Joe Johnson | Ep 72 | ALL THE SMOKE Full Episode | SHOWTIME Basketball

sir man, you look extra comfortable right now. Are you good? You don't mean to fall asleep on me? Are you now? I just relocated to a more comfortable spot in the crib, that's all. I'm not mad at that. Man. We got a special guest today coming from Uh yeah. I saw this series on HBO before it called Gang Banging and Little Rock? Is it that rough out there? Joe Joe Johnson? Welcome Joe Johnson to the show. Are they really gang

banging out a little rock? Joe? Man? They're banging everywhere, man, They're banging everywhere and they just a little rocky man. We'll welcome to the show. Let's get to it. Man. What is what is one thing you took from obviously, starting with Kobe early in it was a domino effect of just negative ship throughout the year. What was one thing you took from and just to cheerish the thing that you have more more importantly, Uh, spending you know countless hours or you know a time with my kids.

For me, that was that was it. But I stayed in the gym, and I'm with if I ain't in the gym, and with my kids Rice versa. Absolutely, how many how many kids? And what are the ages? I got to My son his name is Gavin, he's fourteen. My daughter's her name is Justin, she's seven. So yeah, I try to keep him in there. Women, I got a seven year old too. It is your son into hoping too? Yeah? Yeah, yeah. He's in the hooper man. He uh, he trains his butt off, you know. He

put in the works, so you know it'll come. He hadn't hit it, he hadn't hit no spurt yet, no gross spurt yet. But you know, it's it's funny to kind of see the changes and watch them grow week by week, like it's it's crazy. Yeah, my twins or twelve, so they're on the same They finally started to want to work out in their own so, like you said, you see those gradual improvements by the day to day basis. I enjoy it personally. Oh man, it's fun. It's fun.

So in this in this young NBA season, who's captured your attention, whether that be teams or individual players? That would definitely have to say LaMelo. Man, LaMelo has been He's been great. He's been everything that I thought he would be. You know, a big, tall point guard who has a great feel for the game, and I just love to watch him play. Man. The one thing I took from him is he just out there playing with confidence. And that's what we all we all know, we all

played a long time. Confidences everything in this league. And and and obviously if you get in the league, you can play, but the fact that you have the confidence in the green light. I love the way he's played. He's played like he's been here for a handful of years already. So he's definitely been an eye opener. I've loved the wet way he's played. Yeah, very poise man. I enjoy it, you know, to see how you run the show, how he sees the floor like as a PG.

I mean you couldn't ask for a better player to put with that team with all them athletes a gap. You look like you're in game shape. You're ready for that deadline call. Man, Listen, I stay in game shape. Uh honestly, Bro, I I stay in the gym and me training and working out. I probably enjoyed that far more than you know, hooping. But it keeps me in great shape. And anytime somebody calls me and it's an opportunity, then yeah, I'll take a look at it. Like I said, Man,

my kids keep me going, bro. So we go to the gym every day, workout, and we stay at it. What's up. We'll take us back to where it all started. Um, what was your upbringing? Like your childhood? Man, it was the only child. It was just me and my mother. Uh my dad has two daughters by previous marriage, but we didn't grow up close niche. So we're trying to,

you know, bridge that gap, man. But you know it's been it's been a little difficult because we're older now and you know, things are you know, they're doing anything. I'm doing my thing. But I came up the only trial and uh, you know, it's just me and my mother. She worked two and three jobs. She did what she could, uh to make things working for us to get by. And I've seen the hard work that she put in

day to day. It's just kind of how I applied to my My regiment is uh, you know, as I got older, the things I started to do, when it was training, working out, or taking basketball serious. When did you stop playing basketball? Man? I fell in love with the game probably about like eight, that's probably like right when I started, like seven, eight years old, and from that point on, Jack Man, I just I couldn't put it down. And still to this day, Bro, I love it just as much as I loved it back then.

That's why it's hard to let go. You know what I mean. It's hard to let go, Bro. It's it's like that was that was really and truly my first love, and uh, it's just hard for me to just throw it to the side and be like, you know, and I don't want to do it no more. Did you play? Do you play any other sports? Growing up? Just basketball? Strictly hooper, Bro, This is hey, listen, strictly strictly hooping. That was it. I didn't try no other sport, didn't

want to try no other sport. That's just what it was. Who Who are some of the players you looked up to um growing up as a Hooper, Some top players my idols, obviously Michael Jordan's opinion hard the way Kobe Bryant. And when I say Kobe, I'm talking the number eight Kobe. That's the Kobe. That's the Kobe I felt in. That's the Kobe that was planted on my wall, you know what I mean. I competed a lot against twenty four.

I competed against eight, too, but I competed a lot against twenty four, and uh, the number eight is just you know, seventeen, eighteen years old out of high school, playing in the NBA code, about two three years older than me. I felt that to do it, I felt it was possible, you know what I mean. I remember

because we did the same pre draft. You were out in l A working with Neilo Shake and I was just blowing away at how motherfucking smooth and under control this dude, Jack Like, he didn't say a word the entire time he was in there. He just killed the motherfucker had that handle, the shot, the step backs. Joe was just out there doing this thing. I'm like, who is this quiet motherfucker over here? He was just going about his ship and just steadily how he went out

through his career. You know, his career was the same way. He just went out there and performed. It wasn't no talking, it wasn't this, it wasn't that. Joe was just out there the hoop. And I got my first introduction to him like that, and I think it was was two thousand two one. Yeah, I got draft one on the person to spent me around in the NBA. I say that I get hey, listen, listen, listen. Man. I enjoyed

every uh. I enjoyed every bit of that, you know, the draft process, going to l A working out and what y'all gotta understanding. Always my whole career, all way up to about ninth grade, I played point guard. I wasn't the biggest guy. I was average hYP. I was literally I was a strictly point guard. I complain no other position. That's how like I was average hype. I had always had a decent handle going into ten grade, man, I grew like four or five inches, you know what

