Special Episode: AR 15 Alternatives

spk_0:   0:01
Hello, everybody.

spk_1:   0:02
Hello, everybody. And welcome to the show The Big Show, the largest show that is recorded in our car, salty and spice with you. It's the three b y podcast, and we are again on the road, heading out for an event on a beautiful Sunday afternoon. We're going to do a little work in an event. That's what the things we do. So welcome to the show today. I want to talk about something that will, in a sense, border on politics a little bit. But we're gonna stay strictly away from the political end of things. Except for a brief analysis of what I think a current trend is now are one confirmed political stance. At three. Be wise. We are pro Second Amendment, period, and that's just it. We all are. All the staff members, every one of its own firearms were all firearms people, and we believe that it is. You know, I could read the Constitution just fine, and I see what it says in the Second Amendment. So that's our one political stand, and we're not We're not gonna apologize for being pro Second Amendment, so,

spk_0:   1:25
but it is what it is

spk_1:   1:27
we're looking at a float. I'm looking at a flooded farm field that really isn't shouldn't be flooded. But anyway, driving down the road Beautiful sunny day. And, uh, right now, as we're recording this, I don't know when it layer, but right now, when as we're recording us, we're not too horribly long past the most recent school shooting in Florida and in this school shooting the perpetrator used in a r 15 were kid legally purchased. It interesting to note, though, for all the people who are clamoring about banning quote unquote high capacity magazines, which they aren't high capacity than normal capacity but high capacity magazines. The kid in Florida did not use quote unquote high capacity magazines. He used 10 round magazines. That's just enough. Why I so the whole limiting the amount of damage that could be done? Well, maybe not so much. Now there's more of an argument. Could be made from Los Angeles shooter, the guy with the bump stocks who just sprayed a large concert crowd for a long time. He had, uh, you know, it is what it is, and he was using. He was actually I believe if I recall correctly using high capacity magazines 101 100 round magazines. Now there's no way you could justify that from not being a high capacity magazines. 100 rounds is a lot of bullets, so I took a drink of my energy live ation. You could hear about that in a different story. We have all three b y, but it was weird that we're here to talk today about some alternatives. If things go south and the availability of our fifteens and similar guns at K 40 Sevens becomes difficult now, there's 22 things we need to look at on that side from the political aspect of it. Again, I'm not gonna talk about the rights and wrongs or anything like that. I'm just gonna talk about what I see out there is that there are several states that are moving to strengthen bands or in fluent bands that are already existing and or bringing bands into it to make the ownership and or transfer of guns with certain aspects illegal. I have not read a confiscation ban that would that would be hard, but I've seen the transfer bands big talked about. Now here's the thing. Some of the stuff they talk about is eyes is patently ridiculous. My favorite. One of the my favorite thing about the assault weapons ban that that was done in the Bill Clinton era was one of the features they banned. Where is the sale of guns with bayonet mounts? Think about that.

spk_0:   4:49
I worry about bayonet charges every day.

spk_1:   4:53
I mean, really, when's the last time you've heard of somebody getting involved in a mass band ending? Where do they come up with this stuff?

spk_0:   5:03
Peanuts look scary.

spk_1:   5:04
The pistol grip? Yeah, cause it's a grip because yeah, because it

spk_0:   5:11
might be able to hold onto a gun if you had a pistol grip. Yeah, well, the people writing the legislation don't know a heck of a lot about what they're writing legislation about, so they just go for things that look scary. Here's I've never actually used a bump stock, but frankly, I think they look like the best way to miss your target and spend more time changing magazines that you need to for effective shots that I've seen in a long while. I think it would degrade the effective ist. I'm guessing

spk_1:   5:43
the local a friend of mine, a local gun store owner of the guy we shop with all the time had something funny to say about bump stocks, he said. Two things. One. I love them because I saw more ammo because people have to. The only actual real use for a bump stock that I've ever come up with is they make a lot of fun and a bachelor party, But other than that, they're not very useful.

spk_0:   6:09
I have a friend who goes out after Easter every year slaughters the Easter eggs.

