Tulsa HC Frank Haith on Talking Protests With Players, Coaching Path, Lost Season; Recruiting Expert Brandon Goble

something interesting that he learned. He learned about the Tulsa race rights only after this took place, and now obviously I think that's gonna change how he coaches and teaches his men in the future. Um. Also on this pod, we've got a kind of a double double hit hit for you. It should be really really good. Brandon Golbel joins us. Um he is. If you follow hoops, you know he's has Twitter handle at Juco Advocate. Here's a guy who will go anywhere to find any player and

give him a chance to be seen. It's pretty cool. So Brandon Gobel and Frank, Hey, first, let's let's get to our conversation with a head coach of Tulsa gold Hurricane. Be sure to catch the live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show weekdays at three p m. Easter noon Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app. Let's welcome him in. And he's the head coach of the Tulsa Golden Hurricane. He's Frank Haith and Um, Frank, there's a bunch of things I'd love to get to

you get with you on this this podcast. But let me start with something that I did not know until listening to some of your remarks UM on other podcasts and other outlets, that you know what um and and maybe this is something I've probably learned, is man, everybody's life experience is so different when we see police brutality and there's this massive now international movement to end it and uh and to change so many things with how

how police are are purporting themselves. It strikes home, I think, especially sharply with you. Sean Bell was your what nephew and he was shot and killed in New York. Yes, he was my nephew and back in two thousand six, Um, you know he uh used at his bachelor party, um, at a club with some friends and a couple of other brothers and and he's getting married next day. And

so he was leaving the club. There's three undercover cops in the club and uh, I'm assuming that one police officers, you know, just unidentified miss unidentified Sean and um, you know, pull the gun out on him. And Sean obviously acted like any Norman being because he never said who he was and got in his car and tried to escape me intwo of his friends and there was fifty rounds shot into the car and he was killed. His two friends survived it. Um Uh one of his friends have

shot fourteen times and survived, survived it. But uh, no drugs, no guns, no weapons, no, nothing was uh and um, it's just that I think there's something in my case, dug. When it happened, I was like, hey, coach at Miami and this is uh fourteen years and not really talking about it, and um and I think at a time, you know, I was discerned, worried about my brand. Maybe I don't know, afraid, not knowing what to say. How they said, I don't want to say the wrong thing.

I don't want to come off as a uh you know, someone that said against police, the policing uh you know, just so many things, so many factors and uh, as I said yesterday, I was I felt guilty about shame uh you know, as as George Floyd uh situation played out in front of us. UM. And I called my brother yesterday because it was the first time I had a conversation about sehn and and speaking on it, and I apologize and um. But it was a tough time for our family and I and that's something to stay

with me. And I've never even talked about it with any of my teams until this team this year. UH. And I think the reason for doing that was to say to them, it could happen to anybody. And we've all, as black men, taught our kids and been taught how to uh uh engage with terms of engagement with policing policemen in terms of how we should uh you know, respect, ask questions, don't argue, show your hands, um and uh.

But in this case, in Sean's case, he didn't have that opportunity, and UM it was It's a difficult top of our family. But every time we see some of these incidents, It just brings back that pain that we as a family endured back in two thousand six. Um, did you? And look? And I'm in no way impugning your level. Like I we know each other for a

long time. I'm a lot of people don't know about it, so I'm not But did you Did you know about the race riots of the ninety twenties in Tulsa before I've been you know, kind of brought to people's attention following George Floyd's death, You know what I did not? And the read and it's funny, Doug, not funny, but you know, it's not taught the history books here, and it's something that I think as I talked to people, that's really a sensitive subject and I did not know

about it. And then obviously when I hear Russell Westbrook and Lebron James doing this documentary and learning about it, that's why I decided to do something with our team too. And I think it's a coach, Doug. And you know this because you know, we have a calling. We have a uh, you know, to educate, to teach, that's what we do. We're coaches. And and I looked at this

as an opportunity to continue to educate our kids. And we've had a couple of zoom calls to talk about some things, and to talk about George Floyd, but also talk about you know, I sent them a link on uh, you know, the Black Wall Street and I asked to watch it. Then the next week we we talked about it. And you know, something so historic is right here in our town. And I don't think you know, I haven't

interjected that with any of my teams here. And uh so we we wanted to have a unity walk, not a protest, a unity walk, uh to show solidarity, to

show um that we're unified. Uh you know, I've got black players, white players, you know, and and and we have something we want to do to honor the three tragedy Brianna Taylor, George Floyd, Ahmad Avery, and to have an educational piece of it at the end, uh walk into Black Wall Street, uh degree with Culture Center and and it was we we did some you know, putting it together in terms of how far the walk would be and able to honor those three tragedies. And we

started at ten o'clock. We got to get at ten o'clock and we started our walk at ten fourteen and ten fourteen is George Floyd's birthday. And then as we started our walk, we got to in a Delaware and you know Delaware because you know Tulsa. We paused and and and had a moment of silence the twenty seven seconds. Brianna's birthday was that last Friday, and she turned twenty seven,

so we wanted to honor her. And then the walk from there to the Culture Center was two point two three miles and uh, Ahmad Aubrey's birthday is February, so that way we were able to honor all three of those and to uh get there and then it wasn't open, but just so happened we were able to communicate with someone in there and they allowed us to go in and our players were able to see a lot of you know, stuff that was been an archived and about uh, you know, the black black Wall Street and uh and

and I think that's that was a great experience for us a basketball team and uh and something that I think that we will continue to do in the future in terms of educating our our our young people. I had no idea the level of racism because I actually I feel like Tulsa is tulsas a lot very midwestern? Is I mean obviously you know you lived there, but for people who don't like um. But I started to know the history of Tulsa and like, hey, did you know this happening? Guys in my team and talked who

are from Oklahoma? Like did you know that? I had no idea? But it is. It is fascinating that in these moments and now, uh, with your experience now kind of learning about it, we're all kind of realizing even the flaws to how we've educated kids, right, Like this is the bit. What are we teaching our children about history?

What are we to teaching children that they can use kind of in the future as a as a coach in a and and as a father and as a mentor and you mentor even guys who are still playing in the NBA today who recruited going back to your days awake and of course the Texas UM what what what should we be teaching our children? What are the in your minds? What are the right messages that we

need to relate, especially to our players. Well, you know, as I've talked to our guys about a couple of things, is we we we you know, the the George Floyd uh murder situation has allowed us, as tragic as it was, is I think we're starting to see change and has given us a platform as coaches to have serious conversations that are uncomfortable and about a lot of things that that and I think we've got to continue to have those conversation in terms of teaching and educating our our

young people until they become comfortable. And but to me, we talked about we talked about a lot of things in terms of I wish the world was a team because you know, and you played on a team. When you're in the locker room, football locker room or basketball locker the team, what are you teaching your teaching respect, love for each other, play for each other, Uh, care about each other, doing things together. Uh, And that's what

we need. And the time of crisis that this, you know, there are our countries and a lot of pain right now. And but I do I hope I see when I see the protesting, and and I've see just as many white people as I see black people out protesting. That gives us all hope. I see it not just in the United States, but all over the world. I think this has spurned a lot of different feeling than we've had in the past when we have these situations. Uh.

