[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome in Bears fans to this episode of Bear Bones. [SPEAKER_01]: As always, I am Mason West and go host Danny Mean. [SPEAKER_01]: Danny, how you doing today? [SPEAKER_00]: I'm good, may so much or so. [SPEAKER_01]: Not too shabby. [SPEAKER_01]: We wanted to make sure that we got you an episode for the fourth of July, probably weekend, maybe tomorrow you're driving to your in-laws in Michigan or in Wisconsin, and you need something for the road.
[SPEAKER_01]: I personally will be going to Wisconsin, where I should now excuse me why I say that. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to Michigan. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to doing some brewery hopping of starting in Benton Harbor and then working my way back to Illinois. [SPEAKER_01]: How about you Danny? [SPEAKER_00]: I will be at work. [SPEAKER_01]: No, wait, less fun than what I'm doing. [SPEAKER_00]: But what are you doing super important for the July at the firehouse? [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty fun.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll probably be doing like, I'm the cook for my shift. [SPEAKER_00]: So I'll be probably doing like your typical barbecue grill out thing for lunch, like burgers and dogs and dinner. [SPEAKER_00]: I've decided I'm probably going to three to one method some ribs for all the men. [SPEAKER_01]: Ooh, okay, okay. [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, not too. [SPEAKER_01]: Not too shabby. [SPEAKER_01]: But what we have in store for you today, we did this last year. [SPEAKER_01]: I liked it.
[SPEAKER_01]: I have no idea today's impression of it. [SPEAKER_01]: But I think, you know, in the dead time, it's a good time to kind of look and see where we're at before actual news starts coming back out about some of these positions in terms of our confidence and concern about where the death chart lies and then also how this job death chart is going to compare across the NFC or. [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, and I'll be honest with you, Maison.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's been kind of, I've really up until the last few days when I started like going through these depth charts and whatnot for the show that we're doing. [SPEAKER_00]: It's been kind of nice to just turn football off in my brain. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I'd see stuff in our group chat and it's like, I don't care. [SPEAKER_00]: None of this means anything like today. [SPEAKER_00]: We had the Rubin Hippelife's been working in it weekside linebacker today. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, neat.
[SPEAKER_00]: The fast guy who tests well, theoretically looks good in shells. [SPEAKER_00]: That shocks me, guys. [SPEAKER_00]: Come on, what do we do? [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and it's interesting, we can get into this when we dive in. [SPEAKER_01]: But it's interesting that Ben Johnson does specifically call out a guy like Ruben Hippolyte, but at the same time, is it a degree of pandering? [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_01]: Ben Johnson is in a pandering kind of guy.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think he'd rest for a random name. [SPEAKER_01]: Like you said, at the same time, it's shells. [SPEAKER_01]: He should look very, very good. [SPEAKER_01]: And we'll see what happens when it's, you know, preseason second game, you know, second preseason season, I could have said the word season a lot there. [SPEAKER_01]: And what he's actually doing there, how much playing time.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think of the day two, that position that linebacker spot is on this longer starter, right? [SPEAKER_01]: It's niggle. [SPEAKER_01]: You're starting. [SPEAKER_00]: You're starting deep. [SPEAKER_00]: That's yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: Which is why they paid Tyler so much money. [SPEAKER_01]: And that's going to bring us to our confidence concern meter here.
[SPEAKER_01]: So like what we're going to do, like I said, we're going to go from the position we are the most confident in that right now as it sits, don't need to touch the room, don't need to edit it, that you're pretty happy with what it looks like all the way down to our least confident and we're as we're going through this. [SPEAKER_01]: So Danny, what is the position that you are the most confident in at this point going a couple weeks away from getting into training camp?
[SPEAKER_00]: So we, I'm so I'm guessing because there's nine were separating corner and safety, right? [SPEAKER_01]: Those ones are separate for this activity and then they're paired together when we get paired. [SPEAKER_00]: So I would say right now just because of how good he was still last year. [SPEAKER_00]: I would probably put corner is the position on most confident in like just because Kyler Gordon's very good.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jalen Johnson's still at the very near near the apex or the peak of the positional grouping right now. [SPEAKER_00]: for cornerbacks. [SPEAKER_00]: Teralsmith is a personal player. [SPEAKER_00]: I think Tyreek Stevenson for all things considered no matter how bad his second season, second half of the season was. [SPEAKER_00]: He's still a talented football player. [SPEAKER_00]: So I think right now corner is where I would put my confidence.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I hope it's like I like people who have not listened to this before watching for Danny and I tried to do as much of this up separate ways possible and then just kind of do it off the off the cuff when we get on here because it's more natural and we don't want to influence what is thinking nothing would anyway we're both very independent people when it comes to this. [SPEAKER_01]: But I also had corner as the first and think on the most confident.
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to pair this together with also my second position, which is wider silver, because I think you hit on the end to the wide corner should be there in terms of Jalen Johnson. [SPEAKER_01]: between his skills. [SPEAKER_01]: I believe he's like the tenth highest paid corner right now. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going off the top. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like tenth or eleven some more like that. [SPEAKER_01]: But you're getting I mean true number one corner out of him.
[SPEAKER_01]: You can swivel with what's happening at corner two, but you're having a playable corner regardless there, right? [SPEAKER_01]: I think that Tyrik is in for a bounce back and you look at the Dennis Allen of it all when you look at, you know, secondary position coach at this point in time. [SPEAKER_01]: I think they're going to get him right. [SPEAKER_01]: He did look better at the end of last year as well. [SPEAKER_01]: So I think Tyrik, he's very, very skilled.
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's getting twisted where he's like a bad corner. [SPEAKER_01]: He's not. [SPEAKER_01]: He's a good corner back. [SPEAKER_01]: And then worst case scenario, like you were talking about, you have to melt Smith there as well. [SPEAKER_01]: And the bare secondary was not necessarily like a problem for them last year. [SPEAKER_01]: That was not their issue. [SPEAKER_01]: And part of this is also why I'm not trying to as a receiver.
[SPEAKER_01]: You could also hide your corners a little bit if you really want to, with how much zone that you play. [SPEAKER_01]: with how you're going to organize that defense. [SPEAKER_01]: If you have so weakness there, it doesn't, it's not as belaring as some other positions. [SPEAKER_01]: And then you already talked about Crowley Gordon. [SPEAKER_01]: We don't have to, we have to, he's fantastic.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's one of the best guys at his position, whether it's playing action, a slot, whether it's blitzing, whether it's covering the tight end. [SPEAKER_01]: He's absolutely fantastic. [SPEAKER_01]: But that led, so for me, in terms of why you're silver, why that's number two and not number one, there's just more question marks. [SPEAKER_01]: And by that I mean, DJ Moore, [SPEAKER_01]: It has been an on again, off again, whiter see for one for me, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Like he had a year like you did with Justin that one with a Washington game with fantastic, but then you have last year where it's like you didn't look like you didn't want to be there at the time. [SPEAKER_01]: Rome did not get targeted as much as we would have hoped, plus he was a rookie, keen and allen really overshadowed him just in my opinion in terms of what that offense looks like.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you have guys who you're confident in that they're going to be helpful, helpful, you know, Zacchaeus, Devon Dubernase, more of a special team guy, but again, that's kind of a question mark. [SPEAKER_01]: We have no idea we're going to get out with the burden. [SPEAKER_01]: Tyler Scott has been absolutely just [SPEAKER_01]: Pretty used. [SPEAKER_01]: He does not play special teams and he's done absolutely nothing.
[SPEAKER_01]: So for me, that's why, again, I'm not like, it's not an issue. [SPEAKER_01]: It's not number nine, but I'm more confident in what I'll make get out of the quarterback room and that I'd want to worry about it. [SPEAKER_01]: Just slightly more compared to why I'm sure. [SPEAKER_00]: I think that's fair. [SPEAKER_00]: I had to I had weder see for it three personally. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, why I'm see for at three.
