Hey, folks, In this episode, everybody seems to be breaking up, so why not you too? And with that, welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ. Yes, we are Robes in a very strange time right now. If you've read the headlines, obviously the people have been seeing all these breakups. But we are in a weird time right now. We are in the mixed of midst of cuffing season. Engagement season and divorce season are all happening at the same time.
People are focused on their relationships for.
Much different reasons. I'm told for of all engagements happened between Thanksgiving and the first of the year before. Oh yeah, it's that range all.
So it's all happening cuffing season.
But also at the same time, everybody's breaking up.
Why because they're realizing that they want something that they don't have. Whether it's not that necessarily another person. It's like a connection, a deeper connection, or a you know, a better.
This, or a so love island y right, there is connection. When you start throwing around she's been watching, Oh you know, I had a deeper connection. How many times you have to hear that a deep I just want a deeper connection?
What is this, but don't we all know? But there is the grasses greener mentality, and you start to see other couples and think, wow, I want what they have. I mean, I do think people think everyone else's relationship is better than theirs a lot of times, and maybe the first of the year, you start to think, I want to I want a new start, I want a fresh start. I want to try to find what I'm really looking for.
You are hitting on already the exact thing that many psychologists say is the exact reason why people break up, in particular around the holidays. A lot of couples that we've seen breakup happen just before Christmas, and then a lot have happened. I cannot believe how many have happened right after January one boom boom, boom, boom boom. We've seen so many things. Do we know anybody personally? Oh? Well,
I say personally, but outside of headlines. I'm trying to think of anybody in our families or friends right now. I don't think so right, I'm trying.
You know, there have been divorces. You get to a certain age, you definitely have friends and family who get divorced. I can't remember there being a consistent time of year where I feel like those are now because you know what, Honestly, the truth is, by the time friends and family usually tell one another, it's long done, so I don't know when the actual decision.
Was to plan.
Yeah, I mean yeah, And that's the truth, right, That.
Really is a true statement we wanted to do. You know who did it well?
Of course, you know who did it well, Jiselle tom Brady. That was the model I was trying to go or follow. I was thinking to myself before I announced it to everyone, including some of my friends, I want to have the divorce actually already be filed in the court so that the messiness is over. Any sort of tumult I'm gonna deal with personally. And then by the time I announced it, things are cool and calm and we're all good. And that was my goal.
That was that was our goal. They announced we are breaking up. That's what we heard. And they said, oh, actually the divorce is final, it's done. That was the way they went about.
It, because when you announce to people that you're breaking up, people usually want to weigh in.
I have questions, this is about whose fault is it.
So once you already say, hey guys, it's a done deal, there's no room for discussion. And I think by the time you get to that point, you've already made your mind up and you don't really want to hear what everyone else thinks about it. And so that makes a lot of sense to me. But when I think by the time you actually hear about these breakups January one, January two, maybe even in December, at the end of
the year, when people are focused on other things. This has been going on for six months, this has been going on for maybe years even so we've.
Been talking about this, and you are, I guess, cuffing season. You've you seem to be a fan of just saying that sometimes it's fun. Okay, okay, I'm not wrong, I'm not okay, it's just funny to me. But that's the time between I guess Thanksgiving and Valentine's Day. You don't want to be alone. You don't want to be lonely around the holidays, don't want to be lonely and single around Valentine's Day. A lot of people will say, so
that's why they call that cuffing season engagement season. A lot of people like to make it a family event around the holidays, starting a new beginnings. New Years is a very popular day to propose, and then you got Valentine's Day. A lot of people like to do it then. So that explains engagement season, divorce season. It's that as well, because you have a lot of attorneys who will tell you that January. It's a myth kind of but they say most divorces happen in January. Lawyers tell you that's
when they get the most calls. The divorces don't always go through and don't get filed, but they start their switchboard starts lighting up with inquiries right after the holidays, and we can understand that as well, a lot of people just don't want to put the kids through it. When it gets passed it, we don't have to explain things to at the family gatherings about so you just get through the holidays and file for divorce. So we in the midst of all three of those are happening
right now. Just about everybody that can hear our voices right now is going through one of them.
