While we get doctor Guardier America's psychologists, and there's a couple of things we want to talk to him about. But as we get him adjusted up here, we absolutely wanted to take questions from you guys. I think it's a small enough room that you all can shout them out. So by all means, can we get doctor as we get him up here, anybody got a question, you all toss it out.
We need to talk.
Oh, by goodness, yes, this happened in a in a crowded public place. People were all around us at the time, loud, pardon good time, and we were sitting there the only and I may say, hey, so are we going to talk? Why aren't you acknowledging what's happening? So do you just want to keep going the way we're going, because if you want to, we can and I will drop it and we're done. If not, we need to have a conversation about what's happening and a way forward because we
are working together every day. We're together every day together all the time. So either we address it and drop it, or address it and figure out what we're going to do about How wasn't this aggressive when I did?
But but yeah, it was. It was a crowded room, which actually was probably best because I said, can I think about that? And then I think we talked about it the next day, and then we kept talking about it. But I was so shocked that he brought it up that you, like, I think you maybe had a little liquid courage, but I was not prepared for you to call me out. And that was a moment when I thought, oh, wow, we actually have to acknowledge this.
Anybody else, Gret, I'm curious, how are your colleagues that work?
So we went back to work for two days after that tabloid that shall not be named release those photos of as we pointed out, just discovering us in a private relationship. They did not catch us cheating. That was not what happened. They found us in our private relationship. But when we came back for those two days, we were surrounded with support. My dressing room was full of all of our colleagues.
Some of it fake, some of it fake absolutely, some of it was bs.
But once it was clear that we weren't coming back, I never heard from most people again.
Yeah, and we get that to a certain degree, right, everybody's trying to hold onto their job. They don't want to be seen as being an ally of the two people that ABC News doesn't like, and we get it to a certain degree. And for us, even we stayed away from some of our former colleagues because we were worried about them. I don't think you would mind us saying this. We had lunch with Stray what last week
before last last week. You wouldn't believe the effort we put into it with straight hand, just that Okay, you arrive at this time and then we'll come in and you can come in after. And we sat down with him and we were being a politic dude wish sar and he said, you idiots stop, just you have to stop being that way and thinking that way that we are trying to protect you straight hand from us. That
is the shame I'm talking about with. This is a guy we've been very close to for ten years now, and even we didn't want to get whatever our stank is on him for some reason, and we struggled to get out of that mindset. But friends like that do help, and time helps.
I used to say, it's not like I murdered someone, but I definitely felt like that's how it seemed if you read comments anywhere from all of these articles. I will say when we did walk down the street, which we didn't often, we got a lot of people yelling support, like we support you, we love you. Love is love, Like I want to definitely say that we like. No one came up and said anything horrible to our faces. But it was just all the comments and all the
commentary and all the headlines. It just it weighs you down to the point where you think I'm the worst person in the world, and you do feel like you've committed a crime. It's bizarre. But yes, I mean, I co hosted twenty twenty. I dealt in death and destruction, you know, and so yes, it was strange to me to suddenly, you know, be this just hated horrible person for loving someone. It was frustrating too, because the narrative was not true, and so it was frustrating.
We lost the narrative off the top. Is the problem, Yeah, is that once people were told what it was and we didn't come out and make a statement, even though we drafted statements that day that ABC News said, uh right, we were encouraged to write these statements, and we had statements to put out explaining much of the things we said tonight. Once we lost that ability to speak and to control the narrative, it was done. And in social media age, nothing we could do.
Perception becomes reality.
And it's simple as that. I see hands going up now, doctor, doctor Gourdia, come on and go ahead and have a seat. You'll know, doctor, this is doctor Jeff Gardier here. He's gonna help us. So I see a lot of hands going up you all.
So, yeah, I wanted to ask you made the you mentioned controlling the narrative. Did either of you ever consider going to ABC.
Before the photos room?
Yes?
And okay, how did that go?
