Hot Scoop w/ Marc Malkin

And That's what You Really Missed with Jenna.

And Kevin an iHeartRadio podcast.

Welcome to and That's What You Really Missed podcast.

I'm Jenna and I'm Kevin.

Still tell me about today.

Well, when you and I first talked about this, we talked about the different doing the podcast, what kind of guests we could have on the show right, and we wanted to make sure we got the people from all the different sides of this that were involved in it.

He was a familiar face on the Red Carpets too when we would go and see him, and obviously.

We talk about all this, so we're just gonna let you listen. But he really was.

It was very comforting to see him there at these events that can feel so kind of you, kind of like go on autopilot a little bit, and it was nice to see like a friend and yeah, I'm really excited for this conversation.

Enjoyed Mark Malkin, Mark Malcoln, thank you so much for joining us.

Oh my gosh, I'm getting emotional.

It is so good to see and hear you.

Are you?

You know, I like little hair on my arms standing up and preparing for this, like, you know, doing google searches. Mark Malkin, Glee, Youngline, and the stories that were coming up that I forgot about.

I mean, I would, says Elton John if he wanted to be on Glee.

Yeah, really, he said he wanted to, but no.

One asked him to.

Oh no, we dropped the ball on that one.

I'm trying to remember where on earth was I sitting down with.

It was a weird time, Mark, it was a weird time for all of us.

Do you know how many stories were blah blah blah, would love to be on Glee, blah blah blah, love to if anyone could sing, I asked him anyway, Sorry, I know.

So when you thought about coming back to do this podcast, a really important thing for us was to be able to talk to people, yes, that worked on the show every single day, but also the people who we saw the most outside of that set, which the first person

So this is you can come down here and get emotional, like what is with your bob?

Definitely, No, this is definitely a bit of therapy. There's laughter, there's crying, there's everything, all of it.

Yeah, Okay, what do you want to know?

I want to know. I want to know it all.

But I want to know when you first Do you remember when you first saw the pilot of the show.

Yes, I still.

Have the DVD on the pilot, which I think I sent it Kevin because I think I found it on my I posted it once on my Instagram.

I literally still have that DVD.

Not that I have a DVD fire, but I mean, and I remember Chris Alexander, who is the publicist. Maybe he called me or sent me an email. Was there an email back then, I don't know.

Yes, with the Dinosaur, yeah exactly.

I sat in my office.

I was at the News of the time online and I sat in my office and I bawled watching it. I was by myself, and I cried. I literally cried. I kept watching Don't Stop Believing, over and oh, even now before I got on with you guys, I listened to it again, just hearing those first notes, and I remember going to everyone at egoing this is this show is going to be huge, you know, and then you know, as a journalist, it's like it's going to be huge just because I'm a gay guy and I love.

The excomater and clean. But I was, I know, this was.

You know, it was the life that I wanted to live when I was in high school. And it was you know, it's the cliche. We had never seen anything anything like it. There was all these you know, new actors obviously, you know, there were some that had some you know background that kind of.

Knew you know what. No, I didn't know anybody.

Why am I anybody was? No, I didn't, And I was like, we've got to get on it. We've got to get on the show. And like you know, Kevin said earlier, then it was like I was going to send visits before you guys even premiered. Yeah, which is wild when I think, like I was like, especially when Leah got funny Girl, I was like I was on set when she sang, don'ts wow some theater I think in the Valley, maybe Glendale, Burbank.

Yeah, well we had we had the theater in Long Beache, but no, you're right, it was.

Yes, yeah, and sitting on the steps, and I remember doing interview with the two of you. I probably have.

I mean, if I went through my storage, I have the files Corey and everyone.

So when you would normally get sent DVDs of new shows coming out and things like this, was this. I'm sure you got some things all the time by networks network publicists doing their job. Here's the new thing we're premiering. Like what is given to you? Are you instructed like this? We're really behind this? Do they believe in everything you get sent there like this is our new hottest thing, blah blah blah blah blah, and you do with it

The buzz for Glee was starting way before we saw anything.

