AOW 401 Joe Malenko

This is the art of wrestling with professional wrestler called Cabana. All right, how you doing? Come on in, sit down, Relax, You're about to listen to the art of wrestling. A professional wrestling podcast. It's a life podcast is a personal journal. Tonight your ways, the minds of souls, hearts and lives of people involved in the world a professional wrestling. I am your host. My name is Cold Cabana. I am a podcaster, I am an actor, I am a dog owner, I am a fringe

performer. Most supportedly though, I am a professional wrestler, and I am coming to you live from my studio apartment in Chicago, Annois. Before I go further is a fan supporting listener. To support a podcast supported by people just like you, we give it to you on whenever it comes out on a Thursday. The best way that you can support rate, review, and subscribe on iTunes, tell a friend, tweeted, out, spread the word coltmerch dot com, t shirts, buttons, pictures, posters, DVD and

so much more. The best way to support though over on my Patreon. Every single episode including this one ad free and the almost five hundred episodes on the archives every month two bonus episodes of Wrestling Anonymous. Last month, Chris Cubas joined me. This month, Ian ric Abani joins me. We listened to calls, we put our two cents in, and we have a good time. That and so much more a great way to support patreon dot com

slash Cold Cabana. I'm back with two episodes for August. These all happened at the National Wrestling Hall of Fame show that happens every single year in Waterloo, Iowa. We did a live show, which I will put on next week, but this week it was important to me to have Joe Milenko on the show. Brother of Dean Milenko, Joe Milenko, son of the Great Milenko. Perfect timing as I head to the gathering of the Juggalos this week.

But Joe Milenko is his own person, and I met him last year at the National Wrestling Hall of Fame and he was so nice, very personal, just like his brother, and I knew I was coming to the show. I knew he was coming to the show. Seems like a guy who wouldn't mind talking about the past of wrestling. Seems to really love wrestling, has such a history in professional wrestling, and I don't think a lot of

people ever kind of sit down and ask his story. So here I am a throwback to the art of wrestlings where I would grab the ones where we want to know their story and we talk to them, and that is Joe Malenko. I was curious about his path as a Malenko brother and of course of his father, so we get into it. Very fun to sit back down and talk with wrestlers and Joe as a pleasure. We will get to

that, but I do want to make an announcement. I am headed back to the Edinburgh Fringe Festival and if you are in Scotland or near Scotland, August nineteenth to the twenty first, we are just doing three days myself and John Hastings where we watch bad wrestling and do comedy and commentary to it. Tiny urel dot com slash ed Fringe Wrestling for tickets. They're just ten dollars. The fringe is a favorite activity of mine for so many years now.

I didn't think it was going to happen, but luckily work is sending me to Germany, so I was able to sneak in a little trip to Edinburgh and we are going to do some fringe shows. As for me, this is usually the part where I described my tales every single week. We haven't done an art of wrestling for a couple of months. I haven't really wrestled for a couple of months. I think last time I was like, I haven't really wrestled, but now starting to get back into it a little bit.

Opened the Ring of Honor Death before Dishonor show Me and Anthony Henry. Anthony Henry a hell of a professional wrestler. Hope he gets more of a shot him and j D. I wrestled in Lowell, Massachusetts. I wrestled at this show with Joe Malenko in Waterloo, Iowa, the show that I wrestled at every single year. I'm gonna be wrestling at the Gathering of the Juggalos. I'm gonna be wrestling in the Mall of America for first wrestling.

I'm gonna be wrestling in Mesa, Arizona. Trying to get back on some kind of wrestling schedule, but also very very grateful that at my age forty two years old, I'm able to slow down a little bit. I was given that time off through COVID and then through a reshuffling of my professional contract, and it gives me an opportunity to understand who I am as a person

where I don't have to be so super focused on professional wrestling. Gives me an opportunity to work more here on the computer with my Twitch, trying to grow my Patreon, maybe trying to grow some projects where I don't have to constantly travel all over the world every single week. But then I remember that I'm going to be doing one PW in Doncaster in October, I'm doing scott I'm doing the Edinburgh Fringe Festival, I'm going to Germany. I got booked

for Qatar. So as I'm grateful for the slowing down, I don't know, it always seems to speed up. But I will never complain because I do know that there are some people who would love to have the opportunity to do what I have done and what I am doing, and I will always be grateful. That's the point of this podcast. That's the point of this listen. It's the point of having someone like Joe Milenko on the show.

We all have our stories, we all have our rich history, and we're gonna get into it with Joe Milenko in just a second before we get into it though. Today's podcast is brought to you by Manscaped, and this catchphrase is actually what they want me to say. Here we go. If you haven't heard, it's smooth Sack Summer. Yep, that was on the paper. Manscaped is the leader in below the belt rooming and they want you to

have a ball this summer. Oh my god, dive headfirst into smooth Sax Summer by going to Manscape for twenty percent off and free shipping with the code Cults. Okay. As a wrestler, I feel I was taught to manscape, maybe at an earlier stage in my life than many. Here's how to fall, Here's how to do a promo, Here's how to take away all of your body hair in that order. But for once, wrestling was before the times, and now manscaping is an important part of grooming. Manscape sent

me their performance package four point zero and I use it. I use the ball deodorant. Your armpit stink. You use deodorant. You don't think your ball crevices don't stink. They do. It's the perfect tag team partner for your sack. Get twenty percent off and free shipping with the code Colt at manscape dot com. That's twenty percent off and free shipping with the code colt at manscape dot com. And make sure you have stay with me a smooth

sack summer. You know, most most Sunday mornings we'd have bagels and then there was a little uh delia CRUs the street. So he go, he go get locks, he go get herring. Good filter fish. Actually, my grandmother made good filter fish, something best you ever had if you happen to like a filter fish. But she's not here any longer, so you can't get My grandmother could fill to fish anymonger, did you that's on the recipe? No? Would you have? Would you even make it anymore?

You can't't even know where to start, right, I would just I just end up throwing a fish in a blend or somewhere. Yeah. Do you cook? No? Right? Like? No, grand of course my grandma did. I don't. I don't like I don't cook. Yeah, do we do? Us Jewish men not take that on or um? I don't you know it's funny that you. I do like to cook. I just don't take the time. So maybe that's a wrestler's thing of pure laziness pretty

much what you're you're on the road. I mean, the most we did in Japan as we grabbed the the ramen soup canisters and put a little water in there and heat them up in the room. But yeah, yeah, just short of that, you're eating out all the time. Well, uh, okay, I appreciate you coming on and talking to me. Have you done anything things like this before? Once or twice? Once or twice? Yeah, So I think that's why I think I'm curious. I think a

lot of people are curious. I guess there's like a couple of things I'm kind of interested in. Otherwise it's just bullshitting. Um. I think you know I'm important. I'm interested in like hearing kind of like your father's side or your father's story through your lens, and then obviously like getting you know, getting into wrestling and your wrestling aspect and all that stuff. Yeah, it was my life. And before we get going, I got to my

dad's song was Bagel's Bagels two for five. That's what keeps us Jews alive now probably nowadays politically insensitive and people would scream in hollar, but he sang that when I was a little kid. Well, and then and then you'd go get bagels. I mean, you wouldn't just sing me the song and say, okay, you're on your own. He makes me and then he gave me a bagel. Yeah, like okay, and you ate that way for the next twenty five years. Yeah. Well, my story was so

Bagel's bagels two for five. You'd get two bagels for five cents, which is crazy because I was thinking like five bucks for two basics. No, no, no, no, Because um, in Irvington, New Jersey, so where we where we were, my grandfather was across the street. He

had a hit a tailor shop. Because you know, the Jews came over the United States and a lot of them did certain things, and a lot of them besides besides taking over the movie industry and some other things, they became tailors and um, the cobblers, you know, shoe shoe people. Actually, his brother went down to Argentina and became a cobbler. They were.

