What's up, everyone? This week on the pod, I have Lisa Fancher from Frontier Records, so stay tuned for that. Please support the podcast by subscribing to it wherever you listen to it. Also, if you have the time, please like it, rate it, and review it. If you go to 185milesouth.com, there is a playlist for every episode. So like this episode, there's a playlist built out for Lisa Fancher and Frontier Records. So check that out. There is also some 185 Mile South beanies in the store.
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185 miles south a hardcore punk rock podcast
what's up everyone this week on the pod yeah what's up i got uh lisa fancher from frontier records and uh badges helped me out with the interview because uh he's so well prepared always But Lisa, thanks so much for doing it. I really appreciate it.
Yeah, no problem. It's a nice break from just watching TV or Netflix.
Yeah, that's what's up. I got to take a break from watching 90 Day Fiancé. Oh,
wow. Yeah, I watched some dumb stuff, but I haven't gotten involved with that show.
That's good. It's a serious brain melter. I have.
You have too? I have a big crush on Noel Fielding, so I've watched like... all of the British baking shows he's on, but now I'm, now I'm just watching the ones that he's not on just cause I like it. But, uh,
Well, to get back to, to start off by being on topic, Lisa, do you remember, uh, when you got into punk music and, and how it came across your plate?
Uh, well, if you want to say like punk music, punk music, it was one I was in. Oh God. I mean, do you want to call the dolls? You know? I mean, I was listening to the dolls when I was in eighth or ninth grade. when the records came out. And so I called them punk and the Stooges. I discovered Cream Magazine early on when I used to be walking to junior high. So I would chase down whatever they told me I had to listen to, whether it was the Dictators or the Modern Lovers.
But in terms of like really being involved as opposed to Total Spectator, I started going to shows, you know, the Mask and the Whiskey when Kim Fowley did his dumb shows and all the weird venues that everybody's played the very first bands, the Weirdos and the Screamers and the Germs. Even the Nerves. The Nerves were there just bothering people. They were power pop and they were fine, but they were just around in everybody's face.
Most of the people I've had on the pod so far come around in the 80s, so they don't have the perspective on that early scene and the mask and so forth. Can you kind of describe what it was like to see the Screamers or a band like that in the 77 era there?
Well, it was funny. I went to work at a place called World of Wonder for five years. I was in TV, and their basement was the mask, which I had forgotten. I didn't realize when they bought the building that that was where the mask was, because you went around the... If you know where... Wait, where are you, Zach?
I'm in San Diego, but I grew up in
Austin. Oh, okay. So if you know Bordner's Bar, I don't know if you know that. It's on Cherokee and Hollywood Boulevard. if you cross the street and you went in the alley, that's how you got into the mask. And then you walk down a flight of stairs and there was exactly one way in and one way out. And it was just horrifyingly, it was, it was like CBGBs. Like I wouldn't go to the bathroom for hours just so that I could go somewhere else. Like I would just wait till I left.
Cause it looked like somebody blew them up. And, uh, you know, there's graffiti everywhere. There was like, you know, the gnarliest couches. And, uh, And in other shows, I don't know how to say how many people were there, 100 or 200 people maybe, but it was absolutely packed. You know, like the walls were sweaty. And again, there was one way in and one way out. So you're hoping that you didn't die if somebody dropped their cigarette on the filthy couch. But it was amazing.
It was really remarkable. The stage was super low. So unless you were standing right against the stage, you couldn't see who was playing particularly well. I tend to always, at punk shows, just because you never know what's going to happen, I tend to always sit in the back just so I could see. Because I'm not tall like Ben is. You
didn't want to get peanut...
Even
what? I was going to say, you didn't want to get Darby Crash to throw peanut butter on you.
I didn't want any of that. But also, if you're up against a stage, you're going to get kicked in the head. And that's not my favorite.
Real quick, Ben. Lisa, did any of those bands, did you connect with them more than... another one or were
you just like, I was friends with the screamers, uh, fast Freddie and I, who did black backdoor man magazine. We saw the screamers. I want to say it was a cheap trick concert. Maybe it was something that wasn't punk at all. We were just standing there. So those guys were standing there and we're like, Oh my God, those guys look amazing. Cause you know, they had spiky hair and the only people that we'd seen really were like the damned and sex pistol, you know, on TV, you know, from far away.
So we went up to him and started talking to him and it turns out they were really nice. They weren't like snotty or scary or anything. And I just started hanging around with the screamers. I was acquainted with the weirdos just cause I was a fan, you know, just because, you know, those people didn't hang around the dressing room and you just go up and talk to people. But yeah, Yeah. A lot of the people I knew, I worked at Bomp Records and a lot of people brought their records in.
So I went from some people I was better friends with than others. When they bring their 45s or their LPs inside.
How did you end up starting your own label? How did Frontier begin? Tell us about that.
I was working at Bomp Records, so I you know, that wasn't my job. I mean, I basically did mail order, but I knew how you, you know, made a record, you know, you take them back in the studio and you make a jacket and your bump was a full service, teeny tiny record label. So I just kind of had an idea in my head that I thought that it would be fun to put out a record. Cause I'd already done a fanzine and I was like, Oh, maybe I'll put out a record and see what happens.
So I picked a band called the fly boys, which is kind of an obscure frontier records. Didn't do well. And it took me maybe almost two years to put the record out because I didn't, A, I had to save up money from working a bump to pay for it. And I just didn't know what, just to make a long story short, I didn't know what was going on. I had to master the record and create artwork, get jackets printed. So it was a learning curve.
And then
that was, that record came out in March of 1980, right?
But when was it recorded?
Probably starting with the last half of 1978. And it wasn't because it was some Boston epic or anything. It was just that I could only get this much time. We were recording it at Leon Russell's studio in the Valley, kind of off Magnolia Boulevard. Ben will understand this. Nobody else will care. And he had a really nice, super state-of-the-art recording. He had a place where he recorded, which was a house that was kind of on Barham. But this is actually like state of the art.
I don't even know how long he lived here. And Jim Mankey from Sparks was an engineer. And then a pal of mine, Scott Goddard, who of all things was the Dickies roadie. And oh, phone. And. So we would record this like after hours, like, you know, I got a super deal because we would start it, you know, whatever, 10 or 11 at night and go till sunup. And then we also got a lot of free sessions because nobody even knew we were in there. So, but it just took forever.
It just took ages and ages and ages. And it wasn't even like it took that many hours, but it just, you know, it might do, you know, something every other month, a little bit of recording.
Yeah.
And guess who answered the phone? Johnette from Concrete Blonde. But she wasn't even in a band yet. She was just a lady that was answering the phone. So who even knew she could sing or anything? So that was really fun. But it took, yeah, it took ages. And then when the record was finally, after all that finally came out, the band came to pick them up and they told me that they broke up. So I was like... Awesome. Perfect. Perfect experience.
What every label wants to hear.
Yeah,
exactly. Did you have an early mission statement with the label or were you just going to try to put out something that you
liked? I think my mission statement kind of became clear through the way things looked. Believe it or not, it was funny. People gave me a bunch of shit like Jack Rabbit. It was too professional, which I thought was hysterical. It was too slick and you know, like my covers. Cause you'd get like, I don't know if smoke seven was around yet, but you know, you get people that like hand wrote the everything and black and white looked like a Xeroxed.
And, uh, you know, I tried to go that extra mile and make it look good, like the circle jerks or whatever. And, um, I remember Jack, Jack's a good friend of mine. I'm not ragging on him, but, uh, Jack said that, uh, the adolescence record was overproofed. So I was like, what are you talking about? We made that thing in three days. Um, Like three days in a row.
Yeah. Was it, was it, what was it like? Um, was Dane, I noticed that like your record covers look really well done. Like there's a lot of thought put into them and it, it reminds me of danger house records. Um, was that kind of an early inspiration for your label? Like, or like, who were you, who was, who was like the model? Y'all right there.
Trying to stop as fast as I can. Yes, Danger House was an inspiration. I knew those guys because I knew they brought their record. Again, they brought their records into Bomp, and they were incredible. The records were incredible, but the artwork was amazing, too. They also took it seriously. I mean, it didn't have to be expensive, but it just had to look good.
So anyway, that was kind of my mission statement, but I didn't have anything like... you know, here I am in the suburbs, you know, at that point I hadn't moved out of my parents' house. I think I was like 20, but I was trying to save money by not having rent. So I just put it in all into the records, but I just didn't want it to look crappy. That's all.
Yeah. Did you originally plan on it being a punk label or,
or. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Well, that's what I liked at the time. You know, I mean, there's obviously like all kinds of music, but yeah, I didn't have the money or the wherewithal for the late seventies stuff. Like there was just no way I could even consider doing a weirdo single or anything. I just didn't have, I didn't remotely even have it together to have enough money or anything. So hardcore was happening and I was a super big fan.
I would, besides all the usual bands, I went down to cuckoo's nest and saw the bands and a lot of the OC bands like middle-class opened up for the quote unquote, bigger bands, wherever they would play. So yeah.
I want to jump ahead just a tiny bit. Um, cause you mentioned the word hardcore and this is something that we've tried to hash out on the show before. Um, did you see a difference between like those first wave bands and like the, uh, like the younger suburban, like punk hardcore scene that was going to come out that like you would do some of the records of like, was there a differentiation in like the way that people describe them?
Um, Well, time, you know, time-wise, there was a little tiny bit of crossover between the two, like middle-class and stuff, but the classic hardcore kind of adolescent sing-songy stuff and even Black Flag or whatever, it was just a different attitude than the LA, you know, X or the Danger House bands. Those bands are a little bit older and maybe they would even do like a slow song here and there where hardcore was just, you know, full-on raging. Audience was far younger. Yeah.
Was that the common vernacular, though? Would people describe them as hardcore bands?
At the time, I don't know if I used the word hardcore. At that point in time, it was all just punk. But I don't recall if you used that term then or if it was coined slightly later. I don't recall.
Tell us about Circle Jerks. So your second record is the first Circle Jerks album.
