Wander the Earth🌎| Untethering From Home to Find Grounding Abroad with Kalyn Armstrong

Hello, everyone, and welcome again to Authentic on Air with Bruce Alexander. I'm your host Bruce Alexander putting the real me out there as an important part of my practice of being authentic, especially with the parameters of this as host of this show. It is especially important that I take the commitment very seriously. I respect this space of authenticity way too much to be measured in my sincerity as facilitator of this space. I am an open book.

And my guest today, Kevin Brady, host of the podcast, What do we call this podcast? But that theory to the test, when I went on her show more about Caitlyn after today's reflection, Who's your person when things go sideways or the stuff hits the fan, who's your go to phone call? Mine has been Katie for over 15 years, but here's a twist. Sometimes things would go sideways and I wouldn't make the call. I would be scared or confused or in some other way. Need help? Why wouldn't I call the answer?

As bad as things might get, a fear of something worse always loomed. What if this time it's too much? Could this be the thing that makes her see how much I actually suck? Learning to overcome those thoughts. Allowing my partner to be my lifeboat when the waters rise above my head has taken and will continue to take a lot of deep self work. I'm so very much less afraid of making that call now. But I am a continued work in progress.

In conclusion, I guess what I really want to reflect on is are you truly authentic with at least one person in your life? Is there someone who you let share the burden of how bad it really is? There was a large part of my life when I wouldn't even let myself see the darkness in the nooks and crannies of my soul. So I wasn't even consciously aware of how fake I was being every day. That was a hard realization, but from there, everything I have built is to last.

It's on a solid foundation of 17 reflection. And let me know if you have share that burden. I'll be the first one to tell you that it is okay. Wherever you are in your journey. The self-acceptance and authentic and authentically sharing yourself with the world. I have been there facing the enormity of your secrets and lies is the first step.

If you've taken that step and need help and where to go, Comment Step two Now we'll reach out to you and about one step at a time process of claiming your authentic identity. As I'm writing this though, I have so much love for my audience and I know how hard it can be to take that first step. If you comment, help are step one. I will contact you to set up a completely free, no strings attached coaching session focused solely on beginning your first step.

I never want anyone to have to keep hurting that much. I know how to help because I've been there before. Now let's get into their show because it's not time to cry yet. Who knows what the future of this episode holds, though, Because our guest today is Kaitlyn Brie. She's the host of, like I said, what do we call this podcast? Podcast A successful podcast are, by all my metrics with over eight times more social followers and a five star rating on Spotify.

I don't know where I will sit when this airs, but as I'm writing this, I can't really call my five star rating on Apple Podcasts legit because of my four reviews to where my wife and daughter respectfully shout out to my biggest fans. But what I have learned is that podcasting is art. 90% of podcasts don't get past episode three, and 90% of what's left will quit after 20 episodes. If I'm correct, I was Kaitlyn's 20th episode, putting her in the top 1% of podcast.

Despite all of this, Kaitlyn shared with me that I helped her. Like many that have come on this show for Kaitlyn, success hasn't canceled out Imposters syndrome. She shared with me that I inspired her to be less shy about reaching out to other podcasters in spite of the imposter syndrome. I want to share this about Kayla. In a community above a thousand are sorry in a community of thousands of podcasters who all struggle with the same things. Kaitlyn was the first to make me feel seen.

If audience is my currency to podcasters, I have been an awful investor. I guess I freely offer my audience anyone willing to be honest and vulnerable for the benefit of a more authentic world and engaging content to help others grow and heal. Kaitlyn was the first podcaster who looked at what I was doing and said, I love this and I would love to have you on. It was a very welcome opportunity to advance my mission of making the world a safer environment for authenticity.

My first podcast guest spot Kaitlyn's free spirit and go with full attitude made it so comfortable to share some of the hardest parts of my story, and I hope to replicate that same ambiance on my show. With that, I welcome to my show with the utmost appreciate appreciation and mutual respect. Kaitlyn Brie Thank you for being here. Kaitlyn my gosh, that was such an introduction. I'm like. Blushing internally. I'm like, I'm going to look to Red, but. I do feel so special.

And who doesn't want to feel special? Absolutely. You know, that's a big part of my platform is letting people know that they've affected me. If they don't hear from anywhere else, they're going to know that they've had an impact on me. Because, I mean, in this world today, we need to hear it as often as possible, right? Yeah. Yeah, of course. It's like it's such like an altruistic, like need is humans.

Like, I don't even want to say that because it makes it sound like it's, you know, for the benefit of something else. But it's truly just like we're social creatures and it's like, it's great to know that we have that effect on others and that there are others out there plenty who can have that effect on us. And that's just so special. And then there is something let's see, you've mentioned. Your five star reviews and you're like, you know, of the two of those is my wife and my daughter.

And it. Doesn't matter. That's so special. Like, Yeah, or what? What better people in your life to be rooting for you than those two? I think that's. Awesome. I do have to agree with that. My wife's support especially has been really, really important to me doing this. As you know, it's been a long time and she did not support me. It would definitely be not fun. My daughter also very important. Yeah, I love it.

So before we get too far into when you tell the audience in your own words who you are, how you spend your time, and what and why you think I invited you on the show. Who I am. Okay. You remind me of some of those problems because I'm going to go on if you tend. that's perfectly well. Yeah. I am a gal in her mid twenties. Currently traveling full time with my partner, so that's kind of been what's taking up most of my time.

I think our biggest focus so far has been like trying to immerse ourselves more in a community. We started out our. Travels.

Kind of moving every two weeks and what we found was that by the ten day period we started to feel comfortable in the place and really started to like, recognize the people that we were seeing for the places we wanted to frequent, whether it was like a really good restaurant or like, you know, the little car on the side of the road that's there at 7 p.m. on a Thursday, Friday, Saturday, you know, we would get that comfortability. And.

And then it was time to leave three days later or four days later. And so now you know, we're really honing in on like, okay, for and I do this full time travel thing like. We want to get to know the people in the community. And it's been really cool. And. That's like, I guess the recent thing going on in my life. Yeah, I. Have a podcast that Bruce mentioned and that's been like a passion project of mine that I think has always kind of like. Been burning.

For me or, you know, had like a little bit of a pilot, like going on since I want to say like freshman year of college. And I think that would have been 2017 when I first started listening to podcasts and was navigating the college life and just all the stuff that gets thrown at you that typically isn't talked about in high school, you know, whether that's sex and relationships or like the kinds of things that do happen at parties, Like people go to parties in high school too.

So it's not like it was the most fresh thing, but it's just like, you know, different level of it. And so I found a lot of comfort in some of the podcasts that a few mentors had like recommended to me. And. You know, since then I've always like had the thought of in the back of my mind, like, I'll be so cool to do this and like, provide that to people. I just don't know what kind of like, I don't know.

I'm always like looping back to like questioning credibility or like certification or whatever. And it's like all these things that ultimately don't matter the end of the day, like there are people out there who don't have any kind of like formal proper college degree and are making huge differences in the world. So it's just like. You know. Discovering the different versions. We can make our differences that don't solely rely. On. Whatever license or whatever degree.

Do you know what I'm getting at? Yeah, I know. I totally I totally agree. I struggled with some of the things. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, that's just an overarching summary of like some of the stuff I'm passionate about with like, how do we even navigate in ourselves in this world? How do we navigate our relationships? How do we navigate our friendships? I guess we could say just relationships in general, romantic.

And you know, whether that's the relationship with your mom, the relationship with your dad, the relationship with like an abusive family family member, and how you want to move forward with that kind of stuff. And yeah. I just I just hope. That I'm able to, like. Reach one person. Like, truly, if I could just reach like one person, I guess that would be like the main aim in my podcast.

But you know, even here today, like getting to guest on yours, like if we could reach one person and have them feel like, really heard and seen, like I would feel like I've done my job and like there's no obviously money in the reality that we're in is to an extent something we need. But like making that difference would just totally trump all monetary value with like serving whatever purpose in life. I guess. No, I completely agree.

I've said that multiple times on this podcast is that if one person feels seen or feels like they were helped to find their authentic self through my podcast, then like I've been a success now, does that mean I it's going to, you know, but food, my kids mouths know. So I'd like to be a success. Michael Yeah, monetarily as well. But it definitely feeds my soul. Know that, you know, people like you and I are out here trying and trying to make a difference and hopefully we are.

So I think that answers the question pretty far since we're on the topic of your podcast. You you kind of you kind of go everywhere on your podcast. And I, you know, for me, I try to stay pretty specific for what I'm trying to do, but I love that you're willing to really talk about anything in your in your bio, though. One of the things that you mentioned as like your past is the talk about is parenthood. You don't have any kids. What is it about parenthood?

You know, I went pretty in-depth into like some parenthood stuff whenever I was on your podcast about how important I think it is to show up authentically as parents, what is it about parenthood that you think is so interesting to talk about? I guess the first. Motivation for me to mention that or the first motivation for any of it would come from a more like selfish perspective of like, well, I know I want to have kids. So it's something I'm. Already. Thinking about and interested in. And have.

For the most part, always felt pretty darn sure of which I'm not saying that's how it is for everyone. Like this isn't a everyone should have kids kids agenda like I hear plenty of stories of people who are like yeah, we're like a dual income, no kids household and it's great. And I'm like, great for you. Like, I'm glad you're happy, you know, like that. No propaganda here. Just my own personal like, I know what I want. Like, I'm excited. Like, I just feel like I have such, like a ha.

Just like a need to care. They need to, like, nourish and I can't wait for that to come up. And with that. I. Recently. Okay, let's get the podcast started. I think in April, April 2023. I and I. A lot of people in my life have been having babies within the last year or two, and it's just been really cool to get to talk to people and like their different experiences. Like I had my A we just call each other cousins.

In the episode. We dive into whatever our family tree actually is and how we're actually related. But cousin, for all intents and purposes, I had her on and we got to talk about her like natural homebirth. And. I'm very fascinated by that. I think it's a really great alternative for, you know, that being accessible to people that are able to do that.

So, you know, there's an element of passion there, pre parenthood just with like our health care system, I guess, particularly in the U.S. and how how scary childbirth can be for a lot of women. And then take that a step further for women and minority groups. So the passion kind of starts there with like women's health, I guess stops by like the sexuality thing and sort of, you know, begin to tie in to like the parenthood thing with, you know, childbirth and health care along the way.

But then, you know, diving into parenthood. Did I lose you, Bruce? But I'll try to just jump right back in and. No. yeah. I'm also really bad at picking up parenthood. No, you're good. You're good. Let's see. You were asking me, like, marriage and parenthood, but you're not a parent. Like, dive into that. And I think. I don't know, like, where exactly It says it's still recording, so I'm guessing it recorded up to where I left off. So I'll try to piece. Back. That, but it's kind of.

Summing up what so, so far, what I've gleaned from you in Parenthood is that you're a very hopeful, you know, mother to be in the future. At some point, are you just trying to collect the best information you can get kind of as a as research for whenever you start your parenthood journey? Yeah. I guess it's like a case study collection of some kind, but like less scientific or less like, you know, weird. You know. Weird research is. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's kind of the best. Way to put.

It into words that I honestly haven't been able to. Yet. I just think it's really cool and I feel like there's so much more stuff coming out with like mental health and like the different types of, like disorders that are out there and like, what kind of stuff did you experience as a kid that you feel has like shaped your life and, you know, coming to terms with that kind of stuff?

Like personally, like with my parents and like, you know, I can still recognize like how, how much they provided me as a kid.

And like, we talk about this and, you know, they have their own experiences with their parents and so on and so forth, you know, And so I think I just get excited about it because I see like what my mom was able to do, raising us as a single mom before, like getting remarried and then like, you know, seeing our dad more frequently again and just like, coming to terms with just like the different types of relationships we have with our parents in childhood, because not everything

is like the perfect nuclear family that's like portrayed to us. And also how those relationships start to shift into adulthood. Like, you know, there's a big element of like letting go. And I. Think even before. We, like, grow up and like, enter adulthood, like, I feel like I hear so many parents mention like just being able to like, let go is like such a big thing with like making stuff not so stressful, you know, with raising children.

And I just feel like that's an ongoing thing even into adulthood. And I don't know, I'm just interested in it. And there's like, you know, so much you can dive into, like, I have I have a friend. Who. Wasn't raised by her mom and dad. She in like any capacity, she was raised by grandparents. And you know what that experience has been for her going into adulthood with like an older generation and, you know, speeding up the process of figuring out in home care and that kind of stuff.

This is a tangent, but it's just like the the overall like focus on how those relationships change and like how you can really nurture them to your best ability, like from the beginning. So I think it's really cool to. Choose, which it's pretty hard to actually like choose exactly what it looks like. But if you could choose your parenthood journey, what would it look like? Where I'm at now, which. I'm I. Definitely don't feel ready to have kids yet. That's definitely, you know.

A few years down the line, I would say. But where I am now with like, what sounds really awesome to me, like definitely. Maybe not to. The extreme that like, say, my cousin. What, not, maybe not that. Extreme to her, but an extreme to me of like doing a full home birth and that kind of thing. Like she did home water, birth and like I got to see the video. It was so cool. Like. Super beautiful, like one of the most like, just like, natural, primal things I've ever seen.

And I thought that was really awesome. And I'm like, okay, Like I could see myself doing like a water birth, but maybe I want to do it at a birthing center instead of at home. And like having, like, you know, a mixture of that kind of thing. But then moving into parenthood like, I feel like there's a lot of stuff out there with like schooling in particular, and I don't think I'm necessarily there yet with like, what kind of schooling, what I want to do and that kind of thing.