You know, Fox was on it.

They knew this was something special, so we were being told about the show. I can't I don't remember the first time.

I was told about the show, but there was definitely like, couldn't wait to the pilot.

Wouldn't wait until they could show me the plight, right, so the pilot, because then there would be like these secret screenings, certain episodes that I would go to Fox and would be like five mi us in a room.

But that was that was later really oh yeah yeah, and.

It'd be like embargoed and you couldn't talk about it, but they'd want us to see it for when it write about it or just get the excitement and.

Get you know, people talking about it. But yeah, I mean literally, I mean I for this day.

I get especially now because there's so much content. You know, things are thrown at me. But there's definitely like a machine in place for certain projects where it's like, okay, we're really emphasizing this. And then you know there are people who will say something is the best thing, and I watch it, like literally the other day, someone's pitching an actor for me to interview about a certain show.

Can we wait till your client's next project, m because.

I don't think it's going to do your client any good for me to talk to them about a project and no one's That's that's how the sausage.

Is made interesting, so interesting.

Wild because mad obviously we were not privy to all those secret screenings. We did not know any of that was going on.

Well, you know what what was amazing was that, you know, as you know, there were certain moments in the show that became news stories before they were in the moments the biggest you know, one of the biggest ones, and it's just so weird to think about it because it

It depends on the project, obviously, but that was such like a such a thing. Yeah, yeah, which is just you know, you know that I have so many thoughts about it like it was in many ways also promoting on a.

Not an anti It wasn't an anti gig, but it was like we were making it so taboo and I said, weed media and the show for that matter, we were making it so taboo of two guys to kiss. Was it really that positive doing all those things?

Like which aspect was it feeding? Is it feeding into the heteronormative society we're trying to combat sort of thing, or like.

Oh, you should tune in because you guys are going right box? Well that was that was also like I used to talk about that all the time, like this is fun.

I'm confused, right Box News and you know, but then you have an American hertor story and.

It's very different.

It's it's very different, but was owned by the same person. So is he made money you guys made money for you know.

There was a time when we all we were in New York during press and we all had to go to Fox News for an interview. You remember this. I remember this and Corey and I. Corey was very vocal about it, but Corey and I were not. Nobody was happy about it, but I was worried Corey was going to say some stuff. Yeah, and we were I remember that. I think I was sitting next to him or near him, because we were both sort of like, if you go down, I'm going to go down with you sort of thing.

But how do you right?

Right?

Right?

So tell me about I love that. I think it's so interesting talking.

About the like because you're on the other side of it, like you're it's kind of like you're in the driver's seat a little bit, but then it's it's turned because you're also answering to people.

It's so it's so fascinating to me.

But getting mestically, I'm interested to hear about your from your side of it, seeing the show blow up, seeing the show explode the way it did.

I mean, you guys were the Beatles.

You were the Beatles, you know, and what happened, what eventually happened too, is you were in that moment in time. No, you know remember those cars. Yeah, there was I remember the first sort of public event I went to. I don't again, I don't think you Premier jet was that Santa Monica High School.

That's right, we hadn't.

You hadn't, but there were fans there. Yeah.

Now, okay, maybe I think the pilot had aired because our pilot aired into that right, right, and then the rest of the series Sember right.

So I remember going to Santa Monica High School for it, and you know, hearing this story is Leah had glass in her hair during the audition that yeah, I'm trying to remember all the other.

Corey drove down from Vancouver audition. Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely.

So I remember it blowing up before it even started to blow up, because you had only, like you said, you only the pilot. And I will say this, and I don't you know, I don't think I've ever even talked.

About this with any of you. My career blew up.

Because of Glee, because my on camera life started because of Glee.

Because what happened was.

Corey and Leo were dating and they had never now never I worked at the ant work a variety, so you talked about personal life, they're dating, they never confirmed it.

For some reason, and I don't know why.

A producer at he said Mark could you go be the correspondent at the Chrysalis Ball.

It's this fundraising ball.