Right. So after the abject failure of the Flyboys record, I could have quit or I could have just been like, ah, it's something to do. You know, that was a lesson learned. Those guys were shopping that record around the decline of I think was already out or just about to come out and they did not wind up on Slash and they'd already recorded the track with Poshboy and they didn't like him. So the good news was that there really wasn't a lot of choices. So I called up Lucky.
He had an apartment, right? Like literally right up the street from the whiskey, you know, the party, the punk rock party pad. And I just called him up and asked if I could do it. And the first thing he said was no. And then I guess they still couldn't find anybody to do it. Not really sure what the Genesis was. And, um, I guess he talked to, I guess he ran into Kim and Rodney and vetted me and then suddenly called me back.
Cause the first, one of the first things he said on our phone call was, you know, no, no girls putting my record out. And I was like, cool.
And I knew he said that like, yep.
Yep.
because you're a girl, he doesn't want you. Yeah, exactly. Like it was
just like the most ridiculous thing you'd ever heard of, but you'd have to know lucky to know that that's kind of the guy that he is. I mean, hopefully he's not that way anymore, but quite a high opinion of himself, but I had been seeing, I didn't know Keith, but I had been seeing Keith at shows, you know, ever since I left my parents' house, you know, and went into town ever since I went to any show. Cause he was always there.
So you, you would, you would heard the record then when you tried to court them.
Uh, I hit Rodney and played a bunch of it. I don't think he played the whole thing, but he had played like a few tracks. It was kind of stuck on a few tracks.
Yeah. What was your impression of it? Because it's such a timeless record.
Oh my God. I was a huge circle jerks fan for starts. Cause I liked, I saw Keith in black flag and, uh, I just, you know, the black flag experience couldn't be beat, but, um, No, I thought the jerks were great because I loved the way Hedson played guitar. I'd seen him play and, you know, like any footage you've seen of those, like just people flying through the air. It was lucky their set was only like 18 or 20 minutes because they just barely ever got through it.
With that, it just, I mean, you know, just complete and total chaos. So I really wanted to do it. I like, you know, I figured I had no shot. So it was just kind of totally bizarre what it was like. I was in the record biz, and so I decided to put it out. And we made that deal because I had to look at the contract recently. And it took me, instead of like two years like the Flyboys, it was more like six or seven months to get it out, which was still way too long.
But I just had nothing but chaos with the pressing plant. They were terrible people and just kept putting me off and putting me off. And then I finally got Rainbow to come and pick up all the components and And then I was at rainbow for 40 years until they closed last fall.
Wow.
Yeah.
Um,
but anyway, that one went much better than the fly boys. That was a whole new, then I was like, you know, I didn't quit my job or anything, but it was like a whole new world. If somebody cared that you put a record out instead of like, you know, so.
Yeah. So a lot of it had to do with like bump, just didn't care about hardcore music.
No, Greg didn't like it. I played it for him before I put it out because he was a big mentor to me and a good friend and I didn't want to... I saved all the good stuff for me. I didn't have any say with A&R over at Bomb, but... And it would have been easier for me, obviously, if I just had an overseer role instead of spending my very own money. But he didn't get it. No, he didn't like it, didn't get it, thought it was crap. So I was like, all right. So I had his blessing.
And I used his employees, Diane's and Cabbage that worked at Bomp, did my earliest covers up through, gosh, probably up through the Long Riders, I guess.
Yeah.
And so they were really, really cool about it. They cut me a lot of slack if I had to, you know, go take things to the printers or go pick up this or that thing. They were super cool about it.
How did early distribution work of records in 1980 compared to, you know, what distribution would become?
I can't think. There wasn't much going on, but JEM, if you've heard of those guys, J-E-M. They were like the biggie and they could actually get your stuff coast to coast. And then there was like little tiny local people, like really small. There's a place called city hall up in San Francisco. And I don't know, they're all long gone. I think rough trade was one of the very, very earliest.
So did you just go and approach Jim with like having two LPs?
Yeah, well, actually, Bob was a good friend of mine. He was almost a partner in Frontier. I'm glad that all of my friends flaked out because I had four or five friends. We were all going to do Frontier together. And every last one of them, you know, when push came to shove to put in money, they're like, yeah, I don't really want to do it. But Bob was a good friend of mine.
So that was really good because I always got paid because there was a lot of people that didn't get paid, but I always got paid on time. And yeah, distribution was patchy. And I sold directly to stores. I sold to the original Rhino. And, uh, you know, Zed and Long Beach, you know, as far as I could drive my sweet, sweet ride, I would, uh, fill it up with records and go drop them off everywhere.
The
Circle Jerks record, believe it or not, was like, so on fire. It was like a Bee Gees record or something. And if I got them from the plant, they didn't even want to wait the day that it took UPS. They'd be like, no, I need them Friday night. So I would go to Long Beach on Friday, if you know what that's like. If that means anything to you, they're like, okie doke.
Yeah. Well, hopefully traffic was better in 1980 than in the 90s when I was driving to Oxnard or Long Beach.
Yeah. Oh, my God. Yeah. No, it was nothing like now. But, yeah, it just really was not something you wanted to do, especially in a Pinto going like 45, 46 miles an hour.
Yeah. I saw in an interview that you had a Pinto. That's so ill.
Oh, so good, man. It was like top speed.
Was it lime?
It was white and it had lime green or like green. I wouldn't call them racing stripes. They were just like stripes on it. And
there's green in there.
Yeah. It had to have green instead of like, I always wanted one of those flesh colored ones, but yeah, it was sweet as hell.
Lisa, you mentioned seeing Keith of Black Flag since you, have you, did you get to see all four singers?
I have seen all four singers. I've seen, Yeah, I've seen almost everybody in the world sing with Black Flag, I think.
So maybe you're the first definitive person we can ask. Who was the best?
Oh, it had to be Keith. Yeah, hands away. I mean, Henry was super entertaining, and he's a friend of mine, but not my favorite singer. And kind of go from there. All those guys were characters, Ron and everybody, but I didn't really have a lot of regard for them as singers. Sorry, people. How
about, so the next record you do is the Adolescence self-titled album that everyone calls the Blue Album. What were your first impressions of that band and how did they end up getting on Frontier?
The Adolescence were superstars of Rodney because Posh Boy, Amoeba was on, what record was it, Ben? Was it Beach Boulevard or Rodney on the Rock?
Anyway,
Amoeba was like a breakout hit. They played it all the time on K-Rock. I can't remember which one. I don't think it's on Beach Boulevard. Anyway.
It's on Rodney, volume one.
Rodney on the Rock, right. So those guys also, thank God for Robbie because everybody worked with him once and they hated him. So Frank called me up when I was... I never even asked him where he got my number or anything, but... It doesn't matter. He called me while I was at Bomp and we talked for like a half an hour and they told me what they wanted to do and wanted to make sure I was cool. And so we're like, yeah, let's make a record. And yeah, they were just regular old nice kids.
They were just super easy to work with. And we recorded at this place in beautiful Sun Valley where I'm from. And again, state of the art studio because the music business had completely collapsed in the 70s. So we got this place that was, you know, would have been two or three or even in those days, a couple thousand dollars a day lockout. And we got it for two or three hundred dollars because I just wanted somebody to be there.
So we just they because they lived in Orange County, I just found them some fleabag motel that was not very far from the studio. And thank God they didn't burn it down or anything. And yeah, they recorded there. They're very well behaved. Went in there, did their part. First day was kind of rocky. The producer, Tom Wilson, who did a lot of records for me, didn't get the music and he was really, really mad. And the next day he came to work and he loved it. He was just all about it.
He's like, I didn't get it. I didn't know what they were doing. Because he worked on Seals and Crofts and Super 70s, the most whatever. He didn't think people should play. It really wasn't that good music. you know, good at music or maybe it wasn't, maybe they weren't in time. And I was like, dude, that's not even the point. Like, does it matter if they're playing in time? And so he got it.
Yeah. That's, that was really common. I think where a punk band would be in a studio with an engineer who just had no concept of what punk was or what it was about. And like a lot of records got ruined that way, but that record came out great. So it was like, serendipitous that this guy who has had no background in punk like something in his brain clicked and he ended up doing a lot of classic punk records yeah that was the first one
yeah everybody uh as far as i know well he made he recorded some stuff for bump and it was like stiv bader so it wasn't like hardcore it was you know it was like rock music anyway but stiv bader's band was you know again was like boston compared to anybody that i brought his way right
That's so interesting because, you know, adolescence is one of the most musical punk bands. I mean, is the black hole is, is like a, you know, an apex of musical punk songs. Like, so maybe they're the perfect gateway band for him to like get into it.
And I was there, I would, you know, I don't, I don't, I don't consider myself a producer and I never even say anything at all, but I just wanted to be there to make sure. Cause I don't trust anybody anymore. I just wanted to be sure that they didn't A, kill each other, break anything, pee on the board or anything. So I would just, you know, park myself there the entire time they're making the record. They are the funniest people, especially together.
Like Steve and Frank were hysterical, like just like the cut up kids. Cause you know, you get so tired. I mean, they would work like more than 12 hours straight. And yeah. And that's tough when you're playing that stuff. And yeah. And then Frank would play a guitar solo and he'd go, Leche. And I'd be like, milk? And he'd go, yeah, that solo is terrible. Erase it immediately. So they just had their own words and their own language and everything.
Was it Frank doing the solos or was it both Rick and Frank? It was
Rick and Frank, but I would say Frank did a little touching up of Rick's stuff because Rick has a very limited ability to focus. So after he had played a solo a few times, but it's not Frank and setter, Rick, it's kind of just kind of a blend, but you can tell, I mean, you can tell an all by myself. You could tell Rick style, you know, I mean, it was like super easy for Frank to, to, you know, fill in, be a fill. It'd be like a standing actor or something.
It's Rick writing most of the material or who's actually writing the song? We
wrote a lot of it. Casey and Rick wrote some stuff. A lot of it was really, really early on before Tony was even in the band. But I would say, you know, Rick has a credit on most things. Tony has a lot of credits because he wrote the lyrics, but it's kind of spread around, really. But, you know, the ones that are the super legendary ones on the record, like Kids of the Black Hole or Rick.
