He's boorish, his pompous, he's arrogant, he's unself aware, he's a bully, he's incredibly stupid. He has no sense of idnity apart from his own status as a royal. I mean, even until literally last Thursday, he couldn't understand what the foss was about. He had no sense of remorse. He's a narcissist.
But by the time a wide eyed Andrew mount Batten Windsor was slumped in the back of a range Rover, the reality had hit home.
I think it did hit him finally on Thursday, just the seriousness of the situation He's in. Breaking news on the former Prince Andrew.
Thames Valley Police say that Andrew mount Batten Windsor has been arrested.
The BBC understands that he has been arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office.
Now, as the world reels from Andrew's arrest and the Royals scrambled to protect themselves from one of the biggest crises the Palace has ever faced, a warning from a Royal biographer Charles could go down to learn about Andrew and that.
With this new headline email proves Charles was warned about Andrew's secret deals. It's now not inconceivable that the king may fall.
Your majesty, how are you feeling off your brother's arrest?
Have you spoken to your brother? Your majesty. I'm Nicole Johnston and you're listening to seven AM today Royal historian Andrew Lowney on what's next for the former prince and could the king be forced to abdicate the throne. It's Tuesday, February twenty four, Andrew. It's a few days since the UK and the world was rocked by the arrest of Andrew Mountbatten Windsor has the shock worn off for you and for the country? And how is the mood in
the UK now? Because I imagine that it's all anybody's talking about.
Yeah, No, I mean I think it's not shock. I mean I think in some ways people wanted this to happen, and they're relieved it's happened. Shows that there's not one law for the royals and ones for others. There are just absolutely transfixed by the new revelations. I mean today, the revelations that the king was aware about the problems with Andrew, going back to twenty nineteen and seems to ignore them. So the wagons, though they've circled and try
and protect the King. He's now being drawn into the story.
Let me stay clearly, the King has said the law must take its course as this process continues. It would not be right for me to comment further on this matter. An extraordinary statement from the king.
There's been a lot of stuff, for example, about how his police protection officers were actually in effect working for Epstein. There were bouncers on the door in Manhattan. So the new disclosures almost every day, the raw family on the back foot. They've lost control of narrative, and it's actually really serious. I mean, we have a possibility that Charles will have to abdicate, I think if he's found and
being complicit in protecting his brother. This is a story about financial corruption at the heart of the royal family, abetted by the Queen. I was vilified when I said that the Queen was involved in protecting her son. Now they're kind of throwing her to the walls. She's dead and she's been blamed for not dealing with the problem while she was alive. The cause for a parliamentary inquiry an MP today has said that Andrew's committed treason, it's really bad news.
I have to say, what makes you think though, that it could actually lead to the abdication of King Charles, because that seems as though it would put it on an entirely new level.
Yeah. Well, I mean, they're trying to protect Charles. They trying to keep the damage a limitation just to Andrew. But if the facts show that the Palace knew about this, Charles knew about it and didn't had protected someone who consorted with pedophiles, slept with underage girls, was taking bribes, was giving away secret information, including not just commercially sensitive information, but military and political secrets, and he was protected by
the king. People are not going to accept that. They're going to say he goes as well. And we're getting close to that stage. You know, people feel William as hands seemed to be clean, and there's a sense that, you know, the old God have let everyone down. The monarchy only depends on trust, and that trust has gone.
A lot of this, of course Andrew denies. But you wrote about the relationship between Andrew and Jeffrey Epstein in your book. Could you tell us what they both got out of it? Who was more powerful? And what was Andrew even thinking when he continued that friendship even after Epstein had been convicted of sex trafficking.
Well, it was just I described as between a rattlesnake and a mouse. Epstein at Andrew live. Andrew gave Epstein credibility QDOS, access to the royal family, a respectability. And Andrew got from Epstein a ready supply of young girls, someone to pay Fergie's bills, and again some useful contacts. All those relationships are transactional. He was making sure that Fergie's debts could be paid or restructured, and Epstein helped him.
I'm at your service, Just marry me. This is just one of the ex changes that Sky News believes that Sarah Fergson had with a disgraced pedophile, Jeffrey Epstein. And just briefly, this doesn't reflect well on Fergie either, does it.
No? I mean she's abstually finished. I mean, you know, there she is supporting children's charities, sex trafficked woman, writing children's books, and she's busy consulting with a pedophile, bringing her kids to meet him, introducing her godchild twenties to Epstein, saying that Epstein's like the brother she never had. She wants to marry him, she wants to work for him, pleading for money. Twenty thousand pounds here, one hundred and
fifty thousand dollars there. She comes across as a complete grifter, which is what I knew. But you know the reputation she had, I think, particularly in Australia, she was this ditchy sloane ranger, a bit foolish, but actually at heart and pretty nice person. And actually she's now seen as a very cynical hypocrite who manipulated the royal family, played with her staff, has now abandoned the husband that she
claimed to stand by. Now he's no longer a prince, and in Royal Lodge, you know, you suddenly realize this is the world of Thackeray's Vanity Fair. It's understood that the government will consider introducing legislation to remove Andrew Mountbatten Winsor from the line of succession.
So for now, Andrew's still eight in line for the throne. And as you told us, there are these reports that the government is considering introducing legislation to remove him from that royal line of succession. Do you think that is likely, and is it also the right thing to do well.
