This is the Art of Wrestling with professional wrestler Colt. Comeata All right, Hi you doing, Come on in, Sit down, relax, You're about to listen to the art of wrestling. A professional wrestling podcast. It's a life podcast. It's a personal journal. It's an entreeway to the mind that solds the hearts and the lives of the people involved in the world of professional wrestling. I am your host. I am a whatnotter, I am a podcaster, I'm a mental health advocate. Most importantly, though, I am
a pro wrestler. I swear I'm still a pro wrestler. And we are coming to you live from my studio apartment in Chicago, Illinois. Before we go any further, this is a fan supported and listener supported podcast, supported by people just like you. Some great ways that you can support cultmerch dot com. I'm shipping all types of fun merchandise from my apartment to you all by myself. Grab some upper deck cards, some pins, headbands, comic books, brand new eight by tens, all types of fun over at Cold
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bonus wrestling, anonymous calls that I take with my friends. This month, two episodes with Hornswaggle, and a lot of great bonus stuff over on my Patreon slash colt Cabana. Today's guest pretty Peter Avalon, and I am so grateful to have Peter on my podcast. I said this to him privately, I will say it publicly. He is one of the most underrated and underappreciated wrestlers on the scene to day. He's what you would call a wrestlers wrestler.
Us the wrestlers in the back. We always love what Peter does, how he performs, and sometimes you know, it takes a classically trained pro wrestler to kind of understand the little things or the nuances, but we see it and we appreciate it, and I appreciate Peter coming on the show. There's a couple of really key points or things that I'd like to point out about this talk. So we did this podcast in August. We did it in Cologne, Germany, when I went with a crew of wrestlers to promote
AW Video Games. Actually, I'm gonna shout out the crew. It was me Uno and Hellico, Peter, Chris Daniels, and referee Rick Knox, along with some like the business people of AW Games like THHQ and some the AW marketing team, and well, a lot has happened since this podcast we did in my life personally and professionally. Amazingly enough, at the start of the talk that I did with Peter, we kind of just started talking about
anxiety and mental health. And this episode was supposed to come out in early September, and honestly, I just haven't been able to want to talk about anything, so I just kind of delayed everything and I told Peter and he was more than okay with it, obviously. And I didn't delay it because the company that I worked for like told me not to talk about anything or what I could or could not do, just kind of where my brain was
at, you know. I started the podcast in two ten and we don't go every week now, but I like to put out shows occasionally spot letting my friends or people that I find super interesting. And from the beginning, you know, I was so open, maybe even to a fault, about dealing with losing my dream job of THEWE or fighting to be an independent wrestler, or how to make money in wrestling, or how to survive a lot
of things that I was very open about. And I knew I made fans for life, which is I assumed you people listening to the show right now because of my ability to be candid and real. And as I think about it and as I did it, there was really two things that I just kind of never touched. You know. It's a wall or a barrier, or I'm good at compartmentalizing, which I know I am, but and I'm not there yet, nor may I ever be. But a lot of you
probably notice I never really talked about significant others. I never really talked about my relationships, which was kind of fun to hear people guess about my sexuality over the years, or my lifestyle or how I conducted myself. But that side of life was just something I didn't want to talk about, nor do I want to talk about, and maybe that's stuff to work on. And the other one is well, you know, kind of what's been going on. I've been in the news, you know, whether it's now or for
the past whatever years it's been. I think the closest that you'll ever hear me touch upon it was on an episode of the Art of Wrestling called The Trial, which is where I documented all of my feelings while I was going through the trial in which the WWE doctors sued me in a court of law
and lost. And so Peter talks about or brings up mental health and anxiety, and looking back to the conversation with Peter, I noticed that I jumped right on it, and I feel that's desperation to connect with a wrestler on a deeper level than ever before, especially at that time when I was feeling a lot of feelings. I mean, I'm always feeling a lot of feelings, including now, but it was definitely prevalent at the time of this talk.
And if you go back and you listen to the Trial episode, and I haven't, but I remember it very well, I recognized now the feelings that I had were the feelings of debilitating anxiety. At the time, I said, it was like a sign that I was alive and I loved it because I was feeling feelings that I had never felt befored and meant that I
was going through something and that's part of life. And I was feeling those because the trial and everything was traumatic, more traumatic than anything I've ever been through, and I was in the eye of the hurricane. I was in the middle of it. A couple of years ago, I seeked help. I got help in many different ways. A while back, I started seeing
a professional. Many of you have noted my silence publicly with all that's been going on with me, and that's because I'm working on myself privately, and I'm not gonna say it's amazing or cured. It'll probably take years or decades. Maybe I'll never fully healed or understand what my head and heart and feelings are going through. But like the great Cody Rhodes once said, do the work. I'm doing the work, and I'm not here to bash anyone or
take shots at anyone. And I've learned that there is no right or wrong. I can't control what I can't control. I'm trying to understand why I do things that I do and how I can control my feelings and only my feelings and try to become a better person. So I command Peter for talking with me about it. The whole thing isn't strictly about this, but it's kind of the start of it. He didn't have to do it. I appreciate his ability to be candid, and I appreciate you, the wrestling fan
who seem to understand. I mean, my Twitter has been a wild shit show, and it's crazy how some people feel that their tweets towards you are like an acceptable move in life, like you're allowed to do that. But I've also been really good about not letting that affect me and also realizing that whoever is tweeting this there, you're not a real human being, Like I guess you have a lot of work to do. And here's some good advice.
