And that's what you Really missed with Jenna.
And Kevin An iHeartRadio podcast.
Welcome to When That's What You Really miss podcast. Oh my god, it's Tony Award winner Ali Stroger.
How I never get tired of hearing that?
Nope, well never, I'll just that's her new name.
You know. There's going to be three of us in this conversation and three Tonys, but I have zero Tonys.
And Alie did Oklahoma, which she won the Tony four in Circle and Square in the same theater that Alex Newall did once on this Island the year before and one Best Revival which one me and the Tony as well. And so we are in Circle and Square in full Circle.
And she was in the revival String Wakening of Broadway and you were in the original String Wakning of Broadway.
Correct, all coming together and we were both ungry.
Yes, And she's just one of the kindest, most talented, creative bright lights in the world. And we love her. Yes, Ali Stroker, Hi, Allie, are you my god?
I was so excited when I got your message and I was love.
Your I had to have on too.
Thanks for having me and also congratulations on the next little baby.
Thank you and congratulations to you too, Yeah.
You, thank you.
How's being a mama? How does it feel?
I love it? Like I am obsessed with it.
How old is your bibe?
He's twenty one months? Next?
Oh really?
Yeah?
We were like pretty close then Emma's twenty five or twenty six months?
I think, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, So you know that the season it's intense, really intense. But I love it like more than anything. It's been special. I do want to like work a little bit now. I was so ready for the first year. I was like, I can't miss anything, I know, so, like you know, like I had so much FOMO on both ends, and so now it was this fall ready you will play and just get back into it a little bit. But yeah, it's been so so good. How are you guys? Good?
Same old ship over here?
Yeah, how's la?
That's fine. It's a weird TI like job wise.
I don't know if you guys feel this way, but like I feel like the industry has like been shaken up, and like the dust has not quite settled yet strikes and like the pandemic, and like the way that everything has changed with streaming, and I just feel like it's still a bit in transition, like I.
Don't know, yes, yes, I agree, it's like everything is pulled apart. We don't know exactly the new mold yet. Yeah, but it does feel like it feels like because you don't have to be in the city or you don't have to be in la people. Part of the adjustment outside of like the things we can't control, like the
structures of anything, is like the work life balance. So being able to live forty five minutes outside of the city and like not feel guilty about it and like or feeling you're missing anything because like you can do that and I have a family and yeah, yeah, I like that.
And it also is starting to feel good that it feels like our generation is now becoming like the bosses and like creating content and writing, directing, and it's like, yeah, for me, it's what a relief, Like yes, yes, now they're like making decisions versus like this other generation of art that were amazing but came from a different world. So that's something that I am like grateful for and like feeling like, oh good, it's it's us. It's like our time now.
Yeah hopefully, Yeah, you know, especially when you like we've all been around for a little bit, and so we're seeing our friends get opportunities and friends want to work with friends, and like if we're in a position to help people, like oh, this person's so talented, let's work with them. And exactly right what you said, I think.
Yeah, it feels like it's like finally it's like our voices, you know, and like I feel that same way. It's like my friends are now like casting and hiring and wanting me to be a part of creating something. And it doesn't feel so much. And I know this also comes with like coming into your own and like maturing, but it doesn't feel like I have to prove myself, like.
Right, Tony doesn't hurt either.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean those those opportunities are It's it feels different now.
It doesn't feel as much like, oh God, like will I ever work again. There's like a little bit more.
Trust in what's coming, what's next, and and people do you feel that On the other end, Two, it's like people trust in you where they come to you like we know you can do this.
So yes, there's that confidence that we often don't get, you know.
On that side of it, I always thought after I did an episode of Glee, I was like, oh, like I'm set, like the doors now will fly open and everything will be so easy, And then like nothing happened, and what like how could this not? You know? I always look like Glee was like the magic wand this thing that was like gonna just like change my career, and it did in so many ways. But I also feel like those changes come.
Slowly, yeah, like incrementally.
Yeah, it's not just like one wave.
It's yeah, that's not obvious.
Years later I hear from somebody, or four years from now, I'm getting a call from someone who knew someone who did the Glee Project, you know what I mean. Like, there's all different ways in which it's like affected and changed my life, and in none of the ways that I thought it would.
