten on to the end of the game. I just think the Titans are a better football team and I think they're the one team in the a f C come playoff time that can actually beat one
of the big boys. Uh, you're give me three and a hook here. I will take the Tennessee Titans as my number one pick, Christopher number two. I'm gonna give you you guys know the way I operate here, especially in college, I am going to I'm gonna hold my nose with pick number two, and I'm going to take the Jacksonvill ag Wires plus the six and a half there. But I know they have issues on the defensive side of the ball. But but the brown the Browns offense
just is not not good. Every game they seem to win is a close game. Uh. Jacksonville has had a tendency to play hard at least didn't compete every week. Now, last week they the Steelers are obviously one of the best teams in the league. But you look game in Green Bay. They very easily could have won a game against the Texas that they very easily could have won
like the there there's Titans. Earlier in the year, they beat the like at least they're trying, and they're they're competent in spots, and I just don't trust Cleveland's offense to go in there and put up a big number. And if I can get the six and a half points, I'll take up. Or maybe what do we got? What do we got at six and a half? Or seven? Are we go? I see six and a half and pretty yeah, I see pretty much six six and a half. Yeah,
I'll take I'll take another. Uh and an ugly dog there with jab Worth, I'm with you would be Jacksonville or nothing for me. That's too many points for Cleveland. Who are the paper tiger? Now that the Bears Bears used to be the paper tiger this year when they were five and one, I think the Browns are the seven and three paper tiger. My gay number two Todd? What do you have for a number on the Sunday Night game? Ask your question? How did Todd become the
arbiter of lines all of a sudden? There's no point of asking you? And then he argues about it. You won't argue with him, you know. We send it to the junior associate me first, and then I give a number. And then if there's any issues, we kick it upstairs to the management, which is you, and you give the final arbitration. I'm just the junior associate. You're the senior associate. If he's the managing partner. That's that's why. What's the
number Bears Packers? Todd get to it Sunday Night football. I have some interesting numbers here. I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood. There's numbers all over the blathers. I see eight and a half. Ish, I would say that's the most normal. What do you think, senior management? A half? We're gonna lay it with the Packers. This this Bears offense is all time bad folds. Isn't the answer to Biskie?
Isn't the answer? They don't try to run the ball effectively. Um, Green Bay much better at home than they are on the road. Big rivalry spot is not going to be a letdown, especially the Packers off a loss. I'll lay it eight and a half. By the way, you're your boss. Derik Stevens very vocal against those of us who took the Packers in that game against the Jaguars and survivors, saying, oh, you should have saved him for the Bears. That's what he said. I don't know if I agree with him.
You had to avoid go ahead, go ahead. I agree with Derek. I I agree with Derek, and that's why I looked ahead as well. That's why I I went to New Orleans two weeks ago and was sitting there rooting for the Jaguars to try and knock off green Bits. I'm not playing. I'm using green Bay this week myself. So I agree with Well, the green Bay lost Indianapolis certainly didn't hurt that cause. I'll say that they're gonna be angry. Todd number two dot I would like to
take as my number two picks. I would like to do another over. And this isn't over in the l A Charger Buffalo Bill football game. I have a number of let's see I checked it before. Let's just make sure it's I have fifty three or fifty three and a half. Gill, I'm gonna kick it to you for a fair arbitration sale. No, it's fifty four. If not fifty four and a half, I'll give you fifty three and a half. I don't see four three and a half. I am currently looking at Nevada lines today as opposed
to my usual off shore over fifty four. Yeah, pot here at circa the worldwide leader, we're at fifty three. Oh oh see, so I was I was somewhat right. I'll take the fifty four. That's okay. I don't have to be like Mike and Tredit. Wait a minute, how come about we're talking about we're talking about the Chargers and the Bills? Right yet? Oh I said, well this is not updated. Then it's the senior management has the
wrong numbers. As in most organizations, the people that actually do the work know a lot more than senior management. In this case. Again, yes you know what, Todd, you are fifty three and a half. There you go. I always fight. I always fight for my friend Todd. Yes, I know you care about the little guy. Um. The l A Chargers against the Buffalo Bills. The Buffalo Bills are a good offensive football team. They are not a
