So here's an interesting coink heat ink. We were just talking about the messaging by the White House and how it is that you've got these headlines going around time magazine. Trump gave Americans a massive tax cut. Few are noticing. The New York Times face it, you probably got a giant tax cut, um and the realization that the vast majority of people got tax cuts, but the vast majority of people think they didn't. Write would how how does the how does the White House not fix that messaging?
Earlier I would put out that both of those outlets are distinctly left leaning, and and it's got to be so clear a case, uh, for them to say something like that that it's a hell of a clear case. It's not like one of the subtleties of immigration or something that this will encourage immigration. Well some believe it will. Just know it's it's just black and white. And they, you know, had to come out as strongly as they did. I think that's really notable, uh, to discuss that, and
and in similar topics. Please welcome back to the show. Deborah J. Saunders, the White House correspondent for the Las Vegas Review Journal. Deborah, how are you? I'm great. How are you doing? We're fining dandy? Really? Um So, let's let's talk about White House messaging. I don't know if you want to get all editorialists um as as we've been, I think Donald J. Is enormously talented at certain aspects of men of messaging. But in general, the White House
shop has done not a great job. And let me hit you with a couple of numbers real quick to make the point. For people who make between fifty and seventy five thousand dollars a year, that's kind of like right in the wheelhouse. For a lot of the country, eighty two percent got a tax cut. Only forty one think they got a tax cut. Half for people making seventy five thousand to a hundred thousand, almost of those people got a tax cut. Only forty scent of people
think they got a tax cuts. Astonishing. It is astonishing. And why would that be. Well, you know that Donald Trump told people that they get tax cuts. But he's not always the most credible person, right So, even though he has sent this message out and even though they were really clear about it, I think people tend to be skeptical about many things that he says. For certain reasons. Um. Another thing is that the number of Democrats kept saying that it was just a tax cut for the very rich.
And it was a tax cut for the very rich. It was just a tax cut for practically everybody though, so uh and so there were think tanks that were sort of sending out misinformation, if you will, about the early versions of it, and uh. And a lot of people don't know what they pay for taxes. They changed the withholding tables, so you're not getting a bigger refund than you would have gotten before because you're paying less every week, and so people are clueless about it. And
it's just this sort of uh. And it was great to say. The New York Times run a story about it, and Donald Trump, when he was in Minnesota yesterday, actually read the headline face it you probably got a tax cut, And you know, he would joked about how these people are going to get fired, but they were reporting on something that's true and people don't know. But but I think it would help that Trump and I understand what you're saying that a lot of people don't don't believe him,
but a lot of people do. I mean, he's got around fifty approval writing, you would think he could get those numbers up a little higher on that they think they got a tax cut stuff. If I were him, might tweet out that New York Times article every day this week. Yeah, I mean, and it would probably get
lost in an avalanche of other tweets. I mean, well, if he would stop tweeting about if he would stop tweeting about how the firefighters ought to take on the Notre Dame Cathedral, I mean, stay out of that issue. But he tass this way of exaggerating. So when he says this, I think a lot of people are like, uh huh is there. He's just not the most credible, credible salesperson. Even so he actually has to turn to The New York Times to prove that what he's been
saying about the tax cut is true. That would be an unfortunate aspect of his proclivity for hyperbole. Yeah, that's true. That's true. It's a little boy cried wolfish. Yeah. Deborah J. Saunders, White House correspondent for the Las Vegas Review Journalist Online. So, Deborah, who is the messaging guru in the White House? Is there one? It's Donald Trump? Right? I mean, how many briefings have we had this year. I think too, the Press Secretary of Sarah Sanders is not really the face
of the administration for the press corps anymore. It's Donald Trump. Donald Trump in pool sprays, sitting in the Oval Office, having reporters shot questions to him, walking to Marine One, making stray comments during rallies and roundtables. That that's where the message all comes from. And it can be garbled at times. And uh, I mean we just don't have Uh it's there are no public events scheduled today in
the White House. Um. And when you know, and when we do have contact with the White House, and we are I mean we asked questions of the Press Office all the time. We frequently get answers, not always. I mean we know that they are not the highest step place in the world. Um. But I Trump wants to be the person who says everything. Okay, fine, But if I'm if I'm Donald Trump, the day after Tax Day
or yesterday would have been even better. I'm hammering these numbers from the New York Times all day, day long until people are sick of it. And they can't they can't ignore it in their news coverage. I Mean, here's another one for people who make more than a thousand dollars a year, households that make more than a hundred thousand dollars a year, which is the case for a lot of people in uh and and a lot of the cities were on in eighty nine point five percent
of them got a tax cut. Only feel like they think they got a tax again consistently half that's amazing. Even a lot of people feel that because of the fact that state and local taxes are are not deductible as they had been before, that that means that they got a tax hike. But it's not necessarily true because
the rates were lowered all these other things happened. So there are a lot of people who may think they're paying higher taxes and they're just long, and they really ought to be paying attention, and they have to be looking at their pay stumps, and they ought to have a better idea of what they're paying that they don't. Yeah, that's true. And and griping is more common in terms of conversation than than shouting hallelujah. It's just the way
human beings are made. The number that came out of Bernie's taxes yesterday, his his twenty six effective tax rate. Everybody should know their number that maybe I'd like to pass a law or the I R. S. Has to put that out. I don't have the slightest idea what mine is. I don't. I don't either. Everybody ought to know their number, and that would help a lot. Did
my number go? Yeah, I've forgotten it changes because I mean, obviously you pay a certain percentage on the on the first let's say your income, and then and then it goes up, so there isn't one exact number. Also, another wonderful thing about our tax system, right right, our bizarro
tax system. Well, you know, just one final thought on the White House messaging thing, you know, the the seat of the pants not slick practiced politico speak, um aspect of it is really appealing to a lot of people, and it's it's a substantial part of what got Trump elected, I think. But in the kind of music I really like and I like to play. Uh, there's a phrase ragged but right um, And I just sometimes I think the White House messaging is is mostly ragged. Uh. Deborah J. Saunders,
White House correspondent, Las Vegas Review Journal. It's always great to talk, Debrah go get him. Thank you all right, see you later. Uh. Yeah, there's a law I would pass. I think it could change taxes overnight. Maybe if if everybody knew their number for the year, their effective tax rate. Do the average of all your taxes you're paid. However, they came up with Bernie's number from yesterday, do that
for everyone, and uh and know what it is. We should know that, like our cholesterol or our blood pressure or weight. Right, I think we gotta come up with five numbers. You gotta know five numbers. That's several of them right there. Oh. I like I know my height. I've known that for quite sometimes probably truck and you're going under underpasses. You don't need to know your height. That's that's dumb. Bad number. Blood pressure, that's a big one.
It's amazing how often I have to write down my height. Yeah, no kidding. It comes up a lot. That is interesting. Yeah, I mean, if I committed a crime, am I in a lineup? Is the cops looking for who cares? And my five nine and my five eleven? Who cares?