We decided not to. We were We've said this, I think we've already said this publicly, but we were threatened. We were directly threatened that if we didn't do what was being demanded of us, that we were going to be outed. We were threatened, and two days after that threat, photographers were seretitiously following us. So that is what happens now. Even before I think even before that threat or certainly after it, we said, you know what, let's just go
give ABC News the PR department. A guy, a friend of ours, there who we were close to, just the heads up to say, hey, we are going through divorce proceedings, this is what happened, and we're dating now and leave it at that. We we absolutely.
Had those We almost did. I mean in November, I believe it was maybe the week before the pictures. We had a long discussion back and forth about whether or not we should just give them a heads up. And what we decided was, let's just wait till after the first of the year, so let's get through the holidays and in January we will go and explain to them what's happening.
Even we talked to an executive. I love this line, he said, he said, So I'm not saying we saying this. He said, ABC News. They're idiots. All they have to do is take you guys, now, move you to the entertainment side and print money, is actually what he said. But we lost a net. Look, we worked at a this was a company. This is a network, a network owned by a company Disney. That I mean, it's iconic,
right image is a cute little mouse Disney. And that cute little mouse has been with the same girl mouse for one hundred years. For divorces. That ain't work.
A follow up question to that piece about what two to three years ago, when you all were in that happy, healthy place in your careers and you're still very early stage in both of your professional careers. I would imagine that you have milestones, professional milestones, goals that were in your line of sight, and knowing that there are only such limited, high visibility platforms that exist in the world that you are in, do you still believe that those goals are achievable for you?
Are they still in cable or network news?
They've changed. Absolutely. We sit here now with the idea of going back to network news and doing that. It doesn't appeal to us in the least bit. Did I mention? Those jobs almost killed us, literally almost killed us. So we think we're doing great, but we talk about a cost of us being together. We don't ever talk about the cost of being in those gigs in the first place. Oh, look at what you guys lost. You had these great Yeah, I should have maybe given that gig up a long time ago.
Agreed, I have zero desire to go back to network news and the grind. And you know, we know how the sausage is made, and it got more and more frustrating to me the more I got to a higher level and I saw it. Look media bias. It does not exist with how we tell stories as much as it is the story we don't tell. And I was very frustrated and I had moments where I wanted to leave before any of this happened, just frustration with the industry. It is a business, so I wanted to be a journalist,
and sometimes those two don't don't work well together. So as hard as it was to lose our jobs, I mean like they were lucrative and they were fairly easy, like we could do it in our sleep. It was we were we were printing money, but it wasn't challenging, and it wasn't really what I wanted to do. So we're hoping and we're hopeful that we can actually start doing things we really want to do. So trying to
look at it as an opportunity now. And because we never would have left those jobs, Like don't like we would have never left, we would have stayed. And so now we have to look at this as the street we were supposed to be on, and we're gonna we're gonna walk down it and see what happens.
And doctor guard. Dear, can I ask we love it. I cannot say it enough how much we love his brother. But this love you love you Black when when you can speak on us, sure, But for everybody else in this room, the idea of that private shame causing you to behave in ways that aren't really who you are.
So we grow up with this fairy tale of your life is really about pairing up with someone or you're not successful. And so we achieve all these incredible things, but it's never enough until we feel that we're in that romance or in that family or that pairing that really is the cherry on top, and it comes in time. But when we're in relationships, and I would think every single one of us have been in relationships that haven't worked out.
And I don't say so much failure.
Because I'm a psychologist and I'm a positive thinker, but when they don't work out, it's the shame that we're not being successful at everything that we've learned, all the pairing fantasies that we've learned as part of our culture here in America, in the world, but especially in America.
So we live with a lot of that shame that it's not working out, that there's nothing we can do to really change that relationship, that we've failed at this thing, and our friends will look at us in a different way, and we have to get new friends and possibly new family and so on.
So that shame is very real.
