Welcome back to unplugged. Forgive us we missed you guys. Last week All Star was All Star was All Star. But we're back this week with excited, with an exciting show. PK Sue Band stop by to discuss his comments about the NBA and the NHL. They ruffled some feathers but also got a lot of praise for. We also have Keenan Duley stopping by to talk NBA, and one of my favorites, Rachel Nichols is here to discuss all things basketball.
Now.
I want to welcome to the show. PK Sue Ban Sue Band, Sue Band, Sue Band. Yeah, and I just said perfectly. PK Sue Band, thirteen year NHL VET was out here recently for the LA Strong charity game to support the firefighters.
We appreciate that. How was that game?
It was awesome?
Best hot, best fraternity in sports in my opinions, hockey because when we do those things, we come strong and everybody showed out.
We have people flying in from all over.
I saw someone took you down though, Oh yeah, what happened?
Well, you know hockey, Matt looks when you put the gear on, you step on the ice, you gotta be ready to go, so I did. I didn't have my fighting strap on, and I didn't pack a big enough lunch his kids. The best part about that whole thing was in the locker room after his kids came up to me and they're like, ah, my dad beat you up. So that was pretty funny to see the kids enjoying it and celebrating it. But there were a couple of fights, but everybody good cause love to come out and support
LA and be there. So if I got to take a beating for the team, I'll take one.
Four nations tournament, huge win for the NHL. And like most All Star events, it you know all. I mean, the NFL doesn't even do that. They do Skills Challenge now and obviously we'll get to what the NBA's All Star event is. But you guys transitioned into this four nation tournament and had a lot of success.
Yeah, you know, going into it, nobody really knew what to expect. It was something new, you know. Obviously with just four nations, I mean, anything can happen. Right, Let's say the final, I mean it could have been Sweden and Film and in the final.
What would that have done for our ratings.
But the hockey was so great that even the games that you know, people weren't talking about were games.
And people ended up talking about.
So I think that it was set up for success and to me, where the league was going into that we were prepared to take that step. And I don't think that we were before. I think we were getting there and you could see it happening and evolving. I think players, you know, we have all these different podcasts and shows, and players have different interests now, so I think people are starting to feel comfortable just being themselves
and showing who they are. And for us, we know who we are as a sport, but we have to show the world that. And you know, ultimately it's great internally in your circle, in your world of sports right to understand it. But we need new fans. We need to bring people into our game. We need to share our game. That's the best part about playing the game and loving the game is being able to share it with people and allow them to do it.
And you know this with sports.
You know, look at the LA Strong Because of hockey, we're able to support a great cause like that. So it is bigger than just what happens on the ice, and our players understand that. So going into Four Nations, you know, whether it was ESPN and what we did with the NHL to make sure that everything was right on the broadcast, making sure we're getting eyes on the sport exposure. What happened at Four Nations was on the backs of the players and they they stepped up in
a way that I probably haven't seen. And you know, Team Canada they did their thing, They did their thing, but you look at Team USA, Brady Kuchuk, Matthew Kachuck, Team USA, all that they did that tournament to promote the game. Forget everything else, Forget what was on the ice, the interviews, giving the time, you know, not just being there and saying, yes, we got to play sixty minutes, no giving us real answers, feeding into it, understanding the
event and what we're trying to do. And you got to remember, this is sports, but it's entertainment and you know that's a part of it too, and our players understood that and they executed it to a t. You know, people talk about the fighting being staged. You can't stage a fight when you're getting punched in the face. So what you need to see blood to understand that it
is real. I'm telling you it's real. The players took it upon themselves to say, not only do we want to win, we're going to put on a show, and that was the de facto for us at four Nations and why it was a home run. So, you know, hats off to everybody that did a great job.
There's no mystery. The NBA has been trying to find a solution for All Star, which leads me to our you know the next part. You know, you spoke on it, and you spoke from a perspective of a lot of fans, just the frustration with the lack of effort. Let's take a look at what you said.
Can you see it?
It's because it's not just based on the skill and talent, it's based on the pride, honor playing.
For the guy next to you.
I got a question for the NBA players, what the hell are you playing? What are you playing for? It's not about the money you make all the money. What you're injured? Well, there's a difference between being hurt and injured. Are you hurt or are you injured? There's a difference.
In hockey. We play hurt, we play injured.
Obviously I didn't get a chance to see the Four Nations tournament, but to me it made sense. And then to hear the post cap and in the recap of how well it went, I mean there was a pride, sense of pride there, it sounds like, and it turned out to be some great hockey. The NBA has been trying to juggle what to do with this game since Kobe left, so I may say a little bit before, but most of the time they were pretty competitive, at least in the fourth quarters. Kind of take us into
just kind of your thinking. Obviously, again, hockey kind of had to try to find something new and they found it.
Maybe the NBA.
Is it a transition for the NBA to do us versus the world and really bring some competitive nature out. And another thing you said is just like when certain guys were in charge of kind of somewhat the lead, so to speak, it was a competitive game for the NBA. So what kind of what kind of standpoint were you coming from when you were kind of breaking down your one hundred percent.
I did speak on behalf of the fans, but I think I also spoke to some players too, and not just current players, retired players, athletes that are no longer around the game but still watch the game and enjoy it, that look at the game and say, you know what, I don't like that, or hey, I wish this was still the same? Why is that changing all that stuff?
And you know, that's the feedback that I've gotten back from a lot of players and athletes is that they appreciated it, because you know, in our sport, in hockey, there's a lot of guys who didn't make a million dollars a year, that didn't make eight million dollars nine million dollars.
That had to go and find jobs after playing.
But you want to know something, those guys played banged up, they played hurt, they played injured, they fought, They gave everything they had to give. And that has allowed me to make the money that I made in the National Hockey League. That has allowed me to have a decent job after my career is over because now we have a TV deal. So what I'm saying is you cannot forget.
But Matt, you know this. You play with superstars.
You played against them, right, you see them.
That is a small percentage of the sport. Are the stars?
Yeah?
You know, people forget about the rest of the league, like, there's a lot of other guys out there, and we have to think about it. The responsibility of the players is to push the game forward. If you are a part of that greatness conversation, that's how I'm evaluating you. Are you moving the needle for the game or you're just moving it for you, Because if you're moving it for you, we'll celebrate you as a great player.
We'll say, hey, you're a great player, awesome, you know, one of the all time.
But to put you in that category of a Michael Jordan, a Kobe Bryant, in my opinion, because I followed those guys, I didn't follow them just because of their rings. I followed them because of their mentality, their approach to the game. That is I take. I celebrate that more than anything in sports. I don't care. I will take a guy that empties the tank on the ice and loses on.
A bad balance or bat.
I will celebrate them as a champion because that's what I want guys to follow. That is what is sports is all about. There's got to be a winner and there's got to be a loser. It's not always the best team that wins it's not always the best player that ends up hoisting the trophy. But ultimately, what I have to take from you is when I watch you for eighty two games, do you give everything you have? Do you show up every night? Do you do right
by your teammates? Do you do right by the game, Because ultimately, that is the best part of your legacy. That is what people will remember about you, more than your.
Championships and your rings.
No, I agree, I think that's been a that's been an issue with the league. What did we discuss.