great defensive football team. And you know what, with this Herbert guy, the Chargers are pretty much the same thing. They move the football weekend week out. This guy moves the football up the field for you. And we have seen that the Chargers like to blow the game late, even against the Jets. Had they blown that one, that would have been the all time Anthony Lynn Anthony Lynn situation. I mean unbelievable that even the Jets were able to cover, and then even the Jets had an opportunity to tie
the game. It is beyond belief. I didn't think it could happen. Last week it almost happened. So you gotta think in this game, where the Chargers have been moving the football, I see them be getting in the twenties easily, the Bills easily. I love this game over. I just think that, you know, the Bills are not a defensive football team, guys. And now is the weather going to be bad in Buffalo? I didn't check the weather yet, but the fact that the numbers, the fact that the
number has gone up making me the question. So it's only Tuesday, Chris. The problem is doing accu weather, you know, instead of on a Thursday, been on the Tuesday can be fraught with peril. So I'm not gonna do my weather this far out. If there's weather a big issue there. Yeah, Well, now the fact that the number has gone up from the open makes me think that probably they have checked the weather. So I'm just gonna take this over. I think,
like I said, I don't know what's so funny. Guys lower me and Chris Felika, the average guy would get down here doing the work, and uh, you know what, I think this game is going over. I just you know what, I haven't seen anybody really stopped the Charge. I haven't really seen anybody stop the Bills. I mean the Bills played poor, maybe a couple of games on offense, but most of the time they moved it up and
down the field. And I haven't seen anything from the Charges defense that gives me any any confidence in either of these teams defenses against what I would consider two above average NFL offenses, both probably in the fifth to fifteen rank, somewhere in that basket I would put both those offensive football teams. So I think we can get way over the fifty three and a half. Here, give me another over l A Chargers, Buffalo Bills to the jerk Offs great breakdowns. Brady, Oh, that was what was
only seven and a half minutes. I was like, it's not like chiropractor appointment. Jesus, you're making fun of and going on and Okay, Brady, I hope you're listened to this. That was Mike palm out of in front of you. Thank you. I just love that you have so much conviction on the over You're like, I haven't checked the weather, but the fact that it's going up tells me they have so thorough Uh. Number two, number two for me, I'm taking the Arizona Cardinals. Now, that's minus two and
a half, right, Todd? Your Arizona Cardinals are minus two and a half. That is correct, sir, Arizona minus two and a half. The New England Patriots. I got the Patriots wrong last week. Let me just be the first to say that. But I don't understand why this is only two and a half given what we've seen with
the New England Patriots. I think Kyler Murray will make one or two huge plays here to win this game for the Cardinals and to cover and this will finally be the game or the Patriots clinch their season win total under uh in what is just a lost season in New England. I just think the Cardinals are a better football team all around, and uh, I don't think here's the only The only caveat is Cliff the Cliff Kingsbury's got to get his act together. Here late in
games and figure out what's going on. That's the only thing that concerns me here. But I'm just gonna I'm gonna play the minus to what happen. I play my early instinct on guessing lines and not overthink this. Going with the Cardinals, it's it's it's fewer than three points. I don't get it. Give me the Cardinals pick number two. Mr. Felika, I'm Matt rule is is one of my guys who who have loved in college and gotten to know. And uh,
but I can't. I don't even know if Petria Walker is gonna play or if Teddy Bridgewater is gonna play. But but that defense I think going against even if I had a dealing can't play. I think Minnesota can basically hand the ball off the Dalbytin Cook thirty five times and they can cover the four or four and act against Carolina. I think a couple of turnovers last week kind of given a game away against Dallas, but they probably should have won to uh to stop that
three game winning streak. Uh. I can't see the Carolina rushed defense having too much success against Dalvin Cook and that and that Vikings offends coming off of a loss home game before they gotta win to Soota. They hat to schedule the next couple of weeks to get back to five hundred and put themselves back in the playoff race.
