Hello again and welcome to Authentic on Air with Bruce Alexander. I'm your host, Bruce Alexander. Today is a special day because Emmy Award winning artist, activist and entrepreneur Jabee is joining me in the studio. I have so many questions for this man after today's reflection. If you had the talent, drive and connections to write a song about yourself that would be heard by millions of people, would you be honest?
Would you use the platform to share a true account of your story or embellish a little or even try to imitate someone else's story and hope of being accepted, complimented by strangers who know nothing of your truth? What does your answer say about your level of self-acceptance?
Think about it and hop on Instagram threads, LinkedIn or Facebook and join the discussion on the episode 15 Reflection Post or make your own post and tag @AuthenticIdentityManagement and use the hashtag Authentic Reflections because I really want to hear from you. I wanted to reflect on combining honesty, creativity and mass communication because my guest today has done just that.
He has taken his talent and used it to pour himself on the page, put it to music and release it for millions to hear. I got to personally observe this, the development of this process, because J.B. and I were facing socioeconomic struggle at the same time. Vaguely. Somewhere in the early nineties.
I would spy around corners and from the stairs of breezeway in South OKC as my brother and JB would draw comic book characters and exist unconcerned with the trials we faced as black children with uncertain futures in the then titled Los Pueblos Apartments. I remember Joey's energy being so much more sure of himself than I would ever feel even 20 years to come. My father's career at the fire department progressed, and with that came money.
Eventually some security, but then financing a divorce and a move with my mother and brother to a completely white suburb just outside of Tucson, Oklahoma. I wouldn't say, I'm sorry, I wouldn't see JB again until I moved back to OKC, live with my dad and commute to the University of Oklahoma over ten years later. It run into my brother a few times in the local B-Boy scene as he was putting pushing early CDs and my brother was chasing breakdancing or it was still just little brother in my mind.
But he remembered me, was completely genuine and kind. I was in yet another phase of pretending to be likable, which likely read as fake and desperate. But I remember thinking, I hope he makes it to successful restaurants. Eight albums, an Emmy, a Run, The Jewels tour, and multiple other civic and musical accolades. Later, he sits across from me in my authentic on air studio. Welcome to the show, J.B.. Thank you. It's a hell of an introduction to this drama. You've got a good memory. I always.
My wife will tell you that I can't remember anything in order ever. So I'm you know, I know what happened, but when it happened, I so good. I'm going to ask of my stock questions to start out the interview, but it'll be a little different than I usually do, because you are involved with two of my very favorite things, music and activism. But my activism tends to be what I call armchair activism, you know, Facebook, social media, that stuff.
But the what you're doing is extremely close to my heart. The things that you stand for mean a lot to me. So I've got a lot of questions that, you know, kind of get into into the mind of an activist, no doubt. So first, can you tell the audience who may not know who you are in your own words, who you are, what you do, and how you spend most of your time? Okay. Well, my name is JB, and I'm just Oklahoma City. You know, I do a few things.
You ran down a bunch of them, but I think the the to sum it all up, it's just, you know, you know, trying to be an A, you know, a part of my community in whatever ways I can and and give back whatever ways I can. And and just in the middle of that, you know, you know, sometimes, you know, you have to fight injustice. Sometimes you get to have fun. Sometimes you, you know, do other stuff.
So, yeah, it's just participating in my community and then, you know, using my time responsibly and just trying to make impact and following the lead of, you know, some of the others that came before me. That's a big question. If you were to wake up tomorrow and not want to rap anymore. Not want to make any more music. And every problem that you have with society today, with song, what would you do with your life? Who sleep. Okay. All right.
And, you know, I would probably, you know, just spend more time with my kids to grab me a, you know, a cool cigar. Jamison, Just keep, you know, I mean, do things that I used to do, like draw, you know, paint, you know, stuff like that. So one of the questions that I ask everybody is how do you, in your own words, define authenticity? You know, I guess for me, it's just, you know, first of all, I have a knowledge of self meaning, you know, you know who you are.
You know why you know, you know your value, you know, and knowledge of self and understanding your purpose and and then, you know, living that out the best way you can, you know, sometimes it doesn't always turn out right. You always pretty you might mess up, you know, you might not always, you know, do the best you wish it could, but, you know, as long as you, you know, as long as you try hard and never give up, it's automatic matters. You know, I, I've been able to do a lot of things.
I don't always feel like, you know, they turn out the way I like them to, but, you know, I do want to the best of my ability, you know, And I try really hard to, you know, that's as authentic as I can be and and not be afraid of, you know, the ugly part. You know, sometimes we like to celebrate the good parts. But, you know, I think that people can learn from the bad, ugly parts, too. So. Yeah, I totally agree with that.
So in an article speaking of the song Allegiance, you were quoted as saying, the song is pretty much just me saying, This man, I define myself. People might have an interpretation of me based on one thing or what they saw or what they heard, but I don't have no allegiance to none of that. I get to be who I want to be. I get to say what I want to say. You can't put me in a box because I rap. You can't put me in a box because I'm black. You can't put me in a box because I'm from the east side.
Vernacular quote. Yeah. And where did you get the confidence to lean into all of that? You know, just. It's love. It is. probably just like I said, knowledge of self. But, you know, my mom was always there encouraging me and, you know, and and just knowing me and like, this is we live in a world where, where, people like to pretend they're perfect, like, like to pretend and look like a certain way or, you know, with all of that.
So, you know, I just, I just learned along the way that, you know, especially with everything I do, I learned along the way that, you know, some people only know certain parts because of certain parts. They feel like that you, you know, and or sometimes I feel like they knew me when I was 15 and that's me. Or they might in my you know, knew me last year and that's me, you know, and none of that is true, you know.
So I get to decide. So, and so I just, you know, I just try to try to, like, you know, just live in a, in a, in a place where my, ah, like myself, my own, my, you know, knowing that the day is, is going to be on me and, you know, when I'm gone, you know it's gonna be left behind is what I, you know, I'm seeing it, you know and how the things I said and did affected people and, and so I got to, you know, you know, really, you know, be confident in the fact that, you know,
you know, right or wrong, you know, I'm not gonna try it, you know, really. And you know, people going to say what they want. But you know, the legacy left behind will will, you know, be a bigger footprint than what anybody got to say. Em saying so yeah. I feel like you're you're a little I mean, I guess it's lucky in that I'm lucky because everything that you believed in has been put on tape for, you know, for your legacy to be heard for, you know, in perpetuity. Yeah. Like until this year.
