Sabotage, surveillance and state-sponsored killings: ASIO's warning - podcast episode cover

Sabotage, surveillance and state-sponsored killings: ASIO's warning

Feb 20, 202514 minEp. 1479
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Episode description

Australia faces its most “difficult threat environment” in 50 years, with larger and more varied plots than ever before. That was the message from the director-general of ASIO, Mike Burgess, when he gave his annual threat assessment on Wednesday night, taking the extraordinary step of declassifying some of the intelligence behind the warning.

According to Burgess, foreign interference and espionage are at extreme levels, with ASIO foiling five major terror attacks against Australians last year.

Today, special correspondent for The Saturday Paper Jason Koutsoukis on how foreign governments are trying to interfere in Australia – from AUKUS to our elections.

 

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Guest: Special correspondent for The Saturday Paper, Jason Koutsoukis

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Transcript

Speaker 1

From Schwartz Media on Daniel James, this is seven am. Australia is under threat and has never faced so many different threats at once. That was the message from Director General of ASIO Mirk Burgess, when he gave his annual Threat assessment on Wednesday night. Asier's work is usually classified, but Burgess has taken the extraordinary step of revealing some of the intelligence that is let him to sound the warning.

According to Burgess, spionage and foreign interference are at extreme levels and just last year AZIO foiled five attempted terror attacks on Australian soil. Today, special correspondent for the Saturday Paper, Jason gotsukis on why the national terror threat level is probable and why it won't be going down anytime soon. It's Friday twenty one. Jason. You're at the speech given by the Director General of AS Mike Burgess where he

laid out the security situation in Australia right now. Can you tell me what was like to be in the room, who was there and how significant this address was?

Speaker 2

Absolutely? I think Daniel that other than the federal budget, I think this Annual Threat Assessment speech delivered by Mike Burgess has become one of the marquee annual events in Canberra. It's certainly the night of Knights for Australia's intelligence community.

Speaker 3

Welcome to the ben Chiefly Building, Welcome to ASIO, and welcome to my annual Threat Assessment.

Speaker 2

Australian Signals Directorate, the Australian Secret Intelligence Service, the Defense Intelligence Organization, they all send representatives to this event.

Speaker 3

The Attorney General, the Honorable Mark drefuskc Chair, Deputy Chair, and committee members of the Parliamentary Committee on Intelligence Security, Directors, General Inspector General CDs.

Speaker 2

And perhaps most surprising of all last night was that the Chinese ambassador was not only was he invited, but he accepted that invitation and he was placed front and center of the audience, and he was placed in a

position where the television cameras couldn't miss him. So it's interesting that Mike Burgess is sending a message by the kinds of people that he's invited, and it just underscores the fact that this is a very highly choreographed event and that Mike Burgess, the Director General EVASIO, he's someone who not only understands how the media works, but how to get the media to work. To his advantage, and I think that's a really interesting aspect to his leadership.

Speaker 1

And there was a lot of news in his speech, things like the terror level threat will be remaining at probable and that it won't be going down anytime soon, that Australia is under attack in all different ways, and that ASIO has foiled five terror plots on Australian soil just in the past year. So can you tell me what we know about these attempted attacks and how they are different from what we've seen in the past.

Speaker 2

Well, you know, one of the most alarming things that struck me about this speech was that there's been such a significant shift in the types of people likely to commit an attack. So we're still seeing religiously motivated violent extremism, but it's not the majority. So whereas you know, perhaps ten years ago, we were seeing groups like ISIL, ISIS and al Qaeda inspiring direct attacks here, now extremists tend to be much more self radicalizing.

Speaker 3

Now the most likely perpetrator of a terrorist attack is a lone actor from a family previously unconnected to extremism.

Speaker 2

And I think what really stood out for me from the speech that the majority of threats are coming from racist nationalist extremists who are trying to mainstream their beliefs and expand their movement, and they're doing this by very provocative, offensive and high profile stunts. According to Mike Burgess, the greatest threat of violence come from individuals on the periphery

of these organized groups. And another thing that was that is very striking about the nature of the threats that we face is that a lot of the potential threat actors are much younger people than we've seen in the past.

Speaker 1

So how young are we talking here?

Speaker 2

Joce Mike Burgers said that the median age at which miner is a first subject to ASIO investigation is now fifteen, which is pretty alarming when you think about it.

Speaker 3

Many of the recent cases we've dealt with are as sad and sobering as they are shocking.

Speaker 2

And Mike Burgess rattled off the types of things that are getting young people noticed by ASIO.

Speaker 3

Mine is allegedly sharing beheading video in the school yard, a twelve year old allegedly wanting to blow up a place of worship, a seventeen year old watching Nazi propaganda and klu Klux clan videos and scrawling gas the Jews on the wall of the classroom.

Speaker 2

And according to Mike Burgess, these people are cherry picking ideologies.

Speaker 3

Traditional distinctions between extremists motivations are breaking down. Individuals are cherry picking seemingly antithetical ideologies to create new hybrid beliefs.

Speaker 2

I just talked about one person being motivated by Islamic state propaganda and neo Nazi propaganda. Another person allegedly described himself as a left wing environmentalist aligned with Adolph Hitler. Yet another person apparently considered himself to be a radical communist anarchist while allegedly embracing nationalist and racist violent extremism. So all types of views and that's increasing and will

only be exacerbated by the online landscape going forward. Mike Burgers added that the impacts of social media, mental health, the spread of misinformation and conspiracy theories, ubiquitous data encryption, growing grievance, and the radicalization of miners are all things that are swirling out there and making Australia's response to security threats more complex.