Can we talk a little bit about the LP cover? Do you know, do you know what went into that because it's so iconic?
Well, uh, those were the days when, um, UPCs were new and then the generic stuff, when you'd go to the store and a pack of cigarettes would say like cigarettes were on it, you know, and it didn't, you know, you didn't have to buy anything from Philip Morris just said cigarettes. So we were all just delighted with that. So Tony really, I kind of ran with it. Tony wanted it to be generic like that before Flipper, right? Was it the same time? I can't recall.
Anyway, so I gave it to Diane's and Cabbage and I was like, they really want it to look like, you know, like a generic record, like, you know, like something if you walked into Ralph's and it looks like album.
so after that she just came up with that and presented it and i showed it to them and they were like oh my god because and the second thing they wanted was that thing where it hurt your eyes the blue and the red together so the two requirements they had were those colors hurting your eyes and the generic thing and we're like you know knocked it out of the park
that's awesome
by the time we did the back cover, like they already, I wouldn't say they got along that well, all five of them, you know, there was camps of some people that got along and some that didn't, but, uh, they would not pose together on the back cover. Like that was, that was Glennie Friedman's job and they would not even stand together. So that's why there's portraits. So there you go. Secret.
Um, Well, it's funny that you mentioned the, the hurting your eyes thing. Cause I wrote that book about cold chilling and that the cold chilling colors are those exact same colors as the adolescence album. And for that, and for that exact same reason that, so that it would hurt your eyes. Yeah,
no, it's a great thing. And most people avoid it for that very reason. And we were like, the only thing that could have made it more hurt your eyes is if I could have afforded somebody to silkscreen all of them, but that would have been ridiculous. I mean, just ridiculous. I never would have gotten them in stores if we were silk screening of where you got the real true day glow, but that's the best we could do, but it was cool.
What was the, so, so adolescents are from North or from Fullerton, which is North Orange County. Yes. How was that scene different than the South Bay where it's circle jerks were from or Huntington where some of TSOL was from and that whole scene, like where, Could you differentiate those areas? I wouldn't
say musically I necessarily could differentiate it. You know, like the South Bay bands were harsher, more violent. Because, you know, you had the whole Pedro, Minutemen thing. So it kind of ran the gamut. But, you know, I would say the Orange County, like the true Orange County HB ones were the guys that were really the toughest people. Like Fullerton's, you know, I don't know if it's a nicer suburb, but it's more, I don't know.
It's just kind of different than, than Huntington beach where the kids are a little richer, but a little richer and like way more messed up on a kids of the black hole level where they're, you know, a lot more drugs. And, um, but anyway, the kids so misbehaved. I went to cuckoo's nest a lot to see bands and they were very poorly behaved compared to like the old people, you know, when I would go to the mask and stuff and people aren't really hurting each other or making a target out of someone.
There's no circle pit. So it was just a completely different thing.
Right. But I'll
say the clubs in the South Bay were scarier for whatever reason. There was just, I don't know. They were just really crappy. Maybe it'd be a restaurant. There was like dancing waters and all kinds of stuff and, you know, really crappy and run down, but no, you get there. There'd be like zero security. Like maybe people, they hired a door guy to take tickets or something. And a lot, a lot of fighting and trouble and, M80s and bad things.
Did Tony do all his vocal tracks twice on the LP?
Yes. And you want to hear something interesting? I'm going to give you guys a worldwide scoop. I always remembered that we recorded not on every song, but a lot of songs. We recorded two sets of vocals because Tony took his lyrics and he had maybe half the song was cussing. And Rick and Frank got, I'm sorry, Steve and Frank just got super bummed about that because they really thought it was going to be like some super duper number one record.
So Tony recorded two sets of vocals and there's the occasional cuss word in mind, but not really, you know, nothing really bad. So I went back to my engineer and I had him you know, play the two inch tapes and there is some of those vocals and you're going to hear some of those new versions of four or two long.
Yeah. Wow.
And we had to remix it obviously, but you know, he's really good. So he made it, you know, it doesn't, it doesn't sound exactly like the blue album, but it doesn't sound like, you know, some creepy, you know, MTV record. It, you know, it sounds super cool, but it doesn't sound exactly like we mixed it in those days.
So
sometimes my brain works better than other times.
Is that the reason that, that no, what is the reason that no friends is missing from the lyric sheet?
You know what? I never even knew why he just wouldn't. Tony just said no. And that was it. There's at that point in time, Tony was such a fucking jerk. Like he was just awful. Like he was, he was just like the most, it was almost like he was a cartoon character of obstinance. And I don't know what the reason, I still don't know why if you just hated him, but if you're singing and it's on the record, I don't know. Just look, you know, nope. Not giving you the lyrics. Like,
okay. I thought it had to do with what, what the lyrics were, which I still can't really, I can only make out some of it. I know, but it might be
like, it's like, uh, really, really hard to understand. Maybe he didn't want to take the time to figure out what he said. I don't know. It was really fun.
Oh,
go ahead, Ben.
Um, I was going to say earlier, you mentioned Robbie Fields who had the record label posh posh boy, who put out a lot of, a lot of bands that ended up on frontier, put out stuff either on comps on posh boy or TSL put out a whole record. And I was just wondering like, um, what's the connection with posh boy? What, um,
honestly, I probably wouldn't exist at all. If Robbie, um, didn't irritate the shit out of the bands because they would have kept working with them. And I, you know, I mean, I would have wound up with something. I mean, I would have, you know, God knows I love Dread Cross, but they were also, they recorded for Posh Boy. But anyway, they worked with him once and he was, he did fancy himself a record producer and they hated him.
Like Tony, if you just say the word Robbie, like he'll just go insane. Cause he would just make him sing the same thing over and over and over again. Like he was Phil Spector and Tony's Tony is not that guy. Like you get one, two takes out of them and you got to move on or at least then, I don't know. He's like, no, but you move on.
It seems like you can't physically sing. If you're screaming, you can't physically sing the same thing a hundred times in a row.
And the first or second one's going to be the best anyway. It's just going to be the best, probably, you know, it's not, there's no need for Stanley Kubrick stuff here. So,
um, right. What were your first impressions of TSOL?
Uh, TSOL, I loved TSOL and I'm still super bitter that I never put out the, the black and white cover one. Cause I think that EP is phenomenal, but they hated him too. So that's how I went up there, but I saw TSOL, uh, Few times at the cuckoo's nest, they were really rough. And then mostly Jack was notorious. Like he was his own underground superstar because he was fighting all the time. He hung around and or was in vicious circle.
I'm not sure if he was a formal vicious circle, but just would get, I mean, he's a huge guy, huge, scary, muscly dude and would just get in crazy fights. But also you'd see him and he was wearing like the craziest outfits. He wasn't afraid to wear anything. He didn't feel like he had to wear punk rock clothes. And the very first time I saw them, they played in the Valley. No, not the first time I saw them. The time when I met them was at Devonshire Downs in the Valley at Northridge College.
And that was the famous one where he was wearing the white face paint and some lady's giant ass dress. And there was all these gang troubles then as detailed in that. I can't remember the name of it. That book about La Mirada punks. all these people hated Jack. So basically the entire audience, you know, beat Jack up and then you get back on stage and get pulled in the crowd and get hit somewhere. It was like the craziest shit. And I was totally in, I was like 100% like, let's do it.
Wow. Did they approach you then? Or did you approach them?
You know what? I could say, I remember, but I really, I really don't. I'm going to, I'm going to say, I believe Frank told me, that I had to keep an eye on TSOL cause they were so awesome. Cause he had seen him a whole bunch.
So when you said jet, you didn't know if Jack was in vicious circle.
Yeah.
He was in a band called vicious circle, but vicious circle was also,
there was the gang and I think it morphed into a band at some point. Okay. But, um, he, yeah, he would do hilarious stuff. One time when I got to the cuckoo's nest, he had started a rumor that he died, uh, and everybody was all crying and stuff. And then he like jumps out of somebody's car and he's like, I'm not dead assholes, idiot. So he was the life of the party. And then when we made the record, he had some terrible stories about crime that they'd done.
No, not murder or anything, but just breaking and entering and stuff. I mean, those guys are like the real thing. And as you know, except for Jack, all three of them did time. And I think Todd, I don't know if Todd ever got out. He did. I don't know whatever Todd did. I don't think he ever got out of prison. I think he died in prison.
I think Todd got out because I regret missing the show, but they did a reunion in 1999 at Bergamot station with like the go-go's. I want to say he was, but then by the time I saw TSA, well, it was like the, he was like right after he died, like 2000 maybe.
Oh,
okay. But, but I'm, I'm not certain, but those guys were all,
that's good. He got out. Anyway, it was something to burglary or drugs or drug burglary. I don't know, but it was bad. Like it was really bad. I didn't know people that did things that bad. Like, you know, I knew people that got DUIs or something, but not like people that like really did time. That was crazy.
Right. Um, What kind of deals did these bands have with Frontier? Like, you had them sign contracts?
I did have them sign contracts. I only did one-offs just because I was, like, one person in a house. You know, at that point, I didn't live with my parents. But it didn't seem right. It didn't seem seemly to sign somebody for a long term. And it was easy, too. If you just do, like, you know, 50-50 after expenses, one record, it didn't become something. Because that was the other thing Robbie did was... try to sign you for seven years and stuff. And they're like, Oh hell no.
Right. But that's
very important. Even if, even if you're one person and you're not really that serious about being in the music business, they have saved my ass. I just use Greg Shaw's, but save my ass a million times.
Yeah. I noticed that, um, you didn't do follow-up albums with a lot of these bands. Um,
No, once they got big, they were all like, we're big now and we don't even know your name and we're not going to put you on the list. And then they wind up on like, oh, like Fawlty. You know, you know where everybody went after me and their second record's really not that good in general.
Yeah. I agree with that. Yeah.
