The Stunned Condition

Marker, Marker, Marker in the Dark, Marker in the Dark, Bow, Chicka, Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow, Wow, Hi, Alison. I'm at Welcome to Episode 4. three. Oh, Welcome to Episode 3, Season 3, of ADHD20, which is a podcast that finds the correlation, the connection, the intersection of ADHD and. TTRPGs. right, that's right, that's what it does. Why are we in each other's brains today? Goodness! It's fun. I know, I know, I You're like a little tadpole swimming around in here. Sorry, you guys.

I'm obsessed with Baldur's Gate 3 right now and I just realized that we're connected by the same illithid and that illithid is ADHD. Transformation to full nerd complete! Starting out strong. Holy crap. That wasn't in the notes. I have not even thought about that, but yes, for those of you who love BG3, Uh, would, I would easily say that ADHD could be a tadpole in your brain. That, um, And it's like, we have guides encouraging us to like, use it, right?

To like, lean into it instead of fight it, which is like, the whole part of Act One of BG3 is your little guide whispering in your dreams. Use, use the connection. Use the power it gives you. He's pretty handsome too, the mysterious dream warrior. Oh, I have, I have a lady. You get to, you get to, choose your own guide at the beginning. That's what it was! That's what it was! Well, to be fair, I've started this game over about three times.

I was telling Alison that, um, I just, all of January was like, was treading water so hard, I just, I came out of the gate strong, uh, last year, hit January, just felt super disorganized, all, nothing worked, all the, all the, everything, all the systems just crashing on top of each other, uh, and then, I, very proudly and dutifully, uh, had a colonoscopy, uh, screening, colonoscopy, a screening, uh, which happened last week, and at that time, uh, my coach from episode

one went off to have a baby, and my wife went off to dog sit, so I've just been unhinged. So, You're, you're uh, You're treading water in like, viscous gel instead of water now. It's 87 times harder to, to fight. I get it. it really is. Another thing about BG3, to that very point. Mm hmm. to that point, I do love Okay, as a Dungeon Master, I have learned already a shit ton of stuff about DMing from BG3. One of Interesting. being the amount of difficult terrain that these Yes.

Yes. Implement that, because it's really difficult, and it should be. It, in my DMing world, everything is just perfect, slick, easy movin jams. But what? And let me, yes and that. I, it took me so long. I am a brand new video gamer. This is my first gaming system since my Atari. Um, so I, I, I came in not knowing it and I literally had to watch YouTube videos of like how, how do I hold the control? Like, what do these buttons do?

Because I was so lost for the first, like, Several hours I was trying to play. It took me so long to even figure out how to build a character just because I didn't know what to hit, even though it's right there on the screen, if you know how to read it. That's the thing. Like, the key is there if you know what to do with it, but I couldn't, I needed a key for the keys. Anywho, I digress. is not It's not easy.

it is not an easy game It is not an easy first game to jump into it is really not That is the Alison way right there. Like, why would I wade in when I can just make myself drown out the gate? Yeah, mm hmm, yeah, Um, but I noticed that, like, when we would go through these rough terrains, I would, we would come out of them, and my character, I'm actually playing Chimerical, who you guys have heard me talk about on this podcast. She would come out damaged.

She'd come out like 20 hit points down and the rest of the party would, and I'm like, what, they're all jumping. That's why it's like, that is, that's ADHD right there too, is like, I'm making things harder on myself. I could just jump over the fire. I could just like do a perception check and see. See the vines that are going to entangle me, and instead I am just the impulse gremlin like running through life and just taking the damage. Oh man, we did, this is not on the outline, Matt.

We have something else totally to talk about today, but we're gonna have to like circle back and do like a full This is a this is your appetizer. We're sprinkling a little taste of what's to come as we all get deeper and deeper into this game that I'm loving so much. And it's just, hours are being devoured by it and I don't care. I don't give a hoot or a toot. You feel me? It's good. It is good. It is good. But what are we, uh, what are we talking about today?

Mm. We're actually bringing you guys a little tale once again from our home game, from our Curse of Strahd game, that we experienced in game Yes. really just yesterday.