Corey and Leo were going, and I said, I'm going to get them to confirm their data.

Watch get there.

First of all, our crew guy forgot on my her phone, so having one of those big fuzzy things if I have my crotch, and right there, I was like, are you serious? This is my first thing and it's that big?

What is it? A wolfer or whatever? You know what I mean, yes, something. So I'm like and Leah comes on the carpet, and as we know, Leah was a little more media trained and a.

Little more savvy than Corey was. And I said to Lydia, I said, who's your date for tonight? And she basically winked at me. She knew what I was trying to do. She's like, I'm here with my girlfriend. I'm like, oh, she walks up.

Corey comes, sweet, sweet, innocent Canadian Cory.

Corey, Innocent Corey, and I was like, so, Corey, is this a date night for you?

And Leah? He goes, yeah it is, And I was like, we did it.

Wow, wow, wow.

That was my first red carpet as a correspond You know, I've done TV before, but as a Red Carb correspondent, and you never, you never, you.

Never looked back.

It was a question.

Yeah, it was just it was it was a good question.

It was a very good question.

It was a very question.

And that's that's how my on camera corresponding work started.

Because of Leah and Quarry. I had no idea, Wow, yeah, my first carpet, dude, I mean, I should google it. It was you know, it's like that news.

Then it was, oh my gosh, that's it. There was, oh my gosh, that's amazing.

Because like from the moment you watched the pilot and you felt so passionate about it and being able to see the show grow and then also resonate with people because I imagine this happens sometimes too. You see something you really like it, and then for whatever reasons, it doesn't keep going. There's not the amount of success you hope it would have. This one had that success and we're all here because of it. And what was that

It was, you know, you know, Glee one of those examples that I use when I'm mentoring people saying, you know, if you're passionate about something, get on board early, you know, And I usually as an example, I said, you know and listen.

I never went around.

To people saying I'm friends with the gleek cass, I'm friends with Ted and I'm friends with We were friendly. It's a business transaction. You need something, I need something. But as a journalist, I was an early supporter of it.

To see it.

Because let me tell you, there are other I'm trying to think of the other product or I like got really crazy about it, people like Margo Nutts, and it never went anywhere, and there were.

Probably plenty of that.

So to see it grow and to see it resonate, you know, and really, you know, we didn't call ourselves queer at that time, but with other you know, gay people like as a gay man of a certain age, the Lee was not something that I could literally ever have imagined, could not have imagined what's amazing is Since then, I've said that about.

Many things, and it's usually Ryan Murphy, right, and it's.

Like, oh, insight, right, right, what right?

You know? Game changer?

And I don't know if you realize in the moment it's a game changer. You know it's different, you know it's resonating. But you know, could oppose come if.

A glee hadn't right, right, you know, you know. So I remember being in it with you guys, totally.

God, there's so many, Oh god, so literally I was writing down all these times.

I literally have no here.

I mean, I feeld share because you were like when you say you wouldn't say you're friends with us, but you were friendly. But you were the like talking to journalists was a very new thing, and making sure we didn't say the wrong thing things was hard to figure out, but like you were always if you were on the red carpet, we always went to you because were the beginning. Yeah, you were saying friendly.

I remember, oh.

The first the first time I think I saw you guys like out of work, the two of you you came up to me. It was like an H and M party. It was some clothing brand. This is what I remember in my I could see it in my head. I feel like Jenna was maybe wearing a hat, or maybe Kevin were wearing a hat. I can't remember someone was wearing a hat.

And I literally remember like my shoulder and I'm like, I'm like hi, And.

I didn't recognize you guys because it was out of in a wheelchair. Like I'm trying to remember when I found out that you were actually weren't in a wheel chair.

Said visits, and I remember, I think it was it was a it was some kind of like clothing, the kind of party.

It was some crazy event and then.

You know, seeing you guys, just you know. The other thing that I remember very clearly is it was for the concert film. The concert film, the premiere.

It was in Banana. Banana was crazy.

But I remember of blue and gold.

