Not to say she's not.
But again, Asia Willison, No, no, he said more than angel Ree's you know. To me, I'm thinking she's already had all these accomplishments. Why hasn't it happened already? It should have already happened. We all agree that she should have her own shoe. If we're looking at Nike, maybe Nike's not the movement.
Welcome back to Unplug our weekly.
Look around, and there was a lot to look around at Jack. A lot of fun stuff happened over these past week Denver Recap. We had a good time, went out there and messed with our coach, Prime and Shador and then I see you rocking. You came back loaded. Huh bro I headed the school shot.
But prom say, you got some packages on the way for us, so we got more coming.
Also.
Man caught up with Jake the Snake Plumber and his mushroom farm and got a chance to meet Dale and this whole team.
Man, we had a blast up there. Can't wait for you guys to see that. Yeah, I'm fresh out my lines. Maine, Man, you've been psilocybin duck. No, lie, man, they got no psilocidin oh Lion's Maine.
I think you said, fresh off your lines, I didn't know what was the boot.
To know what's going on over here. I just want to know this thing.
Reminder, we're going on tour. The first two leads of our tour Detroit June third and Chicago June fourth, Man, b Square, go to our page for tickets.
Uh, it's definitely going down. Man.
We'd love to see you guys there again Chicago Detroit where when we said who do what city should we come to?
They represented the most. Man.
So again, this is the first two stops. I think we got like six more. So keep throwing your cities in there. Man, we want to come see you guys.
Please come to the show.
You sounded like Bob from Martin. Thank you, cowboy Bob. Ryan Garcia shocked the world. Man dominated heini. Obviously you're the expert in the boxing field. Actually, we were all in what Jake gave us on the FaceTime and also a little bit of cannabis because that was four twenty as well, so we all kind of watched the fight together from different parts of the country.
But man, what did you see in that Hainey Garcia fight?
I had peete with Ryan. His mindset was when he came into the way in three pounds over. You know, Ryan had no plans to even.
Make hi weight.
He knew the last experience he had in a big fight like that with Tank we he had to make weight and he didn't come in the weigh he didn't come in to fight strong as he felt as he normally feel. So he felt like, you know what, I pay that one point five. I probably make thirty forty million off the fight. That one point five ain't nothing, and fuck them belts. I don't even want the belts. I just want to get the money and beat you and get to win. And he went in there and
did that. He was a bigger fighter, He was a stronger fighter. Devin punches didn't affect him at all. Ryan went in there and did what he told everybody he was gonna do. People thought he was crazy, but he went in there and fought the fight. Now, I will say this, Matt, three pounds mean a.
Lot, especially in those lighter divisions and weight training all all that matters.
So I would I would like to see the fight with the way yeah and no with with uh Ryan making weight.
But I'm saying it would probably be a catch like one forty five, then he wouldn't he he already said he's not going back to one forty no matter what. So maybe a catchway he said he wants to fight one forty seven.
Maybe a catch at one forty five. Yeah, but I don't think it's gonna happen. I think I think he moving on.
I think he didn't beat devn he just and he'd beat Devin in great fashion.
They got to run that back, Jack, I mean, I mean.
A lot of and a lot of we're saying it, but I don't think Ryan will you know, Ryan and Ryanan called our boots.
Was was not a great move. He's calling the other fighters.
I honestly think Matt, I honestly think they're gonna move on because Ryan is not fighting for belts. The only way he fights, uh uh, Devin Haney again for belts at a catchwaight, it's for the belts, and Ryan is not fighting for belts.
He's fighting for money and he's fighting just because he loved the sport. M I don't know.
I think they're definitely gonna I think they got they got a running back the one I mean, I mean what I saw is I mean, just explosive hands. You know, obviously Hainey Haney, Haney got one of the best jazz, but like you said, his punches weren't really doing nothing to Ryan. And I want to say, I think it was the seventh round that ref was on some bullshit. Man, that ref was on some bullshit, the extra long counts
getting in the way, letting the holding go. Like I really thought that Ryan had a chance to, uh to finish Haney. But Jack, you and I discussed before. I thought, I mean, I like Haney a lot. I thought Lumba Chenko beat him. He did, yeah, you know, I mean I thought Lumba Chanko beat him. But it was only a matter of time.
You know.
He ran into Garcia Pops. You know, what's it, Bill Haney, Right, that's his name.
Bill. I just didn't. I mean, and we're we're we're fathers, so we get it.
But he was just talking real, real, real greasy out there, and uh it was you know, at some point I'm just like, damn, like you know what I mean, this is between them.
But at the end of the day, you know, it made a fight.
Everyone thought Ryan was crazy, you know, every thought everyone thought Ryan went off the deep end and he was doing all this and I and it was funny because I made a comment like three or four days ago and I forgot what what paide. I was just like, if this this dude's doing a hell of a job of selling the fight.
I hope he's there mentally and to find out, this whole ship was a plan. Man.
So he did a great job because he did everything he do to sell the fight and then went out there and performed and shocked to perform everybody. And I and I don't I don't know if this is but I read this morning too that he bet two million on himself in that fight and went twelve off the betting side too. So if that, if that is true,
that's super dope man. Happy for him, you know, definitely happy for m because there's kind of been a you know, he's a social media rapper or a boxer and he can't do this and he's not doing that and he's not focused, and he this dude went out here and did it his way in one So it'll be interesting to see, you know, who is next opponent, if it's a rematch with Tank, if if there's other people in the mix.
I mean, what do you see? It won't be tanked in for them already.
Ryan is not gonna do a rehab vision clause again, so that's not gonna fight and it makes no sense.
I mean, tankeding already beat him.
Ryan getting better, So a lot of guys gonna start ducking Ryan, trust me, because of that speed, his size at that weight class, it's just dangerous and he and he got so much power. So I would like I would like to see him fight either Pitbull Cruise or Chaquelle Stevenson to see where he really at, you know what I'm saying. And then I think if he wought chakor Stevenson, I think that'd be a great uh tune up for Chaquelle Stevens in the tank.
Tank just announced he's gonna fight Frank Martin and Ben. The videas will be the Cole Maine June fifteenth in Vegas. Yep, fight Town Fight Way with Horror is fight Town coming back?
Jack? You got something to share with us, I'll let you introduce her that she was already introducing. It just sounds good here.
You said, no, I mean I want to know. I mean, obviously, fight town is back. Something you started over at Showbox and you know, now that we're doing our own thing, we've been able to you know, talk to some people, to know some people that owe some people. Get it back, you know, get get the lines back working. But tell us about it and who you're working with.
Fight Towns, We're back.
Shout out the DraftKings, Shout out to bad my guy who always making shit happen. Fight Times back Man show boxing show. We started the showtime, you know, but we wen brought it over here. Now we're finna get it back. We're going to Miami. We're going to link up with UH David Bennabdez, Roy Jones and UH and Tank and UH and talk to them, you know, for the right before the big fight. But having Roy Jones on, we're
possibly uh even bringing on the great andre Ward. So just to just to have those two great minds, UH a part of a part of this company and this new ventually starting with Fight Times and in our new boxing company. Matt, I'm excited, man, because you know, I'm a big fan of boxing and Uh. I love going to these guys hometowns learning more about these boxes because I admire the.
Way they stay in shape, you know, the.