Because they got Pathers, Jaguars, Bears against that's three wins, and then they got a couple of road games against the Bucks in the Saints and the line, so it looks like they potentially could get to uh to nine wins in a playoff spot with any of that. Any any path to a playoff begins with the win against the Panthers. I'm gonna lay the points with the Vikings at home against the Pathers on Saturday. Yeah, Vikings and Vikings are going to be in it in the race
anyway with the expanded playoff format, for sure. Four minus four against Caroline at Chris's number three pick. Todd, wait, I have him minus four and a half. Actually, I gotta minus four across the board. Okay, we'll give the minus four. But yeah, I'll refresh just in case something happened. But I think it's I think it's four. Let's see here, Yeah, I see, I stually, I see four is everywhere as were four and a half golden nugget Minnesota minus four.
He's got it. Okay, you would like my third pick, and I am going to go. Guess what, folks, I'm gonna make it a hat trick. I'm going over again, folks. I'm going with the Kansas City Chiefs and Patty Mahomes, who I love with that great late game touchdown to push it over for me last week. And the Kansas City Chiefs against your Tommy terrific Dampa Bay Buccaneers, who also crap the bed late against the Rams, which also helped me the past week. So I'm happy with both
of these clubs lately. I like Kansas City to go over. There's really nothing to say there. It's Kansas City. The only thing that really stops them is when the other team just plays so far back they have to dink and dunk it down the field and they end up with a seven minute drive. But even the seven minute drives end up in touchdown. So that's seven points in seven minutes. You're fine. So the Kansas City Chiefs are
gonna move the football. Tampa Bay. Look, Tampa Bay stopped the run last night against the Rams, but they couldn't stop anybody throwing the football last night. It was all Jared Goff could do to mess up that game. He was trying desperately, but he could not mess up that game. There were wide receivers named Cooper Cup running all over the field wide open. What the hell is gonna happen when Tyreek Hill was running all over the field or
Travis Kelsey's running over the field. The Buccaneers are gonna give up points and I think Tommy Terrific could probably have a pocket that's somewhat clean to throw to Antonio Brown and Evans. And the Chiefs are not really doing it on defense. I mean, the Raiders met up and down the field against them, and many of the other games the Chiefs don't kill you on on defense. There are offensive football team. These are two offensive football teams. Give me over fifty five and a half. Make fun
of me. Go ahead, my go ahead, all right, let me get back on pace. My third pick, I'm gonna take in late three points with the Raiders at the Falcons. I really think this Raiders team is just keeps improving. I mean I thought their performance Sunday night flattered them too. I really do. This is a tough team my homes to stop at any time. They were able to get a few state just the offense didn't score one one more time catches that ball down the sidelines that Mike
me or you would have caught sliding situation. They win the football games. I'm not sure the Raiders aren't the top three team in the f C. I think this is a good team. They play well in special teams as well. I know their defense isn't stout, but they do play well in special teams. They get enough stops to take control in most games. Grooon has done a beautiful job with this offense. They can run the ball, they can throw wide, they can control the possession with
their tight ends. I like them here. The Falcons disappointing effort. I thought against New Orleans, a lot of people like New Orleans and or the Falcons in that spot, and they got dominated. I think the Raiders will continue. They'll bounce back here and I'll lave a field goal in Atlanta. Sorry, without order, that's okay. That way, I knew how much
catching up I needed to do. Final final pick for me Um taking the Kansas City Chiefs in that game that you referenced earlier, Todd minus three and a half against the Buccaneers. I did think Tom Brady showed himself once again yesterday to be and there's no shame in this. He's forty three years old. ESPN flashed it up during the broadcast yesterday. He was one for nine on passes thrown fifteen plus yards down the field, with two interceptions,
one for nine two picks. Those picks were bad. And I had a Bucks ticket yesterday, and I think that game should have been a Rams blowout. There were so many things that happened in that game that kept it close. One of them was, ah, by the way I got on Rams plus three when the Rams were averaging six point seven yards of play and the Tampa Bay Buccaneers were only averaging four point three yards of play. The
score was tied seventeen all you are absolutely right. That should have been a Rams blowout, and had Mitvey not pulled the plug with twelve minutes to go in the game, it would have been. Well, there was a couple. There was a few things. One there was a phantom flag on Jalen Ramsey when the Rams were up seven to nothing and it was a third down on the would have and that and we don't seize enough on these