Semial Glee, Yes, because you did. We've talked to a lot of the first Glee Project season one Gleed Project folks. Yes, you had a different like Glee Project Season two was quite different than season one. Yes, how did you even get into that? How did you like, how did you hear about it? Like what was your life going into that?
So I graduated from NYU in two thousand and nine, and that's when I feel like we like exploded. Yes, And I was so excited because I saw your character Kevin, and I was like, oh my god, I don't have to make this up. Like this is a world I could fit into. And so I told my parents I wanted to move to LA and they were like what, And I was like, I want to go after this,
like I want to be ugly. And at the time, like I was young, and I even I was like, they shoot it there, it's where it's happening, Like I'm going to go out there for pilot season. I wasn't super green, like I knew that, yeah, you know, I knew that you had audition and it was like a super super big deal show. But I was like I couldn't. I was having trouble getting auditions in New York and sort of looked at theater as like sort of an older art and TV was kind of maybe a world
that I would fit into. So I go out for pilot season and I go into U d K and Uh, I don't meet with Robert, but Robert finds out I'm in the office and asks me to come in to his office and sing on tape for Ryan, and I was.
Like, now, did you go into UdK for a Glee audition or did you go in for some general audition or like a general general okay to like meet them?
Yes, wow. So Robert's like Ryan needs to meet you. So I sing Here's where I Stand, which is like this song from Camp Amazing that I sang for my YU showcase. And I was like this is it, Like I'm gonna get to go in for the show. And then I hear nothing for like three years until the Glee Project was like being talked about and advertised on Facebook and I was like what is this? Like what is this? And it's not on Fox, It's on Oxygen, Like what is this? And then I'm like, oh, it's
reality TV show. I don't want to do reality I want to be like an actor. I don't want to reality TV show. I was like total ego, like I can't do that. And then I was like I like it over yourself, Like you can't even get an audition right now, like put yourself on tape. So I put myself on tape. And at the time it was like this for the Glee Project, it was like this website that was like kind of like MySpace. And this was even before like the like culture happened.
Yeah, but so.
If you submitted a video, people could star it. And I submitted a video singing true Colors, and the next morning it had like twelve hundred stars.
Wow.
And I was like, oh my god, this is so cool, you know, like before yes, And so I was like, oh, maybe i'll hear back. And I did have an agent at the time, and so I don't hear anything for a while, and I end up getting cast in Spelling Bee at paper Mill Playhouse. So I go back to New Jersey and my agents call and they're like, they want you to come in for the final callbacks for the Glee Project. And I was like, but I'm doing the show, like I can't. I can't miss it. And
I take the back. I don't think it was tech. I think like we were in the run or it's like opening night or something like that. As a better person, like you don't miss right. So I was like, I can't do it, Like I can't do I can't go to the callbacks for season one. So I was like, well, there goes my opportunity to be Ungly Project or Glee oh my god.
And then of course, though I mean the amount of time, right, it pours and it comes down to like the same day, like I've been trying to get work for years, I'm doing this play and now.
Glee always always like why is this not lining up?
Could have been any other time in the last always happens.
So then I go back to La after spelling Bee, and I like, am really in a not good place, Like I'm in a dark place. I'm like, what am I gonna do? Like what am I doing out here? Like I think I even did one of those things where you like paid to be in a play like Wow.
It was like a low point and I was just feeling and I had been in like some bad relationships, like was not thriving, And so I decided to come back to New York and I moved in like to Midtown, and I was like doing well again, and they were like they called and they were like, we want you to come to the final callbacks in New York first, and so I did and don't where you can cut the line, you know, at the time, sort of like the open calls in New York around the block, and
they were filming all that you know. And then I find out I'm going to the final callbacks in La and I go and that's when I like meet everyone, Like I met Lily at the final callbacks, I met Danny. That was the first time we met. I met people that didn't end up being on the show that now are on Broadway. Like it was sort of the beginning of this era, like my Glee era season, and it
went really well. And then I got a call, like right before Thanksgiving that I was going to be cast on the show, and they filmed that again, and and that was it. And then and then not long after we moved into the house stop.