Because, you know, that's other people who are having an influence on your children's life that like I just haven't even gotten. I know you mentioned you you home school, right? Yeah. So I'm like, yeah, I haven't even gotten to like, how I'd want to do that. Yeah, I think it's cool that you do that. I feel like I hear a lot of cool stories about, you know, the different ways people like, integrate that into their lives

and that kind of thing. But purely just from like the parenting standpoint, I think like, there's like so much stuff about, like gentle parenting, but then it's like, how do you do that in the right way without it being something of like, you know, you got to teach like consequent consequences of your actions, but then also like not having such like a, like authority, like punishment based type of relationship with your kid as opposed to, like mutual understanding and respect

for one another, like just on like a human level. Like. I remember when you came on. You said something along the lines of like how intuitive children. Are and. That just totally prevails. Like, I think I think about that the most more than anything, whenever I think about being a parent and just how to like, I'm going to go on another tension here. Have you ever been in like. Have you ever. Been in like a workplace situation or like, well, just a workplace situation where like. Someone.

Of higher authority just totally demands respect and is just like a total tyrant and like, thought to yourself, like, now why. Would I want to. Send to that person? Like, it? Does it really cool? Like it doesn't really cultivate like a great learning environment. So it's like, why would you do that with your kids? You know what I mean? So I think a lot about. Like how.

You know, how to make it known that I'm going to be a safe space for them to come to no matter what with like body safety, body image, like the way we talk about ourselves and that kind of thing. But also like how to teach them those consequences, action, consequences and actions like lesson without punishing them for something like I think that's a that's kind of what I'm getting at when I'm mentioning total parenting. I'm obviously not a pro, so I'm not like a child psychologist.

I don't have all the right terms to like. Use. To like coin. What I'm trying to like really. Let me tell you something. Even fear, even like if. You had all the right. Terms. Yeah. And you'd done all the research. Kids come along and they just like, stop all the books out of your hands. And they, they really, you know, they put all that stuff that you think you understand to the test.

And I think what's really important about what you're saying is that you're thinking about so many more things than I was before I became a parent. And I definitely started as a parent way earlier than I should have, way less prepared than I should have been way I wasn't taking it seriously enough. It is I mean, it's as much as a job as you make it. But to me, that's that's a good thing. But I want to work at being a parent. I want to get better. I want to take that time to improve.

I you know, I try to study I could study more, study a lot more. But, you know, I appreciate talking to somebody who is thinking about these things many years before they're ready to have children, because, you know, if you were to have a child like our first kid was, you know, five years before, I thought I was going to be ready for it. And we weren't prepared for that at all. And we had to get ready really quick. I feel like that's not going to be such a huge leap for you.

Also, on the whole homebirth thing, three out of four of our kids were born at home. So I am I'm definitely on the home birth control. Love to hear it. My wife can give you plenty of information if you ever want more as it is a great it is really a great experience. And for somebody who doesn't like being in the hospital, that works really well for both of us because, you know, you get to stay in your own home. But birthing centers are also great options.

Well, I'm not going to tell anybody else how to do what they need to do. But for us, it's such a great experience to be home. You know, the first birth we were we had our midwife with us for like 20 hours. So it's being somewhere else uncomfortable whenever you can be at your home and still uncomfortable, but at least, you know, comfortable as you can be while birthing a child. I definitely an urgent. Yeah. Getting a little more into, you know, talking about like your parenting journey.

How have you had these conversations with your partner? Yeah, maybe not to the degree that I have to. Not to the degree that I like. Just word vomiting that you. I what? What you and your listeners just got was like Kaitlyn's internal monologue on a daily basis of like, how do I want to do this so I don't totally mess up. I you keep asking that question. You're doing good. Never quit asking how do I not mess up my kids? So it's like that's like really works like.

Up. In my dome, just like, rattling around. So many other things. The like, the core pieces of it are definitely like the things that we've talked about with like, I mean, definitely like the home birthing thing. We both had hospitals. That's like, you know, something we have in common. But like for the parenting side of it, it's just like we both come from families that got divorced and or separated or however you want to phrase. It, and we just have both.

Always been really good, like pretty much from the start of our relationship about like talking about like here are the things that like I remember seeing as a kid. For me, it was a little bit younger when my parents separated. He was a little bit older.

And. Will share like here the things that we saw with like, you know, what went wrong, Like even just on the relationship level were like, if your foundation is pretty much solid from the get go, like it's going to be really hard to like continue making a really good, like nurturing or nurturing, nourishing space for like new beings, you know?

So like the main focus of what him and I like to talk about is like it's just it's so much more like relationship focus because we're so still so young and like still pretty fresh in our relationship is in terms of like how relationships go. Like he doesn't feel that way. Like we always joke about, like how it's crazy how like we felt like we've always known each other so long.

But like at the end of the day, we've been together like just about a year and a half, maybe a little bit more than a year and a half. Like, I can't be doing math right now. So it's like recognizing the things that we saw as kids and like what didn't feel very good and like, what kind of still prevails now? Like, for example, I find myself like, anytime, like conflict arises, I shut down. Like, I'm just I'm silent.

I get like, you know, sweaty and nervous and like, my heart rate goes up and I, I just want to go inward. And I, it's very avoidant. And that can be really frustrating for him when we have a conflict. And that's something I recognize in myself that I remember seeing as a child, what was modeled for me.

So a lot of the focus now for whenever we talk about like, you know, the stuff that would apply to parenting is just like working on how we want to handle conflicts with one another that will then apply to like handling conflicts with like something that's happening with. I think. That's teach your children method. Yeah. Of did. That answer your. Question instead of talking about kids right now let's talk about our relationship and talk about how we can make the strong and then build from there.

And I and I completely agree that it is so important to have a I'll tell you, I'll be honest with you. Like my wife and I like I said, we weren't ready to have kids. We still argue a good amount because we're very different people. We have like our brains work very, very differently. And so just our basic understanding of the of the world is different.

And so whenever you have the responsibilities of sharing a house and parenting kids and financial responsibility and all those things, the way you view the world really has a lot of there and whenever I think something should go one way and she thinks it should go another way, and we both just operate that way because that's what humans do. Like they, they work as their brain, you know, tells them that they should figure things out.

And then those things don't line up in an argument Sometimes in suits. And having those arguments in front of your kids is it's a soul crushing thing, like not being able to, you know, bring that in and say, let's talk about this like adults. And here's a thing. You know, it's great that when we can do that and we do do that sometimes, like, don't get me wrong, we're not like knock down, drag out all the time.

Yeah, but sometimes there's, you know, and an immovable or or an unstoppable force comes against an immovable object. We're often that because we're both very assertive. And so, you know, then our kids get to watch us argue. And that's not my favorite thing at all. But having a strong relationship and especially figuring out how you are going to resolve conflict early in your relationship anyways.

But early in your parenthood journey when you're when you first have kids or whatever, because I promise you it only gets more stressful. But I'm going to say more stressful gets more interesting. There's a there's there's just more things added to the equation. So as you're adding more things to the equation, it gets more interesting, right? It's more complex.

So solving it whenever there's not that constant of here's how we are going to, you know, deal with conflict when it arises, it gets it gets more difficult. So, yeah, I really, you know, it's awesome. And especially for a couple who's only been together for a year and a half, where does that that process come from, where you guys for you to even have those conversations as a you know, I know that the generation coming up under me because I'm almost 40 years old.

You're in your mid twenties, you guys, you're just different about the way that you talk about things. You're more open with mental health and more open with, you know, building a future together. Like you're traveling the world with somebody you've been together with just over a year. So I'm guessing this started right about a year together. You guys started traveling the world like that's that's a really big jump. But I never would have been okay.

And I'm like, I'm happy for you that you were able to do that. But that's just a whole different way of thinking. Like, where does that come from? I guess just like, well, for someone to express, like, gratitude for like how, how emphasized it was by my parents to just, like, do what makes you happy? Well, you know, with that being said, like, they, they really, really like emphasized that.

And with that being said, there was always like a little bit of a flavor of like, you know, make sure you have a roof over your head, make sure you have a career and that kind of thing. And I thought that was what I wanted because, like, that was all I kind of really ever understood. And I saw them do it and I was like, okay. Like, yeah, I could see this. And then, like after having a. Job the while the. People were really awesome within the company itself.

I, I know maybe we'll dive into some of the other stuff I mentioned to you last night, like a little bit later, but like the company itself and the people that I worked with, like day to day were really awesome and like that environment was really cool.

The nature of the work itself and like working the 7 to 3 shift day in, day out, doing like really physical labor was like really mentally taxing and I guess like, you know, having this opportunity to travel together for this amount of time and like really talk about like what our life priorities are was kind of where it all stemmed from. So now that's okay. I feel like I'm kind of all over the place here. This happens a lot. So sorry. Yeah, yeah. No, that makes sense because I think we've.

Been through enough, you know, your work experience and giving you enough information to kind of not really be Whenever it came to your relationship, you kind of wanted to make it clear what was important to you in that aspect, at least because you had enough to figure out what you wanted to do with your life, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

It was it was like I mean, that job in particular was like a big lesson of like, here's what I don't want, particularly with scheduling as someone who, like, can't just do the same thing over and over and over again. Like, it just gets really like. I need stimulation, you know. Something new to like, focus on something you wanna be like, stoked about. But that can be a slippery slope, of course.

But like, you know, just like having maybe more of, like a project based mind as opposed to, like a day in, day out, same tasks, five days a week type deal. But like, yeah. You mentioned like knowing what you want, that's also knowing what you don't want. And I feel like we've just been really good about like talking about that with each other. Like I it's funny.

Like being this young man, like I've only been in serious relationships, Like I've dated a little bit in between each relationship, but like, not for too long a period. Of time. Like, you know, nothing like, super extreme. So I have like two other examples before the current relationship I'm in where I'm like,

Here's what I definitely don't want, you know what I mean? And it's like hard because we are still so young and there's only still so much that we like both know and also all the other crap. We don't know. So it's like just like always talking it through together. And just.

Day by day getting better about like mentioning when there's something that I wasn't very fond of with, like the way something was phrased or like the way we were approached, like bringing up something to the other person or whatever. Like, I feel like I tend to have this really bad habit. Of like.

As soon as something's like, looming in the back of my mind, like I will bring it up at even the, like, worst of times as opposed to like recognizing like, okay, maybe I should like, make sure we both have the space to, like, talk about this first, like talking to someone about something that I'm angry about first thing in the morning is probably not the best way to go about it. You know what I mean? Not to say that I'm not. Really the only one like doing that.

Kind of like more problematic stuff. Like, we. Both have our flaws, but I can only out myself. For that, you know, like. Overall, it's all like, really solid, but like, we all. Have. Our struggles and that kind of thing. And the stuff that like, like you mentioned with you and your wife, you both see the world differently. You're both pretty stubborn. Like, Yeah. You're man and woman man in life, you know, like it's it's just like it's the opposite.

It's like it's the sun and the moon. It's the light in the dark. Like the. It's hard to even, like, find that common ground. So I think, like, that's kind of just like the biggest focus is like, well, here's the way I see things. And then like hearing him say, Well, here's the way I see things, and then like figuring out how we want. To bring it. Up. Whenever I was your age, when I was 25, my wife was 28, 21.

And, you know, as we were talking about getting serious but getting more serious, I was like really committed to this theory that she was not even I was like, you're not even who you're going to be for the rest of your life. You're not even close. Like until you're 25, you're still like, you're basically still baby. Like, I was very committed to this theory and I was like, I'm afraid to, like, get married. And you change and us not be right for each other anymore.

I think I feel like it was kind of a narrow minded theory, but at the same time, looking back, you know, I want to be like I'm almost 20 years later. I was right. Like she wasn't who she was going to be, but also neither was I. I thought because I was 25, I pretty much I was pretty well baked and I was done. It turns out you keep growing like you never really stop. And I mean, you can. I guess you can. If you do stop, then likely your other is going to keep growing without you.

And that's, you know, that's the scary thing and you're going to grow apart. Or what I've learned is that we've got to we've grown apart at times. We've had to grow back together. And that is, you know, growing back together is almost like a trellis thing, a plant or, you know, like kind of setting it back on a path, like having a vision to where you want to grow and like working back towards that and, you know, having to use tools to accomplish that.

Do you have any fear of being so committed to somebody? I mean, like you're overseas together, you know, you're talking about what you know, what the future looks like with kids. I don't know, like, I know that marriage has kind of lost some of the luster for the younger generation. I think it's very important to me.

But have you talked about marriage? Are you are you worried about growing like growing your identity, not being really fully formed yet and that being, like affecting how you guys grow together, Is that stuff that you've thought about at all? Yeah, I, I, I think about it all the time. It was something maybe we talked about a just over a month ago when we were still in Mexico. So we're in Costa Rica now. We had traveled Mexico for a month doing that whole situation. And like I currently.

Don't like money, always. The root of all evil. I currently don't have a job. So I remember like inviting him one day and just saying like, I'm so scared of like not having this figured out yet because like. I'm. You know, I have like a good savings situation figured out for this, like, I didn't and just go into it without, like, having that security blanket.

But even before we left, we had talked about like, what do I need to do to get to that point to feel comfortable doing this while solely relying on him for like the financial side of things.

And it's like, that's like a thing to be doing while we're in our mid-twenties and like, still in like the, like fresh stages, like a relationship, you know, with that being said, like, I think what we've both learned from like past relationships has just been like, you know, prioritizing like the individual things that you still like to do. Like, like, I like my pole dancing. He loves rock climbing right now.

It's been kind of a different situation with traveling because not all that stuff is accessible, but like making sure that, like each person has like their set time for themselves and that kind of deal. But then like also like supporting one another and like the different stuff they want to try out because the stuff we're trying to do now is definitely not what we'll be doing 30 years from now. Like, I guess we're going to talk about it from like a career standpoint, but like.

You know. Even just like the relationship stuff like marriage and like, you know, just being so into it at this point, like we've talked about and it's something like, I don't know, it's easy for me to fall into like the mindset of like, well, I'd like then like the next year or two, but then it's like, I'm also not that big of a stressor because it's just going to happen when it's going to happen.