I mean, obviously all stars kind of all stars a whole different thing. I think just the amount of money that's in the NBA now is incredible, and I'm happy for those guys to be able to make as much money as possible, but it has brought the load management, and whether that's team or guys sitting out, it's caused a lot of issues from a fans perspective, I think, and just people who love the game, you know what
I mean. Obviously, the NBA needed to do something too, and we talked about before we got on camera that David Stern's vision of being able to promote superstars within a team game, and I think that's what's grown the game and obviously made it international. But at the same time, there's so much money injected into it and there's so much science behind the game that this rest stuff rubs a lot of people.
The wrong way.
Whether you played or not. You know, you're getting paid a ton of money. It cost our family a ton of money to come see you, and we may only get to see you one time a year or one time our lives, and the one time we go, the best players isn't playing because of load management or just
taking a night off. And I can see how fans can have an issue with that, because you know, we came from an era of early two thousands where it was it was a badger honor to try to play eighty two games and play through shit that you know you can. There's some shit you can't play through when no one's asking you to play for that, but there is shit that you could probably get through. But each of those situations are, you know, kind of each.
Of their own.
So I do agree a lot with what you said, and I think sometimes I think you kind of got to mix reaction from it, and you can tell me because one thing I'll say is sometimes I feel like athletes don't like other athletes speaking about their sport. But if anyone can speak about a sport, it is another athlete because you've made it to that kind of level in your respective sports. And then I think another time
where NBA takes a lot of backlash. These guys are making so much motherfucking money, so there's a jealousat there's a jealousy component and hater component involved in it. But I think when it just comes down to actually competing, if you can play every single game, play every single game, I think the NBA definitely lacks that right now.
Yeah, and here's the thing.
Those guys are on the biggest platform in sports. I mean, NFL is huge two but they have the TV deals. What I'm saying is it's not that they don't deserve the money they do the game.
The game has grown to that that's the money you're making.
But what I'm saying is with sports, there are core elements to sports that to me, need to be staples. You need to show up for fucking work. Yeah, you have to be on the fucking floor. I don't care like for me, the team will support you, the league will support you. If you can't go if you're hurt and you can't go find But I'm watching Kobe walk off the court with his frigging finger dislocated, popping it back in and going his achilles is torn, and he's
shooting free throws. These are the facts. This is not like I'm not making it up. It's right there for you to see. So do we want to celebrate that or not? Do we want to treat him differently because he speaks five different languages and he didn't grow up in the fucking hood, Like, No, the guy's a gamer. He's a gamer. Michael Jordan's a gamer. Those guys leave it all on the floor. They don't care, they break their nose, they don't care. They want to leave it,
they want to kill. I want to see athletes that want to go out and win it all costs and we'll give everything. Those are the guys I would go to war with. So it's not about fighting. It's not about going out there and fighting. You gotta fight for the opportunity. You have to fight for the next generation. You have to fight for yourself and your family. You have to fight for the league. Your job is to shine the league's shield. If you are a star player,
that is your responsibility. Okay, you don't have to carry that around David Stern he had trust with Michael Jordan that he was going to do the right things. He had trust with So there's trust that has to be there and the fans through that trust. It goes back to the fans. Do the fans trust you? Do they trust it you're gonna show up for them? Do they trust it? They're paying the money and they're getting their money's worth, you know, all those things matter.
Yeah, a lot of things. Things are falling on the Lebrons and the Kds and Steps because they're at the end of their career and they're obviously the biggest stars in our game. But the game they came into was a different game, you know what I mean. And they bought into that and led with that. So you know, my whole question is it's not necessarily a question that I just will it ever change? Because the president has
been set. So with these next the three guys I mentioned moving on in the next who knows the fucking bron But next two to three years, I'd say they're all out of the NBA. This next run of great and title incredibly skilled talent. Will they change the tone or will they follow in what they kind of knew as youngsters? You know, Like you said, I think it takes the leaders of the league to set the tone.
And is it too late for the kds and and the steps and the Lebrons to kind of be like, hey, guys, we're going out there are because they are at the A's there are and the game is what it is. Do we need to allow them to kind of ride off in the sun and really put the onus on this next generation of young players to really try to set the tone right.
And and I'm gonna be clear on this.
You know, for Katie's Stephan Lebron, they're on the they're on the latter part of their career. Everything you're getting from them is a bonus, so you gotta celebrate them and enjoy the okay, But for this new generation that's coming in, you can't be letting these guys off the hook, like no, no, no, no, no, I'm sorry. You gotta be on the court, you gotta you gotta be a gamer, you gotta be all in because those guys, you know what, it's not gonna be exactly like Kobe and Michael Jordan.
No one expects anybody to be like Kobe Michael Jordan. But we gotta see those elements competitiveness, We have to see those elements like they We gotta see those elements. I want to see a dog. You gotta entertain, You gotta put on a show every opportunity.
You have to sell the game. You gotta step up.
And no wonder two has that has the money tarnished because the money is so astronomical now has it kind of tarnished it. It's even starting at a younger age now too. With basketball. You know, I mean the nil situation college. You know there's kids Cooper Flags projected to be number one pick time. I want to go back to college. I want to stay in college. And you know what I mean. So the money is so crazy now,
and guys are understanding. Like I said to me, it's always crazy because there's medicine now to supposedly understand load management and keeping guys healthy. But it seems like now guys are more hurt than ever, one hundred percent more hurt than ever.
Big time.
Well once again, so let's go back to the playing part. You can't expect your body to respond in the war if you don't put it in the battle.
So what I'm saying is you're off season training to prepare your body for war. Are you prepared for war?
Or are you prepared to go out there and dance around the court and then you get bumped and now you get sore, and now it's your hip And No, the season is not about getting in shape and getting in playing shape.
You need to be if you are making two one.
Hundred and fifty three hundred million, your only job is to make sure that your body is equipped to handle eighty two games plus. It's not on the game that you're hurt. It's on you. It's not on the game. Lebron, let's talk about Lebron. He's been playing for freaking forty years. The guy is on the court most of the time. Like, yes, he misses games, but he's forty years old. But what I'm saying is, whether you like him don't like him, the guy takes care of his body. He takes care
of himself. So what I'm saying is for these other guys, if you're not on that level, you need to be all in. If you're out.
Jumping around, you want to go on vacation and do all that stuff.
We all do it. I did it, But you got to make sure that you're on the court. Because when you're doing all that stuff and you got the money and you're doing all.
The fans, you got to show up. You got to show up.
So to me, I think that the culture of sports has changed. I think there's all these gimmicks in training and that's why guys are getting hurt. Like training is very very simple. You gotta know your craft, know your sport. You gotta be strong. Asketball guys, I'll tell you this, they don't want to lift. They want to go in the gym and shoot you. Tell me if I'm wrong, call me out if I'm wrong. But most guys, in my opinion, don't understand that they got to be strong.
Just because you're playing basket. It's a contact sport.
You're still getting hit, you're still hitting the floor, you're still getting bumped. So your body has to be able to take that. You got to earn every inch you're running, you're jumping, you're pounding. Are you preparing your body for that? And to me, I think that there's a lot of gimmicks across sports and training, not just in basketball, but how you train and prepare.
Your body is also a part of why you get paid.
Like, you can't give somebody three hundred million that doesn't know how to take care of their body because they're not going to be on the court. So once again, how do we value greatness? Greatness isn't just about winning championships. It's your approach to the game. You need to set example for your teammates. We have young draft picks coming in. Are you going to be a good mentor to them? Are you going to be a good example. Are they going to see you every day at the gym doing
the things that are right? I don't know all those things matter, and that's why we see organizations that never ever come out of that spot because they don't draft the right guys.
