My colleagues, We'll stop commenting on everything I get at people and meeting? Why does my coworker keep taking credit for all my idea? Have any wisdom for me? Hi, I'm Alison Green. Welcome to the Aska Manager podcast, where I answer questions from listeners about life at work, everything from what to say if you're allergic to your coworkers perfume to what to do if you drink too much at the company party. Let's get started. Taking a new
job is always something of a gamble. Something can sound great in the interview process, but then once you start turn out not to be at all what you thought it was going to be, And sometimes it can be hard to sort through whether it's just a rocky transition and it'll get better, or whether it's the wrong fit. And if it is the wrong fit, it can be tough to know what to do about it, especially if you're trying to build a stable work history. That is
the situation that my guest today finds herself in. Hi, and welcome to the show. All right, thanks for having me. So, you started a new job about a month or so ago, which came with a pay raise and a better title, and was supposed to be work that was more in line with your master's degree. The position that you took used to be held by one person, but it was split into two, so they hired you and one other
person to do that work. But what you've been finding is that most of the work that you've been assigned was handled by an intern before you started, And it's not the work that you talked about during the hiring process and that you thought you were coming on board to do. And you're trying to figure out is this just growing pains from a new job or is this not the right fit? Am I getting that right? And is there anything else you want to add to that? Um? Yeah,
I think that's about right. Uh, you kind of have the gist of it. Um yeah, there's the basic details now When you say that most of what you're doing now is work that used to be done by an intern. Was it the intern job that was split into two between you and your new coworker, or was it was the job that was split into a different higher level job. So the job that was went into two was a
different higher level position. And Um, there in the sort of transition period between this other person leaving and the two of us coming on, there was an intern that sort of did the majority of the work, and when the other person was employed there at that point, they also had an intern that sort of helped with that work as well. And that work is sort of consuming my everyday work life now, so I can't really focus on the other responsibilities that were listed in the job
description during the interview. And the person, the other person who is hired at the same time as you, from what you can see, are they doing the work that you thought you would be doing some responsibilities, yes, but not everything. There was one thing in particular, like one project in particular, um that I was really interested through the interview process, and I brought it up a lot as as having had experience in it from my previous position.
They were really excited about it. But when I came on, it turned out that project was not in my wheelhouse at all. It was somebody else's responsibility. Now. And is that somebody else the other person who was hired or a completely different person, Yeah, that's the person that was hired, Okay. And the stuff that you have been doing, how far off is it from the work that you thought you were coming in to do? Is it pretty different. Um. So I would say that I had some idea that
this would be part of the position. I just didn't realize that it would take up so much of my time. Um. I was coming into with an understanding that this might be maybe of my responsibilities, but it's really more like
cent of my responsibilities right now. Has anyone acknowledged the situation to you, Like, has anyone said anything like, oh, this is just until you get ramped up, or someone was unexpectedly hit by a bus and out for a two months, so we're having you kind of pinch hit for them until they're back, or any other kind of acknowledgment that this is different than what you talked about
during the hiring process. Yeah, I think. Um. Recently, my boss has sort of um come up to me and said in a few instances, like, I know that this is like a really big part of your time right now, and we're hoping to sort of transition that work in some way. There has been some talk of bringing on an intern again to sort of help with that work as well, But there has been some acknowledgment that this is, you know, a lot of work. It's taking up a lot of your time. And we want you to do
some some of those other responsibilities. Oh okay, so that's really promising actually that they see what's happening and they're not okay with it. And when you've had those conversations, has there have you gotten a sense of like is that like oh often some hypothetical distant future, or is that like within the next couple of weeks. You know, it's been really hard to tell. When I first wrote to you, this wasn't part of the conversation at all yet. It was just sort of appeared that, oh, this is
what you're doing on these responsibilities. But as time has gone on, um, there have been sort of or glimmers of hope that this might be changing and this is not actually supposed to be the status quo. But it's hard to tell whether or not it's actually something that could happen, like, you know, like my responsibilities might change. Um. Yeah, And it is your sense that your boss let me
ask about a different way. When you have talked to your boss about this, how have you handled that side of the conversation, Like have you tried to give the impression that you feel some urgency around getting this settled, or have you tried to be really accommodating. I've tried to be really accommodating, especially because it's my first month and I'm trying to make a good impression and um not trying to sort of make them feel like I'm
burdened by a position that I just started. But I have expressed that it is a lot um and some some help would be really appreciated. And when did you and your boss last talk about it? How long has it been since that last conversation? Maybe about a we
could go okay, So that's interesting. When I was thinking, when I first had your letter, before we talked today, and before I knew that there were sort of these glimmers of hope on the horizon, I was prepared to tell you, you know, there's a few different things that could be going on here. You know, since you're a month in, maybe they're easing you into the job just way too slowly. Because sometimes employers will do that because
they think it's easier on the person. Sometimes they do it because they are being pulled in too many different directions and they haven't been able to carve out time to train you yet, or just start delegating work to you because delegating work to a brand new person actually takes some time in order to set them up to do it well, or that it could be that there actually wasn't enough work to split that job into two, and so they were filling up your time with this
other work or worst case scenario. And I no longer think that it sounds like this, fortunately, But the worst case scenario I had in my head before we talked was that it could be that whoever hired you had done a really bad job of figuring out what your role would be and conveying it to you in an accurate way, or that it was accurate at the time, but something changed since then and no one had talked
to you about it. Yeah, I think. Um. I think part of the issue as well is splitting the role into two sort of a new decision for your organization. And I think through the interview process they were still trying to figure out what work would be delegated to what person, and I think that process is still continuing now in some way, but they're still trying to decide what I'm supposed to be doing as opposed to what
my colleague is doing. Well, I like that your boss has acknowledged it to you, and you're not just sort of doing this completely different job than you're hired for it. No one is talking about it. So it's good that it's been acknowledged. It's good that it sounds like at some point it's going to change. I would like it a lot better if they were giving you a clearer timeline so that you knew does that mean two more weeks of this or does this mean six months of it? Um?
