Can Anything Move the Needle? Lanhee Chen Talks to Armstrong & Getty

six people in total. That's Chris Christie talking about debate prep. The President has tested positive for coronavirus. He tweeted that out last night. You know MSNBC is making a huge deal out of that and how reckless they are. No, none of us are wearing masks in this room right now. No. I don't feel like we're being insane either. So well, No, we work in a small group of people that interacts on a daily basis, and we don't get tested every

day like all those people around the president. View. We're joined by Lonnie Chen David and Diane Stephie, fellow in American Public Policy Studies at the Hoover Andtitution, hosted the podcast Crossing Lines. With ln Hitchen on here. How are you. Oh, I'm doing fine. It's slow newsday record. So it's just it's just, you know, the announcement of a CB to the Supreme Court seems like it happened six months ago. Well, and as I texted to a friend this morning, we're

texting back and forth. They said, the last thing in the world I am is superstitious, but I will not utter the words. This is as crazy as it can get out. No, you don't want to say that. So what's your reaction to the announcement of the president's COVID status. Well, I mean, first of all, you you hope he's able to make a quick recovery. Same thing for the first lady and and for people who may have been exposed.

I mean, that's really the big question now is you've got this detective work of doing to figure out, you know, exactly who may have been involved. You've played that, Chris Christie clip. I mean, obviously the President has been in contact with a bunch of people. My presumption is that

they'll test Biden as well. Even though the President and him weren't all that close in the debate, you know they were, they were potentially close enough indoors, So I mean, they are just things that they need to track down in terms of how it impacts the race. You know, I've I've I've heard and thought about everything under the sun from this is this is the October surprise. It's going to completely un ended up end the race too. It's really just not gonna have much of an impact

at all. My my view is the dynamics of the race don't really change. Uh, you know, it is what it is. It's going to change the campaign schedule over the next week to two weeks, to be sure, but I don't know that anybody. Again, the question that I've been asking all morning or since last night is does this change anyone's mind about the election? And I'm just not sure it does, at least until we know a

little bit more about the president's condition. Hey, here's a good thing to ask you about, because I've I've heard this a couple of times this week, and it's probably gonna be true. As you just said, even after the coronavirus announcement. You go back to the UH average polling lead Biden had over Trump in January, and it's about the same that was pre impeachment, COVID, economy, George f Wait justice. All these things lead is about the same same with the right track, wrong track before any of

that started, about the same as it was now. It would seem to me that nothing can move the needle. You either can stomach Trump or you can't. And that's where we are, you know. I think that's a good observation. People have their minds made up about President Trump. They've had a long time to figure out what they think of him, uh, And so as a result, what you will see are episodic differences. Right, So occasionally something happens

and a bump goes one way or the other. But fundamentally people know what they think of President Trump because he is the most covered in terms of the media, uh, most kind of out there public figure we have in our country, perhaps in the world, And so you know what you think of him. And that's kind of why I'm I'm floored by the notion that they're undecided voters still at this point. And I kind of wonder sometimes like are they really undecided? Are they just looking for

attendent or are they stupid? Because are they really really stupid people? I'd like to stand up for the voters of America. But go on, Lonnie, No, I mean, I mean, I just think that it's it is. It's got to be the case that you have at least a gut instinct about Donald Trump by this point, and you've had it for some time. And this is why, you know,

at the end of the day. I still have a tough time seeing all of these late breakers go for President Trump at the end of the day, because I feel like you've got an opinion and if you still haven't figured out that you like him, you probably won't before him when it comes to election day. See. So it's it's interesting. I don't know. I think it is um it's more a question of I like him on policy, I can't stomach him as a human being. And people are undecided which way that push and pull is going

to propel them. I think they're they're less undecided about the candidates and more can I pull the lever for Trump or pull it again? Having said that, in again, it seems like it was months ago. Did you hear there was a debate, Lonnie was like seventy two hours ago. It seems like it almost seems irrelevant. It was seventy two hours ago. I know, what's your take on that? Um, you know, I called it the Black Guys for Democracy

right after the debate. I really thought it was one of them, since well, I just can't imagine why one would conclude that. No. I mean I I watched it and I thought, you know, if if you wanted to learn something, did you really learn anything? Probably not. What you saw was, you know, really kind of petulant, childlike behavior at various points during during the debate. And I sort of thought after it was done, like, gosh, wouldn't it be nice if we didn't have any more of these?

And now actually here we are on Friday, and I'm thinking we might not have any more peace for for very different reasons than I thought before. Um the debate. The problem with that debate format is when you don't empower the moderator to really do a whole lot more except for telling the people that are doing bad thing to stop and not really giving him the authority to

stop them in any real way. When you have this format that essentially, you know, doesn't really allow for constructive engagement, That's why I do think they've got to sitting through the rules as not after this cycle for future cycles. But I, UM, I didn't get a whole lot out of it, and I'm pretty sure most American didn't either. Well, now that I've watched parts of it, uh, you know, after it happened, so I don't have any of the the emotion or excitement or the newness or anything like that.

