In a word, Ben simmons defense halfway through the regular season has been sensational. Simmons steals the inbound, goes in and puts it up and good Ben Simmons with back to back baskets. Yes, he's among the NBA leaders in several key statistical categories, but what he's been doing defensively
he goes well beyond that. I think we don't give versatility like kind of Simmons has, maybe because it's so rare and we don't encounter it very often the credit it deserves, because I think it really does help an entire team become more cohesive when you have a player like that. The Ringers Rob Mahoney returns to talk about Ben Simmons and defense on this episode of the broadcast. How you do it out there, seventy six Ers pod people,
Brian Seltzer, hope you are great, very much. Appreciate you coming back for another episode of the broadcast or giving it a listen for the first time. Rob Mahoney is back for another appearance. Can't wait to chat with him about a recent article he wrote about Ben Simmons being a hell of a defensive player. As it was put in the article's title that ran on The Ringer earlier this week, so we'll get into that in a moment.
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to subscribe. Let's go back to mid September, before we started seeing evidence on a regular basis of Ben Simmons being one of the elite defenders in the entire NBA. It was a couple of weeks before training camps assembled, and in another life at another media outlet, The Ringers, Rob Mahoney released his annual NBA Top one hundred list. Rob had Ben Simmons number twenty three on that list, and one of the why Rob cited simmons defensive versatility.
I'm Simmons to struggle back and intercept it. Don't ask me how he did it. Simmons directing traffic the law vobless two way, playing a boy, Ben Simmons. It is great to have Rob back on the broadcast. Rob, why don't we start here before the game has even began? Back in October this year? What did you expect to
see from Ben Simmons defensively this season? Well, I think what we had seen in seasons past is just that ability for his team, you know, for you know, in top one hundred, we're talking about kind of a generic team context obviously in real life time about the Sixers, to move him all around the floor to help dictate matchups,
help control things for his teammates. And it's such a valuable thing from a team building standpoint, because you know, whether it's you know, you're you're protecting JJ Reddick in seasons past, or you know, maybe with this year's team, you're just trying to find tune your matchups to make sure you're getting Simmons on the perfect guy to really kind of smother them and use his physicality to your advantage. That really gives a lot of power to a coach.
It helps you build lineups more effectively, it helps you maintain your bench even more effectively. And so you know, that's one area where I think we don't give versatility like the kinds like the kind of Simmons has, maybe because it's so rare and we don't encounter it very often, but we don't quite given the credit it deserves, because I think it really does help an entire team become
more cohesive when you have a player like that. Your vantage point as you cover the NBA is an intriguing one because there's so many storylines that you have to follow for obviously all thirty teams in the league. Was there a matchup earlier on this season, a game, a play, a moment when you were watching the seventy six ers saw Hilo to Ben Simmons playing defensively, and you were like, hey,
there's something happening here. There's I mean with him, it's almost just kind of an accumulation where you see him chasing over screens against so many of these smaller guards and doing and just doing an incredible job for a player his size. And that's one area where you know, especially if you watch the Warriors a lot over the last few years, or any of these teams that have really good off ball movers and then encourage opponents to switch.
You know, watching a guy, you know, a big switched on Steph Currier, Clay Thompson try to chase them over a screen. It's impossible, Like biggs just are not prepared to do something like that, they don't have the practice doing it. And so that's what always stuck out to me with Simmons was this idea that the NBA is more you know, three point driven off ball screen driven. Uh and certainly you know, your ability to get over the screen as a defender, it's never been more valuable
than it is now. And he's you know, a guard in the modern context who can do that. He just happens to be you know, six ten, and that's it's such a strange combination of size and skill in that way. And so I think that's what jumped out to me more than anything. And you know, we've seen it recently, particularly in the first half of that game against Dallas, when he was guarding Luca don Chiz and just hounding
him over these screens. You know, guard you know, really taking away not only he's driving lanes, but you know the passing angles that you know, really getting directly in the way of whatever donche was trying to accomplish. I think that's what we've seen from Simmons time and time again over the course this year against some of the higher profile guards in the league. Speaking of high profile guard, Simmons certainly had to go up against a few of
them in the postseason. Last year. In the opening round, he spent a lot of time on Daniel Russell, who was then with the Brooklyn Nets. Russell around on the screen again, bot down Undernead Bett. Simmons the defensively for Philadelphia, and then of course in the second round he was the seventy Sixers primary man marking Kawhi land Runner one
on one with Simmons. Leonard Pluck high Simmons on the perimeter, and even for everything that Kawhi did, such a herculean effort he made, the seventy Sixers felt talking about Brett Brown and Elton Brand that Ben Simmons, for as much as he could, acquitted himself and made like difficult on Kawai. Simmons now is in rob his third year. Can you comp his progress to jump It seems like he's making
defensively to anyone else that you've seen before. At this day of Ben's career, I don't think there are a lot of comps for him specifically just because, as I mentioned, you know, the the uniqueness of his skill set you really don't see, you know, in an everyday context even you know, I wouldn't even know who to compare him too. Do you compare him to other bigs, other you know, do you comparement his wings, other guards, just because he
has a little bit of all of that. And it's you know, that ability to to guard Kawai, but also to guard James Harden and also to guard you know, Pascal Siakam if you want him to. And so that combination I think is what's so tricky with him and puts him in such a unique space. I think developmentally speaking, a lot of players, you know, within their specific defensive lanes, you'll see things start to click for them, you know, maybe three or four or five years into the league.