All the days are running together because Matt and I just were talking about last week what we could talk about for this episode, circling everything back, back to you and Under Anesthesia last week, and it just, it zapped you, and we wondered, like, is that Is that normal or is, does having a neurodivergent brain react differently to, you know? Right, and and I will I will I will immediately say we don't know the answer to that But we're gonna talk about it. Anyway, like we Mm-Hmm?

We've done no research. We don't know whether That's a thing, but I do know that generally the feeling of being stunned of being incapacitated Has to go hand in hand with the fact that With all of the other topics that we have broached, like RSD, and over explanation, and hyper focus, and, or, you know, or lack of any of those things. So, that's what we're going to talk about catastropic. trying to remember. But, before we do that, of course. It's time. It's time to roll some beautiful.

You are, you're rolling. What, what dice are you rolling with, Mattie? Um. I see. I told you I'd make a dice gremlin of you yet Oh god, you have no idea. Now it's, it's out of control, actually. Uh, I have, I have two sets. I have my office set, and then I have my home set. so that sounds incredibly in control to me. just. hehehehe, yeah, yeah, That sounds so the opposite of impulsive or gremlin like. Do better. Do more. For Fur serious. Ah, and they're pretty okay.

And a one and two and a one, two… 68. so close. I know. So close to being nice. If you had a familiar in real life, what would be its primary form? Oh, I know. I've had a familiar, okay. Is that, so that's a little tricky because, you know, I, I am a dog person. I love dogs. I don't dislike any animals. But a familiar is such a specific. It's a soul connection. And Familiars, for those of you not familiar. Uh, gross, Alison, it's a spell.

So when you are bonded with a familiar, it's a being that exists on the ethereal plane that you can call into the material plane that you do have this bond with. They have kind of a base what they are, but as part of the spell, you can change its form. So if we're going on a sea adventure, I could make my familiar an octopus. And they can be of aid, they can take turns with you in combat.

Our friend Matt, not this one, the other one, has a familiar in our Barovia game and does amazing things with that fiery little bird that he has. It's really a cool mechanic for you to just kind of like have a little buddy, but also kind of, uh, you can see and hear through their eyes and ears, which is neat. But when you, when you're seeing and hearing, you as a person lose access to those senses, which I kind of love. great. Um, Again, I love dogs. I, I, I, will have a dog.

But I feel like, uh, a familiar really needs to be a pocketable creature, or something that has its own. constant, uh, you know, ability for motion without getting tired because, you know, otherwise, Shih Tzus, Shih Tzus get tired they, I feel like I know what you're going to say, so let's see if I'm right. You want to, you want to guess? I was going to guess rat. You got it! You got it! You got it! Uh, yes, I think a rat would be a perfect familiar. Because they are smart. are Personable?

know, I don't mean sewer rats. I know that, I know that rats get a very bad, bad, uh, rep, but can do amazing, amazing things. They will live in your pocket. They will, they will, like, they can learn tricks. They can, wish I had a rat Yeah. It's funny, you made one of my a were rat in one of our campaigns, and like, Yeah, I cried. Like, I was not Matt was so horrified as to why I was having such an emotional reaction. I only know, like, pizza rat and sewer rat, Yeah.

I love, I love it, Matt, the rat cats meat man. I mean, just keeps going on and on. Yeah. Yeah. Perfect. Familiar. How about you, Alison? Okay, so I know that everybody's going to guess I would pick cat, and that was second place because I do, I love cats, I love my cats, um, and I think cats make for excellent familiars for many, many reasons. But I was, I was sharing that our illithids were connected once again, that I, I would want something a little bit more pocket-sized Yeah.

Um, you're not going to be able to guess what mine is. Mine came to me while you were saying rat out of left field, but the more I think about it, the more perfect it becomes to me. If you want to guess. Mole. No. Hamster. Nope. Sloth. Oh, that's a good one, but not, that's, that's lost in our pocket, but they could just like hang on your neck. Anyways, we could spend an entire episode talking about the best familiars. I would pick porcupine, Holy moly.

Because, I mean, they're, they're smart little creatures is what I know about them. And I love, I feel like, I feel like we share, like they've got these, you know, the spines, right? The, the, the needles, whatever they're called. I don't know a ton about porcupines. But they only use those when they're threatened. They can't, they do have the ability to like, lay them down and be gentle. And I feel like that's me. Like, I can get real prickly real quick.