One thing I will say that hurts the NBA a lot, and I think it's overlooked, and we've been saying it for a long time, the lack of veterans in the league period because older players and you probably I don't know what a lockey room locker room was like, but I remember I came in the league and two three and there were ogs s motherfucker smoking cigarettes in the
locker room thirty eight, thirty nine to forty. Whether they're on the court or not, they were just there and they were instrumental in just our mentality, the way we carried ourselves, our work ethic, the way we dressed, the shit we did. And the game doesn't have that nowhere. The game is now is so young and everyone has to play and if you can't, you know what I mean. So it's just like I think the game sincerely, missus vets.
And why is that? Because when they came into the league, the game wasn't where it was. They needed to be all in because they're like, we gotta make money, we got to.
Grow the game.
We have to do right by the So now people are walking in, they' getting paid thirty forty fifty million, if not one hundred million before they hit the court. But for me, I'm sitting here saying like, did you dream about playing in the NBA? Did you dream about competing in a championship? Did you dream about hoisting the Larry O'Brien trophy?
Like? Did you?
Or was it just you wanted a sneaker deal, you wanted to be like the guy on TV like all that stuff is great. Like Mark Messier. I always tell Messad this all the time. See he's sixty three years old. But like, I don't remember mess from playing. I remember him from the Lais commercials. That's what I remember from him. I'm like, dude, I've seen you in more Lais commercials than i've seen you with two hands up. And he scored so many goals, He's won six Cups. That was
my generation. But it's okay. That's I choose to watch the last dance. I chose to fight my way down to TV Garden for Kobe's last game to meet him, to see him with ice bags on his knees and surround it, and meet Vanessa and meet his kids and get his numb or in text with them during the Stanley Cup finals and have that relationship.
I was hungry for that. Not to say, Kobe, can I get you sneakers?
No.
I wanted what he could offer to me to make me a better player, a better athlete. And I think that that's what I'm talking about with all of this stuff, is our athletes that are coming in. What is your mentality, who are you following? What are you doing it for? And we got to ask those questions too, because I'm telling you to invest in someone, no matter how talented they are, if they don't have those intangibles and you're
trying to win a championship, it ain't gonna work. So you know, we're trying to win a championship, you're trying to build the league, you're trying to grow the league. Those intangibles are important for me.
I mean, I think we can talk about this all day, but before we get you out of here, we discussed off camera, just the newer commissioner or new Garyman.
Yeah, no, he's Gary's been doing this over thirty years now, forgive me.
Yeah, but very close.
David Stern was, wait, that's what you're talking about? That The point I was trying to get to was kind of of being able to you said, what's helped the game if you're an ultimate team type of guy, is hockey is an ultimate team type of sport. But what has held the game back is the same thing. And I told you know what, David Stern vision his ability
to promote stars within a team game. And you feel like Beckman is on the way to starting to do that more because one thing I heard when KG kind of responded to what you said, and what I kind of got from what he said is just like, you know, there's a part of what he said was you guys don't appeal to the majority of our culture at all.
And you're right, And I said, and I told you before, I didn't appreciate hockey till I got a chance to go to the Stanley Cup finals when the King's playing and I saw it live off the puck action all the kind of completely changed my point of view. But for the people who aren't fortunate enough to do that, what do you think your league can do to promote to our communities and our culture.
That's a great question. So the first thing is this. You know, when I retired, you know, I said to myself, what can I do? What can I do to give back? And really why I stepped on TV was to do that, you know, was to be a part of helping the game grow to a certain extent. You're right, So part of the game not growing has been that team aspect of it. Team first, and our core hockey fans they're
the most loyal fans, right, They're loyal to that. But to get new fans in it's got to be personalized because these young kids coming up, they don't know about the one hundred year history of the Montreal Canadians. You know, they understand Original six, but they don't understand the Rangers and the Montreal that have been around for one hundred years. They're only going to see our Temmy panerin. They're going to see Connor McDavid. Those are the players that people
are coming to watch now. So you got to sell it to them that how do we apply to different demographics. Well, it's this You've got to cross over. It's doing different things to bring people in. It starts with grassroots in the community. If you're in Chicago, are you just the Chicago Blackhawks or are you present in the community. And you know, I'm co chair on the p C. There's
a lot of grassroots programs now that we do. I remember I was a part of a program in Toronto called Hockey Hyundai Helpers Program and we used to donate equipment and do all those things. The biggest divide is the money. It is the money that is the biggest thing. It's not about our sport. It's not about it being racist, it's not about it being white. It ain't that like I.
Played in it.
Of course, you're gonna face those things in every walk of life. So anybody thinking you're just gonna see it in hockey is.
Crazy, you know.
So for me, it's the money that is the biggest variable. And you know, we're doing things. There's a lot of things in our sport now to create opportunities for kids to get equipment and play.
And I'm an advocate for that.
So you know, I started a program called Blue Line Buddies program to get underprivileged youth into our game, and we're going to continue to grow that to open up doors for scholarships, intern opportunities for kids that want to be in sport who can use hockey. And I've seen it grow. We talked about the first round this year, thirty two picks. I'm pretty sure that like out of
the thirty two, like twenty of them weren't white. Like they're from different backgrounds, So the game is already growing. I think it's the first thing is do people know about our game hockey?
What's that? Well, here it is, tune in, watch a game. Here's what it is.
You know.
Stephen A said something to me when I was on first take that really resonated, and he had said, you know, I think that for the NHL, it's like, what do you guys do now after four nations?
You know, what do you guys do to keep it going?
And he said, you know, you could do a lot with the rivalries in every night, you know, rivalry games in original six. But what the NBA does very, very good is when you turn on your TV, they're not just talking about the games. They're talking about what production thing Lebron's doing. They're talking about him in the space Jam video, they're talking about this, they're talking about that.
It's a lifestyle show. It's not a basketball show. So you know, in hockey it's always about hockey, hockey and excells and use we don't talk about anything else. So part of what I do on the broadcast is to talk about other things because I'm gonna tell you some If you don't know anything about hockey, what the hell are you gonna.
Understand when I'm talking about a Ford check.
No, I'm saying, listen, how can you connect?
Right?
And you've got to connect with people, So it starts with this, what's your message?
Your message has to be something that resonates with those people. So I know this, If a black person turns on the TV and sees me on ABC, they're gonna say, shit, who the hell is this guy?
And did he play hockey? Right?
So what I'm saying sometimes it's a visual thing. There's there's a symbolism part of it, and then there's the message. And I think that with those two things, we can show people, first of all, feel welcome to come into our sport, Feel welcome to come to a game. The second part is if you love sports and you're true sports fan, this is something you're going to get into. And I think for a lot of people they're scared
of what they don't know, like me and you. You know, everybody would be frightened to step into something that they don't understand. So how do we make them understand it? The first thing is grassroots, getting kids involved, making the game more affordable for them. The second thing is symbolism. People got to see their people, People got to see things that they resonate.
So having Snoop Dogg at the LA Strong game justin.
Bieber, having those people show up, just that alone moves the needle for us in a big, big way. Right, and then it's the message right, it's you're welcome to come. We cut all this crap out. I don't want to hear nothing about players. Our players are the best. We have no issues with our players saying crap or anything like that, like any of that stuff.