So I think that the thing to do might be to talk to your us and try to get a clear understanding of that. It also maybe like it's great to try to be accommodating when you're in a new job. That's totally understandable. You don't want to seem like you're difficult enough the bat. But it could be that your boss is thinking, oh, well, she's completely fine with this, so I can take my time and I can deal with other priorities, and when I get around to dealing
with this, i'll deal with it. But if it is months away, then so be it. And so it might be that you need to be a little bit more upfront about where you are on all of this so that it doesn't set for six months, right, Okay, we'll pause here for a quick break and then we'll be right back. So I think, um, I mean, if you just talked to her about it a week ago, I might give it like another week just to see is there any movement on it? Does anyone bring it up again?
If not, and it's a full two weeks since the two of you last talked about it, then it's co letely reasonable to talk to her and try to pin it down and to say, you know, hey, I know we talked about this being something that you're working and figuring out. Do you have a timeline in mind for when that's likely to happen, and then see what she says.
But if she's at all vague, or if she says anything that makes you think, okay, this is not going to be taken care of in the next month, it's pretty reasonable at that point to say, you know, hey,
I want to be transparent with you. I'm completely happy to help out in a pinch, glad to do it, but I want to be transparent that I accepted this job because I was really excited about the responsibilities that we talked about in the hiring process, and that is the stuff that I want to spend my time unprofessionally, So I'm hoping that we can nail down a timeline
for making that transition. Okay, great, I don't think we've had sort of a conversation about the exact responsibilities yet, so I think it might be actually really nice to sort of sit down and talk about how things are going and sort of my expectations and their expectations, and kind of come to understanding of what my responsiblity will entail in the future and if there are certain steps that are being taken to sort of alleviate the work that I didn't not just pay to be doing so
much of. Yes. Absolutely, And it sounds like she does realize how much of your time that intern where it is taking up. But if you at all get the sense that she doesn't be really really clear about that, because if it's taking up eight percent of your time and she thinks it's taking up that's a huge difference. So try to put a numerical value on it if you can. If you're getting the sense that she does not realize, Okay, yeah, that's great. Do you want to talk about what to do if you can't seem to
pin down a timeline and this is going on and on. Yeah,
that would be awesome. Okay, So let's say you have that conversation and she tells you like, oh, yeah, it's in progress and it should just be a few weeks, and then a few weeks go by and like there's just no sign of a change, and you maybe check in again and say that you're just trying to figure out where she's at with it and you're getting the sense it's not happening anytime soon, or when you talk to her initially she says, you know what, realistically, it's
going to be six months before we actually bring out it in in turn to help with this work. If it is something like any of those scenarios, it really is okay to say again, you know, I think did you mention in your email to me that you you had two offers and you accepted this one and turned down
another one. Yeah, that's right. So you could even say that, if you're comfortable with it, you could say, you know, I want to be really up front with you, I accepted this job and turned down at a different offer because I was so excited about the work that we talked about in the interview and it really is important to me to be sing my time on that, and I want to get a sense from you of how likely that really is in the next few months or whether it really is going to stay like it is
right now, because you're trying to get her, You're you're trying to get her to d two things, to be honest with you, first of all, to be really th right, but also to sort of do the thinking that she should have done quite a while ago, frankly, or at least to do it in front of you, of of thinking through, okay, what actually needs to happen to take care of this and realistically when is that likely to
be or is it likely to be. So you have that conversation, Let's say you continue to think, oh, this is not this is not changing anytime soon. I think at that point you would need to decide, knowing that it's going to be like this for a while, do you want to stay or not. And I know that you mentioned in your letter to me that you're concerned about leaving over this, and you're worried that it could be hard to find another job because your job searching
for three months before this job came along. But I think you also said, this is one of three different jobs where you got to the final round and you got this offer and another offer, and that's actually pretty good for three months of job searching. Yeah, three months is not a terribly long search. It certainly feels like it when you're in the middle of it, but that relatively speaking, that's not a crazy long time to be searching,
and you've got two offers out of it. So I would not take that at all as a sign that you're trapped where you are. Okay, great, that's yes, absolutely. Now, you also said you were worried that if you did decide to leave this job over this, that it would be bad for your resume because your your last job for two years and the one before that for a year and a half, and you really want to show