I mean, I would have done it, mind you. I would have done another one, but... everybody would be after, you know, after they got to a certain level and they drew really well at all the clubs. So, you know, somebody come along and sweet talk them and then they'd make a crummy record. And I was like, oh, well, there's plenty of fish in the sea.
Right. Right. Let's talk about, you branch out a little bit. Did you have anything else on TSO Ben? Sorry.
Oh, no, that's all I have. I love that album, by the way, the dance with me.
I like that record a lot myself, but I really love the EP. If those two records were merged, that would be the perfect record.
Right, right. Well, I'll just chime in and say I like the next one as well. But whatever. Lisa, how do you branch out and try to do a band like Christian Death? How does that come about?
Well, it wasn't that big of a departure, but again, that was my A&R guy, Frank... told me that Rick was playing with them. Of course, it didn't occur to Rick to tell me that he was playing in another band, but Frank had seen them around and he had seen those weird shows that they did called art shows where they would just take over a storefront and just do artsy noises and stuff because it kind of wasn't really what my record sounded like.
And then I heard the track on Hell Comes to Your House, which is a pretty big comp. I didn't like it. I didn't like half of the stuff, but there was some really good tracks on it, but the really standout one was Christian death. And, um, you know, so I was down and dirty enough where you could just make a decision and it didn't cost that much to go in the studio. I mean, maybe that maybe instead of three days, it was five days. And I tried to find the studio where we did. It was really weird.
It was somewhere on Gower and sunset in the Paramount lot. And again, we got this crazy deal because of Tom Wilson knew someone and, But now they've reconfigured Paramount so much that I don't know if this studio even exists. It just looks like a fortress. So anyway, but we did that there. That was a crazy experience making that record. That was, I never had more like hangers on, you know, just like people, you know, just sitting around and serve no purpose. It drove me crazy.
And Rick was really out of it. He was super, just wouldn't show up. if it was an all day session or an all night session or whatever, he'd show up hours late. We didn't know if he was going to come. So it was definitely very dramatic.
What was that whole death rock thing? Like a totally separate scene from punk or hardcore at that time in Southern California?
Yeah, I would say so. Yeah. Christian death were kind of its own deal altogether, but yes, they were not really, yeah, there's a 45 grade. There was that whole goth thing.
thing but the other bands were kind of more punk like i would say where christian death were just doing their totally whole roz thing and people didn't know if he was a boy or a girl and it was very kind of mysterious and intriguing but um and then there was kind of that sound was sort of developing so all those kind of hell comes to your house bands could kind of play together
how did you feel about the lp once it was done because it is really a game changer
Uh, I really liked it and I'm super, still super proud of it. Like that one, uh, definitely was a cut above the, the punk ones, I would say in terms of music. Cause once Rick, Rick rallied and we got in a big enough fight and I got him to do his thing, you know, the tubular bells and the whole thing, like Rick, you know, I rented them and Rick had never touched a tubular bell and he figured out how to play them.
I don't know if you've ever seen tubular bells, but you just look at it and you're like, I don't know what to do with that. And, uh, He figured out tone-wise how to play them and put them in the right places. So yeah, I'm really proud of that record. I think it's good. A lot of people hate Roz's voice, but there you go. He's the guy. That's his band. That's his baby. People have asked me for a copy of the record without his voice on it. I'm like, come on.
Wow. Can you describe a little bit about what it was like seeing Christian Death right after that LP came out?
Um, they were, you know, they weren't like the greatest live band in the world. They did not play live a whole lot, but, uh, it was, it was very musical, but there wasn't, they personally weren't like running around or doing anything like that. They were kind of, you know, intent on playing the music the way it sounded, but their fans are pretty crazy.
Uh, before they played, they would go to like, Oh, like somewhere like Hollywood forever, or maybe, or a smaller cemetery and just steal like car loads full of flowers and then put them all over the stage. And, uh, so they did some crazy, those crazy kids, they did some crazy stunts.
I thought you were going to say they stole a body body parts. I really thought you
were going to say, Oh, can you imagine how mad, but yeah, Mario, who was a, Mario's a pretty good friend of mine. I've been going to whiskey since 72 or 73. You'd be like, what is this garbage? This is terrible. And, There was one time where they, you know, and he was super Catholic Italian guy and they pretended to crucify Ross at one of their shows. And he was like, I don't want to see those guys ever here.
I don't know if he really banned them or he just said he was, but he was not happy with Christian death.
Again, you, you mentioned your parents, your parents were kind of upset that you put out that record because they were kind of religious.
No, they're not religious at all, but they were
just
like, yeah, they weren't religious, but they were like that, you know, they just saw the cover and the whole thing. And they were just like, cause I'd always been blowing their minds with stuff that blew their minds, whether it was Bowie or whatever. And I'm like, what is this crap?
But, uh, but I would get mail, uh, that was like 82, that record came out and I would get mail at the PO box and I'd show her how some mom, you know, mailed the record back to me and she had like broken it in a million pieces or things like that. So it was pretty funny. See, I told you.
Let's talk about coming across suicidal tendencies. How do they come across?
Where do they fit in? So I knew Mr. Glennie Friedman for a very long time. And he, quote unquote, managed them. He can't really manage suicidal tendencies, but he managed them. And... he would bring me demos and I'd be like, that dude can't sing. Like, they're just not good. And he'd tell me, he had described very colorfully what their crowd was like. And they were, you know, gang members and they were all, you know, the Mexicans and blacks and white people all together. They loved them.
And I'd be like, I just don't hear any tunes. And I had several demos.
Anyway, finally brought me the one that institutionalized on it and then i got it like i did not i had not seen them play or anything but then when he played me demos that he made and had institutionalized it was like okay i give up but people hated them and the reaction to me doing it was not good because they just had the worst reputation in the world people are just like bummed what was the reputation of that time uh the band members themselves were violent they weren't gang members, but
they, you know, they did a lot of fighting and other young men. They did plenty of like pretty chronic fighting and their fans were terrible and whatever club they would play, they would just, you know, ruin everything and make sure that suicidal could never come back. And then I was working at the time with the band called the three o'clock, you know, the, the poppy poppy three o'clock. I don't know if it's true. Don't know. I have no idea.
I don't have any evidence, but When they played the music machine, somebody stole all their gear out of the dressing room. And everybody said it was suicidal and they do that stuff all the time. So I didn't have a good opinion of them. But again, I have no proof. Could have been anybody. Could have been inside job. But apparently they were known to boost other people's gear. Wow. So anyway, I didn't have a good opinion of them. The city didn't, whatever.
But I was like, I'm going to make this record. And, you know, Glenn was my pal and I knew he would get good performances out of them. Like he actually did actually produce the record and tell Mike to stop and, you know, sing it better. That wasn't good because, you know, you just don't say stuff like that to Mike Muir. And it was it was a pretty painless, pretty painless three or four or five days. I can't remember. It was nothing memorable about the.
session itself everybody got along and played their parts and and you know what that record was a total stiff that was the worst if i ever put out for like two years and then glenn kept bugging me you know we got you know mtv and we got to make a video and you know i had done a three o'clock one that was kind of popular and i was like dude this record is dead in the water i am not making a video so he said i'll make a video okay i'll do it so he actually glenn actually pulled all the budget and
everything together from the band. And they were the ones that paid for the, the video.
Yeah. That's crazy. Cause I've talked to other people and said, Hey, you know, that record didn't sell well when it first came out and that blows their mind. Like how could that be? Like people who were.
Yeah. It sold worse than the China white record. Like it was dead. And I was like, Ooh, I know I shouldn't put this stupid thing out. Cause I was on, I was on kind of a role, you know, nothing was like a million seller, but I was on kind of a role where every record would make their money back. If not do pretty well. And it sat there for two years, two whole years. And then once MTV played it a few times, you know, it started out slow, like it died or I don't know if 120 minutes it started.
Anyway, got a few plays on MTV, then K rock picked it up and then it was ridiculous. Then it was just like insane.
the original version of institutionalized that you heard on that demo was the, were the, were the lyrics different?
I still have the cassette hanging up in my room, but I don't have a cassette player anymore, but I would say probably it was a work in progress. Cause he would sing it kind of different every time.
Right. I heard that a
little bit different.
I heard that the lyric was changed. from maybe coke or another kind of soda to pepsi for a specific reason but i don't know if that's like complete nonsense i would say
if that is true at all i don't know that to be true doesn't mean it isn't okay it's because glenn's a pain in the ass and probably hates coke or something and glenn just said you know no pick because when glenn bugs you you're just like all right fine whatever whatever you say because he's very persuasive but i don't know if they had another product
I can't imagine that
line. Thank goodness. I know. Thank goodness. I picked Pepsi. Maybe it just had to be a two word.
Well, yeah, it has to be two syllables, right? Cause Coke
has to be two syllables.
Yeah. I was wondering about Glennie Friedman. Like he's a famous photographer. So it's weird that he also produced and managed suicidal tendencies. Like how did, how did that even come to
be like about them for whatever reason he was just so into them maybe maybe for him he just wanted to try something new too or uh you know because he was their fan okay mike muir's brother's a very famous skater jim muir so i think glenn you know had some inkling that this is going to be this marriage between the two cultures and And he liked them and all that kind of stuff.
Cause he, you know, as you, as you know, from his photo books, he was there way before there was hardcore taking photos of just of skaters.
Right. Right.
Was Venice's own scene or, uh,
there was a scene. I wasn't, I wasn't probing it that much. Like I didn't really know, you know, I knew that they had their whole thing going on, but, um, I wasn't super familiar with the bands. It wasn't my area. I went to the same stuff, the same whatever, Vex and Whiskey and whatever was open, but I don't really know what happened in Playa and Venice and all that.
Was the gang thing that was associated with them, was that heavier than the gangs that were associated with other bands?
It was kind of their... Their gang kind of was suicidal, more than a Crips and Bloods or... M 13 or something. It was like, that was their thing. And they did wear those shirts. You know, they had the white dress shirts thing and, uh, super distinctive and, and, you know, the, uh, you know, whatever they like the misfits, then they would have the misfits hairdo along with the white shirt. It was, it was all very confusing.