And me starting this, like, I believe so many things, I'm kind of glad that, that they're not recording. You know, it was what's crazy is it's like I think about this sometimes it's like, you know, I'm blessed that, like, you know, like, for instance, because of music, you know, whether it's a release or a show or something. And like, I can always create something for me to look forward to seeing. And I just know, like there are people just living day by day, negative side.
They get excited about, you know, things other people are doing and saying, I get to be excited and put energy into what I'm doing, you know, So and part of that, to be able to leave stuff behind and you know and I think about, you know, my kids and my family and stuff like that. And, you know, they'll always have my voice when I'm going, you know, I'm saying my it won't be lost, you know, then And got to remember, you know, what it sound like they can they can pick it up.
You know, I you know, you know, my grandma just passed in like, you know, I got to sit on top of her. Well, before that, we set up, you know, our SO just, you know, just really chop it up and, you know, I went through memories. I thought of stuff that I've read about her and she thought about things about me that I was too young to remember. But, you know, you know, I have a voice in my mind, you know? I mean, it you know, I pray like, you know, as the years go on, like I remember
sounds like. But, you know, you know, because I, I get to do music because I've done so much. You know, you can always, you know, if I'm going to do that, you have something in my voice that I'll still be there. So I never considered that. You know, I've only been doing this podcast for three months or so and I've never considered the impact if I were to be gone today, you know, there's 20 hours of me talking to other people that my kids can tune in and listen to it.
They never, ever missed my voice or whatever. And that's you know, that's a powerful thing. Yeah. It's important that, you know, and, you know, they might not understand it now, but, you know, they will, you know, I mean, so yeah, it's important. Yeah. So you'll notice a little bit of a pattern of I'm like going through this that I'm reading your own words back to you because you're you're pretty, pretty nifty. But the phrases like, you're pretty good at it. So I appreciate it. Yeah, absolutely.
And I really dug into your your catalog as I was, you know, preparing for this. I heard some of your music before and like, I'm very, sporadic with my with my listening patterns. Like, I go back and forth and I'm all over the map as to what I like, but getting, like, really getting into your music, I was extremely impressed with the, with the lyricism for one. Like that was really great. And then you're your actual taste in like production was, was really appealing to me.
And I was I was reading about some of like some of your albums. So in my opinion with Am I Good Enough and Black Future, you dropped two of the most cutting edge albums and structure and substance of our generation. Like I'd say, they're right up there with Outcast Speaker box the low below us up, and that's one of my favorite albums of all time, mostly because of the dichotomy that exists in, you know, two really different albums that are under the same umbrella and also work together.
Yeah. And so really with Am I Good Enough, I was like, how is he going to have four different producer like tape set? Like, I'd never heard of that. Like, where do you get these unique ideas? Like, where do they come from? You know, part of it is just, I think, always trying to reinvent or outdo the last thing. And then also, you know, meet me at this level. I feel like it's important that that, you know, I try to do things that, you know, will people would notice, you know what I mean?
And something different, you know. And so that's what that was, is, you know, I it's I'm doing something I try to, you know, especially with music, I try to always put the art first, first, first started. I'd be like, you know, I'm just trying to rap people or trying to be the best rapper or I'm thinking about this line is it's my think is hard or not.
But but now I feel like, you know, with with there being so much music and people being so bombarded with it's so easy, it's so easy to be so young because there's like, you know, the Internet and like, there's always a new rapper and there's always something, you know, me, it's like I just always need to be I always need to try to be more creative and, and try and create a piece of art
as opposed to just the music, you know what I mean? And, and stretching myself to and trying new things, you know, it's more than just trying to be the best rapper, you know, outdo people. You know, I want to I want to operate at a level of that. You know, people that are really in the industry are operating in insane. Yeah. So so black future to me was it was a moving experience like listening to that, you know, intentionally from beginning to end.
I was like I literally the first time I heard the Black Future poem by let me express their name right, nausea and nausea. I would I was in tears because to me, everything that she was, that future that she was predicting was everything I want my kids and everything that I never had. Yeah. So, you know, it was it really did move me. And what brought that poem to your heart? And then what inspired you to base an entire album off of it?
So like future, I always when I before I did it, I knew I wanted to put one black to be in the title. And, and she and I were talking about doing the project together. And of course, whenever I would do shows, I would have her come up and open the show like she would be like, You got I'm ready because you, like, you know, can be spontaneous like that.
And she would come up and kick some really, really out, you know, and so many times when to announce, like this next album, I want you to be a part of life in the studio, you know, working with me and going through ideas and stuff. And so we had said them a couple of times and got through different things. And so it was 2015 and I had it was February. I was supposed to do a I was supposed we but we didn't have a title yet.
I was supposed to do a, a black history show or Black History Month drive, all black show at this event. And before I went to I was in New York for something and I went to this like history of it at the museum out there. And they did this, like this production where they went through like the history of black music and like, I mean, they started with like Negro spirituals and into like so like James Brown Public Enemy, and it was so dope.
And I remember, you know, calling the band and being like, Yo, I just saw some sick, this trauma, this we working on this scene like, you know, I'll call it nausea and told her bodies okay, double try to write something around that you know around the idea of you know starting at the beginning going to now into the future. Yeah And so we got back I got back to Oklahoma. I think I got back the same night of the show.
It might have been a day before and I was the same night and my friend picked me up. I went to the mall, pick up something to go get a haircut in and go to the show. So long story short, I got arrested in the mall. Yeah, I read about that. Yeah. And also, just so you know, I had a hoodie. I have a hood on my head because I wanted to get a haircut. You know, it was sad. And so I didn't want to bite my hair crazy.
So anyway, they came to me, told me, you know, it got cut off and just, you know, this is 2015. So, you know, attachment issues and I'm like, not in like what we all now business mom. And I'm like, Well, anyways, I've seen him arguing with these security officers about staying in the mom. I'm arguing to stay in the mall. So I start leaving and they follow me. I get to the door, it's a cop there, and he arrested me. I go to jail and I'm thinking it was probably like four or five at this time.