A strong word, yeah.
Exactly, And they took away our phones, they took away our books, they took away our music because they didn't want you to be like influenced, and like I had no contact with my family.
Oh my god, how long was that? How long were you on the show for?
I was on the show for ten weeks, Oh my long, Yeah, which is why I feel so close to everybody beforse, they were the only people I was in contact with. I had a lot of fun, like, oh god, show, I had a really positive experience, and I was also just a little bit older, like I was out of college at this point, so I was sort of like taken with like the experience of making a reality show. I was like, this is hilarious, like another room of producers like trying to figure out how to like string
this story together and create a drama. And I got to really kind of share my story the way that I wanted to. So that was something I was very conscious of that, like being in a chair, being in a wheelchair, people in the industry might make assumptions about me and what I could do, and Patrick was this amazing platform to like tell my version of who I am and what I do. And then Glee was sort
of the perfect genre for me. It was like musical theater meets pop meets like the underdog meets like overcoming things and this is perfect, Like this I fit into this. So then I'm the final I'm in the final three, Like I'm in the final episode and I don't win.
Now did you think you were like you were gonna win? Like was there? Where were you at? Where was your head?
At that point?
I thought I could win. However, I knew that the show had to be like m structured in a certain way that like the underdog would win, which in the end was very funny because Blake won, like was not exactly the underdog all the way through and in the industry, isn't really like an underdog. No, but it was a different time, like the world has changed a lot, so this narrative of like who's the underdog, like who should
win this show? They also Glee was super established. They needed certain kinds of characters on that on your guys scripted show.
Yeah, it wasn't just a reality show. It was also we have to fill these slots that we know we are going to carry up.
And the other part of it was that they didn't air this because they did this on the first season. But the first season they were like they gave people spots on the show that didn't win, and our season
they did not air that. So they told Eileen and I that we were going to be on the show, but they didn't air that on the Glee Project, and they told us they were not going to which was scary because it was like, well, now there's no accountability, they don't have to totally and that interesting to Eileen. She ended up not being on the show.
Wow, because I remember running into her, like out at Starbucks or something, and she was like, I was told I was going to be on.
I was like, ah, super disappointed.
I mean, of course breaking yes.
But they called me not long after the final episode aired and they were like, Okay, we're going to have you coming on for the Valentine's Day episode and immediately I was like, oh, they're going to pair me up with Kevin and like I didn't know exactly what my story would be, but Ryan on the Glee project was always like, you're like sassy, You're like Dolly Parton, but like also like a cheerleader bitch. And I was like, Okay, I'm getting like what you might write for me.
That's fun.
So that's kind of how my Glee journey went until then. I was on the show and it was just a dream come true. Like it was it was what I wanted and uh, it happened, and it was in so many ways you like dream about it in your head,
like what would you like to be on set? And it was just better because in so many ways I already of felt like a part of your guys family and everyone was really nice to me, and I was really you know, I was really observant and watching like how people like were acting and how people and who were the leaders in the cast. And obviously you two were like just so genuine and real and and kind to everybody who was, you know, not a regular on
the show. And I just loved sort of seeing the machine right right and Jenna you talking to you and you were like, I am so tired, like you had been in rehearsal, like all night you were shooting yet all day, yes, and you know it was like you guys were working so hard and it was just really beautiful to get to be a part of it.
Aw, that's very good to hear.
Yeah, you never know sometimes.
Every time like somebody because we were we I especially that episode, we just watched it and we just like I do we just by the way.
Very you were funny, so very funny, so good, very funny.
Now knowing the backstory of you saw the show like well, I'm gonna I gotta get on that show, and then you did. You got on the damn show and you didn't miss. Everything that came out of your mouth was so funny.
So I was.
Of course, I was also like even like the thing, even though I had been doing it for four years at that point, like the things of like us being in bed together that was new and like me me working with like someone who was actually in a chair. I was also like, I feel like the fraud and is this okay?
I don't know, I felt about that.