[SPEAKER_01]: So what was your, so why didn't that end up at three for you? [SPEAKER_01]: Like, over some, why is it more concerning than four? [SPEAKER_00]: So it's more concerning for me because I, I don't think Rome's going to be bad. [SPEAKER_00]: I think a lot of the things Rome made mistakes with isn't a physical ability thing. [SPEAKER_00]: I think he might be dumb and that scares me.
[SPEAKER_00]: like I can't I know it's a one what the touchdown thing where he's completely out of bounds on the unfilled in headlines like I get it it's one but it's like it was like the precursor to I almost feel he doesn't know where he's supposed to be and that might be a time like it comes in time thing it also might just be a guy who's really talented [SPEAKER_00]: who may never have picked up the true nuances of playing offense that wasn't just, hey, I'm really talented.
[SPEAKER_00]: So that worries me. [SPEAKER_00]: I think the Luther bird and DJ more skill sets are very redundant. [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't know how you can manifest and use both of them, but that's Ben Johnson's job. [SPEAKER_00]: After that, I think it's a case is good. [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's a good solid strong wide receiver room. [SPEAKER_00]: I just have more questions specifically about Rome and the fit of the burden early on, then probably war and tabbing.
[SPEAKER_01]: You mean more in burden or Roman burden? [SPEAKER_00]: more and more DJ Jordan had a lot of a lot of all I think. [SPEAKER_01]: And there's been conversation there, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: Is Luther Burden pick a DJ more insurance policy, whether it's attitude, injury, or, you know, just a contract you want to move off of in a year or two, potentially, it wouldn't be any time soon if you did that, but that's all future have, we're not sure, but yeah, like you said, it's the Ben Johnson's job to figure out how you get all those [SPEAKER_01]: pieces to fit together, because you're hoping it's not like last year, where it was just real clunky.
[SPEAKER_01]: You had guys running routes that didn't make sense. [SPEAKER_01]: You had Keenan Allen who just lost us two steps and also which is being forced by the ball. [SPEAKER_01]: But again, we're we're not overly concerned. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Danny hasn't met three I met two, but it's just it's not as clean right now as the quarterback room or who did you have that number two? [SPEAKER_01]: Safety.
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, I'm laughing, well, you'll see why I'm laughing as I hear. [SPEAKER_01]: Safety, why did you have safety as number two? [SPEAKER_00]: I think Kevin buyer is a solid a solid arms. [SPEAKER_00]: He's he's got probably the most important ability in all of football. [SPEAKER_00]: He's available every game. [SPEAKER_00]: You know Kevin buyer is going to be playing football to this point news career at least. [SPEAKER_00]: I think he's still really solid.
[SPEAKER_00]: If not unsightacular. [SPEAKER_00]: Um, I think Chiquan Brisker is one of the better box attitude tempo setting safeties in the NFL and they very much missed him last year. [SPEAKER_00]: Um, after he went down with that concussion post the Carolina game where he killed a man and therefore killed himself. [SPEAKER_01]: Most things except for the, with the brisk or stuff, he wasn't even his fault. [SPEAKER_01]: It was Ian Thomas put his head into Japan brisk or whatever.
[SPEAKER_00]: And there's a multitude of questions I know that we've got of the handling of his concussion and whatnot and his contract status at the moment. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I get it. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's, that's the biggest hangup and why I almost did flip corner and safety. [SPEAKER_00]: But then you go to the other end with Jonathan Holmes is an NFL football player. [SPEAKER_00]: He's a legitimate, like, he can play.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's not great, but you can throw him out there and not feel like it's an absolute negative that he's playing safety for you. [SPEAKER_00]: And he's a special team's contributor. [SPEAKER_00]: So for all those reasons, I had to put him into, I didn't think that hard about it when I was doing it, because I think the bears overall secondary room is really well put together. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly to like you said, Kevin Byrd, like just doesn't miss games.
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he was seventeen of seventeen games started games played for the Bears. [SPEAKER_01]: He was ten of ten for Philly. [SPEAKER_01]: He was six or six or ten see the year before that. [SPEAKER_01]: And then, you know, even more so before before then. [SPEAKER_01]: And he's just a professional safety. [SPEAKER_01]: He's going to be in the right spot in these going to do the right thing.
[SPEAKER_01]: is either long term safety for the bears at this point, you know, that's a future question, but like for this year, if you've got us in twenty five. [SPEAKER_01]: The Briskers stuff. [SPEAKER_01]: If to look at him multiple ways, one is to look at how that concussion happened. [SPEAKER_01]: Like I said, it was Ian Thomas into him versus Britskernis, necessarily, you know, creating a dangerous contact.
[SPEAKER_01]: And without getting into too much detail on it, I know bears fans as they're sitting there and there's not seeing him play and the concussions are scary and they're thinking, well, he's not playing. [SPEAKER_01]: Therefore, this must be a very bad concussion. [SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, in the story came out in terms of him going that specialist, Yadiyada. [SPEAKER_01]: It's not all that it seems in terms of it being a, oh, like, that was a horrendous concussion.
[SPEAKER_01]: There's more behind the scenes going on. [SPEAKER_01]: He's back full now. [SPEAKER_01]: That's all you have to worry about. [SPEAKER_01]: And that anytime you get to even the question, there's a higher chance of you getting another one, just like if you get a hamstring train, you have a higher chance of getting another one.
[SPEAKER_01]: That being said, [SPEAKER_01]: I think in my professional opinion as someone who treats concussions pretty regularly, I'm not overly concerned about him for this year. [SPEAKER_01]: It's still gonna happen. [SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be wrong, so it's not gonna happen, but I'm not overly concerned. [SPEAKER_01]: And like the last thing I'll say on that for safety, because the reason I was laughing before I had safety in number three. [SPEAKER_01]: very similar what you had any.
[SPEAKER_01]: Your backups, you know, Jonathan Owens professional safety that could protect start. [SPEAKER_01]: You could start for another team, right? [SPEAKER_01]: He's not blowing you away with it and you would like to probably upgrade that position, but you're not losing sleep at night, knowing Jonathan Owens is starting for you tomorrow. [SPEAKER_01]: Elijah Hicks played well last year. [SPEAKER_01]: Again, nothing, nothing special.
[SPEAKER_01]: Nothing crazy, but he can keep gives you special teams any played well when he needed to start. [SPEAKER_01]: So that's so it's a solid room. [SPEAKER_01]: All right, next, what do you have is your fourth most confident position? [SPEAKER_00]: This is where the wheels kind of fall off because it's like kind of pick what you believe in versus what you don't believe in. [SPEAKER_00]: I put linebackers at four. [SPEAKER_00]: Interesting, okay.
[SPEAKER_01]: So why do you linebacker here? [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's a product across the lead linebacker play just kind of sucks. [SPEAKER_00]: And the bears don't outright suck at linebacker play. [SPEAKER_00]: Um, and they TJ Edwards still attacking machine extended clearly Dennis Allen likes and he's going to probably be your Mike this year. [SPEAKER_00]: So he's going to have the green dot all that stuff. [SPEAKER_00]: Um, to make Edmunds, he is what he is.
[SPEAKER_00]: He he offense my sensibilities to watch play because he just wants nothing to do with coming downhill and and putting his face in face mask in someone's chest. [SPEAKER_00]: But that that's neither here nor there. [SPEAKER_00]: What he's good at is taking away the deep metal being covered lineback or being enormous like for better for worse like being enormous in coverage matters. [SPEAKER_00]: He's got these tree vine arms. [SPEAKER_00]: He's huge. [SPEAKER_00]: He's fast.