At this point, I'm thinking of beginning out. Tom, to show you what I'm saying. And I well, I stayed overnight and missed the show. And in the homies was thinking that this victim abandoned them. I didn't show up. I was a no show or not, but I didn't tell anybody. I went to jail. I didn't go on Facebook. And I say not even though it was wrong. I shouldn't went. I didn't. Because, you know, once you go through something like that, like it takes a lot out of you.
You know, you don't want to it's hard to like I don't want that to do caught that it was in and so I didn't see Najah I think I might attacked her and told I was sorry you know I went to jail or whatever but I had a show in Tulsa probably like a month later. She was showing me. She was was you were, you know, like I you know, I'm telling her about the whole situation while I was in jail. And I was like, how did it go? She was like, it was cool. And I was like, What was it called?
She was like, like you, you. I was like, That's the album, you know, let's get busy, you know? So that's how I came about. Yeah. Let's talk a little bit more about that, that mall thing, like reading about that, it blew my mind that, you know, this wasn't like 1990, this was 2015. This was not that long ago for you to be in a public place wearing a hood. Is this not anything? There's literally nothing there. But I got to stay focused cause I get kind of pissed off thinking about it.
Yeah, no. Doubt. For you to, for one, not have made a big stink about it. I know that took a lot of patience and self-restraint on your on your own, but also, like, so, like reading the research in you. Chuck D said your music has the potential to change the world, so you have a lot on your plate anyways. Then you have the expectations of society that if you're wearing a hood now, you're you're dangerous, are like you've got all these different expectations being put on you by other people.
In that moment, did you question yourself? not because I knew I didn't do anything wrong. You know. And what's crazy is it's like, you know, I work at that mall, you know, for a long time. We both know for sure. Yeah. You know, and and I remember, you know, before they whenever he was for me, pick a name, he not really buy the tape. I'm thinking that is so I mean, I worked with kids. People got caught shoplifting.
They would take them off as was I would take them to, you know, So I just remember asking, do like to we walk around, so I'm going to walk through them are like this handcuffs. You know, I'm saying, you know, I mean, I remember him being like, you know, nah, I like this kind of things, which I like. I think I remember thinking, man, like, you know, like you don't know me. And like, he's he's telling me what kind of person he is by saying it.
And then I remember also there was a lady pushing a stroller who had a white lady. I remember saying it to him like, look, you know, you take him, you arrest me for wearing a hoodie. She got to he said to me, you go fish and you catch every fish. No, I just stopped talking, man. After that, I just quit talking to him and, you know, did the whole thing get in the car? They had a pick me up the beginning of the car, and I was like, What's the charge? What are you talking about?
Because you can't arrest me for it for wearing a hoodie. He was like, Well, they charge you with trespass. And I was like, All right, I'm saying. But, you know, I just you know, I looked at it like this is you know, I knew what it was. And, you know, I looked at it like this is something that we deal with as black people, you know, saying, I didn't look at it like it was nothing, not it wrong.
I just knew I could always know, you know, being black with this kind of stuff, you know, being black, there are things that we are we are at risk of, you know, any time we're in public, you know, I know. I know that people that our bodies are risk of being harmed, you know, You know. So that's it. That's like I just I just felt like it was my time, you know? I'm saying. So, you know, I just took it on the chin, you know?
I mean, and, like, I didn't you know, it was other people that was bringing in, you know, saying they were wearing hoodies. But I remember when I was doing my paperwork and he was like, yes, you asked. And I told him he was like, I thought you was a kid. And I was like, I didn't. And know also, you know, said to me, like, they look at the good
looking for black kids. You know, I'm saying, you know, I mean, so, you know, I just I just, you know, I just understand that, you know, you know, black is you have you have you have have a target that is placed on you that you can't get rid of, you know, And, you know, that's just like, you know, if I'm if I'm in line at Target and this lady in front of me, I know I'm I know I'm a black man.
And, you know, regardless of who she is or where she was came from, I know that, you know, my presence can make people feel uncomfortable just because of black. Yeah. Because, you know, condition that people have been conditioned to feel a certain way about black people.
So I always, you know, make some of you feedback, know, I'm saying, you know, if I'm if I'm somewhere and, you know, just like, say like if you had a if you had a if you had a bar, you know, you said no, which girl and you having a conversation with your girl and you know, you know, somebody say, he's been aggressive with her. You just have a conversation with if it was somebody white, they just talk, you know, I'm saying so, you know, I just know that that's a thing.
So I you know, and that's what comes with it. So at that at that moment, I didn't feel like, you know, what did I do? Or, you know, felt like, you know, I was in the wrong. I just knew, you know, it was my time, you know? So the sign up I use for the show is be yourself. And I've had experience similar to that one. And for me it has made it hard. Love myself. It is me, you know, because I have that same stigma branded into me that there's something wrong with me because I'm black.
And that's something I've had a negative I've had to take hold of and say, That's not true. That's that's what society puts on you. But it's been a. Challenge that. I've had to you know, I've had to act we deal with. Was that something that you that you struggle with before that? And did that make it any worse. Or not before that? You know, as a kid, you know, there were times where I didn't understand stuff.
You know, like, for instance, whenever I was second, third or fourth grade, I went to high school, you know, elementary school, majority white, playing like three or four kids. The two kids are my two black kids class Me, I take that back, break me on to naked only black kids in the class. And so this class, she was the only black girl in class with no other black kids, you know.
And I remember, you know, you make friends with these kids and, you know, you know, as your kid, you you want to they have sleepovers and stuff like that. And I remember, you know, they would have sleepovers, you know, and like, invited me in. So I remember one time, you know, kids would go home as they parents and their parents, like, not you know, and I was just me to stay at my house, you know, not go home as my mom. I'd be like you had to come stay the night.
But they're not going to be able to. And I'm like, why? And and sure enough, how much I can stay if they go in the next morning, it I had to sleep over without me, you know, So mom had to tell me, you know, it's like, you know, say it like, you know, I remember you know, one of my girlfriends when I was in elementary at that same school. It was it was tight, you know, real tight. In August, my best friend sort of got mad at me.
We got into it, you know, the first time he called me or, you know, seeing and, you know, I was probably like eight, seven, eight. And my mom explained to me that that's what he hears at home with parents and about spit it out, you know what I'm saying? So, like, at that time, I thought something was wrong with me, you know, I'm saying.
But as I got older and, you know, I say you get you get not yourself, you know, you understand were you know, you know, not you know, I guess, you know, there's a difference. You know, like I, I try to be really careful what I say, you know, being proud of you know that because I know.