If you ever have people going after you on Twitter, some more than others, just go to that person's account and then look at their tweets and you realize this is a them problem and not a you problem. So that all goes into doing the work. And I don't know if that made any clarity, but maybe you got a better idea of what I'm going through and that I'm going through it, and also maybe when I'm at a convention, you know, there's certain stuff you don't want to bring up. I think
I've said that forever. You know, I always love talking to people, and I love talking wrestling, I love talking shop. But then once you bring up some stuff that has been traumatic for me over years, I shut down. And then you read on a message board somewhere, how cool to dick and again trying not to read that. But sometimes stuff takes over the Internet, and then I mean, it's happening, It's happened, it will continue to happen. Before all of this went down, you know, I
like a hustling businessman that I am. I was trying to set up my future in case my contract didn't get rolled over. I had seen it almost happened to me before. And then, you know, I resigned a new contract. But I was kind of unsure of my future, so I partnered with a company called Whatnot. And this is not an ad, This is just something that I'm doing. The ads will come later. I'm assuming I'm
still going to have a job with my employer. But the great thing about AW is that we're allowed to work on ourselves and our businesses outside the company, so Pro Wrestling Teas and I are still doing Whatnot. I host it. I bring some items on from my closet over the years, and then PWT they also have so many things from the warehouse over the years. It's
like kind of QVC meets eBay fast auction style shopping. And we're going to do a live one from aew from the arena in Chicago in the building with wrestlers selling their gear and exclusives. It's so much fun. Join us once a week. It's usually Wednesdays, sometimes it's Tuesdays if I end up going to work on Wednesdays. It's on an app called Whatnot or Pwtlive dot com is a site that we may that will lead you to there. I wanted
to promote this Whatnot thing that we're doing. And I probably have so much more to talk about, returning to Dynamite, doing the fringe, playing Fortnite with Kip on Twitch, all the fun stuff that I usually talk about before the podcast, But we'll do that next week. I got an episode next week coming to another Friend, another great talk, so stick around next week for that one too. But I feel talking about my brain was enough for
you this week, and definitely enough for me. Before we get into the talk with Peter, I do want to talk about sponsors this week, Manscaped and the performance package four point oh. Manscaped is the leader in below the waste grooming, and they have asked me to say something about using the code cult getting twenty percent off and free shipping when trimming your pumpkins, which I guess can relate to both Halloween and Thanksgiving. But I'm going to stay away
from the ball humor. You get the idea. I definitely use Manscaped. I've been man trimming ever since I got into wrestling. I think it's the only thing that wrestling was ahead of the curve on, and when society started to pick up on it, I did feel cool in some weird way that this is something I have been doing for years. And over the years I've used many different things, including I remember in college waxing my chest. But Manscaped the product, it's perfect. It's part of what I do now.
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Hi. Let's talk about all your problems? All right? What are you're in today? Have you been? Um? Have you been on all this Britain? Okay, I'm here. Hello. We're in German first of all, German rest first time? And have you been out of the country. Yeah, I'm into China. Yeah, and to China and Mexico. Those that's how the international has off going. What's your China Middle Kingdom Wrestling? I was out there helping in produce the show and to produce the Battle
Royal that we had as the main event. It was me Zeta Zang Raylan. We were all out there together for about a week. Was this one aid started and they went by China? I'm not sure it was not with aw you just went separately. It was separately, Yeah, that he was working with us through a championship rustling from Hollywood and then he was doing his own separate thing. Okay. Yeah, it was pretty cool and then hold
on. So, so you went out to produce what to produce the show and to produce a show or like they have a they have that's a name I've heard of the Middle Kingdom. Yeah. Right, they've been trying to make their their show in China. I think they were trying to do everything monthly and it was just I guess my turn. They wanted me to help produce the show and try to you know, elevate it. Yeah, the appearance of it like they did with Championship Rusting from Hollywood and and Championship Russ
of Arizona and you, and that's it. I'm a man, I'm the man for your job. That was it. So it was nice. Did you wrestle out there? I did. I also wrestled. I was featured heavily in the Battle Royal. I came down to me and Zombie Dragon, who's one of their main guys out there, and he beat me at the last two. You know, I especially for you as a Los Angeles person, you would think we had enough dragons. You'd think with Super and American. I think that was a running joke for many years, right to the
point that there was a dragon Dragon in Chicara. Yeah, and uh, we might as well add the zombie to it, might as well the dead one. And what was Mexico or you know, being friends with Rocky Romero for so many years, you just learned that every Los Angeles wrestler that's good like wrestles in Mexico. Right, Yeah, it's nearby. Might as well? Is that a thing? So when you say Mexico, do you do you mean Tijuana Ja. That's one of time three hour drive maximum, I
think yeah. And then you work at the the TJ Arena down there, it's Big Pact Arena, and uh it's me and Ray Ross against Yuma and at the time Johnny good Time. Now Kevin Martinson. So he has changed his name. Yep. Oh, so I didn't mean to out him. I didn't know. If I don't keep up with the product. Well, good to have you here. It's been so we've been hanging out in Germany being German goop balls. It's nice that like we just get sent here from
a e W. Everything's kind of take can care of. I guess this is the better part of the job. Yeah, this has been my favorite trip ever wrestling. Yeah, it's a good crew here. Yeah, it's a great crew, good thing, and I want to touch on that thing. I'm going to edit this if you don't like it, though, But you had talked about you've talked about that anxiety stuff. I don't know if
that was just for us or if that was for oh nah whatever. Yeah, yeah, you mentioned this morning and again, I you tell me if you don't want anything in there, because that's how I run my show.
That you were a little anxiety driven, and it's and I only bring that up just because I think it's good to talk about because me berstally, when you said that, I was like, oh what, you know, like we're wrestlers, were out there, we're half naked, we're putting ourselves on the line, and you were like, I got a little anxiety this morning. Yeah, I could. I consider myself an introvert. I try to be extroverted a lot of stuff, but it's an introvert I end up,
I kind of meet I will hit a threshold I guess of socialization. I guess sometimes and just being around just mass amounts of people and uh, doing a lot of my own personal work over the over the past a few years, with like therapy and stuff like that, trying to I guess put a put a term to stuff that I'm feeling, and it's like anxiety was a big one of them. And uh, I am trying to also finally diagnosed ADHD, so I'm also I'm handling that I put my I'm on medication.