I felt self conscious of it. I was like, like, are you okay with this? How is this from your end? Like yes, yes, So there was a lot of all but obviously you're like the kindest, sweetest and most creative person, and so you are. You do have like eyes everywhere, you are really noticing everything all the time and taking all that in and being around you also someone who was on the show for a long time, you made
me feel calmer too. So I felt very lucky to be able to work with you because you're just a beast, your powerhouse.
Thank you so much for saying that. I really that means so much. Kevin and I you know, I admired all of you so much, right, like what you created, Like it's one thing you know, to write a show, but it's the people who make the show. And like
there was magic. There was magic with you guys, Like there was a magical thing that happened it was an opportunity that I dreamt about, that I wanted, and I think arriving at it and getting to see what it really took to make that show, it set the tone for me of like, oh, my dreams and my goals, Like that's not just like an instant thing that happens. It's years and years and years of hard work and then once you arrive there, like you have to give
a hundred percent of you. And that is kind of what started sort of my journey to like really finding the things that I was very excited about working on, like Spring Awakening, Deaf West and then making my Broadway debut and you know Spring Awakening, Kevin, you know like a lot about that journey. I'm sure you do too at this point, Jenna. But like it was like two and a half years in LA before were it transferred.
And you know the first time we did it, we were getting paid like forty bucks a week, and like we're seeing at a church. It wasn't like some fancy, flashy opportunity, but it was something really special totally.
You guys are grinding it out.
Skid row, Yes, Oh my gosh, Dna skid row. Okay, So that was that was kind of again another situation where I was like, this is there's something magical here.
What a valuable lesson? Though I think it seems like when you see people, it often seems like, oh, they're an overnight success, and sometimes they are. Sometimes that happens, but it's very very rare. You just haven't seen no
before you showing up on Glee. People don't know it's a three year process, or they go see Spring Awakening on Broadway and like, no, that's been a two and a half year process starting down for forty dollars a week, or like Austin was living in his car, like he moved to la where you being able to appreciate the work itself, the camaraderie, the experience, and being able to also then appreciate the journey it takes is such an important lesson, yep, because people don't know about that or
they forget that and they only see the success of it. And it's like, if you don't enjoy the other part of it, you will not enjoy doing this. And so it sounds like you really learned how to find the joy in each and every day of just doing sort of the very unglamorous parts of the job.
Yeah.
I mean I came up as a theater kid. So the process of theater was the thing that I fell in love with because it wasn't just like get on stage and be the star. It was like you get this family and this community and these best friends, and like you're getting to sing and dance every day and it's really hard and there's drama, and like I loved that. Yeah,
that to me was just heaven. And I think growing up with a disability and being in a wheelchair and having that outlet, like it wasn't just something I loved, like I needed it to survive. It was how I was able to express myself. And I was feeling so many like intense things about being so different right and wanting as a teenager to be to fit in so badly.
I mean, I'm just curious because as like a woman of color, which is not even It's like I was told theater with you know, this industry was going to be hard, that it was going to be harder for me than a lot of other people, and that you know, maybe I shouldn't pursue it because I probably wouldn't succeed.
I'm curious for you as you said, you grew up with the disability in theatre, was your outlet, Like what were people telling you or what was kind of the methods that you were getting as you were brought up in this industry and then wanting to pursue it.
I I always could sing, which was helpful because it kind of opened the door for me. But as far as like logistically how I was going to do it, people were terrified. They had no idea what to do with me. They didn't know how to stage me, they didn't know how to choreograph for me. They didn't know like in certain buildings, like how I would get around, but I would sit there and sing and like people would cry. And I think for like a lot of reasons as an adult, I can like unpack and see.
