This week Jeff and Dave continue their look at Carl Richard's 2009 masterpiece on Classics in America. As Richard surveys the antebellum landscape, there are some surprises in store. For example, devotion to the Classics, to the expanding literary reign of 'Tully' was not limited to the eastern elite along the seaboard. Even in the hinterlands, rustic frontier types were clutching copies of Cicero's Catilinarians. And, with the war for Greek independence raging abroad, Lord Byron and others fost...
Jul 23, 2024•1 hr 10 min•Ep. 160
This week we salute American independence with a dive into Carl Richards’ fascinating tome The Golden Age of the Classics in America (2009). The guys begin with a look at the state of Classical education during the antebellum era, frontloading the discussion with questions as to why Classical education was the default at this time: did Americans believe such an approach produced virtuous and clear-thinking citizens? Was it that Greece and Rome provided a gold standard after which America should ...
Jul 04, 2024•1 hr 12 min•Ep. 159
This week the guys wrap up the second portion of Marrou's chapter on the ancient ephebia, that system of education for youth ages 14-21 that was popularized by the city of Athens and which spread to more than 100 cities around the Mediterranean during the Hellenistic era. What were the features of this system, and how did they vary from polis to polis? What happened when the generosity of local benefactors, euergetes, couldn't be tapped anymore for resources? How did public funding come into pla...
Jun 25, 2024•1 hr 10 min•Ep. 158
This week the guys are back into Marrou and off into the history of education during the Hellenistic Era. Contrary to what one might think, following the transformation of the world after the conquests of Alexander, the world of education did not become centralized and governed from on high by the potentates of succeeding dynasties. In fact there was eclectic mix (as does befit this time period) of things happening--certainly a recognition that the State did have an interest in fostering educati...
Jun 13, 2024•1 hr 26 min•Ep. 157
Dave and Jeff are off to Abonoteichus this week to wrap up Lucian of Samosata's crazy account of Alexander the False Prophet. If you like crazy, you're going to love this episode. It has a bit of everything: Big Sid the Standale Terror, Jeff's dad sporting with fugitive serpents, the origin of mustard, food trucks, snakes in a can, and so much more. And, oh yeah, Classics. As the Second Sophisitic (c. 60-230 A.D.) got into full swing, Lucian emerged as the most successful satirist, detaling the ...
Jun 06, 2024•1 hr 14 min•Ep. 156
This week Jeff and Dave take a break from the Marrou series to talk about 2nd century A.D. satirist Lucian of Samosata. Born in the further reaches of Asia Minor, Lucian made a name for himself as a Greek stylist by making fun of the rich and powerful, including the gods. Many claim him as the inventor of the science fiction genre because of his most famous work, A True Story. This fantastic voyage seems to anticipate Jules Verne and H.G. Wells by almost 2000 years! But the subject of this episo...
May 28, 2024•1 hr 5 min•Ep. 155
This week Jeff and Dave continue on with Marrou's clues, finishing up the last portion of Chapter VII, Part I, Isocrates, and taking on all of Chapter I, Part II, "The Civilization of the Paideia". For Isocrates, the comparison to Plato continues, particularly with respect to the question of the teaching and inculcation of virtue. Is it possible, and if so, how is it done? Don't miss Marrou's thought-provoking concluding remarks on the relationship between P and I, how they "enriched the classic...
May 21, 2024•1 hr 19 min•Ep. 154
Isocrates, Yousocrates, Hesocrates? This week Jeff and Dave are back at it with the work of H. I. Marrou and education in antiquity. Here they tackle the last bit of Part I of the book, Chapter VII, and the groundbreaking "humanist" Isocrates. Born in 436, he spent the first part of his career as a "hired gun" speech-writer, before developing an influential -- and profitable -- school for rhetoric. But if you have never heard of this guy, no wonder. He has spent the last two millennia trying to ...
May 07, 2024•1 hr 6 min•Ep. 153
This week Jeff and Dave welcome into the studio Classicist extraordinaire and all around good guy Dr. Kirk Summers. We should probably also mention that Kirk is a Prof. of Classics at the University of Alabama in Birmingham, former co-owner of the Red Cat Coffee Houses in the same city, and one of the world's leading experts in Theodore Beza. And he still finds time to root for the Alabama Crimson Tide. Kirk drops by to talk about one of his earliest works on Beza, A View from the Palatine. Firs...
Apr 29, 2024•1 hr 14 min•Ep. 152
Herein Dave and Jeff resume their tour through Henri-Irénée Marrou's ground-breaking volume on ancient education. We wrap up Chapter VI, "The Masters of the Classical Tradition", and see what Plato thought about mathematics, elementary education, gymnastics, plastic-segmented jumpropes, playing the triangle and blocks in Kindergarten, and more. How was Plato's Academy organized? Was it a rigorous shool for political science, a training ground for the abstruse, esoteric, and recondite? Or did it ...