things after the fact. And I can't prove this to you, but that game could have been completely different without that flag. It could have been the Rams like completely destroying them in the first half then and that was almost like
an arm punched from Brady there on that past too. Yes, and and and there was a couple of times where the Rams had it in high levelge situations in field goal range third and one in the third quarter, they're they're matriculating the ball down the field easily, and then McVeigh calls a run right into a Dominican Sioux they're forced to kick a Matt Gay field goal at misses. And then the final drive where they took the lead
to for good, there was the oddest sequence. They're like running on third and eight at the end, like just very odd. And if he was able to run the ball three times, or if they couldn't run the clock out, it didn't make sense. Brady was always going to get it back with two minutes left, so the run, the run to the weak side there was incredulous. And then they didn't. Here's the thing, the Rams did not run
the football the whole game. Even when they were dominating the game, they were just throwing the cup every single down. And guess what with twelve minutes the oh they were up a touchdown and decided, oh, we're gonna be like a real football team where we're hand off with the lead and try to run the clock out. It didn't work. They gave three drives with nothing. They could have won that game by three touchdowns had they kept throwing the football.
But like an idiot, McVeigh got scared, Like an NFL head coach, you know how they get conservative. And by the way, same thing happened on the third night that you mentioned Gil. Why did he run the ball on that third night? He got scared of golf. Now I understand golf is scary. I wrote on Twitter, I'm taking the rams. I know Golf's gonna shoot his pants and I'm gonna be crying later. But you know you can't run. If you can't run the ball, throw the football, no
one's stopping you. Those are those are bad picks on both sides. That last pick from Brady to to seal the deal, he saw that that safety was right in front of him. He had to see him, and he still threw it. It was picked off um short week for the Bucks. Kansas City minus three and a half is my final pick. If you can beat me, Tampa Bay Bucks tip of the cap, I'll take Patty Mahomes in the Kander Chill. I have a question for you, what what division is Kansas City Chiefs in A West?
And is there a team named the Vic Fangio's in the in the a f C West's correct? I just want to tell you a little story about Vic Fangio. I've never ever won a bet with or against Vic Fangio in my entire life. In fact, he may be the most maddening coach of all time for me, even worse than Anthony Lynn. But this past week, folks, I took the Denver Broncos and they beat a little team. You might know the name of them. That's right, it's the Miami Dolphins. Miami Dolphins. They even gave me a
win against Fangio. How the hell did I got a w with Victor? How did I get a w with Vic Fangio? It's never happened in the past. Yes, well done. Way to wedge that in there time I had to wedge it in people go crazy if I don't get the Miami dol what a division of the Chiefs play? Okay, let me right, U, Chris, you had at that was good for Survivor purposes. Dr called be blott and a question for Mike here because I see Adam Schefter talking about the Ravens had a whole bunch more positive, like,
like what happened? Are there any stipulations in the the circus Survivor? Like if one of these games on Thanksgiving get canceled? Like is it just okay everybody's dealing with the with the same situation, or like what happens if that that Ravens Steelers game can't get played? Or maybe if unfortunately reading the sad news out of Dallas, if something happens with a delay in that game, Like are there any stipulations where the rules might be changed just
extended into the weekend? Excellent questions. I'll say this in the most empathetic way. I can you lose. Anybody that had plays on those teams loses, whether it's Dallas or the game must be finished by two am Friday morning Pacific. That's the rule. You have to pick a winner on Thanksgiving. Um, So it's just like the other weeks, if you had to pick on those on any of those teams, you have to pick a winner, someone that wins. How about if you have a couple of ties on Thanksgiving? That
really interesting as well, and so possible. It's very possible with ten minute over time, it's very possible coming over time three toss up games exactly. The deadline for the Thanksgiving games is okay, ten pm Pacific, you have to get it in pm Pacific and the Wednesday night one am one am Eastern Thursday morning. So don't wait think you can get it in at eight am Thursday. You're gonna get locked out Wednesday night. Make sure you let your proxy know or make sure you get your pick
in yourself. You've said it over under on the number of entries that you don't think we'll get in. Paullie Howard follow the Money Fame, asked me this question Sunday. He said, how many Thanksgiving and wouldn't get in? And now we knew we were down to about two twelve to two oh nine based on the Monday night game. I said, a look at ten out of eleven weeks when everybody knew the deadline was three pm Pacific on Saturday. We had people not get picks in four this past week.