Yeah, right, that is huge. We didn't almost don't even make it in for the movie. I remember it being so massive and like you're like, is this the Golden globes?

Globes?

And I completely for how I forgot about this because I've told this story, but it came back to me always doing some research.

Was I had Matthew Morrison's first interview.

After the finale, the final final, like an hour after.

Harvey Weinstein. So here's the story. Harvey Weinstein.

Was producing Uh Neverland find So Harvey Weinstein really wanted Finding Neverland to be mentioned during Live from E on the red carpet of the Oscars. He was he wanted Juliana Ransay to mention Finding Neverland. He'd gone to one of our producers that e she didn't come through. But then Harvey's people are calling me, going what.

Could you do?

And I'm like, I called the producer Ida. I'm like, it's Harvey Weinstein. If he calls you gotta you know this is got you gotta come true. So we were like, Harbie, if you want something Juliana Ranson, can't just mention it at him nowhere, like give us some context. So the night before the Oscars, the Weinstein Company as there has a party. Matthew was going straight from the finale shoot to the party to sing.

From Finding Neverland.

So I was like, Okay, if that's the case, what I want is an interview with Matthew Morrison.

Harvey arrange a whole set for me. Up it because it.

Was at the montage whatever it's called now w Hill, We're in a severed room.

They set up the two camera shoot.

Audio blah blah blah, because I was like, we not only have to shoot it, we needed edited now because the oscars.

Are the next day.

Yeah, so Harvey made Matthew leave like he couldn't hang around with you guys after your shot the finale because it was like, you've got to be my party to perform and do this interview with the news.

That's why Met wasn't there. Yeah, that's crazy.

Because we after the when we finish shooting, we all I had a moment together, like in the auditorium we're doing on the stage that he was there.

To go sing for freaking up Harvey, and.

I felt bad.

I was like you, but it must have made it more enjoyable to do to cover our show so much because you.

Were a fan, right, Like, did it make your job a little bit better? Not that your job was bad.

I'm trying, you know, listen, when Corey passed, that's where I got a little sticky, because you know, we're covering something that was not happiness, So I have to put my journalist tap on. And I always when I come at it. Yes I'm a fan, but you guys know me.

I want to break news, but I don't want to hear you you love Glee. I want news. I want to headline.

So I'm trying to remember it. There was ever a time where like I did.

End up butting heads.

With probably more like publicists than obviously you you know. But the Corey situation was, you know, that was a tough one.

You know, and I will you know, I remember the day.

I remember getting in bed and my husband, my then husband at the time, uh, turning to me and said Corey and he couldn't pronounced the last name. He's Corey, the guy from Glee.

I was like, what like?

And you know, Corey, as you know, was so special. And you know, I remember the first time I entered your chore and he was using the language of recovery and I was, I was in my recovery. I was, I was struggling with my recovery. M I remember the true and we never talked about his sobriety.

There's a language.

Yeah, you hear someone talking and he talked to it. And I remember just bonding with.

Him, you know, in that way. But no, it was that was a tough cover story to cover, but you know we.

Had to know and.

To do that makes sense, Yeah, but it is you know, it's fun for sure seeing a show blow up that you, yeah, that you.

First got excited about.

I mean, that's just you know, it's uh, just sort of a comparison in a way was Jessica Chastain. I didn't know who she was that she had to do with Glee, but in the same vein I remember being introduced to her. She was getting like the new Artist, the New Newcomer Award at Elle Women in Hollywood.

She just shot The Help.

And a Tree of Life with pet No one knew who she was at that point, and we bonded right away. So I'm going to support, you know, and it's I've got this great relationship with her. I never asked her she wanted to be on Glee, but we've had this great I did get her to do her singing debut, though it was it was the Critics Choice Awards, and it was my birthday and she's saying happy birthdays. Recently, we have this ongoing thing where like every time we talked, one of our sentences.