But I can also like, choose You can lay, lay down. when I can want to lay down my defense mechanisms. And they're just, they're cute little noses, just, you know, And also, and I blame you for this, Matt, like, the, the, the burgeoning hipster in me that can't choose, like, the easy, you know, the obvious answer would be cat, like, I was like, I got to come up with something cooler, but there has to be a reason. So, I love that. we're keep behind in a rat. Porcupines and rats? All right. bits.

Um, amazing. We'll We'll our porcupines and our rats to stun our enemies I wonder how they could help you out of a stunned, because my dogs don't really help me out of a stunned state. They might help me relax. in one, but, All right, so let's talk about being stunned in game and IRL. Yeah, so kind of setting the scene. So, so in, in, we play D& D 5e, but I'm guessing in, in many TTRPGs, there is a condition called stunned in which your character is incapacitated.

And when you are incapacitated, it means you get no action, you get no reaction, and your movement is reduced to zero. So you can't move, so you may be able to like, Talk or be like vaguely aware of your surroundings, but you're so entranced. But it doesn't mean that you're like dead on the floor, right? You're not dead. fall down. You just Yeah. can speak only falteringly. Um, So you can't cast spells because spells usually have verbal and somatic. components.

Yep, you're easier to hit because you stand there like a big lump on a log. Um, you fail anything that would involve strength or dexterity. Any saves of type. So, there's a lot of ways in game to be stunned. There is the monk, which has the stunning strike, which is a very powerful thing that a monk can specifically do. Uh, you, yesterday, you threw out hypnotic pattern on the, the vampire, on the vampires that attacked you.

Well, and this is the story now for I think two sessions running with us, Matt, is that you have had these, you know, not necessarily big bads, but you have had these, you've brought these characters in, these beefy, you, you, you faced us against a death slod a couple of weeks ago that you thought like you honestly, as a DM, you thought it was going to be a fight. You thought that it was because those things are. Ruff!

Like, they can, they can take some hits and they can lash out with some hits. So, you kind of came into that game like, I got this, I'm putting my party against the slod and we weren't expecting it. We had just come out of this room and we had gotten this thing that we've been looking for, for a really long time and we're feeling good and then there's this, this. You know, kind of thing standing in our way of our, of our hasty exit.

Um, and then yesterday's game, we came across a clearing and, uh, a coven of what looked like just, you know, like old regular people. led by a, a, you know, a fanatical, leader, and, and I loved how it started out. The, the PCs kind of, you know, came upon this crossroads in, this kind of opening in a, in a field, and there's a gallows, and there's a beautiful young woman in a, Like I said, a charismatic leader that is speaking to a small flock of people and saying, This is a witch!

We're hanging her as a witch! And all of you are like, What? Why? This is a fantasy world. Why would they punish her for being a witch? Wouldn't they be into that? And so the confusion was exactly what I wanted and you kind of approached the gallows and it turns out And Matt, uh, the other one, again, had this fantastic idea. He had an item that would maybe help us determine if somebody actually was a witch or not.

So we were gonna do this really weird approach that I don't know if you're watching this or listening and you don't know much about D&D and you wonder, like, do you always have to fight? No, you could talk to people. You could try and, like, persuade or intimidate or deceive. We don't do that. We just walk in and start swinging, but you could, is what I'm saying, if you wanted to. I don't, I don't know if anybody knows that about, about D&D.

Um, so we thought maybe we would try a conversation, you know, that had all the makings for, yeah, try a little tenderness. And then we did what we do, which is we started swinging. he started swinging, and, and, that was okay with me too, because, it, what, these, these characters were, these, This little, this little gaggle of villagers were not just townies, they were also Vampire Spawn in, in This little light of mine, I'm gonna bite you in the neck.

hmm. Um, and Vampire Spawn are, they are the weaker variety of Vampire, but they are certainly I mean, they can get, they can mess up, and they started to beat the crap out of, uh, Evan's character. Um, Tee hee hee. and then, when it was revealed that all of them, not just the charismatic leader, was a vamp, but all of these, these five, uh, her, burn the witch, um, they were all, they were a pack. What is the pack of vampires called? Is this not a coven Oh. vampires, the fang of co vampires.