Now we're changing the deadline. I put it at six and a half. Six and a half, wow, I think good number. I think it could go over. I really did if there were just if there's nobody, if everybody gets it, and I'll be very shocked. I would be too. Do you have and this is going to screw them up? Ahead? Sorry, Chris, No, no, no, I was gonna say, do you have any idea? How
many people have multiple entries left? Just to talk about that that taking taking Houston, taking Detroit strategy, Like I'm because I agree, like I think almost at this point, like if you have two left, the idea is to win and if you can advance and guarantee yourself, I almost think you have to sacrifice an entry and take both side. But but do you have, like any idea? Yeah, I have I have an idea. We we know it, right, you can go on and look at it. I think
it's something like twenty six or twenty seven. It's not as many as you'd think, you know, and then and then the majority of hundred and forty or whatever have one entry left. There's a couple with three. No one has more than three. Chris and I have on group text with it with our buddy, though. We were trying to convinced him, like because he's got he's got two, and we're like, you're crazy if you don't do this, and he he may think that we're trying to hoodwink
him or I'm trying to hoodwink only having one in there. Um, but if I had to, that's absolutely how we played. If they were not, if they were not this close up games, right, these three matchups weren't this close, I might say, he's right, I'm all shot. Bought one entry this year and he has it live. Yeah, And he said the biggest gambling mistake he made in recent memories not buying multiple entries in this because he needed to going into into Thursday. He's right, I only bought two
and I regret like getting five. Yeah, alright, I'm not. I'm not making a survivor pick because I genuinely don't know. I genuinely don't know. Favorite six point teaser to team teaser of the week, Chris, we start with you. It's got it. It's I mean, it's got to be the one that everyone's gonna go with, right, is it Isn't it gonna be Rams Packers, Rams Packers, Man, that might be one, might be one Rams Packers, Todd or no key. Yeah,
I'm using the Rams as well. And then I'm I'm I'm sort of torn um, I'm sort of toward on the second one. Uh boy, who are you going with on your teaser? Rams? Packers? Rams? Down to what we're up to? What Rams goes to Rams to one and the Packers going to two and a half? Right, Yeah, Packers goes to and a half. I'll take I'll take the Dolphins down to one. That's what I was doing. Yeah, I'm gonna go Rams Dolphins, Rams Dolphins for me to Todd.
That's exactly Rams Dolphins and Rams Dolphins for Gil. I am going to go with my pick with that I wrote down here is Cleveland minus a half. I know I'm gonna cry when that one doesn't happen. I know it's accident, but I'm gonna do it any Cleveland minus a half and I'm gonna take Green Bay minus too, all right? Uh? Final two questions? Which are the big favorites? Do you think is most likely to lose outright, there's not a whole bunch of these Cleveland. They are six
and a half point favorites at Jacksonville. That's choice number one. Miami, seven point favorites at the Jets, Rams, seven point favorites hosting the Niners, Green Bay eight and a half point favorites hosting these Chicago Bears. Those are your four choices. We're not going to include the five and a halfs
and sixes. So those are your four choses. Cleveland againting to reiterate Cleveland, Miami, Rams, Packers, Chris most likely to lose out right, Well, I took jackson Will plus the point, so I'm not I'll just stick with Jacksonville just because of a lot of respect to half for that Cleveland offense. Right now, Mikey, same Cleveland, Cleveland for sure. For me to todd, uh, you know what, I'm gonna say that
the Miami Dolphins could theoretically lose. I know it's crazy to say, but they've gotten so many you know, all the breaks have been falling for them, and maybe maybe maybe they were playing a little bit, they got got a little bit too far out in front of their skis and they lose the Denver. Maybe the Jets could pull a crazy upset. Who knows. The Jets have looked not terrible. I mean they looked not terrible against New England. They played well in the second half against San Diego
or l A Chargers. It doesn't play well in the second half against the Chargers. Every team in history, no matter how good or bad, they are dominant in the second half against Anthony Lynn. That's a good point. Good point, Mikey, very good point, true Dad, Alright, final question, we lived in a a bizarro world. We have to make a bet on the side, and every single one of these games except for one. Chris, what's the game you'd want no part of on the side? Seattle Philadelphia? No, No, I
want nothing to do with that game. The Eagles are awful. But do you really trust that Seattle Tea. I mean that that that line. I want no part of betting on that game. I think it was Todd that said like that that backdoor could be wide open with how bad that Saddle defense is. At the same time, with how awful the Eagles have been, I could just see them showing up one one game and keeping this game close.