Things they go through, the ups and downs in the boxing RNE, the the punch and the bullet. No like, all this stuff. I admire because I'm a warrior and my damn self. But I ain't a worry to that to that damn extent, you know what I'm saying, not to that extent. So yeah, I admire those guys. So I'm glad we back. Shout out b D again.
Definitely shout out BD.
You know, as you said, we're you know, and in close conversations with andre Ward the Great andre Ward and Roy Jones, Jack. We've been working, man. People don't know, man, we're you know, we're in the boxing space now. We got some MMA stuff cooking, we got some football stuff cooking.
We got we cooking. You know, we over here, man, So dream team.
Yeah, man, it's been fun to be able to you know, I mean, we're getting we're creating great content, getting paid like we're still athletes, but then also opening up doors for other people and bringing more people on the roster. Obviously shout out everyone who's on the roster right now. More big names coming, but more important, man, great content.
You know it's coming.
From a good place, and you know, we're blessed to be able to continue to build our company and do what we love.
Jack.
Now we want to welcome to the show one of our brothers, Brandon Jennings, one of your Oak Hill comrades.
BG. All right, BJ, whatever, Bro? What what up? What up? Y'all?
What's up?
How's life? How's everything going right now? Good Man?
Good up this morning?
Got the podcast in a couple of hours, So I just wanted to chat with my boys.
Well, appreciate you spending a little time with us. Jack.
I'm gonna let you kind of run it because you guys just had your Oak Hill reunion of sorts, your jersey was retired, and you guys got a little project coming.
So let's talk to us. What's going on?
Yeah, shot out, my little bro, Man, one of the realist men I've met.
Man.
We played together in the league and Milwaukee together as somebody who I consider a real brother, Bro.
So thank you for coming on today. Man. We went to Okill together. You know, got putting in the Okay Hall of Fame.
Such an honor that man, you both appreciated and wonted because so many great players come up out of there. We went down there, we got the OKILL Doctor is out now you can catch it all Smokeroducts YouTube. We had a great time, man. I think the experience all the players wasn't there, but a nice group of players that we were inducted with. And then to be back to OKILL was a great feeling. Talk about your experience being there, man, Okay.
Man, I remember getting there at sixteen, Man, definitely a culture shock coming from la you know, coming from Domingus actually Compton, and then you know, just I think, you know, I got to get the credit to my mom, man, because being sixteen and her even just having the confidence in me just to go away all the way from California to Virginia and you know, play basketball was a huge step in my life for me and also a challenge. So I got to give it all of up to
my mom for that. But the experience was great, man. I was able to, you know, work on my game every day. You know, Steve Smith, you know the schedule that we played, you know, we was always playing against eight against five. You know, the challenges, the different you know, everybody on the team was going D one and just you know, just the experience. Man, just being able to focus on basketball was something I needed at sixteen.
Yeah, I agree, bro.
When I mine was kind of similar my mom. She believed in Steve Smith too. I know if I didn't leave, I was I was going to either be dead or in jail. But I knew I could play basketball, and to be there away from everything, focusing on basketball and still being traveling there to all these terms, being able to be seen everything I needed because not only did it show me that the geam of me making it to the next level could really happen, but it also
it made me appreciate the game. It made me appreciate Steve Smith and being at okill in the position it put me in.
So it did the same for me.
I mean the structure. Let's talk about the structure of the school. You know, you know we had Saturday schools. You know, we had to go to church. You know, we had to wear uniforms a certain way.
You know, we had to wear uniforms, and we only had like six or seven people to a class. So we got the attention far as like education wise, and then you know, you just played basketball every day. So it was kind of like, I don't know it was like I don't know, it was like the first europe experience.
I guess just playing basketball.
I don't know if this younger generation appreciates just the history, because you know, this younger generation is not so much on history. But just to have you know, forty five NBA players come through there at one point, from Carmelo kd Rondo Stackhouse, Rod Strickland, Josh Smith, Michael Beasley.
To name it.
I know you guys have a list of guys, but just the history of that program and Steve Smith and not only how it was a positive influences on your basketball life and career and journey, but like you said, be off the court and you know, taught you discipline and and structure and you know how to do the above and beyond, which is really dope. Why do you guys feel this kind of a joint question that kind of structure on and off the court is so important
to continue. Why is it for that important for that story to continue to be told.
I mean, I think the way social media is today, I think it's probably needed way more for kids just to focus because we're seeing a lot of things and you know, the internet is like it's a fake place. So you know, kids get these highlight tapes and they think they're you know that it's on, and it's like like, you know, you got to get back to the grid and grind of it and just being away, man, like just being away like you're not I mean, you're not
really missing much. I mean, you know, if you can dedicate your life to basketball for you know, from from from sixteen to eighteen and just focused on strictly that, I mean, I think the outcome is gonna be insane for you.
I think I think to b for me, o'kill still gives you that old school high school field. You in a small town, the whole town comes out to every home game, and it's just about basketball there. You know, it's not about nothing else, it's not about no politics. It's about basketball. And you're gonna and you're gonna work
on your gaming and become a better man. I think, like you said, social media and some money being involved in so much going on with kids bouncing around playing even in high school, not just in the portal kids doing that in high school in the aa U circle too, bouncing around playing from team to team to getting paid.
So I think places like Okill. It's very important if kids want to just be a high school kid, grow up in high school, play basketball the right way, but also be seen the way you need to.
And also to piggyback on that is like you're also playing with other great players, right, so how to play with great players?
So when you played, I.
Was gonna ask not to cut you off, like what are those practices? Like, I mean, you guys had you know, d one NBA players in high school, so what were those I'm sure those practice sometimes is really in the games a lot of the time.
Yeah, I mean for me crazy, I mean no, I played as long as like Nolan Smith, Alex Legion, Julian Vaughn, Trey Thompson, and you know, every day it was a battle. But like like I said, my team was so good, so being able to play with good players was always
easy for me. That's why au me and Kevin Love you know what I'm saying, we went thirty eight No, because just playing with o'kill every day, like you know, you learn how to play with great players, and in the NBA, you know that's how it's gonna be anyway.
And Steve Smith was good at teaching man he'll probably our practices started. He'll he'll go through some stuff, teach, teach for about a good ten fifteen minutes. The rest of the practice is all scrimmaging. He wanted to live, he wanted to do practice with he teach live, so we he didn't do too much talking. We did a lot of playing in practice.
Fellas, We're gonna play a quick game right here with the start of the NBA playoffs, and and there's you know, always a lot of overreactions in this space.
So you guys tell me if it's gonna breathe in or breathe out? Are you fucking with it? Are you not?
Adidas is stomping Nike in the signature shoe game right now. Uh ant Man just released his debut Love Low Tops. Harden came through with his heat, Dame came through with his firing Game one on the flip side right now. Obviously Giannis didn't play. I think bronze shoes have gotten a lot better now that they're more sleek and and and you know, kind of up to the newer kids with the kids like fashion. Obviously, kd uh d book jaws on the sidelines, and I'm seeing a lot of guys and.
Kids now too wearing this Sabrinas.
So with all I just said, is Adidas the top signature line for basketball right now?
No, and and and and they never will be. But they got some fresh air coming out there. I think I think the ant Man's are super dope. I would rock them if I could, you know, shout out to Jordan Brand, but uh uh it's stupid. Uh, They're definitely doing their thing. Bro Uh they did. I think. I think I think Nike. The reason Nike lost their tame
is ever since they lost Kyrie. If you went to every every AU tournament because I got sons, I got my daughter, Matt, you got sons, y'all got your kids playing basketball, beach and everybody.
