Hunters Horn - TN Mountain Bear Hunter Eldridge Cutchall

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their podcast. My name is Clay Nukeleman. I'm the host of the Bear Hunting Magazine podcast. I'll also be your host into the world of hunting the icon of the North American wilderness. Prepare. We'll talk about tactics, gear conservation. We will also bring you into some of the wildest

country off the planet chasing bear. Well. In our family, when my grandfather there died, we started a tradition that anybody in our family that was a hound hunter, when they die, we bring the hunting horn to the graveside service and the last thing we do before we bury them a is my son blows that horn, and it's symbolic to us that as we lay them the rest that we're calling their dogs in the last time. I recently had the opportunity to travel to East Tennessee and

to sit down with my friend Tracy Jones. Tracy Jones is a houndsman, a longtime houndsman, and Tracy took me over to a man's house that he deeply respects and uh and I do, how as well. After I met him, an older gentleman eight five years old by the name of Eldridge cuts you off. Eldridge is a long time Tennessee mountain bear hunter and we we had a conversation

with Eldridge. So the way this podcast lays out is a little bit different than most in that there's a Tracy and I will have a conversation privately before that that that starts the podcast off, and then we'd go into about a thirty two minute interview with Eldridge. This podcast special and you can enjoy it. Check out W Hunting Supply. Buddy Woodbury and his team. These guys and

gals are dedicated to the preservation of hound sports. They're also dedicated to incredible customer service and having the best selection and best prices for all your garment products, all your hound related needs. So check out W Hunting Supply for any of your dog related stuff that you're gonna need. Hey, there's also something pretty cool that happened First Light. Our buddies at First Light the clothing company produced a film called New Cam. Yeah, they came to Arkansas and they

made a film about me. And in the film, we squirrel hunt on mules, we coon hunt, and we uh we deer hunt a little bit. And they they kind of introduced my family. It's just a super well done film. I mean, like the quality of the film, it's incredible. It's done by Jordan Riley Taylor Coleman of Captured Creative And you can check all you can check that film out. It's it's up right now at first light dot com or first Light's YouTube channel. And uh, yeah, you could.

You could support what we're doing here at Bare Hunting Magazine by checking out that film leaving some comments on it. And uh, I was I thought it was pretty pretty important, pretty cool that that we got a hat tip from a big national company like first Light. I mean there's hound stuff inside of there, and and uh and and I hope the film just represents the the hunting lifestyle that a lot of us lead that that listen to this podcast. So check out our buddies at first light

dot com. We just got back from Eldridge Cutshaw's house. Eldridge is eighty five, and uh, a guy like him would have just had a He would have had to have been an incredible athlete. Really, is that a good way to describe it? To hunt these mountains like he had to? Tracy, Yes, sir, I think so. Eldridge. Uh, Like I told you before, I was too young to get to hunt with him and some of the other a whole lot up until you know, I became a teenager.

But my grandpa, my dad, and a lot of other men around here hunted with him, and I always had a great deal of respect for him. So when we talked to month or so ago and you were telling me you weren't want to do some podcasts with some of the old Mountain bar hunters that were the real deal, I was very glad that you were able to get over today and talk to Eldridge, because he he was a real deal. When you say that, what do you mean, Well, I mean he knew what he was doing and he

did it. Yeah. Yeah, he was just good at what he did. Yeah, you a minute ago, he said, I mean, Eldridge was a humble man. He didn't you know, he's getting up in years that he didn't. He he wasn't trying to tell us what a great bear hunter. He was humble man. And uh, you know, a guy like that probably never knew even how unique his life was inside of what he did and how he focused on on bear hunting and and the toughness that it took. And I mean some of these guys probably never even

knew that what they did wasn't normal. Is that a good way to describe it. Well, he was raised in the mountains, so what other people would consider to be extraordinary? And I believe the average person if they followed a man like Eldridge cut y'all, or Layman Rice or another man I knew the name of Carson Landers and other men that I could name who were exceptionally hard goers in the mountains, if they followed them for a day, Um, I believe they would come away understanding that these were