But I think in a lot of ways it plays into a lot of the criticisms that you all experienced, because one thing is we have to look at what COVID it has done to the world, and what it's
done to America. We have unprecedented anxiety depression PTSD, and so a lot of what I saw and I looked at it, even though we've known each other for many, many years, I looked at it psychologically, Why are they attacking these two people who are just trying to live their lives, who, according to many people, made these mistakes and so on. And they went from this you know this most loved you know TV pairing as co anchors
to you know, all these tabloid stories. And I think a lot of it had to do with the fact that we're all emotionally ill still from COVID, and we were looking to project a lot of the anger and the shame and a lot of the grieving that we had as part of COVID, as part of what we're going through coming through COVID. And I think you all
see this. And I'm not going to get into the politics, but with the tribal politics, the hate that's out there, the venom that's out there, it's not fashionable to say I'm sorry. And you all have said I'm sorry, and you all have said how you're grateful, which is an amazing catharsist, this amazing walk that you're taking. And so a lot of what we see is with this splitting we're okay, you're bad, projection I'm okay, you're bad. I think a lot of this played into what you were
going through. So we have to acknowledge and take responsibility for our own shame instead of projecting it onto other people. Number one and number two, we have to do the hard work of realizing sometimes relationships don't work out, and it's really important for us to learn as to what it is that we can all do better instead of pointing fingers at one person or just ourselves, but taking the responsibility together of learning and going on to more
positive relationships. And I'll just end by saying, yes, I hear you thinking, ABC News because you are on this very very fascinating journey of pain and love and still some shame. I think it still takes time to work through that. But you're also helping so many other people who experience life and experience that shame.
And so.
These two folks need a round of applause y'all for the incredible work that they're doing.
Thank you, Jeff, Thank you doctor Guardier. I think we have a question back here, Hi, Hi Amy, Hi TJ.
You know me, we did conversation together with black men and you facilitated that. Yeah, And I find it really interesting that this is kind of like reflecting in a weird way, like the experience I had before getting on set where I was like, oh, like I am like this like queer person who's coming in talking about my black maleness, and they're like, don't go this far, because like, if you go this far, that's not what like Disney wants to hear, That's not what ABC wants to hear.
But I again, I just want to thank you because you allowed me to like push those things in a space that probably wouldn't allow me to do.
So that is that is one of the greatest compliments, right, I remember that, but that you took something away right in that moment. I didn't know if I'd ever see you again. That is the greatest compliment to hear that in that moment I made you that kind of not something I thought I wasn't trying to impress, but my brother that that that that feels great to have you stand up here and say that to me.
And I guess, like my question is, it's like it seems like there's a lot of like same similarities between like coming out and like shame and like depression and suicide and like also like new familial like structures. And I'm like here, I'm like here with like this like white man, that's my date.
And I'm like, oh, white man, Like does white man have a name? And we're just gonna go with white white man Leodo.
His name is Leto, all right. But I'm like, oh my god, Like if my dad, if I told my dad this when I was like sixteen, he'd be like, you've done like ruined the whole family line.
You've married. You're like you're going to like marry a white man. That's crazy.
But it's like, what do you guys feel like you guys have like some sort of like alignment to kind of like a queer experience. Have you been able to talk to your like queer and LGBTQ like family or friends about how there is kind of that.
That's cool, Well, I have my two queer friends right here, Joe and Preston right love that I called you out. I'm sure, But you know, I think anytime you feel like you're an outlier or you're not like the others, or other people can look at you and say you're bad, you're wrong, I think there is a shared experience, for sure. I don't. We haven't had that conversation, have we. I mean, it's I'm not even getting any feedback from you, Joe at all. Okay, Preston saying no, but I do. I do.
We appreciate that I hadn't thought about it like that, but I love to hear that there's a connection there, because because anytime you feel like your relationship is viewed to be morally wrong, there is a shared connection. So we appreciate that, and I hadn't thought of it that way. But I'm happy that in some way maybe you feel seen or heard or just like you're not alone, because not all relationships are put on a pedestal and appreciated
or even welcomed. So and I really hadn't thought about that.