I mean there's stories that there is an attempt to introduce the legislation. I mean Edward the eighth was actually able to abdicate an afternoon. That's because he agreed to go. So if Andrew agreed to go, there would be no need for parliamentary debate. He would that things could just be sorted. What the royal family doesn't want is a big debate about royal accountability and privilege. They want to
shut this story down. I personally think that getting rid of him from the last session is a waste of parliamentary time. It's an irrelevance. He's never going to take the throne. He's never going to be a Councilor of state. Keep focusing on two things, accountability of the royal family and getting justice for the victims by holding Andrew to account for what he's done.
Coming up, is this the monarchy's me too moment? Andrew, the King and Prince William. They've been praised for how they've handled it so far. They're continuing with their public duties, though they have been getting some blowback from it. It seems there is a real sense of keep calm and carry on. But how much damage is this doing to the royal family and its future even though they are trying to somehow insulate themselves from it.
Well, huge damage. I think there was a poll the other day saying that seventy nine percent of people in the twenties are basically think the monarchy should go.
The monarchy, Well, it's not having a very good time at the moment, is it.
Young people are interested in the values of fairness and in the values of representation. Whatever way you slice it. The monarchy is neither a fair nor a representative institution.
Approval rates to the monarchy in general have fallen. I don't think that the feeling is that the king has handled the well, he's lost to control of the narrative. He's running to catch up. William is better. People feel that he has wanted to deal with this but been frustrated by his father's reluctance to really address the subject.
Now, it's pretty well known that Andrew was the late Queen's favorite child, and she did a lot to protect him, even paying a reported twelve million pounds settlement in the civil case with Virginia Dufrey. Why did she have such a soft spot for him, and did she do too much in the end to the extent that it's obviously ended up with the royal family now in total crisis.
Yeah, well she passed this BOMD to Charles. I mean, I think to a certain extent he has to take responsibility too, because he was in effect reigning with her for the last few years of her life. He's been on the throne in the last four years. But yeah, she was blind to his faults. She didn't want to know, put a head in the sand. No one felt that they could really address this problem, and so he's able
to get away with it. He would run to Mommy complaining about people, and instead of her giving him a hard time, she would give the person giving Andrew a hard time a hard time. But the Royal family could have dealt with this for years. I mean they've known about his behavior. I had lunch yesterday with someone who knew as a teenager and was telling me about exactly this sort of behavior. And Charles or Edward's screaming at him, know about, you know, behaving properly and not behaving in
the way he was. So this isn't going to be new to them. But I think where they've been caught out is they didn't expect this Epstein dump of material. They thought they got away with it, and to a logic scent they had. I mean, even my book coming out in August didn't lead to calls for investigations or any real criticism of the Royal family. It's only really this last few weeks that it's become really untenable for them not to do something. Same with the police, same
with the government. The government have tried to shut the story down. Ambassadors were told not to speak to me. The files are still closed till twenty sixty five. Everyone has tried to suppress this story. I saw when I did my book on it with the Eighth and his associations with the Nazis. They destroyed files, they briefed against the press.
Same thing in your book you quoted a Royal source is saying that Charles thought Andrew's trade on void job was always a disaster waiting to happen. Now he's been arrested with allegedly sharing confidential commercial information with Epstein, and as you were telling us, there are other investigations into him underway. So could this just be the tip of the iceberg.
Yes, it is just the tip of the iceberg. I mean we may well have the sex trafficking allegations lead to charges. I mean they're there's a lot of material in the Epstein revelations about that. I think they're just trying to find the girls to interview them, see they will give testimony. There is I mean, I think more material on the misconduct and public office, but the sex trafficking there. I think eleven police forces looking at various allegations.
So they have to make sure they get this right. But there's a lot riding on it. I think people feel that the roles have been protected and that justice now needs to be seen to be done.
Andrew looking forward, despite this huge crisis that's underway at the moment and the legitimacy of the monarchy being questioned, do you think that the younger batch of royals, William and Kate, that they can eventually right the ship again or is it going to be pretty tough?
No? I hope they can. I mean I think they're very popular. I mean, the rest of our family are very popular. I mean, so it's just these two rogue roles, and so they need to cauterize this get Sarah and folks, and Andrew kind of distanced from the rolls. But I think the one person who's vulnerable this is King Charles.
If Charles is implicated, then I think he will have to be the sacrificial lamb, and there will be the sense we clean up the stables, we move to a completely new regime, we move to a more transparent monarchy, more on the European model, and this is the sort of me too moment for the monarchy for change. I just don't think it's a tenable for them now to operate in the way they used to. Never complain, never explain, Hope the problem goes away. Work on some trusted correspondence
to leak stories. It's just not going to work in a less deferential society and with social media pressures.
Andrew, it's been fascinating to talk to you. Thanks for joining us.
It's been a pleasure.
Also in the news this week, the Royal Commissioner looking into anti Semitism and social cohesion in the wake of the Bondi attack, will visit the scene of the massacre. Virginia bell is set to meet with survivors and relatives of those who died. I called Judge will give an opening statement today outlining how the inquiry will operate and humanitarian organizations Save the Children says. The coalition's proposal to make it illegal to help the so called ISIS brides
and their kids returned to Australia is extraordinary. CEO Matt Tinkler says no Australian child should be left stranded, calling on politicians to dial down the rhetoric and show some compassion for vulnerable children. I'm Nicole Johnston. This is seven am. Thanks for listening.