My grandfather was across the street from us. If you go down his street, there was a synagogue to school, and just across the street from that was a was an actual bagel factory, wasn't it wasn't like an Einstein bagel. It was a bagel factory and they made thousands and thousands, and so you could just head on over to and on over grab a couple. They were hot. They're right off the right off the bagel Express, right, boy, what was your bail of preference? Mine? Egg bagel?

I mean I liked so, I'm a pretty regular plane bagel guy. I'm not am I'm like a purist when it comes to certain things. Um, the only other thing was salt bagels. I love salt bagers. So you like your bagels like you like your wrestling. Plane borings, but pure boring, right him? Playing? So New Jersey is where you grew up. Yeah, that's that, I assume hearing that. And it's interesting that you say that your dad would go and get you bagels every morning, just like

my dad did. But my dad wasn't known as a legendary professional wrestler. Well, I mean in our neighborhood. I'm trying to think back because you know, obviously we're talking to sixty years ago. Yeah, but I think of like just thinking of I guess wrestlers are on the road all the time. That's what I think when I think of a son of a wrestler. Oh he was, Yeah, he was so. I mean when I say he went to get bagels, it wasn't every day. Okay, Well when

he was in town, and especially on Sundays. Sundays was when he got bagels, and then he got other stuff from the Delhi across the street, because I was like, a you know, the special thing you got whitefish whitefish was the other thing, whitefish herring. Um, My dad loved Borsh. He is a big Borsh guy. I can never I can ever really acquire a taste for beet juice. No, I'm not into it. I

didn't even know what that was. Sport. Yeah, So your dad Boris Milenko, Um, well that was part of his name, Okay, his full moniker was the Great Professor Boris Maximilianovic Milenko. And would he stress that to you. No, not at all. Just to get the record straight, just to get the red Okay. Your grandfather, you said right away, was so it was your grandfather And was he I'm guessing he wasn't in

the wrestling industry, wasn't even a sports guy. Interesting, he was just he was just a small guy who could sew a whole suit from scratch. Yeah, amazing Taylor, but not a sports guy. And then you are, so your father just picked up wrestling, do you know, like, I don't know how much you have talked with your dad or know all these ins and outs of you know, I mean the same thing about all of us, um or at least most of us grown up. You don't.

You don't really sit and say, hey pop because my dad was popum, Hey pop? You know, tell me about your life before I came around and you ruined everything? And is there like, is there much on record about him that you've like since when did he passino? So since ninety four, have you like ever gone and started like research stuff or since the internet became prevalent the only thing the only thing that I ever researched, Well,

I didn't research my daughter did um? So I was telling telling you previously, you know I have My grandfather was a tailor and he had a tailor shop and he had he actually owned the building, and then the building was a pest control place and he had the tailorshop on the ground floor, and then if you go up his stairs to the second floor, he had an apartment and then there were two apartments above that, so he had he owned a building. There were three apartments. There was a tailor shop, and

I mean I could still smell that place to the day. Not it wasn't a bad smell. It's just the smells of a tailors shop, you know, the the cleaning materials. And he had this big steam press and stuff like that. Well when he came and he did that when he came from Europe, and he did that. He came through in the changed his name to Simon, which our name was legally Simon. It's always been that, but I knew that it really wasn't before he got to the States. Now

he had a brother, and his brother went down to Buenos Aires. They never saw each other again. In sixty years from the time that they split up coming over from Europe, they never saw each other again. So I never really knew what our full our real last name was. Karl Gotch gave me the name Joe Sarkoff when I went to was kind of a funny name rather than jerkof Jello Sharkoff when I went to Japan, so I thought,

okay, maybe it's Sharkoff. And I don't remember why I even thought that he would give me a name and it would be the correct name of my grandfather as he came to States. So my daughter, my younger daughter, she researched it Ellis Island stuff, and she found that it was Sierkin s I r K I N it was. It was seen in the records. She had the records of him, you know, arriving on Ellis Island,

the change of the name from Syrkin to Simon. And so now, if I wanted to do, I could check out when his aires and probably find a whole side of my family down there. Wait, but Carl got kind of got that close. He did get it pretty close. And maybe he did, and maybe he did that because my dad. I don't think my dad knew what well, I can't say. I don't think I never heard my dad say here was your last name before it was changed to Simon.

So I would think that my dad knew. And maybe my dad said something to Carl and he just said, okay, starkoff, right. Maybe that's that's what he remembered, that's what he remember. Yeah, who the hellmet were they? Buddy? Were they buddies? Carl and my dad were very close for instant yea, yeah. Yeah. When when Carl came into the States, he came into Minneapolis first through God in his territory, and my dad was up there, and nobody wanted to Nobody wants to bother with Carl

for a number of reasons he was. He was a bit of a countrarian. At that point. My dad walked up to him in the dress room and said something to the fact, which is kind of strange because carls ten years older than my dad, or was ten years old in a minute. Um, my dad came up to Carl and said, hey, kid, you know you want to go grab a bite. It was after the matches, and from that moment on, Carl took a liking to my father because he was the only guy who extended his hand and said, hey, you

know, let's go talk. So from that from that point they were great friends for most of their life. Kind of fell apart a little bit last few years for a couple of reasons, but then re regathered their steam as friendship right before my dad dynastic. Yeah, because when I think of so people of my generation, I guess like I think of the Gotchas and Milincos, I think of like Florida, like both of them training people probably in

like in their backyards. Like you know, I think there's something like ma Noor Suzuki doing like squats with Carl Gotch watching him in the other Japanese lads. And then you know you hear the stories of like the Malinco camp in Florida. So yeah, it was all I mean, it was all one big happy family, although was separated at some level Karl's Karl's training and the submission style stuff that he did, which was the precursor to MMA as we

know what today. He had a lot of Japanese guys coming over to the States and they would go to there, you know, I would, They would a couple other guys here in the States. We'd all go out to his house and we trained his house. There were many days and I lived out there in the back room. That was one thing. But then we also had our wrestling school, wrestling school, and a lot of guys came

there to learn pro. Some of the guys that came there to learn pro also wanted to learn to shoot, so you know, shoot fighting, so we called it shooting. They would get on the mat and they you know, they wanted to go through what it took to become a submission wrestler, and you know, they would do a little bit of that, and a couple of guys even went overseas as part of UM yeah uf U WFI at the time. Fujiwara Gumi. Um he came. Glenn Jacobs, Yeah,

