Hi, I'm Kristin Davis, and I want to know are you a Charlotte? Hi?
Everybody, welcome to Are You a Charlotte? We had so much to discuss with Sarah Jessica that we have another
episode all just thoughts, random thoughts with Sarah Jessica. The thing that I want to say to now is that I do feel that female friendship is so much more valued and talked about and discussed now, And I love that so much because I do feel like it's just incredibly important and it used to be a time where somehow it wasn't discussed or you know, there were all these soap operas where the women were fighting each other, and that was always something that was very key to
our DNA was that that was not going to happen on our show. We were never going to fight over a man. Do you remember? That was one of the few notes that came from HBO over a kind of very minor story point between you and Miranda that one time where she wanted to date that you had dated, and you.
Were like, yeah, sure, okay, you know what I mean, Like it was.
It was a different we were going to be completely different in that way. And then eventually we get to that beautiful scene on the stoop where I say, you know, maybe wore each other's soulmates, which I remember was just a beautiful scene in the middle of the night on that certain street that I think I'm still not supposed to mention.
Are I don't know what. Yeah we got yeah we got some trouble. But you know, so confused the special students on your daily path. Just go to the second left. Just trust me, it's the second left. There you go. But you know what else I want to ask you?
But I mean, I'm going to have to mold this over what you're telling me now, and I'm going to have to really think about it from this person food for thought. I know, I think for me right because I'm over here, right like you're there and I'm over here, and.
You had to play cares I'm up here. No, no, no, no, we're sitting there in our housewife quote apparently, I don't know, yeah, famous house it was housewife. It just makes me laugh. I don't know. Yes, somebody said I'm up here and you're down here. Really you're saying, oh, you're over there, you know, we're in our own bubbles.
Someone the other day told me that they think that that the Housewife you know, uh franchise, mega franchise that our friend Andy.
Created was inspired by us. And I was like, what, I've never seen it, so I didn't know what to say.
That she meant as a compliment. Yes, you know, Andy's just a genius and came up on his own.
I believe. But anyway, and I forget. Oh, I know it was good. Are you kidding? You said the driver hare cast. Yes, because so one thing, when I'm looking.
Back on the show right and rewatching, which is so incredible, I was in my own, you know, somewhat of a tizzy right like the first beginning, especially because I'm in La.
I'm coming back. I have my golden Remember, I would haul my golden retriever back and forth with me Kelli and you know, like just trying to figure out where I'm going to live and what I'm gonna do, how A'm gonna.
Wear those shoes that took her a whole season at least to get me into the shoes she wanted me to wear.
You know, so funny. I know, I know it's also funny. So I'll let you finish. Then I just want to say something about your angst that you talked about. Please tell me what you want to say now about I'm going to say that, you know, I think you're always really good about saying when you were nervous or worried or even if something upset you. But I was very touched. I mean, I feel like I I hope that you felt if you shared that with us, that you were
taken care of. Like I hope that when you felt nervous or literally angst and you would lie in bed and worry about seeing your body, any of these things at the times that in which you felt comfortable to share it. And I feel like we we talked a decent amount about that that you nobody dismissed it as silliness, no, but I was like, wow, it really like state. It was like your constant companion for the entire first season for sure, for sure. And my part of me is like,
oh my gosh. But the other part of me is like, wow, look at her. Because everybody has a way of like revealing or beings demonstrative about the things that they're worried about, and some people are are willing to share it, and some people just it blurts out and in different directions, and you have to assume that it's because they're worried or they're insecure, nervous like it. That's our most human parts of ourselves. Absolutely, But I just don't like, you
didn't really it didn't really mess with you. Curiously, I know it didn't really mess with you. And that is a real testimony because I feel like we talked about being worried, upset, nervous, et cetera, and you, I think you started the podcast today Sarah Jessica doesn't cry much, and I was like, what, I feel like I am so sensitive so overly. Well, it's not creating sense of or two different things, right, but I feel like in my head I'm a mess, worried, nervous, et cetera, et cetera.
But we have like a job to do in the camera rolls is to try to convince somebody at that time that you are Charlotte and you feel really strongly about this and you need to get from A to B and then B two C and and then exit. Cy is where you're going to and the camera is going to say cut right, thank god. Well, she was so good at saying when she was upset, nervous, and then something did something like distracted you or gotten a thing. Then it was like over and out and done, like
you expelled it. But I didn't know that you actually weren't expelling all of it, like you weren't ridding yourself of all of it. You actually were like, hang on to have a hood about I did.
I did, I did, And I think, I mean, really, what you're saying, when I think you're saying, is that I am.