I mean. Now I'm six five and jump balling. Bring the ball up the court, like, man, who the tall skinny kids happen? That's gotta happen for real. That's the same way with you know, I grew I grew probably five inches and once something going to the ninth grade. Going to the ninth grade. Yeah, alright, these are things

that I break down to my son. I'll be like, look, man, because he be asking me questions like why he can't grip the ball, Like, man, you ain't even grow into your body at your hands, just coming just you'd be patient, you know what I mean. He wanted to be Joe now. Man, he wanted right now, chill, just chill, It's gonna come b But he's in that area too, you know what I mean. Like I said, he's fourteen, my kids, or

twelve now was when people start hitting those spurts. You know, miss something, get it early something, get it a little later. I got mine at fourteen going into high school as well. Was I grew six inches, So he dried on the cusp, Like I already know how he's feeling. What was the basketball scene back um, like in Little Rock from high school, was a lot of competition out there. You want Mr Alcosol basketball nine, but was there any good competition out

there for you? Yeah, man, we had great competition. Uh Man, you know what, you know, they don't come really do. Back then, you didn't get a lot of McDonald's all Americans from down South. I mean, you get a couple here and there. But the talent, the talent down here is is crazy. And we're gonna help get these guys some notoriety, you know what I mean. But by some of the things that me and my camp is doing to help. He's got to put them on a major platform.

But no, the talent is great. It was great back then. It's still great, and uh we just gotta get some notorieties to it. Yeah, that's fast. Because I'm from the South. I had to go to Okhill, Joe just to make the McDonald's game. I was the same player my junior year, but going to Oak Hill, I got a better look. You know what I'm saying. It's always it's so much talent coming out the South. Bro, we just don't get them looks. But what's stood out to you? What's what

stood out to you about your high school career? My high school career, Man, I went to school. I went to high school with a bunch of guys who I knew and grew up with. To be honest, we had been playing together since it was about eleven, twive years old. A and the majority of us, you know, went over to Central, the school called Central Little Rock Central High School, the Little Rock nine segregation all that. That's a whole

another story we can talk about on another day. But initially me and my best friend was just going there because you know what, coming out of junior high school, we wasn't highly red creuded like that. But he's like, we're gonna go to Central. They weren't about nothing. We're gonna go over there and we get to play and be something. But then all other guys they kind of came over there with us and they chucked us into a powerhouse off dump like from the first season. You know,

Tin Gray was was high school. Nine grade wasn't high school then, so yeah, they went I Tink Gray year. We made it to the title game and we lost, but we should have wanted every year, man, But obviously

we came up short. Our senior year, you know, we ran the table, but it was awesome and it was on the best shops of my career as far as basketball, because you really becoming to who you think you're gonna be, you know, as far as then you go off to college, but through high school you're still trying to figure all that out. And the fact you got to play with your people, you know, I mean, that's what makes it specially when you get to pay with the people you

grew up with. Yeah, that was dope. Man. Also winning the championship that that high school hadn't won a title on a long time prior to us winning one there, so that was Yeah, that was fun. What top schools were recruited, man, Jack, I had everybody recruit me, but I only wanted to be a razor back. Man. I came up watching Yeah, I came up watching Corlis Willson, Scott. Yeah. I knew he was gonna say Scotti, bro I came up. I came up watching them guys. Not only that, I

was playing pick up with him here and there. So I've seen how dominant they was in college, and they made you want to be a razor back. So you saw them when you see l A ran through them in the tournament. Look, look, look, I see I've seen everything. You gotta understand when the razor backs played, bro they stopped school like were in school. They stopped school like we go every class and have it on like we Man. It was crazy. Yeah, it was crazy. That's that's that

small town field. Some games with arkansasin and U n l V. Man, those games was classic, bro Man. They was really broadling out to them, man, for real. That was that was some real basketball back then. Man. What was your first meeting like with legendary coach Nolan Richardson to mean with me and Coach richard and my family was It was awesome? It was everything we expected. I mean, we committed right after that. I wanted to commit anyway, but you know, him come sitting in my living room

talking to my mother and my grandmother and my uncle's. Uh. That was an amazing feeling. You know, I really feel like I had made it. After that freshman year, All Freshman Team, All Tournament average sixteen six, two and two, led Arkansas to the tournament, lost to Miami in the in the first round. What was your first experience like in the n C Double A Tournament Because that ship is amazing to me and for those of guys that

like Jack, you know, went straight to the league. He didn't get a chance to see what the n c Double A tournament was like. What was that first experience like for you? It was awesome for me, Uh, the competition alone. But I will say this, you know, my freshman year was kind of a blur. I didn't I was a prop for the eight going to college, so I didn't play into January. He's something. So when I came on in January, I had everything pent up and built up inside of me and I just kind of, yeah,

lasted out on the court. But man, we was We was fifteen and fourteen going into the SEC tournament. We weren't making it. No n c A Championship, no n c A tournament. SEC tournament. We running the table. We played against three top ten teams in the SEC tournament to go to and beat him and go to the n c A tournaments. I heard the first team the only team never win then SEC title. Who were the teams you beat on the way through through the tournament? The SEC tournament, Man, we had to play l s