And again, we for a while thought we were the only two people in America who ever experienced a divorce. Like we felt that way, like we were maage to feel like we were the only ones who had a failed marriage and then started dating again. But we to your point there, and again all this talked about everybody's throwing barbs at you online on social media and whatnot. You wouldn't believe the number of people that have come up to us and said, who you think you guys?
You should hear my story, like who can relate to life relationships, love, marriage, being complicated, being messy. It's not a perfect package. But again, when you work where we worked, you got to have the perfect package there. It has to look perfect. We know it's not perfect, but oh, I used to say this all the time. The network would never tell us they expect us to be perfect. But you better make damn sure nobody ever finds out
just how imperfect you are. That got us. Yeah, and doctor GARDI does that make I haven't thought about it that way? Before does this, But does that make sense the parallels that were just described.
Yeah, I think I think so. I mean, certainly feeling alone, feeling like you may not you were fortunate and that you had the support of family. But as we know, many of our brothers and sisters, and you know, our trans people in the LGBTQ I plus community feel very much alone. That's why suicide is the third leading cause of death in the LGBTQ community. And I was concerned. I'm very concerned as to the lack of support that
we see to that community, to our community. But I'm also and I was also concerned, and I said this to the two of you on one of the podcasts. I was concerned about the two of you in that, you know, keeping that stiff upper lip and you know, we're getting through this, and you know, we're going to be strong, and we're gonna robot, We're.
Gonna do this.
And and I said, you guys are really hurting you guys, you guys are in pain. You know, there's a lot of embarrassment that you all felt and that was projected onto you. And it was important that you talk about the experience and dissect the experience and emote the experience together. And so every time you have one of these talks, I keep hearing an invisible psychologist, not necessarily this one.
I'm invisible at home, don't get me started, but an invisible psychologist saying yes, yes, say more about that, be able to support one another, talk about that pain. The catharsis is so important, and it's not about solving a problem. It's not about putting a bow on it or a cherry on top, but it's about letting out that pain. And that's what you do each and every time. And this thing about being that perfect you know, TV couple,
you better be the perfect TV couple. I think you're giving a new definition that you better be a real person on TV because that's what we need, not what we're seeing on social media where everyone pretends as right, you know, to be that person, because it's not authentic.
It's about living authentic lives. And so this is something that I think we all need to learn the importance of being authentic because if you're not, that's what leads to illness, leads to strokes, heart attacks, Depression, anxiety can contribute and put one at risk for other illnesses, including cancer, and so on, which we know may be genetic environmental also, but it's important that you're authentic in order to be healthy. So continue to be authentic.
Thank you. This one thing I don't want people to.
Miss here is the friendship that will building over the years. And I can tell you sure you know you can meet someone one night stand or you know you you know online dating, you meet someone very quickly, you get married.
I've seen these marriages last for years and years. It happens in a different way for everyone, but one of the tried and true formulas, and you know this too, of a strong, strong, strong relationship is building that friendship, getting to know each other in a way where sex does not get in the way of knowing one another, understanding each other's vulnerabilities, being there for one another, and taking the time to truly know one another.
And that's important.
Thank you.
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There's a guy in a red jacket. I'm sorry, the guy Charles yelling at me.
Here.
Oh, God, my boy, Charles, I was telling you about he Oh my word, this isna go. Yeah.
So seriously, though, at what point did you guys decide to just come out to the public and try to even live normal lives. Tell us tell me about that experience doing normal.
Basically, man, I mean, Charles, we went into hiding d No November thirtieth when an article came out. We were in two places, either her place or my flat, taking trains back and forth, but we were not out and public doing anything. When we finally got we took a trip in February thanks to Howard. I can't remember when we ever actually got comfortable enough to go to a Knix gang together, to go to a restaurant together to go. We were absolutely shut down, in lockdown.