And this is for the generation after us. And I think that's what we're doing at if everyone would receive that, you know, let's let's let's teach a little bit of love, let's teach caring, preach one another. And I think the one thing we talked about, the other thing we talked

about our gods is voting. And I know Coach Ravanal at Georgia Tech, Uh, his comments was so profound, so awesome and an encouragement and give it take a move them a third off and and and but but how can I just understanding you know, they have a voice, they can be a part of change. Uh, they can. Uh. And it's not it's not about voting. The about for the presidency is about local We want to we taught because we got got small of the country to ask

the depot and we want to help them understand. But they need to get educated on you know, things that you you want to see happen in your communities. And you know you're you're, you're you're you know you're voting for city councilm and you're voting for all kinds of things that that are going on that you can create and change. And I think helping educate our young people to understand they have a voice is the most important thing. Frank Um, why did you get into coaching? You know,

I had a Mike my father. I moved out south from New York when I was a very young, uh five years old, so I was raised by my grandparents. My grandmother and my coaches were my father figures. I actually knew I wanted to coach. My first team sport I played on was I was a ten year old Mike I think is Mike's a peelie football team. And Dr Allen White was my football coach. He was also the after that director of Elon College. And my my

people that I looked up to. They had the impact of my life and growing up with my coaches, and I said, I want to do that. I wanted to impact young people like I've been impacted by my coaches. And I went through college. I couldn't get through it fast enough because I wanted I thought I was a high school coach and teach. I don't know health and Kenney said, I was a pe and that was gonna be my career because those people, those are the people that had the profound effect on me. So how did

you get your first job? So you get done with the Elin College, right, and then how did you how did you like take me through the steps of which you actually became a coach there? Well, I when I when I decided I wanted I didn't want to go far away from home. My grandmother was still um my senior year, and so I went to Elon, which is where I grew up. And as I said at the director, there was my first coach, brockt down in White. And you know, first year, my grandmother passed away. And honestly,

I paid for my education. I didn't get a scholarship. I paid for schooling. UH. And I had all kinds of jobs. I you know, I worked in a mill cleaning UH machines, I U. I did floors, I stripped floors and polished floors, UH cut grass. I did every I paid my education. And so after my freshman year, Dr White came to me because I was going back to my high school and then a volunteer UH football and basketball assistant, he came to me said, listen, Frank, look,

you got a proposition really helped you with school. Uh, we want you to live in the gym. And we had this closet is literally like a closet, and we could turn into a space where you can live. And you took care of the gym. And and that's how I helped me. And I still had two loans, but I saw I'll finished up paying for school. And then I got involved with working with Bob Burton, who's the head coach at Elne time and uh, then I worked

with Jerry Steele. I worked camp to work seven eight seven straight weeks in camp with Jerry school, I started working five star and prep stars. I've got no coaches do that in the summertime. But I would go out recruiting my my junior and senior year in college. I had just seven before Hatchtack Pentel. I would go recruiting in I had to put boiled in every hundred miles because it run out of oil. But but that's how

that started. And uh, the rest kind of his history in Yas and Dave Oh got the job to wait for us. Jerry Steele said he got hire this guy. And I was my first college job beyond Els, I was a g at weight force for one year, and I became a full time assistant with Kevin Easton right after that, and I popped around with a couple of other places, working some outstanding coaches and Tony Barroney, Rick Barnes, Jerry Dunn and and uh Kevin Easton. So I feel

very blessed getting into the profession. And then I had opportunity to as a head coach at Miami and Missouri and Ali Taulson. Um, I got a bunch of kids. I got so many players. I want to first time you saw Chris Paul's win. Oh, when he's a ninth grader and he was a bass. That little sucker was so good and we were the first school to offerers and uh, um you know, And actually I thought he didn't. I thought he didn't make varsity until his junior year.

Oh no, not asked, Well, I don't seem they made bars out him. Was a nightcrif and Tim Fuller was assistant coach at East for Side High School, and Tim played it wait for us, so he told me about Chris, so I would go, I would see Chris, and uh we offered him I'm we offered his tenth grade year and at wait Parson, but he ended up you know, Skip recruited in procepted. Dave took a job at South

Carolina during the senior year and uh. And it got a little harry there for for a right, But I think they were always going to get him because he's right there at hometown guy. Yeah yeah, um, but I mean it's pretty interesting. I mean how the town you you mentioned you mentioned Skip, Um, Tony BARRONI who passed away. Um, Dave Odom, who of course you worked for. Let me start with with with Dave Odom, what what's your if you would say, hey, this this is what made Dave

Odom special, different, unique? What would it be? You know, the day was always under control. I mean he never he never felt like he lost his composure during the games. Um. He handled any type of adversity with calmness. Um. Uh. And I think that's the one thing I took from him. You know, he never got too high, he never got

too low. As why you watch those moments of those back to back ACC championships and he's calmly walks over and sits on the bench when everybody's going crazy, but that that was day and and I don't you know, you know, tough losses, great wins. He was the same guy. And he was always very much glass half fool kind of guy and kept things in perspective. And I and I appreciate his calmness and allowing me to grow as

a coach. I mean, I think Dave was I was so blessed worth the guys that really allowed me as a young coach in ball with everything every aspect that it is to be become a head coach. And and Dave was so good to me in that redult um. Your career trajectory I felt like took off when you got to work with Rick barnes Um. Not that it hadn't been building, but the level of guys you were guys able to recruit and Texas was really kind of killing it. And you were known as the you know,

the guy. That's one of the things that allowed you to get that Miami job. Um. Okay, so you're you're at Wake, You're from you know, I mean you're from New York technically, but you grew up in Carolina. How did the move to Texas take place? You know, I got to know Rick when he was at Clusteron. Um. You know he was if you recalled Rick time to Cluston, he was a he was a tough dude now um, but seeing him on recruity trails and and talking to him,

you know, Rick's a personal guy. We both from North Carolina. He went to Lenore Ryan. I went to Elon, you know old Carolina conference guys. So we had a lot in common conversation, and Rick tried to hire me. Um. When I came back to the way, Rick tried to hire me. I was there two or three years and we started recruiting, like I was kidded Josh Howard, Barry san Gala, and I was. I said, I gotta see it through here because I couldn't do it as Many got the Texas job a year after he was. He

lost Ricky Stokes and I stayed. I said, coach, if it ever opened again, I'll consider it. And uh. And then he brought the mirror lea and takes the Cianna job, and then and and I went. And it was an easy transition because that was one day left Wake and was going to South Carolina. And so I I went to Texas coach and obviously coach turn Texas around. I

don't know people who understand where the program was. I mean, I think you know, they were solid, but coach took Texas to another level, and uh, you know, the guys were recruited. Then it all started with t J Ford. Uh but you know, because it wasn't quite quite cool yet to go to Texas being from Texas, and p J made it cool to go to Texas. Um and he was the first one, and then obviously from Daniel getson to LaMarcus all Rich. But one of my greatest recruits.