But you know, you I think it's a testament to the type of person you are that it's not just us, Sir Gisca Chastain. There's Brendan Frasier. There's lots of people who you have, that's right, really great relationships with because fun, Yes,

But you know, it was you know in terms of like are like you know, sort of like where I got not sticky, but it was like I remember with Chris called for you know, coming out of a closet, you know, and that was that was the thing. And I remember, you know, we were discussing, I'm like, does he even know he is gay.

He's so young and Kevin, I'm trying to remember. I think when I found out you were gay. I think it was one of those like really may have been. It's hard to be that now.

It's one of those things, you know, like I also might have It was something that like I don't even think I was consciously doing of when I was around other gay guys, you like overcompensate, so you know, like and so I'm wondering if I did that with you. As much as I was always so excited to see you, I wonder if I was also like over compensating and some like hey, like I don't know. Maybe no, never,

I will say it about every closeted celebrity. This is how they are when they're closet, when they.

Come out there like that.

Mm hmmm mm hmm.

Everyone.

My big example of that it is Christmas Stewart m hm. And you know I had a very similar relationship with her, like Lee because of Twilight, so like Highlight was another one of mine. But you know, she they don't look you in the eye. They they like I'm talking about like some foreigners or something. But like it's the you know,

I'll call people girl. I'll call a straight guys girl.

You know right, I'm a girler.

But so yeah, so Chris, you know it's part where but also Chris, and the same thing with Chris so young.

So I you know when Glee started, you know who he was. He was eighteen, you know right now, you know when I was eighteen.

I mean I came out when I was eighteen, but I was in college.

I wasn't on this humongous right right the show trying to figure that out.

And I remember having conversations probably you know, whether it was within his personal rep or reps at Fox, and I remember being like, I don't think he like, we haven't talked.

To him about it. You don't.

You don't say to someone who if they're not sure about the sexuality, like are you sure of your sexuality yet? Like, right, there was no one you know, he wasn't. Yeah, so, but there's definitely the guard is down as soon as.

You're out, the guard down.

That makes sense.

Uh.

You moderated the pallet Fest with us.

Yeah, Paley Fest. That was a big because I was I was thirty six people.

Yeah, how do you prepare for a pallet Fest with thirty six people on a panel?

Like what do you choose to ask? Who do you choose to? You know, how do you do that?

Listen?

Pale for the fans. So it's not you know, we're not doing deep dives. And especially so when when it's a lot of people on the panel, you have a question, you have to direct it to a person if you just open up, like Hey, who wants to answer this?

Half hour gone anywhere? A half hour is gone?

Yeah, And also everyone I'm top of each other, so you got to be like Corey, tell me about this. And obviously I never got to Jenna tell me about this, so I'm obviously still hurting about that.

I remember it.

Was now's your time. Now you can ask her anything.

You ask me anything. That's crazy.

So yeah, and it's you know that Pales has been circulating recently. Kind of forgot about it and you're like, oh, I saw you.

You interviewed the.

Interesting huh, that's so funny. Interesting?

How is this you started sort of a relationship too with Like maybe it's because you're a fan of like Ryan Murphy shows, but I feel like Ryan was always really apt to give you sort of like the like to be a part of this, like come join us.

And you know, I think that again, I think that was just like hey, I'm you know, supporting this from day one, you know, is it a loyalty thing? But like I said, I don't pretend I'm friendly with Ryan Murphy. Yeah, I don't call him, I don't have his email nothing. You know, and listen, if you're if you're a producer. If you're a content creator, you're going to gravitate towards people who are excited about, you know, what you're doing.

Yeah, so that's for me that man.

You know, I got exclusive that man, I got time to talk to Ryan and other people didn't, uh talk to the cat and other people did and so on and so forth. So you know, it's uh my god, Wow, it's it was yesterday, but it certainly was.

It certainly wasn't sure it wasn't it.

Was definitely, But we feel you, We feel you.

Like Matthew Morrison's Halloween.

Parties, Oh my god, was there a carpet for those?

You just go No, Matthew would always give me the exclusive hilarious that it was like the one I like.

There are videos out there of me dressed as a green witch interviewing Matthew Morrison, mean.

Dressed the first year.

