This is part two of a two part episode that we're bringing you recorded back in September of twenty twenty five, just Aster Victoria introduced the bill that will give effect to Australia's first ever treaty with First Nations people.
Indigenous leaders across the country have welcomed Victoria's first treaty. The legislation will enshrine a democratically elected body for First Peoples called Gillingwall that will be consulted on laws and policies affecting Indigenous communities and now there are calls for other states and territories to use the Victorian example as
a model to establish their own treaties. But there's also predictably pushback, with critics calling it costly and divisive in claims that echo the voice debate and state and territory leaders across the country are walking away from previous promises and commitments. Today, writer and seven AM co host Daniel James, who was also one of the authors of the europe Commission reports on whether Victoria's treaty marks a turning point or an anomaly. Daniel Australia's first treaty was introduced into
Parliament this week in Victoria. How significant is this moment.
Well, it's the only time in the history of the entire country that our treaty has been introduced into a state or federal parliament. It has been on the back of decades of work, but in a formal sense, in terms of the actual process of getting this treaty to this point, it's been at least six years. It has survived two elections, it has gone through a pandemic, it
has gone through a very divisive referendum. But despite all that, the First People Assembly, in its two iterations, have gotten us to this point and it is a It was a remarkable day for everyone that has either paid close interest to this or been involved in it.
It didn't take long though, for criticism to appear in some media outlets.
Any legislation is a slap in the face to the majority of Victorians who less than two years ago voted no to Labour's Voice to Parliament, isn't it.
On Sky we heard people start to say that the Victorian government is quote pandering to a minority.
And as usual, Victoria is way out in front in another example of pandering to a minority in favor of the majority.
Singling out in particular things like the changes to the curriculum that will be introduced and changes to place names.
Have a look at this barry Yip primary. Now you say it apparently bar ray Yip. Now you've got Cuyim primary in Packinham. It's pronounced Kuyim. You've got mini.
Did you expect that kind of commentary?
Yeah, it's sadly predictable because it's pretty much or they've really gotten their kit in terms of being able to attack processes like this. They are ostensibly a bunch of one treeck ponies when it comes to the idea of the First Nations people here being a minority. Yes, we are a minority, but we are a minority that we're here for fifty thousand years, and when colonialism came here, we're a minority that had our land stolen, our waterways desecrated.
We were the result of policies of eradication, both formal and informal. We were the victims of massacres. We were the victims of disease and alcohol that was brought here.
The tremendous wealth that was created in this place through things like the gold Rush, oboriginal people never saw even though it was the plundering of their land that resulted in that the billions of dollars that have been generated through our waterways and land and skies, we've never seen a cent of We were deprived of our rights, and so yes, we are a minority, but we also are the first peoples of this place, and this treaty and the truth telling process you work before it is a
reckoning of that, and it shows a state that is mature enough and bold enough to be able to deal with these particular issues in a mature and forensic but also incredibly nuanced way. And so the response from sections of the media was entirely predictable, trying to conflate it with things like the referendum, which is a completely different thing.
This is it, this is what's happening, and if people want to conflate that with the referendum result for political purposes, then we'll wave to them as we go over the hill and down the road.
We even heard some voices saying that this treaty should be put to a state referendum, much like the voice.
What this shows is that the elites in this society don't care what you think. They don't care how you vote. They've got their own ideology and they are going to implement it anyway, and we've not only seen it with it.
You don't hear those types of comments about legislation in other areas of Australian politics. So why do you think that indigenous policy draws that kind of reaction Because I think.
That people conflate the referendum result with actual political mileage and gain to be had at the expensive First Nations people. It's only with black veils that were asked to have
referendums to put it to the vote. Well, this thing has survived to state elections, which was a key platform for the Andrews Labor government and did have bipartisan support from the National and Liberal parties before they chickened out of it and saw an opportunity after referendum to try and gain some sort of political capital out of it.
But I think the last referendum we had in Victoria was around daylight saving, So that's the that's the kind of referendums we have at the state level here in Vittoria. What would we have a referendum on this? And anyone saying that the government is planning to have a referendum to enshrine this in the constitution of the state. It's just either mistaken or they are lying for local gain or for clickbait.
And during the voice debate, the Prime Minister he avoided talking about a national treaty. He said, this is something that's happening at the state and territory level. Victoria is now the first. But what are we seeing in regards to other states and territories.
In terms of the treaty process. Victoria is years and years ahead of what's happening in other states and territories. We've seen attacks on treaty processes and truth telling processes across the country, probably most brutally in Queenslane, on which there was a truth telling process that was established but was torn down. I think on the second day of the Christal Fudy government in Queensland being in power.
The Prime Minister was warned on multiple occasions in the last six months that if he continued down this path, this is what would occur, this is the kind of division that would occur. Well, I'm not going to make the same mistake as the Prime minister.
The Albaniza government spent a tremendous amount of political capital in its first term on the referendum, they haven't been wanting to go near aberginal affairs in a truth telling or treaty sense since then. But I do note that the Minister for Indigenous Australians, Melandarry McCarthy has been in Victoria this week and she is making more and more solid sort of pronouncements around a national truth telling process, which is encouraging because there is a void at the
national level. It's a case of Victoria going out on its own and trying to improve out comfort for people here. But what we've done by going through that process is showing to the rest of the country that this can be done, and it can be done in a way that is inclusive and in a way that is looking more to the future now than to the past. We have through the truth telling process, he reckoned with our past. We are now got our eyes firmly set on the future.