U with stro Smith. Hey, that was Duncan. Strom was a Duncan motherfucker. Man, I wish you never got hurt. That motherfucker was a Duncan, motherfucker boy man. Dude was unreal Outdore. And we played against Kentucky Tashaw Prince Keith Bogan's y Yeah yeah yeah. And we played against UH Alban. Alban was ranked like number five a year, sophomore year,

All SEC, Second Team, UH Honorable Mention, All American. You got a chance to play thirty games fifteen six and three, lost to George down in the n C Double A Tournament, and then it's time to go capture walk us back to what your college experience like. Obviously, it was a dream to go there. You go there for two years and then you're ready to take your talents to the NBA. It was a scary moment. It was scary because I knew that my my dreams was right in front of me.

So to make that leak and going and have to tell coach listen, um, I think I'm gonna enter the NBA draft. That was That was tough, but you know I went through with it. So two thousand one, the tenth pick in the draft to the Celtics. You joined up with Paul Pierce, Antoine Walker. What were those Celtics teams? What was that Celtics team like your first year. Man. Listen, first though, Paul Pierce, they just got his first check, like his first big country I think he you couldn't

tell him ship oh man. And then you know he had been you know, Paul had went through you know, he had went through a lot, man, you know, and you know with everything he went through and he got that in twin you know it's won't hey, man, I had a great time. Trust me, I know, I know he look for a young country boy. Man. You give me out damn bousing man. Listen all through that day, you mean who were who were who were the some of the vets on your team, Tony bat Williams, Kenny Anderson,

Walter MC. I played with some real events man. Them dudes, Hey, they changed my life. Man. I think you touched on a good point because the NBA is completely obviously changed the way they play. But when we came into the league, there were vets, like real vets, like in the age vet that thirty three to thirty seven thirty eight range, where whether they played or not, they contributed to the team. They help young people like you. You know, they were ready if they were called upon. But the game is

different now. And I say that to say, I still feel like you can play. I can still feel like Jamal Crawford can play. There's guys that can still play. But the be A has changed from a standpoint of Now, you know, Steph Curry is a vent on the Warriors and he's like thirty two. He's the oldest player on the team, which is crazy because, like I said, when we first came in the league, they were real O

G O G vets. They were there to do a lot of you know, the dirty work and in the lifting and helping young guys kind of navigate the crazy NBA life. Yeah, well, I mean it's tough now. I mean the league is getting younger and younger. You know, you got guys, there's so many guys coming one and done that you know they're gonna keep a guy based off potential as opposed to somebody who's been around, you know for fifteen sixteen years, you know what I mean. So that's just kind of how it is. What was

your welcome to the NBA moment? My welcome to the NBA moment's playing against? Uh? What's playing against? So my rookie year was MJ's first year back in the NBA with the Wizards. Yeah, we played against them. Fourth game of the season. I was starting. Will was getting hurt the second game of the season, small for so they started me. Uh, and I gotta guard m J. Paul Paul Piers Like, man, I'm gonna get him in the fourth quarter. I need you to get in the first three. Look,

I'm like I been so uh man. We got out there first off, Twin and m J talking stuff to each other on the tip, like you know what I'm saying. So m J tell Paul, I gotta come all the way back to the NBA just just to get a pickup game with you, just to get around with you said, hey, all going back and forth. But I'm like, man, y'all gotta chill. You know what I'm saying, Like I'm the one got to guard this man. But uh, it was it was a fun moment. Man. I embraced the challenge

and uh, I had so much fun. But I got so many pictures and memories from that moment and even the video, like it was crazy. It was on T and T like I never forget it. What did he do that game? He finished with like thirty thirty two? End up getting I had sixteen and tens l solid solid. Yeah, I'm surprised you got I'm surprised you got enough looks to get so early in your career. You're traded from the Celtics to the Sun for Rodney Rogers and Tony Delkin.

Oh too, Is that when you realize there was a business? Yeah, I didn't know. I didn't realize it was a business that I just started. I wasn't want it, you know what I mean, Like, Uh, I didn't understand that when you create a little value for yourself as a young guy, then you know, uh, they don't want you to get hurt or they don't want you to miss their value up, so they're gonna push you to the side a little bit,

you know. I was. I was asking fourteen points a game, playing with them as a rookie, and uh, coach came to me straight up and it was like, look, man, because we had two other rookies, Joe Forte and Keijick Brown. He was like, we gotta give all these guys a look. So I sat down. I didn't for like seventeen streight game DMPs and then I got traded cold game, cold game. So what was it like Head of the Phoenix, obviously a great city. What was it like when you first

got there? Well, when I first got there, it was Stephan mar Verry Penny Hardaway, Sean Marrion right away was coming off the bench back and those three guys, and uh, it was fun. But you know, I was so inconsistent early in my years that you know, I didn't really I didn't even get to play a lot, to be honest, And two thousand to two thousand three we end up playing y'all in the playoffs in the first round, and

around that time you was coming to your own. You really was helping carry that team besides Stephan MARII what you remember about this series, I just remember being amped to play. Man, I'm gonna be honest, like, uh, I think we were the a C y'all, the one C Jack. Yeah. I knew it was gonna be tough to beat y'all, but I know we we we messed around the one that first game was Steph hit that buzzer beat them oh man from half Hey, Uh I knew that, you know,