It's wild, right. I was just asking, is this an exceptional year for breakups? If you look at the last two months or is this always the way it is and I just haven't paid as much attention to it.
I got social media now, I think a big part of it. I think the breakups and things always happen, but I think people are learning, I do a new strategy, a new way of going about handling a public breakup. We failed measurably at it and dealing with our divorces. But I think Brandon routh Is one actor played Superman.
They are running from la fires and he and his wife have to announce their breakup because they were about to be it isn't that the one They were about to be exposed by tabloid So in the midst of all that they had to announce seventeen years marriage.
Yeah, they had to go on to social media and get ahead of the headline. And it's nice that they even had a heads up, because sometimes you don't even get that courtesy. They just go with whatever rumor they've heard or whatever source they've been able to get some information from. So yeah, but that's sad when you're dealing with your life and you're dealing with a massive tragedy that you then have to get ahead of headlines, But there have been a lot of headlines over the last few weeks.
You go back and get it, don't have to go that far. Megan Fox, Machine Gun Kelly split early December. They've been together four years and they announced they're split a month after they announced they were having a baby. Chance the Raptor Rat the Raptor. I chanced the Rapper and his wife, Kirsten Corley. She filed for divorce in December. That was after five years of marriage. They had two daughters together. So Brina Carpenter and Barrick Yogan reportedly split
in December. They had been dating for a year. Then you got Zoe Kravis Channing Tatum reportedly split at the end of the year. They were engaged and they had been dating for three years.
I was rooting for them. I really liked them, you know, And I do think people feel personally invested sometimes in some of these couples. Jessica Simpson and Eric Johnson, they announced their separation after ten years of marriage and fourteen years together because they had two kids before they even got married, but they have three children together. That was a bit of a chakra for a lot of folks. Some people who've been following closely noticed that they had
stopped wearing their rings for months. Then Naomi Osaka, the tennis Star and Cordet the Rapper announced they're split the first week of January after several years of dating, and they have a daughter together.
Now, Jessica Albucash Warren, I got a lot of attention. They announced theirs early January. Sixteen years of marriage, they got three kids together. You had Austin Butler Kaya Gerber. I think they had been together few years.
Right, I think three years?
Oh yeah, news was out of there, reported split. We started hearing about that the first week of the year, and then we just mentioned Brandon Routh and Courtney Ford their divorce seventeen years. And then the one I guess that stung a little bit for us because of our personal connection to it had to do with Matt and Rachel.
Yeah, and as we're Matt James and Rachel Kirconnell. Matt announced their split just a few days ago, January seventeenth, after four years of dating and after a lot of people were only expecting the next announcement from them to be one of engagement from all the hints they were dropping and you know, we learned the hard way. When you don't fill in the details, when you don't fill in the gaps, and by no means are you forced to or are expected to, and you shouldn't have to.
But what happens when you don't is other people do it for you. And unfortunately we're kind of seeing that with the Matt and Rachel announcement now because we haven't heard from Rachel and Matt didn't give any details and again, doesn't have to, shouldn't have to, doesn't owe anybody anything. But then people start speculating, and that's when things get
tough to witness and watch. It's especially tough to watch because a it's personal because we know him, and b because we went through people filling in the dots for you. And it's painful because almost certainly it's not true, or at least it's not the way people are painting it.
All of these come together now to put you in the flight, like you do have to wonder. It makes you wonder what's going on. Maybe there's nothing going on. Again, these are just headlines and look social media and the way news spreads online these days, and maybe we're just seeing more about them. But there's got to be a reason for it. Certainly a lot of this has been studied over the years. But the reasons around the holidays are threefold that you hit on. One of them has
to do with the holiday stress. Holidays are Yeah, we talk about the Christmas cheer and the music's playing, and he called me a grinch all the time, right, Screa, I.
Got you No, I got you a grinch sweatshirt for Christmas? Do you remember that?