extraordinary men in the environments that they grew up in. Yeah. But those men grew up in the environment and it was an extraordinary to them. Yeah. I mean the elder and said his dad took them to the top of h Can't Creek bald what a lot of people call a Viking mountain and dropped them off, and they were boys, and they coon hunted out the mountain, out the Appalachian Trail and down off the side of the mountain to their home place. I mean that's rough country through there, Yeah,

no doubt. I like what you said there that they they were tough men. I escaped me. What you just said that they that that for the area. They they did what it took to be successful, and they were and they and they they took it serious. And um yeah, well I always have the utmost respect for some of these men, because everybody ought to be honest with themselves.

And I think I can say that I probably enjoy bar hunting as about as much as anybody, but I don't consider myself on the same level or anywhere close to it as some of the people that I had the opportunity to grow up around. I mean a man like Eldridge and again I mentioned Layman Rice and Carson Lander's and my dad was pretty tough. And I mean I could name other people. I mean, I there's a long list I could name. I hate to do that.

I just named a few people that a lot of people around here would say, yeah, they were, they were really tough in the woods. Why. I never put myself in that category, because that would be a lie. But I recognize that when I see it, right, Yeah, what you know, what I think is is unique. Is a guy like Mr Elders is truly the last of a breed. There will never be another generation of people barring and apocalypse and we lose our technology. I mean, he grew

up before GPS. He told us that he didn't have electricity in his house. He grew up running through these mountain mountains chasing these dogs on foot, and that produced a certain skill level that you can't attain unless you have to do that. I mean, I have no problem I coon hunt in Arkansas. I have no problem saying that. If it weren't for garments, I probably wouldn't be a coon hunter. I mean, we coon hunted without those when I was in high school, and we didn't know any different.

But today it's changed me, you know, And and in some ways there's some positive of that, but in a lot of ways there's there's negative. So what we're just saying is that these guys were a different breed and there's there's not a lot of them left. Well, I think we're in a position right now, at least here in the area where we live where the old timers, they're real what I call the real hardcore bear hunters that you know, lived and breathed in the mountains and

that was their sort of their natural environment. They're fading away, which is why I thought it was important for you to go talk to Eldridge. And I know maybe another manner too that I'd like for you to be able to talk to along those lines. And then there's some men that I know personally now and I'll hold off on missing the names. They probably wouldn't want me to

mention their names. That I grew up with those people, and they're really were really tough, I mean really tough in the mountains, but they're now hitting their late sixties, early seventies, and not not too many men can really handle the mountains outside of their late fifties, the sixties and mid sixties at really point. I'm not that you can't go to the three, but there's a difference between a man in his peak when he's thirty five versus

time you get sixty in his mountains. Like you can go someplace where it's flat, like you know, Wisconsin or Michigan and other places, and it's really great hunting, but you don't have the elevation climbs. Yeah, and it's the elevation wires on you, I think when you get older. Yeah, yeah, what do you what do you think The big takeaway from all this is because you know, I think about it, I've I've always appreciated older people. I mean ever since I was a little kid. I I just appreciate it.

I think I got I think my dad instilled that in me. He he turned our gaze towards older people and I saw him give them respect. And so, aside from just a hat tip to an older man that's been there before, what can we take away from these guys lives, Tracy? Aside from just yes they were Yes, they were tough. Yes they had to endure hardship. We're not gonna go back and hunt the way they did. Just like I said, I mean, nobody's gonna get rid of their garments and nobody's gonna So what's what's the

what's the takeaway like for for us? Well, I think the only thing that makes life worth living is for some things to be sacred. Like the relationship between a man and his wife is sacred, So that makes life worth living if that relationship isn't sacred and takes the value out of it. Um, your relationship with God, if you have a personal relationship with him that's sacred to you. That's why you don't want to dishonor that relationship with God and Uh. I think part of the sacredness of

life is honoring your elders. Any society that doesn't have a huge respect for its ancients is basically doomed because you you learned neither from their successes, nor you you you don't learn from their failures. Mhm. So you're gonna have the same problems that they had without any recourse. I mean, you're not gonna learn from them whatsoever. Last night, last night I was dealing with at church. I was in a passage where David was running from Saul and Uh.