Stephanamari could dominate, you know. For me, I'm just gonna be honest, man, I just wasn't I wasn't that polished to help them dues uh and Sean to help them or get on the help that we needed to try to, you know, make a playoff push. It took me another year or two before I could, you know, understand that what changed when Steve Nash arrived the following year. Steve could have averaged ten mm, but he chose an average

fourteen points in thirteen and six. He kept We get Steve Nash and Quentin Richardson Q that's my guy with me and q uh Q led the league and three point three point mates I shot. I shot four to seven percent from the three. We're shooting the cover off that thing. And Steve made shure man. He made sure that we ate. That's what it was. I really appreciate it for that man because he could have each and every night he could have came out and the average

at least twenty five. Well, you guys kind of really started or not started, because we touched on it with Golden State, but you guys really brought that small ball, up tempo pace a game to the NBA to stay and obviously now everyone plays at that, But what was it like that style? Because I mean, at the at the end of the day, that's the style we all want to play. We all just want to get out and hoop, run, feel the lane, shoot dunk. But what was it like actually getting to do it in a

real life NBA setting? Man, I don't even know if that was d An Tony style from the jump. I'm just gonna be honest. I'm gonna tell you what happened. I'm gonna tell you what I think. I'm gonna tell you what I think happened. What I think happened was, like I tell you, I was a little inconsistent. So they bring Nash and Q O with for me and Q to battle out at the two spots. Because Sean at the time of the three, he was an all start to three. You who you You know what I'm saying.

So throughout throughout the whole camp, you know, from time to time, me and Q will be up against each other sometime we've been on team. But by the time again in the first preseason game, he was like, man, Sean, you just played the four, mar you played the five, Joe and Q two and three. Because I don't know, he just he just didn't want to leave nobody out. I guess I'm not sure. And from that point on we went. We blow through the whole preseason. I'm talking

about smashing teams, but you know it's the preseason. They're like, oh man, with up. Regular season started the same thing. So your next the next year, you're having your career high seventeen points, get a chance to play all eighty two games. You guys win sixty one games. What was it like, kind of finding your footing? Because on the outside looking in, that's kind of when you really started fighting yourself. What was it like to kind of finding

and come into your own in that situation? It was fun for me because I played backup point guard, even though I started at the two or the three. Rather I backed up Steve Nash when he went out of the game, I played the point, and I always I always loved playing the point because I love making plays and making guys better. So I always took that challenge and uh and have fun with it. Cod Antony, trust me enough man, and put the ball in my hands

through Uh. You know, in tough situations, crunch time, and I just tried to deliver. You had a nice run with Phoenix UM two thousand five, you signed as a restricted free agent. Oh yeah, so excuse me, a sign and trade. You got your first nice piece of money,

ching ching. You feel like your time was up in Phoenix or just you wanted a fresh start in Atlanta the way it was set up, you know, like if Phoenix scared everybody off from trying to sign me, then they can lowball me and come back with some bs. So I had to tell them, look, let's due to sign and trade. I don't want to come back. I had to if I didn't being out of cane back for peanuts, you know what I'm saying. So I had to make a tough decision. Yeah, I had to make

a tough of shooses. That sounds like some Robert sarvership over there. Yeah first year Actually yeah he was. He was. He was a bum. So we understand where you're coming from. What did you see for yourself in a t l Like when when you got there? What did you see? I mean other than the city? You know, I liked it. I loved the city. Uh you know, I had been in Atlanta a few times, but I knew the Hawks

wasn't it wasn't a playoff team. But you know, I was like, look, man, maybe you know, in a couple of years, we can get this thing rolled and turn this thing around, because I thought that the city deserved, you know, a playoff team, a title contending team, and uh, you know, he was able to turn around. And when I first got to Atlanta, man didn't even feel like the NBA like we we non seriously, we literally had about maybe three or four hundred people at the games.

It was it was bad, man. It was so depressing, Like to the point, well, I ain't even want to go out to eat, hangout, I ain't wanna do nothing. Like it was bad. From two thousand five to two thou ten. You ever run a five straight seasons averaging twenty points a game? What were once you? Guys? You

were able to change the climate and the culture. They're um getting into the playoffs two thousand tho thousand and twelve, you have some re memorable matchups, you know, running to the Celtics team oh eight, Lebron's MVP two thousand ten team Derrick Rose. What were some of your more memorable playoff moments with that team? Man? Probably, you know, to be honest, I had to say the Celtics series against KG and Paul took him to seven, right, You took

him to seventh, didn't you. Yeah, we took him to seven games. We were the A seed, they were the one seed, and they just couldn't beat us in the Atlanta Man. Atlanta, the fans really came out and gave us that that six man that we needed because we was kicking their butt in Atlanta, but they was roasting us in Boston. We didn't have a chance. They have at hey, listen, man were mopping the people in the eight Man, but we could do nothing in Boston. Tough, tough, tough.

