You're listening to an Airwave Media Podcast. Hey, it's Chris. You know, beyond the All Creatures Podcast, if you're looking for more fascinating interviews with conservation advocates, then I have a perfect recommendation for you. That is Going Wild with Dr. Rae Wynn Grant. She's an absolute superstar.
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And again, she's a friend to the podcast. To get started, check out the first episode of the new season with Alexis Nichol Nelson, better known to her millions of TikTok fans as Black Forager. She talks about rediscovering her childhood, love of foraging, and falling back in love with food and plants. It's a really inspiring conservation. So follow Going Wild with Dr. Ray Wynn-Grant on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you're listening now.
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Welcome to the All Creatures Podcast. This is Chris. Today, a really special episode. I'm going to start with a quote today because we're going to talk about Ocean with David Attenborough, with director Toby Nowlin. During the film, I actually wrote this down because it just stuck with me. And this is from Sir David Attenborough. And he said, if we save the sea, we save our world. And that captures...
this film to a T. This is a must-see film for everyone on this planet. I know often when we talk about, you know, the different documentaries out there, I'm like, you have to see this. You have to see this. This is different, and this is why I'm giving a little bit longer introduction. This was one that really is beautiful. It shows the incredible ocean that we share this planet with.
But it does show how humans are impacting our planet. And I'm asking each and every one of you listening today to sit with your family and watch this film. You need to share this film on social media and you need to be part of the solution. I feel really strongly about that. And Toby, congratulations. I mean, this is...
It goes back, it's not just the filmmaking because that was so beautiful, but it's the message. And I think it's so important that we reach as many people as possible. But thank you for being on the podcast today.
You're so welcome. Thanks for having me, Chris. And thank you so much for your kind words about the film and for recognising why we made it. It's not a sort of... another tv episode or an entertainment piece i mean ultimately we really hope it is entertaining and my job as a filmmaker is to make sure it's something of an emotional roller coaster but the idea is that this this film
creates a moment in time um hopefully a piece of history an opportunity for anyone who wants to help save the ocean and we we you know it's it's a different it's a different something so it's it's yeah it's for everyone on earth for sure well and i'll give you a little insight when we we look at our download numbers our ocean species always do the best
For some reason, there's just this love or mystique. Our top downloaded episode is bluefin tuna. You know, we've covered so many incredible species, up to 250 now. That still sticks with me that so many people wanted to learn about bluefin tuna. And it is something about the ocean. So really quick, you know.
as the director and producer of this you've also worked on our planet dancing with the birds wild arabia um and then i came across just today it is the last stand of the javan rhino so can you just kind of give a background into you know how you got into filmmaking sure i mean yeah so
From a super early age, from as long as I can remember, it's been all about the animals for me, all about wildlife conservation. I spent the last sort of... um 15 20 years or so and i'm still doing it now whenever i can i kind of lead expeditions in search of the world's most endangered species to photograph them uh or to raise their media profile boost their conservation profile the javan rhino is an example of an animal who uh which
which had almost zero conservation media profile because it hadn't been seen for about 55 years, barely been photographed. There were almost no photographs of it. And there's none in captivity, still none in captivity.
they're all just in one little jungle in java and um so they were in desperate need of a sort of boost because um seeing is believing right and until you you you can see these animals and what they look like and and they're right in front of you you can't the human mind doesn't sort of emotionally connect with them um and so the mission was to go out and form the
clearest photographic record of this species which we did and now all of the NGOs around the world use these photos these photos are being used very very widely as is the footage and it's really So that was a sort of microcosm of what then, fast forward to Ocean, you know, I think the power of, that really is the power of filmmaking and that's our responsibility as filmmakers.
seeing is believing right we're bringing stuff to a big audience for the first time so that people can immediately emotionally connect um you know take the example of bottom trawling This is a thing that was invented off the coast of the UK here 700 years ago. And we knew it was a bad thing back then. There was bycatch being brought up on the deck.
letters of complaint to the king, but because we could see the process, we couldn't actually... see it happening because it was happening out of sight out of mind below the waves uh there's no really way way to sort of understand that and and and work out how you feel about something so fast forward 700 years
Bottom trawling is happening thousands of times around the ocean in an extremely common way. You know, it's as common as ploughing on land, but as destructive as tearing up my ancient woodland. You know, and if that happens... I live in Bristol. If Lee Woods, my local gorgeous ancient woodland, was torn up one Sunday, I mean, the entire city would be up in arms. And this is what's happening in the water every single day.
on our seabed so um that's our role as filmmakers so the idea the mission with bottom trawling was to bring that very common process to the screen to the big screen in crystal clear clarity for the first time um and just show people what's happening and and you know our our mission isn't wasn't actually has never been to vilify individuals or
or boats or you know it's it's we're not actually even criticizing we're just showing things as they are and that's the beauty of the Attenborough brand that's what David Attenborough does so well as he tells you a story of how things are and what's happening and let the images do the talking and give you the facts and then you make your own mind up. But yes.