But at the time, like was really like it was something that I felt like gave me power my voice, Like nobody could take that right right, nobody could say, like, you know, she's you know, like I knew that my voice, and it was where I didn't feel limited. It wasn't like I had to figure out the stairs and the
lifts like when I sang. Like when I sang, I was just like free yeah, and so you know, people were really afraid, and thank goodness, my parents were always like we'll make it work, We'll make it happen, don't worry about it. Like my dad, I remember him carrying me on to stages like in the performances wow, and
like wow. My mom would drive me into the city and like sit there and rehur like I'd be in I'd rehearse for things, and my mom would just like sit there and be there and make sure like if there was any sort of like accessibility issues, like she was right there. So they didn't have to like take
it on themselves. And I just felt like an enormous amount of support from the people I trusted the most, which were my parents, and they were like, Alie, you can do anything like if they and they really didn't want me to hear some of the stuff. But then when I got to college, yeah, it got a little
more wild because they couldn't protect me. And I went to Nyu Tish and Yu Tish had never had a student like the drama department had never had a student in a chair, and so it was clumsy at the beginning, Like they sat me down and they were like, we don't want you to take dance class, like we want you to sit on the side and take notes. And you know, this was two thousand and five, It's not
like this was like right the seventy recently. And I remember like this thing clicking in of like these people are terrified they trust me, and the thing I've always been good at my whole life is making people feel good. So I was like, listen, let's just keep talking about this. I really want to take dance class. I will sit on the side in the beginning, but like, let's revisit this, like, let's talk about this again, because like I think I
can do this. And it was the best lesson of my four years at NYU because I learned that no one can do this for me. I'm going to have to figure this out and I'm going to have to get creative and for dance, like I had to learn how to translate on the spot for myself, like in a chair, and I couldn't rely on anybody giving me like ideas, and totally it was an opportunity to get really creative, and my desire to be a part of it was so strong that there was no part of
me that was going to give up or quit. And that's how I feel about my career, and like how I felt about being on Broadway. I was like, I don't know when this is going to happen, but it's gonna happen. Like even if I'm sixty years old and I'm playing a grandma on stage, like I will be on Broadway one day.
Yeah.
And I think that like people can feel that somewhere that like, oh, she's not she's not going anywhere. Yeah, And I just I was like, let's get creative. It's what I've had to do my entire life, everything from like gym class in kindergarten to like sleep overs and like trips to the beach in fifth grade and like high school, like getting cast in a show where there's a tap number, like let's go, Like I don't care
if you guys don't have the answers. I don't, but I was raised to just like make it up.
That's big. Anyway, everyone feels like they have to know what to do, Like it's okay to not know. It's a collaboration and it's like your game, then figure it out.
But in college, you know, I remember we did these casting director workshops at the end of senior year, like oh meat cat some drittors and I auditioned for this one and he's like, you know, this is going to be really difficult for you. And I remember leaving like being so fired up. Welcome to my life. Right, life is hard, right, I don't do easy like when you're in a chair, Like you don't get weekends off. Right, this is my this is my every day. I don't
know life without challenges. So like the industry, I was like.
Yeah, this is hard for.
Exactly. And I also like wanted to like come in and like sing well and look good. Like I was super conscious that I wanted to be like competitive. I was like I have to be as good as everybody else and then better in some way.
Which you were and you are.
Yeah that's what I wanted.
I wanted that, and like I was super aware of what it was going to take. And and that's part of why I want to be on Glee because it was like this super like respected and like it was the most famous show for you know, like it was such a big deal and I was like, if I can do that, it will give me some kind of reputation. And Ryan Murphy trusts me maybe other and writers and people will direct me or direct and want to want to work with me.
That's right.
All I wanted. I didn't go after I never thought I was going to win Tony Award. I just wanted to be able to work in the highest level of our industry, right.
And the important thing is you have to to an extent know that there is a possibility of it happening seeing yourself in some way, and so Ryan having a show that checked off a lot of boxers, for a lot of different groups that never seen each other, seeing themselves on network television then gives those people permission to be like, oh, I mean you're living proof of that, of like, oh I can do this because that that guy sees it, he sees me, and so nobody else does.
Then you smart smart business lady.
Yeah, thanks, thank you. I just I've always loved it, So I just like, yeah, I needed it.
You have to. You have to love it. So you got on Glee, you got you, you did the three year hard work manifestation, got on the show, and then you said at the beginning of this that you thought it was going to open all these doors, and it like kind of did in a lot of ways. But then it also didn't so talk about that.
Yeah, I thought that like being on Glee was going to open up like more TV opportunitary, right, and that like it would just get easier because it was really hard to get an audition totally, and you know, there were very few people with disabilities working in the industry.