Who were some of the people you were closest to on the Atlanta scene, Guys like Josh Smith, you know ST's got this is you know, someone who I talked to still the day and I mean he's my neighbor, Marvin Williams. Uh when we got a Jeff Little, Jeff t Josh Childress. You know, all those guys were young in age and uh, you know, not far apart from me, at least two three years far apart from me. So you know, all those guys are cool. Was Jamal there with you with all Crawford? Yeah, I played with Jamal

Crawford for two years. Man, they're doing there as a clown. He take the all time? Man? What wrong with this dude? Man? Bro with it. He don't have to say a word to you. Man, he just walked up to you start tackling. You know, you said he with them fingers, they'll poke, right they do. Man, My boy though, no boy, shout shout out Jamal. We gotta get Jamal on the show. Man. I can't leave absolutely. So what led to you making the move from Atlanta to Brooklyn? I don't know, man,

maybe timing. Uh, you know, I got a phone call. They asked me. He's like, man, would you think about playing, you know with the Brooklyn this? And at that time, the Brooklyn it's been to be a first year So I was like, whatever, it's New York. Whatever, And uh, two three days later, I was traded. It's gonna happen. So you're trading for Jordan Farmer, Anthony Morrow, Petro, Deshaun Stephenson, and Jordan Williams for a first round pick. Um. What

was that experience like? Obviously a new Brooklyn team, Like you said, you're in New York. What was that experience like there's nothing like no other. I had a great time playing in New York. It was it was awesome. I never thought I'll be playing in New York. And I thought Brooklyn was a great franchise. It still is, um and I just enjoyed it. I enjoyed the whole process. I had great teammates, you know, I would I wish we could have, you know, done something special, but we didn't.

It was but it was fun. I got chat to see Darren Williaves at his best, bro and uh, you know, we lost to him in the in the playoffs. How was it playing with him? And how good was he at his best? He was great? You know, I think, you know, whenever he had his mind, made up man

to attack and and made guys better around him. I mean, you couldn't do nothing with him, because I've seen him except the challenge, you know, night in and night out against guys who you know, he may have heard whispers that was better than him or things of that nature. So I've seen him accept the challenges and and you know and answer that. Uh so, yeah, I knew he was the top point guard. The blockbuster trade of two thousand thirteam that brought Paul pierceon Kevin Garnett to Brooklyn

along with Jason Kidd as the head coach. What was the energy like around the city and what was your excitement level like to to be able to have these guys team. Oh, the energy around the city was crazy, you know, I mean, the buzz was it was sick. We was a title contending team. We was a team that was supposed to be Miami and uh And honestly I felt that way. I thought that we could have. I thought that we really had a team to give

him a great run. Man. You know, those guys brought that pedigree, that championship pedigree that we need it as a team to get guys like myself, Darren and Brooke over the hump. So they were great. They did their part. Man, we just came up short. But the journey was fun, man, getting to know you know, KG and getting to know Paul on another level. Uh, I mean it was fun for me. What was it like teaming up with them

as teammates. Obviously you got a chance to team up with Paul your rookie year, you know, your your several years into the league. Now you've established yourself as as one of the best players in the league. What was it like having those guys around in the locker room and what are some of the maybe some of the crazy stories you guys had as as a team. Well, KG got a story every day, He got a different day. Every day. He gonna be in full sweat telling you

the story too. So I looked forward to I look forward to getting practice because he was always the first one that practice. You could never beat in the practice first, but any time I got there, he always had a story for me. So he was definitely one of the guys who I used to always, you know it, pick and ask some questions. And he's a hell of a teammate. He's just, you know, a guy to compete against. You know, you probably have problems with, but as a teammate, bro,

you would love him. Know, we had him on the show and I only got a chance to compete again us in the whole time. But getting the chance to meet him off the court and know him now, it's crazy because you would think, like his energy is like is that fake? Because that this it is that that's the that's the motherfucker you get when the game is going and in real life, sitting next to you chilling, the same energy, the same kind of talk, the same sweat, the same crazy stories. Uh is what you get on

and off the court with him. So it was fun seeing that the energy was great. You know, Jason Terry is with them too, so the character, oh my god, the energy was crazy. But you know, like I said, man, they kept us focus day in and day out on what the prize was ultimately what we was trying to do and with the title, and uh, we just tried to gain their chemistry the whole year. But we dealt

with so many injuries. Brooke went out for he broke gets foot and was out for the whole year, and we was playing through Brooke, so you know, now we had to switch up the whole scheme and figure things out. But we tried to make the most of it. Man, those guys were great. They did everything they could for us, and uh, I just hate that we didn't even you know, at least make it to the Eastern Conference finals or something.

You know, I just thought that, uh, we had that they put that team together for us to really compete. Obviously the goal was to make it to the finals. You guys felt a little short, but you know, that playoff process. You guys had a thrilling seven game series against Toronto, but Paul Pierce comes up big with that shot. What was the process like trying to get to the finals that year, because obviously you guys had the team you felt it was good enough to beat Lebron in them.

What was the process like in the playoffs? It was tough. It was up and down because we had we had a game in there to where man, we were down almost forty points and we came back and tied it up and almost one. I think throughout every game we learned something that you know, you had to be consistent for for eight minutes. And I think for me that was probably the most the most thing. That the thing that I've seen the most. Like, you know, we put together a good half or or three quarters, but we

wasn't finishing games. And uh, come to the latter part of that series, was able to put him away. In that seven game in Toronto. We we played unbelievable down the stretch. Now you guys are heading into the second round with Miami. You know obviously they got their big team. You guys got your team. You guys played We played them well during the regular season, but in the playoffs Lebron went on another level. What was that series? Like?