When they
played, I saw, I saw him play a couple of times and there, uh, audience went completely like super scary looking anyway you just kind of stay away from them but like they played perkins palace which was a very stately kind of venue kind of like uh the lra doesn't have seats anymore but if the fonda had velvet chairs in it anyway they just destroyed they just kicked the shit out of that place they just broke everything they could break and i'd be like oh that's why they nobody will book any shows
with these guys. So they couldn't even play in Los Angeles. They couldn't even play in the city limits. Like nobody would book them.
Right. You hear the gangs are associated with other bands, like, you know, the family with circle one, or you hear bad religion a little bit with like the lads and so forth. But with the suicidal thing, it's just, it seems like it's on another level.
It was on their own posse. And there are people had been in and out of jail and juvie and stuff like that. Yeah. The circle one thing. That's a whole nother story. Yeah. That lot of Murata book was pretty edumacational.
Did you think that book was accurate or no?
I don't know how accurate I didn't know. I didn't know much about it. Like I just saw the graffiti and everything, but I mean, geez, like I didn't know people were like killing each other and stuff, you know, people, you know, they took drugs and things, but I didn't know any of that stuff was happening until after the fact it was pretty surprising.
There's, um, There's a song on that first suicidal album called I Shot the Devil. But he's singing I Shot Reagan.
Right.
And I'm just wondering, there's a story there. I know there is. There is a story which is
nobody is allowed to make any threats against the president whatsoever. They take that stuff very serious. So I don't think I suggested it. It was probably Glenn since Mike would actually listen to Glenn. So that was specifically so he didn't get in trouble. But ironically, I did get a visit from the FBI and I wouldn't let him come over to my one bedroom apartment. So I met at my parents' house, which is probably not the greatest idea. So I'm almost terrified.
You know, I was like, you're going to go to prison. And anyway, they questioned me. They're very polite and they questioned me about it. And I was like, He has no intention of killing the president. It's just a song. And they were like, Oh, we have to follow all this stuff up. So we just wanted to ask you like, what's up. And I was like, yeah, you don't have to worry about it. And they're like, cool. All right.
How did, how did they know? But how did the FBI find out about it? I don't know. I
don't know if somebody, you know, some mother was mad and called the FBI because, uh, Parents are pretty upset sometimes when some of these records came home with their kids, but I don't know how the FBI, I don't think I ever, I wouldn't put it in an ad or anything. So I really genuinely don't know, but, um, right. Good work. FBI. Did
you ever speak with the band about that and ask them if they got questioned as well?
Um, I know I was the only one. I don't think you could even find any of them if they were trying to. But I'm sure I was the only one that got a visit. In fact, I called Glenn and told him and we had a good laugh about how weird it was.
Wow.
You'd think that they would interview Mike, right? Like, are you going to kill the president?
Right. He's the guy who said he'd do it.
Because I certainly can't represent that I know anything that Mike would ever do ever. And
this is two years after Reagan was actually shot.
Yeah.
I don't
know what year it was, but it was like, yeah, you want to take that stuff seriously because you never know. Telling their little fans that break all the chairs to go shoot Reagan.
Were you surprised about what Suicidal merged into and how huge they got?
Extremely. Yeah, it was weird. They just tapped into something where people just, you know, it was the right song. And I guess it was the right song in the right time. And it kind of had that metal tinge to it.
Right. But how about like the rest of their career? Like, were you surprised? Like when they went,
they
made that successful transition. I
hate to be cruel, but I didn't really, they had, they wrote a few good songs after that, but they never wrote anything as good as institutionalized. You know, they had a few tunes that weren't too bad. Like maybe after maybe the next record or the record after that. And then, man, I heard some of them, they were just like terrible. Yeah. Um, but you know, people liked them and they still do, and they still draw good crowds, but it's not, you know, good for them.
They can play with like sort of rap crossover bands or heavy metal rap, rock and roll, punk, punk rock thing. They can kind of maneuver around.
Right. Um, that, so what are your, the three best selling records on frontier?
Definitely suicidal. Um, Neck and neck would be Adolescence and Circle Jerks. And then TSOL. You know what? TSOL didn't sell that well. It was like people really liked it, but it wasn't... I don't know what happened, but they were not part of the bigger early records kind of thing. And after that, everything kind of didn't really particularly sell that well. But I would say, yeah, I would say ST, Circle Jerks, and then ads.
Maybe it was something about... Like, I've heard Jack talk about how TSOL didn't go over well in the rest of the country. Like, the East Coast didn't get TSOL. That
doesn't
surprise me. Yeah, but it trips me out because, like, it's so good. I know. Why would you not like this just because you're from New Jersey instead of LA? Who cares? Like, it sounds good to me. I don't know.
You know what? It's that whole thing that I don't understand, that whole Steve Blush thing. The East Coast is good and the West Coast is bad when clearly we are so far superior to the East Coast scene. But anyway, discord aside, talk of discord aside, but, you know, yeah, some good bands or whatever. But I mean, agnostic front versus any frontline L.A. band or O.C. band now. Sorry.
Don't make me chime in on that one.
Yeah. Zach is a
huge. But anyway, that was that whole, you know, that's how, that's why you can't trust history books. Cause they just totally give LA the short shrift and they're like, Oh, Boston, you know, whatever it is like, whatever.
Yeah. You know, one of my biggest punk hardcore regrets is not chucking that guy into a trash can.
Really?
Well, yeah. Cause one of my bands played a show where, up in Seattle and he did the slideshow and I was like I was just thinking like this guy's like going on and on telling us like hardcore died in 86 but yet he's like piggybacking on the back of our show to do a slideshow and sell a book
slideshow of what
when he put out his book
he did like
yeah Oh,
my God. Don't even get me started on that shit. I
want to get you started because I'm
sorry. First of all, Seconds was that magazine. They were that magazine where if you ran an ad, you could be on the cover of a feature. And I'd be like, this is just Jack Rabbit would never do that. But you completely bought and sold for. But my personal bitterness is the hardcore movie. I took that guy down to the mask. He had the run of the mask to photograph it. all the graffiti and everything. There isn't one frame of that. He didn't use any of it at all. I was like, what a total dick.
And also I'm bitter because I'm not even in it. I'm not even in the extras. Like, you know, I'll play the girl card. Just had the same people. It was like everyone from the East coast and they kind of blazed through Los Angeles. So I saw the premiere of that at the Vista and I was so me and Ed Culver was just like kicking stuff. Like this movie sucks.
so why do you think that that la gets glazed over i don't
know it's just so stupid i don't know it's just it's just always been like that like it's not you know la is not real because there's sunshine and we have to trudge around in snow so you guys suck and it's like all those bands sound like some version of the you know an la band they're all like the lousy version of whoever the la prototype is
I have to say this theory that the reason that LA and OC aren't talked about in that in, in those circles as being like the God fathers is because you can have that because LA is where it transitions from punk to hardcore. And like, so then if you come into it from our core perspective, you look at all that stuff, you look at, you know, adolescence and TSOL as punk and, And if you came into it from punk, you look at them, those bands as hardcore.
In other words, it's like they kind of fall through the middle.
Right.
But who knows?
But I mean, there were definitely posts to like the, uh, for lack of a better term, just the, you know, the LA, the LA thing was, you know, screamers, weirdos, but even the cramps and whatever it was, that was, that was punk just because it was like, those people are never going to get record deals kind of thing.
Yeah. Um, Oh, I was going to ask about how you pivoted kind of away from hardcore right around the time that suicidal album came out and you were putting out like Paisley underground stuff and, and other types of music. And I'm just wondering like what,
I just thought actually it was, it was, it was pre suicidal. I would say the, I started working with the Salvation Army who again were on New Alliance and they were from San Pedro and they were pretty punky just because they didn't play that well. And, but I always liked the pop punk thing. That was my deal. And so I just, I don't know. I didn't see good stuff coming out of the hardcore scene. It was super repetitive after the, after, I don't know, like maybe 83.
It was just a kind of the same old, same old stuff. So I just lost interest in it to tell you the truth. Like, when Christian death came around and I put out the fly boys had morphed into hilarious sort of a new romantic band called choir invisible. I put that out. That's the worst selling frontier record. And so, yeah, I was just kind of, you know, moving around and then I got into the, you know, the three o'clock kind of corralled this whole thing called the Paisley underground.
That was, you know, sort of a retro sound, but good. So I didn't see any punk that I wanted to work with for quite a while. I mean, I would assign jawbreaker in a heartbeat. I never had a shot, but they were like my favorite band. I would assign them in a second.
In the late,
not in the cards.
Yeah. In, in the late eighties and up to 90, you, you license and reissue like a bunch of classic stuff. Like you do the second circle jerks record. You get the damned a couple of records, I believe. Yeah,
I traded those. There was a label called... It was originally Stiff, and then it became Demon. So they loved this band I had called Thin White Ropes. So I just traded them. I'd be like, no advance, just let me put out the first Damned and Music for Pleasure. And then there was a horrible EP called Not the Captain's Birthday Party, which is a massive Stiff. But anyway, so that was great to have the Damned because... I won't, I won't call them my friends, but I was friendly with them.
Like when the first time, when they came to the States and we drove them all over the place, it was just like a cool thing to do the damned.
And then also like the danger house issues.
Yes. And that took a lot that those in the weirdos took forever because all the people hated each other. Like by the time it was the late eighties, early nineties, like they all just completely weren't talking and refused to negotiate or hear anything about it. So those took a long, long, long, long time. David Brown and the owner of Danger House, Pat Garrett, just weren't on speaking terms. So I wasn't going to just like, oh, well, I'll talk to one.
I'll just go put it out and let the other one sue me. So I didn't want to do that. Anyway, those fell together. I'm really proud of those. Those are super good and important records.