I was say I put myself on medication. I did not. I wrote a script. Yeah, yeah exactly. Now I went to doctor and I'm on medication and everything now uh therapy and then uh healthy boundaries with with people and family and stuff like that and just leads to better mental health. Well, I just I say, because we're wrestlers and we're out there and I'm you know, and we could both talk about our things because you know I have that too, and I'm I found myself and tell me what you think
about Like the I found myself a little like introverted getting into wrestling. And then once when you're younger and you're starting wrestling, you're just like, you'll do it for me personally, I'll do anything. Like it was the same. I became very extroverted. And then now like years later, I'm reverting back to that same inch over. But when the when the light is on, I'll do anything, right. I'm a maniac, right, like you
put a spotlight on me. I there's something different about that too, because like when you're in the ring up, you're surrounded by the imense amount of people there. They are watching you, but you're not having to like really
get to know each and every one of them. And then like when you go into back into the back into the business setting, it's like, I guess the anxiety was also from having to meet a lot of new executives and a lot of this and a lot of new stuff and just I guess all the new amount of people that I'm having to meet and then also represent at the same time, aw and all this it's just you know, a lot,
I guess when you because you've done a lot of extra work. And I so so lately I found myself under a lot of anxiety and so I and I also have been, you know, seeking help for this. And I remember, because I've got this like shock of whatever it is through my
body that I I guess you learned that it's anxiety. But like I'm trying to think of back to when I had that kind of anxiety, and it was when I would go to WWE and do extra work, right, So I got my question was like were you were you also in thats when you
did that stuff? If by saying like meeting all these executives, because when we're in our you know, we're trying to get a job in our young twenties or whatever it is, it's like those are all the like the undertaker is the executive, right, Like everybody is the exact Like luckily you're in a place now where you're friends with all the wrestlers, but because there's new
people, but then you're friends with nobody. It's so anxiety drive absolutely and then like you're you're younger at that time, so so you don't really have you feel an anxiety, but you don't know how to manage it the right way. So you're just kind of panicking like, oh my god, don't fuck it, and you're so. I for sure it was feeling that then, but I just didn't know how to manage it the best way. Now it's like breathing techniques and grounding and blah blah blah. You know, yeah,
I just I just I don't know. I just it brought me back to those days of just like how fucking crazy it was, and nobody And something I also I've realized is like nobody knows what you're going through, like because someone else like said something to me and they were talking about like that kind of stuff for them, and I was like, oh, I had no clue. The same case and poys, but like I'm a mess and I feel the same with a lot of stuff out at hiding. I yes,
And I think that comes with just the job. You have to you have to hide certain stuff because you can't you don't want people looking at you and thinking something, Yeah. I mean so I kind of comes with it, and I don't know. Yeah, um okay, So when when you got into wrestling, were you a little scared little boy or were you? Yeah? I was. I had a what's the word, like a helicopter parents, overbearing parents, you know what I mean. So it's like I
was kind of kind of sheltered. I felt barry sheltered. I I went out and I did stuff, I had friends, but it was a lot of overbearing, overbearing and sheltered Barry sheltered. So then finally turn eighteen, it's one of the things were like I'm gonna do whatever the hell I want you know, Uh no, you can't join wrestling school when you're seventeen, and I'm eighteen, Like, well I'm gonna do it. So my eighteenth birthday, I went in to join wrestling school and you know, tell me
about how not you're but like, what does that mean? So you're assume me from Los Angeles? I've yeah, born and raised in Los Angeles, and it was I commuted to school, to the wrestling school while I was also full time at university, and they just they just thought I was wasting my time. But it's wrestling. Really. That was I guess, my way to finally take over what is mine, you know what I mean. It's like instead of having someone else kind of guiding me, I was like,
I'm taking my own life into my hands. And and I mean better or for worse. I turned me into an outgoing, crazy adult man. So where in La are you fling? I was born in Burbank. I grew up in Rancho Cucamonga, and then I lived back in Burbank now but k fab from Carson City, Nevada. Oh yes, you're from I was, yeah, I grew up in Rancho Cucamonga, the home of the Bucks. Yeah, they were. I think we went to rival high schools.
They were Alta Loma High School graduates and I'm Los Olsos High School graduates. I mean, I didn't think it was a real place until I met the Bucks. And now all of a sudden, there's the Bucks, there's Cutler, there's you there. It's like, wait, all these people are from there. Who would have thought that Rachekukamuka, California as a wrestling town? Did you know about are you guys the same agesh Me and Nick Car? Did you participate in their backyard wrestling? No? I don't. I think
they weren't living in Rancho. Maybe at that time my parents wouldn't let you know. They might have been in a high desert and my parents would not. Yeah. Absolutely. Oh were you obsessed with wrestling? Once I learned about it in early elementary school, I immediately was obsessed with it. Yeah, I'm wondering why you didn't find this backyard group that was putting on like look, I don't know, I don't know. Did you read their book
and did you like know there? I don't want to put your apother book, but like, was that like a like was it like, was it. I don't. I think there was. It just their little bubble or I think so. Yeah. But I also I think they were living in the High Desert at the time Victorville. I don't know the difference. Victorville is like an hour away from Kukamonga, so I think they might have moved
at the time, but I'm not one hundred percent sure. Okay, I just met met a couple of friends in high school and when I had like Steve Austin shirts, and I was like, what is this? You know? And they started telling me and then I tried to watch and my folks wouldn't let me watch it, and then uh, just flipping channels. I think we were on like a vacation with some family friends and they had both they had some sons as well, and I would hang out with and we
were flipping through channels and they came across Undertaker and Steve Auston fighting. I said, hey, go back, and they laughed, were you like this ship? And I said, yeah, let's turn it back. And I watched Steve Austin and fight the Undertaker? Is that do you think? Is that religious? Or like your parents being like you can't watch wrestling. I don't know what it is. Like my mom as a kid was around it with like her father and and and her family because they went to the Grand
Olympic. She remember she brought up the Destroyer to me like that and all the I love when older people bring up random like yeah, like in Chicago, it's like I used to watch Go, used to watch Moose no exactly that. I was like, oh shit, you know, but I don't know where the disconnect eventually was. My my dad grew up watching Luca Libre and then he told me when he found out it was fake, it like made him so angry and I'm sorry, I'm sorry. What what what?
