It's nine o one with Jenny Garth and Tory spelling. Okay, you guys, this has been a big one. We had Peppergate, and Michael Lang, the director, is here today to talk to us about what really happened.
He's going to set the record straight.
That's right.
Hey, Michael Lang, Hey, Hey.
How's how come I'm the only one that looks older?
You really don't you look the same.
This was all dark when you last.
Saw me, all your beard hairs, your beard hairs.
And there was more of this.
Oh boy, you really don't look older. Like to think that it was thirty years ago. My gosh, well not the last time we saw you, because we saw you the season ten.
Right, but.
Oh my goodness, where do we start?
Oh god, should.
We start with our email exchange?
Let's just start with that.
Okay. So obviously our fans know that we had an incident that we now have called Peppergate where we talked to a guest star and he from you know, gave his perception of how what it was like being on set. It started with a story of Shannon coming in with a Boa constrictor is that right, Jen, yep? Around her neck, around her neck, which you don't remember.
A constrictor at all on set? No, was it a constrictor?
No?
Maybe it was a python constrictor on your neck? You I would kill you, It.
Would definitely kill you. Maybe not Hannon, though it might kill the bullet constrictor.
Oh man, Yeah, so okay, go on, there was a deadly bow.
Because Jen knows I usually have a pretty good memory about stuff, and as he started to tell this story, I even went, I don't remember that.
We didn't know that. Neither of us remember the snake.
Yeah, and that's a pretty major thing. So maybe we should have started there being like, hmm, things are a little off. Then it obviously we went into talking about he and I. He was the ski instructor and we had a romantic scene in front of the fireplace, but I was still Donna was still in love with David, and he told a story that he uh that you told me that it was great. I should put the scene on my reel. And then when I left the set that you said, I don't know why she's on the show.
I don't mean to laugh. I looked at the scene this morning, because you know, directors, we like the prep. So I looked at the scene, and it hit me when I was looking at the scene. First of all, it was a nice scene. The fire was excellent, and I loved my first shot. I'm a genius, my first shot pulling back from the fire to that beautiful two shot of the two of you. And then the scene starts and I'm thinking, well, Tory, he's really good. She's good. And then I'm thinking, and he's met kind of mad.
I mean, he's very handsome, but kind of med. So I realized what it was. I have no analysis of the python thing that I can't figure out at all, but I know exactly what it was he was projecting because in his head he was thinking, why am I on the show? And after thirty years he somehow spun it in his head too that I said, why is she on the show? When what I probably what he really was hearing was why is he on the show?
Which actually dovetails with a story because I this is so funny that this came up, because there's a story I tell about the casting experience from our side of the of the room, and that's one of the stories I tell his casting session because.
You cast him right in your episode.
Okay, this is the this is it's amazing that this came up with this guy. So basically, Chuck Rosen was in on the casting session. He did not come to all of them, but I think because it was a scene with you, and it was, you know, a pretty important you know, not a huge amount of scenes that he had, but important that you had made the decision even though there was some kind of chemistry between you and the ski guy, but that your heart really belonged
to David. So it was an important scene, a pivotal decision on Donna's part. So Chuck wanted to be there to make sure that we cast the right guy. So we saw a bunch of guys and he comes in and he was very good, and so we finished and I didn't really have any notes for him, but Chuck says, can I is it okay if I give him a note? So I'm like, I mean, he's you know, Chuck was the exact producer, so what I thought it was nice for him to ask, So I said, yeah, of course.
So he says, and this is so funny because it's such a producer note as opposed to I mean, a director would never give a note like this. But the Chuck. He said it was really good. So he whatever he learned in his produce how to how to cast when you're a producer, give him a nice compliment first, that's the same in directing school. So he said, it was really good. But this guy, this guy is just a boot guy, and he's only ever going to be a boot guy. He's never going to be like an assistant
manager of the place. He's just going to always be the boot guy. And I got the feeling from you your performance that you were going to be more than a boot guy. But that's not what I'm looking for it. I'm looking for just the boot guy. And in my mind, I'm thinking, I kind of get what he's saying, But how is an actor supposed to assimilate that note? I mean, it takes a lot. There's a lot to unpack there, and it's not just about the boots in the in
the box. But so that's what he says, right, So to his credit, to Pepper's credit, he just nodded and oh, okay, I got it, and he did it again and it seemed dissatisfied Chuck, and he left and he got the part, obviously, So now we shoot the scene and the next day I got a call from Chuck. He says, you know what, Michael, I guess the guy just didn't really take my note to heart because he still felt like he was going to be more than a boot guy. Oh my god,
I'm like, oh God, bless him. You know, Chuck, he's, you know, such a great you know, such a great hearted guy.