Sorry to go all over the place, but since you mentioned Bluefin Tuna, I will just dance back to that because... that was a particularly great memory if if you if your listeners are fans of bluefin tuna filming on this film um way out in the middle of the atlantic open ocean um And it's really interesting that the bluefin tuna is such a popular download because they are just such impressive animals. They are incredible. And we were filming...
out in the open ocean for this Seamount sequence. Weeks go by in bad weather and you see almost nothing, right, in the open ocean. Very difficult place to film. And then suddenly you see this sort of frenzy of activity in the distance, Corrie's shearwaters, and you get there and we've got these drone shots.
thousands of Corrie Sheawaters, more than has been seen on screen before. We get in the water, and if you've timed it well, you're there on the bait ball, and we were there specifically for the bluefin.
go down to this bait ball of deep sea mackerel that had been brought up from the surface, and these bluefin were rocketing over my shoulder. These things were huge. I mean, few people realise how big... bluefin tuna is and these things were like dinosaurs honestly they were like the size of small cars i mean there were hundreds of these uh spotted dolphins around and the bluefin were two three times bigger than the dolphins monsters it's just so impressive so fast
And I was on these dives, I was directing, but I was working as safety diver in the water. And so I was keeping an eye on Doug Anderson, the amazing cinematographer, and he was... in the thick of this frothing white wall of tuna mayhem. And these tuna were just dwarfing him with his big camera. And what was so exciting, especially about that...
was to know that there are these animals that still exist in the ocean today. And there are these scenes that still exist in the ocean today. You know, at the same time, there were giant blue sharks coming up and bumping into the back of my head. huge say whales coming up and cruising right past our faces within touching distance coming up to feed on the bait minkies spinning up and and you had these incredible scenes
And it's just so exciting and heartwarming and uplifting to know that these things still exist in our ocean. And they really do. So, you know, we are... you know demolishing our seabed in many ways but there is so much hope because That's the big take home of this film, right, is that when you protect the ocean, it recovers in the most spectacular way and life.
fills up the ocean in a much quicker way than life recovers on land it's a completely different process i didn't realize that until i started making the film but that that process of ocean recovery is so so exciting and it's really real yeah you took us through the whole arc in this film no no it was it you know watching the film it was like you know i sat down A full theater here in New Zealand. And, you know, you see the beauty of the ocean and the reefs. And then...
Things turn, you know, you took us on a whole journey and, you know, that we see the coral bleaching, which, you know, now here right off the Tasman Sea or right up in the coral sea with the Great Barrier Reef. And, you know, are we going to lose the whole reef? It's looking that way. Then you take us to the bottom trawling and that one, and then there's another part of what I want to talk about is the krill harvesting. I mean, just gut-wrenching. I mean, kicking the gut.
And nobody was breathing. It's like everybody held their breath during that bottom trolling sequence. It just, again, this is why people have to see this film to really understand. Because as consumers, we drive demand and we have a lot more power than we know. So in this and working with, you know, Sir David Attenborough, he just. And I know before we got started, I held up the letter that he hand wrote my partner, just the type of human being he is. It's really...
I'm really hard pressed to think of somebody that's as admired. I mean, I put Jane Goodall up there. She was a hero of mine as a young kid, as was David. And, you know, some of the other people doing some incredible work around the planet. But I don't know if there's a human being that is as treasured as him.
So to get to work with him and I saw your Instagram photos with them and I just was like, yes. And I was showing my kids. I'm like, you know, look here, I'm interviewing Toby here in a couple hours. And oh, there he is with the king, you know, because here in New Zealand.
know all about that and you know but with him and and i don't call it street credit but the admiration he has and now he's really the last few years coming out ringing the the bell as loud as he can how much did he play a part in shaping the the narrative of ocean well look david's this film is is his most important story yet right this is he's he spent his whole life showing us the natural world he is he is he's seen more of the natural world than anyone else he's traveled
to more of the natural world than anyone else. And he's shown us more of the natural world than any other human. I mean, we all grew up on a staple of David Attenborough. I'm no exception. He's the inspiration for me. sitting here and and and why i ended up doing this film ultimately um and i think he's also the greatest storyteller I think he's just one of the most wonderful storytellers we've ever had on this planet. He has such a presence and a passion.