I do remember the sweatshirt, and I am a grinch. I'm sre. But it's stressful. You wish everybody at some point was running around trying to find something. Man, I can't get this they and it'll be there on the twenty seve not the twenty third and everybody. So it's stressful. You'd throw in the family, the travel. Then we have some bad weather, we knew folks that got had flights canceled, and all these things happening. So doesn't that put a strain on a relationship that's already not in a.
Good place without a doubt, Yes, And if you don't handle stress the same way, or you don't support each other, but you just get further irritated by one another's reaction to whatever isn't going right. Yeah, that could lead to an absolute death spiral.
The other thing of one of the reasons around the holidays is because you are now dealing with what as you reflect unmet expectations of your past year, and a part of you taking an assessment of your past year and your expectations were not met, you examine your relationship and then you think, on January one, do I really want to go through another year of this? And that's the other reason they point to as to why the holidays are so popular.
Didn't you tell me? And I looked it up and confirmed it. December eleventh is dubbed break up Day, or roughly two weeks before the holidays officially begin, for all of those reasons you just mentioned. And you know, I think that's funny. I think if you don't have kids, that make sense. When you do have kids, it was the opposite. For me. It was let's give them one last Christmas, let's make it through this last Christmas. Let's
tolerate one another through this Christmas for them. But yeah, with kids weren't involved, that makes perfect sense to me.
And the other reason is you're looking for a new start, and you actually are in the mood to make a bold move. You're not in the mood anymore to just reflect on how things went wrong. You actually want to take some action to correct them. You don't want to see how it goes anymore. They say, you're in a different mindset. That does put you in a position to make a bold move starting on January one that makes.
Sense, and I actually, you know, it sounds like from what we were reading and looking at. Breakups obviously can happen any time of the year, but you do get into certain mindsets. And the other one was I noticed or I saw that March is a is a big
month for breakups. It's actually been dubbed Spring Clean. And for whatever reason they said, April second ends up being a day where a lot of people announce that they're breaking up or splitting because again they're looking towards now warmer weather, getting back out there, the excitement of maybe going on adventures or dates with someone else with the warmer weather and socializing right, but feeling like you can clean your closet literally, or clean your home or clean
your life up by making massive changes.
So what we're saying, folks, is you need to be on edge in January, March, and December. If you're in a relationship, just yeah, turn off your notifications, be careful about answering that phone the other You said this earlier as well, talking about parents. August is one that a lot of attorneys point to as to why breakups happen
is because kids are actually busy. They might be a camp, they might be going to visit, and parents take an opportunity of saying, well, the kids are gone, we need to talk for a second while the kids are out of the house for several days.
You know, it's crazy, babe. Those were that so July August like, and yes, those were in both of my marriages that ended in divorce. The decisions were made in August like early August, late July, early August in both of my marriages, which is but you know what, It's true, the kids go to camp, the kids, you have some time.
To yourself, have a window.
That actually happened for me the first time around, especially where I had time. I had three weeks and I just thought, I can't do this anymore. And you have this space because so many of us, well everybody is busy, right and you don't have the luxury sometimes of reflecting and thinking on all of those things when you're a parent, especially to young children. Yeah, that makes total sense.
The National breakup Day you mentioned December eleventh, I think that kind of can change from time to time. But the reason that one came about was because some group went through and checked out people's face. They were able to analyze people's Facebook status changes and they noticed on December eleventh there was more changes than any other day people in changing their Facebook status from single to single. That's so interesting that they were able to pinpoint that.
But that's why December eleventh, it is just kind of unofficial. But yeah, that's the day that people do. Well. What I'm just.
Saying, what no one, I'm just saying. What's interesting is we're able to collect a lot of this data now because we all share so much with the world without realizing it, we were very quick to let people know. I mean, it's funny. I'm old, too old to have actually ever put a status on Facebook, so I've never done that. But it's a big deal when people change their I've heard my kids talk about it, or someone
changes their status. It's like, but now you're putting that out there for people to measure and look at and see what trends are and.
