Gay.
Congratulations to your family. Take me to the moment where you heard your brother, Julian Assandra was about to be freed.
Where where are you? What were you doing?
Well?
I've been chatting to Julian in the lead up to this, you know, we're speaking every day. Julian called me and just before he had to get into a van to travel to the airport, and he actually I was just arriving in France and I was waiting for my bags at the carousel and chatting to Julian about you know what. He was getting ready for the next morning where he
had to essentially be snuck out of the prison. He had to wait for quite a few hours inside one of these prisoner transport vans before waiting inside a lounge at Stanstete Airport for hours on end there as well, before getting on a plane. One of the interesting things that Julian's plane is the second most tracked plane on flight Tracker. It might have actually become the first most tracked plane, but the plane he's in competition with at
the moment is Taylor Swift's jet. So it's the people who watching Taylor Swift jet out numbered the people watching Julian's jet, but Julian's jet is a close second on the flight trackers.
It's pretty bizarre, isn't it.
What was the reason?
What was all the secrecy about, you know, being snuck out of the prison at two am? What's that about?
Well, until this deal was done, and until Julian signed before a judge, it was a very delicate thing that could have become unraveled at any time. And so keeping it secret as long as we could meant that it wasn't open to influence from outside parties that could have brought the whole deal down.
Huh.
So yeah, I think that was a necessary element to keep that secrecy. I had to keep it secret from some family and loved ones. So who I'm not so happy, but or very surprised. I mean, I spoke to my daughter and she said, oh, Dad, did you know about this? And I'm like, yes, yes, Rosen. She is actually over the moon. She'd be like, I can't believe we can go and see Julian and my cousins. She was over the moon and she ear the news as well.
From Schwartz Media. I'm Ashlyn McGhee. This is seven am. When gab A sounds jumped on our zoom call. I'm not sure I've ever seen him with such a big smile. His brother, Julian Asangi, is back on home soil after more than a decade in exile and in prison. Slowly we're starting to learn more about how this extraordinary deal between Australia and the US came together and the secret
midnight maneuvers to get safely out of the UK. Today, Gabe Shipton takes this inside the last seventy two hours, But first the Saturday Paper's Mike Second on how it all unfolded. That's after the break, Mike, Julian los angele have landed in Australia a free man by the time our listeners here this What do we know about how this has come about?
Well, to be honest, ash, not a lot at this stage. As someone in the government put it to me when I was trying to find out more about this, they said they didn't want to begin their victory lap as they described it, until the process was done and Assange was safe. So you know, they've acknowledged that the process is in train, but they're not saying much more than that.
What we do know is that around two am on Monday in Belmarsh Prison, Assange was woken up by the guards and he was escorted out into a secure vehicle
to transfer him to an airport to a plane. The first world knew was when Wiki Leaks, the organization he started, posted a video of him boarding that plane, and subsequent to that it was quickly revealed that the US Justice Department had offered a deal which would see him plead guilty to just one count conspiring to unlawfully obtain and disseminate classified information, but that under that deal he would be sentenced but only to the time served already in Belmarsh,
so effectively he would be free to walk after that. So he got on the plane in the UK it was an Australian government charted plane, and then on to the US territory of Saipan in the middle of the Pacific Ocean, where he could plead guilty in front of a US judge.
He arrived just under an hour ago and he's expected at this court to face court here at nine am local time, which is the same time as Easton standard.
Jared austra comments he.
Was walking into a US court alongside the Australian Ambassador of the US Kevin Rudd, and the UK High Commissioner Stephen Smith to plead guilty to that one count. Interestingly, he didn't offer it meekly either. There was a long pause when he was asked whether he accepted that he was guilty of the charge, and then he explained to the judge that he was entering the guilty plea because, as he said, quoting working as a journalist, I encouraged my source to provide information that was said to be
classified in order to publish that information. And he went on to say I believed the First Amendment protected that activity. I believe the First Amendment and the Espionage Act are in contradiction. His legal representative then jumped in to make it absolutely clear that he was nonetheless pleading guilty, and the explanation was given that he was pleading guilty because fighting the case before the courts would be challenging.