he was over there shoot fighting. He went over there and did well, you know these were worked, Yeah, a lot of them were worked fights. But yeah, he went over there once. So like, help me with that timeline then, because in my head, if if the Minco school was in Florida, but you were up in Jersey. So did you move down to Florida at the young age? Yeah, I moved down when you moved down. It wasn't just me because I was a kid. I was twelve or so. Okay, we moved down in sixty eight. Hey,

the shows are at free over on Patreon. But let's take a quick break and we'll be right back. So we came down the first time in sixty two sixty three. Things get a little fuzzy after a few years on the earth. Um, sixty two sixty three, we came down the first time. That's the first time I ever met gotch as a twelve year old. Oh no, you were younger than I was. Yeah, at sixty two sixty three, so I would have been So I was born at fifty six, so I would have been six seven years old. Do you have like

viving like not hell yet memories. I was scared to death, It's right, I was scared to death. I mean he was a he was a He was just a big, bony, scary some bitch. And what would you what would you call him, sir? Like grandpa Grandpa Goche? No, No, yeah, I mean I called him. I think I called him Carl when I was a young kid even and uh so that was sixty two sixty three. We lived on clear Water Beach for a little bit. Then we then we went from there, we traveled more. We ended up

in San Francisco. We ended up out in Ohio, uh No, Omaha, Nebraska, Saint Joe, Missouri. We were in Charlotte, North Carolina. We eventually made our way back to Tampa, and we ended up back in Tampa in sixty eight, at sixty nine. And the rational reason for that, rational in my mind my dad's eyes, was I need to I need to get someplace and settled in because my kids need to stop being gypsies and um, you know, being at a school and stay there and get

to know the kids. Yeah. Well, so the family was in Jersey, but you were a traveling family then and ball you mean your grandpa, No, my grandfather stayed put. My grandfather, That's what I'm saying. So like you were there, just like to have those memories. But for the most part, you were. You were flying around. Yeah, we were on Well you didn't fly I mean very rarely. I didn't mean in the actual Sano. We Yeah, you were driving around. We drove everywhere,

okay, and who twenty four hours straight? Forty eight hours straight? Um, and and you know it's that typical thing. You got to sit and look back at those days and you gotta laugh. Because the place that I the place that I resided in the car was that back ledge under the rear window, and I would lay out there. It was nice and toasty, especially if you were driving in the wintertime. It's nice and toasty because you have got the sun coming through. You didn't have a seatbelt, you

didn't have it. I mean, you were laid out as a little kid. You you were, I mean if if my dad stopped short, I was a projectile. Yeah, I was gonna hit two cars in front of us. I mean, and I was thinking there's no internet obviously. So and you're driving forty eight hours. What do you just being the crap out of your brother? He's been, he's he's annoying you. You're being the crap out of it you're doing. Mom and dad are yelling at you. Your dad put you out of the car. Your mom says, Laby,

you can't leave him here in the middle of Ohio. You gotta let him back in the car. Wow. Is it comic books or anything or just there should have been? It was a comic book? My mom my mom. My mom was a chance smoker. I mean she would just smoke and smoke a smoke, so be in the car and you know sometimes I mean be dead a winner. Yeah, she'd have the window crack, maybe just a little bit, but it barely did anything. I'm surprised. Yeah, I've got so much secondhand smoke. God knows. And is it just you

and your brother? Yeah? Yeah, and another guy who wrestles. Yeah. Did either of you pick up smoking or I guess I don't want to speak for him. And sometimes that's the thing, is like Jesus, like Mom smokes, it's so gross, or Mom smokes, I'm gonna start smoking. No, I hated it, Yeah, of course I hated it. So your your dad's lifestyle was constantly wrestling, and were you constantly going to the wrestling shows? And like, I don't know, like an overall like

how did you feel about it? Were like looking back on it, like were you happy with how that maybe those first twelve years kind of worked or do you have do you have any kind of feelings of like maybe that wasn't the lifestyle for for us or a father shouldn't be doing that. I don't know, think and Andrew is see all of the about you know, yeah, because you know there were those moments, man, where you're There's not much that I can say today that I haven't said before, at least at

some point in my life to somebody. And I would always talk about the fact that you know, I was I was a kid in the early sixties and I'm sitting in Madison Square Garden. It's my dad, and it's Wahoo McDaniels and Bobo Brazil and Bruno Sam Martino and Um you know Pedro more Alice a little bit later. I mean you you you know, the the stalwarts of wrestling history, and in the Northeast, you know, these are legendary.

Mark Sam Martino was a god in his day. Right, So you're this little kid, You're around all these people, and I always, you know, I always laugh about the fact that. And I another story I tell all the time is here, I live in this little place in Irvington, New Jersey, you know, small house because I looked at it the other day on Google Maps and I went, oh, my god, how

we even live really? That's pretty funny looking. Yeah, and uh, you know, we used to have we used to have the Kentuckians come over, so, um, you know Jake's dad, Jake the Snake's dad and uh Sam Houston. Yeah, so their dad was one of the Kentuckians. And then you know, so one day we'd have the Kentuckians show up. So these guys are sixteen sixty nine, and then the next day we'd have

Lord Littlebrook or sky Lolo, you know, three foot two. So you were one of those houses that had like the revolving door of wrestlers all the time. Do you think it was because there was a sense of family in your household. Um, I don't know what was that. Look, my dad loved the business, okay, so that was you know, that was his that was his woman. It was was the business. So as much as he could, he wanted to be around the boys. He really didn't

like being around too many other people there. And it wasn't that he was a jerk or anything. He just he just he hung in the business to which he you know, put forth all his effort because it was easier for him. And you gotta remember back in those days, you know, the days of k fabe, which we would have never said twenty years ago. Um, you just want to You just wanted to hang by yours. You didn't want to have to deal with, you know, being grilled about the

business. So I was gonna say explaining it, right, You just didn't want to deal with it, so you you just stayed with the boys. I don't remember really having I remember my mom having other friends besides the people in the business, but I really don't remember my dad having maybe a couple through the years later on in his life as he got much older. Yeah, he had friends who weren't pros but dry sense of humor. Um.