that we all sort of connect to. And I think it's so easy, isn't it, with David? I mean, words don't really do it justice, but you get lost in his presence and his passion because it's never... about david attenborough it's always about the subject for david and
David hates talking about himself. He hates talking about David Attenborough. It's always about the thing that he's presenting. And that's so wonderful for all of us viewers because it takes you straight into it and it means you're there with him. with that Christmas Island crab migration or down there in the Bluefin Tune or whatever it might be. And the subject here, of course, is the ocean.
For him, this was the greatest message and the most important story he's ever told. After, you know, a hundred years, this is his sort of epic kind of bringing it all together.
realize there's nothing more important than this big message which is such an honor i mean to be you know producing and directing that film with him is just it doesn't get bigger but ultimately yeah it's it's his most authored and personal piece um it's his most emotional and reflective You know, you'll never, I don't think we've ever heard David be that sort of reflective and poignant. and uh and yeah i mean david absolutely was part of the narrative i mean he's
He scrutinizes every single word that he says. I mean, he's very careful about what projects he does. And this, for him, was a passion project. This was right from the get-go. You know, this was something that really... spoke to him very deeply. And I think you could tell that I remember we were on this cold winter's day filming. some of the opening and closing lines on a beach in Sussex near his home, a beach he knew well and has known well.
And that was really wonderful because I remember he was delivering these lines and he was saying... he kind of lent into the microphone and we did these lines it's my great hope that we all come to see the ocean not as a dark and distant place with little relevance to our lives on land but as the lifeblood of our home and if we save the sea we save our world
and he said these lines and so intimately and personally it was so powerful and now even now when I hear those final lines of the film I still get this kind of heart breaking reaction um and i've never heard him speak with that level of power in any other film i think it was really really powerful for me so so uh
Yeah, this is something quite different and very personal for him, absolutely. I had chills as you were saying that because I remember that. And some of those... closing shots was he in dover i don't know if he was on the cliffs there and i just that was dorset dorset and i was just like He's a treasure. He really is. And, you know, I hope we see many more things. It's 99. I mean, incredible, incredible human being. He's just one and, you know.
Not to be able to replace him. And I know that's what people talk about. You talked about the bottom trolling. Was that real? I mean, that was gripping. That was wow. But was there another... A surprising sequence for you making this film. It was maybe difficult to make or you just was like, wow. You know, it was one of those wow moments as you made this film. Because it took four years, right? So four years to make it.
That's a long time. Just, you know, imagine you went through a lot of film. Yeah, right. I mean, yeah, it went through a lot of... the whole story in that time i mean it was it's yeah best part of four years and it that's the story kind of changes and sculpts a lot and there's a lot of back and forth with what's going to make the strongest film here but ultimately I mean to start I guess what I knew of when I started making the film was
was that we had this real, I was so excited because as a director, I had this real gift here because I had a really strong story. This wasn't just like another wildlife film, right? I think... This is a story with a really strong, really true premise that is quite shocking and revelatory and fresh, but also ultimately really hopeful. and hopefully in a real and exciting way, which gives you this amazing sort of payoff to work towards.
And it's this very strong, clear story. If we save the sea, we save our world. And that's not just a dream. It's not just a possibility. It's a reality because it's already happening wherever we're doing that around the world. on every scale from tiny lobster larvae in the Channel Islands of California to these huge slices of ocean out in the Pacific. It's really happening. And I think in terms of sequences that...
wowed me. That huge scale version of that out in the Pacific, that's what really hit home for me. So went to film out in Papahanaumakuakea, Marine National Monument.
in the middle of the Pacific Ocean, which is just the most... spectacular and magical place so super remote thousand miles northwest of hawaii and one of the most remote island chains on the planet and it's an example of what happens when you truly protect a huge slice of ocean is that life recovers in the most spectacular way so you know i'm a bird nut i love my birds and uh and we were sitting there filming in the in the world's largest albatross
colony this colony of of lay san albatross filming every sunrise every sunset um with this amazing woman pelika andrade who you see on screen um and uh And she was kind of blowing my mind on the importance of indigenous wisdom and how the Western world can learn a lot from that.