But you know, the word says about having too much pride, you know, saying, you know, but I think that you need to have, you know, some understanding of the value of your worth and and be proud of it, but not prideful, you know, saying. And so because, you know, black people in this country have done a lot. And for the most part, I believe we are we have been the moral compass of this country.
You know, it you know, meaning you know, we we we were the first to accept people were the first to forgive people. I mean, you look at you look at we'll be through what we've gone through. And because, you know, we're like, think about the civil rights movement. We think about, you know, slavery and things like that. Yeah, there were revolts and stuff like that.
But because, you know, we've always been that moral compass, you know, we we've never been, you know, the group of people that that have, you know, we've we found ways to to come together and try to to move for peace as opposed to being a group of people who are nothing but destructive and, you know, and, you know, I'm saying right now, that's not who we are.
And so when you understand those kind of things, then it makes loving yourself a little bit more easy or at least living that part of you, you know, and and so, you know, that's you know, for me, that's that was helped me down is because I know, you know, you know that's a lot of that stuff was just built into the DNA of people. Yeah I'm seeing meaning meaning you know, you know, it was it was passed down and and taught.
They've been conditioned to feel and think and treat people a certain way based on, you know, how they look, who they are or what race they are. But, you know, like I said, I got called the N-word and I went back to my mom and told her, well, I didn't get invited to sleepovers. My mom didn't tell me to go to school. And, you know, Sandy turned up on a you know, she explained to me that people are and we can't be like that.
And so that's what I mean by the World Cup is, you know, and she was talking about her people, you know, I'm seeing it. So but you see what it was taught me. So so we understand those things about, you know, who you are, you know, where you come from and where you how your people are. Then, you know, it's easy to it makes it a lot easier to love that party. And yeah, when you see it, you look at you look at just, you know, our culture, it's it's pop culture.
You know, seeing like people love it, you've seen it. And, you know, that's that's because of us, because of, you know, what we've been able to overcome as a group of people.
So change gears a little bit like I would I would say as an artist, you share a part of yourself every time you create something new and music being such a collaborative effort and combined with your love for sound exploration and the multitude of different producers and artists you work with, do you ever struggle to keep your own creative identity intact? Sometimes, yeah. Yeah. Because like I said, like like I was saying before, like I used to be worried about, you know, what people think,
you know, how I sound and stuff like that. But so yeah, that, you know, that for sure, especially when you, whenever, you know, you go so long and you're doing this for so long and you got music has changed, your sound changes, all these different things you feel like, you know, am I still good at this? Or, you know, the people want to hear me, you know, so should I change it up, switch and do what they're doing? Because that's what people like, because it you know.
But yeah, all the time, whenever, you know, people might say, you know, like, like let's just say like, let's say, okay, for all intents and purposes, what's say like, all right, there's this, there's this idea that Jay Cole is like or a Kendrick is like a positive conscious type rapper. He does. You know, I'm saying it.
And, you know, the same person is saying, yeah, like, I really like stuff like this, like Jay called like people who write about these types of things, you get in a car with them and they listen to some some B.S., you know, And it's like, well, I thought you or you or you like you. Or you could be like, You like Jay, call it better check out this person at that person.
And they're like, Nah, I'm saying it's like it's like, you know, you know, like, it's not that they like I like the idea, you know, I'm saying so so that those kind of those things throw me off, you know, a lot of times to make me feel like, you know, make me question, you know, my art made me question, you know, you know how I should, you know, go about the next thing. But then I, then I, I remember like, I remember your integrity. I remember like, regardless, like, you know, I can't.
I can only be who I am and I can only tell the type of stories and talk about the things that are important to me because I wouldn't be authentic if I did something you so. So yeah, I have those times and, you know, and, and you know, I just try to always, you know, dial it back and try to remember why I do this. And, you know, I started it, you know, I. Mean, yeah. And that that actually leads me to my next question, which you worked with two of my favorite artists in the entire world.
You worked El-P and Killer Mike, both separately, and then you toured together on the 2015 Run The Jewels Work that gave you a front row seat to the kind of success that they have. And they are also, you know, they talk about a lot of things about equity and, you know, consciousness and, you know, stuff like that. But they've also been pretty open with saying that they dilute that message with like, you know, a lot of flashy distractions. So they they aren't really seen as too much of a threat.
Do you did that ever like seeing like how successful are I mean I'm I'm sure that having, you know, packed stadiums is not something that, you know, is a turnoff to you. You know, think maybe maybe I should dilute my message a little bit and make it a little bit more, you know, just pleasing to hear to a wider amount of people to maybe get this kind of, you know, this kind of success.
I mean, you know, I don't that's a thing like, you know, I don't I think there's a lot I don't see I don't think that, you know, you had that Lucha message, you know, And I don't think you know, I think that you know, that, you know, like, I think within the world just finally caught up, you know, I'm saying. And it and you think about you look at how we're doing it and we're seeing it. It's taken a long time to get to that level.
So I think that I think that's possible for everybody, you know, especially if you stay true to who you are. Now, I will say like for them, like, you know, some of the things have changed. You know, you could tell, you know, they got more is now emceeing. But they're still saying, I feel like they're still the same. You know, And, you know, outside of like, you know, everything else, like they're like just genuine people. And I think that's a big part of it, too.
You know, I always tell my little homies, you know, do music and stuff, It saved me. A part of it is just, you know, just being a person and treating people right and, you know, being genuine, you know, saying you can get around somebody, you know, and you realize only want to be I don't care how cool that you don't want to be around, then you you don't want to be around them. You want to just take this the same. So I think a lot of it is some of that, too.
You know, I don't know if I you know, I think there have there have been times where, like you know, I have, you know, tried to like be a little bit more simple and, you know, more catchy. But I but, you know, not a lot emceeing and just glimpses and then at the same time, at the same time, you know, doing it the way I do it, you know? So it still sounds like me. Yeah. So I think I couldn't find the quote again, but I thought I read that you didn't really cuss in your music. Yeah.
And but you worked with a lot of people who do have experience. What like, what is your relationship with that? Does that ever make you feel like you're you're sacrificing something to work with this artist that you respect, admire? Or is it like a strategic decision? I was like. no, you know, because, you know, I you know, you'll find some cussing in my music.