I want nothing to do with the money night game, Mikey, Let's see if we're sitting pout to go on this. This maybe the week we differ. Okay, this may be the week we differ. I'm going Steelers Ravens. That's what I'm doing. I want no part of this. Greg Roman, Okay, he's terrible. He's a one hit wonder. He well, Kaepernick was good for a year with them, and then everybody figured he has no creativity. If you want to run the football, hire Gary Kubiak is your offensive coordinator. Okay.
I can't stand that he should go back to the Holy Spirit and him seeking. I'm done with the Ravens. I can't play him. They dominated this game the first time, and he decided he wanted to make Lamar Jackson a drop back pass her and throw two interceptions. All Right, I can't do it. I can't bet on the Ravens anymore. I'm done with them. I'm not gonna bet gainst him either. I'm off this game. Holy Spirit what Obsecon? Holy Spirit? Obsecon? Yeah, thanks for thanks for leaving the cross at home today.
I was terrifying. What's that? Terrifying? Holy Spirit of Ubsecon. It's the guy that couldn't do it, couldn't do. It's arithmetic. That's what they put in Catholic schools, the curciffect. That's for anybody that doesn't get their addition effects right. Big blood side, Holy Spirit of obsecon over incarnate word tonight in college basketball that should be huge Steelers Ravens for you, Todd, Yes,
Steelers Ravens. I don't want any part of because I think the Ravens should have won the first football game if you watched it carefully. The Steelers were outgained by one point three gazillion yards. But somehow we're able to come up with a Steeler Yinzer victory. On the other hand, who could take the Ravens. Mike just went chapter and verse on that, including some Catholicism that none of us understood, but clearly you can't watch them. So I don't want
any part of this game. I don't know what's going to happen about FeliCa. He said, you know, but he doesn't understand Catholicism. What does that mean what he said none of us understand the Catholicism he was talking about. I'm highly offended about that. St. John. St. John the eventless church and example, New York. Unbelievable. Unbelievable, that aspersion
that he did to you. I am sorry. I will take back that comment because I forgot that Chris is actually an intelligent Catholic and not just a talker of Catholicism, but an actual actor of Catholicism. He's a follower of Christ rather than a talker of Christ. That's the ultimate argument, Todd. Was it faith or good works? Okay, here we go. We could do another hour, but we got a chiropractic, not faith in good works. It's bullshitting and spouting truth
rather than acting truth. You, my friend, are a bullshitter of truth. Christie, actor of truth. Wow, all right, I'm just kidding. Try I try and live, I try and be a good person. I try and act. As as Jews, we had to put our whole lives on somebody to pull something out for us. In a big spot, we'd go with Chris over Mikey. Come on, well, I don't know about that. What do you mean, like in a in a Holocaust situation? Like what are you talking about? Like?
Who was saying Moses, Moses came through in a big spot? Todd? Moses came through in a big spot. I had to put one call. I was talking about, like who's going to make the correct you know, Uber delivery order was talking about. I thought. I was like, Chris, you gotta save me. I got one call to men Mikey or Chris. It's funny. I'd love to I would love to be someone's lifeline on who wants to be a millionaire. I would love to get that call. Oh yeah, I tend.