I don't have a.
Lot of cover, you know, my my myself if I know you and I trust you, which I do obviously trust you. Ever since the Krispy Kremes, I was.
Like, I can talk to her, but I didn't. I didn't.
I think it took a while for me to feel because I've been in these other TV situations where you know, you did just kind of you were in your own bubble and you had your own situation and you wouldn't want to burden the others or you know, whatever it would be, or necessarily share all of your thoughts. I wasn't in a safe situation previous to our show, let's put it that way. So I think once we got
to our show. It did take me some time because I thought all of you were sew together and New York and tough, you know, and you are in a certain way.
You know what I'm saying. Nay, I just don't. You're funny. But like you talk about the rain's nothing here. I mean for me, I have so many traumatic rain memories. Okay, like in my mind, like the sideways rain. I remember one time. Do you remember that the sideways rain? Remember that Nokia shiny phone I had that. You always like, why do you have that phone? Do you remember this? Was it like a mirror reflected. It was like from the matrix or whatever. I check my teeth in it,
which it lip and it was like a mirror. Yes, And he would laugh at me, laugh at me. I was on the shiny phone, which was like my prize possession, trying to walk to my Upper West Side apartment. Yeah, I had no they didn't past the men. Okay, I'm not sure. I'm shaking the flowers. That's how excited I am. The rain. The rain came and it came sideways, and I was like the phone. I was talking on the phone. I was like, oh my god, I've got to get into a door, stupid phone.
Yes, you know what I mean, like I have. And then like one time I was shopping. Oh, this was a bad memory.
I was shopping. I was wearing my bright pink puffer. Don't ask me why why were that pink puffer? You remember, I mean so bright but very cozy. Yes, you're the queen of cozy. I love to be. I'm always if you're looking to feel good, travel well, pack right among the things. Lady, what are my specialties? Is true? So I'm marrying my paint puffer.
I had gone downtown to go shopping. That's when I lived, the Upper West Side.
I had shopped. I had multiple bags, you know, very New York City. I was. It was a day off. I had no makeup on. I'm sure my hair was a mess.
Suddenly the rain comes and I'm like, no, I think I was wearing mug boots and I'm not prepared for the rain. It's cold too, right, soa I'm wearing the puffer and it got so wet that the bags gave out.
The things get that fall on the ground. That's really awful. Yeah, then I have to find the subway. I'm on the subway. I get on the subway, I'm holding the things. I'm like a wet rat, you know, and these young high school kids get on and there are a bunch of boys and they're like rah, and I'm like, oh god. And they look at me and they're like, that was like that girl from the Sex and the City. And the other guy's like, that's not her. She's ugly.
And I was like, okay, I don't know if this is good or bad, but it looked like a white rad, a wet rad.
I'm like, you know, it's probably a white rang. Whichever, both, it's probably a good thing because they're not gonna ask for autographic a picture right now. I don't think we were a picture time in history anyway.
Side note, I feel very much a whimp, you know, compared to you guys, even Cynthia especially, I mean, Kim is definitely more, you know, of the sensitive nature and and sometimes you know, she and I would.
Be like we're cold, yeah, and you would be like, you know, used to it, I know, and that's actually really good advice. But I always feel, and I felt at the time in the beginning, especially because the first season was so fast. You shot in three months.
I believe the whole season, and I was just like, I got.
To pretend like I'm a month we started. I know we are going to get to the bottom of this. I don't know. I bet I have my call sheets though, no, oh yeah, I'm sure.
Oh yeah, wow, incredible, incredible. Molly also has all the costume.
Molly's like a receptacle. She has like made so much great enough.
So back to me and the and the and the things I was holding clothes. I think for me, I felt so upset that they had tried to demote me during the pilot. You heard that story, and I didn't tell you guys, because I felt like that was like a weight and like also I didn't want them to be like, yeah, she doesn't fit in, Like that was my insecurity in the beginning, right, Yeah, I was like, yeah, we shouldn't fit in obviously, you know what I mean, Like in my mind, that was that was like a
possibility for a while. It went away, you know, and thank goodness. And also I did have that core belief in Charlotte, thank goodness.
And I feel like you guys did too. Yeah, I didn't feel like you were. I had a core belief in everything all of it right, Like in the Foursome, I did. Absolutely it had to be this way, right, you know that we all needed each other. Yes, even if you looked at it like to survive. Absolutely, it was like, well we were, we were very because weather personal. Yet it was like more like, well you have to have she needs me, I need her. We are sustaining,
we are our life sustaining. Absolutely, because these stories need to these stories need to bounce off of each other absolute order to be to have like relative and like touch on things a.