You go to these tournaments, it ain't nothing but Pg's and Kyrie's and Kobe's. Yeah, you're sprinkling through Bron's in there now. You know. With my daughter, I'm going, I'm going, I'm going.
I'm seeing the Kyries, the Sabrinas and the and broar so like. But with not since they lost Kyrie, it ain't been the same for him. And I think too, you know, Adida's got the young players. You know some of the young players and guys that's really making noise right now too, Matt, along with their shoes coming out. So if you if you're putting up numbers, your team winning, when you're dropping shoes, it all makes sense absolutely for me.
I'm gonna say Adida, say is running it right now? You know, I love I love the layout that they did it. You know, the hardens the ant Man's especially Ant becoming one of the faces of the league. I think with Nike, you know when you said when they lost Kyrie, that was huge, but I think them missing job huge job.
He was supposed to be.
He was supposed to not have to cut you off, but he was supposed to kind of and I was going to soften the hit that Kyrie left.
I agree with you one thousand percent.
Yeah, So you know, losing losing I mean not losing job, but job being hurt right now and not being on the floor hurts him a lot. So I'm gonna go with Adidas right now. But then you know, you know, you got Curry Grant coming up. They just signed Curry, you know, the Fox, And then you know, I'm working on some stuff in that Darmer. So we'll see you know, we'll see, get.
Your creative hats on and tell us about it.
But also kind of new stuff is fired too, so you know he decided to over there like his new line is fired to they start buying.
His new line fire ye the way, I judge, all this is what am I seeing the AU tournaments.
Although I definitely think Adidas is making waves in the league right now, does that transition into dollars with the public, and you see, you guys, know you see the Kobe's, you see uh, I see a lot of Sabrinas. Now you know, you you still see a majority of Nike.
So they finished up buying the Caitlyn's and the Wimby's.
And then you know, and then Juju, I mean, you know, I mean, it's definitely gonna be a lot of girls.
You're definitely gonna be next. You know.
Interesting you said that, you know, we with the conversation of ladies, you know about Caitlyn Clark getting her signature shoe and how come Asia Wilson doesn't have her signature shoe? And I wanted to kind of toss that around real quick with both you guys and hear your thoughts.
Well, I mean you know, you know my thoughts. I mean, it's just there's no reason for her not to have one. I mean, she's won back to back, she's won the MVP, she's won all the wats, has been the best player of MVP, defensive player. And the three players that got signs shoes are all white. You know what I'm saying like that, that's crazy and it ain't being racist. These are just the facts, you know what I'm saying. I mean, but look, even to go further, you had four black
women that went number one. They never got paid what Kayla's getting paid.
You know what I'm saying. So, like I wasn't aware of those numbers.
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, she getting seventy eight. Alil Boston that went to Indiana last year, number one pick she got. She she's the second closest to her, she got seventy six.
But yump. So I mean it's to scale up if youy chair.
But still, you know what I'm saying. I'm just saying, these are the facts. You know what I'm saying. But no question, Asia deserves her shoes.
No diagree everything you said. Her accomplishment, but is she moving the needle like that?
Like like like these young girls are.
Coming in from college, like you know, I mean, their numbers are just crazy, like I mean the game, like, you know, can't she move the needle like that?
I think you know As is definitely moving neither.
I will call you no, but I mean Jack not to say she's not, to say she's not. But again to me, no, no, he said more than Angel Reese, you know what I mean. To me, I'm thinking, she's already had all these accomplishments. Why hasn't it happened already? It should have already happened. We all agree that she should have her own shoe. If we're looking at Nike, maybe Nike's not the move. Maybe it's Steph. Maybe it's you know, Steph and his brand. Maybe it's it's Adidas,
you know what I mean. So I'm thinking. But at the same time, and I saw an interesting fact, and I want to say, I don't know if Kannas Parker she had her own signature shoe with Adida, so I'm not mistaken. I don't know she still does. But the way I was looking at is you can't hold that, you know, obviously, seeing three white women that have their signature you can't hold that against those women.
Though.
I'm not people's issues with Nike, and I don't like that people are trying to discredit Kaitlyn Clark because she has a shoe before she's even stepped in the WNBA. Because for the reason that Brandon just said, she moves the needle. She is a movement in herself. So all these people that kind of feel a certain way about Caitlyn coming in the league, or she hasn't done nothing, or players kind of saying they're a little slick ship that we've been seeing them say, they should all be
happy because she's bringing eyeballs with her. She's bringing in the whole ecosystem with her. Like they said, Jack, she sold one mergers in one day. Then your team sold in the whole entire year.
The Cowboys, the Cowboys. We were just talking about Nike falling off, right, Yeah, I don't know falling off, but yeah, I.
Mean yeah, but yeah bye bye by not by not by not having the signature shoes, right because they the singing shoes are not popper, right, So you're saying, how many players with Nike they have signature shoes right now, that's.
Not moving the needle. I don't know, you'd have to look. I wouldn't want to say we just talked about it. We just talked about it. Who who are you talking about a lot.
Of those players that got Signey shoes were talking about the das has passed them and people are not wearing those shoes. Right, They're not moving the needle, but they still got they still got Signy shoes. You're saying, were Asia Wilson moved the needle. She is moving the needle. She's winning the championship. But you got guys in the NBA that ain't moving any of that.
But it's still different, Jack.
I mean, a w NBA championship is not set, with all due respect, it's not celebrated like an NBA championship.
I'm not saying that. I'm not comparing like that.
Her accolades obviously in her league, in her league, she is that.
She's she's she's the one, she's her in her league.
I mean, if I'm Nike, if I'm Nike, honestly, I'm giving Juju a signature shoot right now in college.
Off the risk question.
You know what I'm saying like that, But but that's why you got to go.
With it, Clay Caitlen Clark right now, because she's moving the needle and that was gonna move.
Nobody's denying that. Nobody's denying that. Nobody's denying that. But Asia deserves that too.
Yeah, but you also got to think I think Asia kind of missed obviously, like Jack we taught had her on the show, she missed that ni l ship. You know, she said she would have been showing up with minks like Frank Lucas. So with this nil stuff, these girls are coming into the w n B A bigger than the w n B A yeah, you know what following in their brands and their visibility and their market you know, you mean, the way they can market themselves. Now, so all these women that are in the w NBA, you
could sit, we're all hoopers. We can kind of sense the slick shit that is being said, but they should all appreciate it because they're all all these the top seven picks are all coming in, top ten picks are all coming in with built in So my whole question, fellas was with that excitement and the storylines from college basketball translate to the w because if it does, it's gonna change the game.
It's definitely gonna change the game.
And obviously they're going to go back after this year and go back to the tables and redo their negotiations. And there's some new TV stuff in the works for them, and there's a big sponsor coming in, so contracts and salaries are definitely gonna be up. But I just love the fact that we're having these type of conversations because that means the game is growing, whether you know people like it or not.
I mean, it's society right now. Don't get get better and better.
So I mean the WNBA is gonna have to do their job, make it bigger, you know what I'm.
Saying, regards what somebody else do, regardless what you do, if you if you be, if you go score thirty and you coming in my league and you and you big regards what you done, what you do. I know what I've done in this league. So yeah, you deserve what you what you've done and what you're coming into.