It is appropriate, though, for this fight to end, and it is appropriate for the judge, as she did today, to determine that no additional incarceration of mister Assigne would be fair, would be appropriate, and it is time for him to be reunited with his family.
So Mike, Juliana Sandra might be free, but he's still accepted a deal that involved admitting guilt to this really serious espionage charge. So what sort of precedent does that set.
Well, I mean, this is in a way kind of a show trial played out on a very small stage in the middle of the Pacific. So what the deal does is that it sets a practical precedent that a publisher can be convicted under the Espionage Act in the US. And it's an outcome that media rights organizations have long feared. So no doubt it will have a chilling effect on
those who would reveal uncomfortable truths about the conduct of government. Interestingly, I think, and I would not as others have, that the US authorities have had considerable difficulty in balancing the Espionage Act against the First Amendment. You know, the administration
wanted to pursue Assange, but didn't. It did happen under the Trump administration that charges were laid, but notably, they've only ever gone after Assange, And as we all know, he had partners in publishing a lot of that information. You know, some of the biggest papers in the world. You know, the New York Times, The Guardian are the news organizations in Europe. We'll see how it progresses from here.
This is a huge win for Australia that our Prime Minister stood up to Allie the United States and demanded the return of an Australian citizen and Julian came home today.
If you look at if you look at the whole range of people who've been to the United States, I'm surprised that some of it was missed by the people in this room, some of the visits, but not up to me to indicate that. Go back and have a look at some diaries and who's traveled to the United States in recent months.
Most importantly, I think he's been reunited with his wife, Stella.
It took millions of people.
It took.
People working behind the scenes, people protesting on the streets for days and weeks and months and years, and we achieved it.
Julian's wife, Stella Assange has said they will still seek a pardon because of these concerns the journalists around the world could be open to espionage charges.
Julian wanted me to sincerely thank everyone. He wanted to be here. But you have to understand what he's been through. He needs time, he needs to recuperate, and this is a process. I ask you please to give us face, to give us privacy, to find our place, to let our family.
Be a family.
Before he can speak again. At a time of his.
Choosing, there are questions about his future. I guess will he publish again, Will he continue to pursue these activities that have had such dire consequences for him? What will he do now? You know, will he just settle back into family life? You have to think that, given the frenetic pursuit of what he sees is the truth in the past, that won't be an easy adjustment for him
to make. So, you know, obviously these answers will come down the track, But right now it's a huge moment for him and his family, including people like his brother Gabriel Shipton, who we're just overjoyed that we finally have Julian free.
After the break. What Gabriel Shipton hopes his brother does next. Gabe, have you had a chance yet to chat to your brother since he's walked down.
Yeah, I haven't. We've exchanged some texts, but it's all been it's all been pretty functional. At the moment, no reflections just yet. So yeah, as I said, we're really focused on getting him home intact and safe and sound and making sure that all the logistics are sorted and yeah, but be looking forward to kicking back and having a view with him sometime in the next few weeks. So it would be good.
So talk to me a little bit more about what's been involved in this, because you kind of alluded to it there that you've been chatting to about the details as all these sort of puzzle pieces fell into place, How did this all unfold, What kind of background maneuvering was going on.
Well, this has been a huge global campaign. I think it's important to acknowledge that this is the pointy end of a very long campaign that many millions of people have been working on, and acknowledge that work, that political work, as well as the work of the lawyers, and as well as the work of you know, the Australian government who have been able to negotiate this deal along with
Julian's lawyers. But I think in terms of all the little bits and pieces, all the little negotiations that had to have this deal come together, that was all done by Julian's lawyers and the diplomatic efforts of the Australian government. I think the Australian government has pulled off They've pulled off a miracle. Basically, they've managed to satisfy the intelligence community and the National Security, Department of Justice, but also
secure Julian's freedom. So you had James Clapper coming out today saying that the intelligence community is satisfied that they've got their pound of flesh with the time served and this Espionage Act conviction, but Julian's also free. So I think an incredible balancing act that's been pulled off by
the Austrian diplomats as well as Julian's lawyers. And in terms of these little bits and pieces that were being negotiated, like going to this district in the Northern Mariana Islands, that was one of the key pieces that Julian not go to the United States, the mainland United States, and they figured out this neat solution where he could go to this location on the way home, plead guilty before a judge, have that plea accepted, and then just fly
six hours down to Canberra. So it's those little bits and pieces that were organized and I think really made this deal acceptable to Julian and the national security of the Department of Justice.