In that passage, one of the things that David referred back to was something he had learned from one of the ancients. He had an opportunity to kill Saul and didn't take it, and he said one of the things that stopped him was specifically something he had been taught by the ancients that had to do with not taking vengeance. And I really made a big deal out of that church because I think as a society we need to slow down and reintroduce our young people to their elders.

They need to know their grandfather and their grandmother, and if they have one of great grandfather and grandmother. They need to know their older uncles and their older aunts, and they need to know the older people in their community, in their church, and they need to be taught that those people are valuable, that they're not just old people that can't do anything anymore, and they need to learn what those people have done and have respect for what

they've done in the difficulty. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, I think the what I heard elders say, I kept prodding them, saying, hey, can you think of a story or can you think of a uh what was the most meaningful parts of your bear hunting? That he said he wouldn't trade anything for what he learned. That was what he said. I mean, you know, you can tell elder just getting to the point where life's kind of becoming,

it's kind of distilling down into the essentials. And he kept going back to the relationships that he built inside of hunting. Did you notice that it did? I did that kind of surprised. Nine out of ten, how people you talk to you asking why you hunt, they're gonna say the dogs. Some of them wouldn't even hunt if if it wasn't for the dogs. But elders kept saying his friends, his buddies, and and naming them, and the and the friendships and the joy he had with those people.

And I think that's what I think that's a little different about elders from a lot of folks well, But I think what he tapped into there is something that is sometimes wrongly skewed inside of people where rather and those relationships being healthy, those relationships become competitive or there's

jealousy or something. But I was talking with a gentleman yesterday right here in Tennessee, and essentially we came to the same place, was that the relationships that were built through whatever medium you know, I mean inside of the bare hound world. You can't do it on your own. No man is an island if he's gonna be successful. And last we talked about that with hounds and breeding

stuff and and you depend on people, you can't. You can have the best dogs in the country, the truck full of them and go out in these mountains just you and your gun and that truck full of dogs, and you're not probably gonna kill very many bear, Am I right? I mean it takes it takes a lot of people. In in what we distilled down and what I saw inside of this this gentleman I was talking to, was that he valued those people. He actually teared up. He shed a tear on our podcast talking about some

of the men that he'd hunted with. When he was thinking about the ones that we're already gone, he he said, a couple of times I miss them. Yeah, the elders didn't the yeah yeah. Well to me, what that does as a middle aged man here a few years ago, I would have thought I was young, but now I'm

officially in the middle age. In the middle is that we can get so focused on on the on the fruit, on the product of what we're doing, you know which obviously I'm here because I like bear dogs and bear hunting. That's what drew me and you together. That's the reason I'm in East Tennessee. So that there there always is

a thing that you're after. But what it makes me do is I want to slow down and pay more attention to the to the relationships that I've got with people, and make sure that I'm not burning over stuff in pursuit of and in goal. And then when I'm eighty five, I look back and realized I had a lot of burned bridges or or I hadn't fostered a relationship, because ultimately those people are what give value to what you do.

I mean, in my bare hunting, if I could tell no one what I did, I probably I don't know if I would do it or not. I mean, as much as there's an inner desire and this native desire to hunt, a lot of the value that comes from hunting comes from sharing it with people. You know. I think one of the most important things out of listening to him today is not something he said, and it's something that your listeners won't be able to see. And that was the joy on his face when he was

talking about it. I mean you could tell that there. His face just was like gonna glow because of how much he and Alder, how fun it was him. And he said, if you can't have fun, stay home. Yeah. Yeah, you know, his face really did light up. He had he had bright blue eyes, didn't he and he uh, when he smiled, you could it was almost like he was young. You It's like he he was kind of this old man and then when he smiled, he just

kinda he kind of lit up. But well, I think there's I'm continuing to search for for why I have

why I placed value on guys like him. Well, I think one of the difficult things about being middle aged, like you're you were talking about earlier is the men that you grew up with and that you respected, and that that you think a lot of some of them have passed away, and some of them are nearing that place, and you're finally old enough to realize what a privilege it was to grow up around these men, and that kind of been because they're they're scarce in our society,