It's very, very small.
So we got a great group of players in our league that respect the game, that understand it. During the pandemic, when we had all that stuff with black lives our players.
I could not have been more proud for me.
That was a big turning point for me when I reached when Sydney Crosby reaches out to me and I reach out to them, and I had an idea to start something. You know, we never did it because we created the PC and we did all this. But as a player, as a black player, I'm reaching out to every single player and I'm saying, hey, I'm gonna I'm thinking about doing this program. It's gonna involve bringing under privilege juice. Yeah, I'm in Sid Goes, you know what PK.
I'm in.
But I'd like you to even talk to the younger guy because when I move on, I want these guys to continue it.
That's what he's telling me.
So it's not about he doesn't have to jump up in front of a microphone and put his hand up. No, he doesn't need to do that. Our players are all in. That's why when I say they're all in, they're all in. They know what's asked of them. They're sick and tired of people painting them with this brush that hockey's a racist gay It's it's not. They're great guys. They love the sport, they love everybody. The hockey locker room is one of the best. That's what I miss about the game.
I miss being in the locker room. So I truly love the players in the game. I love all the guys that I played with and played against, And you know, I just want to make sure they get their due, that people know what they're all about. Then you can make your decision. But don't be scared of hockey. It's a great sport if you when you go to a game, you'll be a fan forever. That I can guarantee. Black white, brown, purple from timbuckt from Toronto, from l A You're Gonna Love.
Argument No definitely changed my perspective of PK. Man.
I appreciate your time and best of luck continuing to grow the game and doing your part to help that happen.
Listen, you and KG got you guys got to get me back on here. Man.
I want to come on and tell basketball we got we got some uh k KG big ticket baby ticket right there.
That Hey, g man, you are the big ticket. You are the truth. Respect, love and he was a dog. Yes, that is a guy that I loved to watch play. And my sister loved to watch you play too.
Man.
She's a big bet. We'll connect it. We'll connect the dots for you too. Please, all right, thank you, and I want to welcome in the show. Uh my brother ke On Dueling and key on. You heard the conversation that p K and I just had and some of the producers saying you were texting some information. So what were your thoughts because obviously he he got some good feedback and he ruffled some feathers with his with his uh you know kind of point of view.
Yeah, great commentary, man, I think you know, man, PK has actually peaked my interest in the NHL, right, you know what I mean. He's charismatic, he's smart, he's got a great delivery. So I think he's great for that game, right, But I also believe, you know, like you know, I think it was you know, the timing of you know, his his his.
Commentary, you know what I mean.
I feel like, you know, us as Hooper sometimes, you know, we could feel a certain type way, so kind.
Of listening, you know, we can we can fuel a certain type way, you know what I mean.
You know, especially leagues that you know haven't ascended to the level that we have, you know, on a television basis, on a fan base basis, on a ticket sales basis, on all the matrics.
That you can measure.
So I understand it, man, and I think, you know, he's a great voice, you know what I mean, for that particular industry. But we can't fade in hoops anymore, right we you know what I mean, hard foul those are flavorantwos now. So there's certain things that the players don't have control of, And I think the narrative sometimes is that it's the players are not producing, performing playing the way that the game used to be, but the elements and the rules have.
Shifted, so they they don't have a choice.
They have to play within the concept of those rules and they have to adapt and adjust to the game that they're in now. But I definitely, you know, love PK and I'm gonna take more of an interest in hockey because of his commentary and his passion and his delivery.
Katie, we discussed before we jumped on air with you was about and it was interesting to me because I didn't really know this.
You know.
My whole thing is I agreed with a lot of the stuff he was saying. As far as being available to be on the court. I feel like the NBA has so much technology now and and and modern medicine is, as you know, the leading, all the analytics shit and all this and all that. I say all that to say, guys are still hurt more and playing less, you know
what I mean. And you brought up a point like, you know, maybe it's more on the teams as far as wanting to not we're not save these guys, but have them in peak performance when it comes to playoff times. And then my pushback to that was these motherfuckers are still missing playoff games still.
So yeah, I want to.
Talk about we don't have to do too much of a deep die because I think we both see. Both sides know this of it. But but let me know your thoughts on that.
You know, I think there's a it's a catch twenty two, it's a double air sward, right, because you know, I think there's a healthy responsibility that you know, is on the players and on the way that the.
Rules are now.
Right.
I just know that in our generation, we did push through. We did do toward all shots, we did do cortasone shots.
We did play through you.
Know, being hurt, right, but sometimes guys were injured and had to play through. You know, Grant Hill pushing through in the playoffs, you know, against the heat, which is something that you know, kind of halted his career where we could have had one of our transcending players at his best. But you know, because it's quote is toughness might have been questioned in that moment, His commitment might
have been questioned in that moment. He played through that, and he suffered through that the rest of his career. Now he was able to continue to play, but that was hell. That was the feelie man. Grant Hill drinks frite type stuff, you know what I mean. And so I think it's a healthy balance that we have to find. And then I think the elephant in the room is that,
like the game is shifted. It's not just about like toughness, you know, being courageous and things like that anymore, because now you have the gambling aspect, you know what I mean, You have all these different brands and and all these different things outside of just playing the game that generate you know, money, you know, and so sometimes you know, when a guy you know doesn't want to push through or anything like that, you know, it's not just on
the team. Guys have to understand that they stand on the shoulders of the people who came before them, who put in work, who was making you know, peanuts compared to what they played, what they made, And there's a healthy obligation responsibility to the next generation to persevere, to push through. The reason we still talk about willis reed right now to this day, though he didn't play that entire game, it's the fact that he showed up and
he pushed through, and he motivated and he inspired. And I think our players are losing a little bit of insight on that. But at the same time, I understand that there's a business model, you know what I mean, there's a business model that these guys have to maximize and make as much as they can because that you know, you have a short window to earn.
I think one thing that Kevin Garnett is always saying is is new lens. We got to look at it through a new lens. And I think for the most part, I do look at it through a lens. But again, PK brought up a point that I had talked to some of my homeboys about and I asked, you, because you're closer removed to the game as far from a coaching standpoint, Shit, I'll be eight years since I retired, But do these guys in the offseason. I'm not saying they do or don't, but do they prepare their self
for eighty two plus? Are they pretty much preparing their self for one hundred games in the AUS? Because we used to, Katie, we used to kill ourselves in the summertime, kill ourselves in training camp and take around knee pads to a day. So my question is, with the training camps not being what they are, are they are and they don't practice as much anymore, like, are they preparing
their body? And I don't want to call it war because there's a lot of shit going on in the world, But are they preparing their self for the rigors of a full ninety five game NBA season if we're talking about playoffs and in all that ninety five plus game season. And I don't know if they are, because again I'm
not around the game no more. But I remember when we were coming up in the early two thousand and our era, we prided ourselves on playing as many games as possible, is it closer to eighty two as we can get, and then we knew we also had to
go to the playoffs. Now I feel like now there's a ton of loads management and whether it's business, doc or medicine, and where we were not seeing the guys in the regular season, and then when it comes to the playoffs, they'll get there, then they get hurt again because I don't feel like their body was ready for what this fucking game is, because this game is a monster.
You're right, Matt, and I feel you on your points, But I would say this like, because of the history, guys are eating better, guys are getting more risk. There's different devices that they have on them to monitor their heart rates, their recovery.