Huh what? It's what? It's what? It's what. I didn't hear. You are both of your parents has fan just my dad Okay, yeah, my mom's a white lady. Uh. And did your dad come from Mexico? He came from Cuba? Oh shit, yeah, okay, from
about like during the Wars. He came in the seventies when they were letting when Castor was letting people go, so him, my aunt Molly, and my grandmother and my great grandmother, they all left with just the clothes on their backs and came over here and then eventually ended up in California where my grandmother, single mom from Cuba, was raising two children and helping with her
her mother to live in California. How did they turn it around? Just hustling, hustling that my my my dad and my my aunt would work work from a young age to help help bring home stuff. My dad was telling him all he's stories that he had as like a server at like the Bottom Venture in downtown LA and stuff like that, and just how much hustling they would have to do. And then he eventually got himself into real estate and he became real good at real estate, and he was able to become a
very successful successful man. He owns properties. Yeah, he has a family, you know, his wife and me a son, and I have a sister m He now lived own a property into Mecca and there you could take very good care of themselves. He's really an American story, the American dream, American dream, American story. Have you ever been back to Cuba? They have? I have not, are you? I don't know. My ignorance is very high. But like we weren't allowed to go to Cuba for
a while. No, I don't know if we're still all. I don't know if we're not allowed to either. I think he just still thought got to go about it a certain way to get there. I also was like when I was young, they I wasn't. They didn't have really have me learned Spanish either. It was just like no everything. They didn't really want to be be very cuban. Um and you don't know Spanish. I don't know span. I now I know a lot better. I can understand it,
but speaking it is still difficult. Have you gone like in your older years, have you gone and asked like the exact reason or uh, like my grandmother has passed away, my great grandmother's passed away, uh, and just whatever little vague explanation I've been to get able to get from my dad. But it's just more now he's like, no, go go learn I I what the fuck? Like? Go whoops? So yeah, whoops? My bad? Okay, So they love you there. Maybe there's probably something.
There's there's something Cuban in there, I think so. I think it's the they're holding on to you for eight seventeen point five. The options I was given of a job career was like medicine, an attorney, you know, or something business where you can make a lot. Less matter Jewish parents. All right, so you you're eighteen. I did the same thing. I said, Mom, I'm eighteen, I'm a grown up. I can make my own descent. I'm going to wrestling school. She wanted me to
go to college, and I did have to. But then I also went to wresting school because I'm eighteen. Yeah, fine, I'll go to college. But I'm a grown up. You can't tell me what to do. But okay, you can also tell me what to do as long as you let me go to wrestling school for my college. Okay, who do you find? Who do you find? And how do you find? Oh? Okay, So I am I think at the time, I'm still seventeen.
I'm not eighteen yet, and I'm at a I have this little job, my first job ever, at a at the mall, the Victoria Gardens, And it's a little little kiosk outside that sell in their courtyard that sells T shirts and it was your Skin Industries. Those a god awful bro T shirts like the naked women and it's just so cringe bullshit. I sold all this Inland Empire dog shit clothes. And then slow day I had the computer and
I'm just on the Internet. I went on world famous socalen censor dot com and found Charles Mercury had posted something on the most message boards about wrestling school in Anaheim. So when I turned eighteen, I went down there. Now, were you a person that was going to sokael like every day? I was, Oh, so consensu. I never posted, So I was never a board guy that posted, but I did. I would go to it
because I wanted to no events. I wanted to look up events, and then I also wanted to see, so you were you were going to indies too? I started I was at this point going to indie's. My very first show i'd gone to was PWG in Rosita, and then I went to a couple more, and then I started going to uh E WF nearby Jesse Hernandez's. I went to a couple of Aws Spark Kapitski shows where I saw Adam Pierce beat the shit out of a little cholo with the Induba title.
You could have put anybody in that, anybody, anybody. Yeah, And I'll never forget that show because I don't know what it was, but Pierce, he spat, he spat this loogie and it ended up right on my friend Google's and I lost my mind because I saw he was He's this white guy said the real pasty skin and his face just got red as a tomato. And I'm just best show. And Pierce could not give a five up.
Yeah, it was seen him beat up many audience members. Yes, it was just nothing to laugh about it, right, I'm all was laughing out of sadness. Yes, I feel he's changed his ways, but who really knows at this point. I love at him one of our favorites, of course. Okay, yeah, because I don't know. I'm always curious. It's just like for me, it was a little bit of like oh the first like they say, do your research, but I'm just like a wrestling school near me, I gotta go. I did. I did do
my research. EWF was too too much money for what I had at the time. I was, you know, just that little job. And then uh, I don't know if you was PW might have been gone, and then I don't know if there was any I don't think I found. Some of the others that I found were too too far and in other states, and then just Charles Mercury was running his academy up in junction with other academies, so it was like you pay. It was sixty bucks a month and
I could go to any one of these classes. The only trainer I knew of though, was Charles because he was on PWG and he was doing all the stuff around in the area, so I did kind of do my research. He also had Scorpio Sky and at the time Ronan and Mister Excitement, and then uh, he would have a couple of others. I would come through, like Scott Lost and Chris Hero was there my first day. Cannas Lerey taught me my roles. Yeah, it was great. The young Bucks
came through a couple of times and like like rerolled around together. So he had schools at different places. He had just the one school in Anaheim, but it was a part of another It was a part of a jiu jitsu gym that also had other wrestling schools that ran out of it. And it wasn't his ring. It was Food Dogs Ring, Rest in Peace, Okay, Yeah, it was just it was a local guy in the area and