Really, he was a he was a very funny man. He was he was he was a he was very strong with you know, that whole self deprecating kind of thing. Um. Yeah, he would say things and be off based on purpose. And my mom would be historical ant number one number his number one UM comedy fan for about two days out of forty years. The rest of the time not so much. And then, um, so you went to all these shows. Yeah, were you like this little kid

like running around everyone playing with you or were you into it? Maybe? You know, I don't want you to speak for your brother, but were you Were you both into it? Was? Yeah, because I was. So. I'm four years older than my brother, and that's not you know, that's not significant, but especially in those earlier days, I was a guy. I was a kid running around, more and more interactive my kid. My brother was a small child, so I got to know the old

timers. I was more out and about than my brother was. Um, but it wasn't it wasn't just happening. A lot of times I would just sit there and sit there next to my mom and watch some matches, you know, would be in the back and watch some matches in fact one one h you know, And this happened a few times because I was I still, you know, you can be told certain things as a small child, but you still don't grasp it fully. And I remember there was one house

show. It was a small town somewhere out in the wherever, the Midwest or something, and my dad hits a guy and guy goes out of and my dad was a heel. Guy hits My dad hits a guy now refers in the middle, arguing with my dad, and the guy goes under. The ring comes down, it comes through the under, the ring comes back up the other side of the ring. My dad's standing looking I'm a little kid, I'm dad, watch out. And my mom my mom, My mom almost threw me under the chair. She's like, shut up, boom

because yeah, it's my dad. Man, this guy sneaking up on my father. Of course, did he give did he ever give you a sit down and be like you gotta boom me? Did you say you gotta boom me? Nah? Not really? And then any any guys that like like looking back to find memories of someone being like not like a big brother, But I don't know, there's a special place in my heart for like the

wrestler that always goes over the kids and makes friends with them. I had a lot of I had a lot of second dads, um, And not to take anything away from my father, because here's here's he was my pop. But I had a lot of I had a lot of guys who really stepped up and were really great with me. Don Curtis was one. I didn't spend a lot of time around down but he was just a phenomenal man. In fact, I just talked to his wife, Dottie half an hour

ago. EDWARDO Perez, who wrestled in the h He was from Buenos Aires. He wrestled in Florida for a long time. It's from Kansas City originally and then well through one of his areas to Kansas City back down to Florida. Um, he was like he was like a dad, you know, m Jacob Groby, Hans Mortier at the time. So I had had a half a dozen, had had a half a dozen pro wrestling fathers who watched

out for me and took care of me. And in fact, I was just down at the at the Dragos Says Museum here in Waterloo, and they had a thing about Abe Jacobs, who wrestled with Don Curtis as a tag team. Abe was a New Zealander. Um, I think he's still around. He's gonna be in his he's gonna be in his late eighties, maybe I think so. I don't. I don't. I think he's still with

us. But Abe, you know, before I so in seventy seventy eight or seventy seven, right before the summer of seventy eight, I guess, I was up in Charlotte and Abe worked with me to get me ready to go down to Mexico City because I was going to go down there work for Flores at the time for that summer. So this would have been seventy summer

seventy eight. And just guys did then, you know, they they kind of if you were if you were a son of one of the guys in the business, especially my dad, because you pretty well thought of Yeah, you know, they just all they just all kind of took care of me. Um. I mean that out of a place to be. That obviously makes me think. I think of Abe Jacobs, I think of your father. I think of me as a Jewish wrestler. And then is that so is that stuff that both you you know or your father? Is that stuff

that was talked about? Was would you was like I feel like Abe Jacobs is like probably one of the more famous ones, as is your father. Right, So I don't know if that was like in the atmosphere at that time. I guess anytime it's you know, you mean, you mean the thing Jewish Jewish side of this? Um did did you know? Did the bad stuff was talked about? Not the good stuff, Okay, the bad stuff, the anti Semitism that existed, and it was strong, you know,

and he was It was strong. It was strong with me as a kid when I lived in Jersey, and it was strong with my dad when he was trying to make it in the business. And even when he succeeded, there were a lot of you know, there were a lot of issues of being a being a Jew. Would he come home and talk about it or would you see it at the matches? I mean I I experienced it firsthand through his eyes, and yeah he would. My dad wasn't a complainer, so he was he was a pretty you know, he was a pretty

easygoing person. He loved life. Yeah, He didn't complain about it, but he he made me aware of it. You know. I think it was one of these things that, hey, Jody, you're gonna be out there and you're gonna try and make things go for yourself whatever that means, you know, come to some modicum of success measured by whatever. And in order to do that, you're gonna find that you're probably at some point to fight against you know, who you are as a you know, as a

Jewish man. Okay, I'll deal with it, right, And that was there like a brother ship though I think of because I think of a Jacobs are just um, not really not that you know, not that I not that I recollect them. And it wasn't like it wasn't like all the Jews gathered together, got to stay together, right, Okay, Okay, so you move when you're Jewish ress room. Yeah, there's a Jewish dressing room. And now you're two doors down. Jews are down two doors now,

and there's a missus daughter. Right, don't forget. The shows are ad free on Patreon. But right now we'll take a break. We'll be right back. So you moved it when you're when you're twelve to Florida. I guess maybe let's talk about your galloping into the industry. But it's like you you were one of these kids who was probably in it since you were a child, right, Yeah, you know, the one the one thing that I said about my dad, he my dad made things available, didn't push,

didn't persuade, didn't course, none of that stuff. Definitely not at a level that was, um, you know, like a stage mom or something like that. It was, hey, this is what I do for a living. You know, if you if you like it. I'm not gonna tell you whether I like it or not to like it, but if you do end up liking it and you want to do something, I'm trying to help you if I can. Um. And you know, my dad ran a lot of independent stuff at some point in his life. So you

know, obviously book my brother and I on his shows. Before my brother end up really doing well here in the States. I picked up in Japan mostly because of Carl and my dad's my dads connections, and I mean very

early. You said I never did this for a full time living. Yeah, was that I don't know, like was that a conscious but it was by design, by design that I was almost I was on you know, at times, I was almost prideful about the fact that I and this is gonna sound terrible, and I'm almost, you know, almost like umpany. But I was one of the guys that used the business instead of being used

by the business. And for a lot of guys who's being used and spit out by the business, you know, I always wanted to make sure that whatever happened in the ring, I had something to fall back on. My dad. My dad, I almost said, he drove that home with me. He really, and you know it's not like he drove it home,

but he he through everything he did, he helped me to understand. And I guess I guess I watched him too, and I knew that my dad had nothing to fall back on, and so I just figured, Okay, well I've better, I've better make sure, I better make sure something is there. And so yeah, I went to college. I went pharmacy school and got my pharmacy degree. Always dabbled in the resting business because it was

just fun. I mean, you know, in pharmacy, no matter what you're doing, whether or not you're working a you're working in a hospital job, you're working for the pharmaceutical industry, or you're working in community based practice setting or something along those lines. I'm an oncollegy pharmacist, so I've played

in the area of cancer care for thirty years. But you know, at no point in your time as a pharmacist, and no point in your career as a pharmacist, you ever have you know, sixty seventy thousand people chanting your name, you're right? Or do you ever go wow, this is a lot of fun. Yeah, and yeah, and if you show up the pharmacy in a paradise greased up. Okay, So what what age was your first match? In my head, it was fourteen? Well, I mean I played around, you know, I played around at a young age,

but my first real match probably probably eighteen eighteen nineteen. And what were the steps? Was it like Dad teach me or Carl teach me for X amount of weeks or like you had to have known how to do this stuff or maybe yeah, I don't know, No, I did, I you know, like I didn't. I didn't have the I didn't have the finer points um pulled together yet. But I had the basic mechanics of how to work a match and at least I could go in and out of holds and

yeah, that was that was pretty easy, and it was. It was really only later on in life by you know, then understanding what I needed to do in the ring. I could then talk to my dad and other people and go, okay, so how do you how do you really have a match out of this? You know? I mean you can you can go through the paces or you can have a match that that takes a house down right, you know, And they're two different things. And who was the first one to like really to explain that to you? Um? My

dad, Yeah, my dad, my dad. It's hard to talk about your dad in such glowing turns because he's your dad, and people go, well, he's your dad. But it's beyond that my dad had. If he wasn't my dad, I would still say this. He had an amazing ring psychology. And again this is one of those stories. So, um, you're not getting this new so Ford Homer astute Armory. My dad's in the ring. So first, first off, Tony Charles and Billy Robinson two