and those kinds of men are scarce. Yeah, And I think about it, and I think about you know, it's hard to watch the old bulls go down. It's hard to watch the old lines go down. But then again, what a privilege it was to live with them. And we may never be exactly the kind of men they are, but at least we knew them. Mm hmmm mm hmm. And I think for for our time though, we can be, you know, I mean, we we live in a whole different set of challenges, Tracy, and you know it, we've

talked about it than they did. I mean, so inside of the challenges that you know, they challenged, they were challenged by the physics coal elements and the toughness of life and poverty and and big mountains and and our challenge is now different, but we still have the opportunity to walk through life in a noble way. And you know, so, I mean, I see I see these old guys, and I'm like, I want to be like them. Not I won't be. I won't. I won't be just like them

because my life was different. I grew up in a different time. But I wanna. I want to be honorable when I'm old. I want to have given my best. I want to have, you know, lived ultimately lived a life that I felt like was pleasing to God. Well, I like the the series or whatever you call that you're doing here where you're finding these older men and getting them recorded so that we have them have it saved. Yep. Well, hey, thank you for thank you for for hosting today. I

really appreciate it. You're welcome. I joined it. Yeah, as you walk into Mr Eldridge's house, he's got some bear mounts, he's got bare hides, he's got some old, old, tarnished deer antlers around. It's a place where you know you're walking into the house of somebody who's dedicated their life to the outdoors. When you look off his front porch, you can look about about eight miles and you can see big Appalachian mountains. One of the mountains, this Viking mountains,

and those are the mountains that Eldridge hunter. And uh. He said that he could blow his horn off his front porch and those dogs could hear him from eight to ten miles away blowing his hunter's horn, and those dogs would come back. You're gonna appreciate Eldridge cut you

off well. In our family, when my grandfather died, we started a tradition that anybody in our family that was a hound hunter, when they die, we bring the hunting horn to the graveside service, and the last thing we do before we bury them is my son blows that horn. And it's symbolic to us that as we lay them the rest that we're calling their dogs in for the last time. So you could hear it for a long ways. Huh ten miles you think you can? Wow? Did you

use you use one of those to call your dog? Yeah? Yeah? Tell me about these horns? What did people use them for? Well? Mostly it was back years ago as fox hunters that used them, and they use them to call their dogs in whenever they was done hunting. You know, no GPS, no telemetry, and they could blow their horn and call the dogs in, just like Eldridge just said that from his yard. You could hear this, he said, all the way to Old Forge. And that's what ten mile across

their Old Forge. Really you could hear that for ten miles. Well, they carry through the mountains. Mm hmm. Right, what what county are we in? Are we in Greene County? Greene County, Tennessee, which borders North Carolina. Yeah, it's across the chepd Well shut that door. Just across the top of that mountain's North Carolina and North Carolina. So we're in Greene County, Tennessee, near Greenville, and I'm here with with Mr Eldridge, Cutshall

and Tracy Jones. Uh. Tracy has been on the podcast before. We we talked with him last year. But thank you so much for letting us come and visit with you, Mr Eldridge. Really a pleasure you come. You come, highly spoken of. Bye bye Tracy for sure. Tracy, Why don't will you tell me how you know Mr Eldridge? Well, I know Eldridge through my Papal and my daddy. They

hunted together back years ago and for a long time. Yeah. Yeah, And so you told me something on the way here that most of the people that would have bear hunted with hounds and this part of in this part of the country, in this county, would have would have learned to bear hunt from from from Barry Tarlton, your grandfather, and uh Industry, Eldridge and who else. Well, I'm putting

words in your mouth. Yeah. Yeah, I wouldn't say everybody, but I think a lot of people around here would say they got to start with Eldridge or Layman Rice or very Trout and one of the three. Yeah, not everybody, but a lot, wouldn't you say a lot of them didn't care. Yeah. When did you start bear hunting back when early twenties? Yeah? Yeah, I was about twenty one years old. Were there many people bear hunting at that time? Say? Well, people, but there wasn't many. Bar Yeah, if you found one,