I don't think we did an interview for the first year I ran. It was my first Halloween with my then future.

Husband.

We ran as clowns. We ran as clowns, and my name and the best was I And I'm like, I'm a Halloween person. I love the dress up of it all. So we ran as clowns. I had a Mini Cooper at the time which drive down some of our address as a clown and.

Perfect was amazing.

Wow.

And I remember.

Being a clown and the best you know, and I like a Halloween customer, like you don't know who it is, like you know if you can tell.

It's Mark, and that Mark Matthew Morrison Halloween parties.

My gosh, were you there? Were you there on the last day of set? Did we have did we have press there like for that? For the literal circus that they threw up? No, No, there was okay, they let me threw the circus.

Anyone was going to be there, it would have been marked.

Yeah, no, because I think I was setting on my shoes with.

Matthew Morrison exactly exactly.

Do you have any other like favorite, because you said you were sort of like doing your research and looking back. What else comes to mind when you think about that crazy, crazy era, if you will.

I remember the first episode watching Dot Marie Jones mm hmm. And I remember going to again Ility. I mean I was for the whole time of.

The show, and I remember saying, we need to get her in the office. I need to do an interview with her. M I need to do an interview with.

Don I was assessed, that's what doct Mary Jones and I did one of her first interviews. I was like, come in the opposite a change.

All.

Great and just someone different and.

Yeah, yeah, what a joy to work with Ray Sunshine.

Just just see Jane Lynch. Was always so awesome to see someone like Jane Lynch. She was older and getting these flowers.

It was amazing cool.

Oh my god, Darren Chris. To this day, I still see him and I light up. Just where did I just I just shot some video of Chris called for actually and I got the po He was at the Fatal Attraction premiere the other night.

I got to remember, that's right, I saw that they were there.

I saw that video, or if I see Kevin and the crowd and whatever from here we were at.

Recently, we were at Shrinking, Shrinking.

Shrinking, and I saw him talking to Harrison Ford and I was behind him like a proud parent taking pictures of him entering Harrison Ford, and I was like, oh my god, look at you. I skipped the carpet, but I was like, let me just take pictures of him on the carpet.

Sacks on the carpet.

Now we literally only get snacks from people from celebrities.

My four bags, my four bags of gummy bears from random.

Lace crazier right there in the living room, Brandon.

But you're gonna eat them, right, I'm like, uh no, these are collectibles now. Brain like time in Hollywood, you know, I remember.

Like it was such like it was such moments of oh.

My god, grendath manchall is going to do the show, Y Martin's going to do the show, and those were like we couldn't like the people that Ryan was getting.

Yeah, or catalogues of music that we were being offered. You're like, who almost are you joking?

Right?

And it was like, you know what, people don't really you know, the stories have eventually been done about.

It's like you can't just do a song, right, you got to buy those songs.

You've gotta you know, you've got to negotiate for those songs and just you know, but the fact that don't stop believing still, I mean, it's one of the first times to get in and that's that's the something that I'll always associated with the show.

Yeah, what is the feeling Glee leaves you with like to this day.

There was such a moment in time I remember being excited.

I it brings back.

It's definitely this moment of joy. But as someone in recovery, I can't help but think of.

Cory mm hmmm, you know, and that.

You know, we know the show has you know, had some you know, tragedy.

But when.

I think of Corey, because I think of our interaction, you know, and you know, I'm not in no way trying to equate my interaction with him the kind of interactions you had with him, but I think of what life ahead was that could have been mm hmm. And because of the addiction, yeah, you know, and of what his death did in terms of educating people, right, you know, and showing you know, this is someone who everyone knew. And I say, now, you know, we're on a podcast and so I'm doing air quotes.

So I can't help but think of that.

But I also can't help but think of like all the time I would try to get out of you, like, no, what's next, what's kind of in the next season, what's happening on the next episode.

Is there going to be a Glee Broadway show? Is they going to be a Glee What are you going to adapt Glee for? That's what you know. It was just.