Ben I think was a really strong defender right out
of the gate. That was you know, part of what kind of separated him, and that his Rookie of the Year race to start was the fact that he was coming out, you know, into the league a pretty complete product, you know, jumper aside, you know, he was doing all these other things at such a high level, and that was really hard to argue with, you know, in the Rookie of the Year race, and then when you look at how he's grown since then, I think he's learned to use as about his body and his strength even
more effectively he was. He always had the instincts in terms of, you know, picking off passes that were just kind of hanging in the passing lanes a little too long. You know, really has a good sense of where the ball is going to be and how to position his body.
But then it comes down to, you know, how do you how do you compete against some of the best athletes in the world, some of the biggest and strongest athletes in the world, and how do you how do you kind of maneuver yourself to take advantage of whatever you know, skills and advantages you have. And I think that's where we've seen him kind of grow over the course these last couple of years, is really using that length to its fullest extent. You mentioned rob guys like
Luca don Chich and James Harden. Looking back over the last couple weeks, who Ben Simmons has had to go up against, but there's also been Bradley Beale, Jason Tatum at times, Pascal Siakam Jimmy Butler for the bulk of the seventy six or three games against the Miami Heat. So far that Ben has had to deal with any they're individual matchups that he's been featured in that have
really intrigued you. I think it's mostly on that end of the spectrum where just given a player of you know, of his size and clearly of his talents, you would expect him to, you know, if you need him to guard a pick and roll big, he can do that for you. If you need him to, you know, step in and be a small ball center. And we started, you know, guarding in his cancer a little bit when they played the Celtics with Joel out. Then he can do that, like that's just something a player his size
should be able to do. But the more miraculous thing are those matchups. It's, you know, it's guarding Bradley Beal. It's you know, a guy who covers more ground over the course of an NBA game than almost anybody else. And so it's those kinds of tireless assignments that I
think maybe he doesn't even get enough credit for. Within this conversation where there's guarding elite guards, and then there's guarding, you know, really trying to check guards who are going to run you ragged over the course of a game. And Simmons is a guy who I think, you know, offensively, you could certainly critique his energy level. You know, you want to see it be more aggressive at times, you want to see him attack the basket more directly at times. Defensively,
he kind of always brings it. And he's a guy who looks like he's flat footed a lot of the time. He looks like he might just be kind of chilling. But that's exactly at the moment when you know, the opponent tries to throw a pass out to reset the offense, and he just rips it and goes to the other side for a dunk. Nice defense on Rockmen, take it away by Simmons, who leads the NBA and steals all the way in and he slams for two what a half.