Yeah. uh. Yeah. Anyway, tell them about the spell that you caught. Cost casted. You know, it's funny because Chimerical, I often feel weak compared to the rest of my party. I feel like, and we've talked about this on this podcast before, where it's like, it's like everybody in the party is a specialist, right? Like they are real good at the things that they are real good at. And Chimerical is the generalist. She's.

kind of good at a lot of things instead of being really good at any one or two things. Um, and so, you know, I'm like instantly like, what can I do against a pack, a coven, a fang, a vampire's about coven, by the way. Yep. coven? All right. Thank you, Twilight series. I'm sorry to have to admit that. was worth reading. Well, and what's really funny is in Twilight, Vampire Spawn are actually the straw, anyways, but I digress.

Um, so anyways, I was trying to like level the playing field, um, and like give, give our party a fighting chance. So as a bard, I have access to a spell called Hypnotic Pattern. And what Hypnotic Pattern does is you, there, in D& D, there are, there are, You can either like use your spell to attack one or a number of people, or you can do what are called area of effect.

So anybody in an area, and the spirit, the spell will tell you how big or small, uh, will have to do what's called a saving throw to see if they can like recognize that magic is being cast on them and withstand the effects.

Well, I cast Hypnotic Pattern directly over this little pack of, I think it was four of them, kind of standing down on the ground, um, and then I Because anybody in that area has to do, I think it was an intelligence saving throw, to see if mentally they could, you know, push the spell away, and three of the four of them failed it. So what happened then is they were all stunned, incapacitated. They couldn't do anything.

It's this just warbling mass of energy above them that, as the name might suggest, hypnotizes them. And so all they could do was just stare up at it. They don't see anything. They don't hear anything. They can't take actions, reactions, and they can't move. The only thing that can bring them out of it is if, um, I think you can be like shaken out of it. So if somebody in their party had like shaken them one at a time using their action to do so, or if they took damage.

So I was like, let me do that. That way we can kind of like pick them off one by one. That way we are in control. We have the high ground on the battlefield. And it worked. Thankfully, like a charm. Now, you know, this is where we get into like action economy because like had I spent my entire turn to cast that spell and they had all saved, nothing would have happened. I would have wasted a turn to try and damage, um, or hinder in some way.

But what I realized as we were playing is by my casting this one spell, this one six second decision that, that I and my character made completely changed the course of what Matt had presumably spent a lot of time planning. He was ready for this kind of four on five, you know, hot vampire fight action. In more ways than one, because number one, yes, they could have all saved the spell and therefore not have been stunned, or a, a dungeon master, I could have known that when the leader.

You know, tried to snap them out of Yep. have actually worked, and I didn't know that, so. Whatever, that's not the point. The point is, I got shut down. These, these, these creatures, who were going to provide entertainment, damage, fear, towards the party. You know, uh, you know, that's part of, that's the fun of the game, is like, being challenged. They were just out for the count, and And that is such a metaphor for what life with ADHD is like for us.

Yes, because, because, uh, As, as I know that we've, we've touched on before, but, it's that full shutdown that feels so different, right? It's that full, what do I do now? How do I, what am I gonna, what is, you know, like, really, completely, just out, incapacitated, cannot take actions, cannot react, cannot strength save, cannot, you know, like, it Yeah.

it is extreme, and we would love to know what other people think about this, but For me, at least, um, it becomes something I just have to, I have to deal with the feeling of being stunned. I Mm hmm. Mm I can't fight through it. In fact, that, that often times makes it worse to hmm. I can't, yeah, I have to just experience it. And, the, the, the, the difficult part is that we don't, always expect it. We, some things I can call, some things I can guess, right?

But I did, you know, last week, I had this, uh, this, uh, it wasn't even an operation, this procedure done. And, but it did, it did involve the first anesthesia that I had been through in 2030, 20 years or something. I just forgot. how intense it is. Yeah. Mm hmm. Mm my first thought about speaking today was, do people with ADHD, brains or anyone that struggles with time blindness, because the whole point, the whole concept of anesthesia is that you are out, you are done.

And Mm think you're just going and then suddenly you're awake and an hour has gone by. And that is hmm. because Yeah. world where there is no time and for it to actually be gone. Not, not just, Oh yeah, I was sleeping or I was Mm hmm. to be doing or I was doing something I was supposed to be doing and I just wasn't aware of time. This is Yep. lights out little cookies. You had like an emotional reaction to that last week though, which was that I was not, I was a little stunned by that.