So, given all its happens and the huge toll that it's taken on Julian and your family and his family, in the end, was it all worth it?
Do you think?
Well? I think I'm not a big believer in regrets. I think, really you have to look back at Julian's record and the record at Wiki Leaks, what they exposed, and I think it speaks for itself. You know, it's a historical record that has changed the lives for the better of many millions of people around the world. People have been able to educate themselves on what their governments are doing in their name. They've been able to make
decisions that actually better their lives in their elections. Wars have been ended, The Iraq War came to an end based on one Wiki League's document. So I think really should ask the people whose lives this has affected the most of what they think about what Julian did. And I think there'll be a resounding show of support for Julian and that work because of their lives. How the lives of normal people have been affected by Julian's work.
Just going back a little bit, was there a moment where you realize that this guy that you've grown up with, your brother, your older brother, is suddenly not just your older brother anymore. Is now this character Julian Hassand where was the tipping point or the turning point for you?
Probably I think in two thousand and eight that was when they published InformATE. WikiLeaks published information a corruption report on the Kenyan government, and it led to a change, a change of government in Kenya, and some of the
people who were working with Julian wound up dead. It was at that point I sort of understood how this invention that WikiLeaks was, that this invention that Julian made, and how it really threatened the powerful and made powerful people very very scared and the lengths that they will go to to protect themselves. And that's probably when I realized the impact that WikiLeaks would have on the world.
But Julian's always just been my brother, you know, like I never never really go and say, oh, you did a great job there and things like that. You know, we're all just having a laugh and making jokes and talking about what we can do next, and how I can help him in the campaign to get him out. So yeah, that's our relationship. And yeah, I think you know, with your family members, you're always they always have that familiarity and you know that exists, still exists.
So how does Julian Assandra's story unfold from here? What do you think he's going to do next?
I think he'll enjoy some time outside of a two by three meters prison cell for a bit with his family, having a swim in the ocean. I'm sure he's looking forward to feeling some of that, maybe getting some burnt, you know, something like that, feeling the sand in his toes. Yeah, it's almost time to celebrate really that he's Once he lands and is on home soil, then that's done and he's safe and sound, which is pretty incredible after such a long time have been detained in the United Kingdom
fourteen years, five years in a maximum security prison. I just can't imagine what it's like for Julian after spending so long in a two x three meters sell to be walking around out in the open under the sunshine. Yeah, it's a pretty incredible feeling.
Gabe, I love our podcast, but the one thing I hate about it is that people can't see your smile right now.
Yes, yeah, I've been smiling. I don't usually smile on interviews, but I've had the you know, I've been able to smile and just say thank you to everybody for the last thirty six hours, you know, which I've been enjoying doing in all the interviews that I've done. So yeah, it's been a long road and great relief that we're here and that Julian can be free.
Congratulations, and I really wish you all the best enjoying this next moment as a family. Thanks so much for your time, Gabe.
Thanks, thanks and talk to you soon.
Also in the news today, Prime Minister Anthony Albernezi has revealed his Our senator Fatima Payman not attend the rest of Labour's caucus meetings before the winter break after she crossed the floor and voted against her Labor colleagues and for a Green's motion to recognize the state of Palestine. Labor Party rules, unlike those of other political parties, mean members can be expelled if they cross the floor and
vote against their own party. And Australia's monthly inflation rate has increased to its highest level this year, rising to four percent. The rises increase the looming risk that the Reserve Bank could now decide to raise rates instead of bringing them down, which is something many had a participated earlier this year. It's all from the team at seven am for today. My name's Ashlin McGhee. Thanks for your company. I'll see you again tomorrow