Bigger because that's that's one of the things I love. And one of the reasons for the podcast is the themes, which.
We literally were supposed to talk about, but there's too much.
The themes are so great, right, and I just want to touch on this for a second at least because when I'm watching you first of all, Also, let me just say everyone has better storylines and first season than I remember, including myself. Right, So with Carrie, I just want to talk about Carrie for a second, and Big in particular and the other men that are around Carrie because Okay, oh my god, Oh I've been dying to ask you this. Okay, two things, Oh my god, thank god,
I remembered number one. Do you remember this insane sex tape episode?
What? Okay, yes, it's possibly.
It's with Modalizers with Carrit with real mocked playing the modelizer.
So I remember him. I don't remember anything else. Wasn't he kind of a big deal? Did he become a big deal? Was he's on Suits? The original Suits? And then he quit acting and moved to Europe with his family. It's not awesome. I know they pulled him back in by doing suits la. Oh really, only a little bit he can out there? I don't think does anyone know? Is he anyway? I's talking about toxic ma masculinity in the world. I love him. Oh, I'm passionately begging him
to be on the podcast. What Why would he say? No? I think he's busy.
But you know what, we need him because we need some clarity on this one episode. Okay, I didn't really remember it, which I think is also interesting.
So you don't think it's material from her book.
I do think it's material from her book, and I just haven't had time to look. Maybe she just didn't want to mention, but you know how she was actually telling stories that she heard. She did say I do think that was a real story that was circulating, got it?
Old person?
So basically, Gabriel mocked incredibly handsome, he was an artist. You're with him at his art studio and he's like moving paint around a.
Camera a big open soho space very much so yeah, vague recollection, yes, And.
Then he says, but I need to show you my real work of art, at which point he pulls you into a different room and you're like, cool, Carrie, You've got your cigarette, you know, you're cool. And you go too this other room and there's all these old fashioned TVs set up in this weird tower and then he presses play or turns them all on by hand maybe, and it's him having sex with different models, unbeknownst to the models.
And you sit there, one at a time, one at a time. Yes, yes, he's having sex. This is his calling card. This is that I'm going to sleep with you and film it and not tell you. Yes.
Wow, But he tells you, Carrie, because you're cool, right, and he can confide to you. You're like one of the guys somehow times in the beginning, I know, and you very gamely sit there.
Okay, do you remember this no one remembers this. It's fascinating. Okay, I bet I didn't have to watch it. I'm sure you didn't have to watch Is there a shot that I am included in this imagery? I would have to go back and look.
I think there's a shot where you're included in the back of the TVs.
But we can't see what's on the TV. So I bet I didn't have to see it. And then at the end you're like, oh oh, and then your voiceover says something like I recognize them all from the pages of Vogue. Every major fragrance ad was represented on screen. It's horrifying, right, But then you're so calm and collected, and then you're like, I need a cigarette. Can you believe it? No, it's so.
Old school, you know what I'm saying in a bad way, right, And I'm dying to talk to Gabriel Monckton what he thought and felt film.
He doesn't want to talk about it. Maybe that might be why it's not his bright. It might be why he's busy. So you didn't know, you didn't know you were actually watching. To me, that's for sure. We had nothing, We had no clothing, We were being getting.
Oh, you know, when I talked to Molly, she this is when Molly knew every corner of Century City, sorry, century twenty one, and you won't ask her where the belts.
She lived down there.
And I remember going with them to Century twenty one, like we would have shopping.
Down would be like, there's four dresses down here, exactly, come on your lunch free, exactly exactly, it's a trip.
And people on the on the Great Vitadini down here, there were people on the they were like, what is century twenty one?
What are they talking about? I know, I know, I know.
So anyway, there are some things, some some really like question problematic, problematic. But for us at the time, I I remember thinking like, wow, this is racy for TV. Yeah, but I don't remember thinking this isn't true or anything like that.
We were just used to it. Yeah, you know, yeah, yeah, I think the difference between racy and problematic it might not have been even in our lexicon, like we wouldn't necessarily have believed it was if the culture in which we were living kind of existed in a way and we were just carrying on exactly, get on with your day, get on with your life. Somewhere else, and so today, of course we'd be it wouldn't it wouldn't be suggested
as a plot line. But if for some crazy reason it were like say a writer had dropped from a time machine and offered that up, all of us would say, you understand that, Carrie can't you can do this? Right? The response Kerry needs to then go call the police. Correct, Like there has to be an entirely different right response. Right, she can't be a gavalier and internally objecting, right, which you do.