British men, two british men who had a well. Tony wasn't British, he was from he was a Welshman algi only to Tony Um. So they had a they had an amazing match. I mean they pulled out all the stops and they did all the gimmicks and it was it was it was great to watch for me because I enjoyed. I enjoyed what they did because I know, I knew what it takes for them. I knew what it took for them to do that. But the rest of the crowd at Ford,

Homer, Hastley, Armory Um didn't get off their hands. And for the listener, I mean it's very like technical they put on Yeah, they put on a Tritish they put on a typical British technicals show. Yeah, and they were amazing, and they were great and and even even their you know their English style, you know their English style upper cuts and stuff I did. It looked like tear your head off. And Tony Charles had a drop kick that was amazing. I mean, these guys they were they were great

hands. But it was a typical style and it was a lot of back and forth. It was just it was just too much for the crowd, and the crowd really couldn't pull the psychology from what they were doing it. Just it didn't it didn't tell any story, you know, it was just it was just a lot of athleticism, like a lot of stuff todays.

So so you know, I'm watching this and Tony and Billy get done, and they get upstairs, and my dad's now down and Tony comes and I'm standing at the top of the railing and Fort Homer Hestley Armory by the dress room. You'd have to know the place. What's what state? Oh, this is Florida, Tampa, Flarida. Okay, yeah, they used to call the Madison Square Garden of the South, so they oh, this is Florida championshipress Claria Championship, breshing Um. This was probably mid seventies or right

as I was so seventy four. I graduated high school seventy four, so probably some time around there, because when my dad came in, I think just for a couple of shots towards the end of his career there because he was up in the Carolina's So he comes in, ton Charles and Billy Robinson get done. Tony comes up through the dress room. He stands next to me on the on the balcony. We're overlooking the ring and my dad gets in the ring. You can just my dad starts out slow and I forget

who he was in with. It really didn't matter at the time. He could have been in wing with a broom you know, the proverbial broomstick, right, and he's doing his thing, and you could just feel the crowd, you know, just you can just feel the pulse of the crown and all of a sudden, you know, you feel the heat gathering and my dad just did two fingers in the eye and the polace erupted. I mean, you would have thought you would have thought that my dad just did this

spot that was like amazing. He just did the old you know, three s two, just two fingers in the yeah, because he was known for that. It was it was it was a silly gimmick. In fact, Luthez He used to make fun of him for his silliness. And Tony Tony Charles would stand next to me. He looks over me because he didn't see it, and he's looking at me like this, he's what do you do? What crazy thing? Like, what do you do? And I said,

did he did this? You just and you just see him trying to process this and his mind, and you know, you can tell that he was thinking to himself, I just went out there and destroyed my body for twenty minutes, did everything that I could ever possibly do in a ring, and this guy does two fingers in the eye. He took the house down. He brought the house down, and I and my thing after that was it wasn't just that he did that, it was when he did it.

He didn't do it one second too early, he didn't do it one second too late. You know, it's it was his timy. Man, he just knew, he just knew when he had to do something to make that crowd pop. And you couldn't hear yourself think in that place at times. And he was good at that. And really, you know, there's a level of that that you can't teach. You can get to a certain point, but you know, there's only so many guys that have that kind of

timing where they just know they had that sense of the crowd. And it's years of years of years of matches, yeah and things, and you're dead put. A little bit of luck I've had. I've had a couple of matches like that in my life that just kind of popped up and yeah, and after the match, you're like, holy crap, that felt really good. Yeah, that was a good match. Yeah. Okay, So the first match was just on an independent I don't even remember where it was.

I mean, it wasn't for all Japan. It was Madison, Yeah, probably yeah, probably on the outskirts of Tampa somewhere, just a random Okay, but your trajectory is Japan. I think that's where I did. That's where I did most of my stuff whatever my stuff was, okay, yeah, most of Japan. Okay, I did you know I did. I did show for w c W. I did a couple of things there, a couple of things for w W at the time. But I think I wrestled to Dark Match for WWE, and did I forget even what I did?

And then and then we had yeah, I had a very non memorable um US career. And then you know, then again we had independent productions. One was called Global Wrestling Alliance, which ran out of Miami, South Florida. It was actually it was actually a penny stock at the time. And then we uh, you had Don Curtis and Louis to lettum Ran ran a promotion out of Jacksonville for a while. Um, we had TV up there, so you know, we we had TV a few times. Smaller

promotions never really got anywhere. It was so hard, especially in the days of the territory right before you know, the explosion of Vince and Crew and Turner. Would you couldn't you couldn't compete against the guys who owned the territories. Would you travel with your dad to these shows? Yeah? Sometimes? Yeah? Or was it uw F I or UWF when you was that like your that was my intro into Japan, right, and so like how long

did it take to get to there? Well, out to LA was about it for four or five hours, and then from LA to thank you, thank you beautiful well man, I don't know, probably uh when did I

go the first time? Eighty three? Maybe to Japan down It probably took me six or seven years before you were doing little shows, and literally I was just doing little which maybe we were also, you know, keep in mind, probably the greatest if if the Molco family has a legacy besides you know, having matches, and some of the match has been pretty damn good. We trained a lot of guys we were Yeah, we had the school we placed a lot of guys. I lose track of some of the boys

that we got into the business. Both we WCW WWE guys who went out to you know, major promotions around the country when the you know, when the regional efforts were still running strong and did well. Um, so so tell me, like if you're if you said it from eighteen to twenty four, you were doing that, but you were doing the school Like how would how would it work? Like you go to you go to college, you come home, you helped training, you're there, you're watching it. I

would I would get there as much as I could. You know, my dad really was the school. Well, we had in different places. We had uh we had in the back of a judo plays in Tampa called ed Mally's Florida Judo. Then we had a building out in Stepfner or something one of the rural areas of that your real last name who what my real last name is, serkan Yan? Yeah. Yeah. Then we had like a

in in a field behind some guy's house. Um, he was a pipe fabricator, but he let us use this warehouse that he had behind his house. So we uh, we wrestled out the warehouse and then warehouse their house, um you know, Frankenstein and then uh and then um Brooks was Jewish dude, and I've never seen it. Don't yell at me, are you seriously? Oh my god? You know, being with a Mazza Bryers, um so. And then we got a little place. We actually wrestled out

of a mattress factory, Florida mattress for a while. We with Wally von Strohei, and my dad got Wally to let us open the place and go in there. We wrestled out there for a while, and then we wrestled in an industrial park, Dab's Industrial Park. And at this time, you know, you hear the stories. It's like maybe the Monster factory and like the mid eighties was the first one to like publicize like we'll teach you the business. Um. So it's always weird to hear about wrestling story like wrestling

schools kind of like seventies and eight like early eighties and not exposed. But like you know, like there wasn't like an actual well to my knowledge, like these like mass schools. I guess no, I mean they didn't have the you know, they didn't have first of all, I mean you know