And I wanted that in some small way to come into the sequence and have this idea that actually David could hand over the baton to local contributors through the film to tell their story of the ocean. So that Hawaiian... chapter just became this very powerful...
sort of dream of a future ocean, vision of a future ocean, not a dream because it's a reality, it's happening, but that's the sort of end goal. You know, Papua Namakua Keira is now this... engine of life for the pacific ocean is pumping out life you know i think like uh it's it's it's the the yellowfin tuna thing is amazing right so people thought that the
protected areas would never be big enough to to help pelagic migratory species such as yellowfin tuna and this place just destroys that that assumption because Huge numbers of yellowfin tuna are building up in the reserve and flooding out into the Pacific Ocean, which is helping fisheries in a huge way.
And so that's just so exciting. And I think, I mean, the albatross is also just amazing. You know, the Laysan albatross, the longest living bird on the planet. And we got the first missions to film these these incredible colonies from. air with drones um so you get that feeling of recovery and scale scale of recovery from the air um
That was hard because you were obviously in the world's largest colony of albatross. There's a lot of birds in the air and you don't want to hit one with a drone. That would be the worst thing imaginable.
But luckily, albatrosses need wind in order to get lift, right? That's the one thing that's sort of completely limited to... to using wind so on those windless mornings all the birds were grounded on their nests and then we quickly got the drone up and managed to get these these shots of the big colonies but that was really really really special
And the words you hear from those contributors, from those people around the world, they're all their own. They're all completely their own words, which I think was really... Powerful and gave you this sort of authentic connection to each of these ocean stories. Hello, everyone. This is Angie from All Creatures Podcast.
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using promo code creatures. Now, I did want to bring that up because you do give hope. I mean, like I said, you take us through the beginning, middle, and end. So for people listening, especially showing this to your children, the middle is tough. It's just tough. And it's not gory or anything like that. I don't want people to think that. But when you do show the bottom trolling and just the...
total destruction of any reefs or anything that was there. That was hard. I want to ask you about the krill sequence of what's going on in the Antarctic, because that was really a huge red flag to me. But then you're mentioning the hope at the end. And that's something like we try to do is conservation optimism. There is so many people out there fighting for these spaces and these animals that inhabit them. So, yeah, it was just...
It wasn't a typical documentary. Like you said, this was not. This was a film. And, you know, with David Attenborough in there telling this story of what is going on and then giving you the hope of these reserves. I mean, I grew up in California. I always tell the story, my family were tuna fishermen. My mom sighed, and yeah, I imagine...
And this is back in the 50s and 60s. I mean, going back 100 years in California, how things have changed for them. But the fishermen in the story talking about... with that protected reserve i know the kelp beds are coming back in california the sea otters are are replenishing great whites you know all the food web
And the fisherman's like, this is great. I mean, I was really skeptical, but now, you know, we're catching more fish than ever outside of these reserves. So it is a strategy that is working that we need to expand. And I will ask you about that too, because. that that's a very critical point of the film is this meeting taking place this month as we record this june 2025 but that i want to get to the krill real quick because we're going to do an episode on krill because
This film brought it to my attention. I understand how important they are. And maybe, and I want to do some research into this before we do investigate that species, but... I felt like if the krill crash, that's it. Game over. I mean, game over for all of us. Because if the oceans die, I mean, humanity's going to die. We can't survive without our oceans. And so what was the thought?
showing that and and what is the impact of harvesting all this krill in the southern pacific or southern oceans i guess well i mean yeah the hard thing chris is that we don't actually know yet right because the
We're sort of going there and harvesting on this huge scale without entirely knowing what's going to happen. That's the kind of terrifying thing. And I think... you know again in this sort of Attenborough filmmaker world we're just we're actually not even criticizing stuff we're literally just showing showing you what's happening down there right now these huge
ships the biggest factories on the sea are there uh sweeping up krill on the most monumental scale so what you have is these you have i mean there's i don't know i can't think of anywhere any other ecosystem on the planet um on this on a scale like this where everything is reliant on a single species a single animal like this i mean
The entire Southern Ocean, that southern portion of our globe, is reliant on krill. So almost every animal... all the penguins all the whales all the seals all the seabirds rely on krill it's it's the it's the grass of the serengeti but on a huge scale and i think um
Yeah, but Krill isn't just sort of distributed in this big, wide ring. It's distributed in these, it congregates in these little... hubs these little spots it's really dense in these in these little isolated places and so that's where all the life goes it's where all the penguins migrate to it's where all the whales hang out it's where they all congregate um so they're really important
And that's where these huge ships are going and harvesting these krill in exactly the same places. So if you take those concentrations away, we don't know what's going to happen. And that's what's kind of terrifying. But I mean, the thought process of having it in the film is this is the new thing, right? Bottom trawling we've been doing for 700 years and we're showing you now for the first time clearly.