But I deserve it too. No one's arguing with that. No one's arguing with that.
But like I said, I just think these younger women, I think I feel like Caitlyn is taking heat, you know, similar to where Agel was taking heat a while back for different reasons.
But you can't be mad at Caitlyn because she has a big ass deal, not at all, you know what I mean.
That's what I'm trying to tell these people, like you can't be It's not her fault, right, It's her fault that she hooped and did because it's not like she's just you know, some great white like she's a hooper. I think she benefited off the Steph Curry effect, you know what I mean. People love the way Steph kind of changed the game as a whole, along with Clay
and some other guys. But that she shoots the ship from half court with without effort, and she's carrying a with all due respect, not a you know, not a super talented team, to the team to the Final four and to the championship. So her game speaks for itself. So I just I just don't like the negative attention that any of these women are getting because at the end of the all these women are gonna help build this game more and take it to the next level.
Okay, okay, we could I be negative again.
How do you feel about how do you feel about Caitlin Clark and her team that didn't win the national championship get invited to Saturday Night Live, her whole team, but the national championship actually didn't.
Because I'm moving the needle.
Yeah, Don Stanley not moving the needle, not like she definitely is moving the needle.
Don Staley is definitely moving the needle.
I am trying to make I ain't trying to make this racial. Don't think I'm just speaking the facts. Bro, I'm not making it racial because people try to twist my words.
I'm just I'm just I'm just asking our question. I'm speaking. I'm mad at that. I'm not mad at the question.
But I think what b Jenny said, bros moving and Don Staley is definitely moving the needle. But nobody, I would argue that nobody right now, in this little last month is moving the needle like Kaitlyn Clark period, not Lebron, not nobody like Kayln Clark has fascinated and captured the entire world. So no one is moving the needle like her. So I get I get the Saturday Nights Year, I get the Nike deal.
I get it. Now he gonna have to come and prove that shit, though, you know what I mean.
So moving on, James Worthy, the great Hall of Famer, friend of the all the smoke praying, and he said, Yokic is a combination of magic and Kareem. He said to me, Yokic is magic and Kareem on the floor at the same time. He's a guard who makes great decisions and is a hell of a passer. But when you need, he wants to be Kareem. He goes down in the post and dominates. Question to you, guys, if Yokic wins a chip in an MVP this year, where do you have him on your all time list? Not
all time sinners, we'll talk about that too. Where do you have him in the all time? Is he cracking the top ten fifteen, twenty, Brandon, I'm gonna start with you.
He cracking the top thirty, Okay, Like I get him top thirty.
Still it's too early, so accolades are heavy. Game is heavy. But he's in your top thirty, Yeah, top thirty?
Right now?
Where do you have him on your top centers of all time? Is he top ten there?
Yeah, he's top ten for sure, He's top ten. He's creeping off the bench right now.
Okay, so around six seven he's off the bench. Six I might put him higher. Jack, where's Yoki chat for you? Well, one, you can't.
You can't never go against what Jane Worth is saying because he played with Magic and Korean, so he knowing better than anybody. And that's a great comparison because you can see a lot of both of them and them. I think for me, I got him on the all time list. I got Yokish top ten, topki skim me, top fifteen, top fifteen, top twenty, top fifteen somewhere or up.
Yeah.
And my all time center list, I got him top five. Ooh, okay, I think I'm gonna agree.
I definitely. I don't know where he's at.
I don't have time to knock a list down right now, but I feel like he's in my top twenty players of all time and he's still got you know, more time, and they got something really good going over there right now. And then as far as centers, yeah, I put him up there, man. I mean to me, it is the greatest center of all time. And then you you know, you look at Kareem and then you know, people say Wilt and Russell, but I'm throwing Yoki right up in that mix is TOUGHI is tough. So we shall see.
Are we seeing a passing of the torch in front of our eyes? As far as the new wave of the n.
B A H. Steph didn't make it.
Kd and and and his boys are up against the next face of the league, Anthony Edwards Lebron. It's gonna be uphill sledding to see if they even get out of the first round this year. But you look at that ant man Uh Luca. I don't know if they're gonna get out the first round, but we all know what lucas about.
And then Jokic. Are we seeing a passing of the torch? Fellas hell? I think so?
I think so for the simple fact that you know, you know, when when when you start to see, you know, the guys that was that was carrying the torch starting to be in the play in every year, that's the big sign. And and and you're seeing guys like Shai the youngest team in the NBA be number one in the Western Conference when Western Conference is normally the toughest conference. That's that's that that's starting to say a lot. So yeah, the passing of the torch is definitely here.
Yeah, the passing of the torches here, and the lead's gonna be in a good hands man.
Man, Luca, your kids, you got tit on, you got shy.
You know, you got a bunch of young guys man that can that can hold their own, and you know they're not playing together.
They're all like, you know this this thing like they want to an act man.
You know, he definitely want to go against everybody. So just his demeanor, you know, his or and what he brings to the game. Man, I think you know, the lead's gonna be in a good in good hands.
These young boys not really trying to team up? Is this Are they going to bring that wave back of not really trying to because it was a it was a Big three era for a minute that we all you know, we're part of and and played in and it doesn't necessari but obviously all these guys are young and they haven't got there. You know, they're coming some of them are still coming off their first deals. But do you think this next wave is going to kind of take it back to what it used to be.
But we're not teaming up.
We may get one guy, but that's about it and we try to we go on to each other's.
Next I could see it. I mean the money too.
I mean, you know, Supermax, you know the way the way the money is going in there. You know, the way first team, second team, third team is is kind of like, you know, it's kind of like you stay
over there. I just said, you know, at this time, and I mean, and the way guys are just putting up numbers too, you know, it's just crazy, like they're so young and and you know, the way Minnesota has already built their team, it's kind of like, you know, they have their they have their guys, they have him and Cat, and you know they have a vet in Mike Conley. So you know, some of these teams are well put together. They just got to add just like one, one or two, you know pieces.
I just want to see it from okayce in Minnesota. I love it.
I love that they got there. We all know the regular season is a little bit different than the playoffs. But right as of now, although man, OKAYC went down to the wire last night with that was a really good game with New Orleans, you know, obviously minus Zion, But I just want to see it from these young teams.
You know, obviously, Jack, we spoke.
It's kind of a change in the guards from you know, okay, season number one in the West now and so they finished third, but I got to see it in the playoffs. One thing that also drew my attention was the ship that Anthony Edwards was talking to KD, and KD loved it. KD loved it obviously, KD, you know, being uh Ant's favorite player, and it's you know, it's when your idols
become your rivals, so to speak. And and out of all these young players, and there's a lot of young players, I just love Anthony Edwards energy and his game backs it up. What was going through you guys mind when you've seen him talking shit to KD like that.
I loved it.
Bro put us up the fact that he already He already then came out millions of times saying Kate is his favorite player.
Dog.
So when you get a chance in the playoffs to go up against your favorite player, one of the best players of all time, to prove yourself, it's no better feeling than that, Matt, There's no better feeling than that. When even though were the same age, when I got a chance to play against cobD in the playoffs after they had three pet it and beat them to go.
Win the championship. Doll, that was the best feeling in the world.
So when you you know, I looked even I looked up to Cobe even though it was the same age, just because how good he was. But I get it. That's the best fit in the world. And Katie embracing it, you know what I'm saying. He's not taking it the wrong way. He loved the competition as well. But it's good to see that you got players coming back that's ready to compete like that and give the game what we want to see.