There was one that nobody hardly recruited and I was pg T p J Tucker. Nobody recruited PJ. And I remember bringing h p J name the coach, and I just saw I lived to North Carolina. I saw p J play because I have roots here in North Carolina. Will go back in the truth, and he played a kid out you partly member's named Shavlick Randolph who was

the number one player in the country. And I was at the game and PJ had like Woody and twenty something crazy number and twenty bree Bounds and I remember when as a coach, this kid is something special and because like what was this is? I don't know he used the player. I don't know what. I don't know where you put him that on the court. And he's a ryant Carolina or or even late for US or

anything bos with Crutain coach. I don't know, I mean, but I think I know we can play for US and the first we signed it and I don't push me the song. But he did call his buddy John Lift to verify did he could play in John Lift. He's the headquater of no right, Franks right, He's a good player. So uh, first workout, p J is awful, I mean god awful, throws up in the trash and he's got a shade and uh, River coach just killing

me about him. Uh actually started killing me when he was want to visit because we went to this place and and p J. P J ordered like five lobster tells for I Lockster. They were so expens be woman of bad boys down one bite. Uh. But uh, he he end up benefit to go and he left after three years and obviously he was the twelve Player of the Year and uh and he's still playing in the NBA. You you get your first job at Miami. What's that like?

You like you've been doing You've been doing it for fifteen years or so, and now the head coach is a big time program. What do you remember about your first days on the job there? The first one I got here, which is pretty awesome Letterally Hamilton's flew in. Uh. He was the head he did just be came to head coach at Florida State. You know, he was a former head coach in Miami with coasch the Wizards. He flew in and he met it and uh and he

took me around town and gave me some advice. And I was you know, obviously I got to know Coach Challenging a little bit through his profession. But the fact that he took if I was thought it was kind of you know, we were competitors and we're going to be compete against each other. But he showed me around town, explained you know, people I needed to know in town. Uh and and and that was unbelievable in terms of giving me some comfort level. Um. But I felt good

about the opportunity. Even though the program was struggling at the time. We went through some tough times in terms of they were making a transition in the Big East back to the ABC, and um, you know, we we were able to in seven years, five years of postseason though you know, one day into terms of five and I think that was still an upgrade where the program was and Miami was a program that needed a lot.

We built the practic facilities, a lot of things that needed to upgrade the program to get it to the level it needed to be to be consistently uh competitive in a sec And Jim's done a tremendous job after the taking it to another level. But but it was a you know, I was thirty eight years old, and you know, you know, we we were able to get some things accomplish here in terms of the type of teams we built. And uh that's Jack McClinton had a closer kid that and I think you did one of

our games. And in New York St. Johns who played St. John Jack m Clinton became an unbelievable player here transferred to Tiana and he's guys in the number in the rackets, one of the all time these people in shooters in a sec um and had a tremendous career at Miami. You know, I was I was I was before I

knew I was gonna have you on. I was researching and I remember, like I saw your second game at Miami you lost to South Carolina State, and I just wonder, what like that can you compare that to like a couple of years later, you guys started out twelve and oh you win a preseason tournament you VCU and Providence in Mississippi State and St. You know St. John's what I mean, what's that like from early on where you're I don't know if you ever question yourself, like, man,

this thing and to work to all of a sudden it takes a couple of years. What's it like when it hits, when you're like, this will work? But you know,

I think when you have, I've been very blessed. We talked about some of the people I've worked for and and and people that I could call and rely on in terms of from it their experiences and um, you know, George Raveling was someone else that I leaned on, and you know that's outing of the state was you know, I opened, but I think, you know, I felt like we had some solid players that we could build on. But you know, it was just being consistent. I had

good people working with me. You know, you have to have a good staff. You know, you're only as good as the people around you that kept me encouraged and motivated. And uh and my family. You know, my wife was tremendous. And you know, I had this opportunity, and I knew I was prepared because the coaches that I've worked for are giving me the opportunity to give me the tools that I needed to be successful. And and I embraced

those opportunities that I had. I you know, I tell young coaches this all the time, whoever you work for. You don't just particularly being a young African American coach in this business, you get labeled as just a recruiter. You know, I get my first job because uh, you know, I was able to have the number one recruited class in the country with LaMarcus old Rich and Draniel Giftson and Mike Williams and all those guys. But you better be able to handle all the things that come along

with being a head coach. You better be able to do speaking. Again, she's better be able to do radio edit. You better be able to uh do scheduling. Uh you know, how do you how do. How do you learn if you don't know how? Right, Like like the speaking speaking stuff, you're very good at it, but you've always I mean I we met when you were in Texas and like you've never you've never been somebody who like, well that

guy really needs to work on this presentation. But how if you if that's not something you do naturally, Well, how do you work on it? I think you've got to. You learn, You get better by doing. And I was fortunate enough to have coaches like when we would play on Big Mondays, you know in the Big twelve. Rick Barnes wouldn't do that. We had our we had our our conference calls on Monday, so I would do his This his part of comference calls on Mondays. When we

play on Big Mondays with the radio and ask the questions. Um. So you you learn, you get better at it by doing. And I tell jump Fakes, you can't like you're gonna You're not gonna be good at it the first time you do it. You know Kim English who worked for me, the first time he did a scouting court, he struggled. Kim English is one of them. He's a stuff. He is a stark in this business. But he'll tell you the first time he did a Scoutter report, he struggled.