spk_1:   6:17
Oh, yeah, she just she has fun with that. She blows him to Smith Re,

spk_0:   6:21
since the goal is not actually efficiency, but rather just making a heck of a noise and a big explosions of shell fragments. Cheap

spk_1:   6:33
chocolate Easter egg buddies, the hollow ones.

spk_0:   6:35
Yeah, and if they say milk, chocolate flavor, that's probably the best use for them. Yes, because if you can't actually call it milk chocolate, you're doing something wrong

spk_1:   6:50
anyway, pressing right along. Yeah, so you know, you've got the things that that gun grabbers stupidly look for. And again, I'm Second Amendment that says our this is our one political stance. So, you know, if you don't like it now. That's too bad. Like a pistol stock like a flash hider

spk_0:   7:12
like needing to use a bullet, too. Dude Assembly, darling. Yeah, I've always found

spk_1:   7:20
some of this stuff is just just

spk_0:   7:22
ridiculous. Sooner or later, it will probably happen certainly in some jurisdictions that your ability to buy AR fifteen's and similar kinds of weapons does effectively decrease. And today is about alternatives to fill the same basic mission,

spk_1:   7:43
even if it's becomes totally impossible to get a semiautomatic firearm. That can hold a magazine that is larger than 10 rounds, which is the goal because even even a gun like the Ruger many 14 which was not under the assault weapons ban it is. Every pit is deadly as an heir. 15 everybody. I mean, you get a 30 round magazine for it just fine. It's the same bullet coming out the same length barrel. It's there's just no functional difference between many 14 in Air 15 they have different stocks, different styles, but functionally the same gun. But even then, if it's if they ban, you're gonna have, you're gonna have options you're gonna look at. So let's talk about everybody's first thought always goes to the old S K s, the S K s back in the day of the assault ban. Es que ESAs word dirt cheap. I mean, third sheep. Are you sitting down? She said,

spk_0:   9:00
sitting down. I'm in the car

spk_1:   9:01
was 19 91 92. Something like that. I, uh, went into my local gamble's store were trying to tell you How are you this Watch any interactive guns? Always Old hardware stores had a record guns. And on that rack of ghosts, he had a military surplus s chaos in pristine condition. I mean, this gun looked brand new and he always kept one or two cheap gums in the store. And it is a 1953 tool Arsenal, Russia S K s. I think it's 53 home, and I think I've got a lot of guns, but I think that was a 53. Is a Russian? It's a tool up. Um, it's got the milled receiver on it like the leader's Chinese stamp rolls. Um, no, I don't know. Maybe he said that I don't know if they all have stamped receivers getting it mixed up anyway. Sorry I was driving through a town. We said to that one it, but it does. It has

spk_0:   10:22
really appreciate him paying attention to things when he's driving.

spk_1:   10:24
I was actually driving there for a minute. I was thinking about the A K 47 thing. I was, but it was a beautiful gun. Gorgeous. Got 69 bucks out the door. Standard stock standard 10 round internal magazine. Stripper clips. I bought that. And then I bought Oh. What was it? Spam can of Com block. Corrosive. Some 0.62 by 39 ammo. She threw it. And you know what? At a lot of fun with that gun in that cheap ammo. 69 bucks. How work? Yeah, What's that got today? 506 $100? Because you can't buy them in America anymore. There's zillions of these s K ass is what you can, but you can't import of it. Let me rephrase that You can buy him, which can import resilience of these s gases. But they are ridiculously expensive today. I mean, I've seen the Yugo versions with the grenade launcher junk on the front of over $400. Good gun. But they got the great Dr junk, and then recently they were able to several of the imports were able to come up with some really old and beat the snot Chinese versions that sold for about $300 for an old beat up gun. What makes this gun different than the A K 47 is the standard version Now. They did make a version that had removed magazine, but the standard version does not have a removal magazine. It has a 10 round internal magazine. Now you can get after market magazines for it. I have had some of those. I never really liked him You could get.

spk_0:   12:18
Why didn't you like him?