Did you own the Danger House catalog? No, I just
rep it for David. David and Pat still own it. But I put the stuff out and then I license it. It gets used actually a pretty fair amount where there's going to be a bags track in the next Wes Anderson movie. So they're pretty excited about that. I know because I'm a big fan. So I was so excited.
Lisa, whose idea was it to break all that stuff up on the Danger House volumes? You know, to not put the
record. There was no thought process at all because David was extremely not helpful. So I would be like, what do you think of this? Should we, what should we do? Should we just put A and B and then what? And then he'd be like, I don't care. So it was just sort of haphazard. And I have enough stuff to do a pretty mediocre third volume. So that's never really been a priority, but we should probably just put out everything at this point.
I thought you did. You put out that box set. Oh, the box set only had the...
Those were just the A's and B's of the singles. There was no alternate mixes or anything. So we have some stuff slightly different, not crazily different mixes and maybe a couple of unreleased tracks. And I put out the Danger House, the Yes LA EP. So most of it's out. Most of it's in print.
Do you have any feelings on why the new Trump Bomb 7-inch came out so good?
Just because they're just awesome. The weirdos were just so unbelievably good from the second they formed. They were just incredible. Like you can't even picture them if they didn't have John Demi down Denny, you just can't even picture what it would be like if they just had some singer that stood there. But, um, yeah, they, the weirdos just had had it all. They just had, you know, they had the image and the songs and the singer.
Right. That's like the greatest crime is that, is that, um, when they recorded that neutron bomb seven inch that they didn't just do an entire, like record every song they knew in that same session, just because it sounded so perfect.
Cause they had, you know, that stuff was like somebody's house. It was like a, a guy that knew the screamers like a bedroom or something. It wasn't even like a real proper studio, but yeah, that would have been, that would have been the greatest record ever made.
Yeah. I mean, close to it or if not, yeah, it might've been, um,
And I'm sure you guys have seen the announcement of the screamers record. That was like actually getting stabbed in the heart and dismembered at the same time when Penelope's husband gets to put it out. And the first thing I did when I saw the announcement, I text KK and I was like, dude, I've talked to you about doing that record for 40 years. And he was like, Oh yeah. Oh man, you were there at the beginning.
And I was like, You know, because we couldn't even find Tommy, who was the guy that wasn't tomato, the other guy. We couldn't even find him. He was in L.A. and he was just like M.I.A. So he comes forward and now there's going to be an official screamers release. So try not to be too bitter about it. But I'm so freaking mad about that.
Yeah. What's the label that's doing it?
Superior Viaduct. Superior Viaduct. And he does reissues too. But anyway, it's Penelope's husband. So I guess I get you a lot of credence in the world.
Speaking of reissues. Yes. Group sex just got reissued on a brand new label called Trust Records. I'm just wondering how did that deal come about? Because you own group sex, right? I own group
sex. And those guys wanted to have all their records in one place. And I was like, okay, but I don't think you have the money to buy me out. Basically those guys had the money to give me some money. But, uh, and I could have just said, fuck you.
But you know, it was for Keith, basically a long story short for, so, you know, Keith should have things and he should have, you know, solid, you know, he's lived in the same place forever, but you know, he deserves to have cashflow and not have to worry about money all the time. So they have their own little empire and trust is going to put out, you know, wild in the streets and whatever other records.
I don't think they're going to put out the really stinky ones, but you know, probably like the first five, I guess.
And you know,
honestly, I would have had the money to do all that stuff that they did with all the booklet and the this and that the co-owner of trust is, has fancy money.
Yeah. He's the bass player of judge. Um,
But he has a massive publishing company called Songs, and he's incredibly crazy wealthy.
Lisa, Group Sex was off of digital for a long time. Do you have an opinion on the current state of digital music and how the Spotify's and the Apple Music's are dominating the way that people listen to music now?
It's hard to put it succinctly. I'm very bitter about Shopify. I almost call it Shopify. Everybody
to
my face is like, I don't buy records anymore. Spotify is so convenient. You can listen to it. What kind of a soul, a zombie, are you going to get rid of all of your records to listen to something on a tablet or your watch or some shit? Apparently, that's what the kids like and even the old people like.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I guess it sounds okay. I don't have super high-tech stuff. I don't want to hear things that sound like a YouTube record. I mean, I have an iPod, and I put my own collection on there, but I don't subscribe to Shopify. I guess it's convenient.
Yeah.
But they paid shit. I don't know why the majors, when they could have gotten some real money from, why they let them get away with paying absolutely nothing for everything. So that was a really bad business plan.
Right, right. Yeah, they kind of bent over backwards for the streaming
services. Just got absolutely nothing for everybody. I guess it's an equality thing, but you don't get a whole bunch more money because you're Lady Gaga. You just... it's crappy for everybody whether you know no matter how famous you are the money is shit except that they get a billion more plays but nobody's going to get rich off of any of those streaming services
well the streaming services will get rich off of the streaming services
what'd you say
i said the streaming services will get rich off the screen they get
rich but no no musician like nope
not
gonna happen
So the, the trust records thing, it's like a limit. It's like a, there's a term and then it reverts back to frontier or is it just trust to have that forever?
It's forever, but you know, it feels kind of good because it's got, yeah, it's got my logo on it and they didn't change the artwork. I'm absurdly stubborn about anything like that. So, and they were, you know, they were accommodating. It wasn't like any, any hostile takeover whatsoever.
Yeah.
But I'm like, I need this, this, this, and this. And they're like, cool. It wasn't like they were trying to change the cover. But speaking of changing the covers, did you guys ever see, okay, I sold Dance With Me to Epitaph when I got super broke, long story. And then they sold it to Dexter, which they weren't allowed to do. Like they weren't allowed to resell it without offering it back to me. So he changes the cover and the font and everything. I never knew what was up with that.
Took my logo off. Just made it look like shit. You ever see one of those copies there, Ben?
Not that I can recall. He changed the font of the band name.
He changed dance with me and he changed TS. I don't know why. Cause I gave Brett, you know, the original artwork and the original tapes and everything. It'd be like, why would you change the cover at this late date? Cause it was like 96 or something like that. I was like, what, why would you make it worse? But I was like, Oh, it's Dexter Holland, the guy with the worst band ever in the history of the world. That's why it sucks now.
Lisa, you can say bad things about Dexter, but don't talk shit on noodles. You can't
touch noodles. What about
Dexter's
jet? Can I talk shit about his jet? I think he had a bunch of jets.
That's so weird.
Yeah.
Like,
so punk, and now he has a hot sauce empire. And
if you think about it, like, like, Offspring... basically sounds like dudes who were like let's do a band that sounds like tsol mixed with asian orange but like way mellower
yeah
and like that's what and that and then and then they sold 11 million records like i know that's crazy
you know but that's the story of like uh like smashing pumpkins like you're one one millionth as good as the pixies mixed with whatever all the other bands that are mixed in there And then they're the guys that have all the platinum records and stuff. I mean, yes, the Pixies, everybody reveres them more. But it's like, they just fully stole from all the bands that were around at that time. And Green Day, let's talk about Green Day.
Not good at all, except for stealing songs and enough where they didn't get sued for it.
Right, right. Yeah. Speaking of the Pixies, and you mentioned Jawbreaker earlier, what bands did you want to sign all throughout your entire 41 years, but you weren't able to get? Oh,
God. Let me think about this. The real true heartbreaker was the Pixies. I was the first person that ever talked to the Pixies. I saw them. I was in Boston, and I saw them at a band called TT the Bears because the same person, Fast Freddy, that I was talking about earlier... He was tour managing a band and the Pixies were playing with them. And I absolutely worshiped them. I thought that was like the demo tape I got was incredible. I mean, it was the most homemade rustic thing you ever heard.
And I saw him at TT the Bears, talked to the band, talked to the manager. And I really, really, really, this was 87. Really wanted to put the record out. And I was very close, except they wanted to put a record out. Like they were just adamant that it had to come out in September. And I had a bunch of things planned. Like for once I had marketing in place and I just basically had no more money or line of credit. So they put out the first EP on rough trade and it just exploded.
It was like, you know, I had no hope after that. It was just a one-off on rough trade. And then, you know, their career just went bananas. So, oh, well, but maybe nobody would have ever heard of them if they were on frontier.
What about in the hardcore era? Were there hardcore punk bands that you tried to get, but you couldn't get?
I'm trying to think if there was, if there was, I don't, I don't recall. Throw some names out there. I can't think, I can't think of
anybody. I don't know.
I mean, I would have signed Red Cross, but they always, you know, they're always one step ahead and they, yeah, they kind of work with gas a tank or whatever, but I was always a super big fan. So I did put out Born Innocent, but it was only because Felix closed the label. And so I just bought it. Lock, stock, and barrel. But I'm trying to think of anybody that I just super duper duper loved. I don't know. Oh, anyway. Remember that band called Morphine? I was going to sign Morphine.
It wasn't really a frontier band that much, but I just liked them a whole lot. Do you remember that? They get used every time I watch a TV show or a commercial, they license a Morphine song. And I'm like, damn you.
Yeah. They ended up on... Didn't they end up on... They
were on Ryko. When I was talking to them, we were pretty close to coming to an agreement. And then Ryko, I don't know, called them, I don't know, whatever. And I was like, it would be so much better for you to be on Ryko than Frontier because nobody will probably ever know you exist. And they got pretty, I guess, pretty big in that world, the college radio world.
Lisa, on the other side of that question, were there any bands that tried to sign with you that you turned down?
Oh, I guess that's not very nice. There's bands like JFA and stuff that I liked, but I didn't love them. You know what I mean? Like they were, you know, like I just, they just didn't push me over the edge into spending my own money on them. There was, you know, those kind of fair to middle and kind of bubbling under bands. But I'm trying to think who else, like if anybody became big, like they, you know, I was offered them.
And they became like some giant thing and probably my brain wiped it out. But
yeah,
there was, you know, there was the, you know, some of the bigger ones, you know, like Reagan youth weren't big, but it was Lucky's brother. And I'd be like, I did, you know, if I don't hear any tunes, like I don't care if I sell a bunch of records, if it's not good. I mean, I don't want to just like put out records to make money. Cause why? Oh,
you mean wasted youth?