[SPEAKER_00]: He's athletic. [SPEAKER_00]: He's running chase like [SPEAKER_00]: He does a job and he does it fairly well. [SPEAKER_00]: And he wasn't awful last year. [SPEAKER_00]: Again, I will never critique the play in terms of production. [SPEAKER_00]: He is productive. [SPEAKER_00]: I will critique how I feel when I watch you play though. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I don't think he plays line back or the way the position is meant to be played. [SPEAKER_00]: That's amazing.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not telling anyone else how to feel. [SPEAKER_00]: But he is a good football player. [SPEAKER_00]: I think Noah's soul is can be used in a wave within a sound or if he's used in Blitz production. [SPEAKER_00]: And if you remember a couple years ago when they affected him, that's exactly what I said on this very show. [SPEAKER_00]: With I think his little key to being successful in this NFL league in the league is to be used as a as a de facto like Sam Rush Blitzer.
[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's Hepalite, who's the great unknown. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not even going to attempt to say the man's name, who's a special team, Zase, who's a good athlete. [SPEAKER_01]: You're talking about Amin Agpong, Veninga? [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry for me. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, let's go. [SPEAKER_00]: Him, special teams Zase. [SPEAKER_00]: They've got a lot of athletes and a lot of good bodies.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think it's a great position room, but I don't think it's awful, which is why it ends up at four out of nine. [SPEAKER_01]: So I put it, it makes sense of just do it this way. [SPEAKER_01]: I put linebacker further down than you did. [SPEAKER_01]: I put it at number E actually. [SPEAKER_01]: So in terms of a pretty concerning position for me. [SPEAKER_01]: The reason I did so was because [SPEAKER_01]: to two main things.
[SPEAKER_01]: One, TJ Edwards is creeping older in a position that gets a lot of wear and tear. [SPEAKER_01]: So at age, he's only like till be twenty nine, I believe. [SPEAKER_00]: Well, he was a, he was a subpar athlete when he came out. [SPEAKER_00]: Now he's got hundreds upon hundreds of collisions on a [SPEAKER_00]: under under athletic body. [SPEAKER_01]: And he plays with instinct. [SPEAKER_01]: That's his calling card. [SPEAKER_01]: He's in the right place at the right time.
[SPEAKER_01]: If you lose a half step or a step at age, twenty nine, what does that look like? [SPEAKER_01]: If he gets hurt, what does that look like? [SPEAKER_01]: And so because I don't like the depth behind him. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I just [SPEAKER_01]: talking about her, um, school, stays hurt. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. [SPEAKER_01]: He's always on the injury report or out. [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, what's that look like? [SPEAKER_01]: Um, and it's just a dude.
[SPEAKER_01]: And you obviously, they don't love their linebacking core as well. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, or at least a deaf win. [SPEAKER_01]: They were using Daniel Hardy a bit at linebacker in many camp and stuff of that nature. [SPEAKER_01]: And don't give me, I can't, and so what comes to train at events? [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have the exact stat. [SPEAKER_01]: The applied football show talked about this in one of their shows about I think it was two weeks ago.
[SPEAKER_01]: When you looked at the bear's defense in terms of passes over the middle, I mean, they led the league in not allowing that. [SPEAKER_01]: So clearly he's doing that job, right? [SPEAKER_01]: He's his ridiculous wingspan and frame doing the job.
[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm just concerned that if an injury happens, whether it's on in a live-backing core or like we saw last year, when you lose Andrew Billings, how the middle just opens up because you don't have the linebackers that are going to be able to get in there and plug up the holes then or now exposed. [SPEAKER_01]: That's where my concern comes out. [SPEAKER_00]: So mine was a top end talent. [SPEAKER_00]: Truthfully. [SPEAKER_01]: And I totally get that.
[SPEAKER_01]: That makes sense to me. [SPEAKER_01]: My number four, [SPEAKER_01]: is one of your favorite players in rooms is, I didn't. [SPEAKER_00]: I had them five. [SPEAKER_01]: I put them at four because [SPEAKER_01]: Cole commit is solid, right? [SPEAKER_01]: He is going to, for the, and past blocking, he's for the most part going to be in the right spot. [SPEAKER_01]: He's going to get your block in run blocking.
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes there's some hit and miss there, but, but, and as a receiver, when he's actually targeted, when he, we look at him and throw him the ball. [SPEAKER_01]: He catches pretty much everything. [SPEAKER_01]: He gets open, not from your traditional Sam Laporta, Kelsey, Kittle, athleticism, but like he uses his frame and gets open. [SPEAKER_01]: And it's very frustrating for me to last year. [SPEAKER_01]: It did make sense. [SPEAKER_01]: It's like just throw him the ding ball.
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, are there problems with that he that have come up with him? [SPEAKER_01]: A hundred percent and he had a couple mental errors. [SPEAKER_01]: Like when it came to some penalties, you know, on the rub rouse, things of that nature. [SPEAKER_01]: Some of his run blocking was a little funky, but I attribute that as much to the issues with the run scheme and the offensive line as much as they do with Colcompet, particularly. [SPEAKER_01]: But now you also bring in Colson Lovelin.
[SPEAKER_01]: I get it. [SPEAKER_01]: He's a rookie. [SPEAKER_01]: He's coming off that shoulder surgery. [SPEAKER_01]: But that's just something that I am confident that a guy like Ben Johnson, like we saw [SPEAKER_01]: Sam McCorda, we'll be able to get the most out of him in terms of what they're able to do there. [SPEAKER_01]: Give Durham Smyth who actually did. [SPEAKER_01]: was a useful player in Miami previously, like it wasn't mind blowing, but it was a useful player.
[SPEAKER_01]: So when it comes to that, like, what do you need on your Titan room, me the the block, you need them to run up the seams and catch, that's what you add a minimum need, and then things after that, like you're hoping that lovelin can be in terms of, again, the sample portas, or the, um, why am I blinking on the cardinals of Titan for all of a sudden? [SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna go with Isaiah likely.
[SPEAKER_01]: Isaiah likely out of the Ravens because I can't remember what that heck the cardal side of the name is for some reason. [SPEAKER_01]: That's your pie in the sky, I hope, but in terms of a solid position group tied in for me. [SPEAKER_01]: Why is what what about you? [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty much all the reasons you stated. [SPEAKER_00]: It's solid, not unspectacular, which gets you right in the middle. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't have a ton of worry, but I just think it's your talk, kind of about banking a lot for a rookie. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: And Miller is, or not Miller. [SPEAKER_00]: Comet is what he is. [SPEAKER_00]: Salad Blocker, Salad receiver, I don't expect much from him, other than just he's going to exist. [SPEAKER_00]: He's going to do his job when it's called upon him.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think in general, if you, if you could do like a freeze frame, right, if you could play as called snaps ball thrown, you see the balls in a year heading towards Cole commit. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know about you, but I'm more often than I'm going to be like, he's catching that ball. [SPEAKER_01]: He just, he doesn't drop it unless it's throwing him. [SPEAKER_00]: I think I think catching it is, I expect him to catch it and kind of just fall down.
[SPEAKER_00]: Honestly, like, and there's nothing wrong with that. [SPEAKER_00]: That's a useful player. [SPEAKER_01]: catch it and usually he falls usually forward for like a yard or two. [SPEAKER_01]: So if he runs an eight year route, cool, because I'm getting eight or nine yards and I'm more than okay with that on second and ten. [SPEAKER_01]: And then at this point, too, his contract is aging well.
[SPEAKER_01]: I know people are trying to like just trade him away, like when the whole Miami thing popped up where they traded away, John, who smithed, and people just up out to comment like [SPEAKER_01]: To me, this is a whole conversation, but Devon HN is a better, yes, but essentially, DeAndre Swift, he was, I think, fifth in the league in rushing yards over expected, which was, in terms of bottom of the league, which is not very good.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's, he's explosive, but he doesn't hit the whole super well. [SPEAKER_01]: I just don't, I don't need that. [SPEAKER_01]: I also don't need to give away useful players that, at positions that clearly, Ben Johnson wants talent to, or at least moderate talent to. [SPEAKER_00]: Agreed. [SPEAKER_01]: Um, for me number five was quarterback. [SPEAKER_01]: This is a little over back at seven. [SPEAKER_01]: Quarterback at seven. [SPEAKER_01]: Well, for that.