Yeah, I mean it just talked about.
It just shows his passion and this is why he's about to be the face of the league. This is what the league wants. This is what the NBA is about. Like, you know, this is what you know, This is what the dogs. You know, this is when the dogs come out, and you know, this is when you take your game to the next level. This is something that everybody dreams of.
You know, everybody dreams to play against the favorite player on the court, give him thirty or being that big game, hit that big shot, against them, So I mean that just shows his passion and the love for the game.
So I'm rooting for the young gain.
The great Detroit Mercy point guard who knocked UCLA out in the tournament.
I think it's my freshman year.
Rashad Phillips on Twitter said, Katie smiles at like a proud father as he watches a generation he helped build have their moment in the midst of the battle. This is beautiful. As you get older, you will understand what I mean. KD is one of the greatest of all times. So I thought that was a beautiful, beautifully said by Rashade Fillips because like like I said, I mean, we're
seeing it. And I hope now people are appreciating what KD has been able to do for this game, what Steph has been able to do for this game, what Lebron has been able to do for this game. Because these guys, you know, two three years, they might not be here after that. So you know, I love when when in an era where everyone loves to talk shit and be disrespectful and critique everything, I hope that these people just appreciate what they've been able to see the
last twenty years. From Lebron and seventeen from KD And I think Steph's at fifteen or sixteen. So I just hope these people appreciate it.
Man.
One last thing before we get out of this. A man said he's the best two guard in the league over Booker. We don't leave that out there. We're gonna leave that out there.
I'm a Clippers, right, I'm not.
I ain't even argue. I'm just gonna throw it out there. I know book Go has to say. And that's the best part about it is.
You're playing each other in the playoffs right now, right, Clippers veteran savvy can it? Can it? Can it win? Obviously?
Can you guys think he can get them, get them out of the West? I mean minus Kawhi? They went took Game one versus Dallas Westbrook integral part off the bench, smart doing it on both ends, defensively and offensively. James Harden in his bag twenty eight and twenty eight and eight six for eleven from deep this supporting cast. I haven't even mentioned PG and what he brings to the game. Do you guys think that this team has a chance to get out of the West?
Man?
I mean the West is tough, man, you know, especially without Kawhi. Leonard is definitely going to be tough. But they're definitely gonna have to use Westbrook a lot and let him, you know, do his thing and you know, beat him. But yeah, man, I mean, you know, the West is so stacked.
Man, it's it's I don't know.
And we're not even saying they gonna get out the first round. Just up one nothing on Dallas. This I mean that the series, you know what I mean, the series is just getting started. But Jack, do you feel like, uh with if Kawhi is able to come back, can this team come out of the West.
That's my thing, Matt. I love the Clippers.
I love the coach I loved I love the way they put James and Russ and Kawhi and Parr together.
I love that whole little thing.
But I know Jason Kidd, I know Kawhi, I know Luca Donci is the leading scorer in the NBA this year.
They gonna come back. Real this is far from over.
This is far from over, yeah, because you know, you know, you know how Luclan had some amazing games there in the playoffs. So my thing is they can tie the series up now they have homecome home court advantage, So I don't we've seen We've seen James do this and and I love him James playing well because it's just the game is just more exciting when he getting his threes and doing his io, the game is way more exciting.
But he hasn't sustained that on no team he's been on to get them, you know what I'm saying.
To the championship out of the Western Conference.
So with with with Kawhi coming back, there's less shots with a lot of these guys too, So how this is gonna look when he come back. I don't know if the Clippers can do it, but I know they will see a different Dallas team come Game two.
I mean I kind of feel like, I mean, Clippers have been my pick from the beginning, and I agree with you know, James has been great, you know in flashes of the playoffs, but hasn't been consistent. But I think this team is different from a standpoint if he doesn't have to be him every single night, you know what I mean, Like, you know, PG could be him. You know, Russ can come off the bench and still
be him. If they're able to get Kawhi. We already know Kawhi's resume when it comes to playoffs in the finals, so I don't feel like there's as much pressure. And I don't know if pressure was the reason why he wasn't playing well at times, but those have always been kind of the James Harden shows with with with you know, with the Rockets obviously, and then him and Embiid and
that didn't really mix too well. But I just don't feel like there's a lot that as much pressure on him, and I feel like he's definitely gonna do his thing. But I do agree there's no telling if they're going to get out of this series if they don't have Kawhi, and I don't know if they can make it through the West uh without Kawhi.
But there's still my pick.
I can't go back on my pick, and I hope that Kawhi is able to come back BG before our BJ Before we get you out of here, man, we wanted to you know, obviously, your game speaks for it self.
We're definitely looking forward to having you come on of all the smoke soon, but we wanted to touch on just tough crowd and what you've been able to build and your brand and your partnerships and and and and what's kind of in the future for you there if you don't mind breaking it down for us as I'm interested, but I know our fans are institting here too.
Yeah.
Tough Crowd is a brand I started when I took a trip to China. I think it was my last year playing basketball, and I was just looking at how big our culture was over there, so you know, far as hip hop and fashion, and when I came back, I was just like, I want to start a brand.
Uh So started a brand.
Sat on the name Tough Crowd for for a while, and tough Crowd is just for anybody that's like an entrepreneur or anybody that's you know.
Wanted more in life.
And you know, at the end of the day, you know, life is just a tough crowd because we always got to prove ourselves and you know, it's always haters and doubters.
So that's like the meaning behind it a tough crowd.
And the reason why I put tough Crowd on the collar, uh was because back in the day, you know, they had the selfie era, right, so so you know everybody was taking selfie so I was doing that to use, uh to get the brand out there and use marketing. So it was like a cool little marketing way to get everybody to see the brand first.
So I know you if I'm not mistaking, I follow you on. I g I know you have a gym, a hoop gym that this brand. You've also did a partnership with your brother Steph Curry. Uh, and you were one of the early under Armour guys.
Mar Yeah.
Yeah, I was the first one to sign the un Armour.
Then Curry came over and so me and Curry, we have a a lot of relationships with people from an Armor. So it was just dope the fact to be able to do that collab go back to my home gym in Raleigh Park where I grew up at actually where I first started basketball three. So doing that for the community dropping the collapse was dope, man, And it was actually one of our biggest moments so far.
He man.
He also made our Hall of Fame jackets for our old kids ceremony too.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. They hooked everybody up.
That's what's up. That's really good.
And again we're gonna dig a little, you know, get into more of your story once we have you on the show. We just want to give you all a taste of what our guys giving you right now. But before we get you out of here Gil's Arena. Yes, in one year, you guys have done amazing things. You guys just had a live show. Shout out to the whole team, man. I think it's a beautiful thing, the way you guys have been coming together. I feel like there's just that we all know there's a huge shift
in media right now. And when I was on Paul George's podcast here there, I was like, I don't look at any of my brothers as competition. I feel like all moving the needle, we're all pushing, we're all changing the game. And there's enough money for all us because there's at least some good money out here. But tell us, you know how that you know how you guys kind of came about and what that experience it has been like for you guys.
Man experiences been great.
First, I want to shout out Gil Man forgiving me the opportunity and given you know, Rasha Keing, Lexi Brown, Josiah you know, uh, you know it's called everybody, Tim Steve everybody over there, Paolo, and you know, coming being from la you know, you know l A and I gotta be real.