Like, you know, we knew that you were going into the procedure. It's not a fun procedure to have to prep for or go through. You were put under anesthesia. Like, so we knew those big pieces. I do remember because you got it done on a Wednesday and we were all like. Okay, because you were like, I'll be back up by Thursday. No problem. And we were like, you know, having so I've never been put under anesthesia. I've never had an operation.

I broke my wrist once as a four year old and got it put in a cast. And I've been given like laughing gas at the dentist. You know, fill cavities and things like that, but like, otherwise I've never been put under, so I don't know what that feels like and therefore cannot be as empathetic in that moment as I'd like to be.

But you were fully planning on being fine on Thursday, which we were all like, Matthew, but you were, you were, but, and so, so we all expected you to be like, you know, recovering like you do when you undergo any, anything in the medical field, but you were like, upset about the like three hours of time that you lost and and that was kind of my hypothesis too is that because you already have a very fraught relationship with time as is it you know that like the time

being taken from you that you don't even get like at least with time blindness we are aware at like oh crap i thought that was going to take an hour it took four and a half where did the time go but this was just like Right. Never existed to you. It never, it never existed. And the other part of it. I thought that it was three hours. It was actually only a half hour. But even that was, It was worse, because I, it could have been three hours, it could have been.

And, but yes, going, going back to what you were saying, uh, Lindsay says that the first time she, she had anesthesia, she woke up crying because it was just such a, just such a shock.

And I do want to stop real quick and I want to say, I want to say that, uh, I, in, in saying these things and saying that I was emotionally upset or that it was difficult to prep for this, I do want very much to be open and honest about, uh, my feeling that everybody should get Uh, it is, it is a preventative measure. I know way, way, way too many people put it off and don't. And there's a lot of things that I think, you know, that I'm with you.

I don't know, know, are, are 100 percent necessary. I really do believe in this. I want to urge everybody to go Get a colonoscopy, I think it's like, an American right, it's a human right, mean, and the science is really good, Yeah. Yeah. and I'm speaking from experience because, you know, I now, I know people who had really awful experiences because they did not. Let me get that out there. This is not negative in that way, I will do it again, in ten years, gladly, you know, Woohoo! But!

I will remember, hopefully, because I'm much better at taking notes than I used to be. I'm going to remember the experience. Yeah, I was, was just in an emotional shock, stunned state for almost two days. Mm it finally wore off. I know that there's some residual elements to, you know, the hmm. Mm hmm. and coming out of it, but there was no, you know, it's not operation. Yep. there is no pain, there is no discomfort, there is Yeah.

prep really is the worst part of that, and even that's not horrible, really, truly. But man, I did not, did not expect to be that just flabbergasted by the loss of time, the emotional take. And so yeah, I could not do anything on Thursday. I was trying and trying and trying and trying. So, you know, being, put under, into twilight sleep is not, is not the only way that, that you can be stunned. Yep. there's, there's lots of different ways. I know that you have been stunned yourself.

Um, let's talk about that. What, what do we, what do we do? What can we do when we feel the stunned Right. Well, and that was kind of, and that was exactly it, like, my hypothesis, and this is a hypothesis, as we have said many times and will continue to say. Say many, many more times, we are not medical professionals, so we don't know.

Yeah. my hypothesis here is So, when you are being stunned in game, whether it's from a magic effect or a spell, you typically do something, as I mentioned before, called a saving throw. In role playing games. A lot of times when there's a saving throw, there's something called advantage and there's something called disadvantage. So advantage means you get to roll the dice twice and take the higher number. Disadvantage is you get to roll the dice twice and take a lower number.

And I have to wonder if neurodivergent brains are rolling most, if not all, of these dice. saving throws to withstand these effects at disadvantage. It is doubly hard for us to prevent it. I don't, and again, I don't know this, then it might be neurotypical in a neurotypical situation. Now, not every time. There are things everybody struggles with just by virtue of being human. So not trying to corner the market for people with ADHD here.

Um, but I wonder if Neurotypical people, in some of these cases, when we talked about being stunned, being frozen, being, it's an analysis paralysis kind of a thing where it's like you literally cannot take a step forward.

