Drew Harwell is an actual recognized authority on various things technologically, covers technology and artificial intelligence for The Washington Post and joins US Now to talk about the coming facial recognition wave across America. Hey, Drew, how are you? Hey? Guy's good? How are you good? That was an extremely worthy introduction, but I had pulled it off. So listen. I think a lot of us have followed some of the documentaries about facial recognition in China and it's it's pretty cool
in a weird way, but pretty scary. What's the newest on facial recognition in the US? Yeah, I mean you're seeing it everywhere. You're seeing it in um schools and companies, and you know, it's still sort of rare, but it's it's increasing pretty quickly. And the big sort of new front is for police departments in sheriff's office, where they are allowing sort of deputies and investigators to use it to identify people that they meet out on on the streets and in the field and in their way maybe
lead to new arrests and new investigations. How would that work exactly in practicality, So you know, if somebody shoplifts out of the store. They're often caught on security or surveillance cameras. The people who called the police, they sort of have the footage, but they don't have any quick
way to identify the people. So now these deputies can just sort of take that image, run it through their facial recognition which scans all of their sort of jail mug shots, and you know, okay, instead of saying that he was a guy, he's I don't know, he's about six ft tall, probably way too und nay bonds. Well, they just they just do the facial facial recognition thing and say it's Jimmy Smith, he lives over here, and you go get him. Well, does it have to be
somebody who's been in the system. Yeah, that's right. So it's photos right now, and it's everybody who's been sort of arrested. Will all be in the system before you know, it will all be in the system before you know, if we aren't already. Yeah, that's right. I mean, you know we have to think that there are you know, the d m V has photos on all of us or passport photos of the databases are out there. They're
just not yet connected to those systems. But you know, the question is could they ever be and could we ever be identified like that? Yes? And yes, yeah, you know, there's a fine line between uh aware and paranoid, but you know there and we reference this on the show. Semi regularly drew that there are so many federal crimes nobody even knows how to count them, including the regulations you can violate which end you up in jail, and
the rest of it. And I could see a push made that if you get a parking ticket, if you have an overdue library book, if you do anything, you step out a line, we just we're gonna take your picture. That's it, and you get entered into the system, and then everybody's in the system. Yeah, and that's not really science fiction anymore. I mean that a way. A part of that happens in China right now, where they have
sort of facial recognition camera set up at intersections. If people jaywalk, it sort of takes a picture of on it has their identity, and then they're they're named and shamed. Effectively, their their pictures and identities are put up in these like public squares. Is sort of like you know, moments of embarrassment. So that's not happening here obviously, But that's just a sign of you know, how this technology could
be used. I mean, it's it's it's a way that deputies and police could identify any of us, um without us really knowing or consenting. And so there's all sorts of questions of privacy and whether we really want that that future ahead of us. How good is it right now? The technology on facial recognition? Is it pretty accurate most of the time. It all depends on the quality of the image and the images they're looking at, like their
database of facial images. Right, So if all of a sudden does it not work, yeah, I mean that's a good quay it really, I mean, yes, it can still work in that and a lot of the deputies will say like, oh, you know if even if somebody puts on glasses or they grow out a beard, you know, this can still tell. I mean, it really depends on
how good the images. And you know a lot of these survey and lets photos are taken from in the ceilings at weird angles, so those tend to be less accurate, um, and you know they're they're taken in the darker by you know, crappy smartphones so it all depends. But you know, in this scenario, anything less than perfect accuracy is going to lead to deputies potentially arresting the wrong right. Horrified by all this, but the upsides, you know, for the
things for good. If we could do away with keys more or less, I'd be happy that you could walk into your building where you work with your face, or your house, or start your car with your face. You just don't need keys. That that'd be awesome. Drew Harwell covers technology for the Washington Post and is on the line, Yeah, that that would be kind of cool. And I think we're moving in that direction. Hey, one thing you mentioned
in your piece, which is quite be you. You were too fat, You didn't used to be somebody differently, let myself go. One thing in your piece that will have a link to so folks can find it easily is that they've actually um run artists sketches through a software. Mm hmm. Yeah. And that's not a way to see if that looks like anybody. Yeah, And I mean you have to wonder is that really going to give you good results? Like you know, the system is designed to
compare one photo to the other. When you start getting into artist sketches it. It all depends on how is the how is the artist feeling that day, and how good was the drawing right, and and so you know that's gonna up the the danger of it being a misidentification to all these people are saying we really shouldn't be using them that in that way. But you know, Amazon, for their point says whatever, I mean, this is a
tool for the deputies. They get to decide. It's it's it's all human judgment at the end of the day because they get to look at the photos and the matches, at the system shows up and get to choose. But you know, I think there's a question of whether, hey, is this system being used for for too much? Is there is their mission creep here where we're now just sort of throwing photos into the certain because it's easy. Are well cover tech for the Washington Post? True? Really
interesting stuff. Again, we'll have a link to your piece. Thanks very much for the conversation. Thank you. There's no stopping any of this, all our information unless we fight for ZENA or faces. Everything is going to be everywhere, all the time. The government will track everything we do all the time. That is absolutely gonna happen in my lifetime? Chilling?
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