And that is what Tree is about, and that is something that can be replicated at the national level if the government chooses to do so.
Coming up.
Could the years of work in getting to this moment.
All be undone. You mentioned Queensland, where the treaty process was axed after there was a change in government. So is there a risk that if in Victoria, if Labor loses office, that the treaty could be undone, especially given that the Liberal Party in Victoria is against it.
Yeah.
The difference here is that the Treaty Legislation Bill has been introduced into the Parliament. It will be passed with the Parliament. The Nationals and Liberals here make up a very small minority in terms of oppositions when it comes to the numbers within the Parliament here, so it will pass with the support of Greens and other minority groups and so then it will have over a year to run before the next election, in which case it has the opportunity to ensron itself in some of the systems here,
to raise its own awareness through the community. But over the next twelve months and a bit, it's going to be really hard to put the toothpaste back into the tube once this is out there. From my understanding, the opposition here says they still oppose the process, but they haven't made a commitment or made any noises about whether they would tear it down if they got into government.
Reading the situation here, it would be something that would be seen as incredibly pointless and reckless to do, given that there's been such a process in place for such a long time, and it's not a platform that you want to run on here in Victoria. If you want to run on a platform or if we're going to tear down treaty, it's not going to get you too
many votes. We've got far bigger issues in terms of the political landscape here around crime and cost of living and things like that, where there are far more votes to be mine as an opposition than something like treaty.
And so once we see treaty in action, Daniel, how do you think that the experience of First Nations people in Victoria is going to change?
Probably the most meaningful change in terms of the broader community will be through things like changes to the Victorian school curriculum. We have a report now truths be told through the Oral Justice Commission, which is now part of the official public Record, which will be used as a resource now to redevelop the curriculum to tell the true
history of this place. There's going to be an ongoing truth telling process established, which means that we are able to recognize patterns and speak truth to power on a regular basis about what actually is happening here and how the colonial project is still having that mental impacts on First Nations people. There will be the establishment of oversight institutions.
The treaty allows First Nations people for the first time as equals with the Crown to negotiate, have input and talk to laws and policies that will impact First Nations people. So we're not retrofitting systems or policies or ideas. We are there at the actual point that some of these
systems and policies are either reformed or created. There will be renaming conventions across the state, and any sort of public building or piece of land that is owned by the state could be renamed after a process with First Nations people to just get the flavor and language of First Nations people back into this land after it's been missing for so long, and there will be frameworks to
negotiate further treaties. I think the thing that people need to realize is that the Treaty itself is a living, breathing document. It's not something that is etched in stone. Is a process that will continue to evolve as a society and community evolves. So there's a whole truckload of things ruby that will be part of this process over the future generations that will not only have enrich the lives of First Nations people, it will rich the lives
of the broader community. I think an important thing to also note about the treaty too, is that there's no commercial in confidence here. What you see in the treaty is laid out for everyone to see. It is something that has been negotiated between the First People's Assembly and Victorian government and the treaty now is the document where everyone can see that there are no hidden clauses, no hidden agendas. People aren't coming after people's homes or real
estate or businesses. It is all laid out in black and white there, I say in the treaty document itself.
And for people who have fought for decades to get to this point, the weight of this moment must be heavy. Do you think that there is a sense of pressure now that you know this needs to deliver real change.
Yeah. If there's any concern about whether the First People, susceemly and Aboriginal people in Victoria will now rest on our laurels that we now have this treaty process, I'm here to ease your concerns around that. The weight of our own history, the weight of the people who have fought for things like this and that we've lost along the way, the weight of their memory is something that will push us forward far more than any sort of
immediate political dynamic in this state. I was actually surprised by how much I was actually moved by this. It was something that I intellectually was prepared for, something that I had had a little bit of a role in bringing to life in a very very very small way. But it wasn't until a couple of hours I was after the whole thing was introduced into the Parliament that the gravity of what has happened here kind of really
hit me for the first time. And what the treaty now does is recognize that everyone that lives in this place that we call Victoria now should have their own
relationship with the land and the customs here. Sure, our involvement Aboriginal people's relationship with the land and its waterways and its skies is unique, but it's now an opportunity now for every person that is fortunate enough to live in this place to develop their own relationship with the land and the waters at the invitation of First Nations people and if you want to look at that in sort of practical ways, there are whole communities in Victoria
and particularly in Malbourne now that from my point of view, I kind of see that a court between between worlds that they don't belong to one part of society. They are trying to find their way towards acceptance and find a place of belonging in this community. Well, without being too grandiose about it, treaty is one pathway for people to find themselves in this state and the place they live.
That has been looked after for millennia by First Nations people, and that can be done together with First Nations people.
Well, Daniel, thank you so much.
For your time.
Thanks Ruby. I'm Daniel James. Seven am. We'll be back tomorrow with an episode about Daniel Duggant, the former US Marine pilot turned Australian citizen, now facing extradition to the United States over allegations he helped train Chinese military pilots.
If this can happen to Dan, it can happen to a lot of other Australians. If we put Australians in jeopardy and are prepared to hand them acrosst foreign legal system for things that they did a long time ago that weren't crimes here. You know, it opens a floodgate for foreign governments to be able to reach into our legal system and interfere with it.
We unpack our dug and ended up at the center of a case now stretches from Tasmania to South Africa, China and Washington. See you then,