288: [Dexter Zhuang] Coast Fire, Flexibility, and Financial Independence

>> Anthony Weaver: This episode is sponsored by the portfoliopath.com. >> Dexter Zhang: Of course, financial, uh, independence, uh, kind of came into that conversation because the way we view money is that it's a tool to help you achieve whatever kind of life goal that you have. For us, we care about that flexibility. But for other people, maybe it's a certain level of security that they want, or maybe they want to, um, be able to, you know, take on a certain

kind of career path. Um, so we see that, uh, for, for us, money is a tool to achieve flexibility, but for other families it may be, uh, or couples, it may be different.

>> Anthony Weaver: Welcome back, everybody, to another exciting show, the about that Water podcast, where we help the Sam's generation build strong financial habits so that you can spend your money, talk about money, and enjoy your money with conf. Today, I have somebody who's been doing this for quite some time and has achieved so many different things, but also he has achieved fire, which is financial independence and retire early. His name is Dexter Zhang. How you doing today, sir?

>> Dexter Zhang: Doing well. Thanks for welcoming me onto the show, Anthony. Uh, yeah, just a quick clarification. Is your Coast Fire? >> Anthony Weaver: Oh, coast fire. >> Dexter Zhang: Okay, definitely, uh, so one, one milestone, uh, on that journey. Uh, not quite at that, uh, that bigger milestone, but yeah, happy to share more.

>> Anthony Weaver: Awesome. And one of the cool things about, uh, this particular topic is that, um, it's something that everybody wants to achieve. And so my main question to you has your definition of success has evolved since you've achieved such a great financial milestone. >> Dexter Zhang: Great question, Anthony. Um, in the beginning, when I was starting out my career, I was in San Francisco. I was working in tech there.

I, um, didn't have a whole lot of money when I was starting out my professional, ah, journey. But I was very motivated and my main priorities at that point was really to learn the fundamentals of personal finance. Uh, so while I was growing my career then I could reinvest a high percentage of my earnings into investments. And I could also, you know, focus on growing my, um, my own skill set and grow my income

potential through my career. I think that that part was really my main focus throughout my 20s, now that I'm 33, and, um, a couple years ago, across this coast fire milestone. And that really helped me just be able to take a little bit of a step back, uh, to understand what did I really value in terms of my work and in terms of my lifestyle and how did I want to spend my time,

um, more and more importantly. So my journey has evolved a little bit past this milestone because it gave Me a bit more space and flexibility to ask those questions for myself and then answer those questions of, like, how do I want to spend my time? So, uh, that flexibility, uh, is probably the biggest change for me.

>> Anthony Weaver: Nice. And because, you know, you and your wife have been dealing with this for quite some time, um, how would those conversations happen? Like, when you decided, like, hey, I really want to start dealing and diving into this higher community? >> Dexter Zhang: Yeah, that's a good question. So when we first, uh, started dating, you know, six, uh, six years ago, I think personal finance came, uh, up.

But it wasn't until maybe like a few years into, uh, that the relationship that we started really talking about this, um, more deeply because we, you know, we're talking about, okay, should we open up, uh, joint bank accounts, shared accounts? >> Anthony Weaver: I know. >> Dexter Zhang: We started getting deeper into, uh, the rabbit hole for context as well. I'm American. My wife is Australian. Um, we met in Singapore. Uh, so our finances were also a little bit more

complicated. And when we start talking about it, then, uh, we had to go down the rabbit hole of, uh, really, uh, planning out what we wanted to do, uh, in terms of finances, uh, because there were more variables when you're bringing together, um, bank accounts from different countries, like investment accounts, uh, from different countries. Um, we started talking about that. And then, of course, financial, um, independence, uh, kind of came into

that conversation. Because the way we view money is that it's a tool to help you achieve whatever kind of life goal that you have. For us, we care about that flexibility. But for other people, maybe it's a, ah, certain level of security that they want, or maybe they want to, um, be able to, you know, take on a certain kind of career path. Uh, so we see that, uh, for. For us, money is a tool to achieve flexibility. But for other families, it may be, uh, or couples, it may be different.

>> Anthony Weaver: That makes sense because, you know, you had a discussion. You all had a discussion right before you guys decided to get married. What would that like? Like, how was that conversation leading up to. To the big day to say, like, hey, um, I. I would like to be with you, like, and. And like, I want to share my money with you. Uh, do you guys do, like, separate accounts or what was. What was those discussions like?