It was never ending in right, yeah, you know, I know we keep saying this, and I'm sure not the only one who said this to you a Brazilian time. It was just something, you know, it was for us theater kids, you know, you know, and I was not a theater kid when I was watching Lee. I was

Even to these kids was just amazing. Was an amazing thing.

But like we said at the beginning of this, you know, the whole gay thing is an interesting thing because it was treated as it was so special. But does that play into the taboo of it and not the so called normality of it, right, And I know you know the answer to that is like, can't wait for a day when we don't have to ask like, what was it like doing the gay kids? It was just like,

The lack of a.

Better term, Yeah, eight pm on Fox.

Straight on Fox, and you know the yeah, I mean now I'm going to put my journalists cap on for you guys. And it's even and you even remember.

The moment where you knew was turning.

Where it's like, oh shit, this is huge.

They're sort of and we said, I think, like Jen and I have talked about this, but there were sort of two moments, but I don't think this first one when we went to Australia and the pilot had aired here and in Australia, but when we went to Australia, there were we went to two malls and there were over a one thousand people at each spot and we're like, that's crazy and weird and makes no sense.

It was like it was like chaos and we were moved and it was a lot, and I think it was the first time we were like, oh, our lives are not going to be the same.

We didn't necessarily know. They're like, this is crazy, isn't it. This is amazing. And then we went back to shooting. We came back to the US and the show's doing well and you're hearing about it your friends and your family. And I don't know if it was until like we went on tour, we had to leave La Yea. Once we left la even if it was to go back to our families over the holidays or things like that, when we were amongst other people that were not so jaded as you know, Hollywood people.

Were used to seeing stars all the time.

Right now, you could feel it. Yeah, no matter where we went the and there's a difference between people are starstruck and when people feel they have some sort of for lack of a better word, ownership or connection or friendship with you because they've seen you. And we weren't playing these unattainable characters. We were playing relatable characters. Yea, and it's and Chris got the I think the other

You now turning the table the two of you, like the two of you, would you like, let's say, whatever, wherever you're going on tour, right your backstage you're waiting to go on, you're hearing about that.

Would you look at each other and be like what, no? What? Would this makes sense? No? No?

I it's a little bit of both.

Like before we went on stage, we'd all joke with each other and we'd be in each other's ears because we could all.

Hear each other.

And I think it was like almost a coping mechanism to like to to bond with the people and to feel like you're going through this with somebody without saying it like we would. We would just act like normal kids, right, we're acting like stupid goofy goofballs and be saying like, you know, perverted girl and boy parts, you know, something

Let's not fight.

But that's like.

The attachment and like the things like we know you and we we're going to protect you and we're going to take care of you. Like that's the feeling that I was like, Oh wow, they like really care And that to me was like these moments of like trying to go through a hotel and like get through with security and you're like, I'm still like person with you know, free agency to move around, right, You're like trying to

This is this is crazy? Is this real life?

Kevin? Were you Yeah, I'm coming there turning the table and I know I didn't.

Talk about this, but you know, one thing to tell your listeners, you know what Kevin was really amazing was when Kevin came out publicly. You must have done You must have done it in a social media post that I seen, right, I like as Twitter, Yeah right, and I sent him and we hadn't spoken, you hadn't seen each other in.

A while, and I was I had left me and.

I was trying to like launch this thing. It's so weird to think about a Facebook live show in my living room on my couch and I remember sending you a message, probably on Twitter or yeah, because I don't know no Instagram is run send me your messing. Hey, I saw it to did Where did you come on this show that is not even a show now?

Talk about it?

And Kevin drove to my house at the time in Sherman Thoko by himself, came up by driveway, got on my orange couch.

Yeah, and you know, the story took off.

I mean it was like it was the first time Kevin, I'm talking about you like you're not here. I'm just talking about job that Kevin talked to death about his journey.

Right.

So my question for you is, when all of that was happening, were you scared that someone who's going to scream out you're gay. I know you're getting that you're going to be outed that that something, how much that sort of weigh on you.