your mister stafters or somebody else to get him. Yeah, but I've killed it with I've killed bar with a stick, m the pole out t smoke cost and boys put it and brought it back from Canada. I want to knocked to death on the more green liquor bottles and put up. I put a rope on it to drag it out, and they come back to I got that pole and he didn't get up in a more Oh man, So did did you not have a gun with you? I didn't have it. Use the green liquor bottle. That's

the first for me. How about you, Tracy? I knocked it out? So how did you? Uh? How did you get your start in bear hunting? Like? Where did you get your dogs? And and how did you get going? My dad in law all the cash I and had two walker dogs. He told me said, if you want two bar dogs, you better get to him off Junior rash my brother in law. I gave him thirty five dollars for both of them. My neighbor was burned dog. They trained her step in a reserve. M hmm. There

you go on running a while and come back. What kind of dogs were they? Are? Box dogs and walkers? Yeah, rossed. A lot of guys were using just running dogs back in those days. He's running it, said, use it, yeah to me, I don't care if it's a fistfaire running barr He was a protector. I get tickled at m hm. He's want to put it in the back history fish white suld get them more wide and hare on my doll. Uh everybody him dead mm hmm. But that's part of our own fun. You didn't have a fun, You're better

all home. Yeah. Yeah, So what you're describing to maybe somebody that wouldn't understand bear hunting. This that Mr Barry like hunting plothounds. He had a specific breed of dog that he liked, and and and so you guys gave each other a hard time about the different breeds. Yeah, yeah, farm and he had done what kind of was gypsy? I don't know. She was a good dog, bar do We got her own bar right now. She'd run a deer.

I told clave when we passed Lehman's house that that was one of the hardest bear hunters that I ever knew. Mr Elders what to to go back to a little bit of history on you. What kind of work did you do? Farm motion, cattle farms or what kind of farming? Really? Dairy farm right here? Yeah, so you were born and raised in Green County, So did that a lot. You

a lot of time to hunt. We're we're sitting in your living room here and I'm seeing uh, mounted deer, lots of Tennessee mountain bucks, looks like bear hides you. You you got to do a lot of hunting. Yeah, what was your what were you most passionate about? Inside of inside of hunting? Hunting or forward? You like hearing those dogs run, didn't you? I still do? Yeah? I just hear him no wrong, I don't care if I

never killed and he shows of dogs round. You pointed out that barrel there on the wall before Clay started talking to you there a few minutes ago, and you said, that is that the first barrier you ever killed? Them? There? What's what's the story on that one? Over fifteen and three quarter years old? M hmm, that's what the biologist told you. What year was that? Sixties? Yeah? Killed in Northern Branche find Camp Creek cool, just right up the

creek from behind where the whole plot days now? Okay, okay? What was that the first bear that your dogs ever caught for you in tree and you were able to kill or did you? Did you kill that bear in a different way? Wasn't the first and I don't know how many of the treat before they treatch ovel before. I just got to the three first and heared it. Okay, yeah, well our northern branch spring, there's waterfall. Hey, come around into that waterfall. Come around where I was at. I

shot it. He went straight down and come up. It's like it went down, and I showed it again. It went straight down. Show it three times and he stuck his head drive between each SAgs. Come and roll with me like a baseball. I thought, if you roll down here and open your mouth, I'll focus gun and you to the mouth and putrity an old sound bar. And then besides it was killed on Viking Terry mounted it. You're talking about my dad. Okay, okay, these mountains are

pretty rough. You you must have been in really good shape and can move around these mountains pretty good. Yeah I could. I told him today. GPS, that's cheating. Hmm. We didn't use to album. Yeah, we went on foot. Yeah, of course the GPS is all right, my favorite using right, use them to get in front of the bar and get it. How did you use to navigate the mountains without you just you just had to know the mountains you can't beat anybody on our own land. I'll kill fit, sir.