>> Dexter Zhang: For sure. I think, uh, the first step of this was we. We were in Singapore during COVID and that's when we started, um, you know, talking about, hey, maybe we should open up, like, a joint accounts for our shared expenses. Right. Uh, because we would buy groceries together. We would, you know, uh, spend on rents, uh, together. Right? And these things were all joint. And previous to that, we were using an application called Splitwise.

If uh, you're not already familiar with Splitwise, it's like a, uh, really simple mobile app for you to like, share expenses with your friends or with uh, your loved ones. And it requires you to log every expense. Right. So, uh, I think the where. Where push uh, came to shove moment was like we kind of got tired of having to log all the expenses in split wise. And you know, I'm a little bit embarrassed to say this, but I'm kind of like, uh, like, Like a tracker, right? So I'm like,

oh, can we just track everything in split wise? And she's like, it was like a $5, you know, thing, or it was like a two, three dollar coffee. Like, is that really needed? And then we had to like, agree on, okay, maybe like things below $10. You don't have to track it and split wise. But, you know, it just kind of

became a hassle. Whereas if we could, uh, create a joint account, then we could, ah, on a monthly basis, just transfer in a certain amount and then, um, and then spend from that joint account and not really think about it, uh, too much. Uh, so that. That was, I think one of the big kind of conversations that we had and then taking a step forward in terms of

sharing our finances. And then I think the next kind of big kind of conversations that we had leading up to that as well was like, okay, how do, how do we decide how much we're contributing, you know, to our joint account? And um, I'm sure this, you know, different for every. Every couple that you've, uh, spoken with. But in the beginning, we actually started off with splitting, um, it evenly, like half, half, half.

But this kind of became a issue. Like this was a mistake more on my part because we were making different levels of income and at that point in time I was making more than her. And so, uh, it felt like it wasn't a, um, kind of like a fair, uh, system for how we've decided to contribute to this joint account. So yeah, there were some, um, discussions there, heated discussions there. And eventually I realized, okay, we. We can't do this split thing. Um, this isn't working for us.

So, uh, we divided the um, like our contributions up based on our income level, right? Like our income divided by like the total household income. That became like our contribution to uh, the. The joint account. And that, uh, worked for us. Yeah. Of course, every couple decides to do it a little bit differently. For us, that worked out. We were happy with, um, that setup. >> Anthony Weaver: Okay, so I'll take it. You lost that argument. >> Dexter Zhang: Yeah. Uh, yeah. You

want to simplify it to that? That's totally cool. Yes. >> Anthony Weaver: Like, I'm sorry, babe. Uh, uh, yes. >> Dexter Zhang: Well, now I think it's a great idea. Now I think it's. Yeah, just a sm. It just makes sense. >> Anthony Weaver: Yeah. And you know, that's one of the things that we kind of leave out a lot. It's more than the

numbers that kind of drive everything. It's also like, how do we actually want to live with each other and if we want to bring somebody on into that journey?

Um, and so obviously she's dealing with her background and you're dealing with your background. Um, when it comes to finances, uh, how has your parents impacted your decision making for finances? >> Dexter Zhang: Oh, so I come from. I'm a second generation, um, immigrant to uh, the States. My parents, um, are from China originally. My dad initially, um, moved from, uh, Shanghai to Canada for graduate school with like $300 in his pocket.

So I think they came from a bit more of like the scrappy, underdog kind of immigrant, um, you know, journey. And because of that growing up, I think, um, you know, for better, for worse, they. They wanted to be frugal and they wanted to be very mindful about, uh, the spending and expensive side of things. And that's, uh, you know, kind of continued, I think in terms of how they, uh, they perceive money or their relationship with money.

Things have changed a little bit over time now that they're retired, they're, you know, going to resorts in Mexico and you know, spending on travel with friends. So they are definitely spending on what they're enjoying a whole lot more.

But I think in terms of, um, how that has evolved, their relationship with me is like, they obviously want the best for me and they care about, uh, how, uh, me and my wife, how we're thinking about personal finances and having a plan in place and um, making sure that, you know, um, we're going to be taken care of, uh, while we're going to be able to take care of ourselves.