There were a couple of times, yes, Naya was really she didn't understand why I wasn't being public because she was like, someone's gonna say something. She's like, you're messy. She's like, somebody's going to say something like why don't you want to get ahead of it like that? And I'm like, she was much more media savvy than I was, and I was like, who cares, No one cares about me, Like,

But did you have did you have conversations with Ryan about it?

I did. There was a time our first I think it was our first refference in New York, and we all went out and it was like a success, and we all was it the end of the first season towards or the middle of the first season, I think, and we got we were a little under the influence, and I just sort of came clean to everyone, all the higher ups because Jenna knew, Amber new, Chris knew, you know, like my people knew, and Ryan and the Dantes and Brad and all them were like the Scary Bosses.

Yeah, by the way, not at all.

But also to that time when you when you reached out to me about that, I remember texting my publicist being like I'm doing this like I wasn't should I do this? Like it's Mark? And I never thought again with not planning things because I didn't plan like the tweet of making it some sort of setting up some interview or yeah, And I was like, no, if there's anybody I would ever like talk to about this, it would be Mark.

And to this day, every time that a story that has something told Kevin Mcow comes up.

It's always like.

Live yea.

If I'm remembering correctly, were there paparazzi shots of the two of you and then.

People were thinking you were dating?

Yes at the beach.

You were at the beach.

Yes, we're in control of that. Yeah, we did that on purpose. We just didn't think it would get to the US. We were in Monaco at the time, so we thought whatever.

How I remember beach paparazzih.

That's good because it's the most famous we've ever been.

Yeah, peaked. It was everywhere, it was, truly. It was very strange.

News all the time, and we were like great.

And I'm trying to remember if when I saw those shots, whether I was like girl or I just thought or I didn't know, right, I may honestly, like I said, I may not know, but I remember those beach shots.

Right, good memory. That is a good memory.

You got to go back to Monaco gladly anytime.

Call it, call me Jenna cheating on husband Kevin Mgale, be like yeah.

For sure with each other. So it's fine, works out, It makes sense.

Mark, It's been amazing to have your Thanks for taking the time, and we really really appreciate it and.

Happy to have you back because we could just keep going.

Part two, I do.

I have to do some more Google searching and really sort of go down that rabbit hole.

Let us know when you're ready. We'll have you back at anytime.

No, seriously, thanks for for being so nice to us and that you were talking about being feeling seen, and you know, we've there's a lot of journalists we've met and a lot of our carpets we've done, and we just you also made us feel seen like humans and not just robots giving you haveline, So we really appreciate that.

And the one thing I.

Haven't mentioned that's still freaking me out. And I know I'm going to sound like your old uncle. The baby carriage behind you stroller. I still you.

Were pregnant, that's right. I was very pregnant, and at that event, I said.

This is the last thing I'm going to That's right, I said, I'm done after and she's never been seen again.

And now she's in a basement.

In the dark.

Yeah, you know, I know in a way you my kid, Like, I.

Know, I'm like, what's that prop flar.

Twenty three?

Always, Mark, thank you for being so kind to us then and so kind to us now. You're always so supportive of anything we have. Yeah, we're doing outside of Glee to this day, So thank.

You on your you know success.

Let me know, make sure to break the news there's going to be a reboot or reunion or musical adaptation to Exclusive.

Thanks Mark, Bye bye, Kevin.

You know, I feel really grateful that we have really good people around us and good memories of this and in tandem with these people. Yeah, sorry to be so vague, but he's no. Mark is really a good human and we were very lucky to have him around during that time.

And it makes a lot of sense too, you know now hearing his sort of like personal connection to the show, like when he first saw it and why he wanted to cover it, And you know, I think in part if it wasn't for someone like him who was so excited on that entertainment journalistic side of it. Who knows that the show would have been you know what it was because he cared and he covered it that way and it showed, and we were so thankful to get to see him so often. Thank you Mark for coming

That's right, and that's what you're really missed.

See you next time. Thanks for listening and follow us on Instagram at and that's what you really miss pod. Make sure to write us a review and leave us five stars. See you next time.