When we went to Mexico, we thought we were in the clear, and we had drones following us the entire time, and four days into the into the into the vacation, we oh, it was everywhere and it was just Remember we shut the curtains and we like pretty much cried and said, we can't go anywhere in the world where we have to go back into hiding.
Charles, I'm serious, we don't know when the Mexico thing, we thought we were okay and safe, and we saw the pictures later, but we ended up dipping. Like we're sitting on the beach having lunch, picked up our food and ran inside because it was a drone overhead taking pictures of us. We had a nice place we were staying with the open looking out to the ocean, and one morning she said, is that a drone looking ind to the bedroom of where we were staying. This was so,
this was February of twenty twenty three. This is all so now we're a couple of months into it. I can't remember how far into it to where we got comfortable enough. I mean, I do not know.
I think, I honestly believe it wasn't until the podcast. So our podcast launched December fifth, and once we started speaking, because we had not spoken, we had not released a statement, we had said nothing. And once we started speaking, the tabloids cared a lot less because it was there was a vacuum. There was a void, so they could fill it and anytime they saw me walk out or you walk out, they could create a story about our facial expression or what we were doing. If we smiled we
were gloating, we were rubbing it in people's faces. We weren't being respectful. If we had a sad look on our face, we were breaking up, we had a fight, we were doomed, and so it got to the point where I didn't even want to walk my dog. So
it wasn't until we started speaking in our podcast. So I really feel like it's just been in the last three months where we now feel like we can hold up our heads and then walk down the street and the photographers went away for the most part once we started talking.
No, Charl's crazy, you asked that quite haven't thought about that. We I guess it was almost a full year that we weren't comfortable even going to lunch together. There's a spot around the corner from us downtown that has a We go in there to eat. We don't sit at the bar. There is a wooden booth that we can close the door and the only person that can see is is the bartender who can come to us and take like this. That was our place to do it.
It was like we were in a confessional.
Yeah, so we were high. We were finding places to be safe and to hide out, and so yeah, I guess it did.
Sol House was one of them. Actually, yeah, membership hit we go in here, but there was a chase in Manhattan. We had to get police involved to get into Soho House. I mean it was crazy. I was like, it was the most bizarre experience. Even having been in the media and seeing how other celebrities have dealt with things, you don't know what it's like until you're in it, and you just think, this is the most bizarre, like like crazy experience I couldn't have imagined. But it beats you down.
It's funny. We literally, guys one day we were imagine this day, full daytime, daylight out, the two of us running down this street right here to get to get into Soho House because we're being chased walking. We were sprinting and running down the street trying to get into this building. So yeah, I guess it took a full year. Bro, I know ed I got in the red jack. They're waiting for a minute, go ahead, rather.
Yeah, thank you.
Quick.
Two part question. The first is, so, one thing they don't teach you in like school is how relationships can affect your career. So it's interesting that your personal relationship that's private ended up having an impact on your career. But say you were a doctor or a lawyer or so many other professions, it's like no one cares. So it's interesting to me, And I don't know how you would like structure that and like and for someone who's like growing up and thinking about these things and how
you could go about it. So I think you too, are in a position to help lead the way for people to like create a structure for thinking about this for someone, because if you are thinking about your career in journalism or I think like acting politics and like journalism are the only ones who really care about this stuff, others it's like no one cares, right Like, So that's the first I would just love to hear observations about
that one. The second is you two were such fantastic journalists, and you know, the country needs you, the country needs your voice, And I just wonder, you know, no one really watches I don't really watch network news like that anymore.
A lot of people aren't I And I know you don't want to get back into that grind, but when you see people like it's not a best example of like Tucker Carlson on X or people choosing alternative, alternative ways to reach the people, or even John Stewart going back to Comedy Central, was there has there ever been a thought, I know you're doing the podcast.
Has there ever been a thought of saying like we don't need ABC anymore? Like it's a new game now, people are watching TV in different ways. We're going to reach the people in another way because they need our they need us there.