Um, I think there are. Fortunately, you know, when it comes to the relationship with me and my parents, I, um, don't think there's a whole lot of expectation, um, necessarily around, you know, got to take care of their retirement or the, you know, there's not that expectation, uh, for sure. Would they appreciate me helping out? Yes, um, I'm sure they would. Uh, but I do feel, uh, fortunate in that, you know, they have explicitly at least, at least said, like, don't worry about us, uh, we got the

retirement covered. Uh, so far. Um, so that, that's, uh, been a conversation at least we've had. >> Anthony Weaver: And that's really good that you guys are having that open discussion, because when it comes to retirement, a lot of the times the parents are usually hesitant on even opening up about their finances. Um, how did you all, ah, got to that so comfortable talking about it. Like, uh, what, how did you even start that conversation?

>> Dexter Zhang: Well, to be candid, we haven't talked about like, you know, super detailed, uh, you know, they haven't shared like, their financial plan or, uh, or anything like that. But they did share kind of, um, how they're feeling about their finances, how they were feeling about their plan, um, where do they feel comfortable and where they don't. Uh, so I think it was a evolution. When I first started out working and kind of taking care of my own career growth and finances.

My parents started sharing a little bit more about their own journey and their progress in personal finances and how they've

thought about it. Uh, but it probably wasn't until more recently, you know, now that my wife and I are married and now that my parents are retired, that we're both kind of like in a stage of life where, um, they're more openly sharing, you know, m, what, what they're planning for in the future because they understand, like, we're trying to make our plans as well, and they don't want to feel like they're in the way of any of those plants. >> Anthony Weaver: Nice. Okay.

>> Dexter Zhang: Yeah. So I think that's probably the main trigger. Um, uh, more and more. Yeah, they, they, they want us to feel like we have our own level of independence and ability to take, um, control of our life decisions. >> Anthony Weaver: That makes sense because you're focusing on others, helping them out with their money path. And I'm always curious how it is when it comes to family and one of those things. Family members always look at you like, okay, well, here you

go talking about money again. Like, can we talk about something

else? Like, so, uh, uh, so what are the biggest misconceptions that people have about aligning their finances with their values? >> Dexter Zhang: Oh, um, biggest misconceptions for me, um, I, I, I would say that a lot of people that I see when they want to talk about money, it's really a, um, more black and white kind of kind of measure. Right? It's like, oh, you have either a lot of money or you don't. And that's Kind of the perception of talking about money and personal

finances. But um, I think what's really underrated is the self awareness of what you value. Right. And ultimately whatever you spend on is just a reflection of whatever you value. But reflecting on your values takes a lot of work. It actually takes some time, takes some effort. Maybe that looks like doing some reflection. Maybe that looks like trying out different career paths. It's different for everyone.

But I think that exercise of continuing to iterate, like your own understanding of your values is kind of like this foundational piece that then you can put um, like whatever kind of personal finance lesson on top of that. Kind of like a building block. Um, and money is that lens. Right. That your, your values really looks through. >> Anthony Weaver: Nice.

>> Dexter Zhang: Okay. >> Anthony Weaver: That's a good way of doing it and I appreciate you sharing that because you know, some of our money values actually come from when we're children. And I'm glad that you were able to open up about your upbringing during that process. Um, so you ultimately come up with this cool product called like Money Abroad. What is it? >> Dexter Zhang: Definitely Money Abroad started off as a money newsletter

for expats or people living abroad. And that was a reflection of my own personal um, experiences. Uh, moving from the US to uh, Singapore after. Yeah, pretty pretty much like most of my adult life. Um, up to that point I was, I was 20. 28. Yeah, 28 or so. Uh, when I made that move. And what that's really showed me was like oh, wow, money kind of gets complicated when you're overseas. And that's how I initially

started that newsletter. But over time it has evolved, uh, a little bit, has attracted people who are also non, non ah, expats. But they're excited about uh, carving out a, um, way to live on their own terms. Tends to be people who are maybe you know, seven to 15 years of um, experience into their careers and they're trying

to figure out, okay, what next? Um, after the point of maybe you're thinking about starting a family or maybe you're realizing that you're not um, interested in walking the same career path for too much longer, then it's like okay, what next can you do? Um, and that's why I talk about Coast Fire as one of these topics, uh, and talk about portfolio careers and kind of introduce different alternatives, uh, for people in the newsletter that makes sense.

>> Anthony Weaver: Especially what's going on today. And as a recent event, a lot of people are looking to become expats.