All I ever wanted to be was just the boot guy guy.
And believe it or not, whenever I occasionally do you know, panels or whatever with actors and wanting to know about the audition process, I always tell that.
Story, just the boots man, just the boots. So what did that mean to him?
That meant like reel it back, or don't don't be so high on yourself, or don't feel like matter what was Yeah?
I think I think what Chuck meant was he he felt like he was a little too yeah, high engaged. He's just he's just fitting her for boots and that's it.
And then making out there.
And then making out with her. And I don't know where the boots came into the making out scene, but you know, producer notes, they're very strange. But anyway, so it's funny that thirty years later, this guy pops up and there's a big controversy now with me. And also I loved when he said because I listened to a bit of the podcast, you know, your podcast about with him saying and I love that he said. I was there saying, oh, baby, yeah, that's really great. That's really doll, Doll.
I'm thinking I don't think I ever would ever, That's not in my little package of tricks.
Just say hey, doll, just say it one time.
Right, Hey, hey, there you go. The only person I call doll is Patty Lapone, and I don't need It's not even doll with her, it's doll.
It's all, Oh my goodness. Well, I obviously got very reactive during that episode because you and I always had such a great relationship. To this day, whenever I think of our directors in our experience, you come to mind, it was just we we were friends. You were great at getting all of us, and we, I don't know,
we just felt our best we're with you. So during our email exchange, I felt bad because we did have a moment where you said you felt a little hurt that after all that relationship we had for ten years, that we immediately believed this guy, and I think it was just a re and I apologize for that because
I was very reactive. I was like, oh my gosh, and I thought about it and I was so upset and I told Jen I'm so upset afterwards, and then our producer Amy and I actually talked after that show, and she said, Okay, let's just talk it out for a second. Even if he thought that for a second, no one would be that stupid to say it out
loud in an open set about the boss's daughter. And I was like, who yeah, okay, take myself out of it and how I was feeling, You're right, so even if it was just that and you really thought I sucked. But and then Michael said, I said, my eighteen year old self is still like holding onto that, and was like, oh my god, maybe I sucked. And I was the
producer's daughter, so was it whole horrible? And Michael Lange told me to shut the tell my age yearl self to shut the fuck up, and I was like, you're right, yeah, that's right.
Well, I feel I feel better now that you guys have cleared that up.
Okay, I feel.
Better, Okay, I feel better too.
I do, because you didn't dis direct that episode. You directed thirty No. Twelve more episodes after that, exactly, exactly, over the span of season four, all the way to season.
Ten, exactly.
That's a long run for That.
Was one of my first ones.
I think season Yeah, Peppercaine, Yeah.
Yeah, because it was right, it was sort of I guess midway through season four, seventeen was it? Episode seventeen was in it? Yeah, whatever it was. And then the irony of it is, you know, as I said in my email to you or whatever the Instagram thing I said, you know, there were people who said that, who thought, not only thought, but said, you know, she only got
the job because she's the boss's daughter. And the irony of now I forgot his name, Pepper, the irony of Pepper's story is that I if I ever heard anyone say that, I would again go down their throat. And because you know, I thought you were fantastic in that part, I mean, you were, Donna. I don't I can't, you know, I can't imagine anyone doing that part better than you bringing that that person to.
Life, thank you.
That's why I got so pissed off when people would bring that up, and I said, I don't want to hear that around me. Don't ever say that to me.
But I get it, and we know that exists. And when people, you know, work with people that are their family, there's always going to be someone that says it. And it was something I always tried to excel at because I didn't want to ever just remain the boss's daughter. In fact, you know, like the first the pilot, there wasn't even a name. I was like Kelly's friend. It was like friend number one. And obviously I got that
because of my dad. Like we tell funny stories, but you know, but I worked really hard and and I'm proud of being Donna. So anyway, wait, so now that we cleared that up, we just want to we want you to tell fun stories about your time on the show with us.
Yeah, because when you came in, the show was already going well, Like it was already it was going, well, how was it coming in?