Like I think my biggest mindset, like the biggest mindset shift I've had with what you mentioned with like the whole psychology thing of like your brain's developing by this time and then from there you're who you are and it's like, it's so easy to like, you know. Obviously predicted. I know we've been together 20 years later. You guys are made. For 20. 17, 18 years. We've been married for 13 years.

Okay. Yeah. So, yeah, like you did see that and like, I recognize that that is something that's possible. But like, the the biggest thing I also focus on is like, I don't see like a counterargument because that sounds like negative, but like my thought process to, like counter, like the why do it now type of thing, which I don't think we're going to be doing that now or anything like that. But like you and your wife almost 20 years later, are two very different people.

Ten years from now, that is still going to be the case and it could be in a totally different way you know what I mean? Like you see that with like like you hear the same type of story, like, okay, my parents got together when they were very young. Oops. They had me. They got married, had my brother divorced a few years later. They were super young, had a lot of stuff that like they still wanted to figure out about themselves and like,

you know, other stuff along the way that I don't want to share. But that's like one end of the spectrum with like getting married super young. But then you also hear people who have been married. Yeah, I don't mean this as. A way to be like, this is going to happen to you. I just mean like totally different example. Like you hear about people who've been married for ten, 20, 30, 40, 50 years, and all of a sudden it's like, I don't think this is what I want anymore.

And then that happens, you know, like, like people are we're always changing. Like there's always going to be that possibility. So I feel like my mindset is just like, why not just fully love right now and like, totally enjoy, like how, how into each other, how like stoked we are about one another. Like how like how loving and caring this relationship feels like why not lean into that and just like, navigate everything as it comes?

Because inevitably it's going to like 50% of marriages end in divorce, you know, like it. It's it's there's always going to be the odds are always stacked against us if we're going to like bring marriage into the mix. So it's like my mindset is just like, let's just let's just like, let's just try it out. If it fails, it fails. If not, great. That's what we wanted, you know what I mean?

It sounds a little starry eyed and romantic, but I feel like it's also pretty realistic because it's like, well, you could argue what better time than now, but it's also like, well, if we're really sure about one another. And we know.

Like at some point, like we do want to get married and have kids and whatever and like, I also don't even have like the, the, like timeframe in my mind of like marriage and then kids, like, I don't care if we have kids first and then get married, like that kind of thing. It's just like an overall. Yeah, I guess we'll. Just see where it. Goes. Life is what it is. That's true. Like, I feel like it's frickin weird, you.

Know, we we kind of fail to realize the times that relationships are all about just leaves affect, like, over and over again. Like, you know, you're making these choices to trust somebody that you don't know what they're going to be, who or what you think they are.

I just think that for us, marriage just takes it to the next level of not only am I going to make a leap of faith and trust, you, I'm going to commit to like for us, marriage isn't something that we look at, even though both of our parents are divorced and we say we're going to divorce at some point, even though you know, we've gotten angry. And previously in like the past year or two, we kind of we threw that word around a lot.

And as we've grown and we've gotten more open with that communication, yeah, we both just know that we want to do life together. Like we're we're committed to doing it with each other. And that's going to look, it's going to look different many times. And that's okay. We're just going to both commit to yeah, if we grow apart, we're going to commit to doing the work and coming back together because I know that she's my best friend and I know that I'm hurt.

So why would I want to do it with anybody else? Like I'd rather do the work with her and fix the problem than try to start over with somebody else and maybe never get any part of what we had together.

I just, you know, So, yeah, that's that's just my little yeah, not my little love story to our love story is that I just, you know, I appreciate the fact that you're you're willing to kind of make these big leaps of faith and you're doing them on a like a truncated scale, like, you know, you're just doing it faster because things have come in a way that they've kind of, you know, lined up for you to do them faster. So why not like, why not travel together? Why not, you know, move in together?

Why not? You know, he's he's supporting you. And that's I'm sure is that's a huge leap of faith for both of you, that you're not going to take advantage of him and that he's not going to use it to control. Like that's yeah, that's a big leap of faith. So yeah. Yeah. For you know, it's it's worlds different to even see. it's hard because it's not like I'm here to like try to talk and X or anything. Like I'll piece all of to that.

It's just funny to see like how and you know, obviously focusing on comparisons is not a good thing either. But just like seeing how it's so clear to me how sure we each feel about one another with my partner now. And I've also been on the other side of it where. You shouldn't be. Questioning, you shouldn't be questioning, does this person like me. Do they want to be with me? Do they want to support me? Like I feel like those are all very basic things in a relationship. That are.

So like base level and necessary that like if that's even something you're questioning, your foundation probably isn't very solid. So it's just like, like seeing the two differences and how like, I don't know, like I just, I just I really do feel so loved and so special and so, like, not controlled or not like, it's just support. It's just like, it's like pure support. And it's it's. Just like on a whole nother plane of, like, recognizing what I'm able to rely on.

And like, like you said, it is just on a totally different time frame, like person before dated for a few years and there was never really like a clear moment of realizing, like, how sure they felt about me. They were never sure about me is like the way I interpreted the way I came to peace with, like, whatever, whenever that relationship did end. And so it's just like, I don't know, recognizing like if you have I'm such a big believer in like, trusting your gut.

And like, my gut has not led me astray so far. And my 24 years of life, which is. Not a lot, but it has it. Has it. Like. So I. Don't know. I don't know. It's like it's again, it sounds so starry eyed and that kind of thing. And it's so funny because he's like the much more like logical, like brainy, heady, like peace in our relationship in terms of like friend, like puzzle pieces. But like, we really do balance each other out in that way. But it's like we're still able to express. How.

Well, like just on a different plane than it feels. I don't know. Like I always. Laughed. Or like, scoffed or like, honestly judged a little bit of like hearing my mom say when, you know, you know, with like who you're going to be with. If we're talking operating in like a monogamy mindset, like you just know and you know, and I remember thinking like, that's so silly. But then I would see, like, the relationship that her and my stepdad have.

And I'm like, there's got to be like some truth to this because, like, I see what they have and like, it prevails. It totally does. So I guess I'll trust that. And when comes it comes. And then it came and I'm like, shit, I'm 24. sorry. Okay, don't say these bad words. I'm getting the hang of it. Yeah, it just it. Came along and I'm like, Well, I'm 24 and now I'm feeling this, and we've had that conversation together. We met on a dating app like what?

And now we're traveling the world together a year and a half later. I'm sorry. Like we still laugh about it. We were at the beach a few days ago in a mall. All I say to him every so often and I'm like, Isn't it weird that we met on a dating app and now we're here? And he's like. Dude, I don't get. Back in because that's what my show is about.

I think that it's important to to really highlight the fact that meeting in a dating app moving fast, doing all the things that you've done, has been you, like you said, trusting your gut and living your life in an authentic way where you instead of trying to do what everybody else has done or what everybody else would generally prescribe to. You said, This feels more right to me. This feels like how I should be living my life. And and you've been brave enough to do that.

And that's not something that everybody can say. Yeah, it's it's wild. It's it's funny. Like, even. Like up until we laughed, it was funny realizing, like, how many people I actually felt safe. Like, to about, like, this crazy adventure that we were going to go on. And. Really, like taking in. That like. Data from other people based off of like the reactions they had And like it was actually pretty surprising.

Obviously, negative stuff, the way that our brains are wired, like definitely sticks out more. But in terms of like numbers, when I think about most people that I was talking to, it usually wasn't a very good reaction. It was like, my gosh, you're going to go do that. Like you feel comfortable doing that. Like, you know, that kind of reaction.

And the people that the fewer numbers that how the opposite reaction to that the people that were really excited and like stoked and like, my gosh, like recognizing like that's not for me, but I think it's cool you guys are doing that. Like those people. Like. I don't know, you hear about these big life events like weddings or, you know, a baby coming along the way and that kind of thing.

And families that really bring out people's true colors like this was a much more mellow version of that, albeit, but a version of it where I was like, I think I yeah, this confirmed the people that I know I'm going to have in my life forever. And I just thought that was really big and like, you know, with that, we're going. To need to tie it. All back into like living authentically and just like really being yourself and trusting like, the way you want to live your life.

Like, really hold on to and like, appreciate the people that are always stoked for you and get excited with. You. For like a promotion or like a new job that you're getting or like this big thing you're going to be trying or like a business you're starting like all the people that are going to be excited for you. Those are the ones that freaking matter. Like if there's anything. I could say. Like that, that's the. Biggest fear is like. Obviously the biggest opponent for living authentically.

Like fear, anxiety. Those things make it very difficult. Whenever those people were like trying to sow their fear into you. How how did you combat that? I don't even know if I. Really combated it. I think I just kind of like took it in as like, that's like their reaction. Like maybe I felt like a little bit of disappointment of like, they're not excited like I. Am when. Who knows what's going on in their mind. Like, I can't see what's going on for them.

Like, I only know what's going on for me with like the way I'm reacting to what was being said back or like whatever nonverbal things I'm taking in. But like, I think I just like, recognized like, well, of course we all want to do things differently. Like this isn't for everyone. Like, I wasn't even sure if it was for me. I was just down to try something new because I was not enjoying the job that I had and needed a little push. Of How do. I figure out how to do something different?

That kind of thing. But like, I don't know, combating those like opposing thoughts, it's hard. Like I think I was just like, you know, like if someone like, countered it with like, like, aren't you nervous about, like, whatever. I can't think of a particular example right now. It's kind of just like, shoved out of my brain space and like, it takes up space that doesn't matter. Like, can get. It out of here. Whatever thing. Like, aren't you scared of X?

Like, I'd just be kind of like, I mean, like, yeah, that's a possibility, But like, it's not happening. Now. And I know I can. Get myself so that the majority of the opinion, like in whatever capacity that would know. More towards the negative mean. So it's not, it's not a common way of thought like at least in your circle it wasn't it wasn't the common, you know, method to, to do these sorts of things.

So is it just that you have adopted the mindset that allows you to not care about, you know about them and not not care about them, but not not take their fears in and, you know, and where their opinions. Very. I mean, yeah, I'd say so. Like there are definitely some things that like someone would bring up, but I'd even say like. yeah. That is something I've been thinking of. But like, who knows what's going to who knows what's going to come of it?

But like, I, I think like whatever issue itself that whatever person like brought up wasn't what worried me. I think what worried me was like, damn, they're not excited for me because I know I'm a person who's always excited for others. And so it's disappointing truly like obviously we put expectations on other people and like that's an unfortunate reality and I think we all can fall be at fault to that. But like, I think that was honestly kind of the biggest emotion that I remember thinking.

And like the only thing that really stuck, like for a few weeks after until I talked about that with my partner. And this is I'll get to that in a second actually, with the way that he, like advised it. I really like the way he thought about it. But. Yeah, I just it was just like, wow, they're not excited for me. Like, that sucks. I've been excited for them in the past for certain things, you know?

So I guess like with the whole, like showing True Colors thing, it was more of like a, I don't know, like, like my best friend, like her and I have been able to openly about this and she's like such an awesome, like cheerleader, supportive friend who was like, excited for me but was also able to like. On her authenticity and be like, that's not for me to be. Like, me and my husband have talked about this and that is not for us. And I was like, That's fine, dude.

Like, I just appreciate that you were able to recognize how excited I was for this and that you were able to like, you know, provide that in return as opposed to being like, judgmental about it. Like, Like you're going to do that with your life, you know? Like, that totally wasn't what it was, as opposed to, like some of the other undertones I got from other stuff for other people.

But what I was in, I mentioned with my partner was like, you know, after a few times of like kind of starting to mention, you know, I'm leaving Company X. And. We're going to be leaving at the end of June and we're going to be doing this for six months to a year, depending on what we're able to like, work out with visas and that kind of thing.

Like after bringing that up a few times to people and then recognizing the negative interactions and then after, I guess like collecting a few of those and kind of letting them like weigh down on me from like an emotional standpoint, I came to my partner and I was like, Dude, it's so weird that so many people are having this reaction. Like, I, I feel like it's even silly for me to even talk about, like, the upcoming adventure we're going to have.

And he was like, Well, and I asked him, like, How how are you talking this with other people? Like, how many people like back home for, you know, about this and that kind of thing? And he was like, the people that matter are the ones that know we're doing this. I don't talk about it with anyone else. So the people that he's very sure about, they're the ones he's talked to about it.

And if no one else knows about it, like clearly there was like whatever protests for him to recognize like, that doesn't matter that they need to know. My family knows, my close friends know, that's it. And I was like, that's so interesting. Like, I feel like. I can be. At fault for just like, hoping the best in everyone, seeing the best in everyone. And then.

Blabbing my mouth off and I think that was kind of like what the difference was and what him and I were like talking about our upcoming travels before we left. So yeah. It's really easy to say, like, I only tell the people that, you know, are super important to me. When you're an introvert, when you're an extrovert, you want to share what's going on with you, with everybody, so forth, like and Exactly. So that's, you know, that's a much harder. And I want to hear everything from everyone.

Just don't talk about it, okay? I guess I won't talk about it for 10 minutes and then I'm going to go tell somebody and be disappointed again. But that's okay. Like, it seems like you've really been able to adopt this mindset where other people's fears are not something that you you let let determine anything about how you move throughout the world. But I know that like you've told me, that anxiety is something that you you deal with. So that's your own fears.

Your brain's fear is like letting you out, you know, shaping the way that you move. And you talk about how you deal with your anxiety and and the fear of, you know, moving based on your own fears. Yeah Well. If we're going to. Go off of an origin story. Let's go back to let's go. Back to little baby Kaitlyn, like the age. Of. Probably even younger than like nine years old. But this is like kind of the first time I remember it and having.