What is the, I guess you could say what are the, the main steps that somebody can do right now to kind of prepare themselves if they thinking about going abroad or living abroad. >> Dexter Zhang: Totally. I think the biggest blocker for a lot of people is understanding. Um, you know, if. If you're just an individual at this point, uh, then you just got to think about your own career path. And then you got to figure out, like, okay, how does your career path translates to

something overseas? Right. And then if you have another, uh, if you have a partner, then, uh, that means also translating, like, what they're doing career wise into something overseas. And finding kind of the intersection of that can be a little bit, uh, can be a little bit tricky if you have, uh, specific kind of career goals. However, if you're more flexible or if you're fortunate and there's like, certain cities that just like, really map really well with what you're trying to do, then

that can work out, like, that can be feasible. An example of this would be for, uh, me. I'm in Mexico City now, but before we were in Singapore, and, uh, that was a great intersection of. My wife is Australian. A lot of Australians moved to Singapore for career opportunities. Anyways, thanks. Um, so that was a, you know, good next step for, for her. And then for me, I was interested in living in Southeast, uh,

Asia. And there were, you know, uh, in terms of my industry, there were a lot of opportunities in terms of the tech industry at the time, um, in Singapore. So there was that kind of happy intersection for us that happened there. Uh, for others, it might be, uh, different. I think I saw you had, uh, Stephanie on your podcast.

Yeah, yeah. Um, we met at fincon as well, and Stephanie's a great example of, you know, um, the Portugal expat community and, you know, lifestyle in Portugal kind of being a match for what her and husband, um, were looking for. >> Anthony Weaver: Nice. Because, I mean, we try to figure out, like, how do we actually make money? You know, when you're. >> Dexter Zhang: Exactly. >> Anthony Weaver: And exactly. Do you teach somebody, um, English or

usually. That's usually the one that everybody go to. And I'm like, okay, do something. >> Dexter Zhang: Oh, no, no, no, no, no. Yeah, that's. That tends to be like a recent college grad, maybe 22 or something. Great, great, great. You know, starting point for a lot of people. Um, definitely not knocking English teachers, uh, you know, in South Korea or something. I think it's really cool. Um, but, yeah,

probably not, like, if you're. If you have a family, if you're, you know, in your 30s or, uh, 40s, looking to make a transition. So definitely, you know, figuring out how you're going to make money like the career path, seeing if your career path can continue to extend overseas. I think it's quite important. Um, and if you can take a look at your particular industry and see like are there any cities where your industry is pretty prominent then you might find some m. Happy

overlaps. So I know for example in terms of um, you know the tech industry, because I've been in this industry for a decade, is that there's several global cities um, that now have uh, thriving kind of tech ecosystems and they want to invest further into it. So places like uh, London, um, is one example that is I've known several um, people working in the tech industries either as professionals or as founders moving there in Asia. Of course Singapore is uh, an example of that. Ah so those

are some um, potential examples. Um Mexico City as well there are um, as a hub for Latin America it's becoming more um, attractive for tech, uh, companies kind of like base their operations there, uh, uh, for the Spanish speaking part of Latin America. So those are some examples of how uh, when you take a look at your industry you might find like a few cities that are quite good for your industry and then um, you can maybe visit, you know, talk to some people, get a sense on

the ground as well. So for example when um, my wife and I were considering moving to Singapore, I had already visited before and then I spent some time networking like I did a couple trips in addition just to network and meet people, uh, working in an industry that I want to work in.

And uh, I learned a lot from those conversations because the reality is like most of the time the information you see on the Internet is like totally out of date or it's just not always like an accurate reflection of what's happening um, on the ground. So uh, actually going, meeting people, having conversations, um, or if you can't visit, you know, having at least doing outreach to uh, to potential ah, people are kind of in a similar role in your target

city. Or maybe a super connector, like someone who is really um, like ah, like a community manager or a community leader. Right. Um, in, in that city. I think it's a great person to, to connect with and that can, that can be helpful to get some feedback on um, how is like the job market doing. What are the opportunities for someone like with a, with a background like me? Those kind of questions.