And I think, you know, for the most part I rap the way I talk, you know, So I don't like you know, I don't really cuss that much when I talk anyways. But so that's that's the reason that music is like that. But then, you know, working with people, you know, I like I don't I don't search for music for rappers who don't curse. You don't see him, you know, I just like what I like. So I never I never you know, I have homies who have good ol songs.
I mean, they'll be and they'll rap about how they'll insult me so they can't see us. And I've been like, now, bro, like, do you, you know, saying like, do you, you know, So but I think that, you know, at the same time, you know, you, you had to you have to realize, man, this is, you know, the you, you are communicating with words.
Meaning there is there's so many words that use, you know, in so many words that, you know, you can use if and if you can't find the words to use, then, you know, it's like you probably shouldn't be doing this, you know, saying, you know, but if that's how you talking, this incident might be a rap, too, you know? But with me, you know, I just feel like, man, like, you know, I'm getting to a point to where I feel like, you know, I'm I can't find the words. I'm being redundant. I might step back.
I might, you know, pick up a book, you know, something like that, just so I could start exercising my mind because I feel like, you know, that's part of the craft, that's part of the art of it is is using and having a vocabulary, you know, I mean, so. Is it just about respecting the collaborative effort and just saying that we're creating a piece of art together? I'm going to be I'm going to have integrity about the way I do things and you do the way you do things and what we create together.
We're both going to respect that. Yeah, because if I ask you to be on something with me over collab, then like I'm like, I want you because of the way because I like what you do, right? You know, I don't want you to try to change it and trying to fit. I do, you know, and vice versa, you know, I mean, like it's just somebody, people who usually happens like, hey, people hate rappers here, you know, they might just hit me up, but they got a song that, you know, they got a black power song.
They got like a soul song or a conscious song. And I'm like, I'm like And we rappers never seem like I can wrap anything, you know? I'm going to me on it, you know, same. But you know, but if, if, if we're artists, musicians, you know, it shouldn't be like, you know, you can only do it this way. You can only do it that way, you know, And I wouldn't want to bring somebody in because it's just like, like, take it like this.
Like, you know, I'm we do I have a not with OKC it's art based project more so on the Oklahoma syndicate board and you know we do all the murals in the city and stuff like then Eastside murals so whenever you hire an artist to paint something you might say, Hey, you know, we're thinking of like for instance, we're doing a mural of Captain Pitts at Pitts Park right now.
We could we could say we're doing a mural of Captain Pitts, but if we say to that artist, We don't want a mural, Captain Pitts, and these colors needs to have this, we want you to pay like this. It needs a emcee. And we're just I mean, like we're not allowing them to like it, to have their artistic integrity or to, like, express themselves. You know, we can give them we can give them all the history on the piece. We can give them a picture what it looks like.
We can you know, I'm saying, like, do all these things, but to like, you know, tell an artist like, you know, nah, we have to be like this. You're not letting that person be an artist. So the same is true. You know, I don't ever want to, you know, you know, collaborate with someone and then be like this, you know, outside of this is the song or the topic. You know, I mean, say like, you can't say this.
You can't say that you case it, you know, I mean, like, I'm not letting them be who they hate to be. Yeah, I definitely feel that and I respect that. It's just it seems like it would be a hard thing to do whenever you're having somebody, you know, you've had some really huge artist collab with you too. I don't know to not want to be what they want you to be, you know?
You know, I guess I've never I've never worked with somebody that I have such like respect for and that, you know, in that way, you know, I've got work with lots of people I respect and I, you know, I have a lot of respect for.
But having somebody who's, like, received critical acclaim or massive amounts of success in this way or that, it would be really hard to then say, all right, yeah, I know that you do your thing, but I'm going to do it this way and then have any feedback and not be like, okay, I'll do it your way. Yeah. And maybe that's something about my strength of character. But yeah, I mean, part of it too. But you know, so it's like, it's like, you know, it's just like writing raps for people, you know?
I'm saying. And like, it'd be like if, you know, if I asked you to be on a song, you're like, Okay, back. And I say, I'm writing the rap for you. You know, I'm saying this like, nah, like I'm actually gonna solve this. I want you, you know? I mean, yeah. Is that something that somebody would try to do for you? yeah. Yeah, for sure. So, I mean, I was, I didn't really understand how writing rap works.
Like, I thought that everybody wrote their own stuff until, like, the stuff about Drake came out, and there was stuff about Lil Wayne at one point to and to people that I like. I like pop rap, Like, I'm not going to say that, you know, I don't like it. I think I so I think there's a you know, there's a difference. And never been in the studio with them. But I think that sometimes you know you have like Dr.
Dre right. And you might have like a Dr. Dre or a Diddy who is like, they don't they're not rappers. Right. But they make they rap. Meaning, you know, a rapper write a rap as Dre record it. Dre will learn it. And they just say the same thing. DRE Yeah, really You never rappers like you don't raps like like even when he was in N.W.A, Ice Cube wrote all his raps. He wrote easy to Sing because they're not not rappers. I knew that. About Eazy because he was he was out there, like, in the street.
Yeah. Really? So. So you have you that's like, what's my says? They didn't write, they raps. I'm thinking like that, you know, I'm saying like, like somebody only wrote the whole thing as that person, you know, and then, you know, hand in the sheet and then they rap it into it. But I think there's something different if like, you know, you know, I'm I'm in the studio reporting and you and me and somebody else is in there and I do the whole song and rap the whole song.
We play it back and then you go, Man, you should try sing this. I mean, that is hard. Okay? I'm at this conference. Yeah, I'm saying that's not right. Yeah. So I think, you know, you know, I, I, I just think, you know, sometimes, you know, when people are that big and that good, like Drake and like, way like that, that's just gonna come, you know, saying it. I just can't see because if I like, I don't know, I just, I just hope it was something like that.
Not like, you know, but I don't see my, you know, write a whole rap for somebody like that. I mean. For like a away with. Drake, knowing where he came from on, you know, my wife watched it, the Canadian like soap opera. So like, I could see like him, you know, he's an actor first. I could see that. But Lil Wayne, like, I would be heartbroken, honestly, if that came out because, like his his style so original. And he's so, you know, he's so good with the video.
And we've been watching Louis since he was 15. Yeah. Like, why would he just stop saying And, you know, but, you know, like I said, you got to be careful who you who you're in the room with because you could be in a room with somebody and just you finish the whole song and then they like, yeah, I'm like, man, you should try this. Like, okay, bet you put a lot in the next that I wish. Get into it. That person say I wrote that. Yeah I'm saying yeah.