WCW. You know w c W, the power Plan, you know WWE had, uh, you know, the Championship Wrestling Florida deal with Steve with current and at the time who took over a lot of our guys when my dad and my brother closed up shot because getting back to our school, my dad and my brother really ran. I would show up, work out, teach a little bit, you know, play some games, and then get the hell out of there. We were we were, I mean we were we were one of the few schools. First of all, my dad barely

charged people a lot of times. Yeah, he was. He was a terrible businessman. Yeah, in my head, it's like a racket, Like he's like, no, it wasn't. But for my dad it was. It was anything. But I mean he just he just loved the business. And it was sad because he probably could have done fairly well because he had the you know, he had the pedigree and he had the uh, he had the results of guys who went and did pretty well. You know, the Canes of the World and the Mark Muros and the tugboats and I mean

the list goes on. You know, Gang Grell and a bunch of guys who came out of school who did okay, um, so he could have played off of that, and he probably could have milked the hell out of guys who came in. He just didn't do that well. I always laugh with you know, you know Norman smiling. Yeah, Norman one of the greatest guys around. Man. Norman's awesome guy. Um trade trained me in a little bit in the w W system. I mean we trained, you know, we trained Norman. Yeah, and uh yeah, I think Norman.

I think Norman's feet of my dad was like seven hundred bucks he came. I may be I may be wrong about this, but I don't think I am. If Norman never corrects me out say okay, yeah, but yeah, I think I think his few was like seven hundred bucks or something. My dad to start or you know, for however many weeks, and then he came to my dad later, I says, hey, late Larry, I you know, I'm a little short. My dad said, you know, sort of, don't worry about it. And I don't think.

I don't think Norman ever paid him back anything. It was funny at an event one time, I said, hey, Norman, my dad before he passed away. He said, get that son of a bitch's money from him. Last thing, the last thing. It was the last thing you ever do you need to collect the money from Norman. Yeah, but that that was who he was. Man, He just he he didn't he didn't care

about this stuff. He wasn't the guy. He wasn't the guy to hit you for two thousand dollars, tell you that you were going to be a superstar, and then you know, two weeks later you were looking for him. Right, Which, there's a lot, so many, a lot of stuff that goes on my dad guy and guys and guys who never did anything themselves, who opened up at school and say I'm gonna make you something, and you know when there's opportunity that that's when they come out, right.

Yeah, it's it sucks. Don't forget. The shows are ad free over on Patreon. But right now we'll take a quick break and then we'll be right back. When I think about you, like then, the most notorious thing for me is kind of watching the Malaco Brothers in All Japan. Um, so I guess maybe you can help me tell like getting there and tagging with your brother. Yeah, I mean we uh don't tell me to lay

my jokes. Only flying well one time per per podcast. So yeah, Lord Blair's was in Hawaii, and I think I think Mark Karl, I think Karl made the connection with Lord Blairs at the time for me, but it was from my brother as well. And so Lord Blair's got us book the first time, and then uh yeah, I mean we just started going.

Things kind of clicked. You know. The nice thing about the nice thing about Baba was he recognized before the States recognized that he could get a lot out of his junior heavyweights, you know, that he could get a lot out of his smaller guys. Um. And a lot of that was due to the fact that a lot of the Japanese boys were smaller guys,

but they were just phenomenal performers. I mean, I love the working over there because I never you know, with the exception of a couple of the guy Jane and I never got on the ring with a guy who I looked at one with a slacker, you know, he who's who's just holding back and not giving you everything he needs to give to make a match happen. Um. So it was, it was. It was a great place to

be in Baba. Baba was just good about cultivating that. And he you know, if you if you worked, if you worked hard for him, he'd take care of you. And he you know, he took us up and pay and rewarded us. You know, we were never going to be and we were never going to be at the level of the World Warriors or

the stand Hanson's of the world. But you know, he took care of us and brought us back and we had we had the opportunity pretty much within reason, call our shots as to how much we wanted to be there. I was restricted because I was a farm. Yeah, So tell me about like what your gaps were you there or what? What do you think like eighty eight to something? Well, start, I think I started. So I started with u WF in eighty three. If I'm not again, that's

famous, if I'm not mistaken phrase. Yeah, Um, everything else is a blurner. I mean, I know, I know, the like tours of late eighties, I was going pretty strong with all with All Japan. You were going, I'm doing a bunch of tours, right, Yeah, I was doing a bunch of tours. Yeah. So then my brother kind of pulled away for a while because he started here in the States, and

so I ended up going and doing my own thing. I was tagged up with you know, Kobashi who became pretty special became Yeah, shamrock Can was my tag partner, and that was fun experience. How are you taking off of what do you because? Correct me if I'm wrong? Like your vision is like I got to make sure I have this job to go back to, right, Yeah, So what tell me about your thoughts as uh as that kind of the struggle, that kind of struggle of thinking, you know,

as all I can say, it was a blur. Man. I look back and I think, if I add all the things up that I was doing at the time, looking back, you know, hindsight, if I if I add all the things up, it was more than twenty four hour a day, and it took up more time than than than was available on a clock. Did you I'm not sure. How the hell did you have a pharmacy job? Yeah, and you said I need three weeks off every seven weeks. I would just I would just get time off. You

know. The new thing about So here's anything about pro wrestling. It's a novelty. There's not a lot of pro wrestlers out there, and there's not a pro a lot of pro wrestlers, you know, there's a lot I run into guys who say, yeah, my my cousin was a pro wrestler. What's his name, Yeah, the masked Uh, you know, the massed assassin. Oh, that massed assassin, the guy in you know,

the guy in some small town in Minnesota. There are diamond does, but guys who really do it and who can talk about it and who've had a chance to work in the ring with some you know, some big, some big guys. That's a novelty. So the people that I worked for and the people that I deal dealt with back then and even today, I'll be doing business deals and you know, people will say, so I heard you wrestle, and I'll say, yeah, here's what I did. And they

were like, oh my god. And then they'll check on the Internet and they're like, I can't believe I was dealing with a What's just dealing with the company in Belfast. They're an Informattish company. They deal in they deal in data coming out of labs off of these milecular tests, off off of

tumors. And here I am talking with these people, you know, these high brow folks, and the guy said something about wrestling, and before you know it, the whole conversation was about wrestling, because it's a novelty. And sometimes I get bored and you know, think, oh my guy, we're talking wrestling again. But it serves a purpose. It's got me the opportunity to do a bunch of other stuff, and it gets me sometimes. It gets to me business deals because it's I'm the guy who's a wrestler.