Wasted Youth, not Reagan Youth, sorry, Wasted Youth. And I was just like, eh, just didn't find him that compelling.
Right, the Reagan's In album by Wasted Youth.
Yes, exactly. And they were, again, they were just kind of a rehash of everyone else.
That's funny. I'm writing that article with Daniel Weitzman right now, and he totally uses them as like his, like, standard answer for like generic hardcore band like a stand-in you know like absolutely like uh you know fuck authority like wasted youth he always he's so dismissive of them and i'm like hey i like that song oh
i can think of like a band i guess you would call the vandals big i talked to i talked to joe a bunch about and i just found them too novelty-esque i just didn't i just
uh
I just wasn't buying their thing. It was like comedy or something like that. And I just, I don't know. I could have done it. It wouldn't fit in on the roster.
The
very first one, whatever the ones with the green one with the helmet, whatever the hell it is. Peace
through vandalism. Peace through
vandalism. Exactly. And I'd be like, I got TSOL. I don't need like comedy. It's just like, eh.
Yeah, that's actually the first record that Epitaph ever put out by a band that wasn't Bad Religion. Oh,
it was. Interesting.
Yeah. I had no idea until recently. Right.
I was wondering, it seems like most punk labels, they start small and they'll put out like, you know, a thousand of like 500 or a thousand of their friends seven inch and then they'll do maybe four or five more seven inches and then they'll really you know um take a huge financial risk and put out an lp and it's like you kind of came out of the gate doing almost entirely lps yeah i'm just wondering like how come you didn't do it the other way and just start small and put out a lot of seven
inches
that's a good question because i don't know um it's like danger house was so rad you know what i
mean
But there was a term on it. It was like, you know what I mean? It was like finite. It was like every single release is good and then we're out. But I'll tell you why I don't put out seven inches because they're a total waste of money. No matter how rad they are, pay to come, no matter how good they are and how genius. It's just taking your money and throw it away because, you know, you're super lucky if you get it back, but you probably won't.
Yeah. I'd be like, just for a little bit more money, we can make a whole album and all bands want to make an album instead of a 45. So I still like, I think we're only up to, after all these years, I think we're only up to 14. I should know my own discography numbers, but I don't, but very, very few singles.
Right. And stores
hate them. Like you can't even, you can barely give them away. Like people do tons of singles for record store day and, And people just groan. And I can't believe how much they are either.
Well, nowadays it makes really makes no sense, but I'm just talking about like the very early eighties. Yeah. No,
I never, I just wanted to like go for the whole album. I'd be like, uh, just because it was my money. If I worked for, if I worked for bump, I'd be like, sure. Let's put out a bunch of singles. I don't care, but I wanted to be an EP is another loss leader. Just spend the extra money, make an album.
Yeah, yeah. And I know like the Yes LA comp, you recreated what they had done, which is a one-sided 12-inch with a silk screened art on the other side, and it's a clear record so that you see it. If you put it down on the side with the grooves, you see the image forward, which is like... I don't. So who was it who thought of that in the first place? Cause it's so like fourth dimensionally thinking, you know?
I know. And it's so crazy. And I, and it was just like so genius that they did it like that because all they, the whole project existed to make fun of that New York record called no New York.
Yep.
And they're like, we're going to do the SLA and we're just going to totally do this thing. And it'd be so hilarious. Yeah. And I don't know if you've seen the photos when they silkscreened it. They just had it all over their apartment. Like every surface had like a silkscreen album, like all, like the kitchen, all the floors, baseboards. So they had a silkscreen machine and they made very, very good use of it. And I, they wanted me to reissue it.
And I just couldn't figure, I mean, I spent years agonizing over it. not that you could do a one-sided record, but like who would silk screen it and who wouldn't screw it up and get paint in the grooves. And so, you know, year after year went by and I met these people from Wisconsin and they were like, we're on this, just let us do it. So I did a thousand and we did the exact same four colors as the original Yes LA. And they found everything. They found the piece of cardboard.
Everything was as close as it could possibly be to the original. Even the gold foil stickers, everything. They're like, we're going to make it just like that one. And I'd be like, cool. Because who wants the lousy one where you didn't even try? But they silkscreened it and the whole thing. And they make my stickers. They're super cool people. And they're called The Factory, like Andy Warhol. But anyway, they're The Factory in Wisconsin.
Zach's band, Retaliate, just put out a one-sided 12-inch on colored vinyl that has silkscreened art on the other side of it. Cool. Who did that one, Zach?
Yeah.
Oh, I don't know. Mandel has a spot, a silk screening spot somewhere in Orange County.
Yeah, it's a super cool thing to do as long as the person doesn't get any pain on the other side.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lisa, did you ever meet Doug Moody? And if so, what were your impressions of him?
I never met him. He hates my fucking guts. I have friends that are really good friends of his and they visit him. I don't think he's in good shape anymore. or not much anyway, but I have a really good friend, my friend, Mike vinegar in Chicago. He says I stole suicidal from him because he has one track on some shitty comp. And I was like, I never even heard of the guy. I didn't know the comp was out. I still don't know what he's talking about, but he has this whole thing. Like he signed suicide.
I talked to Glenn about it. He's like, I was their manager. I don't know. What was Doug Moody talking about? Like they were never going to be on. I don't even know what's the name of the compilation, but it's, it's a really bad suicidal song. It doesn't even sound like they sound. Have you guys ever seen that video on YouTube of, I forget what it's called. Somebody filmed suicidal, like really early on. And Mike has like super bleach blonde hair.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's not good at all.
So it's a track from that era when they like basically just got together. So anyway, if you mentioned my name, Doug Moody, apparently like has a stroke.
So.
Good for him. I'm looking right now. It's called Mystic Sampler. It's a cassette sampler from 1983. And the song is I Saw Your Mommy.
Yeah, right. So anyway, his story is he had them signed and I stole them away. And I'd be like, I didn't even know that comp existed for years. Like for years, I had no idea.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Glenn would have never allowed them to put a record out on Mystic. Never.
Lisa, you gave us a great segue because I wanted to ask about Suicidal being on Miami Vice because I think you put that together, right?
Not really, no. I haven't talked about it a lot, but the whole thing was extremely entertaining. Universal called me up and they said that they wanted to have the band on. I was like, oh my God, that's so flattering. Oh my God, because I watched Miami Vice. stupid show, but I watched it. And I was like, Oh my God, they would not pay to fly the band to Florida. I had to pay for it. There was no budget for that.
They're like, well, if you want them to be on, cause you know, they probably dealt with real record labels. Like I don't know how many indie bands are ever on there. So I bought me a ticket too, because again, I did not want Mike to like punch out anybody or the band to get in a fistfight or war. So Mike shows up at the airport and He's gotten in some gigantic fight at a party and he's fucking all punched out and he's on crutches.
And I was like, what the, like, you have to be on TV doing your thing. And I don't know, he mumbled something like whatever, you know, whatever. And so we go there and everybody on the show is shocked that he's on crutches and he's surly. The other guys are, you know, they're pretty friendly or whatever, but he's not, very helpful. So filming it was hilarious. There was no, there wasn't like young people.
And we were at the Fontainebleau hotel and in classic Miami beach, there was no young people said to find young people and bust them in. And they were dressed super new wave. And I was like, Oh God, those guys are going to shit when they see what people are dressed like. Cause they, you know, they got their shoulder pads and everything. And, um, Michael Mann would strike the whole set if he didn't like the color. They're in a nightclub.
I don't know if you've ever seen the episode, but they're in a nightclub scene. He'd be like, that purple's the wrong color, and we'd have to sit there and wait for hours. The union guys would come and paint it, and it'd be like the same purple. It was just ridiculous. They go to costumes because they don't put you in costumes until right before you get in and go on, so you don't get... you know, makeup on it or whatever. And they're trying to put them in Miami vice clothes.
And I was like, Oh no, I just was like, no, we're not doing any fucking no socks. So they just wore the clothes that they had on and nobody was happy about it. But you know, I was like, they're, they're happy to go. If you guys, they're not going to be wearing any salmon colored or turquoise and salmon or no socks. Like, you know, this is what you get. But it worked out okay in the end. Why would
they want suicidal if they don't like suicidal?
Isn't that amazing? Why would you want them to dress like Don Johnson? It's like, oh, the band looks like the show. I don't think they even knew. Somebody probably told them they should have them on because it didn't go with the scene. A band like that would not be playing in a Miami beach. It was supposed to be one of those really nice nightclubs that people go to. They would not be playing. It
must have just been some showrunner trolling, right? It had
to have been just like a fan or somebody's kid. Yeah, somebody's kid liked the song. I didn't even know the genesis of how they picked it out, but I loved it. Whatever we got to pay for the music was so unbelievably low. It didn't even cover the plane tickets, but anyway, everybody saw it and then that kept the song alive and K-Rock, blah, blah, blah. So it was worth it. I probably spent between five and 10 grand to get everybody. Cause we were literally there for 48 hours.
So they wouldn't pay for the hotels or anything. I couldn't put up five of those knuckleheads at the fountain blues. Even then it was hundreds of dollars a night.
Did you get to be an extra?
I did get to be an extra. If you watch, I think it's, I might be wrong, but I think it's on YouTube. But I'm sure it's on the Peacock one way or the other. Whoever shows Miami Vice, it's about a dictator who comes to Florida and they find the dictator. Anyway, I was dead set against being an extra. In fact, I was just like, no, no, no. And they're like, we don't have enough people. So I have to act like I'm dancing to Suicidal. Hilarious.
We got to find you in Miami Vice. And we got to find you in line in Cheech and Chong up in Smoke. and freeze frame, freeze frame it. And you use that as like, you know, the next episode of 185 miles South, you know,
up in smoke is a blast. That was like, talk about that. That's
so cool.