He had one of them games, man, to where he just you know, locked in and I think he scored like forty nine points. But it was it was just him being ultra aggressive and just taking everything we gave. You know, when he knocking down them them deep jumpers, you had, you had his mercy, you know, he was he was, he was, but he had he just had one of those games and man, were he exploding. We couldn't do nothing with him. And that's what it was like. They got him over the hump. Yeah, so you guys

are on the decline. You guys went all and nothing. They were Brooklyn the player doesn't work in fifteen sixteen. You got to study on the decline. You take a buy out. Had the South Beach for a little bit. What was going on? What was Miami like? Man, it was everything you can imagine class. Listen, they first class, first and foremost. Uh and man, you're gonna put it in the work. You know, you ain't no cutting no corners around now, you know what I mean? Like they

do waiting body fat every Friday. So if you don't make waiting body fat, it's gonna be Hey, it's gonna be trouble. So, you know, I looked forward to that, and I needed that type of discipline, man when I was playing. So I had a great time in Miami and I took a lot of things from that place that I still used today in my dated life. Yeah that's dope. So you went from one hot spot in Miami to Salt Lake City, Uh, you know where you found your role and played that perfect vet role and

helping defeat the Clippers in the first round. What was it like going from Miami to Utah? It was a little bit of a coaching shock, but I made the most of it. I enjoyed the process. I knew what I was there for and I just wanted to fulfill that. You know, at that point, man, I was what I was about thirty four. I knew my I knew my basketball career is pretty much coming to an industroice planning in the NBA. But I wanted to go out there and hip those young guys win and we and we

put together put together a great game plan. You get Queen and his and his coaches staff. You know, a great great amount of critic because of what they're doing now. It does not surprise me. Man. That man is the Jeans. Yeah, we were been talking to a lot about him. You got a chance to play two with the with the young Gordon Hayward, who we talked about earlier in one of our other shows, who's kind of finding his footing again in Charlotte. How good was Gordon Hayward healthy? Uh?

In you talk? Gordon is great. I mean he's a three level score get to the cup, mire range three balls. He's good off the good off the bounce, and good in picking rolls. He made guys better. I thought I thought he was great. I think he's a great talent and he's showing improving it now. You Yeah, nickname is so Joe. I kind of changed your name, bro, I kind of. I kind of switched your name up a little busy. People don't know you wanted. You wanted original

Jarding guys. You know what I'm saying. You want original guys. So, so I changed your name is SPECIs. Especially after the battle we had in the Championship and after you ran through the Big Three, I changed I changed your name to air So Joe. Hey, we're hey. When when was when when was the name? I'm calling you ask so Joe from here on out, But when did the name so Joe officially? When? When was the name officially born?

I don't know when, man, gonna be honest, because when I'll be seeing some late game footage, like older game footage, I can hear then announced to say I so Joe. I just remember really coming to live in Utah, you know, in Utah and that uh in the Clipper series. I remember hearing it so much, and it's just kind of just kind of stuck with it. It seems like the rooft your career, you've always been willing to take and make the big shots down the stretch. You've always been

a clutch performer. Has it just always been that way. Was a point in the league where you felt like, Okay, I could do this or have you always had that thought process even coming into the NBA? Man, you know what, It's just a knack that I've had since since high school. Man, I've in late game situations, I've always been pretty good, Uh, you know, just trying to let my team and coaching stepp down uh in those moments, you know, and those

moments are needing a bucket or needing to stop. But but more important is just I just love those moments, man. I mean we all have them, you know, we all count down, shoot the shot. I just I just love being in those situations. Hey, I think, I think so. I think I think Matt that with him, with him it's a little different because he already like a laid back type of cat and and in games he like he got that Tim duncan gene. You can't you can't

rather them, you can't frust them. They always that even killed, So Jake, Kobe and Kobe the same way. And the guys at the end of the game that said, even killed, they're gonna shoot. They shot the same way that at the end of the game, the same way that shoot in the first quarter. That's that. That's that poison patience. That's what that's that's that's that's what I'll be a preaching bro poison patients. I teach that to my son.

I teach that to all my kids who we trained and uh, because if you got that, there's nothing that can rather of you, just kid, and very few players have it. M Are there any shots in your career that stand out the most? You've hit a lot of big ones. Anyone that you remember like, okay, hell yeah, that was it? Anytheam and stands out. I know, you gotta go through a lot of game winners. Make it. Hey that ship I know one for sure? What was you one? The one went in Brooklyn? You too? You

hit two? You hit two against the Bucks against the Bucks? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, that was a yeah them them? Uh yeah. I would say there was probably the most difficult ones because the way I caught the ball on the three point of the first time, I had to turn my body like the obposite wait were like from my shooting hand, I had it. So to make that shot to tie again,

that was tough. And then they come back and over time and make the game winning shot pull up at the free throw line was Yeah, that was probably the toughest one. I would say, seven time All Star. Any moments in the All Star Game that stand out to you the most? Yeah, my first one, My first one, Man, I played. My first one was in Vegas. I didn't even get picked for the Alstar Games averaging game. But I'm playing with the Hawks. We weren't winning. Jay Kidd

get hurt, he was playing. He get hurt. And I was alternate. I took it just I took it with pride. I showed up in Vegas and had a hell of a time. Man, that was my first one. Bro. I enjoyed that with Man. It was because it was it was so unexpected. It was so spontaneous, like we was already on the West Coast playing and you had to be, you know, in Vegas on like a Friday. It was already like Wednesday. So when they told me right to Vegas, Man, we had a ball, me and my home. We went

