Hey, folks, it is Wednesday, March twenty fifth, and Sean Ditty Combs and his legacy have been mis represented. Yes, those words from superstar Usher and by the comments we are reading, he has now stepped in it. And with that, welcome to this episode of Amy and t J. Robes. You are nodding, Yes, this has gone. We were going to let you actually hear Usher's words, but he has now kind of stepped in at ropes. Give an idea of what the headlines and the comments are saying about Usher right now.
Oh, from I don't have anything negative to say about Sean Combs to yeah you were groomed by Shawn Combs. There are headlines and there are comments, And I have to say I have been looking at comments about this interview that Usher gave where he spoke on Sean Ditty Combs, and I have not found one comment so far that has seconded what Usher said or said, yeah, it's good
you said that Usher. No, it's been actually incredibly solidly completely against all of his comments, Like people are outraged at what Usher said.
So and we say that, and we give a general idea, and folks, before we get into the specifics, generally speaking, he seemed, Robes, if you're just reading, I guess before listening to it. Fully, he seems to be coming to the defense of Shawn Colmbs, not because of what Shawn Colmbs did, but he was not willing to go even barely a step into the arena of criticizing or questioning Sean did he Combe's behavior. The word misrepresented is going
to be a problem as well. But Robes, it came across, did it not, as if he went out of his way to not say an iota of negativity towards this man.
He went out of his way to completely and totally whitewash or ignore the not only the allegations, but the convictions against shann Didty Combs. And certainly we all, I say we all, but we did. And a lot of this country heard and listened to almost all of the testimony that took place in that trial.
It was hard to hear.
Nobody wanted to know all of this. I didn't want to know what these women were saying happened to them. And the story was the same, like woman after woman after woman. And so to hear that and to kind of have a reckoning with Okay, I love Shandtycomb's music. I love what he brought to the world, but I'm hearing this horrific, awful, criminal, despicable stuff, and like, I have to find a way to try to make sense
of it all. And so I think we would give a little bit of grace to folks who knew Shawan didty Combs in another way, who maybe didn't know that side of him, who maybe didn't experience that side of him. I think we can all leave a space for that. But he didn't. Usher didn't leave a space for all of that horrific.
Criminal, evil.
Testimony that we heard that Shawn Ditty Combs was convicted of. So to not acknowledge it, to not have that be a part of the conversation is hard. You can't ask us to just say, hey, this guy was a genius. He made a lot of money, he lifted up a lot of black artists. So yeah, I'm not really going to talk about anything negative he did, because all I see is the positive. That is really hard to hear. After the trial we saw unfold.
All right, we'll let you hear it for yourselves. Here he is Usher giving an interview to Forbes, and he was asked about Sean Ditty Combs. Little context here. Sean Combs did have a lot to do with the beginning of Usher's career, producer's first album, it became a hit. These two have been closed since Usher was a teenager. That's the context. But he was asked about Sean Diddy Coombs. This was the answer that he gave.
I mean, this might be a bit controversial, but in the same way, I think many people choose to look past the reality of what our country is, the standards that we now stand on. We can't ignore the reality of the history. But in many ways, I think certain people are prosecuted and maybe not recognized for the greatness you know.
That they offer.
I don't have anything negative to say about Sean Clmes because my experience was not what the world has seen and how he's been misrepresented. I'm not saying that every man is perfect. I'm not saying that all of us don't have flaws. But I can't with any sense of humanity not recognize the valuable contributions that this man made for us as black entrepreneurs, for us, as businessman, for us, people who transition culture and ideas into something that's tangible and becomes business.
So many people benefited from.
What he created, and I acknowledge that, and that's why I see him as legacy.
All right, Well, people are lighting them up over that answer, and we started in WORL. He said what he said, and it didn't sound like it was too much off the cuff. And one of the first things he said what he was starting the answer was this might be a little bit controversial. It almost felt as if in that moment he knew where he was about to go and what he was about to do.
It's like when someone says no offense but or don't take this the wrong way. But look, obviously the next thing that came out of his mouth was just what he cautioned people against. Obviously, it was offensive to a lot of folks to hear to hear Usher say I don't have anything negative to say about Shawn Combs because my experience was not what the world has seen.
Okay, if we stop right there, why can't we take Usher at his word in that like that moment, like I don't have anything negative to say about him because my experience is not what the world has seen. Okay, Okay. That is like an honest and it could be a legitimate assessment of his experience with Sean Combs if only that sentence was.
Said, Okay, yes, you and I are in full agreement here, because if he had stopped there and said, but I recognize the pain that he has caused to so many people that I was not aware of, and it's difficult for me to actually live with the Shawn Combs I know, and the Shawn Combs I saw in court. So I understand the problem with that. But I just am here to say that there is some value in what he contributed, although I see and I've heard, and I've been appalled by the other side.
Of him him.