what it's doing but but we've been doing this forever and now these huge trawlers they're not bottom trawlers in antarctica they're midwater trawlers because the krilla and the midwater uh the trawlers are in antarctica and so we are fishing at the ends of the earth there is nowhere too remote there is nowhere too far or too deep that these these boats aren't going to and i guess ultimately that's the sort of where the film goes is that um The thing is that we're now just fishing.
everywhere all the time right this this film isn't an anti-fishing film actually actually it's a pro fishing film it's a pro fisheries film it's saying um it's a pro ocean full of life pro Pro thriving ocean and thriving planet and it's one that we all want like if we If we do this if we properly protect a few parts of the ocean and just don't fish In those parts, the rest of the ocean fills with life and we can fish more in those areas.
which is so exciting. Like, this is a win for everyone. This is a win for fishing economies, for big coastal communities, for the three billion people that rely on the ocean for food. You know, for conservationists, for marine life, for a stable climate, for a breathable atmosphere, for all living things on Earth. There's no real trick or downside here. So it's the most wonderful take home of hope. And it is already happening. So, yeah, now is a big moment, right? This is halfway through.
decade of the UN's decade of the ocean. This is the year of the ocean. This is Ocean Week. Sunday is World Ocean Day. Next week is the UNOC conference in Nice, arguably the... biggest summit on the ocean ever in our history. When global leaders will meet, this is a huge opportunity to demand change from our leaders and our countries.
So, yeah, there's a big opportunity in front of us. But ultimately, it is hopeful. It can be really, really hopeful. Yeah, yeah. And I got the sense from that. That's why, you know, the... the fisherman sequence and he, and you had him in the film and he was saying, look, it's working, you know, it is working. And so was it, if I get this right. protect about 30 percent of the ocean are we looking to set up is that what they're deciding in these next couple weeks right so so the
The bare minimum that scientists have worked out is to protect a third. If we can protect a third of the sea, and bear in mind this is by 2030, which is really freaking close. But... But it's doable. I mean, it's doable. You know, we could sign some pens tomorrow and create properly protected no-take zones. All countries on Earth, it's completely doable. I mean, take the UK. We've got these marine protected areas, so-called, but bottom trawling is allowed in most of them.
if if i mean look at the images in the film if that's happening in our protected areas what exactly are they protected from what does protection even mean but um if we just don't do that and if we just properly protect these areas we could um yeah we could have an ocean more full of life than not just 10 years ago 20 years ago but but then
anyone alive has ever known i mean that's the exciting thing like if we do this if we don't if we just stop fishing everywhere all the time and we protect at least a third It's possible that we could have an ocean that's more full of life than... our parents knew more full of life than our grandparents knew like because of shifting baselines you can get you the ocean and how quickly the ocean can recover we can very quickly get back to
a place that's more exciting than has existed in living memory, and that's pretty cool. Yeah, I know you talked about the whaling. Once we stopped whaling on an international scale, the whales are coming back. And they're able to go down, especially here in the Southern Oceans, down to Antarctica and eat and then go back to the calving grounds. It's just a... It's a one of a kind film. It definitely is. Did you find it hard, you know, showcasing the wonders of the ocean versus...
Some of this degradation, really that fine balance, because... You know, a good film isn't just, you know, I guess that's going to hit the public, isn't just all bad news, you know? And we try to do that with the podcast. I can't just give all bad news. I've got to give hope. And so, you know, did you find that difficult? making this yeah i mean look we've had a lot of bad news the last few years and i think there's only so much bad news that people can take right i think
I think, you know, before people just disengage, the human mind can only take so much. It just doesn't want to hear it. And if it has a choice, especially if it's on TV, it can just the human mind will just switch off literally. So I think like. Certainly in our industry, you know, we've been very aware that actually we can't, you can't just show lots of wonderful stuff and then at the end say, by the way...
Climate change is happening, we're all screwed. It doesn't encourage or motivate people. I think, again, that's why this film was a bit of a gift, because this... discovery in this revelation about the capacity for the ocean to recover and how that can solve our carbon budgets, that can feed and nourish our world and solve food security, that can keep coastal and fishing economies booming.