Cool. So I'll take the first part, yes, and you can take the second. The first part is you know, I love what you said because how many people actually meet their spouses at work? I mean a lot of people do. That is a huge source of relationships because you spend most of your time with your coworkers when you get to a certain age, so it would make sense that you would likely hang out, go out after work, and potentially fall in love with your coworker. And I
think that was our frustration. Because there was no power structure. We were in the exact same position. No one was a boss over the other. So the truth is they had to we we yes, we got fired because of the distraction, but they had to honor our contracts because they could not fire us with fault because we didn't technically do anything wrong.
And they said that that we're not just saying that to you.
We put that is absolutely their word. So we didn't do anything technically wrong. People fall in love at work every day. It's what happens. The only issue is typically if it's a boss and someone who has power over someone else. That I understand. So it is incredibly frustrating that to me, well, we've said this that that a tabloid, a tabloid could actually take away our careers, and that
is what happened. So that is frustrating. But I would I think it's insane and silly just to think that you couldn't or shouldn't consider work being a place where you'd meet somebody. That is something that's been happening for the you know, since the beginning of time, and it's not going to stop. So I just think as long as you know that that's someone who's your equal, that you don't have power over that person, there's absolutely nothing
wrong with it. Now, you do always have to consider if you break up and you still have to work together, what that's going to look like. So that would be the only cautionary tale I think is you know, if you can still be friends afterwards, or at least tolerate working next to one another. That's probably the only legitimate concern you should have about dating somebody who you work with.
Yeah, our podcast contract is more solid than any marriage license we will ever sign, because that's the thing that's going to keep us together. But my the guy you're dealing with, Martin is a good friend of mine. Well, he's a We went to University of Arkansas together and he helped us put this together tonight. But he said something that goes to your point about the second part, which is you talk about the other outlets, and you talk about the networks and being in journalism and your voice.
People are over it. They are over looking at something that is inauthentic, that isn't relatable. And as soon as you're able to relate, soon as you're able to be authentic. I tell students this all the time. The only are they're trying to be like this gualan TV or that gallant TV. I'm gonna emulate that anchor. The only way you can stand out is to be yourself. And we have struggled to find our way, our footing and our voice.
I think as soon as we nail that, and we are getting closer and closer and closer and getting out of that shame we're talking about. When people see there are more people that relate to they might not shout it from the rooftops like yeah, I was I had this issue in libraries, but they know it, they feel it, they hear it, they relate to it. And if we are speaking about it so openly and freely, I think that is a freedom we now have that we didn't
have before. That we relish and having that taken away again is not something we are interested in at all. So I appreciate what you're saying about our voices and lending to through the conversations going on out there, But the type of conversations we want to have now at this stage in our lives and careers are not happening on network news.
All right, And Martin's Got one and I see you in front two.
Hi Tej and Hi Amy. I'm Kyla. I'm not a Jewish mom, but I am a divorcee and I can relate in a lot of ways. The first part is the comment, which is a quote from Obrah where she says there's no wrong roads in life, that everything had to happen a reason in life, for a reason for you to get to where you are. So you might take the wrong career, you might be in the wrong relationship, but you had to kind of go on that path
to be where you are. So although maybe ideally you didn't want to go in this direction, but I feel like if it didn't go this way, you probably wouldn't
be here right now. The second but my question is, though, do you feel like proximity has a lot to do with relationships and especially as we get older in life, when you start realizing who you really are and what you have in common with people connecting with someone who has a similar background or has a similar you see where I'm going with this question.
We've said this so many times that if we met in our twenties, we would have hated each other. We met in our thirties, maybe we wouldn't have hit it off, but she and I have. You wouldn't believe the trajectories of our lives and careers that are so paralleled. We from where how we grew up, where we grew up schools, we went to the paths that we took to go from this market to that market to cable news to network news and ended up in the same spot. The parallels were just unreal.
And a blackmail version of me.