You know, I think that's what happened with game if you say like you know So. Do you feel like, like being a fan of rap here? You know, that firsthand account of, you know, a rapper saying like, this is what it's actually like? Do you feel like as a fan of rap as well, you have a front row seat to some of like the the backstage controversy and stuff like that? no, not always.
I've seen some of it, you know, but I think just, you know, because rap is important to me, you know, I'll, it's always like checking for it. I'm always, you know, trying to be in the mix and see what's going on. You know what I mean? Yeah, But yeah, and I mean, like that man with the internet, we all got a front row seat now. He has a point. Yeah, absolutely. So I wanted to ask you how much time you had today. yeah, I got one more time.
Okay. So when you collaborated with the marketing agency Funnel Design Group to create the what if commercial, the Science Museum, Oklahoma, what did that process look like? And did you ever have to fight to realize your vision or did you ever have to like, you know, like give away anything of yourself to get it made? No, I like what that, you know, that was the collaboration. Like we went back and forth on ideas. You know, I had a lot of input, you know, on it.
And, you know, I think if if it, if it me I want to did it, you know, and I've had opportunities to do certain things be a part of different project and you know other commercials and even some movies and stuff. I was just you know, I was like, man, it made me look wild. Or if I got to change or, you know, I don't it just doesn't fit, you know, you know who I am. I want to be. I just want to do it. You know, with that, I felt like it was important because you know what?
You know, it was education for one of two science museum. I used to work there as a kid. really? Yeah. And then. And then really, like, you know, I knew the people I was working with would make it dope, you know? And so. And they did, you know. And so I'm just happy that, you know, I got to be a part of it.
And then I got to I got to, you know, make science and, you know, and all these things sound dope, you know, and and write about, you know, all these things that people don't really think about, you know? So they really actually what it did, it made me start thinking about making like a project, like that where, you know, it's aimed at like education and, you know, I haven't done it, but I remember thinking I do something like this, like just make a whole project like that.
Yeah. Because, you know, those things are important. And, you know, I have kids and I, you know, say education is important to me, to my children. So. And this is random. I recently heard about a guy named Harry Mack. We heard of him before. It sounds familiar. He's on Instagram and TikTok like does email. And just like random people come up and said, Hey, let me freestyle for you. And they give him like three or four words and he freestyle raps like the most intricate raps I've ever heard.
That's like just legit, flat out. But then also for freestyle, it's insane. do you have do you have a different place in your heart for freestyle rap or is that is that you just this is it all is all just rap. It's all just rap. You know, I use usually I do a freestyle, like during my set before me, mainly because like, it gives the crowd I can, you know, do he does it. It's making me some words, you know, it's a matter of pocket and hold it up so I can see it in freestyle about it.
You know, I like I like that aspect of it or of like I'm in a battle with somebody. You know, I we start out way, but but it's all just rap, you know, I that you know and you know it's it's not a I think that art of it it's it's it's not lost but you know it's not it's utilized and seeing like like like years ago like something like that was normal saying it was just part of it, a part of the hip hop scene at a people jam or whatever, you know, say like, if it is freestyle the whole time.
But it wasn't like, you know, I mean, so but now, you know, you go to an average rap show, you know, people gonna do 15, 20 minutes of these songs and they're going to be are they not even, you know, then in they rapping over the songs but like there's no like real like live performance to it. Yeah. It's and you don't you're not getting you hear what you heard in the car, you know, because they're just playing the track rapping over it.
But you know but I think, you know you, you freestyle you get to like it's like it, as you say, a little more value to people when they could do that. You know, never do more like you know, I'll go to a school, a middle school, elementary school, not, you know, freestyle with the kids, use their names and stuff like that. You know, I mean, have fun that way. So, you know, it's it's it's just it's just fun, you know?
And it helps you flex, you know, muscle as far as like, you know, like I said, you know, vocabulary rhyme and stuff like that. When you said something, somebody asked, you know, is this is one in one of your songs, you said they asked me how I became an activist. So my ask a question, I answered it is that is that really what happened? Yeah. Like, yeah, like, yeah, that's what happened you know, if you know, because I never really consider myself an activist, you know?
I mean, you know, even now, you know, I like to, I, I feel like I'm more of a community organizer, you know, more than an activist, because I like, you know, the organizing is what is the job, you know, seeing you know, the organizers aren't the ones usually on TV talking, you know, saying. But yeah, so just, you know, I want I feel like it was, what when the kid got killed, but what they wanted to keep talking about the police. Right. And and. Everyone was like.
It was, it was at the Michael Brown. Okay, So yeah, I was, I think there was something to the interview and, you know, asking my opinion on it. And I and I said, I said what it was. But you know, I said what I said.
And it that the story came out, rapper slash activist, you know, I'm saying him I think I think some of the activist like but they got that based on my response to that question Yeah saying it and so so then you know especially like 2020 Julius Jones stuff you know a lot of people are going, man, I want to you know, I want to be a part and help. How can I be an activist like you?
It's like, you know, I don't know because I never knew I was going to I just my ask me a question about a about situation. And based on my answer, I'm an activist here. I said so I said, I don't know if somebody asked the question. That's, you know. So I was like, thank you. But you talk about community organizing. Community has been what seems like a huge part of your story. Do you think you could be the job that you are today, anywhere but Oklahoma City? No. You know. Get something. Why?
Because, you know, you know, I my story is built around living in Oklahoma City. You know, Oklahoma City, you know, built and created me, you know, sand and and because Oklahoma City is the way it is, it makes it possible for a JP, you know, I mean other places and you know it's it's so there's so everything's so big
so many JP emceeing and things like that. So you know I'm just I'm grateful that you know I was, I'm here because you know, it made me who I am and it gave me a voice and a platform. And I don't think you know any other city. My platform would have been the way it is, you know, And I just I even when I go to different cities and places, I remember when I did, I did sway in the morning, you know, the homie who rap next to me, I thought he smashed his way, but he emcee it.
But whenever it was done, it was excited about me. And I was only excited because he was from New York and he, he, he of course he from New York in New York. Rap. If I in New York rap like him, you know, I'm like, it was nice, you know, to him. But they're looking at me like we had no idea people in Oklahoma City was getting down like that. You know.