Later tell Samantha not to go, but then Samantha goes because she wants to be filmed, and then he tells her he's not going to film her because she's not a model, and she says, do it anyway. And it's all very interesting. But the bigger, the bigger issue for me watching the first season is not these you know, occasionally questionable and liked about the twenty seven guys. You're definitely in like some very questionable locations and.
You're just like what and you're like I just needed to be kissed, Like it's all so very I just love it.
It's very exciting and also like odd, you know, to remember back then But the thing that the through line that is hard to watch for me and shocking really surprise me is the complete.
Wall that Big has.
Up just as a human, you know, not necessarily towards you, just in general, Like you take him to a party where he takes you to a party, and that guy who recurred, I can't remember his name right now, he is his party.
He had a cigar, he always had a cigar. Who's blonde guy? I can't remember that, the one that who's crossword puzzle?
I no, I think it's a different one than him, But in my mind they were also the same, but they were different blonde guys. We're friends of bigs and you go to this party and this one girl comes up and like kisses him right.
In front of you and is like you you still have my passport?
You're like, oh, international travel, Like you're just so you handle it, man, But inside you can see flitting across your face at all times, so many thoughts and feelings and thoughts and feelings. And then there's different times when you try to get Big to talk to you in all these different ways, and it's like infuriating to watch. I just want to shake Big, but I never thought about it at the time, because.
First of all, we just read a script.
I mean, I think that you were much more able to be objective and think about the overall arc and you know, things from a storytelling perspective back then. Even that I was, but I was just like, it is what it is. I'm team big, I believe you love No no, no, I didn't really there was no critical thought or whatever. And also, and I talked to Candas a little bit about it. It was interesting to hear her point of view. That's what our lives were like then. We were used to that as women being alive in
that time. Yeah, like there weren't some guys who were expressive and some guys who weren't, or some guys who are emostly intelligent, some guys who weren't. They were just guys and they were shut off. And so your thing was like like one time, you'd have those couple drinks and you'd go over and then you try to get them to talk.
To you, and you'd be like, Carrie, what's wrong with you? You'd be like, I'm just too much. You know, You're so not too much. You're amazing, you are You're so amazing. You're too good for Big, you are Look, she's surprised. I mean I've had so many guests also who are like, oh, yeah, she's too good for Big. And then I'm like, well, see, I tell us, I guess that made her happy. Like I don't know that, I don't know that Carrie's I know people have a lot of strong feelings about Carry.
I've come to understand that people have feelings about Carrie and that's perfectly all right, and there's nothing you can do about it. And it just means they love the show. It just means something has connected gotten a little bit with them. Yeah, And my feeling is that I believe Carrie is very smart. I believe Carrie is bright, and I believe that she is that she sees this man they meet. He asks her this question in the pilot, and it's like a harpoon. It's like this thing got
into her that is interesting. And I don't know that Big is as bright as Carrie. I actually, I really don't think he's as facile and as complicated a human being as she is. It's like, if you look at architecture that is beautiful, and there is a kind of simplicity to it. You are admiring of its stability, You are admiring of its place, that it can stand in its simplicity and people can look to it and it can provide a kind of reliable shelter, and it can
be a mark in a time and history. And I feel like Carrie looked at Big and she you know, inexplicable feelings. It is the human being that can't explain to her friends why somebody that could be beneath her might be beneath her is dictating the hunt, yes, and well put, I I don't think that that is. I can't place any judgment on it. I can't say he's a bad guy or vacuus or like shallow or not.