We'll edit that out as well, But that sounds yeah, I know she said that before. I do believe that timing is absolutely everything. And I wasn't ready for her or this relationship ten years ago. I was wasn't ready to receive a lot of the help she was giving me when we started working there. I just wasn't there. So to anybody. And again, you live enough life, you know this and understand it. Sure, proximity can have a
lot to do with it. But we had so much in common, and so many things in our lives had to happen exactly the way they did before we ever met for us to end up in this position. Our second marriages, both of us. This is freaky. This will oh, this is so free, This is freaky. We didn't know each other in twenty ten, but we got both of us individually, got married, didn't know each other, got married two weeks and two days apart in twenty ten, didn't know each other, but both of our weddings took place
two weeks and two days apart. Both of our divorces, and the ends of our marriages took place three weeks apart all those years later, so weird the exact same now, some people universe talking to you, sending you a certainty. You don't believe that. I believe in that, and I understand. I know better now, I've lived enough to know when the universe is giving you every signal. She likes to call it, what you say, a lighted runway, lighter runway.
Just as we were realizing how we were feeling, ABC was sending us every week to just these unbelievable destinations doing all of these things together. I was like, how I've never been sent around the world with one person for a solid eight months straight. Right when all of this was happening, it just felt like it felt like a lighted runway. It really did.
It was.
It was a bizarre thing. But I do agree that when you can find somebody that it's just easy with. Not to say we don't fight, but we can be silly together and we don't judge each other and we like the same sh that makes it so much easier. You don't have to be like that, but it's just it's nice to just be able to fully.
Be yourself and we are we going to have to write there was somebody you were pointing to.
In this moment.
How you feel right now after sharing it?
Oh?
Lighter? I mean he was so nervous before we came on the stage. I was a little I've never seen you so nervous, like genuinely, but how do you feel now? I feel lighter, you.
Know, Mann? I was to be honest. We rode here with my daughter, Sabine in the car with us, and she actually said to me, yeah, you why are you so nervous? And I asked, have you seen me nervous before? She says she couldn't really come up with said maybe one other time. And I was so nervous, because guys, we are this is the first time for two people who have spent twenty five plus your careers being in front of people. This is the first time that we've
come face to face with an audience. That's a little nerve wracking, you don't know. And I'm kind of jokingly about the tomato in the back, but we always still have that in the back of our minds that somebody is after us. And I did. I said, Hey, if this happens if somebody rushes the stage. I actually said that if somebody, some YouTuber in here is trying to make a point, get something to go viral and gonna threaten us in some way, try to get we have
to prepare for. We actually did, and that sucks and I'm sorry, but doing it now. And this is why it was so important for doctor Garder to be here. It was so important for we have so many friends over here. You can't get to them because they're behind the red velvet rope. But to have Sabine here, my daughter, and to have her daughter, an Elysea in the room, and what we've wanted and wanted and wanted is to
make sure our kids were exposed to us. We hang out all the time, but to be exposed to us and see that, oh wow, they do have support, Like there are other people who love mom and dad, there are other people who are supporting them. Was very important. So do I feel lighter? Maybe the second Manhattan has something to do with how light I'm feeling. But thank you for that question. And yes, you all are part of absolutely therapy for us, and we do sincerely thank you for that.
Thank you, thank you for being so kind and warm and we appreciate it.
We were given this to wrap. Thank you again and again you all hand for doctor Guardier. Thank you, Amen JJ, thank you doctor Guardia. Give them a closing thought. Anybody who's thinking about their life now and the choices they're making, give them a closing thought.
So what we see here very quickly is that it is not just the retelling of a story, but looking for the meanings in the things that have happened and understanding that everything is in divine order. We have a lesson to learn each and every day. But to tell your story, you have to be courageous and not own the pathology of those who criticize all the time, because, as I like to say, how can you criticize the splinter in another person's eye when you have a plank
in your own. Don't own their stuff, Do your thing.