Um, they were looking for people. I never looked at BTW. I never looked punk at all. It was like my era of dressing up stupid was glam. And I did my whole glam thing, but I never tried to look punk or I never had like spank year or anything. I just looked like a power pop person or something. Um, And anyway, they just needed extras to be in this scene outside of the Roxy. So they just put the word out. Maybe we had a flyer, a bump. I don't know.
But everybody was there, like the mumps and the screamers, any band, any girls that were going to be in the Pandoras, any germs, any, you know, so we're all there. And it just. was tore because it was actually a real, like a quote unquote real movie. It wasn't like one take thing. I was like, really took a long time. So everybody wore their most groovy splendor of, you know, day glow colors or people that look punky. So they just kept shooting it over and over.
And there was a scene that you guys have to watch it. It's so bad. There's a scene where the bands are rocking. So don't come knocking.
Yeah.
And we're all in line cheering them on because people having sex in a van. And then they picked me and a few other people, a few other girls. We had to go upstairs and we're in another scene that takes place, you know, on the rocks, like the upstairs thing. And we're, I don't know, react to something that's going on that's stupid. And yeah. But anyway, we got paid the princely $35 or something.
Yeah.
That was the best.
But it was $34 and 78. So like a hundred bucks.
Yeah. It was like a hundred bucks. Yeah. And I mean, considering how many people there were, that was a lot of 35 bucks.
Right.
But it was so bad. Oh my God. When we saw the whole movie, we're like, this is a word. I mean, of course we hate teaching child. Like I hate drugs. I'm not Ben, but I like, I hate drugs. And I was like, oh my God, teaching challenges. It was just more terrible. than you could ever possibly imagine, which made it excellent.
I feel so attacked on this pod. First, we're going to go in on agnostic front. Now we got to go in on up and smoke. Two of my favorite
things. Oh my God. Yeah. But you got to watch that scene because you can see, you know, screamer, like every single person, probably Don Bowles is in there for God's sake. I mean, everybody's in that scene.
You act like I haven't watched it in the last year. I love that movie. It's one of my favorites ever.
Yeah. We should watch it on Twitch. And I'll be like, there's that's Lance loud and that's whatever and whomever and stuff like that. So, and you know, they were super nice guys. They, they would come around and make sure everybody was happy and shake hands with you. Like they weren't dicks or anything, but we're just like, Oh, marijuana, the worst.
But everybody
I know now is all super dope head and you know, whatever. So good for them.
Yeah, were there any teetotalers in the early L.A. punk scene besides yourself?
Oh, I wasn't a teetotaler. I just hated
drugs.
I drank, but I never took drugs. I hated drugs. I've never done coke or anything. I absolutely hate drugs because my sisters were big druggies, and I was like, I never want to be like them because drugs are gross.
Right.
Just the whole marijuana hippie thing and marijuana leafs. No, no. Nope.
Yeah. Tell us, flashing forward to the 2010s, you started a distro with the owner of Beer City Records?
Yes,
because
I'm sure you guys have heard of Mordam, if you buy records. Mordam was just going gangbusters forever, ever since they started. I met Ruth. She used to work at Rough Trade, like, I don't know, super early 80s. And she would always say no to my label. And why? Because if anybody was on a major label, you wouldn't be on Mordam because they were so like lefties. And then Lookout left. And then they were like half of their money was gone all of a sudden.
And then they would be like, okay, we'll take your label. But anyway, being with Mordam was great. It wasn't a long time, maybe five years. They went down. She sold it to a guy. What's his name? Seth something. I block it out because I hate him so much. And so he promptly failed. The employees took it out, took it over. They failed. So after like getting stiffed like three times in a row within six years, me and Mike are like, we're not. forget it.
We're not going to, we're just going to start our own ILD thing. We're just going to do our own thing. So we grabbed up a lot of the labels that were, they used to be with more down like sympathy and Dionysus. And, and we lost a lot to a lot of people didn't want to be with somebody as small as us, but we're still here and we don't get stiffed anymore.
And it's, and what's the name of the distro
independent label distribution. And it's based in Milwaukee and Mike still does beer city. so he's mr punk rock guy i'm sure he's wearing shorts right now i'm sure there's like 50 feet of snow on the ground and he will not wear long like it's not cold enough for long pants
you know it reminds me of that's like how i was when i was 12 like right i was i'd wait till like the coldest day in winter and be like okay fine i'll wear long pants yeah only because i'm dying
but mike is like yeah it's not any colder and i'd be like Mike, it's 30 below zero. Like your eyes freeze when you go outside and it's not cold.
So you have never met him in real life. You've never been in the same room. I have
never, I've never met him, which is probably why we get along. But, um, I hear Milwaukee's a real rad town, but, um, just never, you know, we talk on the phone every single day. And I was like, one day I'm just going to go in there and like, be like, you're fired or something. But yeah, Just surprise him.
Would he even know it was you? Oh,
I'm sure he's seen photos of me on the internet.
It's just, I think about that every day. It's like you own a company that's been like almost 10 years, right?
Yeah. Like 10 years. Yeah.
Yeah. Cause I never wanted
any partners in frontier because I'm such, I'm so hard to get. I'm so unbelievably stubborn and unreasonable.
Yeah.
I never wanted to have partners because I don't want to have to go back and forth. Like I just want everything to be my way or the highway. So Mike and I actually have to like, listen to each other and decide, you know, decide. And he's, and he's a total hard ass. Like he's an Armenian. So the answer is always no. So I'm not ever like the night, like the good cop, but I become the good cop because my, the answer is always no. Like Mike, this guy wants to know, can you have an extra 30 days?
No. No. What does this look like? No, we're not giving them an extra 30 days. So I was like, okay. So I always go back to them. I tried. I talked to Mike, and the answer is no.
Right. Lisa, obviously you have stuff going on still, but with the label being 40 years old, can you talk about where you see the legacy of Frontier Records being in the history of punk and hardcore?
Gosh, I don't know. I mean, because... it's weird. For some reason, I'm not in that, whatever, like the, you know, the, the reverence for discord or SST, you know, like just kind of not in that stratosphere, no matter what I do. So I don't, I don't know what the legacy is. Do you think that's because the name and, you know, I think there's some respect there and stuff, but I'm not like, like, you know what I mean? Like, like alternative tentacles, these are like the tabernacles of things.
And like, I just don't feel like I'm up in that lofty stratosphere of the way people look at things. Or conversely, people think that I put out everything. Like you put out Black Flag, right? And like Dead Kennedys, right? And I'd be like, no, I didn't put any of that stuff. Oh, what did you put out? Oh, I didn't like them.
I think maybe it's because you weren't in a band. Like every record label you named was started by a person in a popular band.
So
they were already like kind of a public face, public figure.
And I have always, always steadfastly stayed out of the limelight because I don't want to be, you know what I mean? I'm not the point, so I never was any kind of attention seeker. Not that I'm talking about Curtis and Tang or anybody, people like that. But did you get that bit of shade? Did everybody get that bit of shade? I never really had a high profile, so I don't think people probably know my name or anything like that, which is fine.
But part of that might also come off of what you learned from the approach of the posh boy guy, right?
Yeah.
What a benefit from that.
Yeah. I don't ever want to be uncool to people ever. I mean, I have been, but I mean, I don't want to be that person on purpose where you just think that, you know, better than they do. It's like, I don't, I don't, you know, however they play the song sounds great. I just want to make it sound good. I don't need to, tell them to do something like play it different, play a different tune, do a different tuning. Like I don't do any of that.
Right. Do you, do you have records coming out that we can look forward to on Frontier?
Let's see. Oh, I've been reissuing a lot of stuff by a band called the Lilies, which is a shoegazy kind of band that I like a lot. And so I've put out, I've re-released two. These are super early nineties records. So there's one called the brief history of amazing letdowns. That's coming out in February. And there's a local band that Ben may have heard of called the flatworms that I absolutely love. We heard of them.
I know. I know. I've heard of them through you. Cause you told me you're going to put out the record. Yeah.
Super rock. And one of the guys is in the OCs. So he's on tour like three 65, but they're just unbelievably rock and band, like super good. Sounds like wire one, five, four, only like five times faster. But they hardly ever play. They play in LA two or three times a year, minus COVID. Anyway, I have a live record ready to go with those guys that Ty Siegel recorded. There's going to be a double version of Only Theater of Pain that goes into a box set with a book of Ed Culver photos.
I'm only doing the LP part. I have nothing to do with the book because I don't need the trouble of books. That's just like a whole other... layer of hell and what else what else oh we're gonna do the aforementioned the adolescence thing with tony different vocals we're gonna do some kind of different version of the blue album
right on
tony is talking he really wants to do a box set of singles so he might do something like that with like a bookletty bit so but it'll be called sodo it's not even going to be called we'll just take the artwork and Instead of saying adolescence on it, I'm just going to say Soto in that font kind of thing. And people that are cool will know what it is, and other people won't know what it is.
They'll learn.
They'll learn. They'll be like, oh, sure, I didn't buy that. I didn't know what it was.
Yeah. Lisa, you've been so generous with your time. I really appreciate it.
I know I have. It's like one hour of Netflix that I... I've not watched today. Sorry. Oh, my God. I just want to go out and see a show. Anyway, here we are. Yeah, that was fun. I love talking about myself. I don't have to think about anything. I don't know. I don't know.
Yeah. Hey, Ben, do you want to ask the final question? Since this is the first time you've helped me out.
Lisa, do you feel well represented?
Well represented by what?
In this interview, do you feel like you've represented
something? Oh, yeah. They were good ones. It was kind of a good overview. We didn't talk about what I consider my legacy stuff, like Thin White Rope. But Ben has always been resistant. Anyway, Thin White Rope is probably one of my favorite records I ever put out. And they don't sell a lot, but they're just super important to me musically. So I reissued those, digitally remastered. And you know what? It's really taken off.
Not like punk rock does, but people are like, We sell like all five of their studio records all the time. Like some, I'll just open my email and somebody bought all five that day. It's really weird. Just like a slow, slow build. So that's cool. Yeah.
Thanks so much for doing this.
Anytime. It was nice to meet you.