The guys are doing hyper bary chambers. Guys are investing into trainers, physical on the court all that. So I think these young guys are prepared.
Where I think there's a gap is in the mentality that they have compared to our generation. They don't have enough dogs around them. They don't have enough around them.
I said it earlier, taken let them know how serving.
The game like, making you dig deep. They are not willing to leave that court, you know what I'm saying. With it all on the line, they save a piece, you know what I'm saying for themselves in my opinion, So I think it's a case twenty two because I think they're more professional. I think they spend more time on their bodies, on their brands. They have more discipline, you know what I mean. Ain't as wild as our generation was, you know what I mean, in a lot
of different ways. But I think, you know what I mean, it's not just a body thing. It's a mentality thing. Dog, it's the mind right bench, get your mind right. And I just don't think there's enough people around the game anymore that indoctrinate them. With the history of going through collective bargaining agreements, have events doing rookie responsibilities, have an event to tell you, you know, how to show up, how to be a professional, what you owe to the game.
And then the next generation who's coming behind, because every generation behind us should benefit. And if these guys, you're going to continue to take games off, if guys aren't gonna, you know, continue to give it.
They're all which I think they do within.
The rules of the confine to a certain degree, but they don't look at it. The generation before we don't look at it like that because we would take quarters on shots, we would take toward all shots.
You know what I mean? They whatever, take the play. We did what we want we wanted to period period up.
Moving on the Warriors first three game winning streak since November five and one with Jimmy Butler quality wins over Milwaukee Houston Sack Butler's averaging twenty points, six rebound, six assists. Are the Warriors a legitimate threat in the Western Conference in your opinion?
Well, you know what, I always think that there's a great area, Matt when you talk about pretenders are contenders, you know what I mean? And I think they're in the middle of that because they have a pedigree that they've been there before, so they're always dangerous when you get an addition like Jimmy Butler and put him in hear him with Steph. Those are two guys who've kind of been, you know, transcending in their own unique way. Steph more so because like he's a transitional he's a
transformational player. But Jimmy has always thrived as being that second guy, right you know. And now when he went to the Heat, he had an opportunity to be the number one guy, so he knows how that feels. So I think there's not too many best, better second options than Jimmy Butler. What he brings to the team, especially when he's bought in, he's committed, and he's ten toes down, you know what I'm saying. Jimmy brings a whole mentality that most people can't bring because he doesn't just need
the ball to score. He can cut, he can get lobs, he can get rebounds, He impacts the game on the defensive end. He knows how to get to the free throw line. And so Jimmy, I think, man is you can you can see you know it was a partnership because they did extend him as well. Right, and when you have your value and things like that, and you feel supported, you feel valued, you can be ten too.
You don't have to hold anything back.
And the pedigree that they have in that at Warriors locker room, and so I wouldn't say that they are a straight contender, but they are not a portender. They are somebody who is very dangerous and if they get you gotta beat them. You gotta beat them, guys, they got to beat them.
You gotta beat them.
I think one of my favorite things about Jimmy Butlers, although he's giving you the numbers, his impact does not know most of it. To me, his biggest impact isn't the statue. It's the impact he just has on the game and his energy and his mindset. The mindset is talking about. He's a fucking dog. The Knicks. The Knicks are ozer and seven against the top three teams in the league. Okay, see Boston and Cleveland. Coming off two
double digit losses to Boston and Cleveland. Are the Knicks a threat in the Eastern Conference?
I think they are. I think they are.
I think they're third in the East right now. I think they have in that like thirty seven wins I think they're threat right. And you know the thing about TIBs coach teams is that the starters play a lot of minutes and so they get they get a lot of wear and tear on your body. And you and I both know that in the playoffs you always need somebody off the bench, you know what I mean, to come in and be that spark plug, to come in and you know what I mean, kind of shift the game.
And I don't think, like during the regular season, you might have to sacrifice some wins to get those guys experienced so that they have their legs, so that they have, you know, all, their their confidence for the playoffs. And so I won''t say they're a pretender, but there's teams that they have more wins then that I would put ahead of them, like the Bucks. I think the Bucks got better, especially getting you know, Kevin Porter Junior had the trade dayline.
Twenty six and six against teams with losing records, eleven and fourteen against teams with winning records. Towns's defense is absolutely terrible.
Of late.
I'm gonna push back a little bit and I want to put a disclaimer because I really like both of these players I really like Jalen Brunson, I really like Karl Anthony Towns. Are they one a's, are they alphas? Are either one of those players the best player on the floor that can lead you to a championship or are those both great sidekicks second option? I don't and I say that with all due respect. Yeah, they're both all stars making a ton of money. Like you know
how people the talking shit, I'm not talking shit. I'm asking a question. Are they either one of those guys the guys that can lead you to a championship in your opinion?
Well, I think on the offensive end, they are, you know, and I think that's why they peered them with bridges. I think that's why they bought you know, O g N as well to kind of, you know, give them that defensive push.
Obviously, Josh Hart he's one of my favorite players.
He's a OG.
You know, he put in work at Billanoba, he's putting them work in the league, and he's continued to grow as a player and shooting the ball a lot better now. But I don't think that those two guys as your one A and one B get you a championship.
You know, I just don't. I just did.
I think that there's too many great players in our league that you know, they just you know, that's just not enough at this particular point. But what happens is if you give your guys on the bench an opportunity to come in and fill some gaps and things like that, you can have some role players that can come out and have big nights. Unfortunately, they don't give their guys on the bench enough minutes to bring a different element, to be a spark plug, to be a guy who could be a game changer.
And I think that's gonna hurt them in the long run.
I'm mad at that tank watch or suicide watch. Washington, New Orleans, Utah, Charlotte, Toronto, Philly, Brooklyn all want Cooper Flag. Cooper Flag is talking about he possibly might want to go to college. This nil life is good. I'm sure, Duke life is good. You got the Boozer Twins coming in next year, maybe a chance to go back to back, who knows. We remember Eli Manning pulled this when he was drafted by the Chargers and said he wouldn't play for the Chargers and ended up going to the Giants.
And then Steve Francis pulled it saying he wouldn't play for was a Vancouver right, Yeah, Vancouver and ended up.
Going to Houston.
And not by any means am I saying Cooper Flag is on this type of energy or on this type of time. I've seen nothing but you know, outstanding, just an outstanding human when it comes to Cooper Flag. But what are your thoughts about kind of just these bottom dollers being the bottom dollars and him possibly going back to college and maybe coming back out the following year. Obviously there's a ton of money on the line, But does that not matter to him?
Well, it matters, but it doesn't because like these guys have nil money now, right, and so it's not like they're living off pel grants, Matt, like how you and I were right are getting you know what I mean, nil under the table, you.
Know what I'm saying.
But I think he has, you know, a great opportunity right now because like at the end of the day, when you're considered the number one pick, the only way you can go is down.
There is a young guy who's in high school right now.
I think his name is like Ajd Fansa, and he is a potential number one pick when he's a prospect and he's eligible for the draft.
And so that could have an impact on that. But I like player freedom.
If you choose to stay in college and get that experience, if that's your in game, and then that's something you're enjoying right now, do it.
But I think our game means Cooper.
You know, we talked about this a couple episodes ago, Matt like, we need an American born, white player in my opinion, you know what I'm saying, to come in and represent I think, you know, the hard part is when you're a great player, is that you're gonna go to a bad team. And sometimes it takes guys, you know, it lessens the development curve. But I think he's talented enough.