spk_1:   12:19
I found them difficult to insert, difficult to pull out, and they tended to jam a lot. And my biggest thing about firearms is when I pulled the trigger, I want them to go bang. I think that's a reasonable

spk_0:   12:36
Yeah, if you need it, you going to do.

spk_1:   12:39
But anyway, it's an option for people who are concerned about having firearms that are less likely to be banned. The S. K s. In Canada, these things are still sold for a song because they could get him from China they don't have that import man. Of course, the United States is not going thio A They're not gonna do away with that. Important. If they did, I tell everybody to go out by several s. K s is if we get back down to $150 or less. Goodbye. Several. All right, that's an option. What are the other options of things? Goods that are probably unlikely to be banned. Well, there's a lot of higher end semiautomatic options out there. The Browning automatic rifle and its descendants. But those could be really expensive. And depending on the gun, he could fall under the band if it had been on how it have they, huh? How the magazine situation works. It depends on the band to I mean, of the Ruger Mini 14 may or may not fall under any man. If you're gonna ban in a r 15 you should definitely ban on many 14. I mean, they just the same effectiveness

spk_0:   13:57
doesn't mean they will. Of course,

spk_1:   13:58
I don't mean it will. So what else is out there? Well, my first thought would be to go with something along the lines of a Henry Big boy in pistol caliber. And before you just go, you know you think about this for a minute. You get it in one of the Big Mac. Just take a 44 Magnum, for example. You get one of these, Henry, big boys, and you've got it. Depending on the model, you get a 16 or 20 inch barrel and you get a 44 magnum shell coming out of that barrel. You're talking about a gun that, for short range work 150 yards or less, is a devastating weapon. Does that 44 Magnum around is the real deal even 3 57 Magnum rounds? A real deal. Recoil is virtually non existent. Keeping on target to gun. You can scope. You have 10 shots. Uh, in rapid fire, the problem becomes, then you're pretty much done. Reloads are not instantaneous. They take a while, but welcome to the world of bands. You know, this is what you're dealing with. You could reload in S K s with a stripper clip, and you could do it pretty fast, but you have to be pretty well practiced at it. You know, when you're talking about a 10 round magazine non detachable magazine. It's gonna limit you, but I personally think, you know, that's a pretty good option. We don't over one of those at the moment thinking about getting one. I've got a nice big store credit

spk_0:   15:58
is going to sign it. And thats has been spied, eyeing one pretty hard lately to a point where

spk_1:   16:03
I'm handing one to spice of saying, What do you think she actually what?

spk_0:   16:07
It's Henry and I I just think Henry's You're sweet, They feel good.

spk_1:   16:13
Did you like that?

spk_0:   16:14
I did.

spk_1:   16:14
She would be. If I get one, I'll get the 3 57 Magnum because I have a lot of 3 57 Magnum. You know, I don't need to add another type of ammunition to collect.

spk_0:   16:24
Yeah, limiting calibers is an important part of our strategy here, so you

spk_1:   16:30
know that's an option. Of course, any bolt action gun is an option. It's just not, you know, it's not gonna be as quick is what you might be used to. Another option is the M one Grant. We want a world war with this gun. Our firepower with the M one grand was way beyond what everybody else in the world at the time had with their troops. The Russians had a lot Maurine more effective submachine guns. But a submachine gun is not a grant. You don't have the range. You don't have your shooting a much smaller bullet. I can rapid fire. You don't have the accuracy, the M one, Karan and heck you know they're They're out there. They're expensive, but they're out there. We also have the M one Springfield, which is basically a dim one A, which is a version of the M 14. But then again, you get into the removable magazine with Grant has a has a clip. This is actually a clip. Unlike most theme, one clips are actually clips and you've got a clip full of bullets. But you shoot through and then you last what fires it pops the clip out, drop a new clip in it, so reloads there pretty fast. And the big advantage of having a grand, for example, is that it has not only doesn't have fast reloads, it's an extremely accurate rifle. It's a battle tested right, and it is a rifle that carries a massive round. It delivers the goods

spk_0:   18:33
That was one U. S military strategy was still kill him all I believe.