Trump made some really good points. He got in the way, you know, he thought he was being aggressive. His aggressiveness worked against him in several instances in which he should have just let Biden lay out for a for two full minutes why he's not going to answer the question

on packing the Supreme Court, for instance. Yeah. I thought the strongest part of the debas of Trump was actually opening when he talked about the Supreme Court and he talked about why it was that he had chosen Amy Coney Barrett, why it was that that that he was, you know, essentially constitutally entitled to make that ways. I thought that was the best part of the debate. Honestly, I thought he made his points clearly. Um. I actually didn't think the healthcare exchange was all that bad for

the president either. I think he was able to make a couple of good points there. Um, I do think the debate. You're right. I think as things went on, he would have been better off just kind of standing back and trying to let Biden make some coherent points, because there are a couple of times where frankly, he bailed him out. Absolutely he bailed he bailed Biden out.

I hope he realizes that. Um, I don't know. I mean it's it's hard, right, Like people have asked me after the debate, what would you what would you tell Trump to do differently? How would you prepped him differently? And it's like that's the premise of that question assumes that you can prepped him at all, or that he's willing to be prepped. I mean, he's got his own way of doing things and it's his style. And yes, with he a little hot, I think he was a

little hot. So I think he could calibrate that if there is another debate, probably if he wanted to. But that's really all you can kind of tell the guy, you know, And and and overall the pressure points he put on Biden, whether the law and order stuff or you know, the stuff about Green New Deal, I thought I thought those were the right pressure points to apply. I don't know that I changed too much about the substance of it if I were him, except for one thing.

I do think he needs to say more about what he's going to do in the next four years. I think, here to your point earlier about some people being not sure if they can pull the lever form, at this point, I think hearing more from him having some reassurance like, look, here's what I'm going to do in the next four years. I think that would help that dynamic tremendously. There is so much that Biden said that it is worthy of criticism politically, as an American, constitutionally the rest of it.

I hate to hammer on Trump, but I would love to hear have I don't know, Mark Meadows and Ted Cruz and Lindsey Graham get in his ear, presuming you know, he recovers his health and tell him, next time Joe Biden says they're going to take away your health care, say these words, we will protect people with pre existing conditions. Just say that. Make it explod is sit because people

are afraid as hell of that. And when Biden brought that up, there was a weird rambling, kind of non specific answer just I get that he wants to argue in his own way, but it seemed like he did not have those core five talking points ready and it just frustrated the hell out of me. But you know, at this point, probably enough has been said on that long Hea Chen's got his own podcast. We understand you had a good guest on your most recent Yeah, so we we did an episode on Monday with a woman

named Elaine Kihano CBS News. She actually moderated the vice presidential debate four years ago, the debate between Pence and Tim Kane, and so I just wanted to ask, you know, hey, what the light to moderate one of these things, you know, and and in in light of all of the conversation about the role of the moderator and what Chris Wallace did, Uh, it's actually kind of a fun episode to listen to, you know, in terms of talking about she talked about how she got picked and what it was like to

prepare and whether she was nervous or not having to do that, and what it was like during the debate and what the debates mean. So, yeah, go go have a listen. It was a fun interview. Yeah, I'll check that out. Yes, sounds really I wonder if the moderators should should start by saying, look, for both of you, I want you to commit right now to follow in the rules that your campaigns agreed to before we get started.

Just right now, do you commit to this? And I don't know if that would help, but and if you don't, I will beat the hell out of you, maybe maybe a physical threat. I've got the Proud Boys here and they're gonna rush the stage. Lani Chen is the David and Diane Stephy Fellow in American Public Policy Studies at the Hoover Institution, host of the podcast Crossing Lines with Lani Chen. Lani, thank you so much for the conversation.

We'll talk soon. Thank you so yeah. I have. I've heard that a couple of times this week, and that is astounding. Sean has I almost said inadvertently, but that'd be cruel. There's no reason to say that Sean has nailed this whole thing from the beginning. Everybody, our producer, Sean, Everybody's meter is completely stuck. If you go back to January and the poll numbers are roughly the same, and

the right track wrong track is roughly the same. Given the craziest year in in the world history outside of maybe you know when the dinosaur has got obliterated or POMPEII. Seventeen seventy six was pretty nutty. But nothing changed through all of that. Well, maybe maybe the things just by coincidence equalled each other. Half of it would have pushed people, right, half of it would have pushed people and didn't neutralize every It's just amazing. A quick note from our friends

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code armstrong. Or if you're old school, dial one eight hundred cars six thousand and again the code is Armstrong one eight hundred car six thousand, armstrong, or just go to car shield dot Com. Lonnie Chin's an easy mark. If I'm a stand up comedian, I want a bunch of him in the crowd. It might be because he does all serious interviews, like all day long, well, and he's got a really good sense of here and any

levity whatsoever. It's just going to see what right, So outside the bounds, the president has the COVID, that's right. What happens next? Suck well next? Well, I don't know. If it'll shock depends how easily shocked people are.