Chris Hero was at your first day of wrestling training. He was at my first day of wrestling training and I was like, oh, this is cool, but I couldn't learn anything from him again because I don't know anything. And Cannas Larey blessed her heart, was very sweet to us. And you know, she took me and my friend Googles, who was training with me at the time, took us away from the other students, showed us our roles, and then threw us back in with the other students. Right,
have you ever told hero of that story? H Like, there's I mean, there's no way he remember. I don't think you'd remember. I haven't. I don't have see I haven't run into him a long time. I don't talk to that man. I'm tell him when I see him next. Yeah, I was very upset that he didn't teach me. He was great man. He was he was great and having a lot of nice things to say, and he did help us, like with tweak our roles and stuff like that to fix him. So that was really cool. So Charles Murkley
was your number one. But but there is something, I mean, I think PWG speaks for it, and there's this like there is like a family. Well, I don't know. I feel in Chicago everyone was fighting, uh you know, like don't go to this place, don't go to this
place, don't go to this place. But but but knowing that PWG started with the six and you just saying that everyone would just kind of come in, it does seem like everyone was kind of like trying to help each There was a lot of people that did want that camaraderie because it's like why why
have this weird tension. A lot of schools did kind of have that energy, and there's still schools that do that are currently still having that energy where it's like, you know, gang gang kind of shit and it's uh, it's corny, so corny bro. Yeah, but it's nice that you could have all of these people, did you would you recognize them because you would go to local shows or the other wrestlers or yeah, like the yeah you
know mister excitement. I mean if you don't know who he is, you don't know who I knew all who all these guys, Yeah, all these guys. I had a I had old old stuff, old footage too, Like, uh, I went back and watched a lot of old like Rev Bro and stuff in the area, and I just I knew all who all
these guys were. It was great. So Top Talwar was kind of So when I get released from the WWE in two thousand and nine, Dave Marquez is starting up, uh, this new Adventure Championship Wrestling from Hollywood in what was the beautiful arena, the Galaxy, the Galaxy Galaxy, which I think up W used to run. Think so it's called the Observatory right now, I think. Okay, Dave Meltzers, yeah, uh And so you and I wrestle yep, yeah, and we I think maybe even the first match
we were We were the very first match of the entire program's existence. Yeah, yeah, were with us? And where? And I mean I know you, I just remember you were I don't know green, you were a good ver, yeah, but you were young but good enough that like, I don't know, I feel like Dave, you know you had you couldn't be fresh out of wrestling school and doing that position, right, And then I remember Adam praising you, Um, but where were you at your career
in that point? It was twenty it was twenty ten when I think August twenty ten when the show started. I had my debut technically is November two thousand and um an eight. But I had like a single match and then I didn't have another match until like April two thousand and nine, so I was like pretty much a rookie and a half. Okay, yeah, well but but when you got that second match, then did you start putting? Yes? Then I was consistent. I was consistently getting booked. I had
two, three, four or five and six followed pretty soon. You know what I mean? How does that? How does that work? On the scene like that? How do you I was This is when I started splitting myself between schools. When I came I had gotten December two thousand and seven, June to December was I was training at the end of that. In December, I broke my arm and I was out for eight months because I also had surgery to put a plate in my arm and take the plate out.
When I came back to finally be able to roll around again, Charles School's gone, so I went to Aws School and EWF School and I was just drive back and forth so I can get multiple days of training at once Barts twice a week, and then Jesse's once or twice a week, and then I just started excelling from there. And they're the promoters also yes, and then I had a spot opened up on a San Berdandino show in November and they're like, hey, you want to wrestle, you have your stuff,
And I did have my stuff. I called up I called up Sky and put in a few of the other trainers and I had to see if I can get their blessing, and they said yes. I called Bart. I was like, hey, I know I've been training at your thing. We'd say I debut there. It's a cool if I do it here, go ahead, do your thing. And then I think my second third match were at with AWS. And then my sixth match ever I won the lightweight
belt. I beat T J. Perkins. Yes, okay, and then I mean, listen, aw he was obvious, Like the idea of like starting up and getting it is obviously I'm going to assume the highlight of like yes, right, yes, absolutely, but yes, but what were what were some of those milestones like how did you look at the t NA thing, How did you look at like like when what were the big big things where you were like, oh this was this is a this was the next
step in my career. Uh, I've always wanted to be a TV wrestler, so uh, our our match was was a big deal for me because I got to wrestle you and then I got to also take that was aw Hollywood. Yes, yeah, so these are the milestones you just want. Aw no, no, no no, I wanted before. Oh yo, like yeah that, but I was like, we wrestled because you and I wrestled an aw it's probably my favorite AW match. I don't know. That
was so much fun. But that the our first match Chapionship Wrestling from Hollywood. It was a big deal for me because like your Colcabana, I was nothing and at the you know, at the fucking time. So I was like given that opportunity to wrestle a star in my first ever television match, and like that was a big milestone for me. And then Impact was a big one for me, even though it was a big one for me too because I was also in awful mental health and in the worst physical shape of
my life. But it got me a job, which is odd to me, you know, like to be absolutely the skinniest and in my end just unhappy and depressed and I got a job, so I was like, all right, let's do this and that was good. That was that was? That felt good? Uh? And what was it? Was like Furnam nor Fernam and I just wrestled EC three a bunch and then the Romans once and
then what was the story then? And I think it was EC three was he was a Dixie Carter's nephew and they were gonna hype him in his debut against like a superstar athlete or whatever, and then here comes my little scritty ass out. But how did you? Why are you the one? Were they in LA So they were coming out that way and they hit up a wrestler in the area who started, uh, you started asking around, just find somebody in the p that he was suggesting. He suggested Kevin Martinson.