spk_1:   18:37
Yeah, that's a big, big round that shoes and big family in one grand, we don't own one, but I'm a big fan of them.

spk_0:   18:48
And if anybody needs to go with the kind of more Communist answer of a motion, we've got a few.

spk_1:   18:56
Yeah. You want anybody tomorrow? You know, you got the old mill Milson surplus guns like the motions in the the Mauser and stuff like that. But the bolt action guns this'll tell you, this is a war game. I play war games and this is a war game. That's what we're getting is literally called bold actions. Great game. If you love to play miniature games, both action is the bomb it'sthe one to play for the historical miniatures I play. You can play it multiple scales. I happen to play mine in 20 eight millimeter and in bolt action. The rules favor the Americans in infantry simply because everybody else ah is much more limited with in the speed that they could shoot because they have bolt action rifles. The Americans, however, have Karan's that can shoot twice a cz much and they could shoot, shoot, move, whereas others are limited in that. So it's representative of the game. Designers realized that the Americans had a fire powered managed without anyone. Grant, that's an option. You know, I think a lot of people kind of over cell the a r and they over sell the way the need for having, uh, 1000 rounds strapped your chest, being ableto you know, Mass Chain magazine after magazine. You know, we personally have a equivalents to the air 15 and we actually do have the ability to do that. And, you know, it is a prop. But, you know, it's one of those deals were really question how many times it's going be you could you could prep without you can probably if you have to. You can use one of these alternatives.

spk_0:   21:11
Probable answer on how many times we would need that. None in our lives, ever Probable answer.

spk_1:   21:19
Now, Certainly. Certainly I am opposed to banning them, and I've owned a R 15 off and on for many years,

spk_0:   21:27
had one for me until let just like the devore much better. So I have to board now, but

spk_1:   21:33
you're probably Yeah, we switched over the X 25 the war. So just because the bull pup fits her better. Same exact fire powers here.

spk_0:   21:43
We got a podcast review on that one. He thumbs up.

spk_1:   21:46
Right. So there's that. Okay, I think one more, um, consideration in the purchase of guns If you're considering both guns and the idea that guns may certain guns may be banned. Is is it a reasonable, uh, is it reasonable thing to d'oh to purchase guns with the thought that this is a gun that is extremely unlikely to ever be banned? I think it is. What are what if some of these kind of guys guys that are extremely unlikely to be banned? Okay, never once sent me are non semiautomatic shotgun a pump shotgun. Very unlikely. Be man dear. Rifle's bolt action rifles with out interchangeable maglev bolt action rifles is flat out a good, accurate, dear rival in a caliber that is a appropriate for game in North America. No, You know, there's talk in New Jersey about banning 50 caliber rifles. Why? Nobody needs a 50 caliber rifle. Do you know how many people have been killed in the United States on purpose murdered in the United States over the last 50 years with a 50 caliber rifle? Exactly? None. Not one.

spk_0:   23:48
But few people know. Is that the real drive to ban 50 calibers? It's coming from the Grizzly Bears guys. It's coming from the moose, their lobby.

spk_1:   24:01
I'm going to throw something out here and I'm gonna tell you where the real this fat was. Funny. But I'll tell you where. The real Dr ISS, the real Dr is, is coming from people who realize that, you know, it's dangerous for them personally to have a gun that could shoot them from half a mile away. Period. That is where the drive is going from. And also it's a milk quote unquote military round, and it's one that you could ban without actually impacting anybody is no wounds, a bear it, You know, a

spk_0:   24:41
lot of a couple of gun stores who have one sitting around is so the guys can come in and pet it new and all over it. But nobody ever actually buys him.

spk_1:   24:50
Yeah, Gun Start had once for three years in it. Every loves it, but we can't give it away. What you going to do with one.