>> Anthony Weaver: Yeah, and you've been doing, I say yes, traveling is awesome but also you gotta get a means to, to why you want to travel, um, but also in your journey you've done so much in tech. Where do you see the tech industry when it comes to financial tech that's going to help out the people, the everyday person that's really pinching pennies right now. >> Dexter Zhang: Definitely. So I think on one hand, uh, you know, you're seeing obviously like more

uh, technologies. Uh, technology is always changing. Right. And because of that the tools that we have are always changing. Uh, personal finance is one kind of area where those tools, uh, change really rapidly. They're getting so much easier to use from a consumer standpoint. I think in terms of managing finances, 15 years ago, 10 plus years ago, I think all I can really think of using at that point in time was mint. But now there's like,

you know, so, so many different options. Right. So it's I think a great time for consumers of these tools. So a lot of these tools are pretty low costs as well. Uh, or like the, the cost of using these personal finance tools are also getting um, less and less. And, and it's not just the tools for managing finances. It's also the um, investment tools, the uh, funds for investments. Uh, so example this would be like Vanguard is continuing to reduce their,

their fees. I think they just announced they reduced their fees again, um, right. Over time. And I think that's something that anyone can take advantage of. Right. Uh, those, those um, reduced fee kind of opportunities for investments. >> Anthony Weaver: That's good. Um, because I, I just want people to know. Well, I want the person that's listening right now to know that you do have what it takes. I mean it's right there at your fingertips. Just gotta press the button.

>> Dexter Zhang: Exactly, exactly. So the tool, the tools are there, uh, the, you know, investments are there with low fees are there. And yeah, it's really, it's really um, up to you to you know, do, do some light research on like what, what it is, you know, fits your particular goals. But they're definitely accessible, um, at this point in time. >> Anthony Weaver: Yeah.

So this is about you though. Like what areas of focus that you feel needs the most improvement for yourself? >> Dexter Zhang: Oh, good. Uh, question. So I think in terms of, um, in terms of, you know, life stage, my wife and I are kind of at the stage where, you know, we don't have kids yet. We haven't really thought of, uh, you know, plan too far ahead, of course, but we do want to like, be financially

prepared. Uh. Right. Like if and when we do have kids, uh, then don't want to be totally like blindsided by all that. And then I think the other thing. Exactly. Uh, and then I think the other thing is just figuring out like, you know, because she's Australian, I'm American, we're living in Mexico City. The question we always get is like, where are you going to end up? You know, where you were going to, uh, put roots? Like that kind of question. And. Well, I think it's a very

valid question. Uh, because of our background, I think we're a bit more flexible in terms of, in terms of location and um, in terms of the lifestyle that comes with that. Uh, but I think that is something we want uh, to figure out at least on a year by year, like a shorter time frame kind of horizon. Maybe let's say next two to three years. Okay. Like this, this kind of chunk of time. Um,

whereas some people want to plan out much longer. It's like, okay, next, like 20 years, like we want to be here. Right. Um, so those areas, the family planning and also planning, um, out, okay, location wise, where, where do we want to like, uh, let's say, uh, open up accounts or figure out our cost of living? Like those, those kind of questions are impacted by where we're going to be for the next two or three years. >> Anthony Weaver: That makes sense.

So that brings up the question then, how are you feeling about renting versus owning? >> Dexter Zhang: Great question. So I'm going to be own bias because my life has been overseas and definitely been shaped by the desire for flexibility and mobility. So while I think earlier in my career I was interested in potentially uh, buying at, at that stage, especially I think in the middle 2000 and tens, it seemed to make a lot of sense or I had a lot of peers, like friends, colleagues

signing to buy at that um, point in time. Uh, but for me I realized, okay, well, if I'm gonna try this moving abroad thing, which, you know, first started off as a travel sabbatical and then move and then actually moving overseas after I realized like, oh, this is actually kind of nice, I, I like this. Then I discovered, well, it might

not be totally worth it, right. From a financial perspective and from a lifestyle perspective if I'm not living in that home, so I'm not really using it and I have to rent it out. Um, but then I have to also consider the operational pieces of it putting uh, the sweat of figuring out what happens when things go wrong, who's going to deal with it, how to get a property manager in that area, that kind of thing. So um, long story short, I am,