It's so big and so exciting that false hope is dangerous, but when we have real hope, we should shout about that from the rooftops. So I think that's why that hopeful... The film, yeah, the stuff in the middle is hard hitting, but... Overall, you look at the balance of the film, there's much more wonder and hope in the film. The film, in terms of minutage, is much more about a hopeful, wonderful story. And in terms of the wonder of natural history, I mean, no, I will never get.
There will never be a problem with wanting to show the wonder of the natural world because we still know so little, right? This is the wonderful thing is that we're living in the age of... ocean discovery right now like it's not even 70 years ago when we learned to scuba dive or 20 years ago when blue planet first came on tv like it's it's right now it's like uh finding
out every year so much about our ocean that completely changes our understanding of how vital it is for life on Earth. You know, every time we descend to the deep, we find new species, 2000 new marine species. every single year across the whole ocean. So we've just tipped the iceberg in terms of what we know about the natural world and especially the ocean. So there's so much to discover and reveal.
And we have responsibility to still... show that beauty to people and show that wonder to people because there's still so much to discover and I want to keep finding stuff out about the natural world for the rest of my life it's what keeps me going and inspires me and what makes me want to live you know
We just, we do. We live on this beautiful, beautiful planet. And, you know, we just, and everybody listening obviously does want to preserve everything. I mean, you know, that's why they follow the podcast. Last couple of questions. I know we're running out of time. Was there just a favorite moment of the film that just really sticks with you? You were just like, wow. I mean, you talked about the two. Now that was pretty dang cool. But was there another one where it was just like...
oh you know this is just going to stick with me for the rest of my life yeah i mean that that dive that i was talking about with the bluefin you know we did a bunch of those baitball dives that particular baitball when we got in and these These monstrous... stunning fish zooming over my shoulder and honestly the sea whale is kind of like here and it comes up and looks at me and you could see this this incredible sentience in this creature's eye and it had just come up for a look
and uh just cruised is right by there's another say whale underneath this one and there's a minky feeding down there and you you i remember thinking at the time i was trying to keep an eye on doug be safety diver also think about the shots but also just keep just just pinch yourself just like okay remember remember remember soak it in suck these seconds in soak these seconds in this is never going to happen again um
That was a hell of a moment. I mean, there were lots of moments on this film, but I think in terms of dives, that was a really special five minutes. Yeah. Yeah. No, yeah. Toby, you're, you're an incredible storyteller yourself. I, you, I, a lot of my questions, you just, as you talked, I just checked them off. I mean, you know, working with David Attenborough and, and that moment in the film.
So the next time I watch this, because I do want to let the audience know, it is coming on Hulu, Disney Plus, and National Geographic on World Ocean Day. So June 8th, it will be airing there. So if you can't catch it in the theater, if it's still in the theaters, please go see it. It is well worth it on the big screen. But be sure to watch it. Watch it with your family, your kids. It's their future. I think...
You know, David Attenborough's legacy has been secured for decades. This is just a nice piece as he's nearing. I know he's busy, right? He's still busy on other things. yeah yeah but what's next for you you know you got some things in the works good question not sure yet um and jumping on jumping on a boat on saturday and uh
I'll be in Southeast Asia for a few weeks, but after that, I'm going to sort of start to take a breath and think about what's next. Got a few ideas kind of bubbling away, but yeah, not sure yet, Chris. Yeah, so stand by. well i'm gonna get you down here we're gonna go find some kakapo um Yeah, they're about 30 minutes from me now on the mainland in North Island, and I'm still trying to go find the few that are in that reserve. Not the ones way off in, as a codfish island, way off the...
the southern tip of New Zealand. But yeah, we are trying to reintroduce them here in the North Island. Incredible bird. Toby, thank you so much. I mean, with my guess, it's... All the people out there showcasing this, what you're doing is critical to bringing it to the consciousness of everybody on the planet.
I don't know if you get told, but thank you for the filmmaking that you're doing. I'm definitely going to watch Last Stand of the Javan Rhino. I mean, I just came across it today. So that's on CuriosityStream. I am going to sign up. I've been meaning to for quite a while.
And I'm going to watch that. You know, thank you for highlighting them. But thank you for making this film. And, you know, and obviously to Sir David Attenborough, I mean, just this letter that I showed you, I... i told my wife today we've been meaning to get it framed because it's been just next to my nightstand because i look at it every so often just to motivate me but you know just an incredible human being so
um thank you you know and and thank you to your your uh all the people you worked with for making this film it's just it was incredible yeah such pleasure chris yeah yeah and great great chat and and so Yeah, hopefully we can talk in your next film or, you know, definitely go see some birds. Love that. Take care. Great. Thanks, Chris.
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