What is your status currently.
Deeply in love?
I don't think they give you Zuckerberg havn't hasn't changed to give that as an option.
What are the options?
Are the options?
I don't know.
It's single in a relationship, married, and what else could it be?
Engaged?
Is it really one oh schnike?
Well, mine would be in a relationship, yes, obviously, what would your be?
Well? I want to hear what the options are first.
I was waiting for you to say it's complicated.
Is that one of them is? I think it's complicated as one of them single in a relationship, engaged, married, it's complicated in an open relationship, widow, separated.
Divorce, widowed, Sara, union, a union?
What was like number four or five? You said, sin open and then it's complicated, Which is the worst you could hear from me? It's complicated?
Yeah, I don't think or maybe open relationship, open relationship and it's complicated. Those are two that would be a huge red flag for me. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Look, we've talked about this funny enough. I have struggled with what to call you. I'm fifty one years old and I'm on a plane and I'm saying, oh, could you
bring something back? Like I go up and say, hey, would you would you mind sending something back to and I kind of stumble, like my boyfriend more or if I say my partner, I feel like they're looking for a woman instead of a man, because that's a lot of the terms people use when you're in a same sex relationship. So I'm like, but I always feel so weird calling you my boyfriend.
Why don't you go with your favorite on the plane at least see she's laughing to see if you're going to say it.
Well, I said, Mike, we were working together at that point, and honestly, we know we catch this was we were together at this point. We were working together and we were out in the open about our relationship, and so I didn't know what to say. Again, this is funny. I went up to use the restaurant at a plan and a plane. The flight attendant, actually I've never had this happen, say hey, we're trying a new mix of
old fashioneds, would you like to try one? And I'm not like a huge whiskey person, or whatever, and I just wasn't in the mood, so I said, I don't know, thank you, but I was like, actually, I feel like my friend.
Wait for it, would wait for it and.
Would like would like to try it. And he's he's sitting next to me. She's like, which one is he? And I'm looking for it and he's like, who is he? Well, he's my colleague. So I referred to as my colleague. And then he goes which one is he? And I looked and I didn't know how else to describe you, and I said.
He's he's wait for it.
He's the black one, because you were the only black person who was sitting in the in the vicinity, and it was the most obvious way to describe you.
So then I came back to the seat and I was like, I'm so sorry, but I got flustered and I described you to the flight attendant as my black colleague, and I was really embarrassed. I just got really flustered.
I didn't know you were say.
You were like what you referred to me as what?
That's okay, but labels are stressful something you should hear. How I refer to you to my friends Sometimes I.
Mean, it's so I've heard you say something's out loud about you. Oh yeah, like how you referred to me? Yeah, okay, there's been a movie reference.
Er too, a movie reference. Yeah, okay, that's come on, that's not the same thing. Oh stop it, that's not the same. We say that in private. You said that to a You called me the black gentleman to a stranger, black colleague.
Well, I'm gonna say it, but like, ultimately, yeah, put the two things together. That is basically what I refer to you as. Wait, how do you refer to me?
Uh? Talking to you?
Well, if someone were to say, if you were to say, hey, could you do something for my ex? You would just say girlfriend?
Right for my blank you mean not my ex? What'd you say?
No, if you're saying, if you're referring to me, to try to describe my relationship to you, Oh, how would you refer to me as?
You know?
I that's a good question. I don't know how just a natural conversation. Yeah, I'm really not sure. I think I you know what I've said more than more often than not my wife. Yeah, absolutely, just to keep the flow. I don't want to explain anything.
Yeah, I have tried out husband a couple of times, just to you know, but also like if you say things like that, sometimes people think, like you don't know if someone knows who we are, and then somehow would say, okay, can I tell a funny story?
Oh god, yeah, the other one about your black colleague was so funny.
Let me redeem myself.
No.