Well, and also you're you're not masked Assassin number seven. They see a clip of you a boudicon right or whatever it is, which is pretty well. And then look, my brother had. My brother had a lot of notoriety. He was a phenomenal hand in the ring. If they have no clue on God's Green or who the hell I was, most people most because I'll say Milenco, somebody they'll say Dean Minco again. My favorite, my

favorite, my favorite story is I met a fan fest in Charlotte. I was brought in because they were getting my dad an award um as part of the mid midst mid Atlantic Championship Pressing deal back in the day. So they bring me in I'm talking to Paul Orndoff, and Paul's talking to me, and some fans seeing me talking to him, and then I go to get on the elevators, the elevator with these fans and they're like, oh,

you know him, Do you know Paul? I said, yeah, you know, we used to We used to know each other in Tampa pretty well. You know, when he was dressing I was drestling and stuff. And they went, you wrestle. I said yeah, I said Molenco And they look and they go Dean Molenco and I said no, Joe, and they went oh, and then they turned and they started talking. But I, I mean, you know, was I was, I a little bit maybe, But I was also laughing. I mean because I I knew my players.

I know my players. My brother had a hell of a career and he was probably one of the best technicians ever, even Jerry Jerry Briscot one time just walked up to me out of the blue, and so I just want to let you know that of all the people who I ever considered, you know, the technical guys, your brother may have been the best. I'm damn yeah, yeah, you're not too shabby yourself, Yes, for sure. And then and and I guess those tours, years of tours of

all Japan, who was who are you hanging out with? And I don't know if it's like the scrape like because I have my experiences of Japan, of Japanese tours, and and I'm a romantic like that, Like when I when I toured Japan, I always think like these are the this is what the ones before me did or England, like this is the you know I used to do those buttling camp if you remember those, Like I'd be like, you know, the ones before me did this. And there's something that

always sticks with me. And I feel like I'm doing the job and I am a wrestler and so you know, and I like to be in the moment of what I'm doing though, so is your touring with all Japan, which is huge at the time, like who are you with? Who are you hanging out with? And then also like how are you taking in these experiences? So when my brother was there, my brother and I spent a lot of time together. Um, Doug fur Nest was probably my arguably maybe

my best friend overseas, so we spent a lot of time. I would train with him because he was just you know, he was a freaking beast man. Um, you trained Doug. You trained legs with Doug Furness, you trained legs. No, No, if hans are butts, well the only butts are your butts to the ground, because you don't you don't squat halfway down, and you squat with Doug for ness. Uh And then um, stand Hanson, I got to be I like him. He's just a

he's just a good guy. And so you know, I would hang I would hang around him a lot because it's the great thing about hanging with stand, especially if you're going out with him at night, is all you had to do is hang back and just walk behind him, because he was a bowl in a china shop, and he would just go through the entire city. It was almost like zillah, yeah, run everybody, oh real Japanese. Yeah, he was just and he just bulled his way through the whole

city and you just walk behind him and laugh your ass off. But also like right, a monster in the ring, but seemed like a sweet man. No, he's he's a great guy, great attitude. Great Yeah. I was gonna say not, may you tell me? Probably not an egomaniac or I don't know, no, but but knew that he was good. But I knew that he was good. Yeah, I mean definitely knows. He definitely knew that he was top dog over there. Cool no no, no, no, no questions ask you. He knew, he knew who

he was. And I did have a question about Baba, because it's I don't know as an American who just like you know, I don't know you hear Baba an okie like you hear these things, um like who was he a nice man? Like? Who was he was? Do you have experiences? So I had, I had, you know, I had minimal direct interactions with him. Okay, Baba, just you know if look, if you were staying or if you're you were the road Warriors or maybe you were

Abbey abdulla um. That's the stories for another podcast. Yeah, if you if you were any of those guys, you probably got more Baba time, gotama time song. And I see some guy in big, big parachute pants. It's time. But I think it's like an old grandpa with giant parachute pants. But he, um, he was Baba, you know it was

it was a giant um and I I'm almost worried. You know, he would talk to me about and just briefly you know, oh he's had that d voice and just call you over and you ask you what you want to do, if you you know, you wanted to you know, you talk a little bit about Monte Air and maybe talk to you about how many more tours or you know what, what you want to come over for the year or something if you were lucky enough and we had you know, we had

that kind of mid mid tier space where we could talk to him about money and time in Japan. Um. And this was sort of right about the time my brother was leaving and doing back here in the States. So, I mean, I know he was larger than life. But like, did you see him that way? Were you like intimidated or anything or no, not at all. No, he was No, he was just he was a fixture, you know. I mean, he wasn't he wasn't intimidating. He didn't try to be intimidating. He was just a he was just a

big He was just a big big man. Okay. Um he even went so far one time. So Kobashi and um this kid Kokuchi. Yeah, yeah, Kobashi and Kokuchi. They wanted to they were they were up and comers, you know, they wanted to push them. So Baba flew my brother and I did to um Honolulu, and so we stayed in Hawaii and we had a week long Malenco school in Hawaii, and we just trained Kobashi

and Kokuchi. So we spent a lot of time when we were there with Baba and those guys and a couple of other his you know, his his underlings. Yeah. Um, that's the most time I ever spent with Boba directly. And now when you talk about that, like, are you like, oh, wrestling is the best I did? I went to Hawaii for a week or is that just one of like so many memories And you're I'm pretty I'm pretty good about stopping, you know, smelling the roses sort of

thing. I realized and recognized at every juncture that was pretty lucky to be where I was and to experience what I was experiencing and to see what I mean, even look, we travel up the coast and Mount Fuji would be sitting there in the you know, in the distance, but not so distant that you couldn't see it, and you're just you just sit there and you go, holy crap, that's freaking gorgeous, you know, or you'd be driving up into into a guido and supporting you know, the snow would be

falling down and it's just the most beautiful landscapes. And I mean, and they just people just treated you so well, you know, they they just they were they were kind, and they were friendly, and they were um, you know, they were appreciative of you as an athlete. They didn't you know, no, no, at no time did you ever get all you know that stuff's fake or they just you were a sportsman and they treated you like that. Even though it was professional wrestling. You were no different

than you know, one of their sumo guys. It was. It was pretty amazing stuff. And you would go out and they would you know, you know, they called the service, right you you know, people would, people would take care of you and and they were just so appreciative just to be with you somewhere. And the sponsors, yeah, the sponsors where they provide for you. And right hey, the shows are ad free on Patreon. This will be our last break stick with us. We'll be right

back as you. I think he's slowed down because you always had this plan of like, I'm in pharmacy, But was there a point of realization of just like, wow, this is kind of winding down. I'm gonna go back to I'll be I'll be the pharmacy guy. I think it's um So, it's a two pronged deal. One is just the nature of trying to succeed in this world and make serious money and do really well. And that wasn't you know, the rest of the world wasn't my place. I wasn't

that wasn't going to happen. I wasn't six six, I wasn't two eighty. I didn't have I didn't have the tool. I wasn't gifted the tools to be the superstar, you know. I was gifted some other stuff to be where I was at, and I was okay with that. So if I was gonna do anything special, was going to be outside of the rescue business. But then the other prong, which is a more hurtful one.

Your body just starts not being able to do what it did. And you, I mean, I don't care who you are, it's inevitable, right, um No, you made you. He's not not for Ric Flair, maybe not for Ric Flair. But you know, I mean and we all we all have one more match. I mean, in my head, I could get out there and wrestle again. And then if I go out there and I do that and I go to take a bump, I embarrassed myself. I did. I did a couple of matches not too long ago.