Apr 02, 2024•1 hr 3 min•Ep. 151
This week tune in as the guys interview one of the greatest and most prolific translators of this and the previous century—Dr. Stanley Lombardo. In this conversation we hear about Stanley’s early education where he was, yes, drawn to Greek and Latin but especially the rhythms and performance of poetry. The idea that these ancient works were meant to be performed and heard (not read silently) has always been at the center of his attempts to make these texts sing and become something new. So how d...
Mar 26, 2024•1 hr 2 min•Ep. 150
This week the guys welcome back good friend, former colleague, and two-time Newberry Medal honoree, young-adult writer Gary Schmidt. How did Jeff and Dave manage that? Well we invited him in, and just like that he accepted our invitation. He found the studio comfortable, or at least okay for now, but the conversation was more than a little bit super. We focused on his 2023 novel The Labors of Hercules Beal, a rip-roaring adaptation of the strongman's 12 tasks, with cats, coyotes, a katabasis, a ...
Mar 19, 2024•1 hr 10 min•Ep. 149
This week, Jeff and Dave resume their woolly perambulations through the wonders of Henri-Irénée Marrou's august volume on ancient education. Specifically, we look at Chapter VI, entitled "The Masters of the Classical Tradition" to get our bearings on Plato's pedagogical revolution. Along the way, we ask, and seek to answer, such questions as: What is the Socratic method? What is the relationship between σοφία and practical efficiency? How many students did Plato have that pursued, and acquired, ...
Feb 27, 2024•1 hr 6 min•Ep. 148
This week the guys are joined in the Bunker (via Zoom) by scholars Anne Larsen (emerita, French, Hope College) and Stephen Maiullo (Classics, Hope College) for a fascinating discussion of the “Minerva of Utrecht” and "Tenth Muse", Anna Maria van Schurman (1607-1678). Van Schurman was not only an accomplished painter, engraver, and calligraphist, she was also a phenomenally gifted linguist and classical scholar at a time when such was virtually unheard of among women. Tune in to hear about the ch...
Feb 20, 2024•1 hr 16 min•Ep. 147
This week Dave and Jeff welcome back into the studio (this guy's becoming a regular!) our longtime friend, mentor, former colleague, and teacher, the inestimable Ken Bratt. You may know him from such episodes as "From there We Travelled to Philippi" (46), and, "A Visit to the Roman Catacombs" (76). For this go 'round, Ken reaches back into the more distant, misty past, as he talks a little about why he chose Herodotus for his doctoral dissertation at Princeton. Using a 1968 article by J.A.S. Eva...
Feb 13, 2024•1 hr 10 min•Ep. 146
In the beginning was the…conversation? In this episode Jeff and Dave tackle a fascinating 1977 article by Marjorie O’Rourke Boyle in which she reviews the history of the translation of John 1:1, particularly the Latin words used to express the Greek ὁ λόγος (logos), usually taken in English as “Word”. We learn that the earliest Latin translations used the word sermo (“conversation”), which seems to have a broader range of meanings and referents (connotation vs. denotation) than the verbum Jerome...
Feb 07, 2024•1 hr 18 min•Ep. 145
This week, Jeff and Dave continue on their stroll through the wonders of Marrou's volume on ancient education. Specifically, they look at Chapter V and the question of the Sophists. Men like Protagoras, Gorgias, and Prodicus were doing something new and unusual at the close of the fifth century, no doubt. And that something was -- wait for it -- selling education! Many arch-conservatives like Plato and Aristophanes did not take to it kindly. But is there any way to sort the wheat from the chaff?...
Jan 27, 2024•1 hr 5 min•Ep. 144
This week the guys have the honor of interviewing kids/young adult author Caroline Lawrence (The Roman Mysteries and Roman Quests series, along with many others!) Ms. Lawrence is beaming in to us from London, where she writes her books overlooking the mighty Thames itself. And she's no pretender when it comes to the Classics--she comes to London by way of Classics degrees from Berkeley and Cambridge. Tune in to hear about her own fascinating journey from enthusiast to author, about how she shape...
Jan 09, 2024•1 hr 27 min•Ep. 143
This week the guys tackle Chapter IV of H.I. Marrou's monumental work, entitled "The 'Old' Athenian Education". Relying on Aristophanes, Thucydides, Solon, and others, Marrou explains how the Athenians decided to lay down their weapons within society, and soon after education was democratized. So, “the decisive step" was taken from a warrior to a scribe culture, and education was no longer exclusively military. There was a predictable reaction from conservative elites: they sprinted to their For...
Dec 21, 2023•1 hr 8 min•Ep. 142
This week the guys tackle the subject of American Urban Legends with an eye to what classical cultural and narrative archetypes tell us about why these weirdo tales can be so, well, weird. Jeff eagerly (a little too eagerly, Dave might say) drags us into those liminal spaces as we recount the odd tale of the hatchet-wielding, murderous Bunnyman of Clifton, Virginia who creepily lies in wait at the train trestle known as Bunnyman Bridge. All kinds of questions to tackle here: Why do so many urban...