There's always this conversation about there being perhaps a blueprint on how to defend Ben Simmons in terms of his offensive skill set. But what type of things do coaches and opposing players have to think about? Given all that Ben is able to do on the opposite end of
the court with his defense. I mean, there's a lot to reckon with for sure, And I think some of that speaks to the Sixers more broadly, where you could go into a game against Philadelphia when fully healthy and just not have a good sense of who is going
to end up guarding your best player. I think that's kind of where where the Sixers have the greatest potential when you're looking at who they could be in the playoffs, and you know, especially if you're looking down the line and you know, who are the teams that could best match up with the honest at a Dakumpo and the Bucks and some of these other, you know, really good
teams in the Eastern Conference. Just the idea that, oh, we could put Simmons on a guy like Janis, or we could put Joel as we saw in the Christmas Day game, or we could put out Horford as we've
seen periodically over the course of his recent career. Having that variability as really is, you know, it really adds a level of complexity to those matchups that makes them so much harder to predict for opponents, so much harder to game plan for, and that's not even getting into you know, whether they want to talk about, you know, Matis Stable or Josh Richardson, who are you know, really strong defenders in their own right guarding Maybe a slightly
different variation of a player than Ben maybe on some nights, but all those pieces kind of interlocking. It is so hard to reckon with Simmons. The strip of ald Rage and other steel for bend first time open he slams for two. That was a year I haven't seen before in front of Matis style, able to split two defenders. But how about that handoff for Ben? A lot of what we've talked about so far with Ben has been
kind of I guess holistic I test related stuff. When you review some of the numbers defensively that Ben Simmons has been putting up first in the league and steals third, deflections first, and loose balls recovered, those stand out too. What do you make of those stats? How do you
reconcile them with what Ben's would do them? I mean, I think especially when you're talking about the kind of on ball recovering, you know, where there's steals and deflections things like that, I think that speaks more to a sense of timing than anything else, and his kind of understanding of the geometry of the floor. I mean, if you want to really break down basketball, it's a lot of kind of if then action. You know, if an offensive player drives in this particular way, where is he
most likely going to kick out the ball? Who is he going to be looking for? What are the reads that are going to be available to him? And I think Simmons, again, at a very young age coming into the league, already had kind of an inherent sense of
how those things work. And maybe there's an interplay there in terms of being a playmaker himself and kind of realizing what he would see on a potential d and what that means for the opponent, you know, the opposing point guard, and how he wants to play that in terms of, you know, where he might dig in to try to disrupt their dribble, how he might try to anticipate their passes and things like that. There's there's just a level of kind of basketball literacy with Ben that
is really impressive on an III basis. And again, the conversation around him gets so much bigger when you start talking about his offense and his jump shot and all the things you know he can't do, which are really in the grand scheme of things, are pretty limited when really we're talking about a player with a pretty high basketball IQ. And I think that's what's what sings out of those stats most consistently for me at the moment.
Of course, the seventy Sixers rob missing Joel Embid due to injury, How does that change what the team needs from Ben on defense? I mean it changes a lot.
I mean, and some of it, you know, if you really want to dig into the data around the Sixers in terms of, you know, which lineups are most effective defensively, which players have the best kinds of on off splits and things like that, a lot of it comes down to who's playing with Joel the most, because he's just a completely transformational defensive player, a guy who you know, you could stick on some of the best bigs in the league. But more importantly, it's just going to be
such a such an asset and help. And you know, having Al Horford is a luxury there. I think we've seen over the course of this year that just just having him, you're seeing the drop off from Joel to you know, the second unit. Biggs has been much less severe has even swung the sixers way in some occasions, so that's nice. But I think, especially with without and Beat in the lineup, the rest of this team is still kind of figuring out what they are defensively as
a team. There are a lot of really strong individual pieces, guys who either have been, you know, on excellent defensive teams and anchored excellent defensive teams in the past, or have shown kind of really strong individual defensive effort and talent. The question is how does all that fit together when you're taking out the you know, really the best and kind of the landmark defender at the bunch, And I
think they're still kind of fine tuning that. Whether it's you know, how exactly how Al Horford is positioning himself defensively in kind of a drop coverage, whether it's you know, the angles that Ben is taking, you know, the the rotations particularly you know when you're talking about Tobias Harris or players like that. There's still a lot to work out, and I think that's what sort of seen kind of some of the unevenness and the sloppiness in some of
these games. But I think the talent overall, the credibility, and the credentials there is kind of unimpeachable, and so it's really I think more of a matter of when the niff for the Sixers. But obviously there's the question of, you know, when you're getting Joel back into this lineup and whether they'll really have time to kind of form their own defensive identity without him. The seventy Sixers still have about half the season to go to fine tune
some things, work on things. But going back to when they first got together, they've been talking about having championship aspirations. We know the seventy Sixers want to make a deep run in the playoffs. When it comes to Ben Simmons and the defense he's playing, how much do you see that translating from what he's been doing so far in the regular season to the playoffs when it matters the most.
I don't see too much of a distinction in his case, and some of that is again because there's such a wide arrange of what he could offer you where you know, I think there are a lot of really great players in the league who you put them in a playoff setting and you ask them to guard an opposing superstar who might struggle just given the particulars of that superstar skill set. You know, maybe they do they attack in a specific way that this defender might be vulnerable too.
Within that's not really as much of an issue because even if he does struggle in a particular matchup, you could move him to other ones in which he could still have a huge impact. And so I think with his game, it really is just a matter of moving the chess pieces around, which is exactly where you want to be in terms of planning a long term, in terms of looking forward to the postseason, I think he gives you a lot of variability. Ben was build all
over the importsimilar he seemed like chess pie. The plays that he can make from an athletic stampoint, the plays that he makes from a physical stampoint is just elague. You know, you hear me sort of cheer lead the cause of him being on an NBA All Defensive team, And it's examples like that to me make it a no brainer. Rap From what you've been able to gather in terms of following the league and doing some reporting, what does the rest of the league say about Ben's defense?