And I think you learn you get better by doing and and you can't be discouraged. You gotta It's like riding a bike, right you, Paul, You get but you got to get back on that bike and ride it again. And you get better by continue to be persistent, to tine to do it. Contiue to work on it, continue to practice and and and then and but but but you have to actually do it. I think that's how you get better. Why the Missouri job, you know, it's here seven years and I enjoyed Miami. We still own

our home and minded and um. The traction there at that time was the fan base and the the rapid fan base, the energy, the um and you know, I just wanted it. Wanted something briffer and uh. But what I loved what we had because I thought we had created a program that was going to be just take

off here at Miami. And and Jim came in and obviously they did because we had a lot of young guys here and it was hard to me and I was really emotional telling those guys that I was leaving, and because I knew with the Kawan Jones and we had Kenny Kaji sitting now, we had you know, we had so many guys, uh you know, Reggie Jones that we were really google to be really really good about the Grand Durrant Scott and we're gonna be really good. Um. But I wanted I wanted something different, and uh um

it was tough. But you know, three years we won seven six games at Missouri, you know, three straight postseason and we looked that first team was terrific. There was the senior laden we only had seven scholarship players win thirty games. Uh but we also won forty six games the next two years, and we had recruited well enough to containue some success there. Um. Um, But I you know, and I enjoyed my time at Mansouri. I had a had a great experience there because we're really good, had

a great fan base. Um. And you know, at that time, I just felt like I wanted something different. I want to try something different. I was young enough, you know, um to do it. And um but I enjoyed my time there. And we you know, we still, like I said, we still have great friends, great relationships here in Miami because this is probably gonna be our home whenever we hang it out. You mentioned that first team. Of course he was famous for not just having seven scholarship players.

But you guys, you were the first to really really commit to true small ball. Like we played small when I was at Oaklahoma State and we had Mason at the four, but Ricardo Bratliff as you know, just a just a junkyard dog inside as your five and the pressy boys, Kim was really your fore man, right, who's like a point for point power forward and Marcus Demmon? How did that come to? Was that? Was that? Just? Um? What was the what is the was the what is it? Necessity?

Is the root of all invention? Or was that the plan? In the second you got there? It wasn't the plan? And uh, you know lost Pollowers was an All conference player towards a c L. I was out recruiting and he tears as a c L. And so you know,

we really didn't have a lot of size. Uh you know, we had a kid to being Green was a pressman that was read sure the year before and he end up leaving the middle of the year and and and it's one of those things where I looked at our team and I said, we gotta have our best players out here. And you know, Kimmy was and I called Kimny in and and and he'll tell you a story, perbade him. I said, kim we're gonna have to probably

play it before and I need you. I know you visit yourself being a off guard in the NBA, and and and but you're gonna play like a guard and you're gonna play this position. But you're smart enough and you're you're you're tough enough to be able to handle it on both ends or the floor. Oudity, they're gonna have a tough time guard you, but you're going to be good enough to do it on a defense the end. And now we'll give up some things, but here's what I want you to focus on. Just keeping your guy

off the guards. Just keep your guy off the glass and you're gonna be and with your quickness, you'll you'll have your way. And we played Kansas twice that year, and kim me a upday is the I mean, Jeff with the you would just se putting in a garden because we're party had the guard Thomas Robinson and just with the struggle two times against him, and but Keimerson

tells him he was fought in. He would you know, he was stricken him on the way on his turn and then he had a you know, a hard time guarden. But they ended up you know, I give Bill credit. He ended up putting a guard on him on the other end to the second time we played them, Um, but it was something and then and then we just had a system where we taught spaces. Those guys really were comfortable with sharing the ball and that was that was something I thought coming from the year before they

they was a lot of sis. But you know, Marcus Denman and Kim Eng was Ricardo, they were scores and even might get there were all scores. But getting them to understand it doesn't matter. There's gonna be some guys

at night. We got enough guys who can score that we They shared the ball like crazy, Doug and and the still to this day, I think the numbers of that team offensive points per possession is one of one of the since they started doing that, one of the best in the countries in terms of Once they started doing that, stack um and we were lethal and we

had a big managhot seventy or seventy percent from the floor. Uh. And then those guys were so good at you know when we got stay and they could play in space, uh, and they could shoot. So you you really struggle figuring out how to defend them, you know, and you know, could you if he got up on him, they all can handle them all well enough to deck it to go buy you if he stayed awesome, they well, they all could shoot it. And so but we also had a threat inside if we didn't make jump shots, which

allowed that to open up the perimitive game. So it was that was a team that you know, there was determined too. They had good leadership at Marcus and Kenney and and I really believed when we look at that team, that seems really good. But if Mike Dixon stays with us the next year, I thought that team was an even better because we had still Mike, and then we had recruited you know, Lawrencepis team making, We had out

to Yaki with Jabari Brown, we had Kean Bell. That team was super super talented and had a chance to be really good, but then we lost Mike Dixon before season got boring. Um, if somewhere were if if you wanted to make a statement about how and why it ended at Missouri, right, what what would what would what would you want people to understand? Oh man, that's a

tough one. Um. I had. I had a great my family loves Columbia and UM my daughters, she dances competitively and that the dance company has se Pack is tremendous and helped her get her start. Um my wife loved the college town. Um it was. It was one of those things, does that you know, I just I'll be honest with you. Uh, you know, I had you know, I was told that at that time that you know, I was getting an extension and uh uh and then

it didn't happen. And and you know, a professional standpoint, Uh, you know, you gotta you gotta look out for your family. You gotta do a specify family. And I didn't feel good about that situation because of that, uh you know. And and there's nothing I didn't take anything personal. I just it's just that I felt like I had to do something. I had to do what was best for my family. And at that point in time, UM, you know, I felt we were successful and we were going to

continue to be successful. Um. Um and uh but um, but not. I was incomfident that, uh, that they had enough confidence in me and supporting me to continue to be their head coach. And that's just been honest. And uh but you know, like I said, there's no howse films because I loved I still root for Canso to do well. There have a lot of passions for that university and what it stands for. And uh, but that was a tough decision for me to make at that time.

But you know, obviously the only thing is on my mind was what was destiny and my family. You get to Tulsa and obviously that anybody who knows anything about basketball Tulsa went through has had some amazing coaches, right, I mean they had to run there. You know where you had Tubby, Steve Robinson, Bill Self, Buzz Peterson right like where he's like man just kind of lying up coach after coach. Um. And you know, you can go back obviously to the early mid eighties when they had

Nolan As as their head coach. Great history of being competitive, but but there was there was some dormant years. Of course, you replaced Danny Manning, who had taken to the n c A tournament. What what did you when you first got to Tulsa. A lot of people thought, he's give me there for a year or two, then he's gonna

move on. That's what everybody does a Tulsa. Um. When you first when you first got on boots on the ground in Tulsa, would you think, Yeah, I was excited about you know, obviously, when you take a good job, you excited about another start. And uh, you know, I knew about the tradition of the program, but I knew we were going to be we would have a different challenge on our hands because we were going to tack on a uh you know, a job that was going

to be joining a conference at a different level. You know, the American compasses obviously a lot different encompassers said, and planning the competition that we were playing. I mean, Yukon had just won a national championship, uh two years prior and uh, and we were joining the comperence with the national champions and so um and uh obviously I think you look at my career, I've had jobs when we

were taking over jobs, you know. And when I came to Miami, we were just joining the a SEC when I when I went to Missouri, we were only in the big troll we had and we went to the SEC and and you know, obviously moved there, and say, was a huge job. There's a different jump in those those other jumps, and uh, but I was excited about the opportunity. We had some really good players in our program. I mean, James Water and she Killed Harrison were really

good players. And uh, those guys are got backcourt. When you got good guards, you know this, You're you're a really good guard on the team. And you know, when you got good guards, you got a chance. And uh so I felt like we had a chance. And obviously whoever you get back to the tournament my second year, um um, and and she Killed Harrison's that still playing the NBS. And there's a guy's a two star recruit's playing the NBA. And uh, Danny did a good job here.