I don't care what I ever, carol or not. There's a cowts and stuff and it's gonna take over. You think they're they're hurting part of the hurting the bear. You think, yeah, hungle identifying or eating a game. My ash up from my hut, from my bar. But there everywhere. Now bar is out in the country everywhere. How how did you used to find a bear track? Now? Now there's so many bears, it's it's a little bit easier to to find a track. How would you guys hunt?

Just get us a dog and hit that trail? So just on foot, free casting the dogs, leading, leading that dog, leading the dog. You're don't on the track directly, sometimes you wouldn't, So you would you'd take a good trail dog or cold nosed dog or a couple and just head off in an area that you felt like was good. Yep. What would you do after you found the track? Eldridge, Bring some more dogs, turn them all those you're a racketan m h. And then you'd have to follow him

just by by sound? Is that right? See the byre Sensual worries just on the left, right up that road, die Horse Creek, n Squib Creek, cash in on and we have turned the dolld loos and Green Mountain and pick them up rocking for same day. How far is that long way? How many miles on foot would you walk on a in a day on a bear hunt in these mountains? I'd say five or six mile anyway? Yeah, maybe more. I bet it was more, but I wouldn't take nothing. I wanted to learn. Were up bur in Canada.

Me and Malvin i Am went around on backside of Downe. You just take your dogs up burning, turning loose, and they don't know what they come out are with. He turned them loose and calling them all, all of them but one as burries. Hey run out built by. It's hard to catch them all. Mm hmm. I told him, I said, I'll catch you. I called it. I went to the spanisyard. I come out. Why I didn't come back out the way I went in. But that Federal was a giving burry down the road. He was a

customer going on, but they didn't boiler burry. And he just ain't gonna be cooled off a little. He ain't eating a hand before we left. That's kind of man burnt out. What was that doubt running her faults? Yeah, that's true, red talk. Mm hmm. What what are some of your favorite memories of bear hunting are? Yes, being

around my buddies. Yeah, I mean, Sam, you know, I hear inside of the hound hunting community, there's a there's a unique thing that's not in all of big game hunting, and that is there's a lot of deep relationships that are built between people. I mean. And not to say that there's not those friendships built and other kinds of hunting, but to be a successful bear hunter, you're you usually hunting with other people. And if you're hunting with those people,

they're gonna be like minded people with you. They're gonna be people you trust. There's gonna be people that you value. And yesterday we were talking to an older gentleman that was a bear hunter, and after talking to him for an hour, that's the conclusion that I came to was just hearing him talk was a lot of the value inside the hunting was was his buddies as the people that he spent his life, you know, breeding dogs with and and hunting with. And would you would you agree

with that. Yeah, yeah, what was your favorite? Now you ever had eldrie? I guess that I've had some good dogs. H walk dog. Hey, folks, he as you catch it? Is this him right here? When you're called rock? He bought you. He bought me if I whipped another dog and he could get to me, he bought me. He took up for read bassies? Is that right? What did you like best in a good bear dog? What would be how would you describe one? If you were describing a dog to somebody that didn't know anything about bear

hunting with hounds? What would you describe the traits that you'd want to see in a good bear dog? And stick with you? I had a red tick one head or busted or inside through the vet, and they sold it up and that told me, he said, now you may go get that dog and are being land are dead And that's what will happen under one day. I want to get her next day start and she's laying her dead. Hmm, she's really all. It takes a lot of a lot of drive these dogs have to have,

isn't it. I come to her quitting that time, not all that red tick? Do you think the dogs that folks are hunting today are as good as the ones that you used to hunt? Or do you think the older dogs are better than what they're hunting now? Elder? The ones now are better? No older? I guess because they're honey more. I ain't got long enough season here game Morton says, we're not killing enough bar but to see Nat long enough and he's a mountains of getting

ticket her. So you think that people used to hunt more, They used to hunt for longer periods of time, so their dogs dogs had a chance to be better. Yeah, more you hunting, the better do they get? Yeah? How did you? Was talking about your buddies a few minutes ago? Who were some of the people you hunted with? It? You really had a good time with your daddy, all right, I've only with a lot of good people. You ain't gonna agree all time. When when is the last time

you hunted? Did you? Did you keep dogs and hunt until just recently? I got rid of my dogs? Is that right? I've got one? Somebody run over broke both fine lads courting there the two thou dollar red bill? M hm. So you stay around though, Okay, so you still got one? You still like to get out and listen to when you feel like it. So you're still getting out and driving around, listen to some of the races around five, I can get out, I wire. Yeah, you coon hound a lot too, didn't you on a coon?