[SPEAKER_01]: So why did you have quarterback lower here? [SPEAKER_01]: Proved to the low below. [SPEAKER_00]: Pro, prove it to me. [SPEAKER_00]: Like the idea of Caleb Williams is what people are hanging their head around. [SPEAKER_00]: He had one of the top five rookie top five pairs of quarterbacking seasons in team history by the metrics. [SPEAKER_00]: I get it. [SPEAKER_00]: Like I kind of don't care because it was a lot of throwing the ball on the games out of reach.
[SPEAKER_00]: It was a lot of [SPEAKER_00]: nonsense like it was just not a good season. [SPEAKER_00]: It was dysfunctional and was disjointed. [SPEAKER_00]: It was a whole lot of just and and all the ugly habits we saw at USC that we were worried about. [SPEAKER_00]: They reared their ugly head in the worst kind of way.
[SPEAKER_00]: He took what the third or fourth most sacks in Lee history for one season like he got hit a lot and credit to me never really missed time like [SPEAKER_00]: He's clearly a tough kid. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not do me him, but I can't say the competence major should be super high either because I don't think it should be. [SPEAKER_00]: You got to prove it to me to earn confidence. [SPEAKER_01]: And that's a totally fair way to take it. [SPEAKER_00]: It's purely talented.
[SPEAKER_00]: It's purely talent versus production right now. [SPEAKER_01]: I justified having this higher for two reasons. [SPEAKER_01]: One, there's a couple of positions that I'm just overall over on, so that's one of them. [SPEAKER_01]: Two, when you look at, you're actually right. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, look at Kale, you're your last year. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he had an EPA per play of negative. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, five.
[SPEAKER_01]: That was between Daniel Jones and Anthony Richardson, who were both arguably very good, not good quarterbacks at this point in time. [SPEAKER_01]: He had a ten percent sac percentage, which led the league, in sacs take with sixty eight of them. [SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, when you look at next-gen stats, Williams also had fifty sub-unblock pressures and thirteen-unblock sacks, which led the leap for both.
[SPEAKER_01]: And when you look at the paper play, so much the e-paper play at this point is also driven by sacks, right? [SPEAKER_01]: And then Johnson said that, like sacks, sacks kill you like that. [SPEAKER_01]: And so when the reason I'm a little higher here than maybe, like you are at this point, is there's so much of the group to me, but if you can just [SPEAKER_01]: The things that Ben Johnson is good, and this is a bank on Ben Johnson, right?
[SPEAKER_01]: The things that Ben Johnson is good at, that he got golf doing, right? [SPEAKER_01]: Getting the ball out quickly, getting it to your track guns when you need to, being able to avoid sacks and understanding the game, all these different things. [SPEAKER_01]: And you look at what Kille was having to go through with all of the line issues, with the film issues, with just the general lack of play, play called creativity and stacking the plays, all of these things.
[SPEAKER_01]: When you tie all that together, it makes me more confident that we can see [SPEAKER_01]: The good things from USC Caleb because that's a thing too, right? [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, something like the deep ball. [SPEAKER_01]: The deep ball is a confident throw. [SPEAKER_01]: You need to be confident that the ball's going to be where you want it to be, but there was no confidence instilled in Caleb because they can for sure.
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's a little bit of a pie in the sky hope, but I do agree with that. [SPEAKER_01]: But when you, when you look at all the things now that are around him, the hopefully the Van Johnson effects and again, a little lower on a couple of positions, I have a quarterback there. [SPEAKER_01]: Where, what did you have above quarterbacks? [SPEAKER_01]: You had tidied it five, you had quarterbacks.
[SPEAKER_00]: I put it above quarterback for the simple reason of you added a Hall of Fame talent in Joe Toney. [SPEAKER_00]: You added a guy that had his best years in the NFL underben Johnson in Jonah Jackson. [SPEAKER_00]: You added a guy who's per of the PFF metrics, one of the five or six best centers in football, the last few years. [SPEAKER_00]: they spent money and you put into it, they drafted a left tackle very high from Boston College and Dr. Fellow.
[SPEAKER_00]: They first bad as Darnell Wright looked the first five or six weeks of the season. [SPEAKER_00]: He looked almost like it did like a complete one, eighty and was looked like one of the preaminent right tackles by the end of the season. [SPEAKER_00]: You know, so I think the confidence should be there that it should get better with better coaching, better, better offensive line help, better
[SPEAKER_00]: everything scheme wise and better talent for it to be this should be a top I'm not even gonna say top third like a top be a top half of the league offensive line which should be if Caleb is what everyone says he is it should be more than enough because I stand by the thought I've always had if you need a good running game the good set of receivers and a good offensive line for your quarterback to be good I got bad news about your quarterback
[SPEAKER_01]: You think that's probably not very good. [SPEAKER_00]: He's probably not a very good player. [SPEAKER_01]: So we both had office line at six funny enough. [SPEAKER_01]: The reason why I had office line at six versus quarterback at five, because of the, how you have to look at the office line and totality and how, and how they have the gel together, right? [SPEAKER_01]: You see the really good lines. [SPEAKER_01]: They're able to play off each other.
[SPEAKER_01]: They're able to, you know, sometimes you need some time, even, like, and you don't have a lot of time, right? [SPEAKER_01]: Especially in today's NFL with decreased practice time in the summer and everything like that. [SPEAKER_01]: This is going to be very new. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I would have anything expected to look better next year because of that time.
[SPEAKER_01]: depending on how enjoyed tune in all that jazz in terms of age and if he could stay at the top top pro bowl over that he's in playing. [SPEAKER_01]: And the second thing for me is left tackle. [SPEAKER_01]: Like you just don't know at this point in time what's happening at left tackle. [SPEAKER_01]: You're, you have two pathways essentially, like a particular story, but one is Brexon Jones can come in the first second week training camp.
[SPEAKER_01]: Can knock all the rust off and can be a solid left tackle for you like he was last year because he is a solid left tackle. [SPEAKER_01]: People who are negative on him, it's just weird to me. [SPEAKER_01]: Um, the or the second path is. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my god. [SPEAKER_01]: Yes or Aussie Trapillo. [SPEAKER_01]: blows you away, and he's just that solid. [SPEAKER_01]: But if he had the day rookie tackles struggle, they do. [SPEAKER_01]: There's a different speed to the game.
[SPEAKER_01]: He played left tackle switch to right. [SPEAKER_01]: He was a little bit, he was better at right. [SPEAKER_01]: So there's a problem reason for that. [SPEAKER_01]: And the third path I'm working would be Braxon Jones is too hurt. [SPEAKER_01]: Ozzy is not ready, but you throw Ozzy out there or you're throwing, you know, a coronamagogy out there because you have to. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't need necessity.
[SPEAKER_01]: So because of that unfunciness, I just had to put line a bit lower. [SPEAKER_00]: Understand? [SPEAKER_00]: It's a reasonable thing. [SPEAKER_00]: I was just more intelligent about the overall and believing in the static yet. [SPEAKER_00]: But you're right. [SPEAKER_00]: The biggest thing with offensive line is cohesion and continuity. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. [SPEAKER_01]: So my number seven, just as I say in order here, I put running back.
[SPEAKER_01]: I really wanted to and I think this is probably just because of the running back in me that when I played it and just the spitefulness and I wanted to throw it at like number nine just to be like a big middle finger especially because everyone and their mother had circled that you need to address running back this year in a big way because of not just the Ben Johnson of it all with you know the running back room you had it with the lines but also this running game sucks last year it was not good well guess where I put it makes it
[SPEAKER_01]: The reason I put it at seven and not at like nine is a couple reasons. [SPEAKER_01]: One, I do think that Ben Johnson is going to be able to get the most out of what you have. [SPEAKER_01]: I think two, the offensive line play is better and you should be getting better running lanes available. [SPEAKER_01]: I already alluded to this a little bit, but this scheme should be better.