You know, a lot of us we don't do business together. So you know, fortunately, you know the fact that.
Gil, you know, as a o G you know, gave me an opportunity to be on the show definitely has opened up a lot of doors for me outside of it, you know.
Speaking engagements for the NBA.
You know, getting back with the Bucks has been tremendous, so, you know, just the whole experience and just being able to talk about the game and my life.
You know, it's been great, man, it's been great. It's been awesome.
I think that shit is dope because you gouts, it's different, you know, I mean, like you bring your energy. Gil brings his energy. Rad Is Burnt over there, he brings his energy. K Mart and you know all the people you guys have rotating as well, other Joe Siah, you know what I mean.
Joe's our dog.
You know, I went to college with Joey, playing on the same hoop team. But I just really love but quick story, Jack, I don't I don't think I've never told this story. So a podcast was pitched to me before I came up with this idea for me and Kmart and this dude from Vice Sports pitched it to me. I don't even know if Kmart knows this story or not. I want to ask him one day. But the dude that was doing it died. The dude that had the idea and was was taking the device.
It died. And then really yeah, and.
Then maybe like six months later is when I hit you up, like yo, let's let's do this thing. But it was pitched to me originally to do something with Kmart.
That's my boy. Yes, our dog ye came came out and that's my brothers.
Man. I like I said, I love the energy in the mix, the mix of Burton we were talking for humor. Yeah, how was how was your We're gonna start doing a lot. We've done a few live shows. Were going on our live tour the summer. But how was it you guys you know sold out the l RA right to hundred people. I think, L right, what was that experience?
L Ray was great?
Man?
And the thing about the live show, like your fans come so they just being a rowdy, like they just asked the question. They just be shouting out stuff, you know, even going back and forth. The questions are you know, the questions are kind of intense, but I mean just overall man like, just to be out of the element of like playing in the you know, like in the arena and you know.
Having life after basketball and doing something different.
It's just like dang, like we still stars, like we still like, you know, still got it.
I love it. I love it.
Well.
Congratulations man, and again, thank you for coming on our show today, and we look forward to you coming and sitting down with us and really chopping it down for show man.
Thank you, Stack, Thank you, Matt love five you know that always always five heys.
And I love to the bros over there too. Yeah, y'all tell everybody we said whatever.
I love y'all.
Jack.
Right now, we want to welcome to the show. Uh. When when this idea was pitched to me, I loved it instantly, you know, once I looked up who he was and what he had going on, and then obviously who his sister was, like all this through this dope, but he also has his own story, not to mention you know what he's doing with coach cal So. Right now, welcome to Unplugged Craig Robinson.
Craig, how you doing, man.
I'm doing fine. So happy to be here with you, brothers. Man.
Thanks for having me, man, We appreciate you making some time for us. Former Division one coach two time has some game of his own. Jack two time IVY League Player of the Year over at Princeton, worked in the front office with the Bucks and the Knicks. Recently launched a new podcast with Coach Cal which I'm definitely looking forward to catching up on.
Craig. What's going on, man? I just do a lot at you, But what's going on with you right now? Currently?
Listen?
So.
I'm currently the executive director of the NABC, which is the National Association of Basketball Coaches. Two years ago we launched our own media content creating company called Coach Plush and and part of that, we've done three documentaries and we've launched this podcast called Ways to Win with Coach Cal and. Uh. I can't tell you how thrilled I am to be doing that, uh, and then to be on here with you guys. I am a huge fan of your show, was a fan of you guys while
you were playing. Even though I'm older than you, I know all about I coached in the Pac twelve, so so Matt, I came to Oregon State right after you left, a little bit after you left. So I coached against Drew and and Westbrook and that that team that just you know, we were eating the pants off folks. So Steven, I'm i'm I'm a big fan of yours because I like both of you all because you're like me. You like big guys who can play guard, but you you also can guard people both sides.
That's how I was both sides of the ball. Tell us how this pod with coach Cal came about? What should we be expecting? And then obviously the whirlwind. You know, your good friend is leaving Kentucky where he you know, set down at you know, set the presidents for the one and done and all the pros that he's turned out and he's off to Arkansas. So tell me how the pod came about, you know a little bit about your guys' friendship and what we should expect from the podcast.
Yeah, well, I've known Cal for a long time and he was always really nice to me when I got into coaching, and uh, and we've sort of stayed connected and then once I got this job. He was on the board, and I pitched the board on using our coaches to start a content creation company where we use our coaches and we tell stories about coaches, about coaching,
about ball. And then we had this idea to do a podcast about lessons learned on the court, on the field that can translate into regular life, the business world, uh, teaching, leadership, that kind of thing. And we were trying to figure out who would be good to be on and so I talked to a couple of coaches and I talked to Cal, and Cal, of course, you guys know how Cal is. He raised his hand, he was like, podcast, Yeah, I'm in, And that's how we that's how we got it.
And obviously we launched it right before the start of the NCAA tournament. So we're doing shows and then he's uh, plays in the tournament and then and then leaves Kentucky crazy and that's where we are. But it's it's it's been. It's been chaotic for him, I'm sure, but as you guys know, in this business, chaos makes for good stories.
Right and and and it don't last long.
And one thing about Cal I know from from watching for them from afar.
He hadjust quickly, you know.
What I'm saying, Yeah, he adjust real quickly, right right.
And you know, I I listened to your last episode it might not have been your last one, but a recent one where you had Boogie on talking about cal and talking about how the effect on him is like when you have two parents who get divorced, right for for for his players, they're they're riding with them one hundred percent, but they're still loyal to Kentucky. So I find that as a as a really interesting dynamic with all this going on. But you know, this is the
business that we're in. You know, you get hired, you get fired, and you know, my my question was to Kentucky, who you gonna get?
Right?
That's a hard act, that's a hard act to follow, and and you know, I represent all the coaches in our organization, so I'm happy for Mark Pope. But that's that's a hard job, hard fans, hard shoes to fill. I mean, come on.
Ye, it's gonna be a hard job.
You were you were a four year starter at Princeton under the Great Peter Carrol Carill pe carea excuse me, peop career.
And he was also a long time a king's assistant.
Did Can you say that the offense at Princeton taught you about life?
Oh? Absolutely, Steven, I will tell you it. It not only taught me about life, but it taught me how to play too, right, because you know, I'll start with that part first. You know, now, all the stuff you see run in the NBA, that's all former Princeton offense stuff. Pistol, uh you know, back cuts off a chin, you know, all that stuff got started. I was doing that when I was in college. And uh so I learned how
to play from Coach Carell. But you know, there were a couple of things when I think about some of the life lessons I learned from them, because there were many, but the ones that stick out were, first and foremost, everything is important. He preached that all the time because we were you know, we were Princeton, right, we weren't McDonald's all Americans, and when we had to play folks like you, in order to win those games, which we want our share of, you had to do everything perfectly.
And so what that taught me was that everything you do, whether people are looking at you or not, is important. How you come to work every day, how do you be a professional, How you hit the weight room, how you hit the books in school. All of that contributes to being good enough to beat the Stephen Jackson's of the world. Right, you can't beat the Stephen Jackson's of the world. You just come show off for a game.
The second thing I would say is, you know, in the Princeton offense and in basketball generally, you know if you give yourself over to the tea team and the process in the game. So being unselfish you get further ahead than if you are selfish.