So we both started wearing these Aura rings for the podcast because they sent them to us and we've actually thoroughly enjoyed them. We put them on our right hand, but we both wear them on our ring finger. And my mom and dad came here to visit for a little while, just watching us, observing us, and I just had a quick moment with them a couple of weeks ago for sadly another funeral and my mom. It was just my mom, my dad and me, and my mom said to me, hey, sweetheart, can I ask you a
personal question? Which was a strange thing for my mom to say. I said, of course, yes you can, And she said, I noticed the rings that you and TJ are wearing, and I know that they're like exercise rings, and I see that you have them on your right finger, But did you too get secretly married. She actually thought that it was possible we had and just hadn't told anyone.
Well, based on recent history with us, she wouldn't be surprised if we ran off and did something. It didn't tell that. I think that was a legit question.
Right, So it was funny to me that that's I was like, whoa, but that might Yeah, that's what that's what we're putting out there, right, So I did tell her, I said, well, funny enough, if and when it does happen, that's probably how it will happen. You'll find out after the fact, because in her reaction to that one, she said, that makes sense. And I said, it's not as if I have any plans to walk down the aisle and pick out my wedding colors and you know, have a
florist involved. I said, it's it is probably going to be one of those moments where you get a phone call from me. But I won't keep you in the dark for too long.
Wow, any more stories you want to share?
All right?
So when is so cuffing season is now? Is there a this marriage season in the summertime? That has to be that's always when all the weddings are right June July.
Yeah, but there's we can only call it an engagements yes, as a marriage season, but the season where people decide they want to get married is now. Weddings take place and warm. But then sometimes people get married because it's a I don't know, get a good deal and a venue.
Sometimes that's true a Wednesday wedding, I mean it has a nice raindow.
I got no problem with that, No neither do I. But it's it just seems right now what's happening. And with breakups they say, it's just so many of them going around, And it was interesting to take a look at why and against it's psychology today. I just I wish I could give this psychologist his due because he's the one that came up with this reasons that we
lose intimacy. I thought this was so fascinating. He has something he calls the three D effect, three reasons now that erode intimacy over time, Distraction distance disconnection.
Oh my god, that's so true.
Distraction distance disconnection, he called the three ds. They're like emotional termites, and you don't notice the damage that's being done because it's being done so slowly. But then eventually the foundation crumbles, and it's done with the three ds, the three D effect, and that's what erodes intimacy distance.
For sure, that makes perfect sense. Yes, when it's you know, absence makes the heart grow fonder until you just stop connecting, right, I mean, yeah, that makes total sense.
Distraction is the other. So this is a part of the around the holidays, you got other things going on. Your stress is here directed there. You're not performing as a team necessarily, you're distracted by this could be work. You're distracted. She's distracted. And over time though intimacy, all of a sudden you come together and you're not close to anymore.
You know what's interesting about the distraction part, because one hundred percent I get it. And so many couples, not so many, but definitely enough couples when their kids go off to college, when they finally become empty nesters, they decide they have nothing in common anymore. They've been distracted by their own children, they've been distracted by their lives. And so many of us don't focus and put our relationships first, which I do think is the key to
keeping it together, to working on it. You have to put it first above all else, above your career. And my parents even said above your children. My parents were firm believers in that, and you know, the proof is in the pudding. They're still together. They just you have to prioritize your relationship in a way that most of us don't think about, can't or don't want to. But
that makes an awful lot of sense. And I do think having shared interests, whether it's your career, whether it's just what you do when you're not at work, if you can have those things that keep you together, you know you aren't as distracted because you're together. And what was the last T disconnection And that's a result of the first two a.
Distraction, distance, and then ultimately a disconnection. We oftentimes this is how he puts it. He said, you can tell if you're disconnected because when your partner does something or
says something, you make an assumption about their intentions. If you're making an assumption about their intentions instead of saying, you know what, I'm reflecting about what you just said, or I'm curious about what you said, if your first reaction is to say that that you're making some assumption about what your partner's doing, that's one of the early signs that there's a disconnection.
Issue because you're not willing to ask, you're not willing to be curious, you're not willing to say what's really going on. You just make an assumption because you're God, Yeah, you're distancing yourself emotionally.