[SPEAKER_01]: The the run gaming no sense last year like the block you so guys didn't know where they were blocking it was a whole thing. [SPEAKER_01]: I also think and hope that Rochon Johnson is going to get this year with a little more tenacity. [SPEAKER_01]: removed from those concussions, because those concussions robbed some of the violence he ran with, which I think affected it. [SPEAKER_01]: Also, I mean, the dude was a really good goal line back.
[SPEAKER_01]: Every time he touched the ball, it was either a first down or a touch down, and just wasn't really used. [SPEAKER_01]: I think enough, because the people that were in charge were just in love with the Andre Swift in terms of having him try to run between the tackles which he just never did. [SPEAKER_01]: And lastly, [SPEAKER_01]: putting Monangai, like, is he gonna, and he's a sound-throw pick, let's be real, but I like the way he runs, I like the guy he is.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just think that you have it, hopefully enough with the pieces that you have that you create, a good-run game versus it being like, overly, overly positive about any individual piece of that room, if that makes sense. [SPEAKER_00]: That makes sense. [SPEAKER_01]: And if the Andre Swift goes down, I think I can live with Rochon Johnson and with Manangai.
[SPEAKER_01]: If Manangai goes down, you know, same thing with the other two versus my last position, we'll get to that later, that if certain people go down, it's like, what do we do right here? [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I just, I just don't know. [SPEAKER_01]: So also, why did you put running back dead last? [SPEAKER_00]: I just, I think we're pinning too much hope on a bunch of guys who are very, like, Manangai, I, like, I was the guy in the draft who leading up to it, loved him.
[SPEAKER_00]: I like how he runs it and he's wired right. [SPEAKER_00]: I think he's very solid. [SPEAKER_00]: If not then it's my calculator. [SPEAKER_00]: But he's some thermatic. [SPEAKER_00]: The hundreds looked his highly flawed. [SPEAKER_00]: I think he's a wide receiver playing running back. [SPEAKER_00]: Rochon Johnson is not so I like them coming out of Texas. [SPEAKER_00]: I think after his last concussion, I think the gladiator we saw running is no longer that play.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I think he's I'm not saying he's running is here, but I think he's running to protect himself a little. [SPEAKER_00]: So that's going to inherently take away from the way you were. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I get the scheme thing and everything, but I think the confidence meter, like I still don't believe the starting running back is on this team just yet. [SPEAKER_01]: I just don't. [SPEAKER_01]: I will put money on it that this is your running back room week one.
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so you and I just we have a disagreement. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't. [SPEAKER_00]: I can't imagine you're looking at this room and feeling good about it. [SPEAKER_01]: No, I'm not. [SPEAKER_01]: That's why it was at. [SPEAKER_00]: That's not you. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying like the coaching staff. [SPEAKER_00]: This is what you really want to drop back out there that that's on you. [SPEAKER_01]: And as far as we understand, there was an attempt.
[SPEAKER_01]: There was a desire to add to the room. [SPEAKER_01]: They just kept getting safe, right? [SPEAKER_01]: And in our reality, you're [SPEAKER_01]: you're kind of avoiding the, I don't know how active they might have been in trying to sign an Ikchub, but you're avoiding potentially the explosion. [SPEAKER_01]: That is Ikchub's knee at this point. [SPEAKER_01]: You didn't go for the JK Dobbins, who, I don't know, is it really the best scheme fit either?
[SPEAKER_01]: Going back to the scheme of it all. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, as much as I liked the dude, like Jamal Way was head of time in this offense. [SPEAKER_01]: Like he was a good running back in this offense. [SPEAKER_01]: So like, [SPEAKER_01]: I feel like you that the scheme is going to have some oomph to it. [SPEAKER_01]: Or at least that's the hope. [SPEAKER_01]: And then the last position that we have Danny had them at eight.
[SPEAKER_01]: I had them at nine very close, just slightly different here as defensive one. [SPEAKER_01]: Danny, why are they so low for you? [SPEAKER_00]: I don't trust anything about it. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, the defensive tackle, it's like, Brady Jared's old. [SPEAKER_00]: It's not very good. [SPEAKER_00]: Still was pretty good last year. [SPEAKER_00]: The, I don't know if people have a different TV screen than I do when it comes to Garan Dexter. [SPEAKER_00]: He's a part time player.
[SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't play consistently. [SPEAKER_00]: He doesn't play with great pad level. [SPEAKER_00]: He gets pushed around. [SPEAKER_00]: I think that people still see like the RIS score when they're actually, when they should be watching him. [SPEAKER_00]: He's not a bad football player. [SPEAKER_00]: He's just not a great one. [SPEAKER_00]: He's fine. [SPEAKER_00]: He's a rotational defensive tackle of this point. [SPEAKER_00]: And then there's Andrew Billings.
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, rotational, but it's a game record when he's healthy, but he's also, I think he's thirty-one now. [SPEAKER_00]: So an older player, then you get [SPEAKER_00]: then you get out to the edge and it's like, you can sell me all you want about how great Montess what was the back half of that one season. [SPEAKER_00]: Like last year was much more akin to what he had been consistently in Washington, prior to his arrival in Chicago, then that back half of the season with the bears.
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think Montess what is a bad play. [SPEAKER_00]: I think his, he is a starting defensive end of the sling and a very good one of that. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think he's elite, and I think you need someone else to come help him and the help ain't come. [SPEAKER_00]: And if God forbid that guy goes down, good luck with whatever you're throwing out on the edge because it's a bunch of balls. [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what I was alluding to earlier.
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, if Montesquite got hurt, I mean, you're just not in a great place. [SPEAKER_01]: There's obviously a lot of debate about who Montesquite is. [SPEAKER_01]: He's he, two thousand, twenty three Montesquite or two thousand, twenty four Montesquite. [SPEAKER_01]: I think a truth is probably somewhere in the middle. [SPEAKER_01]: No, he's not, he's not Miles Garrett. [SPEAKER_01]: He's not trade Hendrickson. [SPEAKER_01]: He's not one of those guys.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's, he's the level B number one pass rusher in my opinion, right? [SPEAKER_01]: He's not like one of those guys, but he's not like terrible horrendous. [SPEAKER_01]: You go out and you get Dio Odango, that's a project, that's a projection. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the guy's already been the league for four years, and he had an eight sexies in two years ago, but then he had a three sexies last year. [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, and also he didn't participate at all in mini-campeter.
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why they didn't really say why, but because of that, you have guy in Dominic Robinson who we've all essentially been trying to cut for the last couple years who was mentioned by Ben Johnson as a guy who stood out. [SPEAKER_01]: And he finally, because of his length and all that, is this a defense for him. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, you're hoping. [SPEAKER_01]: Austin Booker, you're hoping.
[SPEAKER_01]: You're hoping he takes a step this year, but he wasn't really mentioned or stood out by most reports. [SPEAKER_01]: And then like you talked about, I mean, the center. [SPEAKER_01]: It's being locked down by an older Grady Jarrett. [SPEAKER_01]: He looked solid last year coming off the injury, but not Grady Jarrett of old and he's another year older. [SPEAKER_01]: Andrew Billings is coming off the torn peck and is a year older.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I'm a big, you know, Dr. Von Dexter guy. [SPEAKER_01]: I think then you are. [SPEAKER_01]: but he's a piece. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm never, I'm not sitting here and saying he's a top. [SPEAKER_01]: So seven, you very tight. [SPEAKER_00]: I think you and I are saying the same thing from different perspectives because you go on bears Twitter. [SPEAKER_00]: People are comparing him to June Carter and it's not just raw.