Well, okay, first of all, I had my first panic attack at like nine or ten years old. And even before that, I was a really anxious kid, you know, whether that was like moving around a lot. Or. Following, like my parents getting divorced or like, you know, being and maybe like a little bit more of an unstable setting with like. I'm going to be very vague just for, like, identity protection, I guess with like, you know, people not receiving hate and that kind of thing.

But like navigating or being around abusive family members and that kind of thing. Like in the mix of like my mom trying to figure out like how we were going to continue about life with, like, just, you know, her working and like my dad not being around as much like in, like the earlier years and that kind of stuff. I had my first panic attack at ten and who, like, you know, I say all that because who knows like what the cause of it is. Maybe it is just a genetic thing.

Maybe it was like more of a nature versus nurture type situation. It probably was. Both is probably what I would like to venture towards. And I remember like. My mom. Coming over to me and like handing me this like, right purple. Journal and. Me just telling her like, I don't know what's happening. Like I can't breathe. You know, this is really scary. Like, I'm a ten year old, nine, ten year old. I, I don't know what anxiety is. I just feel like I can breathe. You know? Who knows?

Whatever I was thinking about for that moment, like, I know I was alone. In my room. So this was not something that's like a stuffed animal. It was something was. That happened when you you're in the midst of doing nothing, really. Right. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. It's. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I think I would say like, with you bringing that to light, like, my anxiety is much more like a How do you think, like I think myself until, like the bad, like not so great area is like that.

That's where I can induce my panic and that kind of thing. It's very heady. Like there are situational things sometimes like social anxiety every so often, but not too bad. But like, you know, definitely the heady stuff. But yeah, I remember her like handing me that journal and her just saying like, write down what you were thinking about. Like right before this happened and like, write down what you're thinking about, like after you've come down from it. And like, ever since that. Point.

I've been able to, like, recognize when one's like coming on and that kind of thing. But then like. You know, we move like. How many years later is that like 14 years later to where I am. Now? And it just it feels a lot different now where like, I can catch it and like recognize like the, like thought, the thought pattern, the thought process that I'm in right before I like, start to get like, well, before I start to get to that point, I don't have panic attacks very often anymore.

That's kind of stopped since like sophomore year of college, I want to say. But it was a good chunk of my childhood, that's for sure. And like now I can like, let myself think about. I still. Don't want to I still don't know what I want to do with my life or. I guess what. Does that even mean? Basically, that means like, what do I want to do to make money, which is like, that's not what I want to do with my life. I'm just trying figure out how do. I. Determine some level of financial security?

And, you know, if I find myself, like, really like hyper focusing on that, I am able to just like, come to my partner as long as like, he has a mental headspace for it to be like, yo, I'm panicking about this again, even though I know we've talked about like, you've got my back and I've got yours, they're just in different capacities. I just need some reassurance right now. And I think like that's kind of where I'm. At now. In terms of like navigating anxiety specifically with that.

Like that's definitely the most relevant. No way comes to. Life right now. So I'm transitioning again. I'm worry what I've found and the anxious people I know. Okay. There's always some degree of their anxiety, not always. There's often some degree of anxiety in which they don't actually want to share with people. They there's always this level that, you know, it's like, okay, I'll talk about anxiety, but there's this part that I can't feel anybody because it's too much.

Like my wife, for example, doesn't ever want to tell our friends about, you know, her social anxiety because she feels like they're going to judge her. And I've talked to many people about it and they're like, yeah, that's that's not where you're like, I feel that way often, but that's not their thing. That is that that it's too much. That's, that's her thing, that's too much that. You know. It's the one thing that she thinks is going to single her out and nobody's going to get it.

But a lot of people do. Do you do you find that there's that thing for you that you're just like, no, I don't want to? Or anybody that. I would say, just like I can really relate to like this social anxiety thing, especially if it's like. A. Newer group of people or people that I don't feel like totally safe around. Yeah. Where like, I haven't maybe had like that.

Deep. Conversation with that person yet or I haven't like, found some kind of common ground I can find myself, like maybe not wanting to share as much about myself. And I think. Maybe I don't know if this. Is true. This like I would have to ask someone I just. Met. But like my interpretation and like, view of myself maybe. And like, the first time I'm meeting someone, like, I would venture to guess maybe I come off a little bit standoffish. I don't know if that's actually the case, though.

Like, I have so many people tell me like, but you're so bubbly. Like, I don't think that's the case. And maybe it truly is just like a really internal thing, but yeah, I guess. I don't know. I'm like, I, I'm really trying to like my brain or else it's like doing not want to share. I feel like I'm asking you to go somewhere that is unfair if I'm not willing to go to the same place for me, it's like my fear of abandonment and being alone is something that I wouldn't even share with myself

for a long time. It was. It was something that like I was like my father and mother got divorced when I was 11. Yeah. And my dad was always gone before that. Anyway, so, like, it's pretty deep seated.

And whenever my wife and I would, you know, argue and divorce, you know, like, yeah, my first thought was, I don't even want to be like, it made me so anxious that it's like I did not want to be alive because it was, you know, despite how beautiful my family is, how much I love living, As soon as that that real threat to my partnership became like, you know, realized it was like, well, I just I'd rather I'd rather quit like that. That's how terrifying it was to me.

And once I was able to, you know, unpack all my stuff and realize that that was my thing, I was able to, you know have deep conversations with my wife and share that with her eventually. So, you know, obviously, nobody ever wants the relationship to end, you know, for any reason. But I had to, you know, really express to the degree in which it really scared me. And, you know, a lot of reassurance from her, a lot of different times. And that was something that was really hard for me to work.

So I just you know, I just wanted to make sure that I was being equitable and, you know, and if you don't want to go that deep, that's totally fine. That's my show. And I really want to. Be yeah. I want people to know that there is often a very dark place and it's okay to have those fears. Just don't don't feel like you have this sort of that burden alone. Hopefully you do have a person that you can share that with because honestly, it's a hurdle.

It's like, Well, of course, I don't want to leave you. I'm sorry that I ever said anything like that. Like I love you. I want to be with you, like I want to do this life together. And I'm committed to doing that. And hearing that made that weight so much. Like sometimes it still feels heavy. But, you know, I can still, by putting words to that fear, it takes so much of the weight out of it.

It makes it you know, it removes so much of the pressure off my chest and I'm able to move much lighter because I share it. And that's part of my authenticity story, is just taking that super deep thing, which I was so embarrassed about. I was like, Yeah, I mean, like what kind of baby threatens to, you know, hurt him, hurt himself, You know, if you leave. That's what it boiled down to. Like, if you leave me, I'm not gonna kill myself.

And it's like, that's not how it was manifesting in me, but that's kind of how it came out. And but looking at it from her angle is like, Well, yeah, it's up to you. Yeah. You know, we have a lot of responsibility. It would seem happy and yeah, I'm here for you and instead of just, you know, struggling along with that the rest of my life, I just shared it with her. And things got a lot better. A lot faster. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well, thank you for sharing that. I think that helps me, like.

Think a little bit more about, like, the question you were asking. I was kind of like, Like, how do I approach. This? Like I'm again, totally an open book. Like there even some things like earlier in the conversation, we're like, you know, we were on the topic of parenthood and there were things that I was like, I don't want to share that about myself right now. And like, I'm just able to like, you know, push past it.

But when it comes to this, like, I guess I would say my biggest fear is just like. Sharing my sadness. I think I think I'm trying to think of. Like the best way to phrase this. I keep repeating myself. I feel like I have this of, well, if I'm just happy all the time, or if I'm just seemingly happy all the time, I guess the key word is seemingly like no one else is going to feel as sad because I can be like a little dancing monkey or like whatever it may be. And like. I remember.

Feeling that like, obligation or like weird responsibility, like a very young. Age. Not that like, my mom pushed this on me, like, forcibly. It was just kind of like she was going through a divorce and had, like, two little kids that she was trying to take care of on her own and that kind of thing. And I think that that is something that has kind of always like, stuck with me, like always, just like always trying to be a ray of sunshine or trying to be like, I don't know.

Like. A distraction from, like sadness and like at this point now, like. Yeah, I was totally find even. With like my pole dance journey and is okay if I talked about. That. Okay. Like even with my pole dance journey and like the community I found with and the, and like the different types of that, there are even passport fitness of like perfection and form itself. I found like embodiment practices and like movement practices and that kind of thing.

And I think that's like the biggest thing that has like allowed me. To. Recognize that sadness is okay, it's not wrong to be sad. It's not wrong to feel it. It's not wrong to like, want to let it out. I think I've, like always really held that end until recently even like within the last two years and, you know, being able to like, dance that out in a very private, supportive, small group setting has like allowed me to, like. Start. Peeling that out and like different parts of my life.

So yeah, I think like that's kind of the. Most recent like thing I. Was. Definitely been hiding. When you mentioned anxiety and like you mentioned yours with like fear of abandonment, that kind of thing. Like I think a lot of people can relate to that now. So I think I think that's what I have to share with it. I wish I had a more of you. You're so much. More well spoken about this phrase and.

And if it's not any deeper than that, then I'm happy for you because it's not a great feeling to feel that way. It's, you know, to have that amount of like a that amount of, like, weight in your heart whenever you know that feeling. So if that is your story, that's that's good. And like I don't want that for anybody else. Yeah I just know that sharing it helped me a lot. And, and so talking about all like it is definitely not a topic that's off the table because it's part of your story.

Yeah. I was going to bring up body image and, can help whole dancers kind of balance that for you? But it seems like all the answers done more than than just help you with your own body image. Like kind of talk to me about how you found pole dance. I know that that's something that, like, I have no, I have no relationship with, like, you know, I've heard that some people think, you know, they have stereotypes about it and think it's this way.

And, you know, I think it's all about like, you know, attention seeking and sexualization and the other side is that it's it's so much more than that and that it's you know, it's a very deep practice. It's similar to yoga or whatever else. And so tell me what it is for you. Yeah, well, I'll say, first of all, I found. It. For. Myself in. 2020. It was. Spring summer of 20. 20. So I'm sorry. Can you hear that in the background or. No, shoot. Okay. That's okay.

I'm so sorry. Hold on. Let me. I think. What can I do to fix this? Maybe I don't hear him. Can you still. But can. Hear that. Up there? That's okay. Shoot. my God. I'm so sorry. I like I can. I'm trying to get the best. I could go into the bathroom. No, that's okay. Okay. Okay, okay, okay. Sorry. I'm like, I want to get this off topic, but I do want to ruin your audio. So everybody. Okay, so I will start by saying. That I found my pole dance journey. In 2020 and. It was like spring or summer.

Like some things were starting to lift, but it was definitely like, you know, wear the mask in the studio and that kind of stuff. Like, it was definitely a weird time, such a strange time to find it. But you know. What better time to like try a new hobby even then, because there was only so many things we could be doing. And I tried it out and fell in love with it. And it was it was just the whole fitness aspect of it.

I hadn't even discovered like the X Factor in body movement, like side of what pole could be. And you know, that didn't happen until two years later. So I was just trying it out in college and like it was a really nice small pole studio. I actually happened to know the owner from childhood because I went to school, I went to undergrad in the same town that I grew up in. So it was just like, Whoa, small world, like the studio owner.

Like I knew her when I was a kid and like, that was super cool. But. You know, moving to, well, what. Year would this have been? So I'm like trying to do math in my head personally. Is everything still sounding okay? But that's, you know. I Are you sure? I tell my family to be quiet whenever I'm recording because I'm, you know, this is my thing. That's your guess. And I don't want to make feel like, you know. man. No, it's your. Thing. He's just also working right now.

Yeah. Sorry. This is. This has been the really fun, right? Yeah. I feel that. Navigation is a full time traveler. So let's see what I'm going to do. Actually, now, it's okay. Do you have a balcony or a patio? But I feel so unprofessional. I, I apologize. Immensity of a patio. I'm. Let's try that. I'm sorry to make you move around. In the. System with me, Okay? No, you're. I mean, like, I would prefer this. To if it was. Reversed. I just wear, like, such a small little, like, apartment setup.

I'm like, I don't know what to do. It's no one out here right now, so we should be good. I'll take. Intermission. I don't know. And it sounds like you're here. There's a rooster lo constant talking. Yeah, Another person. Fair, fair, fair. For forever. Okay, I'm going to hold the microphone. So funny. You're clips are going to be awesome. Yeah. Please relax. You didn't do anything wrong. I'm. I fully understand. Food is only fun, so I'm my face always look like this.

I have a resting bitch, so it's okay. Okay. Thank you. No, no. No, you're fine. I'm just like, my God. Like, that's distracting to me. It must be very distracting. Yeah, that's something. okay. We're going to cut back and you're going to start from the top so you can cut all that out. Okay, cool. All right. Yeah. So my. Whole journey started. In 20. At a studio that was, like, ten, 15 minutes away from where I was living in my college town. Super cool.

I fell in love with, like, the movement art form just for what it was is like a like a physical challenge, just a totally different to work out. I was like, definitely starting to. Not enjoy. Your typical, like, gym routine. Like, just felt it felt forced. It felt like way to goal oriented. Not that pole fitness isn't goal oriented because you know you want to try to make whatever type of. Pose. And like try all these really complicated tricks. And. Reach like.

It's. Just like it's just like a different like it's a different goal orientation, I guess that doesn't feel so pinned down on the way you look, because I felt I was starting to fall into that mindset with the gym a lot, which not like everyone does. Like, I'm sure there are plenty of people who are like, I just love the way it makes me feel like I feel that way with yoga. I feel that way with pole. It's just this is just my own personal journey.

And so I fell in love with like, just the whole fitness side of things at first. And then. Fast. Forward. A year or two years down the line I think I had like a six month break in between just because of affordability. When I briefly lived in Los Angeles and like all the studios surrounding, were just way too expensive. I couldn't afford it. I was working like a barista job and trying to do like what was it called?