Thanks.
So when you make a cut and you know you're not going to get a pass, but you know that cut's gonna open up the guy behind you. A lot of guys don't learn that these days playing basketball with their one on oher worker.
Yeah, they don't know how to play off the ball at all.
They don't know how to play off the ball, and off the ball is teaching you how to sacrifice for the for the good of the team. Those are Those are a couple of things man, that I took with me. And you know, I spent before I got into coach, and I spent fourteen years in corporate America and investment banking, and and those were the lessons that got me to move up the corporate ladder.
What what kind of person was coach? Off the court? Coaching coach? E?
Well, you guys, you guys got the good coachy in the in the NBA. I always used to laugh when I used to go visit him in Sacramento. I was like, coach, you're way nicer to these guys than you were up I used to tell people he was hard on us and he coached by character assassination, right, So he had a sharp he had a sharp tongue and what he did guys, And I tried to do this with my coaching, only without the acidity. Every day we called it going
down the line. Every day after practice, you know where you stood because he would go down the line and tell you what you did well and didn't do well at practice every day. So if you were the fifteenth guy on the roster, you knew what it takes to get to be number one. It was no it was all accountability. You knew why the number one guy was
number one, and you knew why you were fifteen. And if you were the number one guy, you knew why you were number one, and you knew why what the other guys had to do to come take you from being number one? That daily accountability not most people can't take it, and most athletes can't.
Take especially this day.
So in this day and age, oh, forget about it. Man, It's just it's it's you know, you have to handle these these kids with kid gloves and and like you, I'm coaching my my two youngest in AAU and I barely even open my mouth these days because I'm scared I'm gonna shatter somebody's future dreams.
I dealt with it coming in with Greg Popovich, but it was the best thing for me. You know, Greg, Greg was hard on me, but when I seen him treat Tim Duncan the same way he was treating me and was hard on the best player, it was easy for me to take because you're talking to the best player like that.
So I needed that and that was definitely beneficial for me.
Well Jack, you know, And and it's it's really interesting because I was late to the NBA game when I when I started working in the front office, and it amazed me how many times that that didn't happen. Right, Like I'm with you. You know, I visited with Pop a lot before I went to the NBA to see if it was something I wanted to do, and.
He was. He was.
He reminded me of coach career, only just a mile a milder version. But the ability to hold your best players accountable and the ability of your best players to allow the coach to hold you account is so big in in winning and and to me it's a good it's a good example of why it's so hard for these teams to win on a consistent basis because they're changing out the coaches so much. You're afraid the whole guy's accountable because you're trying to hang on to your job.
Absolutely, your sister, the former First Lady, Miss Michelle Obama, obviously wanted to to shout that out and real quick what was she like as a sister. But then I want to get to those those pickup games and here, if you had any good pickup games with Brock.
Well, you know, my and I are close and continue to be close today. And you know, she was the people don't realize she was like a really good athlete. But she came along right at the time, right before folks started pushing girls into sports. And even if she was her her personality, she's she didn't. She was more of why do we have to keep scoring? Why does there have to be a winner? And I was like, well, that's the whole point of competing some people, But she,
she was was. She was a good sister to have because we're like twenty months apart. So when I was playing basketball, she was playing basketball. When I was playing softball, she was playing softball. When I was playing football, she was playing football. I played ice hockey at our park. She played ice hockey at the park. So she was She was my first competitor, and my dad was my first coach. So so we've been close ever since and continue to be so I appreciate you asking about her.
And then the pickup get Well, you guys have heard I don't know if you've heard this story. I've told it so many times about my sister asking me to take Barack to play pick up basketball and she was first dating. You guys haven't heard that story. All right, let me share it with you. So my sister, who you know, she had her shared dates and she went to Princeton too, so you know she she she was popular on campus and had boyfriends, but they never lasted too long. So we get out of college and I'm
I went overseas, played, came back, started working. She meets this guy and she says, he fashions himself a basketball player, and well, what do you want me to do about it? And she said, I want I know how you and dad always talk about you can tell a guy's personality and character by pick up basketball, because my dad used to well and you guys know, you guys know these dudes to be calling files. He's like a jerk on the he's a jerk, and pick up he's a jerk
in real light. And so my sister's like, would you take him to play? Iff was like, no way. First of all, I play with real dudes, you know, Like I'm in Chicago, I'm playing you know, Michael Jordan plays in our summer league, Tim Hardaway. I mean, I'm like a I'm a bona fide player. I'm like, he'll get killed. Yeah, I'm a real hooper. And She's like, come on, please, and just kept begging me, and I was like, finally, okay, I'll do it. And I was like, but I'm not
gonna be your bad guy. You if this dude turns out to be a jerk, you gotta I'm not saying, you have to say it. So I put together a group of my friends. A couple of my friends Aren'tie Duncan, who you guys probably have heard of, was former secretary of Education, and John Rodgers, who runs a mutual fund in Chicago, and Marty Nesbitt and some other guys who are friends of mine. And we put together this game and we're playing, and Brock comes and you know, we're playing,
and to my surprise, he wasn't that bad. But you know, not like us, not like the three of us. And I'm I'm I'm taking some liberties, including myself. But but but he he could hold his own in a pickup game, right, So, and and so I had to report back to my sister and she said, would you think? And I said, well, it was actually pretty good. Like he passed the ball when he should have passed, he took shots when he
should have taken it. And I said, most importantly, he didn't try and suck up to me, like passing the ball to me. And just because I'm your sister, it's like it was like you know he was not noticeable. It was a good game, and that was how that he passed that test and the rest is history. We had no idea the guy was the guy was going to be present.
Socause so pretty much so because of you is how the union formed.
Is what you're saying, it's absolutely because, it's absolutely because it because I could have just been like, the dude can't play. I don't know why you do this, little skin.
Guy loving basketball is a beautiful thing. I love it. I love it.
The state of college sports right now, the transfer portal, nil, the emergence of women's basketball. Let's start with the transfer portal. Seeing that you're first and foremost a father, so I know you're teaching your kids. You know when when tough, when adversity hits, you got to stand it and get through it. But then you've also been a coach, and I know a lot of coaches like getting those experienced players into portal.
So talk to us about the portal.
Well, I would say that the way the portal's currently constructed, along with the fact that they're doing nil and it started at the same time, it's not working the way they thought it was gonna work. It's turned into pay for play, right, And to your point about folks sticking it out when they have a tough time, it's too
easy to just chase the money. So and the second thing, and most importantly, and folks are not talking about this enough, is that when you go into the portal, it's not like Steven Jackson Matt Barnes going to the portal, y'all gonna get picked up. It's Joe Blow. I'm not even gonna say Craig robinsons. Joe Blow from ex University with no prospects, and he's hoping somebody's gonna pick him up, and so he loses what he he loses his bird in the hand, go for two in the bush, and
then he's out. And most of these see what they're not reporting on are the people who get stuck in the portal and don't have a home to go to.
Well, they also said, I mean not to cut you off. There's over fifteen hundred kids in the transfer portal and a little bit over three hundred and fifty Division one program opening, you know what I mean.
So it's just like, what are we the number? What are we doing?