longer term stays. Right, Yeah, that's right. So I think the thing to know here is that, actually, this is going to sound counterintuitive, but leaving this job pretty quickly would actually be fine because if you left it quickly enough, you could just leave it off your resume. Now, if you stay for a year and leave, like let's say you are patient and nothing changes and now you've been there a year, and you're like, oh crap, I really
do have to leave over this. That is actually harder because you wouldn't generally leave a whole year off of your resume, But if you're just there for a few you can leave it off and it would be like
it never happened. Okay. I guess my concern with that would be that my previous positions were I guess you could say there were more sort of customer service oriented or more assistant admen oriented, and I'm looking to take my career in a different direction, sort of um, higher level authority in some ways, and this is a position that gives me that I hope once we have these
conversations with my boss um. And I guess my concern is if I leave quickly and I leave it off my resume, and I'm not really showing the sort of growth that this job might show. Yeah, I think you would sort of be. You'd be job searching from the same point that you were when your job searching a
couple of months ago. The job started that led you to this job, and this that job started did get you a job that was supposed to at least have more of the responsibility that you're looking for So you would just be kind of a racing the last month or so and and just continuing the job started the you're already in. Now you might be are you worried that, Yeah, but you'd be doing it from a period from a point of unemployment, whereas last time you were job searching
while you're already had a job. Yeah, that's why that would be part of a concern. So I think there's two different ways to handle that. You could put this job on your resume even though you've only been there a few months, which normally I don't recommend. I mean, there's when you've only been in a job a short time, you don't generally have the kind of accomplishments to list that would be a plus for your resume, and the short length will raise these questions about why are you
looking to leave already? So in general I tell people who have already left a job after only a few months just leave it off entirely. But in your case, it might be if your job searching while you're still there, it might be that you put it on and that you're just very put it on your resume, and that you're very upfront about the fact that they had had they had had someone leave who had been doing a lot of this other sort of work and it ended
up getting transferred over to you. And they've been really clear that they've been trying to change to that, but it doesn't look like there's a timeline for that, and so you're you're looking for something that's more like what you thought you were signing up for, and that happens, You're not going to be judged for that. Okay, let's take a quick break and we'll be right back to
talk about this some more. You know. The other thing is you set in your letter that you just got your masters, and a lot of people sort of reset their careers when they get a new degree. So if you wanted to just leave it off your resiman while you looked around, it also wouldn't be that weird that you might have a couple of months after graduating where you didn't have anything listed. I mean, frankly, even if that weren't the case, a gap of a couple of
months is not really a big deal. But school having just finished school, that makes it even more normal. Oh okay, I hadn't thought of it that way. Actually, Yeah, so you could say I was working with these customer service jobs while I was in school, But now that I have the degree, I'm looking for work doing X Y Z. Okay. Yeah, school is actual a super helpful reset in that way. Sometimes. Yeah, I think I've been just so concerned about the potential
gap that I haven't even been thinking about the school factor. Like, of course, people who have finished and graduated, they're going to be looking at their career field and that might take a little while to sort of break into it. But that's off my radar because I've been still nervous about the gaps. Yeah, and also, don't get too worried about the gap, because it's to the extent that it will be an issue at all, and it really might
not be an issue at all. But to the extent that it is, it's only going to be an issue this job search because as soon as you get the next job, you stay there for a while. The next time your job searching, no one is going to be like, oh, what's this two month gap from a few years ago. Like that's when people talk about having gaps on your ASOMA being a problem, they're not talking about gaps of
a few months. They're talking about like big solid gaps where like you're out of the workforce for a year or more and maybe you were in jail during that time or something like that. Okay, I see, And you know, maybe this won't be a problem at all, because once I have this conversation with my with my supervisor, you know, things might change. Yeah, I mean that's the hope, right. The hope is that you won't even have to deal with a job search because you will talk to your
boss and it'll go well. But do have in the back of your head that if it doesn't, here's a different path that you could use and it would probably be completely fine. Okay, Yeah, that's that's a lot more positive than I expected. It's more positive than I expected actually before we talked, because I didn't have the information about the more recent conversations you've had with your boss.