I'm sixty six now, so this would have been, you know, four or five years ago. I'm in the ring and yeah, I'm taking a bump, but I'm taking it and I'm going down in sections you know where where I used to just I mean, I used to splatter. I didn't take a bump. I didn't take a bump as good as some of the Japanese kids who just used to. I used to say they splattered because they went down so far ass and hit the canvas so hard and you just got

this amazing pop when they went down. It was just it was so quick, and it's just I love that. I think it was um Terry Gordy's cousin, Richard Slater, Okay, yes, sladdic Richard. Yeah he was a Noah guy. But all Japan before that, yeah, yeah, I mean, and you'd come off the ropes and ed him hit him with tackle and unbelievable. I mean he just damn just right down and so fast. You're like, holy crap. Yeah, when you say that, I picture

like different coaches being like attack the mat. That's what I hear it attack the mat. Yeah, that sounds familiar. Well, but I mean that's so you couldn't do that at a sixty two. I couldn't do that at sixty two. I definitely can't do it that. I know. I can't. Your mind tells you you can, right, I mean Terry, you know, Dorry Functional comes over to Japan and uh gets in the ring.

Yeah, I don't want to do that though. Two things for me and I really I really hit heavy on this when I was a kid to myself because I saw I saw people trying to hang on too long. I said, I'm not gonna do that because I'm not gonna embarrass myself. I'm you know, if if I can't have a decent match, I'm not gonna do it. And I've actually gone against that because I probably should have stayed out of the ring the last time I was in the ring. But the second

thing is is just hanging around the business I don't. You know, people say, hey, you do watch this if you you know, did you go to a raw it was in town last night, or like, no, I don't want to be I don't want to be that guy. I don't want to be that guy who you know was hanging outside of the dress room and hey, you know how you doing right? Used the russ right, Yeah, yeah, I get it for sure. Yeah, I just

I thought that was always made me. It just always made me sad when I was a younger kid and I would watch some of the quote unquote old timers hang around still. Well, I mean, it's great that you were at the Iowah Hall of Fame, the National Wrestle of Hall of Fame. So like, what's inspired you to come here? I guess I came here last year. Jerry Briscoe told me about it. I mean a few people told about Jerry. Jerry said, hey, you need to go, and I said okay, and I came up here and on I had a good

time. Number One, Jerry and I have a history. He's considerably older, and I'll remind him of that every day. But you know, we have a history that goes back to the early seventies. So you know, we're talking fifty years worth of knowing each other when we were kids. He was an older kid. But when we were kids, I didn't like him and he didn't like me, and we talked about that all the time. Well, we just we didn't like each other. We were jerks, um

to put it nicely. Yeah, And then you know, as you get older and you start talking and yeah, now I was realized, you have a lot of comments. We have a lot of comment Our history is a lot of the same stuff. Just growing up in Tampa. You know, his brother, Jack was phenomenal. He was Jack was a sweetheart, and you know, I knew him real well through my dad and um, so Jerry and I've become pretty good friends. And when he came up here the

first time last well it wasn't his first time. When he came up last year, he said, hey, you know, you need to come up to this thing. This thing is pretty good. And then you know, then I got here and it was nice to see some of the people I hadn't seen for a while. Yeah, that's great. And and Dan Gabele

was like this, yeah, mega hero of mine. Back in the early seventies, when he you know, when he took gold in the seventy two and um, I have a chance to which was which was an awkward meeting because I'm looking at him going hey, um here ago it was like a hero you're you're a hero of mine, I was hero of yours. Well somebody was a hero of somebody. And he was looking to be going,

oh that's nice. Yeah, yeah, I need to go now. And at that at your age, you don't maybe you're like, well, my days of feeling these feelings are probably behind me, right and then boom here you are like being nervous to a man. It was Dan Gabele. I appreciate you coming on. This is so nice to talk to you. Parting words scan the rest in business, stay time, I'll go to a good

go to a good school. I don't spend two thousand dollars again. Nowhere you still if you want to do that, send me two thousand dollars school. You're starting a new one. But yeah, it's a post office box. When I asked Joe what he'd like me to plug, he told me to convince someone to start a gofund me for him so he can retire. But I would say, maybe donate to cancer research so cancer can be cured, and then he'll be out of a job and forced to retire. About

that. We got another show next week, but before we leave, I do have some plugs and coming my Patreon paton dot com slash col cabanas where you can listen to ad free archives of almost five hundred episodes of the Art of Wrestling, ad free archives of Wrestling Anonymous and new bonus Wrestling Anonymous episodes just for the Patreon twice a month. Last month was with Chris Cubis. This month was with Ian Ricabani and we listened to calls and we gave our

thoughts for different tiers. I'll also send you a vinyl sticker every month, and I will handwrite your envelope and I will give you a very fun nickname. Check out older episodes of Wrestling Anonymous and Pro Wrestling Fringe. New ones do pop up time to time, just like the Art of Wrestling. Go grab some Merchcultmerch dot Com, brand new upper Deck signed cards, a brand new comic book signed by me and Daniel Warren Johnson. I got new autograph

pictures up there. Leftover stickers from the Patreon micro brawlers, they'll be gone soon. The usual fun it's all up there, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube. That's all at Coldcabana. I'm on Twitch all the time playing games. I just started Fortnite, Twitch dot tv, slash Coldcabana Cult Wrestling at gmail dot com is my very public email. That's where you can hit me up for shows, conventions, or any business or non business stuff. Send me something fun to my po box, which can be

found at the bottom of my Websitelcabana dot com. Upcoming events this week, I'll be at the Gathering of the Juggalos Tuesday, August ninth, Championship Wrestling in Irvine, California. Of course the nineteenth through the twenty first at the Monkey Barrel and then bro Scotland. Come see me and John Hastings at the Edinburgh Fringe Saturday September three. I'll be in Mesa, Arizona for Party Hard

Wrestling's final show. September tenth, I'll be at the Mall of America for First Wrestling Saturday Night trow and October first, i head back to one PW the Doncaster Dome, where I will team up with my buddy mister Burridge, and we will become Team Shag once again. Podcast cover art designed by Jimmy Lee. Photo by James muscle White. Thanks to our forever sponsor, One

Hour Tease dot Com. They help run Pro Wrestling Teas dot Com. That's where you can buy all of my shirts and cameo style video messages called shoots right over at Pro Wrestling Teas dot com slash Cold Cabana. We'll be back next week with a wildlive show, and then we got shows in September and October. Stay subscribed. The podcast was never gone and it's not going anywhere anytime soon. As long as I could sit down with some people that I

think are super interesting, the show will go on. This has been the art of wrestling for Cold Cabana. I'm Cold Cabana. Thanks. I guess maybe your back off very easy, just chit chat. I want to say hello. Tell me what you had for breakfast this morning? You hear your levels? What do you think I had for breakfast this morning? What am I? I'm a Jew? What did I have from boxing? Bagels?

Well? I didn't have locks, but I didn't have a bagel I was given when I was a kid, my dad would sing, bagels, bagels two for five. That's what keeps us Jews alive. Can we can? I keep that as the start of this whole thing. If you want a bagels, bagels two for five, that's what keeps us Jews alive.