I was so excited to do the show because you know, it was a huge you know, it was culturally, you know, it was just a huge show. And it was in fact I used subsequently in my career, I would always use nine O two and zero, like when I did The OC. I did quite a few episodes of the OC, And when those actors would start kind of feeling themselves, I would say, well, I would, I would. I would say,
do you know? And then I would bring up one of the characters whose name I won't mention, and he and this other actor on Nosie would say no, and I would say, exactly, so he was on nine o two or maybe she or maybe it I'm not gonna say, or another was on nine and oh. And this was only like ten years ago, and Nino two and oh was a huge hit, Like thirty million people every week would watch the show, and these actors could go nowhere in the world without being mob by fans. And our
little show that oh see. You know, it's a it's a definitely popular show, but it's not even close to nine O two and oh. And you don't know who this person was who was on the show. So when you start feeling on your oats, just remember that dig in, be professional, do your job, and know that this is all fleeting, so don't feel so big about yourself. And that's it.
You always had a way of just like really speaking to the actors like they were your friends, like you're very a commonality between you and them, and I think that that is what always made you so liked by us, is that And we kind of let you in in a way that we probably didn't let other directors in.
Right. Well, you know, I try to be understanding of what goes on in actors' heads. I've done a little bit of acting myself, and it's always a crushing experience.
So I appre no, I mean, I so like. The other thing that would be would piss me off is when the crew would start complaining when an actor would say, you're in my eye line, and then the crew and I would shut them down to because I'm like, you know what, they have to create this world that excludes all of this equipment, lights, noises that come in, and they have to become a character that they're not and create this illusion for the audience and shut the fuck
up with the eyeline thing whatever they need make that happen. It's so hard you can't even imagine. And you bitch about this, just shut up and you know, pull focus, okay, whatever, you know. It's like it's you know, I know, I'm very protective of actors, not that they need my protection, but okay, they do.
Teddy Bear, Teddy Bear.
So basically here. So my thing about nine or two and zero, it's I loved the show. I loved everything about it. And one of the reasons is like, actually, I just drove by that street that we used to shoot on, yeah, Calvert, and whenever I drive by there, I always think of movie magic to the max, because that was a pretty gnarly area and here we are.
Do you ever think about the porn that was being filmed?
Okay, I do think about airport flying overhead every.
Pat exactly, and that's another thing that you guys had to figure out how to exclude that from your magical world that you're creating in front of the camera. So whenever I drive by it, I think this show embodies movie magic, the height of movie magic, because there we are across the street from a porn distributing company, driving through an area where we could just as soon get
drugs or shot on the way to work. And then then we go into this stage, which admittedly, if you look beyond the actual sets, was pretty crappy, and we're creating this magical world of Beverly Hills, super spoiled you know, elite, not elite, but you know, privileged humans, and that's the way we're creating. Then we walk outside of the real world to get it's like, oh.
It is pretty funny when you think about it.
So and the thing about it is the show. What I loved about the show, one of the just in the big general sense, was that it never pretended to be anything more than what it was. It was very grounded in terms of what the show was trying to accomplish, what the goal was. From a production point of view, and even from an esthetic and creative point of view. It was not pretentious, even though it was about potentially pretentious people. But the show itself was always here, we're
presenting this world to you. There it is, and either learn from it, not learn from it, enjoy it, whatever aspect that you get from watching a television show. It's yours for the taking. But we're not going to make any comment about it one way or the other, Whereas so many shows that I've worked on are just pretentious. I think we were so creating and we're so artsy fartsy,
and it's like, come on, it's a TV show. It's entertained I'm not saying it's bad to be artistic, but don't you know, that's just part of what we do. And I think, right, you're right, And I'm not saying that nine to two and O was not. It was very art I mean, you know, we did cool shots and a lot of movement, and the performances were always dead on, and you know, the subject matter was important to people so and but it never presented itself as like all hoity toity. It was just here, here you go,
here's our show. I dope you like it.
Seeing as you were on from season four to season intend, did you see the dynamic change within the the inner workings of the show throughout all those years, because there were so many internal changes, Yeah.
Like with the cast, you mean general like you know, like or like.
Actually believe it or not. And it's an interesting I never really thought about it, but a lot of shows within like after the first season, it's like a marriage, Like the first season is sort of the honeymoon, and then then it goes into oh, it's just nice, it's a nice, comfortable and then you end up hating each other everyone. But that never really happened as far as I know on nine o two, and oh, I think everyone pretty much got along.