If, if neurotypical people are rolling what is called just a straight roll, where they just roll the dice once, you know, or they're even rolling at disadvantage because they've practiced and have gotten really good at recognizing the warning signs that something's gonna knock the wind out of them, and they know how to dodge those effects more fully and completely than neurodivergent people do.

Um. And that's, that's the feeling that as we've been talking about this, that I personally just cannot shake that how many things in, in, in our lives totally stupefied us because of our inability to, to save, to roll a high enough number on whatever the dice of life are. Well, uh, I do, I did find an article, uh, on autism. org, Okay. um, I, I tried to keep it neurodivergent, uh, instead of specifically ADHD, just because I know that they're, they're so entwined.

And this is just one person's take, uh, Sim C. Rankin, R N C R N A. I think she, Sim, she is a registered nurse and, uh, has a child with ASD. Um, and, and it, and, and definitely experiences. uh, a sensitivity to anesthesia, an addition of, of behavioral problems, uh, surrounding, I guess, the lead up and maybe even, maybe even post? So it, it's, she seems to be saying that there's, like, even, uh, even, like, something that can.

Not, hopefully not trigger, but just kind of, make, have a larger effect on them chemically, And then she gets into some very specific, we'll, we'll, I'll, I'll send this to you. But, um, I did, I did let them know that I had a DHD, they knew what I was taking it. It wasn't.

It wasn't just that, but, um, but yeah, she goes on to say, like, maybe, maybe laughing gas would work instead, maybe ketamine, maybe Special K would do the triiiiick, but I don't know, like, trying to, trying to say, the, is there something about a drug that just knocks you out? Well, but again, we're not talking about like the drug itself with you. It did, it worked as intended.

It's, it's, but you know, what has popped into my mind that we've talked about a lot is our emotional reactions to non emotional things. Why, you know, when something upsets us at work or in life, like we get, You know, I don't know if it's the RSD, if it's the catastrophizing, but it's like, we take it personally when I can't solve this problem that speaks nothing to how I am as a person, how giving or kind or loving I might be, I take it as a personal insult. Like, I am the dumbest, worst.

You know, and so it's interesting that the residual effect from the drug, the medicine, I don't know what we're going to call the anesthesia, is the same thing as taking these hits, you know, in our, in our work and personal life. It's the emotional reaction that we're talking about, I'll Because it, it, you know, I'll give you a perfect example immediately.

In, in the span of this 30 minutes that we were talking, we started talking about the in game experience of casting a hypnotic pattern, and We, in our, in our outline, we actually took the, the official, write that thing, an outline. Yeah, the outline. We actually took the spell and, and the, the condition, um, uh, from D& D Beyond, from the official things, and sure enough, yes, I did not know that you can snap people out of certain spells.

I just suddenly was like, wow, I'm a terrible Dungeon Master. I just don't ever prepare. I don't ever do a good job. I don't ever know what I'm doing. It is hard. Like, it's so, it's a constant, ending, emotional reaction. And it's like us trying to Every single time we open our mouths to not go there, right? so if you take something that is, sure. I can absolutely see why that would be an emotional, emotional, it would give you an emotional reaction.

It, I, I promise you it's 10 times worse for us. It's just ten times more, right? Now we're just pinging emotion back and forth because now I'm like, that's not your fault, it's my fault for not reading that sentence in game. I'm a terrible player. Why would anybody want to play games with me? I'm the worst. When I gear, there was no part of me being like shady by not I was reading that yesterday. I know you know that, but like, that's the, that was the gremlin that just hopped into my head.

All ADHD friendship is, is just trading emotions back and forth and forth. Back and in really strange contexts. Alright, so we're rolling disadvantage. Something happens. We can't, you know, maybe we have friends that are rolling, I don't know, if they're rolling advantage, maybe they are. Maybe they, but they're at least rolling, you know, they're rolling you know, rolling dice. We're getting out of this situation. We are still stuck. We're stuck. still stuck. can we do? What do we do?

I have an answer, you're not going to like it. do have an answer. Meditate. Well, the answer to everything, like any. Any emotional or physical malady that we experience as human beings can be, if not solved, then lessened or unburdened with one thing, and it is time. And, and, and like a lot, and that's, that's especially because now I'm like weaving layers for you as someone who does suffer from time blindness.