Dec 07, 2023•1 hr 3 min•Ep. 141
This episode is part 3 of the guys’ walk-through of Marrou’s seminal book on education in antiquity. We pick up where the last episode left off with a wrap-up of ancient Spartan education and a look at several questions: What caused Spartan artistic culture to (fairly quickly) calcify and disappear? To what degree can we actually know what Spartan education was, given that so much of our information is filtered through the so-called “Spartan Mirage” loved by Athenian aristocrats? Then we turn ou...
Nov 17, 2023•1 hr 3 min•Ep. 140
The guys are back for Round 2 in our look at the history of education in antiquity through the lens of Marrou’s book. This time we zero in on the ancient Spartans. Wait, Spartans??? Weren’t those guys just a bunch of beefed-up lunkheads whose only education was how to better kill the enemy on the battlefield? Well, not quite. In fact, we learn that the Spartans actually led the way when it came to a number of arts—poetry, music, dance—in addition to their noted emphasis on physical fitness. They...
Nov 07, 2023•1 hr 7 min•Ep. 139
Join us this week as Dave and Jeff launch le paquebot onto the deep waters of pedagogical history, namely, H. I. Marrou's seminal work The History of Education in Antiquity. Written in 1956 by a very learned Frenchman, and translated into English by Charles Lamb, the work is a sweeping review, artfully written, of how education functioned from the very beginnings of Western civilization down to the end of antiquity in the fifth century A.D. With Marrou as guide, the guys begin to examine such pr...
Oct 27, 2023•1 hr 3 min•Ep. 138
This week Jeff and Dave wrap up their 3-parter on Aeschylus' famous play. When Io mooves onto the scene, her first impulse is to show compassion for the shackled Promy, even though she herself is writhing in gadfly-induced agony. Why? To seek an answer, we take a long look at the thesis of Stephen White, namely that the play subtly reinforces ancient Greek gender roles: women are to be complaisant and domestic (something Io has transgressed), while men's ingenuity ought not threaten the social o...
Oct 23, 2023•1 hr 6 min•Ep. 137
It's time for round two of Aeschylus' tragedy Prometheus Bound, and Dave and Jeff are back at it with a careful look at the role of Ocean in his dialogue with the titular hero. Relying on the work of David Konstan, the guys discuss some of the interesting dynamics at play in the stichomythia, as well as some inner workings of the chorus of Ocean's daughters, the Oceanids. Is there a political subtext of democracy and tyranny at work here? How does the poet deal with universal and timeless themes...
Oct 10, 2023•1 hr 3 min•Ep. 136
This week Jeff and Dave - with the help of Prof. Deborah Roberts (Emerita, Haverford College) - begin their look at tragedian Aeschylus' magnum opus, Prometheus Bound. We get started with Prof. Roberts providing a lovely reading of the central passage of the play, in which Prometheus explains the many kindnesses he has wrought for the human race. Then we follow up by setting the table with the briefest of looks at the development of tragedy. Next, we dig into the main course with a bit of Greek ...
Oct 03, 2023•1 hr 5 min•Ep. 135
It's time for Jeff and Dave to finish off their brief foray into all things Philistine and Mycenaean. This week we wrap up our look at Neal Bierling's short but deep monograph on the state of excavation in Palestine. After a quick review of inscriptional and ceramic evidence, the Phaistos Disc, anthropoid coffins, and more, the conversation takes us on to the different eras in Philistine history: Judges to David, David to Solomon, Solomon to Hezekiah, and finally to the eventual dissolution or a...
Sep 22, 2023•1 hr 12 min•Ep. 134
Does the name Neal Bierling mean anything to you, dear listener? No? Well it will after this episode. Bierling's 1992 monograph Giving Goliath his Due is our theme this week and next, and it's a thorough, exhaustively researched look at the close connection between the Mycenaeans of Atreus and Agamemnon and those inveterate opponents of the biblical Israelites known as the Philistines. In this first half, we look at the evidence of archaeology and epigraphy, including Egyptian steles and anthrop...
Sep 13, 2023•1 hr 5 min•Ep. 133
This week Jeff and Dave wrap up their two-part series on the Homeric Hymn to Demeter. Here we learn about Demophoon, infant child of Queen Metaneira of Eleusis. It seems he has a problem with mortality, and Demeter has the cure: nightly fire purgations. As the kids say, "srsly?" But things don't go so well when the blazing goddess of grain is caught in the act of burning off Demophoon's (not huggable but mortal) portions, and rather than wreak havoc on the innocent inhabitants of Eleusis, she de...
Sep 05, 2023•1 hr 14 min•Ep. 132
After a welcome hiatus for all of us (especially you, listener), Jeff and Dave are back in the studio for a look at the archaic hymn to the goddess Demeter. Was this intended to be used in the ritual and liturgy of the mystery cult, or is it just a breezy, Saturday afternoon matinee poem? Clocking in at 495 lines, how does this eypllion differ from the shorter poems from the seventh century? What is a mystery religion, how does this one compare to the cults of Mithras and Dionysus, and exactly h...
Aug 09, 2023•1 hr 2 min•Ep. 131