I, I prefer renting. And the main, yeah, the main thing for me and my wife is that ah, ah, Flexibility. So Kenley, I mean, my wife also has, ah, um, uh, property in Australia. But even still, uh, that was like, from before we got married. And um, I don't think we're totally tied to the idea of like, keeping it for forever or anything like that. >> Anthony Weaver: Hey, I mean, this is why it's the features. I like having this open discussion because a lot of people are

at that point now. It's like, hey, we have our foundation nice and solid. So what now? And you're a perfect example of like, hey, we don't know what's going to happen next, but at least within the next two years there'll be something. >> Dexter Zhang: Exactly, exactly. We, yeah, we, we do consider that, that downside risk. And what we want to avoid is a situation where, let's say, oh, we have to move because, uh, our, our parents are, you know, not

feeling well. That that's a real possibility. Um, well, they're healthy now, of course, but, you know, just, just in case. And in that scenario, then if we had a property that we had purchased and we had the mortgage and the loan payments, um, that would probably restrict our mobility and restrict our flexibility. Unless if we like, rent it out. But then we have to then go through the whole process of, um, getting property manager, like, figuring out the operational, operational, uh, uh, side of

it. So that's what we wanted to avoid and give ourselves a bit more breathing room. >> Anthony Weaver: Yeah. And considering you're selling your 30s, which is a great way to kind of like you starting to slow down a little bit from when in your 20s, you were just all over the place. Uh, and it's a good way to do

it. I mean, I wouldn't mind if. I would say I'm not sure how this show will evolve, but if the show was still here in 10 years, I would love to actually have you back on and be like, you know, we did wind up doing all the things. >> Dexter Zhang: I love that. Yeah, that would be fantastic. And I don't know if you've done this for, uh, previous, uh, podcast guests, but I think that's a great idea just

to, uh, show like, hey, we talked about these topics. Let's take a look, you know, few years later, what actually happens in their life? >> Anthony Weaver: Well, I can tell you a lot of the people that I interviewed during my first season, they no longer have that business. And I can't even find them on social. So they, uh, dismantled. So it's very few of them has continued on. And my podcast is only coming up on five years. So it's wow to See, that's really interesting.

Yeah. And I try to send them emails but it's good like you know, that uh, the 404 error. And I'm like, I at least wanted to at least come back on to at least say what happened. >> Dexter Zhang: But ah, that would be a really great episode if you do manage to get them back on. Maybe we'll see them at fincon and I, I can help. >> Anthony Weaver: Maybe. >> Dexter Zhang: Yeah.

>> Anthony Weaver: Um, so is there anything that you want to leave the audience with before we dive into the final four questions? >> Dexter Zhang: I m. Think uh, just to summarize what we had uh, talked about a little bit earlier, I want to emphasize that it really helped, uh, me and my wife did the exercise to figure out, you know, what we viewed as our top values. And fortunately a lot of them were aligned, uh,

which is great. And that really helped us get clarity on how do we, how do we approach like work more intentionally, how do we approach money, uh, more intentionally, uh, and prioritize, you know, how, how we want to save and invest, uh, for, for different things. An example of this is like so when my wife and I got married, we had a couple smaller banquets in uh, Singapore, in Sydney and in Shanghai with our family members and some extended family and um, you know, a few friends here,

here and there. But we didn't do like a really, really big wedding because uh, neither of us really prioritized that as like, oh, we really, really want to have like a huge wedding celebration. I mean in the future we would like to maybe do like a uh, do like an anniversary party with a group of friends and that would be really fun. Um, but instead what we did with, you know, what we would have spent on a wedding, we put it put away for a

honeymoon. So later, you know, we'll take a really nice honeymoon to do like a safari in Tanzania and like go to Hawaii and like that. That doesn't really put any pressure on us financially because we already had allocated that, um, and we're pretty excited for it and looking forward to making that happen. But that required us to make some trade offs right in terms of um, what it is we wanted. And that started with the values.

>> Anthony Weaver: That is awesome that you guys were on the same page with that and hopefully that uh, the person that's listening is really taking note on. Hey, it doesn't have to be done all at once. You can have everything but just not at the same time. You'll get it. >> Dexter Zhang: Exactly, exactly. Well said. Yeah, we can do a party, maybe not, you know, for the wedding itself, but Maybe in, like, a few years, do an anniversary party, Something like that.

>> Anthony Weaver: Yeah. Well, you ready for the final four questions? >> Dexter Zhang: Yeah, let's do it, Anthony. Let it rip. >> Anthony Weaver: All right, next. They're ready.

So, number one, um, what does wealth mean to you? >> Dexter Zhang: Wealth? For me? Yeah. It used to traditionally mean, like, just having tons of money, but now, uh, the older I get and maybe, you know, 10 years later when, uh, we revisit this, it'll sound different. Is that in my 30s, it really is about flexibility. It's. It's about giving me some control over my time and, uh, flexibility and not having to worry, uh, too much about, uh, about how I'm spending money.