Very yeah you could name them, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and like still and so I was like, this is this is my like ticket And then when that didn't happen, I was like, Okay, I was doing like all these other creative things, and the way that I live my life is like I really trust timing and like the border of things. So I did Glee, and I was in a relationship with Danny, and that was a very new experience and I had met them through this experience and I was really trusting all of that.
And then I had moved back to LA again and was doing this non for profit call Be More Heroic, where we were touring around the country and doing these anti bullying, pro love, pro compassion campaign shows at high schools, and it felt like I was really like making a difference and like doing something positive with the thing that I love to do most and then I started working with new agents and the first audition that they got for me was this production of Spring Awakening with Deaf West,
and it felt like kind of perfectly on brand, like it was a musical and it was with a company that worked with people with disabilities, and it was with Michael Arden, and I was like, this sounds cool. Let me audition. And then when I auditioned and got called back and had to learn sign language and sing at the same time, there was this moment where like I felt so emotional, like I have to do this, like expressing yourself on stage with sign language. It was something
I needed to do while I sang. It was like, oh, these are the ways I can express myself.
Wow.
And you know I have my hands, like I can't take tap dance, but I can sign. Yeah. So when I got involved with that project, I didn't think it was going to be on Broadway, but it was something that was so creatively fulfilling it didn't matter if it had that commercial, sparkly thing on it yet totally. In fact, I didn't know, you know, like I said, like I didn't know if it was going to be that.
I felt like I.
Knew I had to do it, and the people involved were like electric. Yeah, you know, I was meeting all these new people and like Austin Leading, it was like super wild and he was just like just electric, you know. And all of the deaf actors and actresses that I was meeting, they were all so passionate and so good. And then like the people that Michael cast that we're hearing were just so interesting and not like you're like
typical commercial Broadway company. They were just like different. And rehearsing that show and doing that show was like it was heaven. It was just like the best thing I had ever done and to this day is still my favorite show I've ever done.
Oh wow, Oh yeah, I mean it's so special.
I feel like, talk to anybody who was a part of that, and it's very similar Centers.
Yes, definitely, it's super something was happening. It's like there was like a like a like a power thing that connected and you see so many of those people and like what they're doing now.
It was like mm hm whoa.
Yeah for sure.
And the fact that we went to Broadway, and you know, I remember getting this email that we were going to go to Broadway and I was in South Africa at the time teaching, and I like saw the email and I went into the office and I started sobbing, and I was like, I'm going to be on Broadway, Like my dream is coming through. I'm going to be on Broadway. And I like hugged my friend and I went back into the classroom and the kids were like, miss Ali, why are you crying? And I was like, like, my
dream is going to come true. I'm going to be on Broadway. And they like raised their hand, They're like, miss Ali, what's Broadway?
Oh my god?
And I was like, oh my god.
That's so like right, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So important to me, Like, but there's so many people like that don't even know what this is. This is my heaven, this is my magic, and it's so special to share with them like what it was. And and you know, I think that I I do like I carry like this little piece of Mike Lee experience into every single thing that I do, and that is this like importance of like being you and like being yourself because it was the first time that I felt like being in a chair and being different was an advantage.
And I carry that into every single thing that I do. That it's not something that takes it doesn't take anything away from me. It enhances me, it makes me better.
And that I think is exactly what the show's message was, or at least what I took from it and what you guys brought to it, that like, you don't need to be anyone but yourself and that is enough, and that is that is important for a character, for your work, for your everything, Like like Kevin, your character, like was a moment of like, oh, like Artie is like someone that people want to know about and someone can care about and someone that someone could un love with. Like
that was so important to me. And you know, when I found out you were in a chair, like there was a part of me that was devastated because I was so scared that that we weren't ready to see disability as it is in real life, that like my body wouldn't be enough or like digestible for mass audiences. And there was this narrative in my head that disability like it has to be like diet disability or like light disability, disability totally. And I was so scared, like
would they cast me on the show? And everywhere I went, you guys, people were like you could be on Glee, you could be Artie's girlfriend. I know, I know. I don't tell me about it, I know. But the confidence that I took from not just being on the show but being a fan of the show has affected my life in every possible way, everything from being on Broadway, everything from having relationships and getting married and having a child. Like Glee was such a huge deal for me.