The people came, and people came and went, you know, and nobody was there that didn't want to be there.
I think, yeah, So I think it was great and the same with the crew was always great. And I think it's you know, a lot of it. I think was also a lot of it, Torri, was because of your dad, because there was like I remember, like I wanted this, uh this shot. We shot it. I don't know if you remember this. We shot it and at Lax one time and it was in terminal too, and I wanted to I thought when we were scouting and I said, oh, wouldn't it be cool if we saw
a plane. There was these big bay windows at the end of the terminal and I said, oh, wouldn't it be cool if I panned with the plane and then tilt down and reveal the scene inside. And then the guy with us said, oh, well, the planes are on the ground by then, and I went, oh, okay. And then I said, well, what if we got a picture of a plane. And Tom Victor, who was the production designer, he said, oh, yeah we could, Yeah, let's do that.
So so now I go back and now I have to pitch it to Paul Wagner, and I can't remember the John Peree I think was the production manager the so so I pitched it to them and Paul says to me, and this is like the magic words. Do you think you could sell this to mister Spelling because that's always like so everything was within the framework of what's mister Spelling going to think? And it was funny
that very few people ever called him Aaron. It was always mister Spelling or the mister was the other thing you could call him, the mister. I actually was finally allowed to call him Aaron. I did a pilot and I called I kept calling him mister Spelling, and he said just call me Aaron. I'm like, oh, that's like okay.
That's so see, we didn't see that part. So in production they would still call him mister Spelling.
Mister Spelling wild yeah and then but but that was always sort of the hovering. That was the thing that hovered over everything. Was like if you if you're bad, you're going to have to talk to the mister or mister Spelling, And so no one ever wanted to have that conversation with him.
What do you say, what happened with the plane?
Oh well, so finally, so I pitched it, and so Paul wagged, or John Peay says to Tom how much is this going to cost? And Tom said about three hundred bucks. So literally, Paul says, for three hundred bucks, it's going to be worth it to see you two guys look like a bunch of idiots. And of course it worked like a charm.
It works.
It worked. In fact, I got a call the next day from Duke Vincent. Do you remember Duke? Of course, so he and he was a pilot, he had been a pilot. So he calls me and he says, Lang, I thought you were into production and you're you know, you always get things done so fast. I can't believe you would. You did ten takes to get that plane in the shot. No, we ended up we had to
do like sometimes because it's windy. So it was a little cardboard It was basically a cardboard plane, and sometimes it would kind of shimmy a little bit, so but I would immediately cut, so it wasn't really ten because and then so he said, you know, I know that it's at least two minutes between each landing and so that means you spent twenty minutes just trying to get that one shot. And I said, Duke, Duke, it wasn't a plane. It was a picture of a plane. This
is I know a plane. When I say I fly planes, I know a real plane when I see what I said, Duke, I'm telling you, I promise that it was a picture of a plane.
It was a fighter pilot, right.
What reason was that.
It was the one? I think it was. Mister Walsh goes to Washington.
Maybe I can't wait to see it.
Yeah, you should check it out. It's pretty cool. Oh no, it was what I did on my summer vacation, that's the one. It was what I did on my summer vacation. Pretty true.
I was like, what did you do on your summer vacation? I can't remember.
I can't believe you remember the titles of the shows you directed some of them.
I do, Yes, I know. It's pretty strange.
Oh my gosh. So we're obviously rewatching the show. We haven't seen it consecutive ly in thirty years, and season four we're now on, and things are happening. There's about to be huge changes on the show. So it's like, it's crazy for us to be like, oh my gosh, here's the core like cast. It's about the change next season. Yeah, and you came into it when it was already like it was going down that path. Right, So next season, Shannon is leaving, Tiffany's coming in.
Did you ever have any like creative differences with any of the cast members?
You know? I mean, I mean, there's been very few actors in my career that I could say I've had any issues with, So I mean in general, because like I said, I'm sensitive to what you guys have to go through to get to do what you do. It's incredibly hard. You make it look easy, but anyone who tries to do it will know immediately that it's really not that easy. And there's plenty of examples on TV of people it's not that easy.
Do you remember the last episode you did season ten?
Oh? Yeah, it was the second to last episode of the show.
Okay, okay, that was an ultimate.
The penultimate was called so yeah. And actually I have another kind of favorite memory with you, Torri, when we were shooting out at the shic. I think it was the shick estate that big. We had a carnival. Remember that episode. It was a two parter. It had a big carnival. We had a ferris wheel and all kinds of rides, and we had baby Face was the performer.