I think he's.
Popular enough, and more so than anything, man, he's got a motor. He's got a motor. He's a skilled player who plays with energy. I think our game needs him to be successful. And getting him in the right place, in the right situation, you know what I mean, definitely helps incubate that talent, cultivate that talent, develop that talent.
But I don't think you should wait. I think you should go and become a pro. You know what I mean. They can never take duke off your resume. You'll have that network.
You can go back into summers, you know what I'm saying, and get your work in and get the college experience, take your classes and all that. But just the money that's available in the NBA right now. Man, I know, nil sounds.
Cool when you're young to what the NBA is talking about.
Man, Man like, I really think, you know, I would love to see him go, you know, go to the league, and I think he'll be the number one pick.
He should be, you know, obviously for looking at any teams to land and obviously him going to San Antonio with Wimby would be insane. But also I like Philly. I like Philly a lot, and that leads us to our next thing. Uh, they've lost. Philly's lost seven in a row, nine out of ten, and beat his considering options for his need that's given him a ton of issues. Paul George's severely been struggling and came out and said
he's taken injections in his knee just to play. I think it's safe to say that trusting the process is done. EMBIID has a monstrous contract for the next what four years after the season? Four yeah, after this season, four more years. I mean, what do you do, Katie, someone who's been you know, around the front office and in the front office and sat on the on the bench as a coach, what do you do with this seventy
six ers team? MAXI is a killer, yeah, and the you know, the best player on the team right now because he's out there every single night doing it. What do you do with this Philly situation? Do you try to trade embiid? What do you I mean, what do you what do you do?
You know what I think you gotta you know, be patient with it a little bit, right it is their.
First Oh, patient with Paul and Embid.
Yeah, and also with his body, you know, because because.
We've been we've been trusting.
We've been trusting the process for a long time though ten years, I would say ten years. We've been trusting the process. And this is no knock because we know and not to cut you off the last time cut you off and be healthy and beat on the court. Is one of the best basketball players in the world. Paul George Healthy is one of the best basketball players in the world.
I feel you.
You know what I mean, I definitely feel you. I feel your perspective on like trusting the process. Maybe it's time to you know, part ways and things like that. But what if you part ways with a generational player, right and he gets help after taking.
Some time off, you know what I mean, he may need some time off. They may have to capitulate, you know, this season.
They might have to lay it down and say, hey, you know what we got you guys in the contract, Let's give it a Let's give it next year.
We kind of know what we're facing. Let's get our bodies white. Our body's right.
I've seen guys come back from killer injuries, you know what I mean. I think I don't know if you played with Sean Livingston or not, but Sean is a guy who you know, like his need, you know, like it was a rough looking injury when he had it. Now he wasn't you know, maybe as athletic as he you know, he as he was previously, But he came back and he had an incredible career and contributed to
a team. I think they may need to, you know, capitulate, try and see where they can position themselves to get another piece through the draft. I think they got to continue to let Maxie just develop and like not put a cap on him. I think the same with Paul. You gotta get him healthier. It's possible because you made the commitment. I mean, I saw the Lakers rescind the trade, you know what I mean, when they kind of did
their physicals and things like that. So the Philadelphia doctors looked at his body and they signed up for.
It, and so it might be they might have to capitulate with him too, But they capitulate with him and just pack them both in and give them this last twenty five just to rest and have a very important straight training summer and body right summer and really see what they got next year.
Yeah, I would think so, I would really think so. I don't even know if they're in the play in. I think they're twelfth right now. I could be wrong about that, but I think they're twelfth right now as far as in the East, and I don't see them, you know, you know, climbing up that not with those guys' bodies, not right.
I just don't think they have the.
Time, the chemistry and the health, you know what, I mean, to be able to you know, like kind of you know, be a factor in the East.
So I think they need to just kind of white flag it and surrender this year.
Kad. We appreciate your time, Bro. We'll talk to you soon, Okay, jam always.
Now I want to welcome to the show one of my favorite rachel I like your shoes.
I thank you, VI, Sarah, Nate Bronson, special Iam Beer Jordan, very impressive.
Hook me up tonight, big game Lakers in Dallas in LA. Unfortunately there will be no a d Luca just had his best game as a Laker the other night in Denver, Jj Reddick, So he's lost a ton of sleep game planning. But I know, Jay, that's JJ's game, and I know he loved it every minute of it. You got a little glimpse of bron and Luca kind of hitting their start at the same time they come up for only sixty points, nearly twenty rebounds, twelve assists in a dominating
performance over Denver. Where is tonight's game? And you've been blessed to see a lot of revenge games and guys going back and playing against other teams. Where does this Luca versus Nico in the owners of the Dallas Mavericks stack of again for you, Well.
Luca versus Nico is right because Ad is not going to be playing and this is going to be in La Yes, So for a true like revenge game, you kind.
Of got to go to the other place.
So the one that I saw that was like lit in person, that was the crazy at was Lebron's first trip back to Cleveland, right, that was crazy. People were throwing batteries at us on the sideline, like yeah, it was reporting and like it was it was out of control and like just the noise level was insane and all of this stuff. It's going to be interesting to see when Luca goes to Dallas. I think that happens in April. But this one, for me, it's not as spicy because AD's.
Not in the mix.
You're not seeing like my new team versus your new team, and it's not in Dallas. To me, the question is, if you're Nico Harrison, are you visibly sitting at that game where Luca can look at you talk his talk feed off saying things to you, or are you just in the building somewhere behind the.
Scenes off subject.
Real quick, weren't Nico and Polinka in the same building for a random reason the other night. Yeah, they're at a Warriors game, Warriors Gays Dallas. Okay, okay, So will Nico be present?
I mean, I think he'll be in Los Angeles, but will he be will he be visibly?
Lucas both known Nico for a long time.
Good guy. I met him through Cobe and long time with Nike. I always thought that situation was above his head and he may just be the kind of in position as far as his job to kind of.
Speak on it. Would you take that fall?
Take that fall?
I know?
But I mean he's you know, he's got a nice job with that team. But I think that was more ownership. But that's neither here nor there. He's going to be the guy that's going to get the brunt of.
The saying you're wrong.
I'm just saying I wouldn't do it.
Yeah, So this would be, like I agree on all fronts. I think the Lakers have set themselves up post Lebron. Obviously with Luca, the Lakers.
Need to start planning for the end of Luca's career, how they're going to build around Lebron.
So they'll just play forever. I mean, I like, here's what I like.
I like two things that the JJ said, the quiet part out loud. First of all, he made a big deal about prepping for this game in Denver, right where normally.
It's like, we don't care, it's just a regular season game, it doesn't matter or whatever.
Whatever.
JJ's like, no, no, this is a big deal. And he made a big deal afterward by saying, I hope that you guys in the locker room can build on this psychologically. I hope this shows you what a good team you are and how good you can be, especially here. But they hadn't won in three years, and most coaches will be there, like, it's not a measuring stick game, it's not a big deal, just you know, regular season whatever.
I love that he said that out loud. And I also love that he was like, yeah, Lucas playing on ball because that's been a thing, right and he said we're going to go through Lucamore.
I love that.