And I'd say Doug wog So who recruited a lot of those players too. There were some good solid players here. And we were a senior lady team, uh, a junior lady team, and and we were able to you know, since we's been in this league, we've won to play most games in this league. I don't know that people know that, uh behind Cincinnati and Houston and uh, you know, we won more games in Memphis and Temple and other

traditional rich basketball holmes in this league. But uh, I was, but I was excited for the challenge of you know, taking over team he's got some great tradition and joining a league that had some really good basketball, good coaches and uh and and I looked at as a great opportunity, uh to day to grow and and uh and and and I was excited about, you know, and now with them we had which to state and I think this it's it's been a great transition for them in this

league and helping our league. And I think our league is perceived to be one of the better leagues in the country. Um, then you finally get it right, right, you get to your kind of the sweet spot where this year you're in first place in the league and now you can't go an n c A tournament appearance was definitely was pretty much a definite right and it gets right. Yeah, mean like I think, I mean the only I mean, you know, we can it was a weird year. I can't I couldn't see it not getting

in you know you beat Houston. Um, you guys are playing with going yeah, I mean and you would and you would have had an opportunity to you would have been had an opportunity had the conference room had been played to beat those teams a second time, which would have it would have been end of end of discussion, right, but sho'd be You know, it's not you had road wins as well. Wasn't just that you want home games? Um? When your team had gotten better as the year went on.

I mean, all you check out of all the boxes? For me, what looks and feels like an n c A tournament team? You win your league? What? What's that? What's it been like though? For um? For a kind of the dormancy of three months after really having your team rolling and expecting to get an n c A tournam at birth, it was tough, you know. And and it's funny. We were all at the tournament Coerce tournament

and uh, you had the first round. By you you're starting to see the buzz with the cancelations of tournaments and and we got that word. We had to relay that to our team. I mean, we had we had two seniors that were terrific, terrific student athletes and Mark Zibano first team All Leaguer and lost with Kreta and the the the the the conversation and they need the look on their face of the emotions. Um, it was tough.

It was tough. And then we you know, we drove to the tournament and we that drive back was tough. And then going in the locker room. Uh, and visit with those guys when we got back. I mean, just the fund fine nite of that was just incredible. I mean,

you mean, how do you in the season. I've never obviously nobody has end of the season just like that, and uh, and we had a team that I think the way we played, you know, you established yourself as a coach, and you talked about how we played at Missouri and you know, you do different things, and but the way that team played defense, defense, I thought there was a chance to really be a problem for people in postseason played and I felt like and we were.

We were a confident team. And you know, when you get your team to play to the level where they believe in what they're doing and you've got rotations, you

got you got roles defined and everybody's buying in. Now you feel good about you've got something special, because that's all that's It's hard to get to that point, right, you know, when you build your team throughout the year, when you finally feel like you at that point where everybody understands their roles, they embrace it, they understand and embrace it. You you know, you you've got confidence in how you're playing, you know how you want to play day.

I mean in terms of your your execution. Um, and I felt like it was it was it was a tough time and uh um, but you know it was the right call, you know, in terms of what was going on in our country. Um and I think that whereas I was disappointed and hurt for our seniors and our program, but it was the right call. Um. Okay, Now you have as much as you losing Ban, who's a he was a monster, right, just an absolute monster, six really really talented kid. But most of your team

is back next year. How have you like, how challenging has it been to re recruit him them get your new guys keptain? Like? What has this been like for you? It's such a hum you know, different right because we we we you know we had to We signed three guys before guys the spring, uh without even them visiting.

And so that's been taught, you know, and and keep your guys engaged and um, you know when when you know there there's a moment of nothing right, no gym, No you can't be anywhere but you know, isolated and but but continue to visit with those guys in extremely import and in at the level where we're at, you know where this you know transfer epidemic is has become uh something that's uh prevalent and uh um but I will I will tell you that we you know, we've

done a really good job of spending time with our players, talking with them, um, you know, and and and and with the zoom. But the technology we have today with Zoom calls uh and we're able to have a really good recruiting class too. I'm excited about that will give us some pieces. Uh. Missing a bottle is going to be tough because he's the first team all lager and even lost and to all those losses numbers, UH don't really say what his value was to our team, and

he was. He's tremendous in the locker room, but also execution and you understand this stuff. Execution wise, he's unbelievable on both ends of the floor. And those things don't show up in the stats. Like he was always in the right place in our matchup zone. He was always where he needed to be in terms of rotating, taking a charge of you know, uh, you know that in

terms of the rules in ourselves. And and then on offense, in terms of moving ball movement, what about having that guy and you were this guy, that one guy on your team that moved the ball. If you can absolutely count on when you know, when you need a ball moving, that ball gets you know, you know, sticking, novelcro, you want that ball star sticking. You want that one guy when he got it, he was gonna reverse it and and and can knock down open shot when he had it.

But but that's what Lawson brought to this team. So we'll miss those two guys. But we had two guys sitting out, a really good two Oklahoma kids, um Turtis Heywood to transfer from Georgia Tech and and a Keyshawe Nambory Sinson the transferred Markansas. So I think a perimeter game will be really really good. Uh, you know, we've got we have to see what we we will have to be our post position? Will we have to man

by three different guys rotating in there. Um, we won't get Martin's numbers by any one person, but hopefully collectively we'll be able to get something. But I do like what we will get from our primers in terms of what Tishan and Kurt Spring and then Brandon Rochelle, who's an all elite performer coming back. So I think we

have a chance to be pretty good. But you know, Tom will tell and I said this about last year's team will pick ten, So you know, uh, Tom will tell you know in terms of how we developed and how we come together throughout the season. Last thing, Um, you have a great relationship and a good affinity for for Rick Barnes. I I didn't like him when we played against him because I didn't know he was so sarcastic, right, I didn't didn't you know? I was a kid. I

had no idea. And um, I mean I've known him for a long time, sort of through Larry Shiatt, who recruited the West Coast back when they are Providence, and I like coach Shy, but I just didn't get And then I got to know Rick Barnes is like, he's the best. He's an unbelievable dude. Um, if give me, give somebody one story like this. Here's Rick Barnes in a nutshell go. Oh my god. I mean where, I mean, where do I start this guy? I was like, I mean, oh, man, I tell you the one and one of my favorite

stories about Rick. Uh. We were Final four. Uh, two thousand and three. We're in the Final four. Uh, We're playing Syracuse and Rick is in the locker room and I would always sit with him and joke with him and talk to him. And I'm serious, I mean I kind of in and out, go get a bottle of water. And I walked back in the locker room and the suckers did dead to the bone sleep. He's out of it, and uh, I don't bother him. I was like, man,