He suggested, I think Yuma, Johnny Yuma. And they're like, like, too, they look too much like wrestlers. We need a guy who doesn't look like a wrestler. So they suggested it's good old skinny boy pretty Pete and they said that's it. Yeah. But at that point, you I feel you were doing had you done PWG at them? Yes? Yeah,
so like yes, you're accomplished wrestler, Yes, I do. I'd also shrunk physically, like in the middle of my career, got even skinnier than when I debuted and then I like came back and it's just it was, it was just a weird time in my life. Yeah, okay, Yeah, Well, what you didn't say doing a PWG show in your milestones P TOWG, I'm gonna call you, I don't know p to BG even
as a milestone. It absolutely, but it's it's kind of it got very bittersweet towards the end, kind of disappointing, um, because we we had a lot of moment We had momentum going in and I think we had a lot of good matches, um, But a lot of people didn't give the same respect to the SOCO guys on those shows that they did to all these other fucking guys. Yeah. Yeah, including like and behind the scenes, there's a lot of just you know, guys kind of trying to punk us
and all that kind of shit. Super Dragon was kind of a dick too when it came to a lot of us, and it's just like, yeah, it is what it is. Yeah, Well, I mean but and well I see your feelings now, and I shouldn't have asked, but I have no ill will I think, I mean to think, I think are cool. I've I've tried to I've reached out to him, you know, but it is what it is. Yeah, But I would imagine if you're a young especially in that error, well yeah, no, if you're a
young LA wrestler, Yeah, it's the mecca. I would say at the time, I don't know about now. Well, but I honestly don't. I don't know anything about wrestling now either. I don't know the perspective of certain indie wrestling like I know that I think it still exists because some guys that debut and haven't been there that long or like stoked about it. Yeah, so I guess good for you. Yeah. And then did you do
WW stuff or just the enhancement stuff. I did enhancement stuff, and I had a tryout in front of producers at I think it was an Arizona one that I was an extra at, and they lay loved it, and I was kept in mind for a job on two or five Live. And then I got contract here yeah here in Germany added in Germany, yeah, aw, yeah, And then any other like any other things that like when I say about milestones that pop up before you get that contract with AW, there's
a lot of TV stuff. China was a big one. And then becoming uh either writer and headed charge at a Championship Press of Arizona, so having like being in charge of an entire new show. It was a regional broadcast to Arizona, just in with Aaron Phoenix, who Son and Yuma and just to come in there. It was only three years old too. We came in and we really we changed the scene. The first year of the show was very difficult. So this Marquees had had a hand. Did he did
he take over something that was three years old? Soo Marquees uh with Championship Wrestling from Hollywood. He had then started becoming this United Wrestling thing where he was trying to start up different cast programs across the country and it's all become like one big unit, one big loop, you know. Yeah, the United Wrestling in Memphis and LA and then Phoenix and uh the Arizona broadcast was
really the test for it. So we had this this promoter that we worked with in Tucson and we ran out of the Desert Diamond Casino for about a year with this show, with this TV show, and then we moved to Phoenix in the last two years because we lost the relationship with the casino and that promoter. So that's why me and my partner Mick Greenwood, we took over in charge of Arizona and we turned it around just you. That was me and Mick green Mick Greenwood, Yeah, yeah, so the US too.
So we because I remember when Dave and the Championship Wrestling from Hollywood Crew, only because I was part of it for so long, like they would start like taking the bus over the Arizona that so the very first show Marquez went and then after that he never went. It was just me and Mick ran the entire show. Uh. Mick would set up a lot of the stuff with the with the building, the Nile Theater, and I would set up a lot of the stuff with the with the wrestlers, and we would
write. We wrote the stories to Geather and we made this the entire show happen just the two of us. Did this happen on purpose or did you seek this out? I don't on purpose or did you seek it out? It kind of it kind of fell on my lap. I've always been interested in stuff, and I was already kind of producing at the Championship Russell from Hollywood Show, and then when the opportunity came up, David asked me, would you like to for you and Mick to be in charge? I say,
absolutely, let's do it. Is it an overtaken did you find was it overwhelming? It was at first. This is the reason why I do none of Like people are just like, do you want to produce? Well, I do produce for a w when I'm there, but or not for Ring about Her. But like you know, people are like, do you want a book? Would you want to promote? And it's just like, like, I get paid nice money to wrestle. It's ten minutes, Like I it seems so hard to just overtake all of this stuff. I wanted
to. I just I guess I wanted to have an over a complete resume. I want to know. It's like when people say I Could'm all in compass you, I could do it all. I wanted to be not bullshit about it. I wanted it's like, oh, I've written, I promoted, I've done this, I've done this, I've done this and it just was a lot of fun. It was stressful, it don't get me wrong, but it was a lot of fun. And I really believe that we changed that the Phoenix scene like for the better. It got to the point
where the show would put itself together. We would pull up sometimes like an half hour late, and the entire ring crew is there setting up the ring, the doors wide open, and like the show is put together already because of like the relationship we built with everybody in the area. So it's like it started becoming not stressful at all. It was it was like a walk in the park. We all looked forward to going every month in this van
of Pylon's van to drive to Phoenix, just like a crew. It's five or six eight hours, eight hours, yeah, but it being it flew by because we had the boys and it was a lot of fun. Yeah. And saw you said, you saw the crew like grow wrestlers right immensely. Yeah. Man, everybody really got a hang of what it was to
be a TV wrestler. And I noticed that big time when we did the extra work at the Phoenix WWE event, because all the other extras were my guys from from from the Arizona show except for two of them, and then those two ended up being paired to do a match and the match was But then all my guys in there had hell of TV matches that even the producers were like looking at him, like, good job, good job. And of course I'm patting myself on the fucking back because me and Mick turned them
into TV wrestlers. You know, do you think do you think about schools and that kind of stuff, like in your future? I had a school I was. I guess that's another one, another another milestone moment because it I got to train David Arquette from from the school hit Why are you not telling me that? Yeah? That's the fucking It was awesome. This podcast is old. Shout out to David. It was. I ran the United
Russells Center in Oxnard, and I would have classes twice a week. I had just an a bunch of people come through, and but then I would start just taking private, private lessons. H David Laghana suggested me to David Arquette about training. He called me, left me a voicemail. I'll called them back when he set it up, and he ultimately he bought a ring put it in his yard and I trained him at his house. Yeah,
I mean, take that's so interesting. I don't know if there's like any more details of like was he just explaining Hey, I mean I guess he's done enough interviews, right. Oh it was about his Uh it was this movie and everything he was trying to talk. He told me about what he had in mind and what he wants to do, and I said, yeah, let's do it. Did he have fun stuff that you were just like, you can't do that or I don't you know. He was very respectful.