Wow, Wow, it was so important wild It's really crazy.
Yeah, I feel like this has been the gospel according to Ali.
Yeah, great, it was like spiritual connection, well for.
Somebody else who I don't think a lot of people know this that you. You saw it and were like that's that could be mine, you know, and you took ownership and you were like I'm just gonna go get.
It well and to be the person who's actually in a chair and to actually be the real and go.
Through all the journey of the insecurity of it all, like would they cast me? Would I can I be a part of it? Even seeing somebody in a chair on TV like that, So then getting there and being like such an integral part, like you were one hundred and ten percent, like we said, like you took no prisoners on your on the episode, and I'm like, I wish there was more. I wish you got to spend we got to spend more time with you, and I
wish you had to be on the show more. But just that episode was such an impactful part of your journey. It was it was every you know.
Also, I remember am the Glee Project thanking Ryan. So something that I was aware of was that there was and Kevin, you obviously were aware of this too, like that the disabled community was upset obviously, Like I felt something when I found out that already you know, Kevin that you ablebodied, but I understandable. It's like but I said to Ryan, I was like, I have to thank you for writing this character, because this character has changed
my life and it will change the business. And it did in so many ways, Like there are there is more and more disabled representation on television and across the board in film and TV and on stage every single year, and like that character is so important to people, and you are, Kevin, like you did that with Grace. You did that with Grace.
Yes, well, I felt for all of those reasons, very I felt an enormous sense of responsibility obviously, like this is not my group, Like, I can't be like I'm the spokesperson now because that is a living experience that I have not had. And so and like when the episode, the first episode of Jenna and I had that was
like both of our biggest storylines at that point. Because of that episode, we started going to all these events and I started meeting and obviously that week that was the first time there was sort of negative press about already being played by me, which I completely understood, but I was like, I don't know what to do about this. Yeah,
I don't know. Like it also wasn't the first time me or my friends had auditioned for characters and chairs like that was something like and we were very ignorant and naive about it because we had no idea and
I just reet. I remember one night meeting a group of parents who told me about their little kids who were in chairs watching the show and then becoming obsessed with Artie, and I was like, Okay, I was like, this isn't perfect, but it's doing what I think, you know, Ryan Brad and Ian wanted it to do, in the sense that kids are seeing themselves and it's not necessarily obviously about who's playing it At this moment, it's just about Artie and seeing this kid on TV that looks like.
Them and like dances and sings.
Yeah.
That was huge for me too, because I was like he's dancing, like.
He's like everybody else, right, and like it looks good, not awkward, it looks awesome, and like, no, you did such a great job.
That was also the first say rehearsals acts, like, so you figure out what you can do? I'm like, you did.
I mean to figure it out, yeah, which was a challenge, but like, yeah, but I think you know, you just figure it out. Yeah, it is that hard to figure out in terms of like hearing you talk about going to.
Tish and then you can't take dance class. It seems crazy because it's like you can like what are you talking about? How can I not be part of dance class? Of course I can still dance.
Yeah, And that's always been so important to me, Like getting the opportunity to physically express myself. Yeah, because I have a lot to express and physically I just have a different vocabulary than you. Right, It's like allowing somebody it's like telling somebody they can't speak if they don't speak your language. Right, wait a minute. Everyone deserves the chance to express themselves. And I just was excited, you know. I was excited to like figure it out and find a way.
Yeah, and because it's obviously very doable and it's like.
Yeah, yeah, well that's their issue, not yours, you know, yeah.
Right, exactly exactly, And I really did. I'm jumping around a little bit. But when I got the episode of I Do I read it, I was so nervous about like this sort of storyline about like you know, like Betty and Already like go into a hotel room together. And I was like, Okay, what are they trying to say, Like, oh,
they're going to go like sleep with each other. And then like that is loaded, which is like they weren't gonna unpack that on the show, right, But anybody who's in a chair knows that, right, And I thought it was like very tasteful that we're just like in bed together. But like there was a part of me that was like for a teenager in a chair, like there's so much there, so much there.
Yeah, So I was like, okay, like are we to We're not going to talk about it because like the theater where like we had to like spend a week from.