[SPEAKER_00]: I do it because it's fun, but it's, but it's objectively wrong and makes you look stupid. [SPEAKER_01]: I do it with a little winky face more so just because it makes me feel better on the bears passing on jailfire. [SPEAKER_00]: It makes me cope. [SPEAKER_01]: Because I think I might be wrong on this. [SPEAKER_01]: Did Dexter have more sacks than Carter last year? [SPEAKER_00]: I think they have the same amount of sacks, but the pressures.
[SPEAKER_01]: Or if you watch the film, Carter isn't more impactful player. [SPEAKER_00]: Let's see. [SPEAKER_00]: Everyone's favorite free agent for the bear's trace myth got dog walked in the Super Bowl by that man. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and let's be completely odd. [SPEAKER_01]: Like Carter is a better player. [SPEAKER_01]: Now, Dexter [SPEAKER_01]: makes the most of his opportunities. [SPEAKER_01]: He got into the back of him.
[SPEAKER_01]: He got sex, which was better this last year than you're before that. [SPEAKER_01]: But he's a rotational solid piece. [SPEAKER_01]: He's not changing anything. [SPEAKER_01]: Schmer Turner is a rookie who is also a hothead. [SPEAKER_00]: So you're hoping he's going to have to let you know. [SPEAKER_00]: I like to have a lot, but I don't know that he's any good to be true. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm concerned that he probably sucks. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's why he had to play so pissed off.
[SPEAKER_00]: Then he is actually good. [SPEAKER_00]: But you know, there's our positional rankings. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so that's a really quickly just sort of everyone if you're listening to this Danny had in order from least most confidence to most concerned corner back safety fighter sever linebacker tight end off it's a line quarterback defense line and running back.
[SPEAKER_01]: I had quarterback wider sever safety tight end quarterback offensive line running back linebacker defense of line pretty similar couple flips there, but for the most part. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, in sync. [SPEAKER_01]: All right, we're gonna take a quick break and then get to our NFC rankings and see no rankings. [SPEAKER_01]: All right, welcome back. [SPEAKER_01]: We are going to do the NFC North positional rankings.
[SPEAKER_01]: We would help the five flip the page for our people who are watching this live. [SPEAKER_01]: Let's just do this as arbitrarily. [SPEAKER_01]: Danny, who is the best linebackers in the NFL? [SPEAKER_00]: And the NFL. [SPEAKER_01]: But the NFC North. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't like you saying that. [SPEAKER_01]: I look, it's been a long week. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my ranking is wrong. [SPEAKER_01]: I had a last week. [SPEAKER_01]: I was gone.
[SPEAKER_01]: I had a Disney land slash conference in like the LA area. [SPEAKER_01]: Then I had like a stomach bug on Monday that just destroyed me. [SPEAKER_01]: And then I had to make up all these patients. [SPEAKER_00]: I actually had the bears the best linebacker group in the division. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. [SPEAKER_01]: The Chicago virus. [SPEAKER_00]: That being said, I had them as kind of, if you twisted my arm, I could see flipping on what the team I had number two.
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, I, yeah, we'll do this one. [SPEAKER_01]: I had the Vikings at number one. [SPEAKER_01]: That'd be, that'd be my number two. [SPEAKER_01]: And then I had it flipped. [SPEAKER_01]: So I, and then I had the bearish number two, and then you had the Vikings number two. [SPEAKER_01]: So why did you have the Vikings two bearish one? [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I think the top end talent is just better. [SPEAKER_00]: I like pace a lot.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think Cashman is a hilariously fun chess piece that for as uses to the best of his abilities, but I don't think peak of their powers that either of those two is better than, again, I will rag on Tramaine Edmunds, but if Tramaine Edmunds is playing to the peak of his powers, there's not a better linebacker in this division than [SPEAKER_00]: The problem is getting him to play to the peak of those powers with any regularity.
[SPEAKER_01]: I just think like when you take, and I look at this, maybe I'll, I took in the outside linebackers as well, like Dronth and Grinard and Andrew Venkin go as like, that's like their linebackers. [SPEAKER_01]: So I may have cheated here a little bit, and that's why I think I ended up putting them higher because Van Ginkl played really well last year. [SPEAKER_00]: He fits so well in that floor as, and then Tom, they're more focused into the defense of wine as Edward.
[SPEAKER_01]: Totally makes sense. [SPEAKER_01]: And it's however you want to take it. [SPEAKER_01]: Grinar just is a good player. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he was a guy that bears fans, myself and I circled Blaster as a free agent I hope they got. [SPEAKER_01]: So I think that's really the biggest thing for me is we need to take all four up five, excuse me, of those positions, and you compare it to like kind of the three of the bears. [SPEAKER_01]: It just slightly was different there.
[SPEAKER_01]: In terms of for me three and four, I put Lions at three. [SPEAKER_01]: I put Packers at four. [SPEAKER_01]: I got no confidence in the Packers linebacking unit. [SPEAKER_01]: It's just like a lot of [SPEAKER_01]: highly drafted guys that aren't they don't perform. [SPEAKER_00]: I I actually had it flipped and then you have to get Packers at three in Lions F because the high-end talent and it but it actually plays. [SPEAKER_00]: The Lions linebackers aren't on the field of them.
[SPEAKER_00]: They're always broken. [SPEAKER_01]: That's a fine point. [SPEAKER_01]: That's a fine point. [UNKNOWN]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: Where do we want to go to next place? [SPEAKER_01]: Let's go to the off, let's go to offensive land. [SPEAKER_01]: Let's go to running back just to get that out of the way. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, this grows. [SPEAKER_00]: So we just put there at number four for both of us. [SPEAKER_01]: For both of us, that bad running back room is not good.
[SPEAKER_01]: And even like, let's say it's successful. [SPEAKER_01]: Let's say like the running backs are actually like a top of a fifteen issue unit for some reason. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to say that that's because Ben Johnson's a wizard. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not putting it on the look of the room. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm putting it on him. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's gross. [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, what was your one through three for running backs in the in a one through three in order?
[SPEAKER_00]: I would lines, Packers Vikings. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, we were very close. [SPEAKER_01]: You have lines, Packers, Vikings. [SPEAKER_00]: So, while you're doing this, let me go ahead and give you all of the speed. [SPEAKER_00]: The reason I put the Packers above the Viking, because I'm guessing you flipped Packers Vikings, right? [SPEAKER_01]: I did love it. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, Josh Jacobs was really, really good last year.
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was, I thought they were dumb for cutting the guy. [SPEAKER_00]: I thought it was about a running back, who I never really signed in Minnesota and Aaron Jones. [SPEAKER_00]: But I think there's a value in having a true bell cow running back the way that Josh Jacobs is, especially if he remains productive versus having to basically have Aaron Jones's a part of a stable of running backs in Minnesota. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think Aaron Jones is bad by any stretch.
[SPEAKER_00]: I just think at this point in their careers as much as I sound dumb now through how I was talking last year. [SPEAKER_00]: Josh Jacobs is a better, more valuable project right now on a down to down basis than Aaron Jones is at the point in this career because you, you almost have to pitch count Aaron Jones anymore. [SPEAKER_01]: The only, the reason I fled was different than you because in my, the my first thought was was the same thing, Packers at, at two.
[SPEAKER_01]: I, there's something about Josh Jacobs, I don't trust. [SPEAKER_01]: If you look, I mean, looked at the year before with the Reuters. [SPEAKER_01]: He had eight hundred and five yards, three point five carry in six touchdowns, and then with the packer as he blew up to four point four yards, thirteen hundred average, thirteen hundred yards and fifteen touchdowns. [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of what he's always been, and he's kind of flip-flops.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's got a really good year, a year, a year, a really good year, and a year. [SPEAKER_01]: And then after him, after Josh Jacobs, you, I don't, Martian Lloyd is, I don't know, he just didn't really play Emmanuel Wilson, I don't really know. [SPEAKER_01]: I really like Jordan Mason. [SPEAKER_01]: So I think the one-two punch of Aaron Jones and then spelling with Jordan Mason. [SPEAKER_01]: I like that combo better than the potential of the next one of Josh Jacobs.