He is what he is. And it wasn't as if like there was an erosion, like water washed away like a whole shoreline, and finally he couldn't take it anymore, and like he's like all right, you know, like sure, I think he came to see what her absence in his life meant, and even if she wasn't the type. Because I try to remember this, and this is a very long explanation for or as Bridget ever always likes
to say, uh, short, story long. Sometimes you have to remember the age of the person, what year they were born, who raised them, and what year they were born. So look at Big. Yeah, so in early two thousands, Big was how old? I don't know, forty two okay, So in that means that he was born in nineteen sixty, right, or nineteen fifty eight? Sure, right, I'm going to go with a fifty eight Okay, So he was born in fifty eight. That means his dad was born in like
forty no, thirty thirty thirty eight? Yeah, right, totally different time. Yeah, who raised him? Persian era people? Correct? He chose everything the conventional way. He went to college, he got a good job, he worked in finance. He bought this kind of apartment. He dresses like this, He goes for a cigar like he is going to have to undo his entire cultural DNA to appreciate what Carrie is offering. And that's a really big deal. So why did she want
that so badly? Because that's what she liked. God, that's what she loved. He is who she loved. She liked the way he smelled, she liked the way he looked, She liked the way he owned the street. She liked the way he drove around the city. She liked the way he talked to her when they were good. She liked the way that she knew she was mysterious to him, that she was kind of like this, and I'm going to use the word exotic in the sense of it
was unknown to him. It was like a she was a source of total curiosity, but not what everybody else around him was doing. And he did that two times. He did the other thing two times. Two times he did the thing that his dad told him or would have told him to do. YEA, she is from a good family. Her hair does this, she can look good in a ship. She's this, she's this. She won't embarrass us, she won't be colorful at the wrong time. She won't reach for the same cocktail that the men are reaching for,
whatever it is culturally that is. And so I think Carrie pushed against that the whole time, like she was always trying to allow him the freedom to make the choice that he basically said he wanted to make from the minute they met. You feel that, I feel he the minute that they had that exchange, the minute that she said in his car the minute he said have you ever been in love? And she said nine things with one word or four words, and then he said,
abbs of fucking lutely. That's that's that's it. Yeah, it's like I think it's being like. It doesn't mean that she didn't hate him, that he didn't disappoint her, that she didn't think he was a monster, that he was far less a man, that she endowed him with far too many good qualities, you know, when he disappointed her. But they did end up together, They did end up being married because he wanted to be with her, right, It just took a while. Yeah, because he's he was baked,
you know, he was cooked. He was done, and he had to be yes, you know, yes, And she stuck around enough. It's not like she didn't go elsewhere. It's not like she didn't try. It's not like she made herself unavailable. Right, So I like this, This is helpful. You can't be that devastated by the loss of a person if they were are a mere version of who you always wish they'd be. Like when he passed spoil alert, I think everyone else, I think everyone knows my go ahead.
When he passed away, it was pretty tough on her, like, yeah, of course that's because they're not saying I'm just saying that because that was a really hard fought for love, no joke, you know. I just have to say one more thing. Yes, I want to say this. Don't make me know it, Christmas. I won't. I'm just going to try to close my eyes. I want to say it is the biggest honor of my life to work with you.
I love you so much. I could never ever ever have dreamt that we would do everything that we've done. And you are the best friend and a joy you are. Thank You's we have a what did you write in a card? It was so great you said it in a card You're bones. Yeah, bones. I was like, wow, I know. It's so hard to explain what it all has meant, and it's very special. It's the most special
professional thing that's ever happened to us. And it's funny because I don't know that we would ever have found each other in a million years, Like if you had not done this, and I had been in New York and you've been Los Angeles working there, and I was working in New York, like I was thinking about the other day when I was like when I was listening to the podcast, and I was like, oh, we would never have found each other, so true, you know, like
our lives just would not have intersected. And it's just it's amazing to have colleagues that you feel such intensity for and about, you know, like yes, such like very lively feelings, very lively feelings, and it's just amazing. And I agree your family, your parents, your kids, like a whole you know, like someone upsets you, someone said something wrong, you know, like you've been upset with me, like I've
been upset. Like I'm like over like absolutely about that though, absolutely, you know absolutely, it's a really big deal, and it's such it's such a it's a it's the privilege of a lifetime. It is a privilege of a lifetime. So proud of you. I'm so proud of you. I'm going to show you this one thing before we go, because it's very cool.
Look at what I got at the airport. Do you know what these titles have in common, Lord of.
The Flies, that these are all banded books?
Yeah, look at this, you guys, don't you think this is fantastic that they're selling this at the airport.
I'm going to give you that. Now, you keep this, give it to give it to she would love it. This was available at the airport. Yeah, isn't that great? At the at the Hudson Books. Wow right, yeah, that's incredible. Great. Next time you're here, we're talk about band of the Naval Library, the books that have just been banned the Naval Library. We're going to pass your talk about printur we can talk about books on our set. Yes, yeah, yes, yeah,
that's always so much. You've talked about that a little bit.
I have, and I'd love to talk about it because you are just a multi high in in so many beautiful ways.
Not really not like you, baby, I mean, sir Jessica. A joy, a joy to have you. I'm not going to cry again, okay.
But really, literally, we could talk to you for a year. I could have for a year an entire podcast just you and me.
What happens at work too. I know this life happens, it works actually actually, but it is a joy.
And there's still memories that that I know are hidden in there and I'm going to get them out.
I'm going to get them out. Because you have memories, then I have memories, we can combine them. And thank you so much. It's been a total pleasure. I was so looking forward to this. I know we've found the next year. Until next time,