I feel like the media narrative has been pretty favorable and praiseworthy of his defensive impact this year. Are players coaches seeing similar things? I think they are, And you know, some of it again is within the broader tapestry of the Sixers in general not being a particularly fun team to play against. I think, you know, just their sheer size throws a lot of teams for a loop, and you know, you kind of know going into those games what you're going to be in for from that perspective,
you know, just in terms of size and physicality. As far as Ben's defense specifically, you do hear some praise around the league. I think it's starting to get a little bit louder, but these reputations do take a little bit of time to catch up sometimes. So you know, if you ask people who are the best defensive guards in the league, I don't think Ben Simmons is going to be the first name out of their mouth, in part because they may not even think of him as
a guard. So you know, you may jump to Patrick Beverley first, so you may jump to you know, whoever. You know, if you want to think about some wings as guards, then that conversation gets broader. I think Ben, you know, given the players, you know, I think he's
clearly a point guard functionally for their offense. I think he guards ends up guarding a lot of point guards defensively, because, as we've talked about, that ability to maneuver around screens, to stay in front of action, to keep involved makes him really well suited to do that. Whether you know, Josh Richardson or him or whoever ends up guarding a point guard in a given night is more of a
coach's decision than anything else. So I think you know, when you when you really barrel down into that conversation about who are the best defensive guards in the league, Ben is at or you know, at or near the top of that list. Whether the player base in the league fully acknowledges that or not, just from perspective of positionality,
I think it is a different question. Brett Brown has referred to Ben Simmons already in the conversation of all League defensive candidate, potential defensive Player of the Year candidate. Do you think he has a shot any of those lofty honors? I mean, I think he certainly looks like a first team defender to me, given what he's done so far, And you know, we're again, we're only halfway
through the season. Things can change, whether because of injury, because of guys force into different roles, or sometimes players will just shine over the back half of the year. So there's definitely a race to be run. But in terms of what he gives you, I just see something completely different than any other guards skill set in the league, something so much more broad or so much more important.
You know, point guard defense historically has been kind of a thorny conversation because, you know, as we kind of alluded to and talking about, Joel, Biggs can just have such a different impact in terms of the way they help. You know, it's really valuable to have a guy who can lock in on one opponent, who can be a stopper on the perimeter, who can get them out of
their first move. That's an important thing to have. But when you look at kind of defensive data that's available, a lot of it points to the idea that having that high level secondary defender, the shot block or the rim protector, or the guy who's covering space like Draymond Green who can cover angle and things like that, that
that's even more important. And I think Ben kind of bridges that divide in a way that no other guard does, where he's giving you some of the stopper potential that some of the best perimeter defenders in the league have, and also some of that rotation and help and just the ability that you know, even if he's guarding on the perimeter off the ball and you need someone to kind of help in against a pick and roll, that guy is, you know, a six ten player with great
instincts who's going to time that pretty well for letting you go. Rob. We've talked exclusively about Ben Simmons any other seventy sixers impressions at the midway point of the season, Thoughts on how things could ultimately shake out as the
year moves along. I mean, there's there's so many thoughts with this team, to be honest with you, It's been such a strange season for them overall, and you know, they feel so much like a team that is struggling to kind of define itself to you, to figure out not not what kind of team they want to be, but how they want to go about specific actions, how they want to manage and balance things between this line that I think, you know, especially going into the season
for people in our profession is just dizzying to think about all the potential of having this much size and skill pulled together in one roster. The possibilities of that are really fascinating. I don't think we've seen them quite make good on that yet over any extended period of time. You see it for a quarter, you see it for a half, you see it for you know, maybe a particular statement game where they really get up for their opponent. The question with them is really can they sustain that?
And because I think when you talk to the other teams, especially in the East, there's a lot of respect for what the Sixers could be, and so the question is whether whether Philly can make good on that at a level where they're playing championship level of basketball every game. It's a tough thing, you know, it's a tough thing to get up for mentally, it's a tough thing to sustain emotionally over the course of an eighty two game
season and then some. But I don't think there's any question that the Sixers have the ability to do that. I think that's what puts them in such an interesting space going into the back half of the year. Always a great an even better conversation Rob Mahoney from The Ringer. Thanks so much man. Thanks. You can follow Rob on Twitter at Rob Mahoney if you're not yet doing so
already certainly highly recommended you doing so. And a reminder that the morning after every seventy six Ers game this season, a fresh, brand new episode of our Rewind series appears in your feed. You can get some game highlights from the outstanding Tom McGuinness here, portions of Brett Brown's postgame press conference, and some additional commentary from myself and Tom about what we just saw. It's Rewind and it comes you away the morning after every seventy Sixers game from
us here at the Sixers Podcast Network. That's all I got. Talked to you next time right here on the broadcast see it