He needed to be able to say what he said, and that's fine, but he needed to acknowledge what also is known about Sean Combs at this point and to just say it's like your girl, Look, this is a big issue with girls. It's funny. I don't know if guys have this issue, but this is a big thing
among girlfriends. Okay, So you've got a friend and you know this other friend has just betrayed you or done something horrible, and you're trying to get your friends to say, hey, this isn't somebody we want to hang out with because they did this, And then one of the girlfriends says, but I haven't experienced that, so they're cool to me. It creates an immediate divisiveness and divide and it's kind of like a US versus them, and now you've got
to take sides. Can't everything be true and there be some I think there is a space where you can say, yes, Sean Diddy Combs has done some incredible things and has lifted up many artists and done brilliant, incredible things with his career, and at the same time has been a horrible human being. But he wasn't willing to even acknowledge the other side of that. And that's the problem.
I didn't think he had to go as far as you're saying he could. Now that would have been nice, that would have been completely appropriate, and some would even argue necessary, like you're saying. But even if he had stopped swear, he didn't even acknowledge it that there was something maybe that Sean Diddy Combs had ever done that
was wrong. So I was in the wherever we got this news it was happening, and that line of his I don't have anything negative to say about Shawn Colmbs because my experience was not with the world has seen. I was listening to that, and I was juxtaposing that image of him in that interview with the image of Cassie in the hallway, the image of Cassie being kicked and beaten and dragged, and how you can see that
and still in the same way. And I don't want to criticize because I love Usher and spent a decent time with So this is not just an outward This is more an examination of why this conversation has gone the way it's gone, versus us criticizing him. We're seeing why that criticism is coming ropes. It just wasn't a hint in here anywhere, right, given that everybody can describe that video still and to have someone say, ah, I got nothing bad to say for me, And.
By the way, forget that he didn't go there and didn't criticize him in any way he is he finished that sentence. I don't have anything negative to say about Sean Combs because my experience was not what the world has seen and how he's been you know, miss represented and you met you touched on that at the beginning. The fact that he is saying, and said and chose to word it this way, that Sean Diddy Combs has
been mis represented. I feel like that was the biggest dig of them all and that hurt the most.
Well, it hurt to some point. He has to and I'm sure he does understand how that word set people off. There might be more context that was needed. He didn't add it, but the suggestion and not a suggestion. He is flat out saying the way the world is seeing him, he has been misrepresented and how all of this has gone out to the world. That is how it is literally being said and interpreted. And I think that's fair and it's fair for people to be upset.
About that, yes, because I think a lot of these women would say, yeah, you're right. He has been misrepresented up until the trial, where we actually now were able to show the world who he really was, behind the scenes, behind the music, behind all of the cameras. This is who why I stay behind the cameras. But like, actually there were cameras, so it was all documented. But the point being is the misrepresentation was that he was this amazing business mogul who was there to just lift up artists.
It was so much more than that. So I think that is where the rub. That is where people are super upset. And when you look at the comments, people are outraged by what Usher has said.
And again people outrage often is the first reaction to just about anything. I do encourage folks if you want to take the time to go and listen to is a little more. He gave a little more of the answer to this, but that was for the most part the stuff about Diddy that we let you hear there, and he did go on. Brooks talked about the contributions when it talked about money. Quite frankly, he talked about how influential Sean Colmes was not just in music, but
he turned this into an enterprise. He made hip hop an enterprise to a certain degree. To now we don't go anywhere down the street and hip hop and rap and that culture isn't touch in American culture. He made that point. All of that stuff is true, so was the process of the pain. But what the process is worth?
The pain meaning meaning he did what he did, but there was a lot of pain that was involved in the process. Like he just what he is now. I didn't want to say accused of what he was convicted of created a lot of pain? Was it worth it? What?
In order for what there to be? This media enterprise and this medium mogul's what it need to be?
Obviously, Well, yeah, I can't find I don't like to.
Do that kind of some kind of equivalent. Well do we not have all these hits in no industry and people have this if these victims didn't weren't victims, We can't do that. It is what it is. He is who he is, He did what he did, and a lot of what he did was incredibly positive. Are you not allowed to say that? Are you not allowed to recognize that? Are you not allowed to ever celebrate that? No matter? If that's Diddy, no matter, if that's r. Kelly,
no matter, if that's Michael Jackson. And the list goes on and on and on and on. Folks stay here trying to figure out what do we do with these fallen heroes?
Right?
We continue here on Amy and TJ Usher Usher Raymond causing all kinds of conversations online, a lot of but negativity coming towards him because of comments. He made an interview in which he seemed to shy away from being critical in any way shape or form of Sean diddy Combe, someone who was a mentor to him, a producer for him,
someone who helps him reach superstardom. Robes, I guess misrepresented is the word in his statement that is going to bother a lot of people to suggest that Sean diddy Comb's and his reputation at this point has been misrepresented. Not exactly sure what Usher was trying to say, I am because he didn't Robes elaborate. Is given people the freedom to fill in the blanks, and the blanks they're filling in don't bode well for mister Raymond.