The three day I thought it was interesting about the holidays and how this all connects. But it's it's fascinating to me, and it's scary. I guess this is a I guess we're all in a scary time. So are we can make it to April, we might be good for the year, at least till December. I mean, you have to set goals in a relationship. I mean the bar can be low, but at least there's a bar.
I am not trying to make it to April. I'm not I'm trying. I'm trying to make it to one hundred.
Okay, but April is on the way to that. We got to get through Andy gets it. We got to get through April at least.
Yes, well, of course, yes, But I'm a long term goal kind of gal. The short term goal I totally get, But I think you have to have the long term goal with you at all times. Yeah, sure to reach the short term goal.
Sure, well, look to all the couples. And I'm still rooting for even though we heard about j Lo and Ben Affleck at the end of the year. They separated earlier last year, but that was a hard, high profile breakup, and those are folks I'm still rooting for, and I know a lot of that. There was one thing we were looking at, people have been together a long time? What's your advice?
All right?
People always looking for advice, but who've been around, who've been together a long time. And one of the pieces of advice was don't get married unless you're one hundred percent sure you're not going to get divorced. Now that sounds crazy, but how can you ever be one hundred percent sure? But the point there is you can prevent divorce by being sure and committed to I'm gonna get married and I'm not going to get divorced again.
It sounds so simplistic, I know, it's it's so interesting because I it's hard when you've been divorced, not once, but twice for people to say, well, when I walk down the aisle, I want to make sure it's forever and I and I, and I laughed and said when I walked down the aisle, I also wanted it to be forever. It's not for lack of desire. But I hear what you're saying. If you say, no matter what.
There are reasons to get divorced, we say, with the exceptions of abuse, all kinds of I mean, all kinds of things can come into play. But the idea of the point behind it is that you have to be sure. You need to be sure before you make that decision, and that was a key to staying together.
Okay, no, oh, no, no, no, I agree with you. I am actually reflecting back on my own life and knowing that I wasn't sure. Like I was hopeful, but I was not sure. And I don't know if you could ever be. But I'd like to think that there are people who absolutely are. I love some of the other advice from some madly and loved couples share how they've made their marriage. Last Andy gave us this list, and I love that. One of the bits of advice, and we can leave you with this is that smiling laughing.
You have to be able to laugh things off when things get rough, and sometimes some person's not going to be able to smile and the other one can, and vice versa. But if you can find a way to smile, or at least to get a little smile out of your partner when things get tough, if you can still laugh together, there's a good chance you can still make it through even the toughest of times. And I like that idea. That gives me hope. I've never laughed with anyone more than I've laughed with you.
That is true, and I agree. I think a lot of people give that advice. But be careful with that advice though, because you might be the one that just pissed the other person off. Don't go over and try to tickle.
Him so he oh, you gotta do his laugh.
Yeah, this will be fun a robox it.
Choose your timing, choose your timing. Understand you don't want to poke the bear, but yeah, you know, is there anything worse that when you're upset, someone says, turn that frown upside down. No, I'm not saying to do that, But in the right moment, if you can smile and maybe laugh with some time and perspective.
Ah, yeah, well yes I do for sure. I laugh and I smile with you more than anybody I've ever smiled and laughed within my life, not just in a relationship, but with anybody in my life. So that does work. So folks out there, if you are out there, good luck to you. If you are trying to get cuffed this season, good luck to you. If you might be going to a difficult time of a relationship and a
divorce and a breakup, good luck to you there. And congratulations if you just got engaged, we're rooting for you or expecting one by February fourteenth.
Expectations can get you in trouble, so good luck.
Out there, everybody. But we always appreciate you listening to us, and we always appreciate you running with us as well. If you haven't been running with us, you could do that. Every Monday through Friday, we have our Morning Run podcast in which we go through the day's headlines every single day, so check that out. But for now, I'm two Jams.
And I'm Amy Robock. Have a wonderful day, everyone,