But those are really promising, and I think it really does sound like the immediate task for you now, after you give it, say another week, is to just have like be a little bit more forthright with your manager that you're feeling some urgency around this. Um you don't want to be so I mean, you want to be accommodating. Of course, you want to be a helpful person who's easy to work with, but you also want to advocate
for yourself. And you took the job thinking it was going to be x and it's been why you're willing to help out, but not indefinitely. Yeah, and I will say that during the interview process, I did actually have a salary negotiation that went well, So that was also a first for me. Oh good, congratulations Steve for doing that. So did you get more than what they originally offered? Yes, excellent, I like hearing Matt. Yeah, I know. And I did use the toops that you had on your blog. Oh good,
I'm so glad. What was the most useful to you? So the most useful to me was just giving a number and then not saying anything else. Just yeah, just shutting up, nobody explanation. I just gave a number. I was like, how about this, and they went back and it's just like, okay, that's how about this since thead and it was still higher than when you know, what was initially given. So that was good. Good, I'm so
glad you did it. And yeah, people, um, people get nervous and they start talking more and filling in the silence. And then they undercut themselves. So it's good for you if you're just saying it and think it. Yeah, yeah, it was great. Were you surprised at how easy it ended up being. I was absolutely surprised. I could not
believe it. Almost. Yeah. People. I think people build it up in their head to be this like big conversation where you have to like build this whole case for raise and maybe you have to come in with some slide showing your worth, and it's so much easier than that, Like it can be like one sentence. Yeah, that was exactly the expectation that I had before reading some of the tips that you've written about. But yeah, that's all
it was. It was literally one sentence in an email and I just said thanks, and then they got back to me and it was fun. Yeah. I love hearing that. Yeah good. I'm glad other people are hearing that too, because the more that we can like demystify that process and get people more money, the better. Oh yeah, absolutely. Well do you feel like you are set on the next steps? Is there anything else that would be helpful for us to talk about? Um? I think I feel
pretty good about it. Um, I feel good about you know, checking in with my with my boss in a week and asking about next steps. Um, and if that doesn't work to being really transparent about what my needs are for the position and what my expectations are and things like that. So that feels really good. And then I also feel really positive that if it doesn't work out, I do have options going forward. Um, I don't feel like a potential gap well just you know, totally destroy
my work history or something like that. Good. Yeah. I think the thing about having gaps in your resume, it's like the message has gotten out there that sometimes gaps can be a problem, but it's been completely misinterpreted, and it's like scared the crap out of people about gaps that like no reasonable interviewer is actually going to care about. There needs to be some sort of like public service campaign explaining to people that a couple of months is
not going to be a big deal. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Well, thank you so much for coming on the show. Yeah, thank thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. Before we end today's show, I have an update from a previous guest. Do you remember the guest from a few weeks ago whose boss was a horrible jerk to her. One of the interesting things about the situation was that the boss only seemed to be being a jerk to the collar as far as she could see. The boss
was pretty nice to everyone else. And one thing we talked about was that she could consider talking to her coworkers to see if she could get any insight into what might be going on. Well, she did that, and she set me an update about what she found out. Here is the email that she sent to me. I'm just going to read it. Hi, Alison, I wanted to give you an update on my boss. It turns out that everyone in my department hates her, but no one
has directly come out and said it. My nice peer who was also managed by her, this guy on the sister team that used to be managed by her, and this lady on the sister team. She literally made the guy on the other team cry last year, and he contemplated quitting in his first month. Additionally, I found out that a guy who was in my role before me worked at my company for two years and then quit two months after she was hired. There are rumors that
he filed an HR complaint against her. Literally, they all call her a snake. Devoid of any genuine kindness, who was only nice when her boss is around. What I thought was a friendship between my coworker and my boss is actually just self preservation on my co workers part. The worst thing is that they told me that it's only going to get worse, and they've been right. She is just getting weirder and weirder as time goes on.
For example, in our one on one the other day, she made me tell her all the ways that I think she is deficient as a manager. Obviously I had to really water it down, so I'm looking at other options now. I must say it does feel good to know that I'm not alone, though my pure stressed that she does this to everyone. So there is an update, not a great one, but I'm sure it is a relief for the collar to know for sure that this boss is just a jerk and it's not something specific
to her. That's our show for today. Thanks for listening. If you like to come on the show to talk through your own question, email it to podcast at ask a manager dot org, or you can leave a recording of your question by calling eight five five six work. That's eight five five four T six nine six seven five. You can get more Ask a Manager at ask a Manager dot org or in my book Ask a Manager how to navigate clueless colleagues, lunch stealing bosses, and the
rest of your life at work. They Ask a Manager show is a partnership with How Stuff Works and is produced by Paul Deckett. If you liked what you heard, please take a minute to subscribe, rate, and review the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or Google Play. I'm Alison Green and I'll be back next week with another one of your questions.