Like conservation work that was just not very funded because none of that, nothing earth oriented really ever is if you're going to try to go into the research realm. But, you know, then I moved to Santa Cruz up north in California, and once I had made a little bit of money from the new job I found there, I was like, okay, like it's definitely in the budget to be able to go to the studio. Like I'm going to go back to. It and I join code. And it was just a blast.

It was like such a welcoming community. I had heard about this factory before, but I had never been able to try it because the studio before that, The X Factor instructor that they had X Factor is a form of embodiment movement. If you want to research it, I invite you to research it if you're interested. I'm just not a professional. I like explaining it, so I'm not going to dive into that side too much. But it's basically free flowing movement that you can integrate with pole dance.

And I had always wanted to try it and didn't get to until then. So I tried it out in Santa Cruz. And you know, the studio owner. Was the main instructor for that class. And her and I just became like this. And we still are. I think I'm going to be talking to her like later on this week. And it was just like such an awesome, like instant group of friends on a deeper level.

Like it wasn't your typical small talk stuff that you would encounter, like at work, you know, like we actually got to talk about really interesting stuff and find common ground with like body image stuff in general, because that's what we're looping it all into, you know, with like, you know, how Pole Dance and X Factor in particular has really helped us like find more love for ourselves in the different ways that we move and the different ways that we look and that kind of thing.

And so it just I don't know, it just it just kind of blossomed from there. And I really am missing it right now. It's so hard to like, not be with all of them while I'm traveling, but it's. Cool we get to do this. But yeah. I, I don't know if I answered the question a little bit. I could die for a little bit more and if you wanted to know more. But I know you said it's not a word you're too familiar with. So is there anything more than I can like?

Brands lie to us and like Body image is another way that my brain likes to me is it's. Yeah. In episode 14, I talked with my good friend Larisa about being like being big, like being in a big body, like I'm person £350 and it's, it is very easy to not line up with your body whenever you're bigger because America's perception big people is not good. So it's it would be easy for me to discount you being a smaller person and not having the best body image.

But yeah, definitely don't to do that because it's not a choice as to whether what size you are depends on like if you feel good in your body or not. It's just either you do or you don't. And what was it about you that that felt uncomfortable in your body? Like, how did like, how did that manifest for you? Totally. Yeah I do totally recognize like how how different like each of our experiences is with that. I've had a person in the past, like bring that up to me,

someone I was friends with. At. You know, a younger time, a younger age, middle school, high school. This friendship isn't really prevailing as much anymore, but that has nothing to do with the body image stuff like doesn't matter. The. You know, me just setting boundaries for myself. And if they're not respected, then I have to make space for people.

Anyways, that's totally different. Tangent I would say like the beginning of my journey with all this body image stuff and like again, the whole point of me, like bringing up all that stuff with that past friend was just like recognizing like how different her and I, her eyes experiences were growing up, especially in the town that we did grow up in. But like said in the US in general.

Was I was and I. I recognize that my mom, like I love her so much like this is not me trying to criticize her or anything like that. It's just like the, the different versions of like what we consider like body positivity and body neutrality just have changed so much since the early 2000 to now, and I'm hoping it still does continue to change. But the biggest thing I remember growing up was like I was very skinny as a child. I was very fit, I was very athletic.

I could do all the sports like I loved that stuff. And my mom always praised my body, like kind of to a degree that I don't think I would say doesn't really occur for most people. And so I don't think I really had like an actual, like, conscious thought about like I never questioned that growing up. I was just kind of like, okay, mom, like, that's weird. Or like. Whatever. And then like going into college and having much more of a focus on. School.

And research and clubs and that kind of thing didn't leave as much room for activity. As well. As, you know, entering a deeper stage of puberty. And most women experience. A. Metabolism that slows as they get a little bit older and like having that drop off and then seeing my body change was kind of when that started to happen. And I was like, well, this isn't the same body that my mom say is kind of where. Where and when. I was thinking about the way I looked a lot more than I ever had before.

So it's just it's like a totally like. I don't want to. See flip flopped. I can't think of the best way to, like, describe it because like, worry about now and in the U.S., like I'm considered like mid-sized, not big, not small, mid-sized. And like, that's just something that's no where I had been before, like in my younger years. And so. You know, in society still, like in the U.S. particularly, to like smaller bodies are what are considered the ideal and the standard.

And like the best like whatever you want to call it for what it is, it's like going into the pole dance community and. Like if you're going to be doing a pole trick and you're going to be going upside down, hanging on a leg, hanging on an arm and that kind of thing. You're not wearing very. Much clothing. You're not going to stick if you don't. So there's a lot of like. It's a big. Exposure therapy thing is like the best way I could describe it.

And, you know, we're already told and society taught our bodies and that kind of thing like you shouldn't be showing expires. Ian Like I should dive into that totally other time with like the sexualization of women's eyes in particular but bodies and. How. Yeah. Just. it was just like total exposure therapy to like, okay, I'm like. In. A sports bra and underwear right now in front of others or booty shorts or whatever. And it's like. It's for. Safety, like the grippy pants, Like. Hold on to her.

Okay, then just stop recording. Okay, then. Can you hear me? Okay, then. Can you hear me? So you hear me banging Bruce, You look like you had a quick workout. Okay, cool. Okay, we're back. Yeah, it's. I'm like, over. Here panicking inside. I'm like. This person confirmable at the moment. Recording this podcast. What's your feeling right now? Like, let's be authentic. And, you know, so the audience, like, we've been having some technical difficulties.

We're doing this on a and you know, in a remote situation and stuff happens and then all the stuff has been happening right now. So Caitlyn is dealing with some anxiety, like, tell us what you're going through right now. Yeah, I just overall. Like I wanted to say, the thoughts that are bouncing around my head are like, this is unprofessional, this is rude. I'm wasting his time. Like, I. Am. Becoming a problem that I never thought I would become like that kind of thing.

Like just fear of like being a terrible guest. Like, you were such a wonderful guest on my podcast, and I'm like, I know I can do this. Like. This shouldn't. Be a problem. With like. Of course, of all days, it's like boyfriend's talking really loud, but he's on a meeting and talk. About the reality of. Like the reality of it is you're doing me a favor by coming on my podcast like you, like I appreciate you as a guest. So, you know, you're helping grow my audience by us working together.

So that is like, I'm thankful for you being, you know. Well, thank you so much. And it is a collaborative thing. And when you collaborate with. Goes both. Ways, man. You have to accept that there's going to be stuff out of your control like it is absolutely out of my control. If you would have showed up, you know, with crap all over your face and totally unprepared to do a podcast, you're like still half drunk the night before or whatever, I would have been totally out my control.

Like, I trusted that you were somebody who wanted to come on my podcast and, you know, and would show up ready to blow on it. And you've done that and you've been open and you've shared your life and that's really, for me, the only thing it takes to be a successful guest on my gear. Come on, be honest, you know, be vulnerable when you feel comfortable doing so and help us, you know, see your story and health and how authenticity has played into it.

And even in this moment, like that's something that, you know, you could be like, no, let's not talk about this. Just move on. And I think it's important to like to be in this moment for a second and appreciate that stuff happened. And whenever stuff happens, it's important to allow yourself. GRACE It's not. Nothing that's happened has been your fault. It's been completely out of your control it has been Internet, it's been hardware, it's been your boyfriend.

It's all things that like there was nothing you could have done to prepare for that. You came on as a prepared guest. You did what you're supposed to do and stuff still happens. So by breathing in and then breathe out like let it go. Right? Good. Yeah. No, I love it. I love it. You're me back down to earth here. I'm like, It's so true. It's a lot of our country. You know, You've got professionals. You know, We don't have those phobias. I don't know. I don't know about that.

So over here, like, wow, people are like, bulk recording their episodes. I'm like, it's it's the end of Monday. And I have two people who said yes to podcasting with me, but they still. Haven't serious. Scheduled it. Up on my countdown. I mean, they think I was. Late to the game. Another podcaster I know was like, Hey, like last week. And I was like, No, not yet. Let me send it to you in a minute. And like, I want that one up because it does make things a lot easier scheduling wise.

But for me, the idea of not having a podcast, yes, Yeah. Or the week that it's supposed to be released, I think I'm recording for episode today is episode 17. I released episode ten today, it's nine or ten. So yeah, I'm thank you very much. But also I'm engaged to. Do something, so I'm on it. Like, I don't want to, you know, I can I'm super about this life.

So I also I know we've got a movie coming up, so there's a lot of things that I don't want to lose progress and momentum because we're moving.

I don't know if I'm going to find people immediately whenever we get to where we're going to that are going to want to show like, you know, luckily I've been able to find a pretty good remote, you know, all of guest, but like I've got scheduled episodes that'll pretty much cover me through November, November by the end of next week I'll have reported I'm thanks. That's amazing. You that's like Pat on the back, dude. Over here like. I don't know how you do this.

Like, the outreach is impressive. Like, it sounds like. Are you, like, getting. Out into your community and doing. That, or are you like just mass, like cold messaging people day in and day out? Like, I want to know your secret because I'm like, Well, hopefully I have someone on this week. If not, I guess. Zach's. Going to come on. That's my partner. He's going to come on. I mean, that's my bullshit around that.

Because I never heard because would come out. No. It wasn't just because she was convenient. That definitely helped. But I went into, like, you know, starting with authenticity. Yeah, I knew that me and my wife both struggled with, you know, at times. Total. Syndrome. I knew that that was something that I, I wanted to talk about. So I was like, why not start this whole thing with my partner and everything else? And I know I'm comfortable.

I know I'll be able to, like, show my best self with my partner. So that's how I started. But as far as reaching out to other people, a lot of it has been people I met from my past job. Yeah, networking was part of my job. So like the people I networked with, like I kept those contacts and I've stayed in touch with them and like, okay, you know, a couple of them have been my mentors.

other people I worked with at school, like Bree, there's been nobody off the table for me that I thought would be a good guest for the show. It's like we've met, and I thought you'd be a good guest. Like, I'm going to reach out to you if we haven't met. And I've seen you on, like, the Riverside Group, and, you know, I'm just like, Hey, would you be interested? Like, what? Worst thing they can? So I like. That.

Like I had somebody who was getting they just started a whole podcasting thing and, you know, I was like, Hey, would you like to do an episode? And they're like, sounds so awesome. I listen to a podcast and it was, you know, it was cool. It wasn't exactly for me, but, you know, I thought she would have been a good guest. And she reached back I was like, actually, you know, I talking to my partner, I decided to solely focus on, you know, building relationships that have to do with my field.

And it was like, okay, cool. You know, that it it hurt. Initially, I was like, damn, because my audience is everybody like often, I mean, like I've got a target audience to really everybody has to deal with making the choice every day to either be authentic or not. That's something everybody deals with. So my niche doesn't necessarily fit into other people's niche, but it's like everybody fits in the mine. So there's going to be people who are going to say like, Yeah, we don't really align.

I'm like, Are you not authentic in your business? Like, are you are you sure? So, and you know, I might go ahead, but yeah. Yeah yeah. You know, this. Sorry that you're just you're getting me thinking about, like, some of the stuff I've been trying out, like, in terms of, like, alternative, like, profession or job or, like, whatever moneymaking thing. And like, the most recent thing I've been doing is like, trying out copywriting. And excuse me.

I initially got stoked out, stoked about it because I'm like, like there's so many like businesses that I know I believe in that I could like, do this with. But like the key there is like, it's the businesses that I believe in. And so live back to now. Where. I'm like actually practicing the work. And you know, just. Trying to write. Because write writer's block is such. A is another thing. Unfortunate thing just like artist block. Or so Got it.

But it's like maybe I report and I don't like for myself what was up. I feel like I have all these really great ideas when I'm like walking around and then I get home and like, have my schedule write down time. Like. What am I doing? But like, but yeah, like I've been noticing the most writer's block I've been getting is when I'm not stoked about the person or business I'm writing for. And the reason I feel that is because I have an initial gut reaction of being like. I don't think this.

Person is as legit as. They say they. Are feeling. The vibes. The vibes I'm getting from this make me feel icky and I feel like doing it. Do you know what I mean? Like, and I hate to like, be judgmental. I feel like it comes off as judgmental at first, but then I'm like, well, there's there's got to be a reason that. Definitely there's. Something. Inside by how I feel about it. I don't know.

But it's like I've been trying to prepare myself for the situation because at some point somebody's going to come into my show about authenticity and it's going to just all this lot, but it's going to be like a total liar and they're going to not be honest with their story. They're not in. They're going to so they're, you know, trying to take advantage of my audience. And I feel I feel a way about that. No, I, I don't have like this huge following or whatever.

But if I did, I still feel the same way. I care about the people who are taking the time to listen to my show like I care about people anyways. And I don't them to get taken advantage of by somebody who's unwilling to be honest. Like, if you want to come on my show and tell people like your your darkest stuff and be like, Yeah. Yeah. Pretty nasty. And like, I'd rather that than somebody come on and like, pretend to be okay. Like, that's unfair to people who are showing up and are not okay.

Like, you know, there was when I did an intro for episode that hasn't come out and I was like, you know, yeah, as I'm writing this, I just had to argue with my wife and I've got to I've got to clear that off my chest before I'm able to finish writing for this episode because I don't want to be lying to my audience. I don't want to pretend like I'm okay when I'm not. And, you know, it made me feel okay for one. But also, like, I just yeah, I just think that that idea makes me feel really angry.

Like, don't do that. Don't come on my show and don't like it, but I know what's going to happen. I just don't know if, like, whenever that if I try to like, poke holes in their stories, whenever I figure out they're not being authentic or if I just like, end it. And I'm like, you know what? This is not going to work out. Or if I recorded in the area, like, I'm still like I'm trying to figure that out, or if I just recorded, this person's a liar, don't listen to any of this.