But I also think too, I mean, you can't rule them out of representing the Western Conference. I don't feel like you could rule them or Denver out. They've got experience, they got Hall of famers, there's a lot of young there's a lot of youth at the top of the Western Conference, and okay, see very male could be their year to come out of the West. I still think it's Boston's championship to lose. But I don't think you can rule the Lakers out. I don't think you ruled
Denver out. And you have to step on the Warriors like they're Freddie or Jason, like you have to really make sure they're dead. Because with the injection of Jimmy, what he's been able.
To do is huge.
But I saw that to say, you know, the big deal is Lebron and Luca don't really play defense, but there's every team has a couple guys that don't play defense. Can they be a good defensive team. Can they be in the right position, Can they communicate? Can they play with energy and second and third effort? And I think that's what jaj is trying to instill understand, like, hey, you know the elephant in the room. We know Bron is forty, so we need him to do certain things.
Luca's going to get better at effort obviously being here with all the eyes on him. Can we be a solid, solid team, defensive team, and can that be good enough to make a run for us.
Well, how much is the size thing a factor for you?
Because you know, it has seemed over the last couple of years that the West especially was trending big. Yeah, right, and you had to be big to compete. But Minnesota's not playing so well this year, right, And some of the other teams that like that aren't playing so well. I mean, Oklahoma City is not that big.
I think the only issue with big is if the Lakers have to run into Denver in the playoffs because you look, you know, and again, I feel like Boston is the best team coming. Boston's not big, They're very skilled that there skilled positions, and their big guys play hard. So I mean, Jackson Hayes is gonna, you know, gonna do a lot and have to really pick his game up. But I just think it's more can they be a good defensive team or team defensive team and and and
you know, ride this way. Lakers top sense of defense over the last that's a nice that's an that's an espnish status, And they top six and defense over the last five h and again, defense is a mindset.
You know that you've been running the game long enough.
There's there's always guys on every team that are good that don't play defense. You know, it's just a factive effort in a mindset. So you know, I think JJ. I gave JJ Hughes praise at the beginning of the season, and they started off good, then they started off a little slow. I believe in JJ because I know he puts the work in. So again, that's why to me, you can't rule out the Lakers or Denver in this way.
Picture agree, agree, agree.
Main takeaway from All Star I got a chance to sit down with PK sue Ban, who came off a huge segment that has really drawn a lot of attention and criticism and applause. At the same time, Four Nations for NHL NHAF figured out they're All Star format and the Four Nations thing was a success. The NBA is still trying to figure out what that is for them. What was your takeaway from this new format they used this past two weeks ago.
I didn't like it going in, I.
Didn't like it when it was happening, I didn't like it afterward.
It's just dumb.
I'm sorry, Like there's no other way to say this. We're inventing like six ways to play a basketball game. You know, how you play a basketball game. Two teams play against each other and see who's the best.
That's what happens. That is a good basketball game.
So if you're looking to fix the actual game itself, if you still want to have a game, I still say, don't make it the last thing in the weekend. So the guys are trying to get on a plane and get out six seconds after.
The game ends.
Fill the arena with not corporate types. Have people who care in the stands. We're gonna yell and call people out if they miss a step on.
Defense or something like that.
Like phill it with give it the tickets to charities, and like fill it with kids. I mean, you get you get guys playing harder. Another way to go is we talk to people about maybe doing a one on one tournament instead. Though, have you been paying attention to the unrivaled?
So unrival did their thing, and I think what scared people? And forgive me because I forgot the girl's name who beat Stewie? Yeah one, no, no, no, but who was the girl that beat Stewie twelve?
Oh? Yes, forgive me, Edward, you did your thing.
That's I like the one on one thing, but I think that right there with a younger player beating a legend and there in her game, I saw it.
I loved it.
You've talked to players along this. KG has been adamant about this. You've talked to a handful of other guys that would love this. What has been their feedback, not necessarily after, but just in general that guys are some people say NBA players don't. I think it sounds like guys are welcoming the challenge.
Yeah.
I talked to If you guys, you can listen to what they told me.
And if you saw the Unrivaled League the women, Yes, they got down with that one on one tournament. What do you think about doing one of those here at the All Star Game.
Yeah. When there's smoke, there's fire, and that's in the fire in one on one.
We talked to James Harden, we talked to Kyrie Irving, we talked to Anthony Edwards. Janna sent it to Koompa, Damian Lillard. These are guys who you'd want to see in this kind of tournament. Kyrie said something interesting to your point though, about Stewie. He said we'd have to agree to talk about the tournament differently, the way it's broadcast, the way it's discussed. And I think his point is if it was presented by the broadcasting network is like.
Oh, who's going to embarrass who?
And present it by fans and kind of players made to feel like they were putting themselves out there in a way that would be negative more than anything they could get from it. They're not going to do it. He's like, we'd all have to kind of collectively agree to talk about it differently.
It's just something fun.
If guys like, hey, you get beat one on one, that doesn't mean that you're a terrible basketball player. And I thought that was kind of interesting. I don't know if collectively, in an NBA Twitter era, we can I.
Don't think there's anywhere around the memes and the and and just the outside noise and I and I personally feel like that's what may keep it from not happening, is is our pride, you know what I mean?
Like, what would you if it was you?
I would try us versus the world first and foremost for the All Star Game and bring a sense of pride to that game because it's it's it's been lost. I think it's no secrets and what was Kobe's last doll game sixteen? Yep, it guys just haven't played hard, and I'm who to blame. I'm not here to find out who the blame. I want to help, you know, help figure out what the what the fixes why versus the world because I just think it's some pride there. Okay, there'll be some pride there.
I think fill out the rosters for me though.
That's it's gonna be tough.
I think it's going to be ten and ten and ten, twelve and twelve. Some guys are going to get cut. Some guys that deserve to make a normal they won't.
That's where it gets sticky. So it's two things.
Reason why I can tell I can sit here and tell you, just knowing the business of the NBA, why I will. I don't think we will ever see you as savers. I think that the Eastern Conference UH team owners and the Western Conference team owner still want their equal number of spots because having an All Star is good for you, right, is good for you and good for marketing. So they're not going to give that up
as sort of the way things go down. And then also at least right now, even though you would have a really good World team, it would be softer at the end of the roster, right, and then you'd have a bunch of American guys.
It should be there should be all stars.
I mean, who legit should be all stars. If it was only a ten to twelve man roster, would not make it. And can you imagine having your All Star spot?
You're rightful? You know that you're an All Star that year and then you.
Would make the team and they take how many each year? Just right now? That as that we stand right now, it's twelve and twelve right, twenty four total?
Yeah, think about the arguments about the snubs this year, like, I don't know who do you feel, Dylan, who do you feel is the most snub?
You think that the back half of the World team this year would be weaker.
Than the Americans.
I think that the end of the last third of the World team top heavy, it would be weaker than of guys who wouldn't make an All Star team. Do a ten or twelve man roster for me and tell me the last number, like ten, eleven, twelve guys are and would they actually make an All Star team if it was quote fair ups, if it was just East versus West, would they make the All Star Okay?
The world, Shay s g A, that's the same person, Luca Kokich.
Did you just count s and s g as two people because it's the.
Same person, Luca Jokic.
Yannis wembyonisbonis what you're up to? Seven? Okay?
So, by the way, he's going to play for the Wait wait wait wait wait, soons didn't make the All Star Game this year, so you're saying that he's number seven on your words, I'm just telling you that you've got seven and I'm getting into guy okay again, Jamal Murray, a guy who I don't think has never made an All Star Game?
Is that right?