Speaker 1

After the break, how foreign governments are trying to sabotage aucas Jason Beyond radicalized young people, Mike Burgess also talked about the threat we face in Australia from other countries. Can you talk to me about some of the ways we know foreign governments in a fear here in Australia.

Speaker 2

Perhaps one of the most interesting things that Mike Burgers said last night was that if the spy game has a rule book, it's been rewritten. We're seeing a small number of authoritarian regimes behaving much more aggressively, much more recklessly, more dangerously and more willing to engage in what Mike Burgess called high harm activities here in Australia.

Speaker 3

Australia's defense system will face greater threats from espionage, foreign interference and potentially sabotage over the next five years. Multiple countries are relentlessly seeking information about our military capabilities.

Speaker 2

He cited an example of defense personnel being given gifts by their international counterparts.

Speaker 3

The presence contained concealed surveillance devices.

Speaker 2

Mike Burgess also talked about orchis and how this has really become a big lure for foreign intelligence agencies. Everything about the subs, all of that very sensitive technology is information that foreign governments are desperate to get access to. They're trying to hack into our systems, get access to

those very sensitive secrets. Foreign governments are also picking up on the fact that HAWCAS is not really overwhelmingly popular in a lot of sections of the community, and that as we move towards twenty thirty, as the submarine project matures, we can expect foreign intelligent services to try to exploit that and even potentially sabotage the whole enterprise if tensions escalate.

Speaker 1

And how are foreign governments tapping into diaspora communities, what impact is that Having.

Speaker 2

Mike Burgess talked about this thing, which he calls coerced.

Speaker 3

Repatriations, coerce repatriations can contribute to a culture of fear within the diaspora, reinforcing the perception that a hostile foreign government's reach extends across the Australian border.

Speaker 2

So in a coerced attempt to repatriate someone, the foreign government applies so much pressure the victim believes that they have noel alternative but to leave Australia, irrespective of the consequence. Now, these tactics include trying to strong arm people to report on other members of the dousper community. There are threatening perceived dissidents and their family members with violence.

Speaker 3

If you're being pressured, I strongly urge you to contact the National Security Hotline. I also strongly urge those complicit in these activities to reconsider their involvement. We are watching and we have zero tolerance.

Speaker 2

According to Mike Burgess, AZIO is aware of at least four countries that have plotted to use his words, this sort of despicable behavior in Australia.

Speaker 1

And beyond forcing people back to other countries, he also raised the threat of state sponsored killings.

Speaker 2

He did, and perhaps this was, you know, the most alarming part of his speech that azio investigations have identified at least three different countries plotting to physically harm people living in Australia.

Speaker 3

In one operation of foreign intellent servers wanted to silence an Australian based human rights act.

Speaker 2

And the scheme involved tricking the unsuspecting activist into visiting a third country where the plotters would be waiting and they planned to arrange an accident.

Speaker 3

They planned to arrange an accident that was anything but accidental, with the objective of seriously injuring or even killing the activist. Fortunately, Asios intervened early to stop the travel and foil the plot before it occurred.

Speaker 2

He said that more recently last year, in fact, ASIO Intelligence indicated a different hostile foreign intelligence service wanting to harm and possibly kill one or more individuals on Australian soil. But working with asio's international partners, the agency was able to determine that this was part of a broader effort by this particular regime to eliminate critics of its government around the world.

Speaker 1

And this speech, of course comes just before an election. Talk to me about the significance of that timing.

Speaker 2

So obviously, Daniel, this is a big year in Australian politics. We've got a federal election that we expect which has to be called by May seventeen. This is an event that is obviously very vulnerable to foreign interference. And Mike Burgess was at pains to point out to anyone contemplating any interference in our election process that ASIO already has offices embedded within the Australian Electoral Commission to protect the integrity of the upcoming election.

Speaker 3

If a foreign regime tries to meddle in the election by pressuring diasper groups, directing foreign language newspapers, spreading disinformation on social media, or using any other tactics sometimes scenes overseas. We will know and we will act.

Speaker 1

Consider yourself warned, he added, Jason, thank you so much for your time.

Speaker 2

Thanks Danieal.

Speaker 1

Also in the news, Prime Minister Anthony Alberanesi has announced a two point four billion dollars support package for Wyaler and its steel works. Mister Alberanesi described the joint state federal package as an investment in the nation and said there is no industry more important for our nation than steel making. Wyaler produces seventy five percent of the nation's structural steel. The steel works, which was owned by GfG Alliance and chaired by British billionaire san Jeeve Gupta, was

forced into administration by the state government on Wednesday. The federal government also announced a new Green Iron Investment fund to boost green iron manufacturing and supply chains, and Australia's Refugee Community Sponsorship Program is now a permanent part of the country's humanitarian intake. The Community Refugee and Settlement Pilot CRISP welcome five hundred refugees as part of a four year experiment where local groups of volunteers took on the

role of traditional settlement services. Yesterday, Assistant Minister for Citizenship and Multicultural Affairs, Julian Hill said of the experiment, quote it works. You can listen to our reporting on the scheme. The title of that episode is I have eyes, but I don't see the community groups helping refugees. Settle seven Am is a daily show from Schwartz Media and The

Saturday Paper. It's made by Atticus Bastow, Shane Anderson, Chris Dangate, Eric Jensen, Ruby Jones, Sarah McFee, Travis Evans, Zoltenfacho and me Daniel James. Our theme music is by Ned Beckley and Josh Hoagan of Envelope Audio. Tomorrow, we're bringing you a bonus episode about the huge week in federal politics and when you can expect the election to be I'll catch you then at one

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