Yeah, I it's, it's interesting. Like we haven't seen any of that in the particular recording platform, Facebook group that we met each other. And because I would be interested in how many other people maybe have navigated that or have the same fear because that has definitely come up in my head before. Like, you know, you don't know someone. And.

As you out to more and more people, like who knows who you're going to encounter like you could even argue out for like you and I like, we've only ever met face to face two times now. And like, you know, we message on messenger, like trying to, like, plan our stuff, but it's like we only know each other as much trust as, like, how much we've interacted and that's been twice. So it's like you could even argue that with our interactions.

Like it's a scary thought, like, you know, having people pretending that they're being that they're having people pretend that they're okay and that kind of thing, like, yeah. That's. So incredibly common just in day to day life that like. How would you even filter that out? It's such a terrible fire. But I feel like you could totally, like recognize it for what it is. But in terms of what I'm approaching that trying. To do. People standpoint, how you. Go forward like bear my Soul to.

A degree with my introduction, like, you know, generally with people, I'm like, Hey, this is like, I see this in you, I see you and I want you to see me like, whatever way and like, really try to create a space where it's like, this is me being honest. Like this is what my honesty looks like. Hopefully you're going to matter energy. And so far it's been really, really successful.

You know, people have been like one of my one of my good friends, a mentor is Peter Watt came on the and he he really rocked my world because he's somebody who I think of as a really like, bright networking person, somebody who's like, you know, he's not like trying hard, but he's like kind of always on because like, everybody loves to talk to him. He's always like, you know, like, you know, people gather around him in a room and whenever we talked, he was like, yeah, that's not me.

Like, I don't like I do that. But that's what I do is not who I am. And he's like, for a long time, like I was dealing with so much and I was putting myself out there to do that. And, and I was like, and he like, did he he laid it out for me in a way that I would like. It just it floored me.

And that was whenever I really recognized the power that my show could have and the power and me, you know, as the host of that, is that I, by putting myself out there, other people will put themselves out there too. And that's going to help people. I know it's going to help people. And that's really exciting for me. And now I'm on a tangent. So yeah, I need to rein myself back in now. Let's let's go on tangents together. I can I feel like I can relate to that though.

Like I know we opened up to one another. I think this might have just been while we were messaging, but just like, like how, how beautiful and how much more fulfilling it is to, like, just dive into the nasty, deep, like, dark of. Who we. Are is like so much more fulfilling to share that interaction with someone than to just be like, How's it. Going? I hate, you know, like. I hate that. Question. Well, not just. I hate that question. People. I know they're going to give me a real answer.

And so it's like those people I like asking like my friend Courtney is like, Hey, how's it going? And so, you know, some days it's going to. Be like, right, Man. Tell you it's been great. Like, you know, something amazing because he appreciates life to it, like a really impressive degree. But sometimes she will like, lay it on me. I've been like, today has been so much and I love that about her.

I love knowing that it's like we're to skip through all the B.S. and we're going to get right into it whenever I love. Yeah. So let's like, I'm going to hop back on my questions because. Yeah. There's still stuff I want to know about you that I think that my audience will appreciate. Yes, of course. I'm sorry. So you said your your anxiety isn't really social, but. Yeah, of course, if you're.

In a brand new place every ten days to two months, you're starting over, like so, like the safety and security that you build up in, you know, kind of your, your home, wherever that may be for the current place like that goes out the window. And does that start that mindset again where you start asking yourself questions and start doubting yourself whenever you're trying to build a community or there is this again where you tap into that.

Like that doesn't fit my mindset and I'm just going to go do my thing. Yeah, honestly, the first. The first six. Weeks, which. Two weeks? Two weeks, Two weeks. That's what the first six weeks were. I had like that anxious feeling of like, maybe this isn't right. Like, maybe this isn't what we should be doing or maybe what I should be doing.

And I to say we like, I can't speak for what my partner was feeling, but I definitely doubted it a bit more when our location was changing so frequently because was so exhausting. It was like. A. A different group and type of group of people. Each time that it was just like so overwhelming to like, take in all that stimulus and like, you know, recognize like, okay, this person's like, fun to talk to.

Like, I can talk to them while I'm making my dinner in the hostel kitchen or, that person said something that like, really rubbed me the wrong way about how they felt about the Barbie movie. Like, I'm just speaking from something funny that happened, a co workplace we stayed. At and. Yeah, anyways, like it was just like overwhelming to have that be the case. And now we're. Staying in the same town for two and a half months. I think we're a month.

And now to being here and it just feels worlds different. It's so nice like we are able to immerse ourselves like we went on this really awesome chocolate tour yesterday of like, start to finish. Here's how to cows harvested, here's the history of it.

History of it was like colonization and the different ways that like different, like old have like used it and that kind of thing all the way up until we made the chocolate ourselves, like getting to do that kind of stuff in a community and like, learn about this really cool farm and like the locals that they interact with and like trade stuff with and that kind of thing. Like we weren't getting that when we were changing every two weeks.

And I think like, you know, not everyone can do this because of, you know, whatever it is you're trying to do in your working world. And so I just feel like it's like such a disservice for other people. Who. Do get to travel for like there ten days a year. And like, this was me, you know, like I had that time and like that was it. And it's like you're really just much more in that vacation mindset.

And like, now we're getting to just like really, you know get the scoop on like, here are these really good local places to eat and like that kind of thing. And like, I'm becoming really good friends with a yoga teacher that I've been like going to classes with like since we've been here and, you know, making friends with other people at the hostels, like the people that work at the hostels, Like there's this one girl and her and I just get excited to see each other every time. And like.

You know, every time we see each other, my Spanish is like. Just a little bit better. Than that kind of thing. So yeah, it's just like it's worlds different now where I feel like I'm not like the doubt will inevitably, like, come up every now and then when I'm like, trying to figure out how I want to make money and like that kind of thing. But other than that, like, it's been really cool. To. Dive in with people a more here and dive in

with like the great nature spots and that kind of thing. And I am definitely. Feeling a lot like I'm not I'm not attaching to like whatever stuff may arise. It kind of just it comes up and I'm like. that's not my only do not, you know what I mean? Six months. So alcohol. Yeah. And you still are currently like considerably reduced like you know once a month in your, you know, alcohol intake. How has that transformed this travel life has been for you as it made a huge difference.

Yeah, well I'll say the six month thing started. Around. I think I think it was like. August. 2022 and so I did that until I heard maybe it was a little bit before that. I can't remember exactly. It was like summer 2022 and then like six months down the line. And then after that I was like, okay, like I'll have a drink every now and then. And now.

That we're traveling, it's been interesting, like going to each place and seeing the different way that the communities are like, centered or surrounded or like focused around like whatever particular thing, whether that's surfing. Or the. Beach or partying at the beach or like, you know, that like, whatever it may be, wherever, like most people gravitate towards like on a particular, like. Day. Evening, whatever. And yeah, now, like it's so funny. But like, yeah.

So it's this episode probably coming out a while from now, right? Yes. Yeah. Because you're really going to, you know like bulk recording episodes. So. Okay. For the listeners perspective, it is a. Monday while. Bruce and I are speaking with one another and two nights ago Saturday. So Saturday night my partner and I were like. What should we do? Like, what do.

We want to go do tonight? Like, there's not much to do except go to a bar or like, go to a restaurant or like, go to a club or a beach club or whatever. And we're like. A. 24 to 26 year old like. Questioning that. And I feel. Like, right. You know. Most people in our age group, like, that's. Kind of not the norm. So we kind of just laugh and I'm like, gosh, we sound. Like really old people. And I'm like, Well, there's nothing wrong with that. Like, we definitely don't like.

It would be easy to, like, boil it down to just, Wow, we sound like old people. But it it really is so much more than that. Like, that's just the joke that we have. Like, there's like definitely layers of like what alcohol has been in each of our. Families and. You know, drugs tying into that as well and that kind of thing, too, where like, you know, we're out of our college phases and like college timelines and that kind of thing.

We're like partying every weekend isn't really something that feels like super fulfilling personally for. Then you don't have to apologize. For. This is. Not you can edit it and say, I feel you're mad like, I am. I'm here. For you, for you to be yourself. You don't have to bother. You're welcome. Okay. Nobody thinks you're judging the. Thank you. I just don't want people to feel. Like in person because it's like you. Were judging yourself. It's so much. More than just like. Okay, okay.

Yeah, just. Just tell me, like, you know, So you're thinking. No, you're also judging you because. You're, you know, you're not participating in the lifestyle that's normal for your age. And that's that's been that's been good, right? You've been able to appreciate your the places where. You're traveling a lot. Yeah. Yeah, I would have at your age, for sure.

I would have been drunk most of the time and I would have, you know, looking back on it, that would have been super depressing to have traveled somewhere like Costa Rica and not have a great memory of it, because I was just wasted. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel like my biggest problem with it was just like, you know, I'm not like 100% sober anymore. I tried that out for six months and then I was like, okay, like, I feel like my view on it is a little different. Now, and.

I'm fine having like a drink occasionally and that sort of deal. So it's like, you know, like that's where I'm at currently. I just, I just don't want anyone to like, hear this and be like, well, being like, I'm doing this all wrong. That's obviously not the case. Like, alcohol's been around. Longer. Than humans have been around. It. That was. Happens. All the fruit falls on the ground, you know what I mean? A little fruit falls on the beer. Yeah. Let's see this. Let's see.

So the thought process and just like the idea of it came up a few months before, even though, like, actually, like, really stuck with it, like, leading up to that, it was like there, like a soberish sound, which sober. That's okay. Soberish again. And then like before the soberish phase, I was like, I'm moving the microphone around. So I got that the like. It was like first Soberish phase sober Soberish again. And that's currently right before the first Soberish situation. I guess. I was.

Experiencing maybe a little bit of like some social pressure and like, yeah, I guess we'll just call it for what it is like some social pressure of like, okay, I'm at a new job, I'm in a new town. Like I want to get to know my coworkers, like let's try to make some friends. And so I would go out with them and.

Party. Pretty much every weekend. And I think that was honestly the most I've partied like even before college, like I was a grandma, even in college, like I went to the occasional frat party and like. You know, the. Occasional and that kind of thing. But it was definitely not an every weekend situation this particular time. Moving to a new town. It was every weekend for like a month or two. And I just remember feeling exhausted afterwards and like.

Sad. Because with those high highs, you get those low, low. It's like that typical thing they talk about with, you know, any kind of like alcohol education or like substance abuse education. And I sort of deal. And. I just hated. How. It was like affecting me going into work, like I wasn't doing it on working nights or anything, but it just made me feel like I didn't actually have a weekend because of how tired I was, if that makes sense.

Because I was just drunk the whole time or high the whole time or whatever it is. And so I. Kind of just toyed around with the idea for a little bit, and then I just like went for it. I like, you know, like, why don't I just like, try this out and see how, you know, a like how different, how I spend my weekend time differently and. B Yeah. What kind of people am I still hanging around after that fact.

And I think that was like the big thing for me was what people are still going to be around afterwards. And that was the big thing that like started to make stuff a little more clear to me with what kind of relationships I actually want to have in my life. Not even romantic, like I know what kind of romantic relationships I want to have in my life, but like friendships and the of interactions I want to have with people. And I think that's. You know, kind of what the biggest deal was.

And then I think I like kind of lightly touched on like some of the familial stuff, like definitely for my partner and partner and I. The. Like vulnerable share here. Like I just I don't want to dive too much into it because it's like it's so hard. Like I know I'm not the most eloquently spoken person, so it's hard for me to like, want to give the details, but also not like someone who I'm still close with in my life, you know?

And so like, you know, there's other stuff in the mix, I guess like the most the most like vaguely vague thing I can mention is like recognizing how different a loved one in my life talks to. Me. And interacts with me when they've had, say, an entire bottle of wine versus not. And like that. That's like a big thing that I recognized. And. Just didn't like.

And I were calling it out and it started this huge fight and, you know, like that uncomfortability lingers a little bit, but it's like it's a scary thing to bring up to someone when like substance abuse. I mean. Let me tell you, like appreciate greatly for you telling your story, but I also understand that there are parts of your story that belong to other people.

So, you know, in not sharing exactly who you know is dealing with whatever substance, however they're dealing with it, I totally respect that. And I appreciate that there is a degree of, you know, telling your story that you can you can do without, like you said, outing somebody else's or, you know, telling somebody else's story for them in a way that they probably wouldn't tell it.

So that's I appreciate that. And for to like it is almost like right socially unacceptable at this day and age to be sober just because like, you know, if if you're not like a recovering alcoholic, people are like what? You don't drink. And that's, you know, I yeah, I have I enjoy, you know, drink on the weekends. You know, sometimes I'll have a drink. Yeah, whatever. But I went through a phase where I didn't drink for a long period of time to get there.

I had to, like, completely change my relationship with alcohol. I never drank to get drunk. Like, I haven't been drunk in so long. That is that. The difference is whenever I first.

Exactly. Yes. Whenever I got to college, I'd never had a drink before I got to college and I got to college and immediately got drunk and pretty much stayed drunk for, you know, six months and then only ever drank to get like, wasted and the idea of alcoholism was introduced to me and I was like, I don't think that's it.

I don't think I call it like, you know, I was very you know, we we probably had that same fight that you and your loved one had where I was like, no, no, you don't know what you're talking about. But what what was different for me is that I, I, I maintain that to this day because I can have a drink now and not try to chase them a whole bottle or try to, you know, get that feeling back that, you know, that you get whenever you're, you know, like Right.

I didn't know how to make good decisions like that was. My big thing is I came into college having had my whole life running for me and I didn't know how to I didn't know how to make decisions for myself. So whenever it came to that, I made like, what other strong personalities in my life make decisions and strong personalities in college are often bad ones. If you're if you're hanging out, we're in the group I was hanging out with.