spk_0:   24:59
Oh, come on. If they tried to give it to you, take it. But may I don't want 50

spk_1:   25:06
now. Revolvers, revolvers. Now, if you have oh, revolvers, you're pretty safe from a big band unless they flat out ban all handguns, which you know places have done. But a revolver is a gun that's very unlikely to be just out out band unless there's a complete

spk_0:   25:35
can. All of them be speed loaded or

spk_1:   25:37
no, not all of them could be speed loaded. Now you could get revolvers that are designed to be very quick t load with speed loader, and you can't really get one of those loaded. Pretty quick. The ground limitations on revolvers generally not always. Six. But you can always. If you're in the needed to do some really volume level of shooters, you can always do the New York reload. The New York reload is what's mobsters used to do in New York. Gangs used to do in New York and the way you would do a New York reload as you have two bags. Ah, bag on your left side, in a bag on your right side. You'd reach down into the bag on your right side, which is full of a whole bunch of revolvers pulling out. You empty it and then you drop it into the back on your left side, reach down and grab another revolver has called in New York. Reload.

spk_0:   26:39
Yeah, I can really visualize myself needing that, but I'm just saying

spk_1:   26:43
that's what they did. That's a really thing. Mobsters did that.

spk_0:   26:47
How about those rifles that air Revolver rifles? Yeah. Okay. They look kind of quirky to me.

spk_1:   26:55
Yeah, I toyed around with the idea of buying one of those Thea They had one that was the basically a revolver version of a judge or a car by car. Be virgin of a judge. But I just never could you know, it would shoot 45 long called or for 10 shells. And they fixed the the problem with revolvers in rifles, intending to blow people's fingers off from the hand placement by putting a blast shield on it. The problem is, basically, is this when you have a revolver, you need to make sure as you fire it to keep your hand behind. Where the revolving area, the cylinder and the barrel meat because there's a gap in that gap. All kinds of crowd can blow out that blow out the gap grass. You'll get powder. You can even get bullet fragments

spk_0:   28:06
incompletely combusted powder. Getting into your skin and then finishing its combustion does not sound to me like a great time.

spk_1:   28:14
So you have exactly so you have to keep your hand back. And you don't want to stand next to somebody who's firing of a revolver or have them right, you know, so that your by the barrel buddy in front of where the soldier is with The only exception I know to this rule is my beloved. The Gant Revolver, where the actual solder goes up and engages with the barrel

spk_0:   28:42
beloved, is not the expression I would use fund of it in the way your fund of that really insane, quirky little thing. You got one year for Christmas that you admire whole lot but never actually want to use cause just know you once reload all week. That's rather it is,

spk_1:   29:07
and it's ah, the trigger pull of that gun was more than my scale. Yeah, measure and my scale. It's

spk_0:   29:17
right up there with brace both feet and pull with both a forest trigger pull goes totally silly. Oh,

spk_1:   29:24
yeah, But anyway, I love the old thing. I have a lot of fun with it, but so those are some options. Shotguns are very good option for short range, but they're not that good for long range. So

spk_0:   29:37
especially if you tend to like your weaponry to come and go. Thank you. Change your mind about what you want or you you like thio trade things off and you end up getting new stuff in that to me, would up the value of having something that was unlikely to be banned. Yes, if you're more of, Ah, get it and keep it forever, then I might think more about getting stuff that's unlikely. Or that's more likely to be banned while it's available right now. No, I could be being paranoid here, but with all the registration one has to do to buy firearms today, I am certain some of the mentality behind that is so they can they ever decide. They do want to make people turn in guns. They'll be able to produce evidence that you bought one and here's what you bought and we don't have any record of you transferred it. So

spk_1:   30:42
because there wouldn't be if you sold it to a private party.

spk_0:   30:45
Yeah, but I I think they're moving to make those private sales as illegal as possible to increase their ability to trace. They are who has what and when they do, it's like registering for the draft. When you make people register for a draft, the reason you're doing it is you. I want it to be easy and convenient for you when you actually want to draft people,

spk_1:   31:05
right? And so you know, this is the road we're on. I don't know whether we will lived to see the day when there are a confiscation. I don't know, OK, I can't see it. But it's possible, I suppose. But I do believe in the next few years and without going into politics. But I do believe in the next few years we are going to see probably a permanent quote unquote assault rifle ban, and this one won't have 18 year living on it. I do believe we're going to see it. So if you want your air 15 kid need to get it now like right now. Just go buy one. They're available there. Still cheap you want.