Yep.
And so so we had a big stage that we had put up at the on the on the location, and it was you and I because David was he was doing some is.
That when Oh no, no, that's not when he cheated on me.
No, he was playing with baby Face. Okay, I think he played the bass or something, so oh no, maybe keyboard. He might have been playing key So anyway, so you and I are up on the stage. We're looking out over this big carnival that we had set up and I said to you, and I said, at your sweet sixteen party? Is this? What? Did you have something like this at your sweet sixteen party? And I thought I was kidding and you said, well, it wasn't quite this big, but yes.
Fair Oh my gosh, it's so nice. I mean, I'm sorry we caught up with you because of this incident, but it's nice to catch up with you.
It is nice to catch feel. Ultimately we can think whatever salt oh no, pepper.
The fans really like the fans were very upset and they were very much on it was on your side, like, yeah, it.
Was the very he said. She he said kind of yeah, Oh it's right.
I read some of the things of the comments on Instagram and they were very upset. Yeah, I mean both said. It was sort of both sides. Oh. The other thing about the python story that well, is that it's like it was so ridiculous like like and also did he say that everyone came to Shannon's defense when I was telling her she couldn't have the python?
Okay, so here's my question. You said that he said that he that you said he she couldn't have the python on set? But I thought he said right. But I thought he said that she walked in with the python and that she started like going in at you, like I hope you're going to do a better job than last week's director because she had had a problem with the previous director, and it was something like that, Wow, it wasn't about the python.
Oh okay, I must have misheard his because I just was is that true, John?
That is what he said. I don't know what the all the the argument was about, but.
Yeah, okay, well I guess I must have done a better job because I did eleven more episodes.
Yeah right, like yeah, I don't even know what happened the previous week with the director that was on then that who knows if any of this is true.
I know all alleged.
Legend a legend, i'd say a legend.
And that.
If there was a python, that's legendary.
Exactly, I can pretty much guarantee there was. I actually did a show where I had a twenty five foot Boa constrictor on the show, and uh, it weighed over three hundred pounds. Pretty great.
Yeah, that'd be heavy for her.
She's a little little thing, because those those pythons get pretty, they're pretty big. Well, maybe it would be a baby python.
Yeah, she came out with a little porn snake.
Yeah, it was paint this picture however we want it.
Maybe one of for fiancees had bought her a python bag. Maybe that had just happened, or.
It could have been a boa, but like the feather boa.
Maybe maybe now that was jam.
I have one really important, probably last question for you. Were we your favorite cast? Ever?
Why are you hesitating?
Oh? Well, because I'm trying to give it a good thought. I would say pretty close, pretty close. I would say, you know, I never liked to I never really like when people say what's your favorite color, what your favorite music? I never am good with that answer. So it's the same thing because everyone, I mean I kind of everyone's kind of my favorite. I would have a much easier time saying the people who I did not.
Like working with, Okay, not like working with.
I'm just kidding about you guys. In terms of preparedness and punctuality and general level of professionalism, yes, definitely favored and no no pushback, just always happy to do the work, happy to be there, happy to be doing the show always and right through to the very end. So that is rare, So that definitely yes, I would not have to give that a second thought. And that's kind of the most important thing because we're never I mean, we're
going to be colleagues, but not necessarily friends. So I think professionalism was And also you guys were so young, so like to be young and that professional and that buttoned up and prepared that's pretty impressive. And the schedule, as I'm sure you remember, it was we did a crap load of work every day. I mean it was, it was a tight, tight show, and we never were allowed to go over I think it was it was it ten hours, definitely, it was no more than twelve for sure.
I think there was more more than in.
The first season. Maybe by the time I got there, they were never more than twelve hour.
Days for us.
It was probably fourteen because of hair and makeup and trip.
Right, that's yeah, you guys, that's right. You guys would always be longer because you come in earlier. But do you remember the episode we did on the Titanic. Yeah, I don't mean the Titanic. That was fun and that was a good example of how the show is. So I we shot there six days. If you recall, it was Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, and then a Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. So I decided because I lived, it was like forty five minutes from there to my house, so there was
a couple of days. There was one day we had it was the Goo Goo Dolls were played and they played three songs. We had three songs by the Goo Goo Dolls, seven and a half pages with the entire cats, and two hundred and fifty extras. That was one day's work, and so I thought that's going to be a long day, and I also had I did. We had a steady cam and I did like three sixty shots around the whole place with dancing and you know they're coming off the Google dolls playing to a two shot of you
guys and you know, spinning around. It was complex. So I thought, that's going to be a four. I'm going to be you know, begging them to give me another just another half hour. We finished that day in ten hours.