I had other strong personalities who tried to take me under and like say, Hey, why don't you come to this? This thing that is not a drinking thing. It's like a service, you know, like a community service type thing. And I tried that and I was like, isn't as fun. So I went with the other person who was like, drink, drink, tried drugs, do this, do that. And I was like, okay, okay, okay.

And whenever I started to take responsibility for my own life and learn to make my own decisions, I had to back away from everything and look again at what my why was moving forward. And that still didn't work for a long time until I had a kid. And then my way became very clear and obvious. And it was that that lined me up after a while. It wasn't that it wasn't bright out. There was still two or three years where I was not doing good. Yeah, it's.

It's wild how I want to see particular in the US, but I, I would venture to say you can see this in most places. I don't know if that's fully true. I haven't been to Europe yet, but I, I mean, I don't know, it's maybe just like an age group thing, but like. The way. The way it's like sold to us and that kind of thing is like access, access, access. Like, you've got to be having a good time. A good time means you don't remember what happened the night before and.

like it's this glorious, like, party filled life and like, that kind of thing. And it's like. It's. Like such a. An. Inaccurate representation of, like, what actually is fun, in my opinion, personally, like, and this is not like, I am not here to do like. I. Let's see what I know It's September. I had yeah, yeah, September when we're recording not September when this comes out.

Yeah. I had like one of my really good friends through a surprise going away birthday party mixture thing for me right before we left. And that was the first time I had gotten like I was like blackout drunk or anything, but I had gotten like considerably like, tipsy for the first time in, like, a year, in all honesty. And, you know, with that being said, like I say, all of this, but like, I'm by no means perfect and like, that hasn't come up since then.

It was definitely like, let's enjoy it because we're all together kind of thing. But again, it had to be facilitated by alcohol and like that's kind of like what I want to still question. Like, I want to challenge like just society in general, not what the people that were there. Like I had a blast. It was great to get to hang out with them and, you know, have like one last little party together and that sort of deal. But like, why is that?

Why was it that way as opposed to some other way and like that kind of thing? You know what I mean? And like, that's no like Curtis criticism. I'm like the way she put that party together. So every time my critics together, it's just me questioning. I will say this. I hope you're able to enjoy your friends. There is either something wrong with your friends. Yeah. Something wrong with your life or something wrong with you. And saying that doesn't mean that they're bad friends.

That means that maybe they're not the right friends for you. Yeah, like I did not realize for the longest time that I hadn't been the right friend for a lot. Like I hadn't carried a group of friends over for in any period of my life until I started living in Oklahoma City ten years ago or so. I had no friends from before that, really, and that's because I had always spent my life trying to be what I thought they wanted and they didn't. Nobody wants that.

Nobody wants a person who's trying to make you like them. Right. That's and if they do want to use you some way. So that's not who you should be looking. But getting through that, I realized that I also didn't like those people. Yeah, I. Was like trying, so hard to get these people to like me. And what I found was that they weren't even like the right people for me, the people who I enjoy being around. I don't have like, I don't have to be drunk to enjoy a conversation with them.

No way, shape or form. We have great deep conversations, whether we're drinking or not, because we're those types of people. Yeah, like I'm ADHD and I know that my capacity for small talk is super low. Like, I don't really I'm not here for it. And it's it's not that I won't try to try to, you know, if there's somebody I care about and I want to, you know, I want to foster that relationship, I will try to, you know, be interested in something that I'm not interested in.

Like I'll try to mire through it. But in the endgame, the people I want to be around are people who want to talk about real stuff real quick. And that's who that's who I surround myself with now. And maybe just look at how you're interacting with your people. Are you being honest with them? Yeah, because if you are, things change very quickly. People will fade out who don't belong and you'll start to attract people who do look for that.

You enjoy people who weren't, you know, who are really being themselves. That's I mean, that's the whole the whole platform of my coaching is that if you're being fake, you're never going to find what you're looking for because who is looking for the real. You can't find you, but you're hiding. You're hiding the real you. And that's that's in career, that's in friendships, that's in relationships. Like, you can't you can't find those people who connect with the real you because you're hiding.

And so, yeah, that's what I that's my thing about, like, needing to be drunk, hang out with people like you don't you don't need it, but you can like and I'm not knocking drinking because it is nice to not have to be stressed about the shape of life. Taking the edge off is a nice thing to be able to do, but if you need it all the time. There's no totally. Yeah. Yeah. It's like it's something that's so much deeper. I like you can't just, like, go right and go say that to. People that.

You were maybe having those experiences with either, you know, like I, I at least personally, I don't know. I just feel like. Like there's so much more to it that's like, you know, the way that you like, the way that we're told. Like, well, here's how you would approach talking to an addict or here's how you would approach talking to someone who's in an abusive relationship. Like you can't just outright call it out. It scares them away.

You're not going to be able to help them with that kind of thing. Like it just dives so much deeper into like human and all that kind of stuff. And I'm no professional in that realm, but like, in terms of like personal life experience with any kind of substance addiction and that kind of thing, like in my family and, and friends and that kind of thing. Like it truly isn't just like. Definitely a lot of nuance, boom, boom, boom. It's all wrong. Like, they're.

So nuanced, like how you're going to approach it. So it's hard to like. Well, put on my my kid gloves, my will. But whenever it comes to just like, yes, part, it's just like, you know, you're not being honest. That's when I call it out. As soon as soon as I recognize, I'm like, Hey, this is like, Please. yeah. That like, you know, if don't want to if you don't hang out with me, you don't want to talk to me, fine. But please don't come. My space with will be like, I just don't want it.

So I'm about to try again or or don't you know. And that's fine. And that's, you know, that's been a big. Yeah, a big transformation. Get it out of. Here five years. That's not who I always was like I said, I was always going to get people to like me. I was always putting up with stuff that I wasn't really comfortable with and I don't like. That doesn't even sound like me. People who knew me well. My wife would be like, What? Like you? Didn't you put up with work?

Like, why do you do that? And I'm like, I don't know. I just want to get along. I just want people like me and everybody who I so currently hang out with knows that that's not how I roll.

But now, while I occasionally put my foot my mouth, yes, but the people who know me love anyways, you know, and that's the beauty of it is that yeah, you're going to make mistakes in life if you've been yourself, the people who know who you really are and that about you and they're going to say, Yep, you did it again and they're going to be real with you and tell you that you messed up and you're going to apologize because you love us.

People need to want to hurt them and they're going to move on. And that's me tangent thing again. not a tangent. I'm here to listen. I can listen to you talk forever. You're seriously very captivating to listen to. I'm like. Yes, you. The facts give me the life. It's like I feel you're mean 20 years later. I do. I do appreciate. You saying that. You know, I feel pretty confident in the things I say about life, but I also I'm also okay with being shaped by others to a degree.

Like I've got my fundamental self that I'm very confident in, but I also don't want to have such hard edges can't be shaped by somebody else's opinion. Like that's the difference. Like I used to take on everybody's and try to wear it and make it who I was. And what I learned is that being shaped by yeah, I mean not is not disingenuous. It's when you try to be what other people what you think they want that that was where you start being fake.

I want people to like say, hey, man, it seems like you're really above war and I want to take that. And it's like, see how it builds, see how it tastes and be like, Yeah, okay, I can see what you're saying and here's what I feel about that and here's how I'm going to change or not. Like because I want to keep growing. I want to keep getting better. I want people who like me to love me. I want people who love me to love me more. Yeah, that's what social people are. We're social creatures.

So I want to keep growing. And in order to grow instead of like, you know, actually change, like changing and growing, I feel like is we're the difference. Kind of like, I don't want to change. I want to grow like I want to be me, but a bigger, better version of me. And that's before I was like, I'll change and be whatever you want. And yeah, you can only change so many times before you. Have no idea who you are. Yeah, that's. That's where I so. Yeah. No, no. Yeah, we're at that place.

That's what's. Scary. It's so easy to, like, get caught up in it, too. Sorry. We're going to say yes. Please. You said it's scary. Go Go with it. Na na na na na. I was just saying, like, Yeah. It's na. Well, just like, it's just. It's scary How like, how. I don't know, like, big thing that's like, popping up in my head right now is just like what has been targeted sale like my tech talk recently because we all know how that algorithm shit works. Like it's it pinpoints you, it finds you.

And I feel like I see so much like, here's the summer for you to glow up and here's how you have the next glow up. And glow up Globe club club glow up. And I'm like, Shut up. Like. Why am I seeing this? Why are you telling me that? Like, here's a new thing I need to do to be frickin changing myself? Like. Girl should be here. Here's a time where I'm going to use the F word, but it just feels so incredibly relevant. Be so fucking for real.

Are you really going to tell me that in order to make myself better, I have to wake up at 5 a.m.. Make. A whole breakfast? It's actually not that elaborate. It's actually just like diet culture being, like, subliminally, like, projected towards me. And then. Go on a five mile run living off of a fucking banana. Yeah, like you. See that kind of stuff. And there's like obviously so many different versions of that and I'm like, what is the point here?

It's like it's gotten to the point where I'm like, Yeah, report this video. Not interested, not interested, not interested, Stop. Showing me this. Crap. So if I could. Give any takeaway to anyone. Because I would venture to say most of us are consuming some type of media. Like unfollow. The shit that you notice is making you feel like crap that has been like the biggest change for me in terms of like media, like intake and like consumption.

Sorry. Excuse me. Consumption is like if, you don't feel good about it and like. Maybe that is it. You know, you're just comparing yourself to something. Let's, let's. Let's move that out of the way. Recognize like, that's more of an internal thing and like, not that person's particular deal. No. Maybe you can visit that when you're in a better mental space. That's very good. Like I know that my like, just like for a student to blow up because so annoyed.

I have because I was working all the time and and I was looking for new workouts and then like I've stopped working out as much and that's stopped being as much, you know, fitness like ideas. And it started becoming like, you know, something that made me feel bad.

It was like, Well, I'm working out as much like I should workout more, but I don't need like, I know that I don't need to follow this person and have them, like reminding me that I don't look like that this this isn't this isn't right for my life anymore. So I unfollowed them. And my feed is mostly just about stuff that I think is funny that makes me happy. Like that's what my social media especially.

Yeah, like I'm not on TikTok because I know that the algorithm is too good and it will pull me down holes that I won't be able to get back out of 4 hours and I'm too ADHD for that. So like I'm happy with my Instagram reels. Yeah, it's still pretty good and like, it makes me laugh in a better mood. I share stuff with my wife and my friends and some videos that are appropriate to watch with my kids and I leave it at that.

I don't need anybody else to show me what my life could be like because got my life and I and I want to appreciate what my life is. And when you're comparing, you can't appreciate your life for what it is. There's always something that's better, more, you know, less like, you know, even the less and you compare it to as well. And that's that's also not good. You know, it should just be about your life and how living it is. Great. No. It's so much more and.

More and more and more and more and more and more. I'm like, how like, how has that continued to prevail? Like it? I, I guess maybe it's some kind of human psychology thing, but I mean, I don't know. I'm not a professional in that realm, but. How is. That what has prevailed in social media? All this time when everything first came out like I. That's what you. Continue to see.

Like as much as I want to say, like, you know, the more like positive, influential people are out there are out there like all the other stuff is still. Prevailing. Was like, how do we get rid of that coming from this, you know, being anyone? Sure, there are a lot of adults who also compare themselves, but they're not the ones who are like loving the stuff that makes me, you know, it's impressionable youth. Like I am very much not the person. Impressionable who.

Thinks that 13 year olds Instagram like, I don't think that I mean, it's shown that it is like specifically causing more suicide, especially in young girls. And that like that breaks my heart because it's it's a pretty simple fix. Don't give it like I do social media with my daughter. Like, you know, like my oldest who's 13, like sometimes and everybody else kind of sleeping like 18 on social media a little bit.

And we'll scroll together, we'll watch funny videos and, you know, we'll laugh about stuff and, you know, there's some stuff I'll get past because I can tell it's going to be like that It's like somebody image thing that she doesn't need. And like I act as a filter that way because I don't think that it's totally fair to be like, no social media for you ever.

And then like I said, I say videos for all my other kids that are like, you know, puppies and kittens and, you know, funny like, like or whatever stuff that's like, pretty wholesome because I think that there is a lot of good on social media. Like it's basically like the World's Funniest Home Videos was for me when I was a kid. Like, it's like it was really funny to see other people's lives and how funny stuff happened in it. And like, social media can be that.

So that's what I do. You know. I want to share that with them. I want them to not get any of the benefits of it, but I control it because I don't want them to get all of the negative stuff that is involved. So yeah, yeah, I think that's cool. But the looping all the way back to the parenthood stuff, I am constantly like, Wow, how are we going to navigate? You know.

This might be an extreme, but like posting photos of your kids on the Internet and like some of the messed up stuff that's out there with like explicit sites and that kind of thing, when you think about like deep fakes and like those possibilities as well as like. When. Will they be allowed to have a cell phone? Because we're now in a. And that's sort of. Like. Being able to use that basic stuff is really important. For. School like kind of thing. I'm like, how Do you?

Because I know like, like so scary. We, you know, we homeschool. So that that that allows us to have a lot more control of that. We I, you know, my homeschool days I don't use any any like video aids for them like we listen to like yeah a composer on one day a week and we listen to like a hymn another day a week. So it's like, that's the only time I use technology. My wife, well, she teaches nature study. She'll take them outside some days and some days. So. So I'm a video.

So it's it's not largely dependent on technology. And I think that that's great because there's so much knowledge that you can either download from the Internet or you can get from books like you don't need to actually be engaged in the in the use of the technology to do it. And whenever you send your kids to school, that is totally taken. It's taken out of your control and the technology becomes integral to their education.

And whenever it becomes integral to their education, there's going to be either you supervising them using technology all the time or you have to you have to take your eye off the ball so you can do anything else. And that's whenever those things that you're not really comfortable with start to come in. And, you know, I don't know, I, I feel like such a, you know, like a Bible thumper, like I'm not the most like religious person at all. Like, you know, I'm a Christian. I believe in God.