So he's respectful and he's cool, like he's funny, and he's he's oddly athletic, like I don't know what. Like everyone was like is he It was like, yes, yes, he's very oddly athletic. Like it was awesome. It was a lot of fun. Did you guys ever end up wrestling? We did. We had we headlined a Championship Wrestling from Hollywood show at the Urbine Improv. We sold it, sold it out. It was a very I think, our very first show there. So I've had
line the Improv. But he his first match was RJ right on our broadcast when we filmed it. An Ox start his match with first match on our show? Was I just meant his first match in general or was it or was it in I think it was J. I think it was r J. I think like I think like when they announced like David's wrestling, Yeah, I think it was would he come down and train with you guys or are J? Yeah? I think what I mean, you know, like to put this match to get right right? I think as we got closer
he came out here. I think we I don't remember. I think like the day of we did most of that stuff and we might have had a rehearse. I don't remember. And then so that makes me think of like benefits of a Los Angeles wrestler in the entertainment industry. Yeah, um,
did you do family feud? I did? Yeah, So like and if it's just family feud, but I don't know if there's other There has to be so many because it's Hollywood. Yeah, and they're always asking like roles of a wrestler, yeah, or just weirder opportunities that people wouldn't get. I don't know, if you have a list, did some extra work, I've done some stunt work. I met David Arquette on a set of of a film before I actually trained him. Um, anything, I wouldn't know.
No, I never got completed. It's called Hank and the San Diego Twins and it never got fucking completed. Um. And then I was I joined the stunt crew for a little bit and we did a couple of movies. It was one called I think it was called Pandemic and it was like first person zombie movie and like in in the trailer, I'm strapped to an ambulance as a zombie just going. Uh. So that was cool. I got to do. I got to fall off roofs with like a GoPro on
my head and I got a shot with a shotgun. So squibs were popping off of me and getting thrown over cars and everyone thought I had been a stuntman for years. I was like, this is my first day. It was easy and they're like what yeah. Yeah. And then to what was family? Few just uh, David's family. That was our family, and it was just it was four wrestlers. It was me, RJ. Dalton, Castle and Jungle Boy and then David and then we were against p Pee
wee Hermann's team. It was all people from that had been on involved in his show for a long time, like Jack Harry was there, Drew Carey jokes, Joe mag Magne, Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah. Well any even the idea of like we were talking before before, is that Tom Kenny SpongeBob as announced your matt, you know, like even luchavavoom is I would
put in consideration of like this is a holly. I was gonna also say that's another milestone too, because I got a job at Vavoom in the same time I got a job at Tena because of how shitty I looked at the matt. I did a match at Bavoom. I love avoom so much where they they teamed me with Candice Larraine. She was like she was my little girlfriend on the beach and on the on the card in the back it called me the ninety pound Weekling, So I was the ninety pound weekly to come
out with my little little blonde girlfriend. And then it was Cha Chay Caribrera and SoCal under a mask and he came out all big and he was called monta Quia mask or something like they know, butterface. And then he comes over and he starts like kick sand in my face, starts flirting with my girlfriend. Then his big old chingo and a girlfriend comes up. It's pointing
out, I'm what are you doing? Flirting? Flirting, flirting, and then it turns into an inter gender mixed tag match, and then the finish of the match was my girlfriend turns on me to go joined up with Montequia and then uh, we turned around and me and the big thick girl beat them up and then we go leave together. And that got you kind of a spot and it was a lot of fun. Yeah, I got it,
got me a consistent spot on Bavoom. I'm in the Sexy Mexis now, and then I do a bunch of other bunch of other acts that she has me do. Right, I'm supposed to be on the one in October, and I'm excited for that. But that's the cool thing about that is just like I remember, you know, I love friend wrestling. I love the weirdness. I love that, you know, the wrestling at games kind I think it is like, is uh just a just a crazy thing.
You look back at Tommy Dreamer wrestling at E three, you know, like for easy w whatever, it is like we're in the record books of just weird wrestling stuff and I remember being like luch of them was coming Dichicago. I was like, I gotta get on the show. And you know, I know that like my name held some value. I was in w but they didn't give a fuck. And when I pitched, like I was like, oh, I also did this Matt classic character for a wrestling Society X.
They're like, oh, what is that? The masked weirdness like let score skies doing the Black President or whatever. That was amazing. I got to be a secret services there on one of them. Yeah, and then uh he was l presidental with a secret Service and we had a match against It was Halloween times. We had a match against like monsters, so we had a zombie, an alien, and a bunch of others. You wrestled as a secret I wrestled the President secret Service that's got black suit and glasses.
Such a great show. I love creativity and it's great, man, It's so good. Um okay, so then you know it leads you to the aw starts. I guess we're are you. You know a lot of people were just like I think I won't speak for you, but a lot of people in wrestling until you know, I feel the young Bucks and Kenny like saved everybody. We're just like, well, I guess this is what it is, and we'll just do our thing until whatever. And next thing, you know, you know, with a snap of the fingers, it's
like some some of all of our friends are on national television. Yeah, it was. It was insane. Is that? How do I mean? How does is that how it works out for? It's just your Yeah. But then's like then the two or five stuff came to me too, so by that at the same time as the a W stuff, So I had to come had to come sooner. I wouldn't have been in that and that brain, but I was kind of in that brain too. It's like but
it was a positive mindset. We were. We were doing a lot of cool stuff in the area with like bar wrestling was still a thing at the time, and um I had started, I'd gone to like CZW and uh I had worked in the Midwest a couple of times, so I was like, I think there's still potential here to do something make some money. And then I'm I'm now the Championship Wrestling, I'm Hollywood producing there and riding Arizona.