I mean I could almost hear him snore. I mean, he was so he was, he was, he was stone out of it. And all of a sudden, Rick Barnes when the guys walked back in, he could turn it right on, like like a light switch. And uh that was That's so that got so impressive. And you know he you know, the one thing that I learned from coach is adaptability. And you know, when we got t J. Ford, and you know, you his constant teams, they were so motion oriented and ball movement, you know, cutting and they

had those two big physical guys or blocker screeners. And and then when we got t J. Ford, he was you know, you put that ball in his hand, you let him put so to me, being able to adjust to your personnel, to me, that's coaching. That's what I learned from coach. You know, being being having the the the trust in yourself and not being fearful to change. And he was so good at that and and I love him for giving me that quality, you know. And

I look at my career as a head coach. I haven't been afraid to change and to learn and and and and you know, every year you're learning, you you even get better, you get worse. You don't stay the same. And uh, he's one of those guys that is always looking at new ways to get some things done. And uh, you know, I think his defense has been pretty staple, but I'll go I think he's changed that a little bit in terms of his aggressiveness on the ball and that's kind of coming on a little bit. But uh,

but he's a special man. I mean, I love it. He's you know, he's he's one. He's one of my best friends. And I love him for what he's done for me and my family and rely on him. And and you know you've been around him. The guys never had a dull moment. I mean the guys. He's full of fun and and and and uh my wife absolutely loves Rick and he's just so joyable and he's just a great person. You know, he goes out of his way,

um to do things for you. But he still has a insurance policy on my son that he paid and that he started. I mean, and I worked for him, I don't know what sixteen years ago, seventeen years ago, and uh we took it over, but he started it. And uh, he's just a good human being and uh

loves people. Yeah, I think where we started it is kind of where we ended, right because that this is why basketball guys, I think struggles so much and coaches struggle so much with the idea of racism because when you said, like, look, you you gotta learn, you gotta evolve, you gotta adjust, and if you can't learn, evolve and adjust to the changing times and how views have changed and how people have changed how you need to treat them, then you're going to be a dinosaur and you're gonna

be left behind. The same is true in life as as it is in sports. That fair, That's absolutely fair. And that's a great segue to what we just talked about. Is that's awesome. But that's exactly the way life is and what you just said. And if you don't, if you're not willing to change and adapt, uh, you'll become stale and you and you recharge your development. And that's that's that's life and I and I that's awesome, Dog, I appreciate you for saying that. Well, listen, I appreciate

you coming on with us. You've always been kind of me. You always have an unbelievable staff. I can't believe you have Jerry Wayne. We haven't told me Jerry Wayne Wright stories those pier Main off air um. But the meantime, take take care of your family and your team. Can't wait to see you guys back in the Runalds Suttern next year. And and thanks for joining me. God bless you, dog, thank you be sure to catch the live edition of The Doug Gottlieb Show week days at three p m.

Easter noon Pacific. Let me go from Frank Keith to Brandon golbl Now, I were in this kind of really odd new world right where my dad for years had Branch West Basketball and he he was like a placement service and actually for years he did it for free, where he would have his players and he would find the right fit. And his belief was, you know, anybody wants to play college basketball's good enough in starting their high school. We can find a place for you to

play if you have grades. Whether you play or not, you just make the team. There's so many different levels to it, or at least before COVID nineteen and quarantine and the economy there that we're a lot of levels to it. Um. But then he basically ran a placement service and you know, you pay him to come evaluate your kid. Then he put together a highlight tape and they'd say, look, if I get you to this level, this is the level I think your kid can play at.

You pay me, acts, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. Brandon does this, you know, goodness of his heart, unbelievable service to the kids. He just loves ball, and they go around the country, around the world. They put on camps and they try and discover kids and then you know, bring the taste back and send them out to you know, put it on Twitter and just try and help. It's about the players. You can fall him on Instagram, um, and of course you can fall him on Twitter as well at Juco Advocate.

He's he's uh, He's become a good friend and I think this is the perfect day to have him on. As Brandon Golbol joins us here in the All Ball podcast. Let me let me start with this. This is just a weird year. There's no Hutch right, So anybody who knows anything about Juco basketball, you know, like that's what team needs a guy late in a year, and Hutches different now, and Juco basketball is different now than it's

ever been. How different from your perspective? Is a guy who's covered this for years, you really know players and recruiting and is the spring recruiting non recruiting period. So it was it was definitely interesting to see. Is everything kind of fell apart um really fast? Right, Like there was a lot of people that were just kind of still doing their normal recruiting stuff, saying, hey, we're gonna

wait till Hutch. You know, we're not gonna really hit some of the conference tournaments and things like Hutch is gonna be fine, to everything's going to be fine. I was getting ready to go to Paris and run a camp over there and stuff, and then all of a sudden, everything just like collapsed. And and so now all of a sudden, these coaches are going we have these scholarships sitting here that we haven't done anything with, we haven't really dug in all that deep. We were waiting for Hutch,

and now what do we do? And and so all of a sudden, Uh, synergy, right, synergy was was spiking. Like their views on on junior college stuff was going up anyways in January and February as people were kind of preparing, but there their usage for junior college film just went to the room. I mean, it's it's the

most it's ever been by leaps and bounds. And so people were suddenly hammered, hammering tape and and just trying to figure it all out, and uh, you know, making a million phone calls and and it's just it was a little bit chaotic honestly. Um, guys were getting offers from places that you're like, oh, man, like that's you know, that's too high, or you know that doesn't make any sense, or you know, it's just I think guys didn't know what to do, and so there was a little bit

of a panic that set in. And it's it's chilled out some since then, but um, it was it was wild for a little bit. Who's been who's been the most impressive, like in terms of some of their late gets that you've noticed. Yeah, I think Kansas State actually did a really good job with getting Rudy Williams. And I know that saying like a high major and and stuff is uh kind of odd in the sense that like they should be able to get just about anybody that they want, But that was a really important one.