>> Anthony Weaver: Perfect. Number two, what was your worst money mistake? >> Dexter Zhang: For me, you know, I started investing when I think I was 18, and I just got into college, and I opened up a brokerage at E Trade, and I just picked a couple stocks and, you know, started started, um, investing that way. And then it wasn't until, like, maybe a couple years later, I learned about index funds. And I was like, oh, this is a much smarter way, uh, to. To do this. And I thought that

afterwards I kind of figured it out. I was like, oh, well, I just invest in boring index funds. And that's, like, pretty simple. But what I didn't expect is how, uh, emotional investing is. And inevitably, you know, over the past, uh, like 12 years or so since then, I've still, like, felt the. Felt the attraction of, like, oh, maybe it's, like, speculating on, um, certain stocks. Or maybe. Maybe it's like, oh, crypto bull run. >> Anthony Weaver: Why.

>> Dexter Zhang: Why are all my friends talking about it? Maybe. Maybe I should, like, you know, put more than I should into. Into some of that. Um, so I think speculation is still the worst money mistake, but it's also one that I realized, like, it can keep hap. Like, it can keep coming up in different forms or shapes. >> Anthony Weaver: That is awesome. Uh, that you look. You do

a lot of reflection on yourself. It seems like you do almost like an annual, at least a monthly reflection on yourself just based on your response. Wish I had that intuition when I was your age. Number, uh, three. Is there a book that inspired your journey or changed your perspective? >> Dexter Zhang: All right, so the book that, um, really inspired my, uh, expat journey and how I thought about personal finances, uh, as

an expat is one called Millionaire Expat. It's by Andrew Halen, and he built a million dollar plus investment portfolio even as a school teacher overseas. So I thought that was really cool. Um, and I liked his personal Journey of how he learned about investing by investing on the side and how he also talks a lot about, like, as an American, when you're overseas, there's like, certain tax implications or a lot of questions that come up. It's like, how do I invest

while overseas? Should I use my home brokerage? Should I use a brokerage in, uh, this new country? And all those nitty gritty questions he dives into. So if you're someone who is looking to, uh, move overseas or kind of wants to learn more about what investing is like when, uh, when that's your life situation, then Millionaire Expat is a potentially good book for you. >> Anthony Weaver: Awesome. Number four, what is your favorite dish to make?

>> Dexter Zhang: Uh, recently my wife and I bought a instant pot. That's like a nine. Nine in one instant pot. The ninja. Uh, you're nodding your head. Maybe you know it, but air fryer in it. Okay. Air fryer. Uh, saute. It's got everything. Anyways, uh, one of our, yeah, favorite things to make, uh, with it is, uh, a chili. It's like a 20, 20 minute chili. You know, you just throw in, um, you know, all the, uh, all the minced meat.

Uh, you know, we use beef here, and then you can saute it in the same pot that you later. Then, uh, use the pressure cooker to, uh, make the chili all in 20 minutes. And I, I feel like it's. It's just the best because you can do it on Sunday night, and then you get pretty much your meals for the rest of the week. >> Anthony Weaver: That's amazing. All right. I might have to, um. I had to try that out one day. >> Dexter Zhang: Yeah, thanks for saying it.

>> Anthony Weaver: Uh, so this is the last question of the show, which is where could people find out more about you? >> Dexter Zhang: Absolutely. You can go to moneyabroad, uh, co, and there you can, uh, find all my contact information and, uh, more information about what I'm working on. >> Anthony Weaver: Right. Thank you so much, Dexter, for all of your information, all of your personal stories. I know we didn't dive into all the businesses and

everything like that. Y'all can go to the other platforms that he's been on to talk about that fun stuff, but we are here to learn more about the man behind all of the cool things that you've been doing. Um, and I just want to congratulate you on all of the things that you've been doing, uh, especially when it comes to helping people out with personal finance. And as you heard,

everybody, like, you have what it takes. You just got to really take time out to do your research and really understand what it is that you want out of life so that you can align your finances for it. So I wish you all the best if you need to. If you didn't get anything out of this one, but you think somebody else would listen to this, definitely slide it on over to, um, them, because they could actually help them out as well. So thank you so much. Y'all have a great day. We out.