So I'm telling you who is suffering emotionally that the only way out of the suffering is to allocate the right amount of time to allow your mind and body to experience that thing. And I get the, the, the trap of that is expecting someone who has an already fraught relationship with time to be able to do that. Um, I remember, I don't know why this, like, memory just, uh, just came to my mind.

When I was in probably late elementary or junior high, we, we had a DARE, Drug Abuse Resistance Education, kiddies, officer.

Officer Laramie was our, and he, like, we had, like, we all, like, had to relate, like, he was our D. A. R. E. officer, and, like, all the kids, like, we looked forward to our time with Officer Laramie, and so he would come in and, you know, help keep kids off drugs, you know, like, no, he was very, like, dad energy, just, like, Like middle aged man, mustache, but he was char like he, and he was so kind and, you know, he's teaching us about drugs, basically.

That was the best part about D. A. R. E. is that they're trying to keep you away from drugs while actively teaching you, like, this is a pipe versus a bong and Yeah. But I digress, but I will, I don't know why this has stayed with me locked in as a core memory, but there was a basically like what to do with a drunk person. And it was a unit on like smashing all of the wives tales about how you can help someone sober up faster.

And he had this whole like, do not give them coffee because then you're just going to have a hyper drunk person. Do not put them in the shower because then you're just going to have a wet drunk person. Do not give them a greasy meal because then you're just going to have a drunk person with an upset stomach. Like going through all of these things that we were all taught, you know, would kind of like sober you up faster. And the whole point of this spiel was nothing sobers you up but time.

Okay. When our hearts break, when we are going through intense emotions over you know, uh, love lost, love scorned. We all know this from experience, but when you're going through it, you don't, the only thing that's going to heal that broken heart of yours is time and distance. Like you just got to get far enough away from it. It's why there are phases and layers and levels of grief. Like you just kind of got to keep going. It's, it's something that universally, we as humans know, know, know.

If not fixes, at least improves things, give it time. That's why that's an adage. And yet it is something that we don't do. We don't put it to, we do not give it, we, you, you expected to go under on Wednesday and come back up completely normal on Thursday. Mm hmm. And physically, I felt. Fine, for the most part. Physically, again, Yeah. you know, uh, so I just thought, well, I don't have COVID. I'm not, I don't have the flu. I'm not sick. I don't have, like, the, the correct excuse.

I don't Yeah. excuse. But what is that excuse? That's, so, I mean, that's it. it's, like, Well, but it's, that excuse? I did, right. Like, that's not, so, you're right. Like, To be able to have friends around you and to be able to say, guys, I am so sorry. I don't have a good reason. cannot do today. I just can't. Exactly. And that, like, that's one of them. by the way, friend being yourself, because that was, that was the person that wasn't going to let me do that. Exactly.

Exactly. But, It was Matt that was like, I have so Yes. got to snap out of it. What is wrong with me? Well, and, and here, here's the what what, if you want that. Well, what? like you, me and Evan are all especially bad at this. And I have a feeling we are not alone. When we are starting to, like, feel the effects of something, we think I could just push through. Yeah. 999 times out of a thousand. It would be better if you would just take the day and try again tomorrow.

Because ultimately what happens is when you try and just push through things, you cause more damage and have to stay. And I would rather have, I would rather lose you fully for a day and have you at a hundred percent tomorrow or 75%. Why do I have this expectation that anybody's ever at a hundred, right?

But instead what happens when we try and push through is that we deplete our, and now we can get to the whole like short rest long rest discussion again, like where you're not allowing yourself to fully heal. So instead of like you're, you're, you know, a good day, let's say, let's say a good day your ceiling is 85 percent because I just think 100 percent is way too much to ever ask of anybody, okay?

So that's like, I've gotten my rest, I've restored all my spell slots, like I have all of my provisions, I am ready to go. I'm gonna be at about 85 percent today. But when you're pushing it, you're maybe at 60%, maybe at 25%, right? And the longer you push, the longer you stay at this, and it continuously goes down. So like, I could have been at 85 if I had just rested today and gotten there, but instead I'm going to come in and my ceiling today is only going to be 60.