Point Guards are really difficult to kind of lock down these days. In junior college. There's just not a lot of point guards. And they lost it, and they lost their point guard a transfer to I mean you know, so yeah, that's a you can't you cannot play that was probably arguably the best point guard in the class. And to get him late like that with all of the wild stuff going on, I think that was I think that was a huge move because a lot of

the other big guys signed early. UM. You know, I think b y U grabbing getting in George late was like an all year process for them. UM, and they were able to kind of take advantage of the fact that they were able to sneak in a visit right at the last second before everything went crazy when we went and visited during the Gonzaga weekend. UM, that was a big one. To what happens with the Oklahoma State

with Kate Cunningham, What do you think happens? Oh man, You know, I wouldn't be surprised if k just sticks it out for you. I think he knows that regardless of postseason or not, you know, what he does this season can still mean a lot. And there's just so many unknown, weird things going on right now. Anybody making any Scotastic decision is taking a big risk. Here's what I've been told. I've been told the G League is telling these kids, hey, there's not gonna be a college

basketball season, so you're hanging around for nothing. You know. Then the argument against the G League has been, you know, why would you want to play even if you're making money, play meaningless games? And so the G League in turn, for for Kate Cunningham's is like, yeah, our games don't necessarily mean anything, but not that this local mistake. You can't play for a conference tournament and he can't play in the n c A tournament. At least you can

make some money. And I've been told he was offered a crazy amount of money back in December and January and that that amount might even go up at the end of the day if the money makes sense for him or something. I'm thanking. I guess you can never really knock a guy on that, but I think there's this there's a huge misconception about out there of what the G League and what the G League looks like

when you play in it. I mean, these are a bunch of guys that fall intents and purposes, most of them should be in the NBA, but there's just not enough spot. There's players that at any given moment could contribute to a team. So now you're in this different style of basketball that's that's somewhat difficult to evaluate, especially

if you're a new guy that's coming in there. Um, but if you go to a place like home the state, even for a year, and you don't play in the conference tournament, you don't play in the n c Double Tournament, but you have an entire season of your nonconference in Big twelve basketball. I mean, Julie Juligue is fine at all, But I just I feel like there's a lot to be made for him if he takes that chance and

goes to college for a year. I I told him, listen, I agree, like you, what do you mean you're missing out on one or two Big twelve tournament games, maybe an n c A tournament game or two, you know, like maybe three. Like let's not let's not act like they would best team in the country. They have a chance to be really good. And obviously it sucks. But your brothers there. You get a chance to play for your brother for a year. Um, you get a chance to be part of a team. In your mind, I

know Jalen Green is going to the G League. If you were if you were going to take a kid in the end, those two who would you take, probably taking cunning him. What I just think, I think, at the end of the day, what he does for me, it is an easier translation. So I got to I got to watch him a little bit last summer um and and I just I just thought that what he does is kind of translate up a lot easier. I agree. I think I think he's I think he's a better

basketball player. I think Jalen Green is a freak athlete who will make more jaw dropping plays that look good, you know, on social media and highlights. But Kay Cunningham really really knows how to play basketball, and he can play multiple positions, like he checks so many boxes for what you need not to be a good player, but be a great player in the NBA. Green has this level of burst that few guys have. But there's some

other kind of holes. He's becoming a better shooter, but he's got to be the shooter, and you know, I I don't I don't know if he, like Kay, doesn't have to go to a team and be the best player immediately, and he can still be really really effective, Whereas it feels like Jalen Green's only kind of played in a style in which he's give me the ball, I'm gonna just go get a bucket, you know, right, And when you when you look at some of you know,

even big names in the NBA, not the biggest names, right, Like we're not talking about Lebronze and and Kevin Durants and things like that that are just freak shows. But when you look at a lot of the guys in the NBA, guys that are successful, there's not a ton of them that do something that just is you know, out of the stratosphere athletically or something like that. There's a lot of really basketball players. And I think if you're a really good basketball player, like hey, like you said,

that's going to translate faster. Now Green could get there, you know, if he continues to improve development, then all of a sudden you add that to the fact that he is a free cathlete. But right away, right off the bat, I'm probably taking Ky just because I know I'm getting a better basketball player right away. You know what what I love about your site, by the way,

the site is verbal commits dot com. And I love about your site is it it breaks it down through class and guys you're offering and I think the whole thing is fascinating. But we we did start to talk about the G league thing and my my deals with the G League like it's it in theory, it should be great, right, you take a handful of the kids that don't really want to go to college that are

really good enough for your hand. But the problem is what we always see is now it's gonna be a hundred kids that think they're one of the five kids that can go right, and do they lock in on there? And and oh yeah, by the way, like what do you do for example, U c l A Like U c l A. That sucks? You know you the second the second that that staff got the job, they had one focus. Yeah, uh Dasian Nicks right, who's in Vegas? Like, that's the guy we need to go get And they

move mountains to do everything. They get him to commit, they get him to sign, he's in. And then late in the game, the G League comes in and says, what if we paid you two on fifty grand? Now you know, look they still have Tigers, so there they'll be okay. Um, how do you think this G League thing affects not just what you do, but the overall landscape of college basketball recruiting? You know, I think it's something that is going to be a little chaotic to

start with, and and we'll probably find its place. Um, you know, much like when we were drafting straight out of high school. Uh, you know, there were guys that that got drafted and they made their money, you know, so you can't really blame them for that they got drafted, but they flamed out and people kind of went back and forth on you know, taking booming school guys or maybe they should be taking more high school guys, and it kind of found its level before they shut that

all down. And I think that's probably what's gonna end up happening with the G League because at the end of the day, if you've got you know, kids whatever it ends up being that decided to go straight to the G League, and only a few of them pan out, which is what is going to happen, people are kind

of probably start rethinking that pretty quick. Um, you know, it's I don't I don't love the fact that the NBA is using um, you know, the D League and using some of the things, like they even do some of their stuff overseas, like with the the African League that they're putting together, and all of a sudden, like professional basketball is looking like the process rather than the reward, you know, and I think there's so many of these guys that are going to the G League that's still

for the process and still have a lot to develop, but they're trying to jump straight to the reward right away. And yes, well that that look, that's and that's always been the problem. Like and even the success stories like that, this is where I'm different than other people. Dwight Howards the success story. Right he goes gets drafted in the NBA, drafted, He's probably a Hall of Fame. But you look at like,

did Dwight Howard actually live up to his potential? And I would tell you know, and I think that the things that he struggle with socially, like learning to be around others, and like there's an arrested development there his personality. He just I guess people always say, well, he's a weird cat. And maybe he was a weird cat before, and maybe he would have been a weird cat if

he went to college. But there's something disarming about being around only people your age and having to live in dorms and that and and play for a coach and play for a team um or as you know, when you play professional basketball right away and you're an eighteen year old kid, like you're thrown into an adult world. There's a lot of things personally, and then his game itself, like he never really developed a post game, he never