But outside of that, like, I'm not pushing religious on my kids all the time. I want them to believe in God. I want them to believe a higher power. But I don't want to be like, you can't be on social media because that's not right or whatever. But I feel like that sometimes because it's become so normal for your kids to be able to consume whatever they want. And that like that to me feels wrong.

It feels like I feel like I should be the one in charge of this, like I should be filtering stuff out. And even I even feel like that, like just with me filtering everything. I feel like they get enough bad exposure to like and, you know, being like, hypersexualization, like, inappropriate body image, stuff like that with me filtering it. Like, I can't imagine the kids who just get unlimited access to technology and wireless all the time. Right. Yeah, yeah. It's scary.

It's like, like, you know, to take this maybe to an extreme. I don't mean this in a way to like. No, this one actually. I'm going to ask you first and then maybe you can cut this. We don't really talk about and I. Know since your daughter seems like. An understanding. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I just. I'm like, I don't want to, like, make this bad, but, like.

You think about, like, you're mentioning, you know, the, like, unlimited, like accessibility and that kind of thing that some children have. And it's scary because of, like, you know, strangers on the Internet that can, like, totally take advantage of that. And they totally do like that is out there. And then there's also, like all this other stuff that, like. Young.

Impressionable children are taking in like porn and, you know, like stuff like, like they're seeing that children are having sex that much younger ages. And like, those kinds of experiences are happening at much younger ages than previous generations and that kind of thing. And like, if the first like first like sexual things that they're like being, you know, exposed to and that kind of thing or like very unrealistic like portrayals of that.

That's pretty damaging to the brink before they're even doing anything sexual, whether that's pulling. Them for being or being. Like you seeing and like. Straight into sexual. Romantic. Yeah they're so weird if they're having and it's like if. They're being exposed to that stuff and like, that happens to me in my childhood is that I found my vagina hanging out and that's my first exposure to something that was like graphic and I like honestly, for the love, like love everything.

I wish I could take that back because it was like the end of innocence for me. And I was hypersexualized before that, but that just took it even further, like a much larger degree to where objectification of, you know, women's bodies and like not respecting people was a big problem for me. Like even, you know, not a big problem even recently, but it was still a problem I still have like I have to keep checking in on like I that's something that shaped who I am as a person.

And like I for the love of God, which it was not, I wish that that was something that was off the table because there's enough problems without thinking that people aren't people that they're they're body parts. And that's, you know, yeah, it's a terrible way to feel whenever Look back on how you treated people in the past and you're like, Wow, that was me objectifying a person.

That was me being a misogynist like I you, you talked about like comparing yourself or comparing your partners to like past partners or, you know, your partner. Yeah. You were talking about comparing your partner to like, past partners. What I do is compare myself to myself as a partner and as a partner.

In the past, I had been such a terrible person even earlier in this relationship, but all the relationship before that I was like controlling and I was misogynistic and like, I was hypersexualized and I treated people in a terrible, terrible way because I didn't know any better. Like, I'm definitely I had no better do better type person. I didn't know better.

I was raised in a house where the the love was not present like, not for me but between the between the adults and that left a lot of space for me to Yeah. Assign what love looked like. And so I did. And it looked all wrong and I'm like, yeah, that's, that's something that I'm very passionate about. Yeah, yeah. Admitting is that I was never a good. Partner. To anybody I was with or my, my wife and that's, it's really hard to, to deal with because I don't talk to those people anymore.

And for a long time I was like, man, you know, I don't understand how people stay friends when they break up. It's like, because they maybe they weren't in toxic relationships. Like, I was like I and I was the toxic. Like, that's, yeah, that's, that's a lot.

Yeah. Yeah. It's like there's so much out there and then it's like, you know, you take it even like a step further and like, I feel that I'm very, like, passionate, not, maybe not, obviously not the most like knowledgeable in the subject, the topic, the field of like sex work in general But like, you know, you take it a step further and there's like other ways to like, consume that media. If it is something that you do enjoy, like going adult life and that kind of thing where.

Right. It's not certain explicit side that I think we all have looming in the back of our minds of what it's called. And like. There's children on there and there's people who are, you know, being. What's. It called? Like trafficked for said videos and that kind of thing. Like none of it is like looked through or anything of like kind of say and then it's like there's like these so many other like awesome ways.

You can like consume that stuff that does support sex work in a positive way that like, those people are healthy, they have health insurance, they aren't forced into things. They are maybe a more accurate representation of like what people look like because it's different types of bodies of being like shown in those films and that kind of thing. And it's just like it's so much more than just like porn is porn and blah, blah, blah. You know what I mean?

Like, okay, like it's a thing and like, it can be a tool and it can also be something. That has to be totally credibly damaging. I mean, my wife, in. Addition to sex, health and that kind of thing that we are like, I'm not a professional. Really, but a platform. For people to share their stories. But whenever it comes to sex work, like I am totally I want to stay in the dark, but like I'm not.

Yeah. I don't want it to be assumed that, like, I either disagree with or agree with your stance because like, I am totally undecided about, about how that is. And I just want to make sure that people who are listening know, like I want Kaitlyn to be able to talk about the things she does totally that she's passionate about because I think that she deserves a platform to do so.

I'm not going to silence her about talking about the importance of sex work because she I think that she has more information than I do, that's for sure. And I don't have a stance on it. So I'm just going to you know, I'm just letting it be said out there because I'm still trying to figure some of my life out. Like, I'm definitely not going to pretend like I've got it all figured out. And that's one of those things that I know can be very divisive.

And I want people to say like, yeah, you know, Bruce didn't say anything supporting that. So, you know. We can't or he did like I'm, yeah, I'm just letting you share your side of it. And I want you to know that you're the space is open for you to do so. I'm just saying that I don't have anything to offer to. Yeah, no, that's totally cool. Like, I. I feel like. I told. You earlier, like, my gosh. Like, I could just dive into that for hours.

Like, it's like, it's just like the topic in general is just fun for me to dive into and all different realms. And like, I don't know, I feel, I feel like just whenever I get on the soapbox, it's just me hoping that I'm reaching someone with like, Hey, like you being a sexual being like, like overall, like being a sexual being is a normal thing. That isn't something that should be shamed.

And I feel like that's kind of like the biggest like passion that I have and like it's something I still navigate for myself where I can find myself, like feeling shame for like, whatever thing or like questioning, like, why does my partner like that thing? Like, like I have this friend and they like this thing, but I don't like, is there something wrong with me? Like, we're also different, also unique.

And we all have like such different journeys with even just navigating that and the world in general. But again, like particularly in the US and like. How, how. Not great sex education typically is for most people and that kind of thing. And so I feel like I'm just kind of coming. From saying that like. Not really from a. You know, definitely different standpoint, I should. Emphasize it. But like America, as you know, I'm in the Bible Belt, so like, I'm familiar with it.

It's Funny because we hypersexualized everything, but then we make you feel bad for feeling sexual about things, which is super confusing and like, it's a surprise. Like, I'm really confused, but like, I'm trying to, like, separate myself from the hypersexualization of my child and find, you know, a safe, comfortable relationship with sexuality. Because I think I know that it's important. It is part of who we meant to be as humans.

Like I think that we were built the way that we are for a reason and that as part of the the joy of life. But there is a healthy way. And I'm I'm still trying to find that balance. Like, you know, I hope anybody who's out who's struggling with that is, you know, is finding a way to do that safely. And and. Yeah, of. Course. Imbalanced. And I think I'm asking you. Yeah yeah. That's it's a scary thing to navigate and then like if we loop it all. Goes up.

But yeah, if we just like, you know, loop it all back into, you know, navigating that with children, like. What do we do? How do we make it something that isn't like. Like you, you literally. Can't, like, avoid all of it, like you were mentioning with like, you know, even with what you are to filter with your kids. Like, they still see stuff. That. Unfortunately, like you can't hide. And it's like, how. How do we. Go about all of this and how do we make sure everyone's okay?

And it's just it's unfortunate that unfortunately, we can't make everything okay all the time. You know what I mean? Yes, we're here. Okay. Okay. It's starting to record. Excellent. I love all the different scene changes you've had at. Yes. You know what? You know what's good, though? What's good is that you like the changing of the scenes has been with the things that have gone wrong.

So I'll be able to just like whenever I'm going to the video, I'll be able to scrub through it. It's like a scene change. I know that there's something went wrong, so I need to go back and see where it was because honestly, I can't stand. I don't know if you can. I can't stand listening to myself whenever I go back through and edit, like I'm like, my God, please shut up. I can't. I hate my voice. yeah.

Well, my my son, my wife is my she has a VA and she does she works like, does a podcast notes and stuff for me and it is for one super, super helpful. But having her in the house, listening to the podcast, you know, doing notes, I'm like, Do you have to listen with your ears? Could you maybe not because I can hear myself and I want to go, which honestly, I it's not what I say. Like, I like what I say. It's hearing myself say it like that's, you know, I support the things I say.

I stand behind them. But hearing me, my actual voice saying them, I would rather not. Yes. Yeah, Yeah. I hope that you're right. I hope that is the sign of, you know, a little bit of, you know, humility. I don't know, though. I think it's just that I think my voice sounds weird. okay. So through all of our different issues we've had that I think that we've had a a pretty great conversation. I've I'm probably going to have to do more editing for this for this particular episode of the podcast.

And I've ever had to do not in it not for content necessarily than just for for one, the sheer amount of time we've been on. Like, like my other set of recording says we're almost about 3 hours right now. And that is, yeah, a lot of that time has been trying to figure out different parts of the the recording platform while stuff has gone wrong, but it's been a pretty good conversation that has kind of just taken us away. And I did not realize that it's been that long.

It's starting to get dark out here. I'm like, wow. So if while still got you, was there anything that we didn't talk about that you want to share? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let let's be more specific. Go to a trusted woman. Don't go talk to the the like the girl who answers the phone at your at your office who happens to be good looking. Don't do that. Talk to your sister. Talk to your talk to her sister. Talk to somebody who knows one or both of you well.

And yes, hearing a woman's perspective on how to deal with women can be very helpful. Now, is that going to make you a woman, be able to deal with it like a woman? Unlikely, but just being able to see the other side from somebody who's not mad at you is super helpful. And I definitely yeah, I definitely agree with that perspective. I often am like, what do I do with this? If it's so hard? Like I usually end up just asking her when she's not mad is like, So how could I have handled that better?

And you know that that goes over pretty well. Like we I think that open communication between couples is like way, way under stress. Like, I didn't you know, I talked about the model that I had growing up and I didn't realize how much you actually need to physically talk to actually like be on the same page with your partner. Like there's a lot of actual talking. So now we every Sunday we sit down together and we make sure that we have like the serious talk, we call it Sunday talk time.

And we so it's like, Hey, what's been going on with you this week? Like, you know, was there anything that I did that you want to talk about that you know, is there is there some way I need to improve on, you know, the way we're living our life together, Whatever.

And, you know, I share the same and it has improved considerably in my ability to, like, understand whenever I'm messing up, because otherwise it's like if in the moment when you're angry, it always feels like you're being chastised and that that a lot of growth doesn't really come from that. So anyways, that's another tangent. Yeah, I was like, Well, since we're here, that sounds delicious. Like my foods, like my kitchen smells like food and I'm starving.

So where can people get more if they're interested in Kaitlyn Brie Yeah, absolutely. Are you only on Spotify? Really? There must be a Spotify specific thing because you know. Yes, I'll, I'll help you out with that. You don't you should not pay. Yes. No. Yeah. Like like I told you, the other and I deep dive into every aspect of this and I am I'm basically a podcast production professional, even though, like, I still can't get my life right.

Like, I learned so much and, like, RSS feeds and, like, pod catchers and so much different stuff and like, how posting a podcast work. The Spotify for podcasters are anchor methods. Seems like the easiest for getting on, getting a podcast out, but then getting it on all the places. I feel like it makes it a little bit more difficult. But yeah, I can help you out with that. Anyway, so that's your podcast. Where else? Where are you at on social media?

I. You know, know, hey, as long as you, you know, you stick to it and you keep putting stuff on it, it'll be enough. So and it's been, it's been a bit of a marathon conversation, so it probably won't be the 3 hours that we've experienced it together. We're probably going to from that down considerably. But it's been I've enjoyed all of it, even the technical difficulties.

And to Kaitlyn and thank you so much for being so generous with your time and, and you know, kind and sharing your story and being vulnerable and, you know, opening up and, you know, it's been all, it's been amazing. Absolutely. And to my audience, if you enjoyed today's episode, please give a review, a follow. Share it with someone you might think you think might enjoy it as well. Also, you can support the future creation of great content by checking out other episodes.

Like all of the episodes are standalone, You don't have to listen to many order if you don't want to. All of the guests have been amazing. I think that they all have something unique to offer, so you should go check them out. And if you want to go check me out on social media, I'm at Authentic Identity Management on Instagram, Facebook threads, and LinkedIn. And you can also head over to the authentic Bruce YouTube channel for podcast video bonus content.

And then that's my conversation with these guest for Remember, if you guys are wanting to take me up on my offer from earlier and it seems like days ago in this episode to go to that episode 17 reflection post and comment either help. Step one, Step two and I will reach out to you and we'll have a conversation. But I'd love to help you. And if you are anybody else who is struggling to show up as yourself in your content, your work, your family or your life, I'd love to help you.

Authentic identity management does identity coaching to help you align yourself with the identity you share with the world. It's exhausting to live someone else's life, live authentically and accessible, sorry, and access the potential that belongs only to you. You can contact me on social or email at Bruce at Authentic Identity Management dot com and we can set up a free 30 minute consultation and that is it for today's episode. It has been amazing. Kaitlyn, thank you so much to my audience.

Be yourself and love yourself by everybody. Yeah. På