I tend to think I know a lot of like meetingless ship every now, and that's just random idol like carn events. And in fact it's speaking of uber eats. You you Uber up some mus for peppies for me there, Todd You peppies are from Promote Brothers. Guy. You know, I'm going to tell you a sad story. Since June of twenty one, of two thousand nineteen, I haven't eaten anything delicious, so I can't go to either of those spots,
you know, But my sugar level is down. And even though I haven't played tennis in six weeks because of my hamstring, I've been keeping it under two fifties. So I have to say that's a good news. He was asking for him. You don't have to eat any of it Toime. Oh yeah, I mean I'll take I'll take a Roethelsberger Chiefe steak with some some a couple of goall on there as well. With that, I would go permanties for you, Chris, Like if I had to make you one sandwich for the rest of your life, I'll
go permanies for you. See, my my wife is is a ganger as well, and she's very pro peppies and just like the fries on the sandwiches, big signature move. Where is she from the burg? Where is she? Oh, she's done Fox Chapel and that she's one of them rich girls, probably go to one of them private and that I get it. She's doing undone in Millville or one of them more working class areas. She's hanging out in Fox Chapel thinking she's better than arrest of us.
Don aarony celebrity. I know what it is. Her parents was in the Strip district, so they're they're they're there. Was Todd recting a scene from all the right moves? What was that speech? Was somewhepping my wife? But I think it was ripping my wife. I wasn't. I wasn't. I was just making very wealthy. It's a very very wealthy area in Pittsburgh, and uh, a typical Yanzer would would probably say, oh, those those are rich people think they're better than us than that. All right, we oows
it out. I don't think anybody cares about what game I wouldn't play, but it's probably appropriate to end it with this. The game that I would would stay away from might end up being the game I have to end up picking. In Survivor Houston at Detroit. I would
want no part of this against the spread. And yet I think on Thanksgiving, because I don't have Pittsburgh, and because Washington and Dallas vexes me in in so many ways, and who knows what's going on with the Dallas tragedy, I may have to end up picking for my Survivor life the game I would want no part of it. Here's a question of the two hundred and nine that are left, what will be the most common selection on Thanksgiving Day? Based on percentages of entries left. It will
not be Pittsburgh and Baltimore. It will be Dallas. I think you playing quarterback Gilford Detroit. We think Matthew staff Stafford. I think Stafford he played the entire game with Southern, right, and you're thinking, and you're thinking, you're gonna have to go with Euston. Is that what you said? Oh? I said it one of those two teams. One of those two teams, either Euston or Detroit. Correct. Um, God, I feel bad for you. It's the worst. It's the worst.
Do I mean, what what did Mike and Derek do by making people take one of those two horrible teams on Thanksgiving? Horrible? Did you that's a great question. Did you guys when you made the Thanksgiving rule? Did you consider that these were the exact three matchups? Yes, but here, if we wouldn't have had the million dollar bonus for an undefeated season, I don't think we'd have the Thanksgiving as its own week. See, I think one were trying
to protect the story one led to the other. Well yeah, well yeah, we have a few hurdles, you know, set the bar a little higher. But it's ruined a lot of people's lives. According to some common friend of ours, I mean it's ruined their life. My life is ruined. The whole thing and everything was ever he was gonna win, and if there was no shot, he couldn't go undefeated. But because of this week, it's ruined his whole life. Who said that somebody, somebody that we have we're common with,
that are on different commons text strings with us. It has certainly thrown my life into a spiral. He's cursed Derek an eye for a month about this. Mike, he are you talking about a Stanford graduate? We may know, yes, David Shaw's close friend. Uh, how do you feel about the refereeing last night? Though? It was a historic night, he said, And he was glad it was brought to light and then it was celebrated. And he's just a
little confused about the double pass. Just curious at by the way, I have a great question about the double pass. I was thinking about this. Let me ask you this. This is a serious question. What happens if the ball gets tipped backwards right and instead of now, in this case, Brady just grabbed it and through it, so it was a forward pass. But what if the ball would have got tipped really really far back, like ten yards further backwards, and Brady would have caught the ball and therefore it