And I'm going to keep pushing through today too. So tomorrow my ceiling is only going to be 40. And now we've gotten to the end of the week and we're at these incredibly low level levels. Whereas if we just stayed down, if we had just respected time and had said, fine, I, yes, I give in. I'm just going to stay in my PJs. I'm going to rest. I'm going to zone out. I'm not going to use any of the limited mental energy and physical energy that I'm already dealing with.

But we don't, and I do not say that to point fingers at you or Evan, especially. I'm saying I am just as guilty, like, but how do We Yeah, um, it's the boomer's fault. There it is. Boomer blame is back in season three. little bit, it's a little bit, but it's a little bit. A little Yeah, we need, we need, we need A safe word. We need, we need the word that we can utter to each other that says, no, Matt I'm serious. Stay down, man. Like we, we should have enforced that.

We should have said, you know what? You're taking Wednesday and Thursday off. What you're going through is going to be hard on you physically and emotionally and spiritually. I don't think it was that hard on you spiritually, was it? Um, you know, and like we should have, we should have been able to look you in the eye and say, kumquats. And with the uttering of the safe word, kumquats, you would have known. We're not messing around. I don't know. No, I love that.

I think, I think you're a hundred percent correct. I think you are totally correct. And, and to your point, I am still, I'm, I'm still not at my 85, my allowed hmm. Mm So, because I've just been trying to push. hmm. Mm Keep on truckin Yeah, that's that has got that That mentality has got to be squashed. hmm. And I think you gotta, like, like there are days where I get up and I don't, I don't want to, right. I wanna stay in bed. I wanna keep my PJs on. I wanna go play BG3.

One of the things that my very boomer father did, instill in me was take a shower. Get up and take a shower. Because the shower could be the thing that, like cha, you know, you might get outta the shower and be like, yeah, okay. I do. I do feel. Well enough to proceed or you take that shower and you still can't. And that's when you know, okay, I've tried. I've literally tried. I pulled myself out of bed. I took the first step in readying for the day.

And I will say that as much as I hate to say that my dad was right about anything ever. Mom, if you're listening to this, don't tell dad about this part of the conversation. But he was right about that because I do know immediately after I take a shower if I can continue with the day or actually do need to go get back in bed. Yeah. And that, but that's, I mean, that's the equivalent of a safe word, right? Like the shower is my safe word.

Is that like by, by virtue of doing that, I will then be influenced into what I actually need. Take a shower, everybody. Take a shower, everybody. Find that safe word is the, is the hope for a, you know, better experience. Um, way to help. I love this idea and I want to find my safe word. It's not going to be shower because I don't shower every day. I don't either. But, yes, but finding that safe word is so true.

And that, that getting out of stunned, I mean, sometimes, just like the spell, some people can come in and say, snap out of it, right? And in, you know, in a positive way, in a helpful way. So. I'm now giggling because I like that you come in and snap and I come in and bitch slap. And that says a lot about the types of human beings we are. Yeah, well, I like this. I like this, Alison. I will try to do better about just being, being aware and being like, Hey, guess what? And I, I'm stunned.

I have the stunned condition. I'm incapacitated. Don't try and push through. Let your party come rescue you. Or your foes kill you. Yeah, you don't want to die from ADHD. You don't want, don't want RSD to kill you. This wasn't going to be the death saving throw episode, Matt. That's later in the season. Oh God. With that, I'm going to, you know, come up with my safe word the rest of the day. Yeah, let's come up with our save word. Let's go have a good meeting.

This was a good, good, good episode three. Thanks for, thanks for bringing us a great topic and your full honesty about like what you were going through and experiencing. You know people, yeah, it's, it's people say over and over that they. Uh, even if we, even if we get embarrassed talking about these things ourselves, for We do. um, they're still glad that we're talking about them, so, go on out there. It actually takes a long time, at least in Chicago. Go on out there, if you're of age.

Don't worry about it before, but if you're of age, go ahead and book that colonoscopy. Treat Treat yourself. Yep. You know. And, uh, and if you have a reaction to the anesthesia the way I did, give me a, give me a, me a, uh, give me a call. Give me a note. Give me a text. I'll, I'll help you through it, because I've been there. Yeah. The Price is Right got "don't forget to spay or neuter is the platform of ADHd20 "don't forget to schedule your colonoscopy? I think so. I think we found it.

Yeah. Yeah. Take care of yourself. Take care everybody. Pew pew!