It's a numbers game, and so so here. You didn't cut me off because you're going right where I'm going with this. In addition to that, when you transfer, and you guys know this with your own kids and just reading the papers, these schools have different admissions policies, so
not all your credits transfer. So so what I liked about having to set out a year, you all the all the athletes got ahead because you got taught to work on the on the work, and you had some time to get it, and then you got ahead, so you could you go to school in the summer and next thing you know, you're working on your graduate degree. All that's going to go out the window. And they're not talking about that because it's too soon to have any data on it. And I'm so sick of this
whole data thing. I shouldn't say that, but you also got sick. But you also got to think.
I mean, I know, on the basketball side, they're not going for that anyway, you know, which it's just a whole differ. And I remember Jack went straight to the pros. But I remember, you know, I was kind of the end of an era.
You know, ninety six guys started going pro, ninety five scars started going pro. I'm ninety eight.
So we went for the reasons you said. Obviously we you know, you couldn't tell us we weren't going to the pros. But we also went to get a degree. But those days are long gone. If you stay in the in college basketball, if you stay past two years, there's a problem with you.
You know what I mean.
So it's just a whole different mentality and thinking what You can't fault the kids for thinking this way, because that's what that's what's going on.
So they had that matt.
To you, to you to your point. There are four hundred and fifty jobs in the NBA. And really I always tell people after I worked in the NBA, because I was like, so, we're all the good players, they're all in the NBA. So and you you cut off, like the top eight guys are the ones who play. So that's eight times, that's two hundred and forty guys. The rest of the guys are expendable g league might get in, might not. So we're talking about a small
chance of making it. And all these guys are putting putting all their eggs in one basket.
I just don't like the way it is.
And we're and we at the NABC are trying to help with the coaches that are trying to help the n C double A come up with a better way for it. So I like the idea of folks being able to have some freedom. But the way this is currently constructed, it's it's not doing it's doing a disservice to the student athletes. And then there's one other point here. I don't think these are just student athletes trying saying all right, I'm gonna raise my hand and go in
the portal. You know these these there are agents and handlers who are telling guys, oh, I can get you this amount of money, and they really don't have an offer.
Or just like guys, go ahead, Jack. Yeah. I just want to give you two examples of the points you're making.
You talked about credits and credits not transferring over to certain colleges.
Don Staley had to create.
She had to create not not She had to create a what's the word I'm looking for, Matt major. She had to create a major just to get this, just to get this player, and have the school create a major just where they can get this player. Until your other point, Prime Deon SAMs even said his daughter jumped in the transfer portal, and he called it dumb because to your point, why jump in the transfer portal when we don't have a school to go to?
It makes no sense, you know what I'm saying.
So that I just want to make points two great points of what you said, because Deon just said that to us when we had him on the show.
The emergence of women's basketball.
You know, I was someone who played D one and played the tournament and I still feel like there's nothing like March Madness.
But I feel like in the.
Last two years, the women's March Madness has been bigger, uh and had more stars than the men's. Uh.
Talk to us about that as as a former division player and the.
Coach, yeah, I will, and as a parent of adult. So, my my second oldest played at Princeton, got drafted, you know, went to the NCAA tournament, got drafted, got she got cut when Overseas played a couple of years now, she's working in finance, right. I think just it's it's it's just a matter of time the women the women's game has it's not the men's game, right, but it's caught up from a media it's catching up from a media standpoint, like it's getting enough attention from folks like you, folks
like ESPN. That's all they needed is a little bit of that. And then I always said they needed those storytellers to tell the drama of what's going on in the women's game because as a sports fan, like you know, I watched football, I was a baseball fan growing up. You don't just root for your team. You root against the teams you don't your team doesn't like. And yeah, and I'm from Chicago, I'm rooted against the Packers I like.
And now I live in Wisconsin and I'm like, oh my god, I must have done so they only know. But but I think that the attention that the game is getting is helping people. It's it's awakening people to another former competition that they weren't paying attention to because
they it just wasn't being seen. And I'm really excited for what's going on because it's basketball for me, Like you know, I was made privy to a stat that I did not know the bulk the number one demographic of the fans who go to see the w n b A are black males. Really, yes, your reaction, it was my reaction if.
They didn't expect that. But interesting, I.
Didn't expect it either. I didn't expect it either. You know. I was thinking they would say something like LGBT something or other. But it is straight black male. And when you think about it, when I want to take my kids to a game that that's affordable, and I want to sit down.
In front of the key word affordable.
To a w NBA game, right. And then my two younger sons who are in eighth grade and sixth grade, they grew up watching their sister who and and I have an older son who played Division III college, but they all watch their sister play and she's their role model. It's like it's just a different time from women and it's it's happening. I'm really excited.
For I love it. I love it. I love the growth.
I love words going, the fact that at the top of the conversation, the fact that people are getting big time shoe deals now, and I definitely think.
It's good overall for the growth of the sport.
Last question before we get you out of here, your thought on being again a former player and coach on the college landscape. The former professional NBA and particularly NFL guys that are coming back and starting to coach.
College.
Yeah, I love it. I love it for a couple of reasons. One is, so many times, like when I was growing up, I never thought I could coach for a living, right, Like that wasn't that wasn't on my list of things, right, it was like be a teacher. You know, my families are full of teachers and cops and firemen, and you know, city workers and laborers and things like that. So just having the opportunity for young particularly African Americans as as a as a way to
to get in the game is fantastic. And then secondly, you know what I what I learned in the NBA, and I'd love to get you guys take on this, But what I learned is the most important person in a pro franchise is the person who has the ability to connect with the players.
Absolutely and and.
And then sometimes that's becomes threatening, but that's another that's for another show.
Because most of the time those are the assistant coaches, and those.
Are the guys who can get through to the players and help your team win and and and so the more guys who have pro experience, who can get in on the game and learn the coaching profession because a lot of people don't realize you can't just like come out and blow whistle and just say, okay, let's have two lines for layups and then scrimmage right like, it's
a real profession. The more who can learn that profession, the better it is for our game, and the better it is for the players are student athletes, especially the players, because most of our players are not going to the NBA, they're not going pro. So hearing from the guys who know how hard it is to do it. If you if you want to sign up for that, that's great. And if you don't, you understand what other stuff you can do?
Yeah, absolutely one thing I mean people don't understand. And as we were talking earlier, the transfer portal and the likeliness are going pro. Ninety nine percent of student athletes don't go pro in sports. They may go pro in another profession, but not in sports. So it's it's a crazy number if you really think about the end of the day. But Craig, we want to thank you man for your time, best lessen the pod and everything else you have going on. Give coach cal our best man.
And come back. We want to catch up with you again.
Absolutely absolutely, and we want to have you guys on so you can share some of your your life lessons.
You guys learned anytime? Have you any time?
Thanks, guys, really appreciate you.
Thanks Craig.
We want to thank our guest today, Craig Robinson and our brother Brandon Jennings. So, Jack, it was a good one today, man, covered a lot of stuff.
Good luck. What's next for you? Well?
Next, I got coaching the Alans game. And shout out to my son Steve Jr. He made the classic. It's gonna be dope for him. A lot a lot of Cup Player, Cooper Flag and Mercy master Piece Sun, a lot of those guys supposed to be there. And shout out to AI and Bobby and all of them. But uh, I'll see you in Miami.
I'll be in Atlanta before that, thumb. I'll be in Atlanta the weekend before with the Twins.
Au Oh, I'll be there pulling up straight up.
Man.
You can catch this unplugged on the Draft Kings Network and all the all the Smoke Productions YouTube.
We'll see you guys next week