And they had no idea Oklahoma City had all the things you were talking about, you know, And so so I just let me know like, you know, being from Oklahoma City is part of the story. You know, I'm seeing it, you know, And, you know, I could be a rapper in New York City, just being the rapper. New York City. Yeah. So it seems like I mean, with the working with the Science museum, you're I think they played your video with you in it like before every Thunder games like right.
Yeah. I mean so I mean that's a big community project there. It seems like Oklahoma City is, you know, really embraced you as well. Do you do you fill out support like whenever you go out and do whatever project? Yeah. Yeah, all the time. You know, I think, you know, that's that's part of it too, you know, And you know he, I mean it man. It, it just makes you be, you know, I mean, like, I don't, I don't know, you know, I don't feel special items.
I feel like I'm right, you know, I'm just doing what I'm doing me and, you know, and doing what I supposed to do. But, you know, to have people, you know, support you in and appreciate, you know, these things about you and give you opportunities, you know, it's it's it's a blessing. And it's definitely humbling, you know, And like I said, I mean, I, you know, all know that, you know, if I was any other city has a has an NBA team you know they can you know I'm saying name them a city.
They got 30 big rappers they could call, you know, saying right. So for for the city here and the team here to to to give me opportunities like that. I just really appreciate it and it means a lot. So locally I mean to me this this you being here is is a huge deal to me because I know locally you're a you're a big deal. But to you do you feel like you've reached the level of success that you what you want or that you aspire to. I know you know I don't, but I don't.
I always try to decide if that's a good thing or a bad thing, you know, because I you know, I do. When I do want more, I want more, more success. I want more stability. You know? You know, I want to do a whole lot more. But, you know, I also try to be mindful because there are people who we see that have everything in the world that's not enough. So I don't want to I don't want to ever, you know, be in a place where, like, I have everything and it's still, you know.
I, I, I personally think that, you know, there's nothing wrong with you wanting more stuff because, like, I would list your music as much as I have. It's you're up there with many people who don't deserve to be up there. It's good. Like it's really good and it says something. And it also is enjoyable to listen to. I mean, it really is like I mean, I was I was listening to it while I was working and I was writing stuff and I was like, Man, this is so good.
It wasn't just like, this is good for an Oklahoma City rapper. It was like, This is it's good. Yeah. So, you know, I of course when all the success in the world for you but you know it's it's difficult to for me sitting here as an as a lover of rap and being able to access whatever rap I want to listen to, it's hard to even understand what the what how to gauge the success level of a artist these days.
Like. Yeah, you know, and I got homies who are who I look at it, I'm like, you know, I'm saying like you, they're emceeing like, I wish I had all this success and all the things that you got, you know, and you know, those people, you know, if I told you smile, you'd be like, Yeah, heck, they, they're huge.
But even those people are like, I'm saying, you know, man, I'm trying to this like I was, you know, like, you know, and I'm trying to I hate to use this as an example cause but like, it's, you know, Kanye West, right? like he's somebody who has everything at his fingertips, you know? I'm saying legit anything. You know, he can he has the resources, he has the success, he has the money, you know?
I mean, I and so but he's still somebody who said who feels like, you know, there's there should be more of him emceeing. You know, he still feels like there are people that try to keep him from doing other things. But I'm like like you're that person, you know? You know. So an important thing to look at with all of that is he's got all that, but he doesn't have mental health. Yeah. Thank you.
Kanye West, my favorite of all time, hands down, not even close, but he's not my favorite person because, you know, he can't he can't be consistent. Consistent in his values. He does stuff that makes you question, is this person anywhere close to who I think you. And that's you know, that's scary. Whenever you're like, that's my favorite rapper. Because like, his music is something that I take totally separately because it's it's just amazing. Yeah, no doubt.
And he's a you know, he's a dope artist. But but, but that's the point I'm trying to make is like, you know, like, I'm sure he will want to be. I'm saying, okay, it's I'm emceeing. I want to be okay. Relationships won't be like, you know, I mean, so, like, you know, there's, you know, it, you know. Well like more success. What do I have to sacrifice? You know, I'm saying, yeah, yeah.
I mean, I am sacrifice and telling my kids my sacrifice and my my mental health, my sacrifice and being able to walk into a Walmart and buy, you know, a carton of milk. And my mom saying, what am I what am I really sacrificing? So. So how much more do I really want? You know?
But I think for me, you know, I just want to be at a place where I can comfortably, you know, take care of my family, you know, have stability and and peace and and be able to create when I want to be able to be able to build things, when I want to build them and be able to take care of people, not when I need to. You know. I mean, as far as building things whenever you want, you in the last five years you started to new restaurant and to new like other ventures on the East side.
Yeah. That sounds like you've created that. A I'm sure. Yeah, I'm sure. You know. Yeah, yeah, right, right. I mean, it's like, like we hadn't talked about the business aspect, you know, the, the entrepreneurial aspect yet, but like, let's get into that. Like you, you sign pieces is a, it's the jam. Like it's delicious that, you know, it's a hit. Every time I go over there, it's often like it seems like that one has done it scrambled, seems like it's doing well.
Like what do you, what are your goals business wise? you know, you know, I, it's hard because not, you know, it's like five years ago, I wouldn't know not be doing that, you know? So, yeah. So I just like, but now that I have done them, you know, I definitely do. Or when you want to put a scramble like an in Tulsa or something like that, you know, I, I want to expand my live free organization.
I want to expand, you know, with love on, you know, do a burger spot, you know, I mean, I still wanna do a sushi spot, but, you know, we're working on a hotel right now, so just, you know, really, I, I think the the process is doing one thing to help the thing go on.
You know, and then just, you know, have, have cool things and have those stuff that, you know, you know, with the community in mind, you know, seeing it and do it like that, that they could take ownership of like areas and, and put people on him saying we did it when I started the free oxy, everybody that we hired people I grew up with you know seeing homies it was and so you know be able to do things like that, you know.
So with live free like that one is a little less clear to me because you've got this, you know, I want to be free, that I been in charge of. If I wanna see three with fire department, like I've had some experience with it, but I've you've got a brick and mortar building that you know, you've got overhead costs that are continuous. What is your responsibility day to day and keeping that keeping all that running. Do you have 51c3 manager like.