[SPEAKER_01]: And of course, the lines are awesome. [SPEAKER_01]: So they're number one for both. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the combo of Montgomery and Jamir Gibbs is just good. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, it's nasty. [SPEAKER_01]: All right. [SPEAKER_01]: Let's go to, again, let's just get this out of the way, defensive line. [SPEAKER_01]: Defensive, who would it was your number one through four? [SPEAKER_00]: or one through four for defensive line. [SPEAKER_00]: I went lions Vikings packers bears.
[SPEAKER_01]: Lions Vikings. [SPEAKER_01]: All right. [SPEAKER_01]: So wars were similar watching. [SPEAKER_01]: I was already, I like you. [SPEAKER_01]: I have lions down at number three. [SPEAKER_00]: So I wanted to put the lions lower, but like adding reader, DJ, so only you know, [SPEAKER_00]: of Hutchinson coming back. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I get why you would have him lower because so much of it hinges on the Hutchinson becoming the apex predator he wants was.
[SPEAKER_00]: But I think he's young enough to come back specifically from a broken bone injury. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know that he had nerve damage. [SPEAKER_00]: I haven't seen that reported anywhere. [SPEAKER_00]: But that's what I would do. [SPEAKER_00]: And the reason the Vikings were so high [SPEAKER_00]: as opposed to you, or the reason I had the biking tire was because, whereas you gave them the bump for the defensive line on, for Granard online backers, and why not?
[SPEAKER_00]: I gave it to them with Granard and Van Ginkl on defensive line, because they're the fact that we had rushers. [SPEAKER_01]: No, that's what I mean. [SPEAKER_01]: I thought about doing it that way, and I don't know, I can't remember why I just fight and flipping it. [SPEAKER_01]: Did to my backers? [SPEAKER_00]: I really liked Van Ness. [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see what comes of it. [SPEAKER_00]: He's been pretty disappointing so far.
[SPEAKER_00]: I think as I've always considered Big Kenny in the middle a game record, but he's not been good the last couple years. [SPEAKER_00]: And Rashad Gary is like, he got paid and decided to stop playing or something. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what happened. [SPEAKER_00]: So it's all this highly dribbling talent that is just in for me. [SPEAKER_00]: But because there's talent, I have to put them above the bears because the bears don't have talent.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and we talked about that in the first part. [SPEAKER_01]: The bears just, it's a hard drop off a lot of unknowns. [SPEAKER_01]: So the bears are going to be in the bottom here. [SPEAKER_01]: I put the lines as low as they were. [SPEAKER_01]: I have no insight information on this. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't like the industry. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't like some of the videos that have we seen popping up in terms of the movement patterns.
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think they're with the kind of athlete he is. [SPEAKER_01]: He is one funky thing away from losing what makes him special. [SPEAKER_01]: So I don't love that. [SPEAKER_01]: I really like the DJ reader ad. [SPEAKER_01]: I really like the Lee McNeil. [SPEAKER_01]: But then it just when you didn't have in Hutchinson, you just felt how soft that line was. [SPEAKER_01]: I even like the Roy Lopez ad. [SPEAKER_01]: I like Roy Lopez a lot.
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's a good football player. [SPEAKER_01]: It's just like the unknown for me on that line, put it lower down. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, this was another thing. [SPEAKER_01]: This maybe isn't fair.
[SPEAKER_01]: But [SPEAKER_01]: losing air and Glenn is something I'm concerned about for the lions and that what that defense will look like versus I was confident in what Packers defense was teamed up to look like into generate pressures and all that jazz so that's where kind of the flip happened I get you I get you and we don't need to cover the bears again. [SPEAKER_01]: No, the bears again just grosses it's fine. [SPEAKER_01]: Why do receiver? [SPEAKER_01]: Who did what was your order?
[SPEAKER_00]: I want you to grab a little off your top floor. [SPEAKER_01]: Sure. [SPEAKER_01]: I'll do that once I fix this looks like because for some reason you can't see that anymore. [SPEAKER_01]: There we go. [SPEAKER_01]: So my top floor for wider seaver was, again, so much stuff. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. [SPEAKER_01]: I had Vikings, Lions, Bears Packers. [SPEAKER_00]: So I initially wrote Vikings, Bears, Lions Packers and that I wrote a double arrow flipping the Lions in the Bears.
[SPEAKER_00]: because I unjustify that we don't really care for Jane's and Williams. [SPEAKER_00]: And I think I allowed my disdain for the player that he is kind of like cloud my judgment. [SPEAKER_00]: He's a good football player for some reason. [SPEAKER_00]: He just doesn't do it for me the way he does it for other fans. [SPEAKER_00]: Like yeah, I'll akin it to this.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jalen Williams and for the Oklahoma City Thunder people swear by him and something about him, just I don't like watching him play basketball that much. [SPEAKER_00]: He's great, but something about him just doesn't vibe with me. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not saying he's a bad basketball player, nothing like that, just something about him. [SPEAKER_01]: So I say for me, when you have Justin Jefferson, you get like a thousand points. [SPEAKER_01]: So and then the rest of their
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y'know, y
[SPEAKER_01]: And then you have Sam Laporta who had one of the better rookie years for a tight end fell off a little bit last year, unfortunately, and I know that as someone who had drafted him last year and was very, very annoying, but they did not have his good over year. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't, I don't know what the heck they're doing about whole Isaac Tesla thing that we'll see what happens there, but you're hoping that was a bad home is feeling himself pick. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's wild.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then, and I put the bears below for the same reasons we talked about in the first half of the show. [SPEAKER_01]: DJ Morris, you're going to turn his brain around, is Rome going to take that step that we're talking about what the heck is with a burden. [SPEAKER_01]: I know what the lions are in terms of the weapons, so I had to put them at number two, like they are a good past catching unit. [SPEAKER_01]: I have nothing to say about the Packers.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a bunch of dudes. [SPEAKER_01]: Not like dudes, right? [SPEAKER_01]: It's just a bunch of guys. [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, maybe Matthew Golden turns into something, but Romeo Jobs, fine, Jane Reed. [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a very good number two. [SPEAKER_01]: See, I mean, William says, why are you there? [SPEAKER_01]: Doff TV and Wix is something that I just don't need to. [SPEAKER_01]: I want to down table looks to be better than he is. [SPEAKER_01]: He just hasn't been.
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just, there's a lot of, they have, they have seven number ones. [SPEAKER_00]: That's it. [SPEAKER_01]: There's a bunch of two's one piece. [SPEAKER_01]: So it's just like, and most of it is just the floor just doing awesome things. [SPEAKER_01]: This is the floor's boss. [SPEAKER_01]: I think more so than the towns in that room. [SPEAKER_00]: And backwards fans want him fucker, which is hilarious. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my god, yeah, please fire him, but just do it.
[SPEAKER_01]: All right. [SPEAKER_01]: We'll do offensive line next. [SPEAKER_01]: I have in order, Lions, Bears, Vikings, Packers. [SPEAKER_00]: I had Lions, Vikings, Bears, Packers. [SPEAKER_01]: Why do you flip Vikings and bears? [SPEAKER_00]: I think Christian Derosaw is a monster, and that's your great equalizer when you're comparing two lines in terms of overall, like Derosaw's awesome dude. [SPEAKER_00]: He's fantastic.
[SPEAKER_00]: And the lines I think that they're running away and hiding in the number one spot, like there's no one in this division that comes close to them. [SPEAKER_00]: And really to go on top of the Derosaw point, [SPEAKER_00]: The bears haven't played together yet. [SPEAKER_00]: That's a big thing. [SPEAKER_00]: Like you could literally be talking about four out of five, so eighty percent of the bears often have won being just new together. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I talked about that.