No. And I think and you had even asked the question before we went to break And I do think that you can celebrate somebody's genius, celebrate somebody's contribution, and recognize and even honor what they did for rap, what they did for hip hop, what they did for the black community, but at the same time still recognized that there was horrific deeds that have been proven to be true. And you can admonish perhaps what he his what I don't know how to even describe his deviant side whatever,
like you can. We're all complicated individuals. And I'm not saying or suggesting that what Shan Dinny Combs is accused of and was convicted of is something that's in all of us. But we all have good sides, bad side. I get that, so but to not acknowledge it, to completely dismiss something so abhorrent, that's the tough part. And we even heard Shan didty Combs is responded, by the way to what we heard from Usher. This all happened today.
He's already responded from prison through a spokesperson, saying, I've always had love and respect for Usher. I appreciate his words and everything he's achieved. Does that do him good? Does that do him harm? To have? Did he actually speaking out from prison? I didn't even know that was possible, but apparently.
Spokesperson spokesperson he's in contact with in there. Look, I just have to what Sean did. He Combs means the world to some people out there. He did to you, by the way, Well, I'm talking about careers. I'm talking about careers. They owe their careers to this guy. Ussher is among them in all likelihood, Who does what does he? I don't even want to begin to try to understand how.
And frankly, the room for how painful it might be for him to have to see this, maybe this side of somebody that he didn't know, and to see somebody he loves go through all this and reputation to come down what that means for him. He is seeing this whole thing differently from the rest of us. I can respect that his comments are what they are. I can just leave room and respect to why someone might be confused and annoyed and even pissed off by hearing it. Yes,
he's going to have to say something else. I think he's I think he might have left out some details.
Look, I was not aware. I'll be full disclosure here. I was not aware of this prior relationship that Usher had with Ditty. Where he was actually.
He was.
He considered Ditty a mentor basically as a teenager looking.
Up to him.
And there are all sorts of folks pointing all sorts of fingers about how Usher may have been groomed by Ditty, etc.
Etc.
At the very at the end of the day, we don't know and no one will ever know the relationship
that those two have. But clearly there's still love from Usher, or at least respect coming from Usher towards Diddy, and I think, look, you, this is a complicated situation because I think any of us can put ourselves in the position of having somebody we looked up to, somebody who is a mentor somebody who actually you could credit with your career or your success, and now to have to say that person's a bad person or to DEMONI that's
a really tough mental space to get into. If that's the person who you would credit with your own personal success, that's a tough position to be in. And I'm going to try to give Usher that space because he's grappling with that. And I don't think that I understood that fully. Hearing his comments feels incendiary, like what, how could you?
But then we don't know, We don't know what those to and what he received from Didty and what he owes in a way maybe even to Didty, or what he thinks he owes to Didty and his from his success.
Well, these are again, you have like victims of horrible crimes and abuse that we're talking about here them hearing those words who hear and being praised and no acknowledgment even a little bit. Yes, we can say all these great things he did and not even to mention one little bit of something that he might have done wrong that is going to sting for some people. But again it's what do we do with Do you listen to Michael Jackson's music still? Do you listen to Our Kelly's music? Still?
Do you still watch movies by what's his name? Specter? The phil Spector? What do we do with these folks? Will you not watch a Cosby show rerun? Will you not? I don't know what are you ever supposed to do with these folks? I think I encourage everybody, give everybody a break if you decide I don't ever want to listen to another Didy song, okay, but also leave room for somebody who can say, yeah, that stuff he did was horrible, but I love I.
Think if Usher had said that, that would have helped and would have gone a long way. I think to the victims out there a lot of the folks who have and there are a lot of comments that run the gamut, but among them, the raining sentiment is if Usher had a daughter, if Usher had someone he loved in the position that some of these women were in, he would never be able to say what he's saying.
And I think that. Look, it's always easy to say that person should put themselves in another person's shoes, and if we could all put ourselves in the other person's shoes, this world would be a perfect, amazing place. That doesn't happen oftentimes. And look, I don't know, I don't know what Usher is going to take away from the reaction to all of this, But he knew what he was doing. And you and I both said this when you listen to him, This isn't somebody who is just flying off
the cuff and just saying things. This was a well thought out decision where when he was speaking, he was speaking with clarity. He wasn't he was speaking with There was thought behind his words. That was my impression mine as well.
But he it sparked a conversation, and it shouldn't just be about Usher and Diddy and Usher taking heat. Maybe it should be about how we do have a better conversation around and respect for people who are on both sides of these issues. When it comes to so many of our quite frankly hero so many of our greats, quite frankly in the arts, who end up taking these falls and accused of horrible things, what do we do.
Maybe there is no answer, but everybody should be respected with whatever they do decide to do and with that, folks, we always appreciate you spending a little time with us. I'm TJ. Holmes On behalf of my dear Amy Robot. We will talk to you also