Would you use the same dogs or different dogs? I am not learned it. Do you think they know when you turn them loose at night? The tricon? Yeah? No, smarter than people think there are. Yeah, I've walked from Viking down to the old home place, just hitting best a little before day line and get up marking next day. You walk from your home place up to backing back. My dad takes the where and let us out. We coon up back from the top down, from the top down.

Would you go out to the Apple Lachian Trail and then go down Jenn's Creek helf? Is that well by miles? It ain't that many miles a minute? Be pretty red climbing up and down them? Rege? How many coons would he get on a hunt like that? One? Really? Just maybe just get one stay out all night long? That was the coon worth quite a bit? Back down a coon hide? Oh it wasn't. What kind of lights would you use? Lantern? M you carry a rival with you old cone here, gould on Greek chill another they travel

wrong way? Bob, Bob, catch horse? Thing you get after hard to tree, you jump out when you get down there. Mm hmm. Did you ever catch any I crost to in my life? Mm hmm. How did your deer hunt? All these deer? Did these deer come off public land around here? Just go and sit down, be quiet and be still? Yeah? Pretty simple. Yeah. Did you like to hunt? What kind of areas were you looking for? Would you hunting gaps on top of the mountain or most time

by hey for you? Mm hmm. What kind of rifle did you carry bar hunting the l did you raymond like two twenty grain bullet that's like throwing them be grock and a little wrong. Did you use a lever action or a bolt action? Automatic? Automatic? Stay up? God? Yeah? Did you carry the same rifle deer hunting? Iron sights? Yeah? Well, h but the scope on it's look too if it's got orange or not? And I had to see through

mounts drop down. Mm hmm. What was the story you told me that time, elder you about the bargains kill back on the lake. Oh? We went to Parama. Your papa had left, can come home. May ain't killing and everybody we turned loose something run off and leave us. I told Bill Carner, I said, now take him old dogs or turn them loose first, and I'll take him one to don't pack good when they're getting here, and I'll turn them loose. And I did, and we got to kill him. Heard have me would kill and the

person they run we got away from us. There's no rock quarry there. I cleaned up on top that rock quarry. I thought I heard my head downs from the siret. I told him hard on radio and told him I believe I've found him. I went on to the next to the ridge, sat down from me another siarette. Now here I'm playing. When I got there, laden dog dead and Bill Carter's dog. I couldn't find that in mine. I'd drive back a candy and get him. And all right, I started down the side of the lower I shout

that one out. I started down the side of the lake and the beaver day I'm gonna get across on and he knowing that nick away down as a maker doll. My walk where you jump at it me a shit And he blue Gratt in that lake. He going and saw him back out. He run that neck down just to trying to get him a dog. When he did, I'll let him have it. He fell in the lake hard. He didn't sink much, pretty shadow. Did you hunt anywhere outside of here except other than can Did you go

to New Mexico or out there? One time? They're off left hand Mexico City? How how did that happen? Well? I drove, but one of the I told him, I said, don't run off and let me it's it's carry the hype brother. I took it out to she really place to fix it, and rests are gonna wait. Start that store, I thought. While I I was out there, I went to the bathroom and they just come out and got in the vehicle left. I got on some night pull inn I how to say be? I got on that

radio now horror hoop to holler. Finally Burry here and me and he said, who you know here? Knows us? So and Layman come back and got me. So they y'all went out there bear hunting, and you're you were driving two separate vehicles. And but but they they left and your car was broke down they took her privately, investigators trying to trap us into settle them buire parts their car. Can you tell me about that? They come here and rid me my right? I said, I don't