Never? Never?
Who?
By the way, I think Jamal Murray is underrated, But the truth is he's never.
Made a Yeah a star this year?
Yeah?
Sure.
But you're looking at me as if you're proving your.
Point when you're not.
You're proving my point as you talk, as you talk and pointed me, you're proving my point.
That's an American.
Back to Italy again.
So you're you're you're twisting and stretching to get yourself. These are guys who wouldn't normally so so from seven on you're talking about guys who did not make except for Shangoon, did not make the All Star rosters this year. And then on the American side, give me the rosters who have American players who made it this year.
Luka, Murray, Wenbys, Kyrie Sangoon.
Okay, so Embiid isn't playing Australia, is not playing for the By the way, Kyrie is not competing in a World versus USA All Star game where he's playing for the World second of all, and BID's not playing this year, so you can't like say that he's in there. You're talking about guys in the ten, eleven, and twelve spot who are not typical, who in a regular All Star
format would not make the team. And then do the Americans for me, because that's an important part of this equation, as how Soft at the end of the world team being the really big part of this for me is making an All Star game is a huge deal. I think that it is being able to say I was an All Star, I'm an X time All Star.
I think it's sort of the pinnacle of the.
NBA because it's such a star driven league. That weekend everyone participates versus the finals. It's just two teams, that sort of thing. And you are denying guys who legit should be All Stars. And I don't mean fringe guys, I mean anyone number.
Thirteen through twenty four.
You're saying wouldn't make the All Star Game anymore.
Come on, you can't do it.
Be tough, be tough, moving on. And I cannot confirm or deny this is the truth, Rachel. But you have your ear to the NBA streets. Tell me, tell me Lebron James playing in the All Star Game was a fuck you to the NBA for having the young players involved in this little round robin turning.
Him not playing. I do know that that.
I have been told by people that they did not expect him to play for days at all the time, as opposed to, oh he woke up that morning. Okay, So if it was a fuck you, it was a it was a drawn fuck you, drawn out they fuck you.
It was a I am not doing this type of thing.
I don't. I mean I don't because he did play.
He played the first game out of the break right and he looked incredible. Yeah, they were the first game, right, Charlotte. Yeah, we we had some inside information and we can't divulge our sources. And I hate when they used to do this on TV too. It used to piss me off.
But some people said that, some people that have some knowledge of the game, and I don't know if it's true, that it was kind of like a fuck you to the NBA for the format and allowing these younger players that don't necessarily deserve the opportunity to be on the stage with the All Stars bronze that.
He wasn't doing it.
Yeah, just wait till we get to the USA versus the world and you have that in balance, and we really get this for you.
I mean, look, was it worth? Was it enough of a fuck you?
It was worth taking his streak because it's pretty damn good streak going was.
Six seventeen years sad or something like that.
Star Starter.
Played every year and then he played every year since then.
So so yeah, so you'd really have to be willing.
But maybe at this point he's like, you know, he's like Danny murtak.
Man, did you have any issues with kind of the way it went about just everyone else thought it was last minting. He didn't dress, he didn't do any I kind of feel like man's that's he's deserved. If anyone can do that as him, it would be a bigger issue of something.
You didn't love it.
I didn't love it just because I think biggest I said before, I think being an All Star is a cool things, special thing, and he could have given that to somebody else. You know, there's a way to still. I don't know what the technical if he then still is an All Star that year. I don't know if he had been giving up being an All Star.
I don't know what that.
If you're injured, you're still still technically an All Star, like Trey is an All Star and so is Anthony Davis.
And by the way, I don't know for sure there were new days ahead of time, but there were people who told me in the days leading up they did not think play.
So there you go to me.
It's Norman Powell could have got that spot. He played the three point contest the day before. He was deserving.
I respected that. A lot of guys are le bron do whatever you want to do, bro Rachel, you were in Paris for the Olympics. Netflix just released Quarter Gold. We got a chance to preview it at the All Star Game a couple of weeks ago. A ton of viral moments. Let's take a look at this clip.
What are you thinking about this young guy?
He can hook a little bit.
Huh A little h Yeah, I'll be just fan down the true, true, the truth. I guess he cold.
I got a game we created, he gave year time we played, and and and and y'all got.
And he's still.
Don't talk.
No, I'm just saying he got.
He got three. That's right, because you got credit.
I told you that he did.
He did, he did the game.
I remember, okay, leabay, this man. Are y'all talking to this young man? Because because he just keeps on right now, he just said he's the truth and all that and the truth, the whole truth or none. But that's what he said.
You asked him, tell him the whole context of the situation.
You asked him what he thinks about this young man, and he said, I'm okay.
I said I'm the truth.
Truth.
That's what happened.
All that.
We got to have that man the truth like that.
So this is streaming on Netflix right now for your as you don't know, going there and check it out. Rachel as someone who was there around that, around that team, thoughts, I had so.
Interesting watching Aunt there because here's a guy who definitely ran out of gas a bit at the end of the playoffs, right the Western Conference Finals. Whether it was just the energy level, whether it was just getting that much attention, defensive attention and sort of having it come with it to the level that we saw at certain times during the playoffs, having to do that every night
of a Western Conference finals. So I was super interested going into Paris what he would be like around the other guys, if he would be like I'm the one, I'm number one, which he said during Trading Camp member right, He's like, I'm number one on this team. But he did really when we were in Paris, seemed to show a lot of deference to the Kds, to the Lebron's, and you saw that in the documentary. Even with the shit he was talking to Obama, you can see how
he is. He's kidney candy store around Kevin.
Durant taken up.
And I loved watching that because then whenever it looks like it might not be this year. But whenever he gets back to the Western Conference finals, and he will, You and I both know he will get back to a conference finals at some point he will be a different guy in part because of these experiences.
M hm.
Before we get you out of your rate, we are coming to the end. And whether it's two three with Braun, who knows, maybe four when those three are gone, Kevin, Steph and Lebron, who do you kind of see?
Is there a face?
And someone asked Katie this the other day and he's like, what does that mean? What does the face mean? There's a lot that comes with it, good and bad. Who were is it?
Will it be by committee? Will?
Is there one guy that stands out to who do you think is going to carry that torch moving forward? And isn't an American player?
Yeah?
I mean, look, I covered Michael Jordan both when he was playing and then leaving the league multiple times. I covered him Chicago when he retired and who was the next Jordan? Then I covered him in DC? Then it was who's the next Jordan? And it was first of all we had like eight guys labeled the next Jordan?
Right?
Remember the herald Minor conversation Grant Hill, et cetera, et cetera. No one's ever the next steph Curry, Kevin Durant or Lebron James. It's usually there's a little void kind of right after guys like that retire, where people are feeling around and then someone emerges. Lebron James emerged right he
was drafted right when Michael finally quit. Like I think, to me, if I had to speculate now, I would say, Victor Webbin Yama this injury, notwithstanding Anthony Edwards, guys like that are going to be the future face of the league. I am still on record that depending you know. Look, obviously, if there's some huge health thing, I can't predict that. But if he goes on to play a normal career, Victor Webbin Yama to me, is going to be a top ten of all time player, and so I.
Think he is your next face of the league. It's just gonna take a while.
I mean, that's a wrap. Rachel.
Thank you for your time, looking forward to having you back.
Unplug.
You can catch us on all the Smoke Productions, YouTube and the Draft Kings Network. We'll see y'all next week.