to add the ball. I was gonna say, that's the All Star game that the pac Man Jones got in trouble at in Vegas. Right, it was else he got to some ship, right, Yeah. Toughest opponents throughout your career, toughest opponents, man, the toughest guys that were for me to guard with, Guys like Ray Allen, Reggie Miller, Rip Hamilton. They it was too much for me man chasing off

them picks. They don't stop my people. Man, Listen. That is because look, you gotta spend so much energy defensively and take away your offense because you're chasing the whole game. That's that's The hardest part that with them the hard people to guard. Yeah, people think like, don't get me wrong, it's hard to guard Kobe Lebron, But you know you

played good defense. They make a shot, alright, cool, But to chase, to chase a man around the whole court and then had to fight through two and three picks, that's the hardest thing. That's when they had the big big the big screeners too. That's when Ben Wallace playing the Detroit KG was setting picks for Ray, like chasing them. Dudes in Indiana said it was funny because we were playing Boston in the Eastern Finals and I had to chase Ray's ass around. I was going between Paul and

Ray and I just couldn't get it. So I called Reggie Miller just like, yeah, what the fund can I do to So he had told me a couple of tricks on grabbing and not letting them feel his body and it helped. But overall, remember having to chase these dudes around picks. You work your ass off, get hit with big screens and they still make the shot. That ship used to be so frustrating, man, so frustrating. It's the hardest thing. Who was your favorite one on one battle,

My favorite one on one battle. Uh Man. I had some good battles with Brandon Roy. Yeah, killer. Then I had some good battles with Brandon Roy, playing against Brunn and Cleveland a few times that we had some good battles. Uh Kobe. I remember going back and forth with Kobe once and he came to Atlanta. Lakers came to Atlanta and uh Man, probably by like the last fourteen point his fifteen points, it was just me and him going

back and forth, and you know, it's it. And when Lakers come to Atlanta, you can see number Laker fans in there. Uh Man, it was going crazy. That was going crazy. But those are those definitely moments that I remember. You mentioned Brandon Roy as one of your favorite matchups. What made him so special? I feel like he's someone who gets lost in the mix and probably one of the greatest what if stories in the history of the game. What made Brandon Roy so special? In your opinion, he

just knew how to play man. He had a great pace he had to get He had a great pace to his game, and he was an underrated defender. I thought he was a pretty good defender, and uh he really made me lock in when I played against him. That's why I said he was one of the good matchups because he he was a quiet guy also, but he got it done. Yeah. I thought you guys had to have some similarities from a you know, pace of play and and never hurried, can play at different speeds

if wanted, and can definitely get a bucket. So that's interesting you brought that up as a matchup because I definitely see some comparisons and some similarities between you two. Yeah, and he was athletic to that boys some sneaky oh yeah, dunk on you too? Big three Bro? Big Three? Uh? Are you hoping to return to the Big Three? I've started. I was in the Big Thie from the start, one of the faces, bro, and my three years of playing a Big Three, my favorite game. I was honored to

play against you in the championship. I think that was my favorite game by far my Big Three career. But I know you're returning as as defended champion. How are you feeling about the Big Three and did you enjoy man, I'm honestly I'm looking forward to it. I'm hoping that it comes back. I want to play, uh, and for me. It doesn't wonder us. Man. I mean, he gave me an outlet. It was a stress reliever from from that time through what I was going through. Gave my kids

something doing the weekend, something fun. But most importantly, I got a chance to compete again at a high level, you know what I mean. So I really enjoy that. Man, that that that never that never dies. I don't feel like it ever dies in me. You know that that competitive nature always wanted to compete and play like I mean,

it's just me. So it kind of seems like, will you ever be at peace with letting basketball go where you're gonna be someone that we're gonna see in the gym still in ten or fifteen years or busting yourselves ass or somehow someway. Well, basketball is always gonna be a big part of your life. Yeah, basketball will always be a big part. Man. It opened too many doors

for me. Uh, I love it and I and you know I didn't I didn't quit because I have a you know, uh, knee surgery, ankle surgery or you know, I had an injury period. You know. Uh, it's just the older you get. I mean, you guys understand how it is or the nature of the business. But you know it wasn't that great. You know my last year or last year too in the NBA. But I still love to play, and like I said, my kids pushed me. Man. So yeah, y'all are definitely y'all always see me in

the gym. You'll always see me work, can out and probably see me hooping somewhere. Let me go back right quickly, though, but I want you to shout out to Ice Cube. I want you to set the stage for a lot of people that don't know the Big Three Championship bronze sideline. We had all the superstars, all the celebrities. Tell me your experience for the Big Three Championship in led State with something. It was more than what I expected. I

really enjoyed it. I think, Yeah, shout out to Cube man for for making that happen and uh and getting a chance to compete against you. Jack was awesome. Bro. I already knew the challenges that was upon myself and our team going into that game. I was like, look, man, don't y'all go to listen all that Jack gonna be talking. Man, y'all get that. Look we stand what he talked about. Man, we're gonna compete with this weird So, man, I really appreciate that. And then look and I became super super

cool Frank Nitty uh the TBT together. So a lot came from there. Man, I really appreciate y'all. Man, I mean, I had a ball. I hope you all enjoyed John Sales as well. I did. I did, Bro, because like me being around, I know you was going through a lot of the time. You had just lost somebody, Bro. So so to see you rejuvenate, you know what I'm saying, come back to the Big Three and do what you said you was gonna do a dog. Not only I wanted to win, but the competitor and the brotherhood and

me was happy to see you win. Bro. To watch, I mean, it looked like you hadn't missed a step. You opened up a path when you were the first player to get a shot from the Big Three to the league. Right, if I'm not mistaken with the situation. First want to get a job? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah yeah. Some good came from that. The only problem, My only problem was I went from playing one game a week, two in training camp seven days a week.