Oh my god.
Crazy.
We stayed there, remember we stayed on the Queen Mary did I.
It was fun. It was like we were on a little cruise.
I don't remember sleeping there, but I remember we had like little rooms. You slept there.
Like you and Tiffany like had like a sweet or day sweet sair No, and then Kathleen and I did. And then they took us down underneath to see where because we were like, where's the haunted areas and it's like the creation we got to go see afterwards. And then I was scared to sleep there, but I did.
That's right. That was fun. It was a fun show. Though I have nothing but fond memories of that show.
I remember being in our tenth season and just knowing so many actors on so many different shows at that point, and they would I would hear them complain like oh and they'd be like, oh God, you guys are in your tenth season. You must just want to get out of here. And I remember thinking, like thinking about that and being like, gosh, I had never thought of that before. There wasn't one day that I was like, I don't
want to be here anymore. Like ten years. We always and Jenn and I even I remember we had this conversation. There was some courtroom case. I don't know why, and we had this conversation. We both because we were both one of the few ones there for the entire run. And Ian and Brian and yeah, we loved what we did. It just kept going on. Imagine like for thirty years, you could do it.
We could do it. That's for you to do it. Michael, What are you working on now?
Now? I am working on Actually I have a couple. I have this one project which I've been nursing along for quite a few years. It's based on a series of books called Dead End Dating, and it's about a twenty six well she's actually six hundred and twenty six year old vampire who is from a very wealthy, old school vampire family, and she hates her She hates her family. She doesn't want to go into the family business. So she starts a dating service for vampires Wherewold and others,
And it's set in New York City. It's sort of a like a mix between true blood and sex in the City. So, yeah, there's vampires, there's blood, there's killing, and then there's jokes and rom com stuff.
Title, great concept, what's.
The hold up?
What's the hold up? Now? It's the holdup? It's you know, it's TV. Yeah, So that that's kind of what I've been working on. And then I also wrote a musical, My second musical. The first one was produced in North Hollywood and ran for six weeks. This one is based on Macbeth and it's set on walls in Wall Street today.
Wow.
Yeah, Macbeth is like a venture capital none of it. He works at a big like Goldman Sachs type company and he ends up being the King of Wall Street instead of the King of Scotland. So that's pretty cool.
And my musical, what was the first one that.
Was was a sort of a comedy. It was called Reunion it was about my My The guy who's the composer of both of them and I actually have known each other since eighth grade. So we went to a high school reunion. I'm not going to say how many years it was, but you can tell from my color of my beard, and we went together. It was back east and when we on the way back to LA I said to him, we need to write about this
because that was really weird. So we wrote a musical about a twenty fifth high school reunion and like all the kids and you know, well, well now they're all adults coming back and it's pretty funny.
That sounds funny.
Yeah, it was good.
But anyway, will you write a musical for us?
Yes, I'm going to work on it.
So our favorite movie as friend is Death becomes Her? Uh huh, Meryl Streep and Goldie Han.
Yep, So we want to do a musical version of that with you and Jenny. All right, I'll get.
I just like to rile her up.
I'm going to call my composer right now. Hold on, hello, Yeah, musical of Death becomes Her. Get on it. Okay, it'll be done.
You're such a champ for coming on, and thank you digging into this very sensitive alleged situation. Well, appreciate you clearing the air.
It's no longer alleged.
It's dead the python.
It's the past, right, it's the past. Pepper Gate.
Over, over and scene.
And I tell you that I'm not going to say anything mean about Pepper. I'm not going to say.
Anything up there.
Just like, stop right here because podcast and who knows, who knows what could happen.
I can feel it coming. Thank you, Michael. It's really really great to see you.
Great to see you too.
You love you, love.
You too, and congrats, you know, cool.
All the things, all the things.
Well, after this, we have six more seasons and you're a part of all those seasons. So will you come back?
Have you back? Definitely relain some things to us, Yes.
Yes, I would love to. I have many more stories. I'm sure I love it.
Okay, dust them off, Okay, Michael, Okay, good one bye,