This scene, right, I would have been nice though, oh for sure.
But I did appreciate the show always went there. Yeah, Like they didn't pull back, and I appreciated that. Yeah, And I appreciated that they just created the representation that these two people in a wheelchair, like are gonna go in to this hotel room and like whether they had sex or they like hooked up or whatever it was, we're just gonna put it on TV.
Yeah, they're just horning them, Yeah exactly.
But there is there was a part of me afterwards that was like, I feel like people in chairs deserve to like have like, you know a little bit more of like an unpacking of what that is. Yeah, because they was also like at a time like I was in you know, like in my twenties, and like there was a lot that I felt about disability and sexuality and what that meant for me and what assumptions I was constantly being fed and asked about, like can you
have sex? Like how does that work? And like getting so hurt a few years earlier by like guys that I would go out on dates with that were just like curious, like they weren't like actually interested in me, but just like kind of curious about like sleeping with a girl in a wheelchair, and right, always curiosity, and so there was a part of me that was like I wish they like had gone a little bit further
with that. Yeah, but right, it was cool to be like in an episode and it's like, oh, you get to sleep with one of them, Like that's kind of a cool like just diving right in and like that that can exist. Yeah, Again, like the representation was like, yeah, let's do this.
It also felt like to me that it was very important for your character to have this power or like you talk about you had that session with the casting director where like this is going to be hard for you where you're sort of being talked down to and like pitied. But I always felt like Ryan always wrote all these characters to like no, no, no, I have the power.
I'm going to do what I want to do, you know, And it felt like you showed up on that episode and every single moment you were on screen, you're like, no, no, I'm doing whatever I want. Yeah, and nothing is going to affect that.
Yeah.
And like the fact that she was a cheerleader, Yes, like I liked that. I liked that she could do this cheerleader because like in the world of Glee, like that was power. Yeah, right right with insecurities.
We always ask people at the end who are involved in the show, what is the feeling that Glee leaves you with?
Oh, great question. I think Lee changed the world. To be a part of that feels really special. I was a fan of the show before I was on the show, and it changed me. It changed my life. The opportunity, but the storylines and the representation like changed my life. So the feeling is that Glee had this unbelievable impact on me, and it makes me smile because for me, like musical theater is my favorite genre and so they get to watch that like on TV with people that
I identified with. Was it was just it shook my world and it changed everything and it really really catapulted my career. I think in so many ways. So grateful. I mean that's sort of like, you know, not that interesting, but it's very interesting, but also just like emotional too that so many things happened for me around the show, whether it was the Glee project, like different kinds of relationships that I had, getting to be on the show, meeting and getting to know you guys, and then having
many of you as friends. It really was just such a highlight of my life in my career.
Well, the feeling is very mutual. We like to claim you as much as possible on that Tony stage. Mike, that's the first Glee Acting Tony Award.
That's right, right, Thank you guys, Thank you so so much.
I'm so happy you do this.
Oh yeah, but but it's what's so nice that people like you come on and like open yourselves up and share all these experiences, and it's so nice to hear because as you experience on that set, when you're in it, you're just like, I'm just tired. You're not necessarily getting to soak up every moment maybe like you should. And it's unbelievable, and I think we're so grateful that we get to hear everybody else's perspectives of this and to know what it meant to you means a lot to us.
And I think people listening will enjoy it because it means a lot to them. And just thank you for taking the time to come on and share that and just you're love you so much. I feel like we're all like attached for life.
Yeah. I love you, guys. I'd love to do something again with you and do it if you're ever like making stuff and the same for me, Like you know, it's so fun to like know you and to figure out ways that we can create something else together. Yes, yes, so more, let's just say more.
I also love all the ways in which we're connected. There's spring awakening and then there's Austin and it's just we're all, yes, intertwined.
And Jenna, we're doing this mom thing.
We're doing it.
We're in the mom cloud, crushing it. And there's two people I would trust with raising children. It would be you two like you to have all the kids.
Thank you very very much, thank you, congrats Sally, congrats.
I really appreciate you, guys.
I love you.
Thank you so much for coming on here.
Thank you to you soon.
Yes please, thanks Sally, have a great day, guys, Thank you too.
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