really developed a face up game. And what happens is kind of what you show up and arrive as you can become a better version of. But they're just some rounding out. Even Lebron has no idea, has never had any idea how to play without the basketball ever. And I think that stuff would help. And I like it's one of those questions where Jordan's to me is the

greatest of all time. But I think one of the things that really helped him and and he wouldn't have he was People make it out like he was a scrub out of high school, like it was McDonald's All American, set the all time scoring record in the McDonald's game. But I do think that playing for Dean Smith rounding him out as a player, and then you combined it with otherworldly athleticism and talent and he was able to become,

you know, the all time great. I just I just think there's so much missing and we we downplay it, but it's it does work, It does it doesn't mean that the other way won't work and doesn't provide opportunities. But no one who can really play has gone to college and all of a sudden like, well they can't actually play and the college ruined him. College doesn't ruin you. It simply promotes you and rounds you out for the

most part. And I get the thing with you know, well, if I go to college and I heard and I missed the opportunity, for sure. I mean there's a risk in anything that you do. You go to the jew League for you know, grand and get hurt like it's over there too. Um. You know, I'm a believer in the best development system in the world before you're eight team is probably somewhere over in Europe. But once you turn eighteen, the best development system in the world is

in college in America. And and the G League does not is not set up, is not designed to provide that. It's not like we used to call it the D League, the Developmental League. Not a lot of developing that goes on in that. In that league, it's it's ride or die, like try and survive and if somebody see something that

they need, then you get your shot. In the NBA and if you stay awesome, right, Like it was perfect for a guy like one to Scott Anderson that went to Marquette, still needed to develop a lot in his game, goes and plays pro in Mexico too, shot in the G League and then boom takes off and heads to the Warriors. But like, there was a lot of work that went in between that Warrior's contract, and even when he was playing at Marquette, it wasn't and he was the top and and so it wasn't just this like,

oh yeah, I'm just gonna go straight to the G league. Um. And they're doing it with international guys too. Uh. You know, there's there's an Indian player that is phenomenal that's playing down in the Global Academy and his government is like, no, he's just gonna go straight. That's not what this is for. Right. Well, I think and look, and I do think that the n c A they hurt themselves by making it harder

for international players than it should be easier. Right, there's you know and this cancer like yeah, and its cancer was a pro. When he played played in Turkey, I got it. Everyone knew he wasn't gonna play in college if they actually looked. They looked and nothing, but why like, if he wants to play in college, great, you know who can? Like, Okay, so he got paid back home. I don't care is he getting paid here? You know, as long as not getting paid to come here, Like,

I'm good, It's fine by me. I do think that college basketball hurts itself. Um, give me the best tape that somebody sent you of a guy that you didn't you maybe hadn't heard of or hadn't seen. And somebody sends you a tape and this can be any time during your time doing this, and you're like, holy shit, what did that? What did I just see? This kid can really play? Doesn't have to be not now owly

can me anytime? You know? What's interesting is, uh, the international stuff is always one of those weird places where completely context, Right, you have no idea who they're playing against, right, you don't. I've seen their national taste. People sent to me like, hey, we signed this international kid. What do you think. I'm like, I don't know who he's playing against? Right, Because sometimes the game it's like is this played at half speed? Right? Are these is this a beer league?

Or these guys really are these kids fifteen or sixteen and he's eighteen or nineteen, right, okay, but go ahead with the international stuff. So the thing that really just surprised me about this one, this was a kid that was about to get ready to play you eighteen division SAT right, So we're we're down the line here in FIBA, and somebody sent me some tape on a kid named No. One Nelson who played junior college this year for Otero

and huge right six somewhere in there. He's at the time, he's probably two something like that, and this kid is running like a year. He's he's about see through. He's so white, being from Ireland, with this mop of red hair on his head, and I'm just like, this doesn't make any sense. Like if this kid was in America right now, like he'd be blowing the hell up because he's massive and he's athletic and he can catch and

all this kind of stuff. And so somebody sent me this tape on this kid, and I was like, all right, I guess I'm I guess I'm diving into FIBA Division C and uh and watched the Ireland play. I don't even know like some of these places like Micronesia and just these tiny little these little countries and stuff, and sure enough, I mean, that kid just took off. He's going to Wyoming this year after one year in junior college. And it was it was eye opening because that was

three years ago. I think that I first saw him and really really exposed me to the fact that there are players everywhere, you know, and and I've seen better days, right, I've seen I've seen better players obviously, but I've that was one that was just shocking where it's like, man, it doesn't matter where you like, you know. I remember remember Adidas Nations they used to have and I don't

know this time, and they used to have it. I remember like the first year and I was doing stuff with the Dais at the time, and they had me come down to talk to the kids, and I think we're in New Orleans and at the then it was the Hornets facility whatever, and it was just hottest can being. I go in this gym and I'm watching Team Africa play and one guy looked different than everybody else. I

was like, who's that dude. They're like Serge Ibaka and I was like, that's there's your player, Like, well, there's this guy that guys like, no, that guy's your player. And I was just he the way he moved, the way he ran, the way he even shot the basketball at that time was before he's the shooter that he is now you could just kind of tell those things are. But you're right. The there's guys everywhere is a uh is a great one. Um, okay, how can people get

how can people follow you? I gave away Twitter, I gave away verbal commits, dot Com anywhere else we we can get all your information. Uh yeah, I mean really on on Twitter is kind of our our main communication source. That's where you'll see a lot of the stuff that we do when we go overseas. We go to Africa, the Caribbean, all that kind of stuff, run camps over there,

helped bring kids over the college. We brought twenty two kids over in the last two and a half years and playing in schools now and then we do the Live Period podcast as well. That's been fun. We just kind of started that during the during the Rhuna and sat down and said, hey, you know, let's let's do this and uh and it's it's been great. It's been fun. So it's allowing us to kind of get our message out there a little bit more and work on some different stuff and uh and and you know, just kind

of find new things to get into. Well. The best thing is that, you know, you get to learn some of these kids stories and meet him and you just you end up want to cheer for him. It's a it's a cool it's a cool thing that you do at juco Advocate. At juco Advocate is on Twitter Brandon Global is his name? Brandon? Great catching up. We'll do so again in the very near future. And thanks so much for joining us. I appreciate my friend. Be good.

All right, that's it for All Ball. You can listen to The Doug Gottlieb Show daily three to six Eastern twelve three Pacific on Fox Sports Trader, the I Heart Radio app on Sirius XM. We're now on the Dan Patrick channel and two seventeen Serious XM. In the meantime, feel free to ask questions on the Instagram page at Gottlieb Show or the Twitter handle at Gottlieb Show. I hope you appreciate listening to it. Thanks so much. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is All Ball.