would have been a backward pass. Would he have been able to throw a forward pass at that point? No, it's not how far back you hit it. The first motion was forward, Todd. It doesn't matter if they batted it. No. No, Mike, you don't understand my question. You're not understand adding your own question, the dumbest thing you've ever said, how do you define what a backward pass is? Is it a pass that goes forward and then ends up behind where you threw it? Is a backward pass means that it
goes backwards lateral to the line of scrimmage. Right, didn't you see the Music City Miracle. That's the definition of the lateral that I'm coming up with a different scenario where you know you're not throw it forward. Let's say you're standing on you just define your question. You threw
it forward. That is not a backward pass because it is forward one second the ball, the ball lands in somebody's hands back on the fifteen, It couldn't theoretically be a backward pass, even though so once it's a little bit forward, that's the end of it. Yes, correct, Just like once Tom Brady's hand went a little bit forward with the ball in it, it becomes an incomplete pass. The real question because that crew chief Jerome Bogar made a great call whistling it dead. He saw it, he
was looking right at it. And and another thing, you can't replay that because the whistle stops it. There can't be immediate recovery when there's a whistle a tenth of a millisecond after the play happens. Here's the real question on that. On the double pass, when they marked it fourth and two, what if Tampa Bay decided to go for it? Well, somebody asked that question as well. They said what if they went for it and made it?
I think mcphigh would have made an argument. Seriously, this is like when Coarnti in the playoff game in Houston and they they received it and tossed the ball to him. He wanted to call it a touchdown. He want the alternative official head to tell Tony Corenti what the role was. My god, they threw Ben Drife out because he was seventy and they got Coarnti doing every primetime game. What is he got? What is he got pictures of river
On with Donna Ponti? What is going on? By the way, this is why we have to re enact the outcome, not the alcohol of fantastic finished, but the fantastic finishing. Oh, you make the call. That's the best. Here's this duation. I'm gonna set up the situation. Do you remember do you remember to IBM, you make the call? Ben dreyth is the official in tonight's game, Like somebody has back in the NFL office, have pictures of him in a position, what is the call if somebody fumbles inside two minutes?
Do you remember the show on HBO, not necessarily the news face Stewart, they would do takeoffs if you make the call, And they showed a play where the Patriots punted to the Jets. That Patriots had thirteen men on the punting team and the Jets setsteen men on the receiving team. You make the call, and they had been aligned some twenty yards because they had four more over,
there's five yards for everybody over. It was a great show, not necessarily that those are the greatest fifteen seconds of our childhood where you have to make the call in between those that you who he's the alcohol of fantastic don't fantastic finishes? And now I'll go off fantastic finishes. Ready to go, all right, Chris, Chris has gotta go.
You know what? My favorite one was when the Steelers, the Steelers beat the Browns in overtime in nineteen seventy nine on a flee flicker to Benny Cunningham in the end zone in the overtime fifteen nine. Amazing Benny Cunningham, who was the other tight end quick Randy Grossman, a jew who lived literally six blocks from my house where I'm sitting currently right now. That's why on the leaflet, On the leaflet, and on those words, we conclude Chris
has got a doctor's appointment. I get your next fit, Chris Felika for me, s we hads college game day stand receive for the Bear podcast, of course Daily Wager. Thank you, sir. I appreciate it. I had a lot of fun. Let's do it again. Let's do it again. Absolutely, But I want to make a public, formal apology to Mike. I was a little hard on him about his religiosity, and I want to make a public apology because he actually is a good guy and people don't take it
the wrong way. I actually like Mike very much. Thank you. Based on my public image. I must accept your apology. By the way, I've never seen I've never seen you so excited in your life about that referee stuff. It's Coarnti. It's say this is a nightmare, over and over with Coarnti. I mean, he was fine fifteen years ago. He doesn't even know where he's at. He doesn't know what day it is. Every play there's a huddle. He's always confused, he's always cloudy. He's a nice man. He was a
school principal in California. That's all good now, but now he should be an advisor. He can't be on the field anymore. Happy Thanksgiving everybody, Thanks for listening to the BANKAPO. Good luck with all your bets.