care you right my rights. I ain't got nothing, ain't done nothing. I never did hear tailor them no more. They sort of trickings into getting out there and then trying to set you up. Didn't yeah done. And that was during the time when they were trying to tracy what they were. They were trying to catch people selling bare parts, and so they sent private like undercover guys into some of these areas call bladders, and so this guy kind of became your friend here. I didn't trust

him really right off the bat. You didn't trust him. You can tell hey, get drunk, come in drunk everything. And then so once you got out there, what did he how How did you guys know that he was trying to set you up? All right? Taylor? Now he was acting blood You can't tell mhm. But I never did saying it or nothing. You didn't have anything to hide. I stayed all night in their car had tore up on top of that mountain. I stayed all night and that time slept under two sleeping bays and then them

do it that way. That that was coming back in years ago where they would catch some people, you know, like they ought to from, you know, doing something that was illegal. Then a lot they did would just set people up and trap them. I am, and he got lost up our candle was I need give up? He just give up. Pull that sweater down over his head to keep them flows o head. Finally got we finally got him. He got lost. You get turned around very careful.

There's no GPS back then or nothing. You have a compass, wasn't it. We didn't need our compass all right? That peeddlers wore. We stayed. He's a German or partner or some kind. He told us to get us to take guide. He always he The next day he left, which somewhere when you come back, I didn't know. We got a rug that made out how did hang up in the tree, and I know, naming them kill He looked at us and he said, well you crazy. He's something to beaches.

I'll never forget it, baby, and people wearing irish theyver come out. He couldn't believe y'all went back in that could he he couldn't believe it. M I never did worry about getting lost. If you're keeping pictured in your mind, you turn right and left turns. I'm in. You know you won't get lost from back way went. So you never had any trouble with directions like that. So you just you envisioned, you just kind of kept track of what you did. It was that simple. Huh, you're looking

at Matt first. I didn't have him ap you earlier. You said you wouldn't. You wouldn't trade anything for the For what you've learned out bear hunting? What what was your favorite part of it all? Listen to people, don't car I guess really just enjoying yourself. I had a good bunch hunt with. What did you learn about a bear? Be careful watching your flights of bar If you get him down, don't let him up. We will hurt you.

Did you ever get hurt by a bear? No? And I have shot him just I'm shot him more that there's big gutting down here. I don't know how many I've killed That way seem like when you shoot one, don't get it right there. It had come towards you every time. What would you say to young bear hunters these days. What advius would you give them? You learned by listening with a lot of stuff. Pay attention to your dogs. It's good advice for him. Dogs can smell

that barn, you can't. Yeah, and check and make sure you drive from bar mm hmm. Well, any are there any other stories you'd like to tell us? Can thank you? Yeah, I'm pretty sure they are if I can thank yeah. Yeah, Well, thank you for letting us come and talk to you today. You're welcome, appreciate it. Tracy, can you can you think of anything? Yes? Yeah, we've killed barn? The hell bind that bar? Mhm, Well, thank you so much for letting

us come in our pleasure to talk with you. And uh, you're what you did as a young man and was just throughout your life was it was something that not a lot of people, not a lot of people have done hunting these mountains in this part of the country, rough country. A real bear hunter, that's that's that's a valuable thing. I think was you. Was your dad a dog hunter too, elder Yeah, he like couna I've been hunting with. Started out with ms little retread possum down right.

Now we'll blow old home play he climbatory and put the postum in shack and not let the dogs buy it. You know on TI I secured the death read something to get me? Mm hmm. That's how little? When you were growing up? Did you have electricity? And uh what year were you born in? Did you have electricity at your house when you were born? No? Ready to put in? Did you have an indoor bathroom or our house? Would your daddy a farmer? Two? Is that how you may live in? Yeah? And here's an all time sriff And

like Burie, I didn't know it. And Bury's big buddies. What was your daddy's name? He love Joy? Love Joy? Really that's one word two two together. I mean hello Joy mh. I'll be darn. He's party Indian jerkey. I don't know, just partying. And all I know she said your daddy used to hunt down moonshine steels and you used to make it, so I guess, uh yeah, Well, thank you for taking the time to talk to us today. I really do. Thank you. Thank you,