[SPEAKER_01]: We talked about the first half of show that that cocaine is super super important. [SPEAKER_01]: I think for why I had the Packers and Vikings lower specifically like that probably matters here in this conversation. [SPEAKER_01]: It's similar with the Vikings where it's like Ryan Kelly [SPEAKER_01]: older new player will fries had a good year last year before that was kind of but. [SPEAKER_01]: And again, also new player.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then right now you're projected to have Donovan Jackson as your left guard who's a rookie. [SPEAKER_01]: So when you put all that as much as I like Christian Derosaw or if not love the interior of that, especially for who essentially is a rookie quarterback in Jason McCarthy, I think that matters. [SPEAKER_01]: And then the packer's lines, it's always solid. [SPEAKER_01]: Don't give me wrong, but you got, it's just kind of some dude guys right now and I don't like air banks.
[SPEAKER_01]: I think air banks is overpaid and is a very average. [SPEAKER_00]: I also have a little bit of regret that contract at all. [SPEAKER_01]: No. [SPEAKER_01]: And then I think there was a moment because I made this like about three or four weeks ago. [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's when I made my rankings. [SPEAKER_01]: I almost wanted to change them because then we got the news about what's happening on the lines off on some line.
[SPEAKER_01]: Because right now you're looking at tape rattled just their center. [SPEAKER_01]: But Christian mahogany is your left guard. [SPEAKER_01]: Is it going to be the same? [SPEAKER_01]: awesome offensive line without Frank Ragnow there at center without sightler at guard like I don't know anymore. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, but we I think that there are offensive line coach whose name I'm blank. [SPEAKER_00]: He's a rumor to be offensive coordinator candidate for Ben Johnson.
[SPEAKER_01]: He's he's he's good good. [SPEAKER_00]: He's earned the benefit of the doubt. [SPEAKER_00]: So [SPEAKER_00]: All right, so I'm guessing we're going to be saving quarterback for last. [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, frankly, I'll help hold that up. [SPEAKER_01]: Um, frankly. [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, so we're going to do corner back last. [SPEAKER_01]: So what is your ranking for corner? [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, so we're just a defensive back, right? [SPEAKER_01]: Um, yeah, defensive, that's right.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, defensive back in general. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. [SPEAKER_00]: I went bears, lions, Vikings, Packers. [SPEAKER_00]: And that would be, I just think, or, it's such a strong group. [SPEAKER_00]: They have, in case one of the best secondary rooms in the NFL, the lions have Kirby Joseph. [SPEAKER_00]: They have, oh, they're slot, they're slot, like, dimebacker, safety, Brian Branch, Jesus Dan. [SPEAKER_00]: They've spent on Ontario and Arnold.
[SPEAKER_00]: They've got high end, plethora talent. [SPEAKER_00]: all over that secondary. [SPEAKER_00]: It's awesome. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I just, I worry more about their depth than I do the bears because I, but maybe that's just because I don't watch them as much as I watch the bears, you know?
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: And the fact that the Vikings have put the packers, I think just speaks to kind of the wizard that Brian Flores is on top of the packers being like, we don't meet one of the guys when he's healthy, one of the five best corners football. [SPEAKER_00]: because he's weird and we're tired of dealing with him, and he's never healthy. [SPEAKER_00]: Which yeah, he's never healthy. [SPEAKER_00]: Giro doesn't help me. [SPEAKER_01]: It's not a good room.
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you have Xavier's team, which is, they look like a bunch of mad and creative players. [SPEAKER_01]: Xavier McKinney is the only person. [SPEAKER_01]: Other than that, you have Evan Lens at Free Safety, you have Kishan Nixon at Right Corner, you have Javan Bullard who at Nickel, who's fine, and then you got Nate Hobbs, who I, as you're starting outside corner, I just don't see him there. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
[SPEAKER_01]: No, me do do I. Um, I don't have much to add by bears defense defensive backs the whole room. [SPEAKER_01]: We talked to you about that. [SPEAKER_01]: The quarterback and safety awesome. [SPEAKER_01]: Um, I would like the only thing I'll add for like the lions is how the investment that they made last year. [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's going to pay dividends this year in terms of like the draft. [SPEAKER_01]: So that's why I grew up with the Vikings. [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they pin ultimate category quarterback. [SPEAKER_01]: What you got. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'm prepared for everyone to hate me right now, but Jared golf won Jordan love two Caleb Williams three. [SPEAKER_00]: JJ McCarthy four. [SPEAKER_01]: I have literally the exact same order. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: It's how you hate Caleb Williams.
[SPEAKER_01]: It's what you, there's a difference between what I, how it ranks them for, like, within the bear's roster in terms of confidence and concern versus being able to go against the NFC North. [SPEAKER_01]: Unfortunately for the bear's the NFC North, you have Jared golf who is playing, like, a top [SPEAKER_01]: at least top ten if not potentially top five quarterback consistently.
[SPEAKER_01]: Jordan love you can't ignore the year he had two years ago and the fact that even last year at this he healed up a little bit he was looking better. [SPEAKER_01]: So that matters, you know, and unfortunately you just don't have the evidence that Caleb right now is doing what they're doing and JJ McCarthy has through seventeen passes in the preseason. [SPEAKER_01]: I refuse to put him any higher than four. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you can't put him higher than four.
[SPEAKER_00]: JJ, by the fact of he did, has not played NFL football yet, except for a few preseason snaps, cannot qualify. [SPEAKER_00]: Jared Gough, as much as I believe the lines will never win a meaningful, meaningful game like a Super Bowl with him at the home, does not make him not a good quarterback. [SPEAKER_00]: I think Jared Gough is still painfully Jerry Gough and pressure bursts his pipes.
[SPEAKER_00]: Jordan love I would trust more to win a Super Bowl than I would dare you off because Jordan loves got a level of fuck it to him that he he'll get away with some stuff like I actually wish he would stop with so much of the back back foot throws because it's just eating it up there and hoping and praying but it is what it is like to this point both of those guys are a bug Kayla you can't you can't argue otherwise without being a blind home or two
[SPEAKER_01]: If the question was, who has the most potential, you would change this order, but that's not what we're doing. [SPEAKER_01]: We're doing right now if you looked at this with clear eyes, who is the better, more proven, you have more confident in quarterback to go like when you look game, that's essentially that is the order.
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and as much as I'm concerned for the lions in terms of what it's going to look like without Ben Johnson, we have John Moore now is your office coordinator. [SPEAKER_01]: That is potentially going to be a problem, but you got to believe that golf is going to retain some of what he was able to get over his last years with Ben Johnson. [SPEAKER_00]: Right, and God is good. [SPEAKER_00]: If you were a potential, you'd probably throw it Williams love golf McCarthy.
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, but that's not what we're doing, Mason. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, it's just not. [SPEAKER_01]: And if you did this at the end of the year, could all of these ranking have you very different? [SPEAKER_01]: Yes. [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, we could be a little, like, Lydia. [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I expect to look like an idiot. [SPEAKER_00]: That's just what I am. [SPEAKER_01]: I really didn't pull up like last years and see how it ended, but I don't do that.
[SPEAKER_01]: I digress because that's what that wouldn't be fun. [SPEAKER_01]: That's all we got for today. [SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully you all have a real listening to this before or during it, hopefully have a great holiday weekend. [SPEAKER_01]: If you're listening to a way down the road, what is wrong with you? [SPEAKER_01]: Focus on other things. [SPEAKER_00]: Happy Fourth of July. [SPEAKER_00]: We get everybody. [SPEAKER_00]: Use Uber, use Lyft, have fun with your friends and family.
[SPEAKER_00]: Be safe more than anything coming from someone in my line of work. [SPEAKER_00]: Just be safe. [SPEAKER_00]: make the right correct choices. [SPEAKER_01]: Don't hold fireworks in your hands. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, for the love of God, don't do that. [SPEAKER_00]: Don't put mortars on your head. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have a bear down. [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, what has two thumbs and he's Todd Thacker. [SPEAKER_01]: This guy.