spk_0:   31:54
They're not as cheap as they were a month ago. You

spk_1:   31:56
know, they're not as available as they were a month ago.

spk_0:   31:58
The racket or a local gun store was a lot more bear last week that it was a month before that.

spk_1:   32:05
We would preach in on this for months. Now you go get it. It's now available. Get it, Get it, Get it, Get it, Get it If you're going to get it, the best are 15 way to our best gun that you're ever going to replace an air 15 with with a If it becomes illegal to buy and sell them. Is the air 15 you by now? You already have what you want. Okay?

spk_0:   32:34
I'm not a believer that everybody needs one, but, hey, if you decide, you do or you just want one. You could get him now.

spk_1:   32:43
And most importantly, if you want to sell or buy 30 round magazines, get everything you ever gonna wanna own Now. Right now, they're not traced in most places. I think maybe, you know, some places they do something is it's already illegal. Oh, no. You know, many states, it's illegal over 30 round magazine. But if you do, it's legal in your state. Buy them now. Don't wait there available, and they're normal price. You could have hacked five cheap. You can get it cheap. And don't be that guy. Remember the last time when they were real serious talk under the Obama regime about getting that band implemented, and it looked like it might happen. I saw people paying 50 60 $70 a magazine for a mag poll Maggot normally sells for 12 bucks, actually sold a bunch of ones I had for ridiculous money,

spk_0:   33:51
which was kind of the point. He saw him really, really cheap. It was bought a whole load of them, like but why he couldn't conceivably ever need this money. But he told me why I'm okay. And when the when it came up, he had some people come to him asking if he had and he could part with

spk_1:   34:11
and I did, I had him new in the new in the shrink or in the rap. Not really shrink. It's doing the rap. So there you are. Okay, there's a few alternatives if you have any other ideas. Now, we've kind of stayed mostly away from from handguns, because that's a real sticky wicket itself. Because, I mean, if you have a handgun, no matter what the gun is, if it has a removable magazine at all. Semiautomatic. Okay, almost off about it. Can

spk_0:   34:40
you

spk_1:   34:40
guys have except

spk_0:   34:40
the old historic ALS?

spk_1:   34:43
I can't personally even think of a symbiote back that doesn't have a mobile, Michael. Me, But if they all do, they all have the potential. Do you have ate larger capacity magazine? You know, even a gun, like a high point. Potentially, you could have, even though it comes with less than less or 10 rounds or last actually know what most of them are. I know the one I have is a is less than 10 rounds. I have the c nine. You could buy a 15 round magazines for their crap. Excuse my expression, but they're just chunk absolute garbage. It's your hand by them.

spk_0:   35:28
A little fun playing around with the larger capacity magazines for the pan guns. A time or two. But I don't like him. Wouldn't use him that make the whole thing. But

spk_1:   35:37
you've got a clunky to move her, Get a food clock. Joysticks.

spk_0:   35:40
Yeah, which are silly and a little fun at the range. But

spk_1:   35:45
oh, I am planning on picking up just for fun. Planning on picking up a sub two K Celtics up to kay some 2000. It was a millimeter Glock R B because I think you'd be an excellent plug up. Oh God, because it folds flat. If we do that, well, you know the thing on it. So that's on my list because they're very inexpensive, and they use clock 17 magazine's I. The Glock 17 is my main character when I'm open carrying, so there's a thought. The key part of this whole thing is considered now, and I think it's important that if you want to have several survival guides, you have at least one or two guns that are just not likely to be banned because, I mean, even if you don't turn your gun in, you're gonna be able to take it out, shooting in public if there's a man on him

spk_0:   36:44
and they're really more effective if you know how to use them, that's right. Somebody with a weapon that doesn't know how to use it properly is a danger to people around them when they pull it out, no matter their intent.

spk_1:   36:58
That's right. So I think we're gonna wrap it up. So thank you for listening and we'll catch you next time.