So we have I have a my friend Eddie he does a operations finance stuff, you know but the only way to, to keep all of it, keep all of it going is to be successful in reducing the violence. And you know, we want to, we want to see a 20% reduction in this year and war seven And that's the way, you know, we can be successful 20 to 20%. That's the big that's a big gun. Violence has stayed pretty consistent for like 20 years.
Yeah. So that's I mean, I appreciate you having big goals, but is it a failure if you don't reach that? No, I don't reach that. It's a failure. If if we don't see a reduction, period. Right. You know, it's a failure if we don't if we are able to show that lives, we can impact it.
If we aren't able to show the conflict that we've resolved, if we can't show, you know, true data of, you know, people who were at risk of being involved in combat who aren't anymore, you know, I'm saying this is a failure. If we got, you know, kids getting locked up with guys like them saying, but we're already doing that, you know, And we got like like I could taste with the plans we got when we got off.
But, you know, say like we're like in the mix, you know, I'm saying and everybody that we have on our staff are what call credible messengers. And they are people who who have the credibility, you know, in the community to speak the situations the normal person can speak into. Right. And so we're doing that, you know, and it's it's it's it's it's probably the most important work up and able to do a long time.
So how do you find time like I mean because I see enough of you on social and I see that you're you know you're at but luckily you put them on post, which is smart, but you're you know, you're at East Pieces and you're at scrambled and are you actually take part in the day to day operations of all those things or do you just check in every now and then?
So I don't I don't I have a a GM and operator at Eastside Pizza and, you know, I take I'm, I'm involved in like the, the you know, like the the look, the idea is, you know, you know, what we do in here is planning things like that. But I let they run the restaurant. So, I mean, so you're just marketing and branding and I don't like community. I yeah, I don't, I don't try to, not to, you know, get involved with the firing and, you know, that stuff.
Let them do it, you know, and then, you know, give them the freedom to run to run the restaurant, you know. So I can't, you know, say, yeah. And then the same with Scramble. I have a partner with a co-owner. His name is Cordell, who grew up together and he's in there every day, you know, and he operates and he manages. He does everything, you know, I'm seeing in look, everything he did. Excuse me, but it's so.
So luckily, I have, you know, great people who excuse me, great people who are involved and can do a lot that I can't do. But but I'm in, I'm in. I'm in and out both, you know, when I need to be. And, you know, right now it's been in most my time. I live real crazy.
Well, so, like, you got this, this whole JB brand, which is, you know, developing under you and you are having to trust people to to be consistent with that brand as they, you know, they run these different projects that are is a great regional project. Is that a difficult thing to to release control of? No, it's not. because you know I, I trust people you have, you know, I trust my GM is, I've known her since she was 1112 years old, you know, saying that I know she knows what she's doing.
You know, I grew up with Cordell and. When we first sat down to start talking about scrapple, I you know, I was already doing a lot. And he was down to, you know, to to take up pick up the slack that I couldn't do, you know. And and so, so, you know, yeah, I just you just give people that you trust in that you know you know now it comes to JP like my music and that part I do. Whenever it comes to like the graphic design of your music stuff is that is that you or do you, you work with.
yeah I, yeah, you know, depending on what I want. Our designer. It will go back and forth then, you know what needs to be in that, you know, based on what it is, if it's an album, if it's a single, if it's a teacher, if it's a poster for a show, I usually had the idea what I want, or I might spin out and out, you know, so I can make it for each song. So congratulations on the release of your record.
But you know, I know that I haven't been out for like four months already, but like, I think it's really cool that you did a record job for like, an actual physical record. I should have brought you on My bad. man, that would. I would appreciate it, but I got. You know, I'm not. You're expecting. I got one for you, though. I'll leave you if you want. I'll leave it at SRP. It's okay. Yeah. Yeah, but other.
But yeah, like, you know, I. I just think it's such a cool idea, such a cool project in itself. But then to actually the four separate albums released together, I thought was really like a really cool idea. I think I had the bingo last night. It was, it was then it. Yeah, I was happy to finally, you know, get it done. And so a lot of, a lot of the vinyl and yeah, I mean it was, it was dope. That's really cool. It turned out.
I was asking, so, like, I'm starting to wrap up here, you know, ask a few more questions, just that kind of line, the playing. But well, of course, like any of this off the of future album, you tell me. I try to act broke. Felicity, the number one killer among black folk. Do you think the intrinsic nature of flexing or, you know, stunning in black culture affects the cultural relevance of authenticity? Yeah, I think it's deceiving.
You know, not to say that because I like, I've kind of I've I've had the opportunity see behind the scenes at some things and, you know, a lot of people ain't got it. I think they got it. And and and so, you know, it's just like it's just like first it's like gay pagan, right? Like I grew up around gang members hitting bang, bang, bang.
You know, I've been around it my whole life, but, you know, I'm not a gang banger, you know, so but if I but if I flexed like that on my music, you know, and, you know, you know, claiming that my music and I'm talking like a gang member, my music, then whenever somebody who came back sees me saying, Treat me, you know, saying, sorry, be prepare for that. I'm a gang member. Right. So the same is true.
It, you know, flexing money and all that stuff like, you know I'm I'm not expect that when I see, you know dancing and what happens is it's like you know it creates this this this image, you know that you know, we've seen time and time again, you know, destroy people, you know, mean. And so, yeah, it's I mean, especially with rap, it's hard to take away from it. Yeah, right. You seem to have done a pretty good of it. So I mean, congratulations on that. You still being good at it.
Some people just aren't good at the conscious thing. They're not good at the you know, they're not good backpack. They need to, you know, have that persona to to rap to us. They don't have anything. About. You. You're definitely not one of those. I'm glad that. is there anything that we didn't talk about today that you'd like to mention? Any products you want to talk about. We kind of talked about your restaurants and. I got that was I love the question was good. It's good.
Once again, I appreciate you coming on like it is a big deal to me and I'm glad we were able to make it happen. So in order to respect your time and your time and your busy schedule, bringing the interview to a close. But I want to thank you again for coming on the show. If people want to find out more about. JP where they go to find. Of course, social media at My name is JP or my name is JP dot com. Yeah, I'm all of those places. Also find you randomly scrambles live free and the other one.
With love OKC. Is I have a. Location now we don't have a location we use the office out of there now. Okay. All right. Well, if you enjoyed today's episode, please give it a like follow. Share it with someone you think might enjoy it too. And also check out earlier episodes to support the future creation of great content.
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