You know what I'm saying. Problem Like, you know, I worked out and trained during the week during the Big Three, but I know I ain't gotta go as hard, you know, on the weekend, like man, they put me in the training camp and my tender nitus and both my knees bro flare it up and which and that ultimately got me cut. So it got me cut. But I went back to the drawing board and I figured out pretty much how to you know, bullet proof you need so

to speak, or make them stronger. And there's a lot of things I really had to dive into deep as far as the body and how to train the body and keep the body going as you get older, you know, as we get older. You know, people think we got a tendency to where, you know, we can't hoop, but we can't run. We can't do little things like running outside in the yard with our kids. But there are always But you gotta put in the work, don You gotta be discipline. You gotta have some consistency to it

in order for it to work. So I dove into this. I dove into it, and then COVID happened, and I just I stayed into what I was doing, which was working out, training my body, preparing my body to be able to go hoop with no problems. That's basically what it was. No, we didn't definitely see you. You're a lot more active on the Graham Now look like you look like you're trying to be an underwear model. That boy's out here trying to get it. Man. We're gonna

explore all options. You know what I'm sense you know, Peter Palm said, try it all man, everybody, everybody out here getting themself right? I said, may look, let me throw something up here. Man out here, see yeah, I gotta catch that way. Yeah, hey man, listen, if one thing about it, COVID has told us all to be self sufficient and if you don't do nothing else, man, just investing yourself. So that's what I'm doing. You're talking

to the right guy, Matt. Matt is the guy, trust me if you want to, if you want to get into that leg, Matt, it's the guy home stretched quick hitters. You plus four going to the black Top? Who you bring it with you going to the black Top to who? Yeah? Anybody? Yeah? You plus for plus four? Hold on, So this ain't the talking NBA we're just talking period, anybody straight up period. Oh man, I'm the holies from around the way. I got four people around him. Man, I'm putting against anybody.

We're gonna be good. We're gonna but what they don't know is but what they don't know you brought You brought two people from your Arkansas team and won the Big Three championship. Right. We played college ball together, Gario Parking, Sigario Gibson. We played college ball together. That that was another thing. There was another thing that enticed me to play in the Big Three. And I remember seeing Q with to come by and que like, Hey, look, i'mnna

tell you right now, but I'll be picking your homeboy. Man. I look, I'm picking people who I know it's gonna be put themselves on the line. Man for see. I knew that, you know what I mean. But yeah, that was that was that was fun as well. Yeah, that was dope. One player you wish you could have played with that you didn't didn't get a chance to during your career, probably Lebron because I had that opportunity and

uh I chose to go play in Miami. Yeah, but that's the year they came back and wanted Uh they were down three one in the finals and wanted yet the Warriors. Yeah, you could have been on that team. Yeah, but see that's the competitor. That's the competitive side of me, because it was like, Man, you can go over here with d Wade and Miami. Man, y'all can play against le Bron and compete. That's that. That's just what I

had in Man. I was like, Man, I'm going over here with the Wade because at the time that he was still good. They were they were like number five in the East, and I was like, I can help, and I think we got up to like three two or three, but we ultimately white side. He got hurt in the playoffs. Man, we played against Toronto. I'm out there playing the five. That's a look. Look look the funny part. That's how bits Man got paid. Happy. He got paid because he was playing against a small forward.

Give me your top five clutch players, top five clutch h M J cole Lebron. I'm gonna say ai. Yeah, and the way brod Way solid list that the way first championship Man, they may care of the team was unbelievable. He was like thirty seven in the finals. I think he ever real like that. Uh five five dinner guests dead are alive? Five dinner against Bernie Mac rest in peace? Nice, yeah, rest in peace, Bernie mad I thinking about that one guy. That's a good one. Yeah, I five dinner against that

live you got Bernie Mack. Have to come back to that one man. That's a good question. Uh, Bill Clinton, Okay, that's the first. Yeah, arkosos Bill from from from Yeah, of course I definitely put Obama in there. Two more so there's two. There's two presidents. I'm sitting down with two presidents. Yeah, and and Bernie and Bernie. So yeah, we're gonna have some jokes. Uh yeah, bring my mom with me then bring yeah right down right down right then right there. I gotta have moms that make it right.

Who do you want to see on the show? Who do you want to see on All the Smokes? But before you answer this question, you have to help us with the answer. Whatever you're answer is, you gotta help us get that person on. Okay, who do I want to see on All the Smoke? Yeah, we was talking about him earli, y'all gotta get your mom Cromfort on here, bro j Carl good call. Yeah, I need to hit and tell amen looking at you, man, Yeah, hold on,

hold on, man, hold on, man, hold on, man, hold on. Matt. Hey, Joe, you know you know, I know that Southern Talk hit him with the same league on. You just hit this weird. You want me to hit them folks? You want me to hit them with that same thing? People looking on Yeah, yeah, yeah, man. We appreciate you, Doc Man. Thank you Joe for your time. Man, thank you. That's a wrap, Joe, thank you for your time. You can catch this on Showtime Basketball, YouTube and the

I Heart platform Black Effects. We'll see y'all next week. This is all a Smoke, a production of The Black Effect and Our Heart Radio in partnership with Showtime