So I'm like, oh, there's potential there, you know, it's a real later and then uh and then when AW does start, it's like, Wow, now there's this is real, this is some and you're, yeah, I don't know what you is it Tony's vision for a librarian? Is that what it was? I was told that all of this stuff by I think it was the Bucks and Cody. Cody had just slid in my DMS at one point after working together and said, hey, keep may may
open. I said, okay, and that's it. I just okay, and then um, I think CD and Sky and all them kind of told me what this idea was about the librarian. It was Tony's idea, and then the Bucks had their own take on it as well, and then uh yeah, then it just hear a librarian. I kind of had to do my own research to kind of figure out what it was, because really it
was just like you say, shows and that's how you get heat. Tony had one one idea of it, the Bucks had one idea of it, and then I tried to combine them into something where we're also telling two different stories. We have one story on BT and then there's one story on the air, and it got kind of it got it got confusing sometimes, but
it was a nice challenge. Yeah, I mean, and like you're not whatever you're You're the library and is no longer a thing, right, but sometimes like my dream was of just like let's say, like when I went to w B, like I was like, man, if they just told me to, like you're the butcher now, and you know, I was in. I was in. I wanted to. I was trying my damnedest to be a librarian. I but I was like Cracker and Jones, I'll just scoping people go to the school, go to school, become a librarian.
Like I was researching what it did. I was reading more, you know, I went and bought specific clothes. I was trying to do it, and I was I was gung ho, trying to be all in. No pun intended, pun intended, Yeah, yeah, well intended. I
wanted to be completely all in for this character. And I would have been the like I would be if they wanted me to be library now up until the end, I would have done it and I would have evolved it on the way as you should, right, I am had I had maybe some more help in developing what the character was or where it should have gone. Then you know, right, but then you have this crew now which I love, which is so fun, right, I love the Wingman. Yeah.
And then Jacksonville, like you know, there's something about being like a wrestlers wrestler. Uh, it's just when you when you're when you're popping the boys, I feel like you're that you're doing it right, you know, like not like a secret like, but when the wrestlers are excited for people's characters. Yeah, in my head, that's when you're doing the job correct. I agree. And you know there was like always a buzz about in
Jacksonville is just like how much the wrestlers just love the Wingman. That makes me happen. And you know it came from kind of just a hodgepodge of dudes, and it's just like I think it was a hodgepadge of people that
everyone liked. Yeah, and like we're hoping something and then it was nice when it all comes together and I'm sure you make some new friends and you guys, we honestly the four of us really connected and it's it's it's it's really funny watching like them into rat because it's like we have all been friends.
It seems like we've all been friends for years. At a point, you know, Big says there Big, you know, Big j D, and then me and themith dumbasses, you know, yeah, and I don't know, like I you know, says there had some stuff with his family. And then also, like you know, you think about like a man who moves his whole first of all, a man who looks like that, Yeah, it should be the champion of the war of the world. Yeah, absolutely, And then he's got to move his family back, so like
it's all it's cool that there was a spot. Yeah, and to really get them to open up and learn about them, like I says, Our is one of the greatest humans, the sweetest dudes, and yeah, and um and that's and here we are today in Germany, right and this is my favorite fucking trip man, Like I haven't. I've had a blast hanging out with you, with Uno and yeah, everyone in Helico CD. It's great. Knox. You know you you talked about going back a little bit.
You talked about being you were in your worst place. You were booked as a ninety pound man. Yeah, I mean, but you turned it like, yeah, you look like a wrestler, thank you. Yeah, yeah, it was motivating that that all that stuff kind of you let it motivate you instead of just you know, fuck up. How was that turnaround? Was it just like I gotta go to the gym now, or I gotta start eating or yeah eat, you just started eating. And it's still
the hardest thing for me to do. But it's just sucking down. And you're, brother, yes I am, that's the fan imagine. Yeah, I've always been overactive thyroid when I was a child. And yeah, though you know, it's just about calories, right, it's just sucking about everything down. And then that's what I struggle on these trips because I just I have to, I think, travel with like a ten pound bag of rice on with me. You know. Yeah, I'm the complete opposite my friend.
I Yeah, everyone when we talk to when I talk weight to a lot of people, they're like, all, I wish I had your problem, Like right, please don't say you know, it's like it's sometimes I feel like I look like a legitimate stick figure, you know, but I've had that. I'm I'm self aware enough where like I'm not always happy with it, but I but I do always see the other side of the other side of the body type of was struggling that way too. It does make
sense to me. You're self aware and you're smart. That's why, right, Well a lot, right, a lot of people aren't. It could drive into problems, right, that's true. But I'm everything's looking good for you. Thank you, man um, thanks for doing this, Thanks for having me. Yeah, you you're okay with the mustache in real life. I have been now, yes I have. I've now tweaked it to how I like it. I didn't like it at first. It was a little too long on the sides and it was like very I was like, did
you grow out for sexiness or for librarians? So I had just a shit beard, this shit beard at the time, and I was I had it on Championship rustling from Hollywood, and I was like, I need a shave. This looks like shit. So at the at the time, it was at the Hollywood Towers, which was Marquez lived in the front house and then there was a backhouse on the property where I lived there. The director Billy Trask lived there and some wrestlers lived there, and I was shaving and I
had to. I just had the mustache and I started laughing just how it looked. It was all long and kind of whispy, and like, all right, I'm gonna show Dave. It was like huh, he goes keep it and I go, fuck you, and he goes, no, keep it. I go all right, And it was like we were gonna go to a New Year's party that night, so I was like, I was, let me go pop the goofs at the party. And then the reaction I was getting from everybody else I was drinking drinks. I was like,
hmm, yeah, I'll keep it around. And then I started just making it like that until I liked it. You know, I think the world likes it. I think so I specifically thank you very much as I keep there, not into your eyes, but into your mustle, my beautiful stash. Thanks for being on, but thanks bro. Peter Avalon can be found on Instagram at Ppa all Day and Twitter at p Avalon. I want to thank Peter for sitting down with me at gains Com in Cologne, Germany.
I thought maybe my international traveling days were done, but what a treat to do a little tour and all the matches. Actually, there's a headband from the match I had with Chris Daniels in Germany still up, signed and dated Coltmerch dot com. Actually, speaking of coltmerch dot com, let's get into some plugs and oh coming even my Patreon Patreon dot com slash cool cabanas where you can listen to ad free archives of almost all five hundred episodes of the
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